 Alright, so what was our third topic? Sonic. Sonic Forces. Oh boy. So, we learned some cool things about Sonic Forces. Got some new footage. Got insight into something Sonic has never done before. They are letting us make our own characters. Say what? Now, oh my god, video games making our own characters. How original. It is actually. This is akin to Mario letting you make your own character. I akin to Zelda being like, hey, here's a character creator, go to town. This is not something that you would ever expect out of Sonic. Now, Sonic has always had a history of adding new characters, shoehorned in, yada yada, that don't work over the years and don't stick with the franchise, but this is different because this is a character created character that they've already gotten into the game no matter how you create it and how it's going to work and they show gameplay of one of the type of characters that look really, really good. More like a classic Sonic level setup, the 2D side scrolling, but with its own twist, with the whip, and just different ways to traverse the world, it looked really fun. This looked like with Sonic Boom when they tried to make other characters come in and do all these things. This looks like what Sonic Boom probably should have been. Not a beat them up platforming weird thing that it was. But they really nailed it, I think, with this character creator. And I know that there's some people that think, oh great, now all these people that are making their own Sonic characters and deviant art are going to get their say, it's all ridiculous and all the fan fiction that's going to come out of this. So what? Exactly. It's not like Sonic 8. It's not like Sonic games have been this big, massive, 10 plus million seller every time it's come out over the past 20 years. Let's be honest about the Sonic franchise. If it didn't team with Mario for Sonic and Mario at the Olympics, I don't know that Sonic would even still be around. Right. Nintendo is kind of saving Sonic. Yeah. Now obviously Sonic Forces is coming out on all the platforms, all the major platforms, so it's not like an exclusive, but still it's one of those things where, let's just be honest, Sonic hasn't had a lot of relevance outside of Nintendo. Like Nintendo got Sonic Lost World. And that was a decent Sonic game. Parts of it were great. Parts of it were not so great. But the point is that if it wasn't for that game, the lasting memory that we'd have of Sonic right now, Sonic Boom, and that wasn't good. So it's like we need to understand that Sonic is not a highly successful franchise right now. It's a long standing franchise. To me it's almost, I hate saying this, Nintendo fans are really going to kill me. It's like Metroid. Metroid has never had a game sell more than like 4.5 million copies. And the average game sales per Metroid game release is like 1.5 billion. It's not that much. There's indie games that are series that sell consistently higher than Metroid does. Just to put that in perspective, that doesn't mean that Metroid is not fantastic. It's a very niche game. The thing is is that side scrolling or 3D platformers, that's not really a niche genre. That's a highly popular genre. The fact that Sonic hasn't been able to sell very well and it tells you they haven't been making very good games. Well, that's also because they've strayed from the side scrolling 2D. Yes, there are a lot of good games again, but on the same platform it's like Sonic Generations. Awesome on 3DS. Fantastic. Yeah. What was that one that was just absolutely beyond terrible? Wasn't it like Sonic 2000? Sonic 06. Yeah, Sonic 06. That was what started the massive downturn. Yeah. Then there's Sonic Adventures. Yeah. I know Sonic 06 was just absolutely terrible. There's been a lot of bad Sonic games. And there are some people that like them. Some people just like bad games. It's okay. I like bad movies apparently. It's okay. What are people like? They exist for a reason. There are people that like it. But Sonic isn't this franchise that I feel like is so holy that you can't do this too. Because it needs a kick in the butt. Yeah, it needs to reinvent itself, I think. And it's funny because reinventing itself is just doing what it's always done so far. What we've seen. Right. To decide scrolling. Right. But doing it right. Like people want it to be. Now that doesn't mean there won't be 3D-like levels. We don't know everything about Sonic Forces yet. We'll find a ton of E3. But just the character creator stuff. It looks really, really interesting. Really fun. A way to reinvigorate the series. And the fact that it's not like it's this instead of Sonic. You still have New Age Sonic and Classic Sonic mixed into the mix. And you'll be playing as those two as well in their own stages. Yeah. So you're still getting Sonic. It's still very much a Sonic game. But it's just they're introducing this extra element to it that I think is really going to appeal to people. And I am stoked. I think it looks good. I mean, the Sonic Forces look good to you? I was never a gigantic Sonic fan. But it does look like it's fun. I don't know if I actually will purchase it or not. But it'll be something that I would definitely play. I mean, to try it out. Well, I like it in it like this. You have the side-scrolling Mario games versus a game like Super Mario 64 or Super Mario Odyssey. You're more likely. You like those 3D platforms. You like the Super Mario Odyssey, the Super Mario 64. You're a hell of a lot more likely to pick up. Super Mario 64 was probably one of my favorite games. Yeah. Like you're more likely to pick up that than you are, say, New Super Mario Brothers. A side-scrolling Mario game. It's just classic Mario. I mean, don't get me wrong. Oh, it's good. I know you played a lot of classics. But just think of today, you have Super Mario Odyssey or you have a New Super Mario Brothers 4 Switch. Which one are you playing? Yeah, I'm going to easily go with Odyssey. And that's the thing. You didn't say, oh, I'm going to get both. No. You should not. Right. I mean, it's not that I wouldn't. No. I got it for you for a present. But it's not something you're like, I'm going to go buy it. It's not something I need to go buy. And I think that's the way you're going to be. Odyssey is something that seems like it's something I need to go buy. Yes. Because it's going to be, you know, it has that feel of the sunshine and 64 kind of. It's got that feel of classic 3D open world platform. Right. Which there aren't really a lot of those anymore. And it's really weird when the genre vanished because it kind of vanished a little bit around the play. The kind of the GameCube PlayStation 2 era that kind of started fading away. I don't really understand why because there were some of the most popular games during the prior generation. So it was really weird. Some of it was that obviously the people that make them, like Nintendo, Sunshine didn't do as well. So they kind of took a break. And then you had, what was it? Rare got bought by Microsoft. And then they just for some reason made a really crappy Mandrill-Kazooie game. Don't remind me of that. Killed off any possibility of them continuing. Oh, why did you even bring that up? But see Sonic has had a lot of crappy 3D attempts at 3D platforming stuff. And it's still alive. And that's why I said it's like Metroid where Metroid has had high quality games. I know some people argue if other M is good or not. I think it's fantastic, but whatever. It has had consistently pretty high quality games. But it's in a niche genre that can't get more popular than it really is. Versus Sonic that can have a Mario like effect. It can get up to 8, 10, 15 million if it's really dang good. And they just haven't been there. It's almost like Mega Man. Like Mega Man 9. They released that as a digital download way back in the day. Not even way back. Maybe, what was it, five years, eight years ago? I don't remember. It was a little bit ago, but it was like last generation. And it was them returning. It was literally a classic Mega Man, new levels. Oh, yeah, yeah. And that sold extremely well. Because people liked Mega Man. They just didn't like what they did with it after Mega Man X. Mega Man X was fantastic. A couple games that were based on Mega Man X were fine. Then they started straying from the formula, trying to make it a 3D thing and it just didn't work. And that's kind of what happened with Sonic, I feel, is Lost World was great, but in general 3D Sonic games haven't necessarily worked that well. And I think that's why I'm so excited with Sonic Forces is because it's them going back to what made the series great in the first place, recognizing what made the series great. And if they do explore some 3D stuff, maybe they'll take some lessons from games that have done it. Like when people are like, oh, well, Sonic, Sonic Generations, or Sonic Colors, or whatever, was good. And it's like, but why was it good? It was a 2D side scrolling Sonic game. Yup. I mean, why was Mega Man 9 great? Because it was classic Mega Man side scrolling awesomeness. I think Sonic Forces has a chance to blow up. I definitely don't think it's a game that you'd be into as much. I think if Sonic 06 would have been awesome, you might have started buying more into Sonic because he would have been like, look at 3D platforming. Gotta go fast in 3D platforming, that's sweet. But Chili Dogs, the old cartoon series, were probably two more than the actual games. But I think Sonic Forces is a game that is setting itself up very nicely to hit with old school Sonic fans. And I'm hoping that, and I think this is always the great hope for all Sonic games, is that it lives up to the expectations it's setting for itself now. Because this feels like this is almost a franchise revival game. And it feels weird saying that because they've been Sonic games, but we all know it hasn't been doing well. It hasn't been healthy. When Mario and Sonic at the Olympic Games are outselling Sonic games, it's a problem. Because Mario and Sonic at the Olympic Games isn't exactly like huge sellers. They sell enough to exist, but we're not talking about Mario Kart numbers here. Mario Kart sells so well, it does outsell several Mario games sometimes. But, man, I have high hopes. And maybe it's just because I'm still really into 2D, there's a ton of 2D side scrollers. But, and part of it is because of Nintendo, when they brought new Super Mario Brothers, new Super Mario Bros. Wii U, but all those games out, they were so good, and Mario Maker is fantastic. It's like I'm really into this side scrolling thing, right now, I think, is just kind of the way it is. And because I liked Sonic when I was a kid. I didn't want a Genesis to a little later, but I played the first couple of Sonic games, loved them. I played everything up until Sonic 06, and then that kind of turned me off. And I've played Sonic games since, but it's just, I've always felt like Sonic is missing something, and this almost feels like it has that something. Now here's the catch. It's like, when they say there's a Zelda cycle with fans about how, oh, they love a game when it first comes out, then they slowly start hating it, start hating it, start hating it, start talking about how the prior game that they were hating on is now better and amazing compared to the newer game. And then it runs, it repeats from the new game, it's announced and yadda yadda yadda yadda. Well, it's almost like there's a Sonic cycle as well, where this Sonic cycle isn't actually a fan-based. It's actually, well, it's a little bit of fan-based, but it's based on Sega. They first show the game, they tease it, they tease it, tease it, looks good, looks good, everyone starts buying the hype a little bit, they're just like, oh man, this is the good Sonic game. Then it comes out and it's like, oh shit. Yep, thank you. Like that's why I'm a Sonic Boom, because Sonic Boom was made, was pubbed, that it was being made by people at Big Red Button who are former Naughty Dog developers. What does the Naughty Dog make? Some of those popular games in the world, The Last of Us, Uncharted. You know, like they make massive, huge Sony games that have this huge appeal and you just feel like, dude, yes, it's a very different type of game from what they're making, but we're talking about people that know what they're doing, right? Yeah. And, in terms of it, they didn't know what they were doing. So, that's always the thing. Like, we're going to get hyped and excited. I just hope it doesn't have that let down, because I think if it does, especially if this game is more focused on side-scrolling, than the 3D platforming aspect, I don't think it's going to be it. I don't think there's ever it for Sonic. Yeah. But... It's going to be close to fork time for Sonic. It's going to be like Metroid. It's going to be like, we're putting it on a shelf for a while. Yeah. Because Metroid, again, we haven't had any new games. The other game was back in 2011. Maybe it was 2010, I can't remember. I don't know when we're getting a new Metroid game. I mean, yes, we had Metroid Federation Forces, but the Metro fans really want me talking about that game. That wasn't exactly a good game. I think it's a good game. It really is, but, like, I think if there had been a Metroid game announced, it would have been received a lot better. I do want to also twist this into something that I did not put on the topic sheet, but just came to my head because we were talking about Sega. Sega put up plans to 2020 or race to 2020 or whatever. Some sort of plan that clearly is everything's building up to 2020. And the idea is that they are trying to refocus the company on their core IPs and bring back a lot of dead franchises that they have in their core library. That they haven't seen, they just haven't been over it. They literally say, like, our plan is to revive these games and revive them across the spectrum, whether it's on mobile, whether it's on, you know, PC or consoles, whatever. Whatever way they best feel. Like, there'll be some franchise in the past that really might not make sense as a full AAA game today. And there'll be some franchises, like, say, the Knights franchise that makes sense bringing back as another 3D platformer. So, what's interesting here is they also released three videos that show I don't want to say a rebranding, but almost like trying to create a new image for Sega. So one of them is showing, like, I guess probably what they're going to start using in commercials a lot more in the future of future games. It's an eyeball animation, like of a person's face with Sega in the eye. Kind of like a reflection thing. Look at how she looks really sick. Yeah. And it's like, okay, so in that they're kind of turning, like, okay, Sega's back to, like, like, this is a very, like, we're a badass kind of thing. Not the who you put your touch on. Sega! Like, the thing is, like, it's cute for kids. It is cute for kids. But it's kind of like one of those, like, if you're going to do that. I know I say that nostalgia. I know I get it newer generations, not going to give a crap about the old Sega. Not going to care. But, again, I'm folks, I'm well aware it's just a bygone era and new generation people don't give a crap. They're going to be like, that was crappy sound quality and who cares. But, they may be right. They probably are right. I know it's a total nostalgia thing. It is. They also went to a making of video where they show the making of that whole thing. Because it looks real person's face and how they made that all work. And then they go into some deep details behind the company with one of their key people behind one of their long lost IPs and just kind of just looks all ominous and all foreboding of a fantastic epic comeback for something. Doesn't tell you what it is. I think it's interesting because Sega out of all the companies that exist in the gaming world I feel like Sega has probably had the hardest fall from grace. We just talked about it's a mascot Sonic hasn't been relevant with a good game for 20 plus years. Okay, that's sort of to say good. A great absolutely fantastic instant classic. Mario has had it. It had it with Super Mario Galaxy. It hasn't had it in the last generation 3D World didn't really be in that instant classic but it feels like they're going to do it again with Super Mario Odyssey. Zelda just did it again with Breath of the Wild. Sony did it with Uncharted. Microsoft did it with Master Chief for a while. We'll see what they have coming now because the Halo games haven't really hit as hard. Microsoft has probably got something up their sleeve for Scorpio that might just say you have a scale ball and sound like it might be it. They got canned and now there's rumors out there that it might be coming back under a different studio Microsoft re-upped the licensing for it so we'll see why would you re-upt the licensing for an IP that doesn't exist anymore if you're not doing something with it. Apparently the reason they got canned is there was issues with development in Platinum. In Japan's really damn good development. Those are the ones that made Bayonetta. With the 1 or 4 on 1 they make fantastic games but apparently there was issues with it so whatever Microsoft had to pull the plug or maybe they didn't pull the plug maybe they just moved it to a different studio we'll see. The point I'm making is that of all the big companies out there there's always that thing that just hits and with Sega they haven't had a lot of Megaton hits in the console race. Now they did have games that sold well I think one of their major IPs right now is the PC exclusive Total War franchise and that's made by I think it might be made by Creative Assembly which is a subsidiary of Sega so it's not even Sega's main studio is doing it per se it's just a studio they own it's kind of like the Nintendo with Retro Studios Retro Studios made Donkey Kong Tropical Freeze a fantastic game but there's some people that to this day they call it a second party game even though it's technically a first party because it's a Nintendo studio but Nintendo bought the studio they didn't found the studio so that's kind of where people get into that whole first party for second party first party is where the console maker founded the studio that made it versus bought the studio that made it anyways so I'm really interested in this Sega thing they obviously have a huge table of IP they have a ton of exclusive IP that they just haven't used in forever for a lot of various reasons lots of money they focused on the games that were selling when they went to become a game company a game making company only I'm excited a little bit now I was not a Sega kid growing up I was on that playground already and Nintendo over Sega Nintendo over Sega and again I know I put up a video of console wars that mattered I was a kid once I bought into that stuff and as an adult now I realized how stupid that was but so I was a Nintendo kid obviously I'm a Nintendo Prime if I was a Sega kid I'd probably run Sega Prime or I would have kept Shogun Total Gaming alive because I loved the Total War series and at the time I wasn't even called the Total War series there was only Shogun so it was like Shogun Total Gaming I don't know why I'm using a Japanese Shogun thing I could just call it Total Gaming I think I actually was going to call it Total Gaming but someone I think that domain name was taken and it was moving on to something that matters stuff that's actually to my relevant I just sat here explaining all the stuff about Sega and kind of what they were trying to do and their road to 2020 um are you excited you weren't a Sega guy I played more Sega games than you right I didn't know Sega I did play some I'm excited to see what they have coming forward just to you know what they have in their back pocket what they're going to go hey remember this hey remember this especially if it's good the thing is Sega does have some good game I mentioned Total War I think they mentioned in this road to 2020 that right now their company's been kind of focused around 5 IPs and these 5 IPs have generally been really high quality games that they've been focusing on with the Total War I don't know how I'm going to get this wrong I'm not going to say it I'm going to say a game that I think is Sega but I'm not sure see here's the thing that's how far Sega's kind of fell out where like even the games that are Sega some like if I say hey Eric what's what's popular Sega franchise today you'd be like no son Total War and what yeah and it's like okay well they have a few others but you just don't know them because especially if you've been a Nintendo person because they haven't been on Nintendo platforms very much so as we push forward I'm excited because this is a company that has obviously made enough money in the past decade, two decades where they can now say look we're looking to expand we're in an industry now where everything's shrinking AAA studios are closing people aren't getting paychecks at places like Crytek and it's causing issues and people not knowing what to do with their families and here's a company in Japan and Sega that originally downsized and had to go down to just software only and then down to just a handful of select IPs that are selling well for them to being like hey look we think we could be a massive player the likes of Ubisoft the likes of EA the likes of even Nintendo or even Sony's output where they're like we think we can make a comeback with our hardcore stable of IP and become this behemoth in the industry again and not just this company that makes we have a handful of good games but they come out in a few years or whatever right and they're not forgetting those titles they're still making Total War Total War Warhammer that came out a couple years ago fantastic it might be the best Total War game that's ever released even if you don't like Warhammer that's how good it is that Warhammer and the Total War IP mixed so well together and how that game functions I even think there's not going to be a Total Warhammer 2 coming out the thing is I've never been big in the Warhammer I did play the Warhammer online game for a little while the MMO it was good but it didn't grip me like World of Warcraft did still I am really really excited what's happening with Sega and maybe it's because I played a little more like one game I'll always remember on the Genesis I don't even know if this is a Sega game but I don't remember playing any other platform Rampart yeah love that game you guys want to talk about games this was a tower defense game basically okay you had your little castle you built it with like pieces that looked like out of straight out of Tetris and you had oncoming ships coming to blow up your castle and I think it was taking out the fort I think they were trying to get to the fort shoot at the fort and throughout the game you get moments where you finally go to the ships and you get a moment to rebuild but your rebuild was based on how successful you were so like how many ships didn't take out how many shots didn't take out so how many cannons you get to build and you don't ever know what your next piece is going to be so if you get a piece that looks really funky how am I going to place that because you need to enclose the area in order to build cannons in there a really really fun game I loved it and got stolen I think I know who took it but that's another story from that time it's another story you guys will probably never hear about but if they own like the rights to that I would love to see like a series on that come back I'm just excited by the prospect of Sega being like look we want to be a major player again we think we have the financial backing to do it we already have some successful IP here's an example and I think if Sonic because that's always been like their centerpiece Sonic was the centerpiece of Sega's glory days even on the game gear Sonic was the best game on game gear right yeah it was good Sonic was still great so I think that is actually the one Sonic game that I actually owned yeah yeah fantastic game so it's one of those things where I think if this Sonic Forces game hits huge this year that's their first step of pilloring into bringing back their past in new ways so I hope it goes well for them I do too I'm not pre-ordering Sonic Forces now I need to play demo I need to see more of it I need to know more I need to be on board for Sega trying to become a major player again and become a major player in a way that hopefully they continue to bring all the stuff to Nintendo obviously that's obviously my hope but if they bring it to Xbox whatever I'll get it wherever if they're good I just like good games and if Sega is going to get back into the good game territory I am oh baby just imagining a time in the future Nintendo is hitting on all cylinders Sega is hitting on all cylinders Sony is hitting on all cylinders Microsoft is hitting on all cylinders Steam and Valve if they ever decide to release new games start hitting on all cylinders which again that's the more far off dream Valve starts making games again instead of just focusing on Steam and making money games making money too you remember the Steam platform the only reason it got popular is because you forced people to get it with Half-Life 2 just telling you that your games are why Steam mattered in the first place so let's let's get on that now it's one of those things where just imagining where all the main pillars of gaming even EA and Ubisoft say they all are just hitting on everything imagine the world the triple A gaming we could live in oh I know that'd be just absolutely nuts it's a world that's really even existed what are we back in the 90s back in the 90s plus Microsoft wasn't part of that you know I don't think Ubisoft was as big back then yes I know there is some people wanted me to talk about this week Vivendi trying to buy out Ubisoft it doesn't sound like it's happening folks sounds like the price might be too high you can thank Ubisoft for that because Ubisoft went ahead and just made a ton of money in the past year making their stock prices jump way high which made Vivendi potentially unable to purchase a majority stake and take over the people that are up about that is Vivendi did the same thing Activision Activision eventually made enough money to buy all the shares back but it was one of those things where Vivendi took control that's kind of when things started to become annualized and people felt like quality started dropping and they were worried about having that happen with Ubisoft they took a break with Assassin's Creed but now we're going to get two Assassin's Creed games a year we're going to get washdogs every single year we're going to stop getting new IPs and just start focusing on four franchises and just getting them out really really fast which affects quality and again Ubisoft already has some issues with that but lately they've been doing a little better the division came out I know that it's not one of their biggest games but it was pretty good Washdogs 2 was fantastic they're bringing out Raymond and Legends again the definitive edition that's always going to be fun I just want to see an industry where everyone's hitting good because it's good for us variety in life and spice different development teams being really really good it's just good for everyone and man Sega outside of a handful of IPs hasn't been that level since the 90's let's bring it back Sega I wish you luck I hope you pull it off I want you I want to want your games mm-hmm what was that sort of war I always want to I'm a dick sucker anyways and that's going to do it for this podcast I think I hope you guys enjoyed it I hope you guys enjoyed it you can follow us on Twitter you can follow me personally on Twitter if you have any topics you'd like us to discuss any fan topics you can always email those or you can talk about it down in the comments on this video or on the site I read all of it I'm one of those crazy people I read all of the dang YouTube comments which if people know that that can give you cancer I think and you can get cancer from reading all the comments I read all the comments on social media as well it's almost like a full time job just to read comments but I can't help it one thing I like at Nintendo Private is just being kind of personal with the fans and being part I don't want to ever feel like we're up here and you're down here we are with you we're not voices for you we are our own voices but we are fans along with you we're not always going to want the same things we're not always going to have the same opinions we definitely don't want people thinking like we're up here and you're down here this is hopefully a place of good discussion hopefully you can maybe hit our discussion that being said if you like this video if you like this podcast subscribe to our YouTube channel and if you don't then I don't know what you're even doing here I guess we'll never see you again it's nice knowing you thank you for watching this one it's better going to folks one thing I do want to mention I've been putting it in our video version but I don't ever talk about it we have a Patreon and obviously the Patreon is not quintessential to anything we've obviously been making this happen without it but it is something that I feel is essential to have these days not just because YouTube 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well yeah life you enjoy the life moves on enjoy the content you know enjoy the content we're gonna be here every week hopefully unless something bad happens hopefully nothing bad happens something always happens I swear stop talking now right that jinx it like me losing it mad and four Super Bowls in a row alright thanks for joining us on the Nintendo Prime podcast as always you folks have a good one later