 Hello and welcome to another edition of Let's Talk. My name is Chris Satney. We are continuing our discussion on school guidance counseling and I just want to reintroduce my guest again, Christelle Lee, who is from the St. Mary's College. And of course, we have Candice Sejou of the Leonhurst Comprehensive, spirit of discussion we had in our first program. Yes, yes. And of course, we had to continue with our second program. There's just so much to talk about and I remember in the previous program, you were talking about so many issues that you face, issues dealing with children, with school children that sometimes turn bad, sometimes have, in most cases, have very good results. But let's go into another area, bullying. How much of that do you have to deal with, Christelle? Now I think in St. Lucia, people don't like to hear the term bullying because the definitions, people's definitions are different and what is bullying because the boys, for example, may say that's fun and it's, so I always, when I am addressing bullying and which is something, a topic for me, not necessarily for my school, wherever I go and present, wherever I can situate myself, I will always talk about the human element. So when people are unfair to each other, this is something that you get around the island, around the island, if they can take advantage, they will. And so it's something that, even though a school might tell you is not a high prevalence, it's something that they have to address and keep addressing constantly, constantly. As a parent with a child going to secondary school, I find children have to adjust to the environment of bullying rather than having bullying taken care of. So you find that they have to sometimes behave in a certain way, or in some cases, monkeys see monkeys do. What's your experience? With regards to the effect of peer pressure on bullying, it's a defence mechanism for certain students because the bully is a strong presence and they see the effect of the bully on other students. So in order for me not to be bullied, I have to align myself with the bully or I become the bully myself. And sometimes what also happens is, it doesn't necessarily have to be a school thing. It might be my brother is bullying me, my father is bullying me, my mother is bullying me, my sister is bullying me. I can't fight back at home, but I will find somebody who I perceive to be weaker than I am and I will assert my power there. So it is transferring that negativity to somebody else or through some other means. We have, for example, when we have meetings, because of course we have a counsellor in each district that goes into the primary school. So the secondary schools have one counsellor per secondary school, but there's one counsellor per primary school in a district, in an educational district. And so you hear what's going on, where a principal, a teacher may be having a problem. Even with the younger children, why is that person so aggressive and so on? And when they see the parent coming to pick up on how they treat the student, then you understand what is going on. And even with... Direct link. Right. So even with that, you have, these are the things you have to take into consideration when you're dealing with the students, you know. And that's why I say the definitions and how we see what's going on, because I'm not always quick to say, you're a bully and I will get down on you. But kids are getting help. Pardon? So through your work and what you do in the school, kids are getting help, says she. Yes. A lot of schools I know have bullying programs or anti-bullying programs. I know at Leonhurst Comprehensive Secondary School, the Ministry had an initiative, I think it was the Ministry partnered with some people that had an initiative, I Am Beautiful, which we've kept going at the Leonhurst Comprehensive Secondary School for a while. And for the last two times that we did it, we focused on anti-bullying. We had some of the students who were experiencing bullying, they would come to the, we'd have a big assembly and so on, the students would come to the assembly and they would present themselves as beautifully unique, so they would exhibit their talents and you know, whatever their creativity and so on, they'd write beautiful poems about their experiences with being bullied and how they have overcome it and so on. So besides the individual counseling, we do have programs that we have at the schools which help with certain things that we know are pervasive throughout the schools like if there is bullying and that sort of thing, when we have a program throughout the school to help with that particular issue. For instance, what we've started doing at St. Mary's College, we have the big brother, the big brother program at Tung Twister. And the intention is, it wasn't directed to relieve bullying, but however, the idea of building these bonds between an older student, it helps with camaraderie, it helps the younger one which was objective directly to trans-, go through that transition period quicker to settle down so that he can get to what he's there for, to do the work. So to overcome some of these obstacles of how to find your way around and how to settle in and what to expect and how to deal with what's going to happen between the older students. So the maturity that they're making, that's basically what you're saying, that that kind of big brother, I look over you and give you a guidance, helps you to become a bigger brother when somebody else needs to be mentored, so it's like a mentorship. And it's very interesting because for me, the pleasure of this thing is to hear what the other students have to see. They're not talking to you, they're talking to somebody else, and they're talking about something, something that they've experienced or so on. The big brothers talk about their experiences or the little brothers, not everybody's going to have the best experience in the world. But when the-, when you hear these nuggets of gold, it makes a job. Oh, a whole lot better. Well, with you for a break now, we continue with our spirited discussion on school guidance counseling after this break. Pamela, I noticed that you built your retaining wall on my property. You'll have to give me my land back or compensate me for that. My contractor isn't dumb. I trust that he will not build anything on your property. Where is your proof? Let's go to court! This situation does not require you to go to court. Looks like we have to go through mediation here. Mediation is a way people resolve conflicts like this. Someone, a third party, comes to speak to both parties. This person is called the mediator. The mediator is impartial. He or she makes sure that communication between both parties is effective and efficient. So the mediator is a judge? No, the mediator is not a judge. Mediators, unlike judges, do not decide cases or impose settlements. Let me get a mediator to handle this retaining wall and that kitchen. Kitchen? Yes, your kitchen also falls on my land. Let me call the mediator. Welcome back to Let's Talk as we continue our discussion on school guidance counseling with Christelle and Candice. Of course, we're very happy to know, I'm very happy to know, your disclosure that the children, they are coming to guidance counselors, to school guidance counselors with their issues. This must be a good thing to deal with the issues, Tejo. Oh yeah, like I said in the last, our last session, I have definitely seen a change to, like I said, I go to the guidance counselor to every few minutes, knock, knock, knock on my door. Miss, I want to speak to you, Miss, I have something to speak to you about. And they're able to open up to you. That says a lot about what you're doing at the school, it means that they trust you and you're making an impact positively. And speaking helps the child. Speaking always helps. I want to say it helps everybody, but we're dealing with children. It's important, it is important to have a space that they know is safe. And all of these things we explain to the parents beforehand, at orientation, I will always say, here are the limitations, here's what we're going to tell your students and we're going to be telling them that the space we're creating for them is safe. Of course, the limitations which we explain to the children, there are certain things that we have to act on. We must protect our babies. We must protect our babies. I mean, at my school they called me momie a lot of the times, because I don't want people to interfere with my children. I don't want people to interfere. I can understand. You said a very important word, their parents. Let's talk about parents and how they contribute to the situations and of course how they can help to eliminate it, Crystal. Parents' hearing, because parents, I know most of the times parents are thinking, what is happening with their students, the reflection of them, so they're angry. If your child does something, which you deem is wrong, which is against the school rules maybe or something, it says that I'm not a good parent. No, that's not what it's about. And a lot of the time I reassure the parent. First thing you hear. Once you hear, it means you care, you're doing a lot of, we're more than 50% of the way. Yes. We're more than 50% and let's continue to work. So interest. So interest. Right. Let's continue to work. And then let us see it, and I have to explain the students' perspectives as we were talking about in the last time, perspectives of the students are not always the same as a parent. So if I give you, if we enlighten you and say, okay, look at it from this point of view. The more you are able to see from their point of view, the more you are able to intervene realistically in a way that will actually help, and the two of you can work together. That's the difference. Why is it so difficult for children to speak to their parents from your experience? That's a really good question, and I think I addressed that at one of our parent-teacher meetings at one point. Parents forget, I think, this is my experience, what it would like to be a child or to be a teenager. We lose connection with that phase or stage of our lives where we made mistakes, where we were curious, and parents become so engrossed or obsessed with, I don't want him or her to make the same mistake I did, or, you know, they take on their parent roles where what I say is what I say, and you don't do what I, they don't listen to the children. Is it that the parents, and I'm a parent as well, that we are actually reflecting what we saw from our parents? Most times. You internalize what that's what, you know, that's how we learn. I sometimes see it that way. Do you counsel teachers, Kristen? It's not in our job description, but it's not in our job description, but I have had the opportunity that a teacher needs, I will not turn away a teacher. I will not want to advertise, teachers come, but they need it, yes, and they have it. Because there are some serious, serious issues in the classroom that these teachers don't know how to deal with, and having to try and deal it with themselves, they encounter some serious strain, and those people, I think, need attention. What we do sometimes, we have professional development activities for the teachers. So during our PDDs, and that sort of thing, we may have a session on how to deal with boys, or how to get the most out of your students, and that sort of thing, and that way we can reach the teachers, you know, more of them, instead of getting to deal with them. The nice programs that are rolling out, there was a pilot project and it's rolling out about positive discipline, which is really, really helpful for teachers, and so on. Also the teachers are people, they're human beings. So they have their personal issues, which they come from home with, and sometimes they don't even realize it, it projects onto their students, you know. So, and that's why I love individual, I go to the teacher when it needs to be. Final word from you? You have the final word, comments, final comments. I think that people don't really understand what we do, and I would like to let everyone know that your children are safe with the counselors. We enjoy what we do, and we are blessed to be in the positions that we are within the schools, to be able to impact your children the way that we have. It is not an easy job at all, but we're doing our best, and we will continue to do our best. Thank you so much. I just want to thank you for being part of our program, if you can reach across Crystal, that would be fine. Thank you so much, and I really did enjoy speaking about this topic, and I wish you all the best in your endeavors. Thank you very much. Thank you. Okay. Well, that's let's talk for another edition of Let's Talk. Just want to thank you as always for being part of our program. We'll have the next one for you next week on behalf of the entire production team. Chris Satney, thank you for watching.