 Today, I'm sitting down and talking with a very special guest. I'm talking with my friend and fellow YouTuber Josh from Keep It Techy, Josh. How are you doing today? How are you doing, DT? I'm happy to be here. Yeah, I've been wanting to get you on the channel for a little while. I know I've asked you a couple of times and you've sent me messages before. And it seems like when we message each other, it's always before it's always been on Patreon. And I know you don't check your messages that often on Patreon. And I don't check mine, you know, like every few days. Sometimes I'll go a week or two without checking messages. And a lot of times these messages just get lost. Because if you get a lot of messages, you know, sometimes things go by and I'm really bad at checking my emails as well. So I know that's part of the problem that it's taken so long for us to do this, but I'm glad you could be here today. So tell my viewers a little bit about yourself. So how are you guys doing? I'm Josh from Keep It Techie and I have a Linux YouTube channel and I cover various Linux topics. And I also do a little bit of mentorship to help people get into the IT field. I've been working in IT field for over 15 years and I've worked in different positions, network administrator, systems administrator and Linux has always been a hobby that I've done outside of my normal work schedule. And I've always had Linux server set up where I just set up various services, whether it's a website or just different tools that I use backup tools that I would use at the house. And it's always just been somewhat of a passion that I would play around with on the outside of my job. No. Well, when did you actually switch to Linux on the desktop? I'm assuming you're running Linux as your main operating system or are you on Windows or Mac? Yes, I'm using Linux. I've been using Linux since around 2015-ish. It was on and off. I used it before that, but then I went back to Windows for a little while and then I switched back in 2015. So you could say that's the kind of official time period where I fully immersed myself in the Linux experience on my own desktops at the house. What distribution did you run as a first desktop distribution? Now, I started off with Ubuntu and that's probably a lot of people's similar story. They start off with Ubuntu because that's the most popular Linux distro. Yeah, especially in the time period you're talking about Ubuntu with the Unity desktop at the time was starting to get really good. So that would make sense. Yeah. That was really after they got a lot of the bugs worked out with Unity like with 14.04 and 16.04. I think those were really some of the best versions of Ubuntu that they ever put out. Yeah, I definitely agree. I was new to it, so I was still learning. So I didn't know all the ins and outs of the different desktop environments and trust me, your channel, I believe, as well as Joe Collins' channel, I know you know him as well, really helped me get a good understanding of Linux in order to learn a lot more. So. Well, that's really cool. You're not running Ubuntu now, are you? Are you still on it? Or you probably hopped a million times since 2015. Yeah. Yeah, I'm trying to remember exactly when it was. I don't remember exactly when it was, but I know I heard about Orch Linux and I know. You know, and I mentioned this on camera. I did a video about three years ago. I said, so many people take the path of Ubuntu and then Arch. Like it's, there's no in between. They try Ubuntu. And I was like, okay, Linux is pretty easy. And then they go straight to Arch from there. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I took steps in order to get to Orch Linux. Like I didn't go right to Orch. I didn't try out the installer right off. I was looking for an easier way because like I said, I wasn't that deep into understanding 100% because all I ever worked with was Windows systems, you know, outside of it. And so I was still learning. So I took steps to get over. So I didn't just hop right over to Orch. I actually stored that off with Entergos. I don't know if you remember that distro when they, when they, yeah. Well, it's, that's funny because that distribution has. Died and been reborn like three different times. It actually started out as Synarch, which was a Cinnamon desktop version of Arch and then they rebranded it to Entergos and then that died. And then it was rebranded as Endeavor. Mm hmm. Oh, it has a long history. It's just been under three different names, but it's been around probably at least a decade. Yeah. Yeah. Well, that helped me transition. I tried it out in a virtual machine and then said, well, this is easy enough. Let me go down and try Entergos or Entergos. I'm sorry, but I tried that. I have no idea how it's supposed to be pronounced. Yeah, but I tried it on my main system, you know, tested it out, figured out the package manager and I said, Hey, well, over time, I said, Hey, well, let me go down and try at Orch Linux. And this is one thing I always tell people when you want to try a new distribution and similar to what you do on your channel. I mean, try it out in a virtual machine first and then, you know, at least go through the installer. And that's what I did with Orch. I went through the installer multiple times. Just to verify that I understood what I ought to do with the system and get it up and running. And we're fortunate now to have such amazing virtual machine technology that did not exist when I first switched to Linux. Like when I first switched to Linux, if I wanted to try out a new distribution, I had to hop to it. Or if I wanted to try out a new desktop environment, I had to install the full desktop environment on my physical hardware. And if I didn't like it, I had to try to uninstall the whole thing, especially in those days. You know them and KDE had weird conflicts and having both on the system was always a pain. So now, you know, people don't realize that these virtual machines, they're really like a godsend. You can try anything out in a virtual machine and you don't have to hose your physical machine. Exactly. I agree. I agree. Especially when you took time to configure a lot of things on the system. Yeah, it's definitely easier to just try it out that way. What kind of virtual machines do you like using? You're using VirtualBox for the most part, VMware? I started off using VirtualBox a whole lot. That was the main virtualization software I would use. But then I eventually, because I've always had servers like physical servers and not those blade servers or anything. It was basically converting a desktop into a server. Oh, okay. But I said, hey, let me just go on and get me a legit server, so to speak. And so I got one from Dell. And so now I run Proxmox and I do a lot of my virtualization there. So whenever I want to test out a new distro, I just do it on a Proxmox server and just play around with it there. People have asked me about Proxmox. I've never looked at it. I probably should at some point. I probably should just throw it on like one of my digital ocean server, you know, cloud hosting or something. Or actually, I had this server rack behind me. It's not in camera frame, but you've seen that five-foot tall server rack that I've got mostly audio equipment in. I mean, I could put a server on the rack mount just for VMs, but that's a little overkill for virtual machines. That's why I got a small one. I just got a small desktop server from Dell and just, yeah, it's not too big. Now, earlier you talked about your YouTube channel and I've got to say you got an excellent YouTube channel, really good information, both about desktop Linux and as well as Linux on the server, IT system, administrations, things like that. What I want to talk to you a little bit about is you make your content on Linux, right? You record and you do all the editing. What software are you using for your video production? Okay, so the main software to record everything, I use OBS. And I know a lot of people use that, you know, it's free and open source, you know, anybody. And it's become the standard, really. Yeah, yeah, definitely. And a lot of, let's say, audio editing, I do use audacity in order to correct certain things with the audio that I can't do in OBS. And then I typically use Kaden Live. I've been using Kaden Live from the beginning. So I've seen all the different iterations, all the changes that were made, all the add-ons and all that stuff to Kaden Live. Kaden Live, I think is one of the best, you know, editing software is out there. It really is a very powerful video editor for being free and open source software. The one thing about it that I've always, it makes me angry is the fact that it's free and open source software, it sees constant development. And it seems like every other version breaks something. It's like they'll break something, this version. And then the next version, they'll fix what they broke the previous version, they'll break something else. It's like always, but you know, it's got so many different cool effects and compositions. Like it really has everything you need in a video editor. And I know obviously professional video editors are going to talk about things like DaVinci Resolve, especially these days, it's kind of like the one everybody uses. But you also have things like Premiere Pro and Final Cut and things like that. But honestly, unless you need, especially with something like Premiere Pro with that subscription model for Adobe, you are throwing away potentially thousands of dollars over a number of years for stuff you're probably never going to need that's in Adobe Premiere Pro. Kate and Live has got you covered for practically nothing. Obviously, you should donate to these guys. I love donating money to the KDE project every year around Christmas time. They typically do a fundraising drive. I try to throw KDE some money because some of that money will go to development of Kate and Live. I'm a Patreon subscriber actually of OBS because I couldn't do my work without them. So I try to throw those guys a few bucks as well. Awesome. Yeah. That's great that you're doing a lot of open source software. What about a artwork thumbnail? Did you use a Gimp or Krita? Or I mainly use Gimp on a lot of my. Now I have transitioned a little bit and started doing a few of the editing on a few, a little bit of the editing online using Canva. And so I've heard of that. I've never tried it out. But yeah, but I've heard other content creators mention that particular site. Yeah, it's a pretty cool. It it helps with the workflow because as you know, recording these videos and putting out this content. And I heard you do this in the recent video, man. The hours that it takes to put these this content out for people is it does take time. You know, every little bit of time that you can save. If you can save five minutes from your normal workflow by changing up something. I mean, you got to do it because it does. It takes so much time. You got to learn all of like the shortcuts and key bindings and Caden live even if it seems like it's just a minor improvement to your workflow. You got to do it because if you spend as much time in Caden live as I do, you know, you got to you got to learn the ends and now same thing with something like Gimp, which is a very complicated program. It takes a long time. It took me. I've been a Gimp user seriously for about 20 years because I was using Gimp before I switched to Linux even, you know, even back on Windows. But I can't say that I really knew how Gimp worked until about 10 years ago. It took me a long time to because it's just so complicated with all the tools and the windows. And back then they had the multi window thing where Gimp was like three windows on the screen instead of just the one and that was so confusing, especially coming from the Windows world. I'd never seen a program that had multiple windows open up like that. Yeah. And then one of the, I guess, see, I had a little bit of experience using the Adobe product Photoshop Photoshop. Yeah, which is equally as confusing. So yeah, just understanding a little bit of that kind of helped me in. They're all confusing. I mean, these kinds of pieces of software are not like audio editing is not easy. It doesn't matter the program you use video editing. It's not easy. It doesn't matter the program. You talked about everybody uses DaVinci resolve these days. DaVinci resolve is complicated as hell. Like it's a steep learn. I gave up on it. I, I, I uninstalled it, man. I tried. I installed it. I think I installed it once just to see if it worked on Linux because this was when they first made a Linux package. Now I knew proprietary software and I was, I like Hayden live, so I was going to stick with Hayden live. I just wanted to see if I could get it installed and it would it actually render a video? I think I did a test video at like 720p or something and it did actually record correctly. So, but at the time, I think it had more to do with the video card I was using because when they first switched to Linux, I can't remember. I think I was an Nvidia user and I think DaVinci resolve only worked with Nvidia and not AMD at the time. Now, of course, all of that's been worked out. By the way, are you a team AMD or team Nvidia? Nvidia. Yeah. Yeah, I think everybody objectively recognizes that Nvidia is the better product, especially if you're going to use the proprietary video drivers like you should, if you spend all that money on an Nvidia card, but I these days, I like being a AMD user just for the convenience of it being open source and the drivers are already in the kernel. It's so much. I've never had an issue with AMD or Intel, you know, because they open source all their drivers. The Nvidia drivers can be a mess on Linux sometimes to get them installed or sometimes you'll install the wrong one and I'm sure you've done that before where you reboot a machine. You just get a black screen and you know it's the wrong video driver. Yeah. Yeah. Of course, we know that new user is going to think I just broke my machine. You're right. They don't know that's another thing that scares away a lot of new users is these simple things that, you know, if you've been around long enough, I know immediately when grub is broken, for example, when the video driver is bad, but a new user, they don't know these things. And unfortunately we still encounter these problems all the time on Linux because we were just having grub issues not too long ago. Was it an arch? I can't remember which distribution was having some major grub problems. I think it was arch. Linux has gotten so much better though compared to when I started, when you started, wouldn't you agree with that or what has changed since 2015? The design of Linux, that's one of the biggest things that stands up and what I mean by design is the desktop environments, the improvements on a lot of the different desktop environments because I haven't really got into window managers like you on your channel, but the desktop environments have just greatly improved. It makes it a lot easier for new people to get into Linux and really understand the desktop environment and take advantage of the things that are there. That's one of the things I like. I think that's a really good observation actually because especially around the time you were starting 2015 on the desktop, GNOME and KDE are by far the most popular desktop environments. Those are the two that most Linux users use and GNOME and KDE in 2015 were horrible. Especially GNOME. GNOME was straight trash in 2015, so but now the latest GNOME version 45 that Ubuntu just shipped with, the new Fedora is going to ship with here in a few days. That thing is awesome. Yes, it is. Like it's incredibly good. I would run it if I had to, you know, obviously we've got choice, but I would have no problem running that where for the first 10, 12 years of me running Linux, I would have never considered using GNOME. It wouldn't been the last desktop environment I would have used. It was that bad. So yeah, I agree that the desktop environments have gotten really, really good. And then you've got all the alternatives like a budgie and sentiment and things like that that are that are really sweet as well. Yeah, the choices is another thing like so like you just pointed out to just having all those different choices and they all look pretty good man and you got quirks here and there and certain ones that you may not, you know, like well try another one. You know what I'm saying? And they're all pretty good. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Well, one of the things I noticed on your YouTube channel, she focused a lot of on security issues regarding Linux. Obviously, because of your job, you know, Linux is a real target as far as the server space for people, you know, hacking and things like that. So, but as a Linux desktop user, what do you think about security? Is it because for as long as I've been using Linux on the desktop, we have always kind of been complacent saying that nothing can ever really affect us. We don't need to run antivirus, you know, our machines are pretty much secure. We don't really have to go through any of these extra steps to harden our systems in any way. Do you think that that's still the case or what are your thoughts on that as far as that desktop user? I still think is that is still the case. I mean, we're starting to see a lot more malware and different things that are targeting the Linux desktop users because the and all it's ever been was that Windows is the most popular, you know, server and desktop that's used out there in the world. And so obviously these bad actors are going to target those systems. And so now they're starting to see a lot more cloud servers out there, which they've always had cloud servers out there. They're starting to target a mobile operating system, suspiciously. Yeah, yes. So and we all know is it's not seen in the forefront. It's kind of like in the background, but Linux has always been a dominant player in the background in a lot of different areas. Well, the most popular operating system in the world is Android, which runs on which runs on a Linux kernel. So it's not the new slash Linux like on our desktops. It's completely different operating system, but the heart of it is still that same kernel. Yep. Yep. And so people are starting to target that a lot more. And so that like I covered a while back. There was some vulnerabilities and they're being covered and talked about a lot more. You'll start seeing seeing it more in the news where I've noticed a little bit of a unfairness with the way Linux more vulnerabilities are covered in journalism, tech journalism, because I think there are this is not everybody, but there are some Windows fanboys out there that have never liked the way Windows had been portrayed as being a vulnerable operating system and that Linux and Mac and these other operating systems aren't that way. So now that more of these hackers are targeting Linux and Mag and Chrome OS, now they just love it. They want to bring up every single incident that happens. No, that's true. That's true. It's like the shoes on the other foot. Yeah, y'all talked all that trash for all them years. Now, now look what happens. Yeah, that is true. They do kind of like prop those articles up a little bit more. Well, they blow some of it way out of proportion because they make it sound like, you know, it's the end times because of the latest kernel attack or whatever is like, no, like it's already been patched by the time they put the article out there. Yeah. And that's one good thing about open source. A lot of times these problems are found quickly and they Oh, it's pretty quick, you know, like 95% of the time by the time the news breaks, it is already patched and they big, especially the corporate distributions like Ubuntu and Red Hat and things like that, they've already updated. They've already pushed out the updates. So you're already fixed before you even knew about it. Yeah, exactly. Assuming you update your systems, which is another thing that especially desktop Linux users, some of them don't update at all, which is kind of dangerous. Linux Mint did a study a few months back. I remember they actually put out a blog post basically chastising their users because they realized that there were a significant percentage of Linux Mint users that were still using a version of Linux Mint like three versions back. Yeah, like they don't go to the latest version. Not only that, most of them are never going to the GUI Software Center and pushing the update button. They just don't they never update their system and they had to put out a blog post like, Hey guys, you're doing it all wrong. Yeah. Yeah. And that's dangerous. That is kind of dangerous. You need to go down and update your systems and stay on top of it. That's one thing I don't know that I'll get something in my head just pops up and say, Hey, you need to update your system. Yeah. But you've seen that in the server space because I've known I've seen those people that have that Debian server that's been running for 12 years or whatever it's been and they've never updated. I think yeah, but I guess that's the point. I mean, if you're looking for something rock solid stable, you kind of have to not update. I mean, yeah, I mean, that's that's the tradeoff there. Let's talk about a couple of big stories here in the past year. The first one I want to talk about is probably the biggest just general tech related story of the past year. And I think that's clearly the rise of AI. And I personally think that AI is going to be a major disruptor and a lot of different industries. A lot of jobs are going to be lost to AI and a lot of jobs will be created by AI. You know, it's going to really going to turn things a little upside down in various industries. How do you think AI is going to affect IT system administrations, things like that? Do you think it have any effect at all in any of the areas that you deal with? One thing I've been saying and one thing I've been seeing AI is mainly becoming a tool to make things a little bit easier. Now, like what you said earlier, some positions are going to be lost and they're going to think about the help desk. Think about somebody that's just answering phone calls and giving help advice. Does that need to be a real person once AI is a little more mature? I'm not sure. Not sure that person has to exist anymore. Yeah. See, that's the thing. You know, that's not going to be doom and gloom about it, but it could potentially assist. You know what I'm saying? Because you're seeing it nowadays with these by telephone calls. I mean, that's that's. Well, I've mentioned before that I think AI actually would be better as far as public teaching than 99 percent of the teachers that actually teach in our public schools because, you know, a lot of teachers are not good at their jobs and I hate to just paint everybody with that brush, but there's a lot of them that are just not good at their jobs. And I think in some cases, AI could actually be an improvement. And that's one thing like I was looking at an article a while back as well that they're doing something similar in China. They're tracking and see this goes into the whole privacy thing, which I don't know when you want to if you want to get there. I mean, let's go ahead. Yeah, they're they're tracking the students within the class. They have some type of technology they're putting on the kids head to track if they're focused or not. Yeah, a lot of them make the kids now. There's certain web browser plugins that they have to install that in Chrome or five. I think it's usually chromium based browsers, but if you have to have a webcam on and the webcam actually watches your eyes, make sure you're actually watching that screen and you're not looking over at whatever cheat sheet you have. It's just weird. Yeah, but yeah, AI is is is here to stay, you know what I'm saying? And it's going to be more involved in a lot of positions now, but I see it at least at my level as a way to make things a little bit run a little bit more efficient and not actually replaced because you're still going to need that human elements to either troubleshoot certain things. You know, well, you can't replace everybody with a computer. You always have to have an actual real life human being somewhere because at the end of the day, someone has to be responsible. Yes. Like if everything goes wrong, you have to be able to blame somebody. And if it's all bots, all computers, you have nobody to blame. So even if it's just for the corporation to be able to scapegoat somebody, they have to have at least one person that they can point the finger at and said it's his fault. Yep. And so the positions are going to be a little bit more specialized. So you're going to have to it's just not going to be your run of the mill programmer. You know what I'm saying? You got to specialize in something. You have to be efficient in something. Well, that's that's become more competitive. Programming is a great example of an industry that won't be replaced by AI, but it will be made better by it because an AI is not going to program something for you. It'll give you bits of code for specific action you want, but it's kind of like if you're a novelist, you know, can you tell chat GPT to write you a novel? Sure. Is it going to be any good? No, right? Because it's not a human being. There's certain nuances, certain emotions you got to put into a artistic kind of thing like a writing or music and something that a computer can't do. So there's certain things that I I think programming is like that even though a lot of people wouldn't say there's an artistic element to it, there's certainly more than what most people think. I don't think just a computer. You can tell it, hey, write me a program to do this and it's going to do it in a way. Like when it comes to like UX user experience, how would a computer know what a human user experience should look like? You know, yep, is that creativity, you know, portion or side of it that that computer cannot do, you know, at least at this point. Well, yeah. Well, who knows what what will happen in a few decades. You're right. Yeah. Well, again, that's probably the biggest story tech related story of the past year was the the rise of AI because especially for the first three months of this year, that's all anybody talked about. But by far the biggest Linux specific story of the past year, of course, has been red hat and it basically trying to close source some of its assets so that the red hat enterprise Linux clones like Alma and Rocky and Oracle can't just make a straight one to one clone of their operating system. Of course, that's all a lot of backlash from users in the Linux community, mainly because a lot of users of Rocky Alma, you know, those guys are wondering what the hell's going to happen to our distribution, you know, and a lot of them are still mad about what happened with Centos. Yeah, the Centos was an extremely popular server distribution that red hat just you know, put the ax down on. So what are your thoughts on that? And as that particular decision by red hat, has that affected you and your work? Yeah, I think it's I think it's wrong. Just overall, I mean, if you start it off down that path of, you know, open source, don't close it out to to the world just on a whim. And it looks as though it's just it's just about money, you know, it is kind of weird to what, you know, I get the money thing. But if you began as free and open source software, the whole point of any free and open source license is somebody can take your work and do whatever the hell they want with it, have to rename it or whatever. You know, there may there's some other things to the like each license, but essentially all of them grant somebody the ability to take that fork it and do something else with it. They so it's weird now. We don't want people to be able to do this. Well, you and you're not really an open source company. Yeah. If you don't think people should be able to do that. Yeah. And it's it's because they they, I don't know if their share is going down. It's worth market shares going down in any way, but they've always been heavy on the, you know, business side of things, you know what I'm saying, offering support. And that's why a lot of organizations put their trust in red hat because of the support that they have. I don't know if that's, you know, it is interesting. Yeah. Oh, go ahead. I was going to say what you said about as far as market shares, as far as revenue because obviously it's a public company. It's IBM now owns red hat, but I mean IBM, what did they pay for red hat? It was, I want to say it's 20 some odd billion dollars. Like they make money. Like it's not, they're not broke. Right. And I would argue that the people that are not using red hat enterprise Linux on the server, if they were a sent off user or going to the Debian or Ubuntu route on the server, which a lot of people do, and then they're not, they were never going to use red hat enterprise Linux anyway. Yeah. You know, like the same thing with Rocky and Alma users, if they're using those to avoid paying for a red hat license, they were never going to pay for that license anyway. Even now, if Alma and Rocky went away, they probably just spin up a Debian server. They're not going to, they're not going to go, okay, you got me. Let me pay my $50. No, they're not going to do that. Yeah. And one thing he's starting to see though, as well with this, they have to provide these images out to these cloud platforms. They have to have a legit, you know, image up there. And so the GPL license demands that anybody that wants the source code has to be able to ask you for it and you provide it in some way. Yeah. You either have to have it public on the internet, like on GitHub, GetLab, something like that or still putting it out there on physical media, whether it be disc or tape or what, you know, going back before the days of the internet, that was still a legitimate way to abide by the license. But yeah, you're technically in legal trouble if you license, have something licensed under a free license and people can't get the source code from you. Yeah. And somebody could sue you and you would be in trouble. Yeah. And one of the problems I'm seeing and this might affect the market share as well. But a lot of these cloud platforms are basically taking Red Hat and creating their own Linux distribution. I just, I just reviewed those at Amazon Linux. It's a Red Hat clone. It's essentially the exact same thing as Red Hat. And so, well, that's all Oracle is, which I don't know why anybody would want to pay Oracle money instead of Red Hat. Like, I was like, okay, let me not pay this devil and go pay this other one because Oracle is definitely not a friend of open source. Yeah. I don't want to get off on that. I don't want to get off on that because I know. Yeah, but, but Amazon, they, I mean, they're the biggest cloud platform, you know, in the world currently. And so they're pushing their own Linux distro, you know what I'm saying? That's basically based on Red Hat. So I don't know. Now going back to some of your work on servers and with IT and system administrations, things like that. Obviously, you most of the time don't have a desktop environment. You're doing a lot of things at the command line. And I have to ask, what is your favorite terminal text editor? Are you a Vi, Vim, Nano, Ed? But to be honest, I've, I've been using Nano. It's just been hard to get away from Nano. I started out using Nano. That was the first text editor. I actually learned how to use or edit configuration files and different things like that is Nano. So I'm just so used to using it. I just automatically type it without thinking about it. But Vi and Vim, you know, it's, it's, they're, they're, they're good. You know what I'm saying? They're good to use. It's just I haven't been able to transition to them to use them full-time. You know, I, I, you know, I, I learned Vim five, six years ago. So it's not like I've been using it forever. But I mean, have you ever, I'm sure you've probably run into a situation where you SSH into a machine or something. And the only editor on this thing is Vi. A lot of times. Sometimes you end up stuck there. And I know before I really learned Vi. I had to use Vi a lot. You know, like every time I'd end up in it. Okay. How do I move around? How do I quit the damn thing? Yeah, this is why I add stuff. Oh, right. So, you know, I learned just enough to where I knew how to make an edit, a small edit and get out. But I never really learned how to use it until much later. And I kind of regretted after I learned it, like, oh, this is kind of cool. Like, I should have learned this before. Yeah. Yeah. That's, that's one thing I like, I always see like, I remember was that Luke Smith a long time ago. He would be doing all those with the key bindings and different things. And I was just over with. Cool thing with a, well, with Vi, you can't, you can't play with it too much. But Vim, you can heavily configure it, but even just stock Vim with no configuration. It's a pretty dang good text editor. So it's not like, you know, just, you're on a server and all you've got is Vim straight out of the box. For example, it's actually a very comfortable text editor if you know how to navigate it. But, but nano, that's interesting use. You're very comfortable with nano. I always found the key bindings and nano confusing. Oh, okay. Because they're not like any other program like those weird like copy and paste and things. Yeah. And the cut. Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's, um, I don't know. See, I started off with Ubuntu, you know, and nano was there. Always. Yeah. They don't even install Vim on a matter of fact, I have all that bug report on camera. Many times about Ubuntu. You've probably seen me every time I install Ubuntu, it'd be the desktop or the server, whatever it happens to be. I always talk about Vim's not installed out of the box and H top's not installed out of the box. What are you doing Ubuntu? Like you got to have those two programs. Yup. Yup. Matter of fact, I complained about it enough that one of the, uh, community additions of Ubuntu, I think it's the Lubuntu team. Oh, they saw me complained about it enough. They added Vim and H top. So Lubuntu, you know, two thumbs up. Cool. Cool. Now, another thing I did want to ask you is a long time Linux user at this point. You've been using Linux long enough that everyone has a horror story when it comes to Linux, whether you formatted the wrong disk, you deleted your root file system, things like that. What's the worst mistake that you've ever made on Linux? Oh man, I'm feeling embarrassed myself, but I've got some stories. So you're not going to be the only one. I basically deleted. It's a very short story, but I basically ran though. I was trying to, I was trying to restore my home directory. I don't know on a new system and I just deleted before operating system. I basically ran a move command in the wrong direction. Yeah, in the wrong. Yeah. And yeah, it just started dying right in front of my eyes and I started crying. I've seen that with the DD command. Yeah, because you've got the input file and output. Yeah. And if you if you mix them up. Yeah. Yeah. Now, I've had that happen with DD. I've had DD where you're writing to and most of my machines, I have multiple drives because I find I hate dual booting and partitioning a drive. I like every operating system to be on their own drive. But like in this machine, I've got six drives. Okay. So I've got SDA, SDB and you know, it's really easy to not remember which drive is which and to format SDB when you really should have formatted SDC or whatever it happens to be. And then you realize I just wiped out something. I really didn't mean to wipe out. Yeah. I've done that a few times. I deleted my entire home directory. Just a couple of months back. Oh, man. On my home computer by accident. I did a RMRF. And I guess I didn't know where the hell I was in the the directory structure. I was I was inside my home directory. The home directory still existed. I deleted everything in it. So slash home slash DT now an empty directory. Yeah, that's that's painful. Yeah. And that's the growing pains of, you know, learning it, you know, I'm saying it is it's a lot of commands out there that you can really mess up your system. Yeah. You know, with so just like I quit. I actually quit using the DT command after like the second or third time that I meant had a misstep with it because you know, everybody has a nickname for it. They call it what the disk destroyer. Yeah. The data deleter. It has a whole bunch of different names. I never understood that until the first time I did that. I was like, oh, okay. Yeah, because one of the one. Yeah, that's that's the main. I would say one of the main from from what I remember from the documentation because I did a video on a while back, but that's one of the main marketed things about this that that actual program is to wipe a disk and then I think you can do it multiple times and you'll reset DLD standard or whatever. You know, that's one of those things. I do so much stuff at the terminal is because so many of these command line applications are just fantastic. I'm more convenient most of the time than the GUI. But when people see me on camera like flash a flash something to a USB stick, I pull up a program like Etcher. Why didn't you just DD? I don't trust myself with DD. Plus Etcher has that built-in safety feature where it will only write to an external USB device. It won't write to it internal. So you can't overwrite one of your system drives, which I find a nice touch. How often do you have to work with Windows machines or Mac machines? Every day. I do. Yeah. Well, I'm actually a database administrator. So I work on a bunch of Windows servers managing those databases database management systems. So you spend a lot of time on Windows servers. Yeah. Yeah. A lot. You spend probably you spend more time on Windows servers than Linux servers. Yeah, pretty much. Well, probably one of the things I think I've gotten it's become a little bit more. Well, I spend more time on both, you know what I'm saying or the equivalent amount of time on both because I work from I currently work from home. So yeah. So when you have to use Windows or Mac or, you know, non-Linux operating systems, do you ever find them limiting because of your experience with Linux or you ever find them not as good in some areas? Yeah. I do. Well, I did a while back. It's starting to get a lot better. You're starting to see a lot more, more things in Windows that are really a benefit similar to what you would see in Linux. As far as the command line, we're starting to learn from the competitions. Yes. Essentially. Yep. Yep. Because PowerShell is is awesome, man. It's a little scripting language for the operating system. They realized that they were losing all the developers because the bad shell and all the good new core utils and all of that is so fantastic. And then for years Windows didn't really want to have a proper terminal. Yeah. They didn't really want a proper command line experience, proper shell. And then like, hey, you know, everybody's using this Linux thing. Why? That's why. Yep. They, they took from the competition, but yeah. PowerShell is, oh, go ahead. I was going to say, you know, Microsoft obviously has become a lot more friendly regarding open sourcing a lot of their software. I think they've seen why Linux is successful. It's that open source model really is the main reason for Linux's success. No other reason. It's open source is the reason. Linux is where it's at. Yeah, definitely. Definitely. I agree. I agree. And that's why you're starting to see that subset for Linux on Windows. You know, Windows subsystem for Linux. Is that something you play around in a lot? No, I haven't, I haven't really played around with it because I don't have a, I haven't either. Yeah. Yeah. Even though I work on Windows every day, I don't have a need for it. Now I would probably see it more on a developer side. If I was a developer, you'd probably see it there. But yeah, just managing servers, remote desktop management, typically where I live. I did want to ask you one other thing about your desktop computer use, especially on Linux. Do you game at all on Linux? Now, that's one thing I haven't went back to. It's been, it's been a while. I have game in the past. I used to play League of Legends a whole lot on Linux. That was like one of really the only game I would play is League of Legends. I would spend that up when I had some time and run that on there. Was that a native Linux game? Or were you running that in mine? No, this was after I finally switched over to Orch. I was able to get it out the AUR. And yeah, and I just hopped in and started playing it. I got hooked on it for a while, but I haven't recently been playing because I've always had systems. I've always had the, you know, either a PlayStation or Xbox at some point. So I've always played around with those, those systems more than on my computers. My computers, I always saw them as work, you know what I'm saying? Cause I do that every day at my normal job. I'm sitting in front of a server. I'm sitting in front of some computers. So that's just a change by, you know, having another system and a TV I can go play with. So exactly. That's the thing with a console. You can sit in front of that really nice big screen TV and play your first person shooter or whatever we're on a computer monitor is just not quite the same. Yeah. Yeah. And I, and I would say I didn't, I stopped playing Windows. Yeah. I stopped playing regular games on a computer, like in high school or something like that. And I never really went back. And so I never, I lost my, you know, my, my gaming hands, so to speak. If you want to use to call it that, well, how, you know, I don't know all the keys anymore. I used to know all those keys and be able to move the mouse around like real quick. But yeah, I lost all that because I can relate because I was, I was the same way as far as my teens, early twenties, gaming a lot. And then I just, you know what, I don't want to do this anymore. I just quit forever. And now I'll occasionally fire up a game like some of the open source games on Linux. Some of the first person shooters like Zanadek or Sauerbrot and you know, things like that play for like 10 minutes. But it's not something, not like it was when you're young where you can play hours every day for like six weeks because you got to complete this big campaign in some game. I got, I don't have time for that. Well, you got any contact information that you would like to disclose? How would the people that want to get in touch with you or, you know, just check out some of your amazing content and social media. You got any links? Keeping techie everywhere. So I'm on a lot of the social media platforms. I am on Odyssey as well. So keeping techie over there as well and on YouTube, of course. And you can contact me. Like one thing I do is I do a lot of mentorship where I help younger people try to navigate the tech industry and because it's difficult. When I was first coming in, there was no one telling me what direction to go, like what certifications to look into or what trainings to look into. I was just kind of filling around in a dork and making decisions based on the information I can gather myself. But it would have been great if someone was there to say, Hey, you're interested in this. Well, let me tell you this about this program or let me tell you about this certification that can get you there a little bit faster. Instead of you, you know, fumbling. So I try to do that now for people that are running to either through my channel or, you know, on these various social media platforms and I do offer mentorship for free like 50, like for 30 minutes or so. Just quick mentorship where we get in there and we talk straight. Hey, what are you trying to do? Let me help you decide on what direction to go in order to, you know, in order for you to be successful. And so that's that's one of the things I do. So if you guys are interested, you can as I always post it every now and then on my channel, just hit me up and I try to help people with that. That is incredible. Josh, not only do you provide some fantastic content on YouTube, you're just genuinely a good guy. Given that free time like that, that is amazing because there's not too many people like that out there. Yeah. Yeah, I want to thank you for that and thank you for talking to me today and best of luck to you as far as your channel and all your endeavors and work in life. Yeah, I appreciate it. Appreciate it. Thanks. Thanks, Josh. All right. Peace. Bye bye.