 Hello everybody! If it's Wednesday, it's Warhammer and that must mean it's time for another episode of Warhammer Weekly. Joining me as always is our primary co-host tonight, Tyler. What's going on, buddy? I'm at. Good to be here. Good to have you. This is a Tyler primary week which makes our guest, Tom. So Tom has basically no responsibilities tonight. Hey, Tom. Oh, I feel so good. Hello, friends. Yeah, because normally you do so much work. All the work. We are five minutes late. Thanks to Tom. Yes, exactly. That's me working hard, friends. As per normal, I said it in the chat already, but I'll say it again. Hit like for Tom making a start late as per use. Of course, we're going to talk about Dawnbringers 3 tonight. Here it is. The long hunt. We're going to talk about this here book, this really awesome artwork that is not very much like the figure, but awesome artwork nonetheless. And we're going to get into it, get into the new armies, new models, all that kind of stuff, talk about what's good, what's bad, so on and so forth. And of course, we'll do story time too. Don't worry. I saw you might have been worried. You were like, but Vince, is there going to be a story time? I know it. I will keep you up to date on the hot, fresh gas. What's happening in the mortal realms? But of course first, the news. The news. Rumor engine. Yup. 40K. It is a 40K thing. Yeah. Yeah. Sisters of battle. Necromunda. Necromundi. Necromunda. One of those words. Unless we have a very unusual gauntlet and bracer on some AOS human, that is a 40K thing. Because like it just, it has like a sort of normalish looking bullet almost more than a bolt in it. And the arm up here in the top right, clearly like this, this bracer piece looks like a space marine-ish type armor. Not that it's exactly that, but that sort of thing. There you go. Yeah. Excellent. Love it. All right. Strange invitation on Warhammer Community. Yes. The Summer King returns. Rejoice. Like clearly leading us up for the new FEC announcement. We're going to hear more about that in story time today. So yeah, I mean it's like, it's just, it's saying, hey, here's the new FEC. The Summer King's back. They're here. Yeah. Get ready. It's fun. It's a cute little thing. How it was like, oh, it's food. And then we just like, you know, do a little scratchy thing and show you the real image. It was fun. Yeah. You'd be mad to miss it. Yeah. It's great. Very clever. Very clever. So. Got a call from a buddy of ours today who's going to be running some FEC at the championships of Warhammer in a few weeks. He's excited. I won't say his name because I don't know if that's supposed to be public, but. All right. Moving on. What is next? We have our first look at the Old World AOS edition. The old, I really enjoyed that the breakdown of the phases. I have a picture here. You mean it's, you mean slightly redeveloped AOS. Got it. You say that, but I don't feel that. I'll be honest with you. To me, this is just putting a bit of like this kind of stuff that they're doing now. Structural language. Yeah. On Warhammer Fantasy 8th edition. I saw some discussion of it feels like AOS hammered into fantasy and that's not what it all felt like to me. It felt like fantasy just like repolished. You know, they could have made some real big swings here. You've gotten rid of a turn sequence, could have made some you go I go choices, could have chosen a completely different thing, but they didn't. I mean, it's still going to be a rank and flank game where you have effectively six to seven game pieces that you're moving around that you have to paint 30 models to make one game piece. Right. And with angle shooting and all that kind of stuff there. It's really just updating the. I mean, we're assuming we're assuming angle shooting is going to be there, right? Like we're assuming that that's what the structure of the game is. We have no evidence of that. I mean, we know it's a rank and flank game, so it's almost. We do. We do. We do. All I'm all I'm wanting to acknowledge is that we don't know a lot. What we do know is that they cleaned up and reached with a structured or provided structure around phases. And in that, in some sense, it will be familiar to those that are coming to this from AOS. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. It's interesting enough to spread the magic throughout all of the phases, I suppose. Yeah, I mean, it's an elegant design from the standpoint of like having to do all the qualifications with like movement. Right. Like I was thinking about like you normally like they had to add like entire clauses to help communicate about the movement phase and stuff like that. And some of that could simply just get replaced by when these spells are happening or whatever in the movement phase. Sure. Sure. I mean, now you have to remember you have to look at your spell. You're going to have to know what type of spell it is and then know what phase that spell is meant to be used in. I mean, some of that inevitably is going to be in the like in the actual typing like on a spell card or whatever it'll say all that. Sure. There's game aids you can use to ease that transition. I don't disagree. But yeah, like, you know, interesting enough that frankly, it added a lot more questions than it did answers for me. I think obviously all these phases also have sub phases in them and stuff like that. Like they're very much bringing the modern like very structured, you know, sort of legally designed to classic warhammer fantasy archetypes. And so it's going to echo a lot of AOS and 40k because those both have that that kind of work done. Right. So. Yeah, it makes me wish I was familiar with Song of Mice and Fire and Kings of War and some of these other games. I mean. And like how much they're pulling from them. I'm sure they'll draw from from a Song of Ice and Fire War Conquest battles. Thrones game. War makers. Because, you know, it's relative to a well designed game. I played a game of a song. I found it to be all in all fairly uninteresting as a game. I don't mean any offense to somebody who likes it. It seems very simple. The thing I did really like about it, though, that I think was their inventive design that I have general or like genuine, sorry, admiration for is they have the idea of sort of NCOs, these sort of non combat officers. And there's like a back and forth thing you do with those people that can have them influence the battle. And to do with like various buffs and objective controls and stuff like that. And it's actually a really interesting concept to have models that aren't meant to go on the table ever. They're always meant to think like Tyrion and Sansa and people like that, right? And yeah, they're interesting in that they are still have an effect on the game. It's a really cool concept that I actually do generally think is a very creative design. And most importantly, what actually struck me about it was it's very, it has a strong, very similar to the world. Because these sort of, there's plenty of characters in that world that honestly rarely fight, but are still like obviously majorly impactful to the overall fate of the world, right? So anyways, yeah, I'm sure they'll draw on it some, I'm sure time will tell. Yeah, it'll be fun. Very good. I mean, I'm not going to play and I'm probably not going to buy anything, but it looks fun. Yeah, I mean, I'll play some old world. I mean, I'm sure I will give it a shot. I still have multiple old-world ready armies. So I'll at least get some games in to see, you know, what the situation is. Well, if you want to buy some high elves, let me know. I do not. I always hated high elves. I still do. The best thing they ever did was die. So I have no interest in them. They can get back in slanesh as far as I'm concerned. Do you still have a ton of high elves, Tom? I have so many. I don't know. No, and I even acquired like a collection or two over the last couple of years. And so like I actually have like hundreds of high elf models. Like I have two, I still have two skycutters new in box, for example, just to kind of cast some vision for what we're talking about here. So yes, I do have a lot of high elves. I am interested to learn more. I am interested to watch how this all evolves. That's what I'll say. It's it's going to be it's going to be interesting over time. Yeah, definitely. All right, meta watch. So we got our updated stats on win rates and another lovely video with Matt Rose and Nick on YouTube. You got some images for us. Sure do got it up now. So our armies outside the fat beetle on the top. OBR still up top at 58 KO at 57 flesh eater courts at 56. And then what's falling out the bottom night haunt at 44 just ever so close night haunt. You're almost there. And then scaven at 44 same thing. And then fire slayers at 43 and iron jaws at 42. Poor iron jaws. How the mighty have fallen down. Meanwhile, big wall up there like cruel boys at 45 and iron jaws at 42 are funny because the army harvesting the best parts from both of their corpses is up at like 54% one of the better performing armies in the meta. Weird. It's almost like if you take the best parts of both armies and shove it together under really strong allegiance rules, you get a pretty good force. Weird. So yeah, it's funny. It's funny to me because I look at those and I'm like poor FEC the new book is coming and there's only one way to go. Yeah, you're not wrong. You're not wrong. It's rare that it's like you got the syndrome of like the new book comes out they lose 4% and you're like, yeah, it's a success. Yeah. Yeah, like that's what we're talking about here. That's where we're going. Waffles enjoyer said will Old World be on the three year cycle. We have no idea. Waffles enjoyer it's it's made by specialist studio. They don't necessarily heed the same rules. So the main line studio has a three year refresh. Yes, but like the specialist studio that does horse heresy and will do the old world they have. They're a completely separate everything that there's no there's no unity in that chain until you come to like very senior management. So there you go. But yeah, overall, what do you think Tyler, what do you think about the results? Yeah, I mean, this is a pretty good looking field. Quite good looking. The KO, I suspect if we had the amount of games with KO, I would think that that's probably on the lower end. I feel like I'm not seeing a whole lot of KO hitting the tables in the last couple of months. So be curious. Yeah, it's got a plus or minus 4%. It's not too dramatically high. Looks like the fact one is a little higher there. Yeah, you can read how many games by the plus or minus because that show anything. So for example, bone split is at plus or minus 13% tells you no one is playing bone splitters. I'm prepared to go away. Enjoy the last year of your army. Okay. This is it folks. This is the final farewell tour because the next time an army book comes up, my very strong suspicion is you will not be in it. And my guess is it'll be one unified or a core clan's book that combines iron jaws and cool boys into just one army and dispatches a big walk concept. Yeah. So do you think that iron jaws would be a sub faction of that then? I don't know. There's 10 different ways they could do it within there to incentivize. Here's what happens when you do this. You take this general, you get this battle line. This general opens up this allegiance ability. There's different things you could do. Clearly. I'm not going to dictate the design. I'm just saying at a high level that feels like the very obvious move. So I mean whatever it is, I don't care what they do. Even if they do nothing, I'll still be running it as pure iron jaws. I'm going to be like, hey, whoa, ride or die with one side of the army. Yeah. Vince, do you have an opinion or speculation on the potential variance and win rates that we see when we look at like, Wohammer's latest data compared to this? It's like KO, for example, is sitting at 63% with 32 games and Wohammer's public data. That's pretty precise. Yeah, sure. Like the date range of exactly what's put in there, what's it cut to? This data was as of the 23rd of October, but what does that mean as far as how far back it went? Yeah. That can be highly impactful. I wonder, I don't know if you have a sense of whether they're tracking mostly the same data or are we getting one-dayers included in this data with MetaWatch? I don't know. It's never entirely clear. My understanding is they pull the one-day data, but they don't use it in this thing. They're scrubbed of the one-day data as far as I know, but I'm not, I will openly admit I'm not 100% sure. But I mean, keep in mind, if you pull different date ranges, you're going to get very different numbers, right? Sure. Yeah. Yeah. I suspect that's all it is. Gotcha. Yeah. OBR, I mean, obviously still quite strong. We've been seeing more variety in lists. So anywhere from Tom Guan with a lot of Morgana Starkeye to 30 more tech guard plus the harvester making an appearance again pretty frequently. So we're seeing a fair amount of variety within the relative limit of scope of that book. But yeah, maybe I'm sure they're going to need to keep an eye on that. Maybe that needs another adjustment. We'll see. Mostly everything else is in a pretty good place. I think Aideneth have got certainly a fair amount stronger. They've been selected and they're going up. What else? I think they're in a bad place at the moment. We need some point adjustments on some melee oriented units. Yeah, I feel like that. Yeah, I mean, they were over relying on their on pretenders combined with ridiculous shooting units. Once that got broken even slightly, the whole thing collapsed like a house of cards because the whole army is a house of cards. Yeah, a guy still living awesome guy. He was at bolt wars had a rough time. I remember looking at his list and our review show and thinking like, oh my God, I don't see it with like he just didn't have enough in that list. You know, he's playing in the shooters. But yeah, it very much a house of cards type list. And yeah, he had a rough, rough go of it. What else the ones at the bottom make a lot of sense. I mean, those would be the ones that I would generally expect. We've talked a lot about night hot or sorry, Skaven over the year and even longer, right? They're one of those high skill or maybe in the highest skill expression armies where good players play. They're the only army still playing completely fair Warhammer. Oh God, it's coming. Gotta get that in. Check that box. Well, don't worry. When a new edition comes out, they won't be sure. Storm cast clearly benefiting from the battle tactic. Yeah, I've absolutely felt that in my games of storm cast. Suddenly a whole new world with with that army. What's amazing what one battle tactic will do and helping you be more competitive. So yeah, I mean, if you get one to two more achievable battle tactics, he will gain two to four percent win rate on average. It's pretty much that easy. Hmm. Yeah. The family man seems so many befalling host with the control play. It's like the defining control army in the game right now. I think we might as well about it before, but it's like Glock, Kim's and Maga, Lords and the Beast of Nurgle and Sloppyty, right? Like you've seen those list. They were at the top of the sub faction breakdown at Wilhammer's data. 62% right now was 27 games accounted for as of October 22nd. And then Futham was up there with the shark spam Legion of Knights still way up there. We've talked about it. I don't get why things of so tech has not been addressed. I just saw one of our guys practicing for LBO last night. I give another one of our guys a very hard time with that ridiculous list with just mortal winning them off the table. Right. Like that's one of the things I don't. I don't grok why that has not been addressed. That play experience for the majority of balance. I mean, it has to some degree, right? There's been attempts to increase points. I mean, you're making it sound like nothing has been done. That's fair. That's fair. There were changes made. You can say they didn't go far enough. You're right. There were a number of changes that in the aggregates added up to being of note. I agree. It still doesn't. Yeah. And I mean, when rate wise, they're getting fangs of so tech or potentially getting, or well, the coalesce side in general, is potentially getting cloaked by the, or sorry, the starborn side. Sorry, I apologize. It's potentially getting cloaked by the coalesce side. Right. Because it's so much worse. Okay. That's true. Yeah. We're not going to get that. My canines of chaos, my canines of chaos t-shirt is missing. Is it? Did it get eaten? Are you sure? I think it got eaten. Well, I'm forced to wear this one. And this one is just. It's less inspiring when you're wearing me rather than you on your t-shirt. No, I want to wear the dog. Okay, sure. Or at least I could have like a team Tyler shirt. Yeah, sure. Absolutely. I mean, Does she not want me on her boobs? She doesn't want you on the shirt at all, Tom. No. I already have two boobs. I don't need a third. Exactly. There you go. There it is. There it is. Very good. I appreciate that she couldn't hear you and yet managed to just into it. Like she can't hear you, honestly. Oh, I'm aware. I'm aware. Yes. And still intuited the correct joke. Yes. Yeah. Very good. Yeah. Yeah. All right. Keep an eye out for my shirt. I will. Do you think it's in the laundry? I don't know, dear. I couldn't tell you. I'm very, I'm very distraught. Come on. Okay. Why can't you retrieve that shirt? All right. So, I mean, they do have retrievers. Indeed. The, but yeah, I mean, ultimately I think that's the like, not that they don't have some action information and stuff like that is, you know, I'm not sure they do. It's just, you're right though. It's harder to make moves where you're not going to also whack the side that's also struggling. Right. Right. Because that, the Coleside still uses, like some of the, it's like some of the same pieces. Right. Right. So you've got to be like really, you got to be really targeted in like a way that I'm not sure what the answer is there to be frank. So. All right. Well, yeah, pretty good overall though. Good to see you. Yep. Yeah. It's positive. I mean, like we're not back in the like 32% world or the, like, 72%. Like, yeah, you're only 3% out on both sides. Right. Which is great. Which is great. I mean, that's a great place to be. And as pointed out, Skaven did like take top at a tournament and like won a ticket a couple of weeks back. Right. So even the underperforming armies can still get there right now. So there you go. Hit like for dogs. By the way, if you like dogs, I like dogs. Do you like dogs? Back dogs. Yes. I like dogs very much. Hit like. Um, okay. So that's, that's that. What else we got? Last news item. Warhammer has a new website, which has been all the rage this week, at least according to the social medias that I've been saying is bad. I did check it out. It's pretty rough, pretty rough, especially on mobile. Unfortunately, but anyway, I'm sure the people behind it have taken enough crap this weekend. Yeah. I mean, like I'm not going to kick a dead horse or anything, but sure. Woo. Well, I mean, I feel worse for those that like had gift certificates and all that in the prior world. Okay. Right. Yeah. Like it, it didn't transfer over. Oh, and GW, and GW's response was oops, there's goblins in the system. Oh, really? They have to have that to be able to restore that. That's sitting in a database table somewhere. So Rob had posted a little bit about it today on Twitter. And yeah, it's not, it's that is not the right response. Like that's like, no, of course like hundreds of dollars are missing from multiple people's accounts. And they're, you know, they're like, yeah, yeah. Um, but like the, the, the, like the 360 pictures messing up, just the way you like actually navigate around, it won't filter live. You're just like going through this weird menu while this video is playing. It's just like, Oh boy, you know what, you know what struck me most when I was flipping through the website? This is bad. I mean, no, that's inherently true. No, I mean, I think the money models are unavailable right now. Yeah, sure. Yeah. Just how much of the entire line of just everything that I was scrolling through is like tempo, temporarily out of stock, just not there. Um, it makes me wonder how many armies someone could play and actually get like all of the core elements of your army. Like to buy. Does that make sense? Because all of them are not buying from GW. That's the trick. I mean, if you go on eBay and look for any of those things, they're all going to be there. Not pretty much still it. Some of it, like some of it, but even like even some of it. So here's, here's like a funny corner case for me. Like I understand that underworld war bands go out of stock, right? But like I was going to do trolls. And my army like fit Molo just perfectly. Like I was down like 150 points or whatever. And I was like, Oh cool. I'll grab Molo. Cause I was like, I have them done. I know I don't. I'm not going to go to the site because it's underworlds that cycles out. Yeah. I'm not spending $200 on a unit. And that's what, that's what it would cost me to get him in the secondary market. Yeah, sure. I understand. I didn't say all. Yeah. I understand that, but it's funny because that now that these other units have been introduced into the marketplace, whether it's the underworld or war cry or whatever, like the actual availability of some of these units is, is surprisingly low. It's like added a new like supply chain problem that I don't know that they actually thought about when they were releasing, like adding these things to all those core books. Yeah. It's, it's funny because like both of my local game stores that are near me, boy, if there's anything you need for an army, just visit either of these stores because their shelves are, are a plenty. Uh, with, with, with all the replete, uh, well no, I mean, if you're talking like Warpgate, like I was there and like they didn't have any of those war bands that I was looking like any of that. Yeah. So I mean like, and again, some of it's been out of print for a while. So it's totally understandable, but it just struck me just how much like normal models were like a normal kits and hero, foot heroes and stuff like that. We're just missing or unavailable. Like it just surprised me. I hear you. Okay. Cool. All right. Well gentlemen, let's uh, let's move on. So we actually have another news story by the way. I had mentioned it. I realized we missed it last week because it came out that day. Yeah. Yeah. Um, uh, hatchet has is releasing their Warhammer AOS subscription in the U S. And that has just started this like it launched last Wednesday. Um, and I signed up for it and I'm stoked like I got my first two magazines, got 10 of my cruel boys and a hero and the one storm cast and Cantor or whatever. Um, the night in Cantor. Yeah. That's great. Our Lord in Cantor and, um, like look through the lineup and I'm a subscriber like for 60 some bucks a month, 70 bucks a month. Like it's actually quite a bit of models and, um, yeah. So, uh, I'm excited to go on this, uh, go on this conquest journey or whatever not conquest. That's the 40 K one. Um, whatever the AOS storm bringer. The storm bringer. There you go. Yeah. So I skimmed it Tom. I didn't look at the details. Maybe no. So it is 60 70 a month. If you get a premium, like, so the premium is like 17. I think it's like 16 99 17 a week, a week, which then, which then calculates out to, you know, like 64 plus tax or plus shipping or whatever plus tax and shipping. And, um, and by like month three, you have like, uh, the big storm cast dragon. Um, in addition to 12 magazines of, of models and terrain and, and other stuff. So like, I mean, in general, the value is largely worth it there, especially if you're just wanting to add to the kind of your storm cast numbers and, and like, and ironically that mo log kit that I was talking about wanting is in the models that will, that will shift with that with storm bringer. So like, I'll finally get that in like a year in a month or something. You know, like next, next year, sometime I'll finally get that kit that's out of print that I've been wanting. Right. Um, you just have to be patient. So like what I'll say is this, um, and then you get a bunch of miscellaneous dumb paint. Some of them good. Some of them not some brushes and stuff like that, but, um, it's not a bad, like what I'll say is this, like the actual value, like the, it's been done, it's been broken down. And if you buy all of it, you're getting models at like 48%. Well, okay. So that's pretty good. Like that's a pretty good price. Um, so, uh, and then obviously paint and all the other stuff. So yeah, I don't know. Um, so I decided to, to give it a spin and, uh, you know, anything I don't want to end up selling off or whatever, but, uh, just I wanted to make sure that people knew it was out there. Right. For those that are interested. Um, yeah. Cool. Glad you mentioned it. All right. Well, I look forward to your review in a few months after you've gotten some in and see how you see what you think of it. Uh, let's move on to some pick. Oh, the week. Tyler, what would you like to share with everybody? Yes, sir. All right. Well, I have officially begun the exploration, research, planning, taking my time stage of what's going to be a very healthy stage, especially for you, Vince of this painting journey that I've started. And I'm starting with your beginner's videos, which I'm greatly enjoying. Excellent. And, uh, yeah, it really. Okay. I'll be nice. I'm going to be nice. He can say whatever you want, man. You're not going to hurt my feelings. Like the only, the early stuff was junk. No. No, it's, it's, it's Vince plus 20 pounds. Oh, some of the early, oh, you dropped so much weight. When I visited last week, when I visited last week, a perfect backhand compliment. Sure. Yeah. When I visited last week, I was like, I was like, how much weight have you lost? There is nothing there. Hey, I'll come in your old videos. You look so fat. I told you I was going to be nice. You pried it out of me. That's amazing. Oh God. Yeah. No, it's true. I mean, because I was I guess, I don't know what to say. I've been, I keep coming. I'm very conscientious of my weight. And this has been on my mind because Darren, Darren, about killed me yesterday, listening to the last miscast, talking about his weight and he's been dropping some weight. Anyway, so. Yes. I love the videos. Thank you for the incredible videos that you've been doing. Number two, I've been watching a lot of war hipster. I don't know the guy's name offhand, but he does a lot of great videos over there at war hipster. So enjoying his stuff. And yeah, it's been useful. So this is going to be a process. You guys, like I need to get my head around this space. I'm not keen on, like I get it practice. I don't let the perfect be the end of the good, blah, blah, blah. I get all that. Sure. But I know what I need to do for that. I've already done a lot of painting this year on Nurgle. Without doing any of this. And at this point, I need to do some of this before I dive in. Too crazily, I feel. So you can tell me why I'm wrong. It's fine. But yeah, it's, it's starting. It's just going to be a while. I'm glad to hear it. I'm very excited for your journey. Your research phase will be too long, but that's okay. You'll learn in time. You will come to learn in time just as I did, that there is a difference between, you know, sort of thinking and knowing. Absolutely. Part of it, yeah. Anyway, I don't want to spend too much. And everything is fixable. Like everything's fixed. It doesn't matter. Like, unless you're putting... Pause. Hades, we didn't skip the Black Talons. I'm going to, we're going to cover them as part of the show tonight. They're in the book, homie. We're going to cover the scrolls in the book. I'm going to show them to you. I don't need them off the work article. They're in the book. Keep going. Okay. So the teal to wrap this up. What I'm trying to, one of the main things I'm trying to figure out, guys, is an answer to the question, how much effort is going to be required in my part to reach the level of quality that I'm looking for? Generally, when I try to do things seriously, I try to reach a certain, I mean, yes, I'm a perfectionist, blah, blah, blah. That's always the aspiration. If I'm going to do this, I need to get good at it. And if I want to do it seriously. So I'm trying to get a better feel for that question. Well, I don't know that watching Vince's video is going to help that. Well, I'm watching a lot of other stuff like that. And this is just a starting point. Well, I mean, what I would say, so I'm going to pivot to my pick of the week. Like if you're not, if you don't have Ninjon on your table, like on your playlist, like I would spin through some of his videos because one of the things that Ninjon does well is really like cuts to the quick, you know, of just like, of tips and tricks to get stuff done and get it done fast and get it done looking nice. Right. Which is different. Like the hobby cheating series is more about like certain techniques. Yeah. That's my assessment of Vince's body of work that I'm going to talk about as if he's not here. But some of the just the quickest and most like on point tips that I've heard of often been like something that Ninjon will throw out in like a 20 second clip and just keep going as part of a larger video. Okay. And so like one video that he recently did was I just had it up and it's gone now. Byron is another one that I've been watching who I've been at least personally getting some value out of like dry brushing techniques. Yeah. Just yeah, I'm looking anyway. I don't want to make this. Yeah. So Ninjon did like a recently was games workshop will never teach you these painting tricks. Right. And it's just a handful of painting tricks just going through, you know, he's doing here and it's at this point or the photo here and it's right. Okay. And and just going through and just showing just some a lot of good basic stuff in there as he's kind of like reaching through. So anyways, I would I would recommend some of his videos as well as. Because again, they're often accomplishing different things. That's what I would say. Vince is often showing specific techniques. So yeah, my advice is just don't spend too much time on it. Like it's just not like I have like I have a three touch philosophy on painting. And I know Vince hates that, but I don't want to touch any part of the model if I don't have to more than three times. Hmm. So and in general, it turns out like fairly good looking tabletop model. Vince is Vince's reason as an aside, a great example of this. Vince's recent. Here, I'm going to spoof one of Vince's videos with this. His recent hobby cheating that he did a fusillier. I would encourage you to check that out. That came out this last week. And that was a great one that that does a very similar kind of three touch technique, although his might have. Yeah. I mean, I think it could have been cleaner, but you know, he was doing it quick and that was the point. Yeah. Yeah. That's right. Okay. So I'm interested in addressing a comment that was going on. Browning made talking about Storm bringer talking about Elric Melnabone series because you had mentioned it's one of the most. Yeah. Perhaps the most influential fantasy series of all time. I don't know that's it's hard to measure influence, but I'll say it's not. I mean, it's not even in the top 10 as far as best selling, not that that means anything, but you know, I love, I love Elric. I love that saga. I think it's really good. But I mean, I do as far as I know, they don't, they never registered or in any way the storm ringer word. So that's why they can do it. I mean, in addition to it being, it's, I honestly think it's a much more, it's become a much more niche title. I don't know how many millions of copies it's sold, but it's not, like I said, like it's, it's not in the top 10 or 15, even of fantasy series. Anywho, my pick of the week. It's going to be for actually a Kickstarter. It's gone going right now from our friends, Dark Fantastic Mills, who've worked in conjunction with Steve Foote to make some awesome new terrain. It's super cool. Like sort of how to describe it. I want to say urban, but that's not right. It's like fantasy urban building. It's really interesting. It's super cool. I freaking loved it. I thought it was awesome. And so, um, yeah, check it out. Links down below. Go give it a look. It's already funded. So, um, like they've already hit their goal. So at this point, you're just backing in and deciding if you want to get some of that awesome terrain. Dark Fantastic Mills makes amazing terrain. Obviously we, Tyler, myself and Tom go to many tournaments that feature, you know, Dark Fantastic Mills terrain tables and they're always exceptionally good to play on. So I've, I've even, I've ordered some stuff from him as well. And it's been a delightful quality. Yeah. Yeah. It's always good stuff. So like it's, it's somebody we know, somebody who seems like a really good member of the community who makes awesome stuff. So it's, that's, that's the kind of kickstarter I can actually get behind. It's someone like, it's a, And he has a proven track record as well. Yeah. Just a proven track record of delivery over and over and over again. And this is just the way that he funds his project. So like, okay, cool. Yeah. Aaron said kind of a Viking village. Yeah. That's right. There you go. There you go. That's that, that feels right. I was looking for the right words. And I think that, that sums it up pretty well. Yeah. So we had two of the Cata Citadel tables at Walt Wars at just phenomenal. Yeah. So good. Yeah. They turned out amazing. There you go. All right. Pick of the week. Let's, let's talk about some hobby time. I'm going to change this thing over here so we know it's a different thing. We'll just hold it for here for a second. Let's talk about some hobby time gentlemen. Uh, obviously Tom, you and I did not last week get to speak about our shared hobby time. As you mentioned when you were up, not last weekend, but the weekend before Tom and I built a display board together. That was a lot of fun. That may eventually become a video. I recorded a bunch of stuff. I don't know what to do with it yet. Yeah. I mean that, that was only like, I don't know how many hours of work did we put in? Like eight, maybe? No, maybe not even that. That was more than that. Yeah, it was, yeah. Because it was just Saturday. Like we started the morning. It was just Saturday. It was probably about 10 hours of work. Yeah. Yeah, so. It was nice. Yeah, it was great. So we had that fun, but, uh, Tyler, you're doing your research. That's, that's your thing. As, as you mentioned already. So I assume we're not, we're not in the painting phase yet. We're in the research phase. We're in the, yeah, getting a better sense of big, as I sent in the comments, answer, you're trying to get some, potential answers to the biggest bang for buck questions, quality, relative investment. I thought about reaching out to Ben Johnson as well. I remember looking at Ben's armies over the years. Ben was always really good at like, finding tricks and doing, yeah, having really great work, but various tricks, a lot of tri-bushing. So I just, yeah, I mean, guys, like I know, I know Jack. I'm so dumb with this stuff. Like I'm watching your video about assembly and which plastic glue or which glue types to use. Like I just, I've never done this stuff. And so, yeah. It's not about being dumb. Why would you, why, were you expecting to be born with innate knowledge about plastic glue? I'm trying to emphasize like, how starting at zero I feel with this space. That's everybody. Yeah. But yeah, it's going to be fun. It's just, yeah. Very nice. No, I look forward to your journey. Seven, nine, no, we do not know when the Christmas box prices will be available. Probably very soon. But my guess is they're all in the probably like two 10 to two 30 range probably. It's something like that. I would guess. It's usually what I would expect. Could be wrong. Could be a slightly outside of that, but that's probably about the space. Tom, you've been having it on, man. How's it going? How goes the prep for, holy havoc, that thing we're doing in two weeks? I mean, it's going. Okay. So I have paint on everything at this point. So that's good news. I do leave for like four days this weekend, going into next week, and then get back for a day and then leave again. So that's concerning. But models are all assembled and paints on everything. And so I'm in the detailing. I'm doing some, doing some weathering right now. And yeah. Yeah, I'm excited. It's going to be fun. I'm ready to be done with these. Zombies. This has been a project of a year. That I just needed to finally knock out. Right. I cannot wait for the Friday night hotel room painting. I am very excited to see that. No, it's no, it's not going to happen. No, I'm like, I'm telling you, I'm going to be done. And it's going to be delightful. And so we're, we're, we're good. We're good. Nothing to stress about. We, we got everything covered. Everything will be fine. It's all good here. Thanks. All good. How are you? Yeah. I will say this. I used our board for the Halloween party that we had. So yeah, it was ours. It was a centerpiece for the table because I needed somewhere to put it. I had to put it in the Halloween theme and so on. But I've got these little LED lights and actually like, it's going to work great for our, for the board. Like I've already, like I've already, like the things I was thinking about doing completely solve the problem. So it's great. Excellent. I'm glad to hear it. My hobby time, I'm working on a couple of things. One of them I'm not going to share for reasons. Mainly because it has to do with hobbying for Adam and I's upcoming game. And that is to say in just a couple of weeks, basically the same time we go to Havoc, Adam and I are going to be releasing a Starling Badger Studio is going to be releasing our first zine. It will come with a smaller sort of mini game in it. It will come with additional content for previous games in it. It's going to be very exciting. So I'm working on some stuff for that. A little release at the same time. I just have to say, of all of the games that we've ever released. Yes. This has been the most enjoyable one. I want you to know that. I play tested it with my son and his friends at my son's birthday. We had five of us together doing this thing. And it was like truly we ended and like they were asking if they could do another game. And then the next morning after the sleepover, they're like, so can we get another game in before our parents fix up? So like it's like it's a good one, folks. There you go. It's good for good for the whole family. And happily this new one has it's not, there's no solo setting to the new game, but it can be played with between two and 10 people. So how about that? It is truly a party game. So there you go. But I am working on something I'll share. She's kind of in parts right now, and this is what I'm working on here. We'll close that so she actually shows up normal. I'm working on this. She's headless and without her backpack, but I'm working on like a nergal fide sister a battle. Her head and her backpack are obviously over here on this thing. So you can see she's very spiky. Yeah, this is super fun. I'm really loving this model. I just think it's really cool. It's like a 75 millimeter nergalized, corrupted sister a battle. I don't know. It's cool, cool concept. And so I just like, I like it a lot. It makes me happy. So yes, busy, very busy hobby week over here. Lots, lots going on. All right. With that gentlemen, shall we begin? Is everybody in? Is everybody in? The show is about to begin. Let's talk about the long hunt. It's ironic that this is called the long hunt. As in fact, the story is so short and unimpactful, but we'll get to that in a moment. Here we go. What's going on in this book? Well, we've got new armies of renown for Sylvaneth, Stormcast, eternal ogres and fire slayers. We've got four new armies of renown. We've got some new units, Belvenos, the first thorn of Kernoth for the Sylvaneth, Ionis Cryptborn and the Black Talons, which is Neve and her Black Talons, the people from the show. Tyler, you said this is a good show, right? You've watched this. Yeah, yeah, very good show. I have not watched it, but apparently all these characters are in that is my understanding of the thing. So for Stormcast, the Black Talons can be in other things as well, but there we are. We have the Gorgir Mawpack for the ogres and the Vulcan Flame Seekers for the fire slayers. So there we go. My reed, my high level summary here, is Sylvaneth and ogres, to me, I read them. They felt like quite solid, middle of the road, armies of renown. Fun, exactly where they should be. You lose some rules, you have some rules, and it's restrictions that are there that make sense. It's going to feel like a constrained narrative fluffy army that will generally play a pretty average game. The Stormcast one may be actually quite good, but I think that's just on the back of being dragons.exe. Not really anything to do with the actual rules. And the fire slayers army is the weirdest one, because it's just fire slayers. It's an alternate loft near army. Now you do lose something quite notable, but unit-wise, it's just a loft near fire slayers army. That's all it is. It doesn't restrict you in any other way. So we'll see as we get there. And many of the units here, you'd see them in different stuff, like in the army of renown, but they, like Belfinos and Ionis, I think, have played within their own armies as well. Same potentially with the gorgers, maybe? Question mark? I'm going to say possibly. So the flame seekers, I don't know. I'm not sure if they're any good outside of their own army of renown, but I don't know fire slayers well enough to really, truly evaluate them at a deep level. So that's my read at a high level. Tyler, you looked over this. You got any other thoughts to add before we get into some more crunchy stuff? Anything at a high level? So I have not looked at the ogres and fire slayers. Excited to see those as we get into it. Took a pretty close look at Sylvaneth and Stormcast. Yeah, I really like what's going on with the Stormcast one. That's one of the better armies of renown that they've put forward as an integrated little package. I think they did a great job with that. Yeah, it really expresses, at least in my mind, my idea of this concept of an army of renown and what it's designed to do. So I love that. I just said you could even run it at a tournament and do decently with it. Yeah, I think you have a fun time. I think it would be very fun armies for like, these armies of renown generally, this one felt much more in line than the last one. To be clear, there's no KO or King Brogd Stomp here. Right, absolutely. Yeah, and the Sylvaneth one also, yeah, pretty good. It has some inherent drawbacks. That one is going to be even tougher to do well with competitively. Of course, as we know, these are not, I mean, it seems pretty clear they've been forthright about their intention. Like, these are not designed to go 4-1 or 5-0 at tournaments. These are thematic forces, you know, a little narrative oriented, fun things to play, get into a different, you know, a new army. But yeah, you're losing a lot with Sylvaneth. You don't have a lot of unit selection by intent. You don't have screens. You don't have teleporters. You don't have strike and fades. You know, the crux of Sylvaneth and how it plays. But yeah, it's got a cool theme to it. I think it's a little convoluted as we'll get into if things are off with it. But yeah, overall, pretty happy with Sylvaneth and Stormcast. Like I said, I haven't looked at the others. All right. Cool, cool. Tom, anything to add there? I mean, I don't know if there's a chance you got to look at all this, but go ahead. Yeah, I would just say that, like, the Fire Slider one is super interesting to me. It adds mobility that they simply didn't have. I don't, like, I don't, the flame speakers aren't going to be combat effective. Like they're not super punchy, right? Like the foot units. But there's some mobility in that lineup that, I mean, I think is much needed. In that sense, it was very reminiscent to me of the Thunderer change. Okay. Like the Thunderer. Oh, yeah. Because it added mobility to a unit that wouldn't necessarily have it. The difference is the quality of the unit is just night and day. Like you're dealing in different spaces. Sure. And so it's just, it's not going to have the same impact at the end of the day. Cool. All right. Well, with that, I feel that it's only one, what time could it be? But story time. All right. Story time, everybody. Settle in. This is where Vince badly recounts and sarcastically discusses the very average story that we got in this particular one. Headline. Not much happens. That's really the story of book three. People walk a short distance is really what goes on in this. That's the headline. So not long hunt, but nor like short stroll. Short stroll, yes. Okay. We open on Gobsprack and Cragnos. Now they're in Guyran, although this is not told to us at the time. Unless you happen to know where this, the name, they name a geographic place, but unless you happened to know that was in Guyran, you wouldn't know where they were. Cragnos is hitting a wall. Literally. And Gobsprack is floating around overhead and he's just like, Cragnos is just like smashing a wall repeatedly and over and over and over again and just crunching a wall, just beating against a wall. And he's like, and then he turns around and talks to Gobsprack. We had heard that Gobsprack could converse with Cragnos, the end of Empires, right? That's like how, that's what sets Gobsprack apart, right? He can actually communicate with Cragnos. So we actually get dialogue in Cragnos's voice, like not in his roaring or stuff like that. He just like talks and he is extremely eloquent and well spoken. He's just like, you know, he's like, I do not think that what we are looking for is going to be on the other side of this wall. This seems a fruitless endeavor. But in the heck is this? You know, like, what is going on here? And Gobsprack's like, Na na, trust me, it's good. Just keep hitting the wall. It's fine. And they do. And sure enough, what they're after is like a realm gate on the other side, though to what end we don't really know. And then some water busts out and then the dam breaks. And in fact, the realm gate was there just bricked up and hidden behind this mountain that was on it and and the like waters are flowing through it and so it like whatever's on the other side is an ocean or a water or river or something. And so the the water all flows out. That's fun. That's a fun thing that just happened. Okay, so that occurs. Then we come to the main story. All right, so Hammer Hall is in uproar. Oh, rabble, rabble, rabble. Everybody's upset, right? Why is everybody upset? Well, because two cities fell in the last thing, right? Like, uh, Steel Soul and Truce Break both got smashed and every so the people who thought these crusades were stupid to begin with, who are absolutely correct, right? It's complete nonsense. Uh, are only stronger and blah blah blah goes back and forth and all of this. You you meet Zane Dolores who is like the sort of spy master of Hammer Hall and basically what's happened is the religious fervor over Zanestra's cult is spreading like wildfire through the city. Okay. And so people have started stealing wheels and cogs and round things off of everything which has caused like a bunch of the munitions factory to grind to a halt as cards can't get anywhere in the city and everything because people keep stealing wheels. This has got to be the stupidest cult in the history of cults. Like this is an all time dumb cult. The wheel cult? The wheel cult. We worship wheels. Uh, at any rate. It's clearly Zinches behind it. Yeah, sure. Uh, so there's a big funeral in in um, there's a big funeral in Hammer Hall for Gartus because they're not sure he got back and was reforged basically. They tell it because of the bellicor clouds which float around and will like intercept um, stormcast souls. They don't know if he actually ever got home back to Aesir after his sacrifice. Um, so, you know, they hold like this big long funeral for him. Okay, fine, whatever. I'm sure he's not dead. He's Gartus' steel soul. I'm sure he'll be back again. Uh, Kelly said the sled maker's guild is making a killing. Yeah, you're not wrong. You're not wrong. Uh, yes, the Pontifex lady is suspiciously old. Yes, you are correct, cow. Okay, so then we go back to the Oxy and Crusade, which if we all, when we last left our our very bold but very stupid uh, adventures, they were leading this massive thing out of truce break after and all his trolls and gits had just swarmed over the place. So now they're running away and the trolls and grots are hot on their tail. Okay, just hot on their tail. And um, and uh, so they're like, they're running, they're pushing, they can't stop, the trolls don't stop. It's whatever. And basically the bad guys catch up to like the rear guard and just kill a bunch of them. And then they're gaining on the main force, the main expeditionary force. When all of a sudden they get word that there are magma droths up ahead and the dwarves who are in the contingent are like, yay, it means fire slayers and then fire slayers come out and they're like, yay, fire slayers and then the fire slayers save the humans. I mean, that's like the shortest story. Basically like a bunch of fire slayers show up riding their magma droths. A bunch of doom seekers because if you remember Trug earlier had like marched his way through several different magma holds and killed everybody inside. Or well, not everybody, but a lot of the dwarves inside. And so you know what happens when fire slayers lose places, they make grudges. So there's just doom seekers left and right. Right. And they're just like bread and butter with the army. Like they talk about how the doom seekers just walk by and they're like they're like I got time for this. I got to go die killing these guys. And they just hurl themselves at the army and just kill as many trolls and grots as they can before they eventually get torn down. Right. And their leader is a guy named Bale Grimnir who's like apparently one of the most legendary rune fathers alive in the mortal realms. We had his we had his war scroll for a while. It came from the dragon magazine. Oh, there you go. You don't mean you don't mean dragon, but I take I'm sorry. It came it was in a white war for sure. Like it was the one good one. It was like a 300 point magnet or off named Lord. But you know we don't have that anymore because of additions and stuff. Sure, sure. So but anyways, he's there in his like golden armor. It's cool piece of art and he basically leads the fire slayers and they're like all the doom seekers are like we'll hold them off and kill as many as we can. You guys get out of here. Right. So the humans once again are worthless and can't do anything and the fire slayers save their butts and then Bale and the rest of the fires are just not all of them die. They just like most of the doom seekers the ones who dies and they the fire slayers just hold them off and drive the trolls away and then sort of catch back up to the storm cast and then they get attacked by corn because they're coming up near this the sea and when they get to the sea it's a boiling, roiling sea of blood with bones bleached in the sun everywhere and the gore tide is here and the gore tide descends upon them. This is just like and then the humans are once again getting killed by the gore tide they stand no chance they're going to get obliterated once more when suddenly from the heavens a lightning bolt strikes into the Cornish lines and who stands there replete in bright golden armor wielding, held in vol or whatever the heck his hammer is called something like that riding karagar or karag something it doesn't matter look it's Vanda's hammer hand okay he's here he's back baby and he's like he's like alright enough of this and all of his storm cast lightning bolt in behind him and they just go to work and just clean clocks resplendent and thunder strike armor they didn't say they did not use the word thunder strike they just said his golden armor gleaming in the sun he still mounted on the same drakoth that he was back yeah same same same drakoth um same one so like I don't know if the drakoth's getting reforged as well cause he's died a lot just not storm cast armor so so he like he just starts they crush the gortite so the storm cast once again so now a different force shows up out of nowhere like bail in the remaining this is like Mary Sue the book yes this is all just and then people show up and save the humans book three I'm sorry not Mary Sue do second do sex mocking of the book this entire book is the humans can't do anything they're worthless and then some other force shows up to save them this happens so many times in this story okay so humans the fire slayers can't stop the gortite but then Vanda shows up right and he crushes them and yay okay oh he's also got naive with him by the way naive and the black talons are here with Vandus as well lighting bull den and you know she's just like a whirlwind and if you listen to the description of this they're like as Vanda strikes down his his veteran liberators begin crushing the gortite with their hammers driving them back and I'm like where are these liberator options in the storm cast war scrolls right roll a lot of four ups on those moon rules that it's they're the that's the veteran war scroll which is not in the book yet we're not allowed to use that one that's like past a glory but they've made a lot of advancements right so they're they're way up there now okay oh by the way the reason I forgot this this is an important story point it's not but it just shows how stupid this all is it's really hard to get behind your protagonist faction when they're so dumb and not doing anything of value like this isn't some heroic quest to do something this is just folly for no point okay the reason the trolls were able to gain on them and catch them because you might think wait how did the trolls catch up to them not that much fast they got a bunch of grots with them and stuff right is because Zanestra ordered all of the wheels removed from anything that moved with wheels and it had to be carried by hand so all the wagons had to be is this why her model is being carried yes yes wow so I have no words okay like when you're this stupid you deserve to die I so like I want to do a cities now army more than anything and then just have like have zealots running or like modeled running around with just holding wheels yeah makes me want to do a steam tank army that just is like all about destroying this stuff so at any rate they have to walk the heavy wagons like they're literally there's like you know just eight people carrying wagons because they they can't they don't have wheels anymore because they're all all the zealots are running around holding the wheels yelling prayers okay so after they clean up the gore tide Zanestra is like yo you want to roll with us then it'd be really helpful to have you with us does she say roll like please say she says roll no she doesn't that's just me punting that's just me punting um and so then you know they they keep portraying her as like this very stern like powerful charismatic religious figure and like even she is just sort of cowed by bandits like he looks through her she's like she's not in his field of vision because he's like no no I am not interested in helping you we have saved you because that's what we do I am now going to continue in my mission until I find and kill corpus call that is all I exist for and then he leaves okay and nave is like I look fine we'll stay and help out okay so the black talons whatever okay we'll stay we'll stay so so the black talons stay right and and her and her and her personal forces okay all right so then we travel we follow band us elsewhere as he's hunting down like lieutenants of corpus call mm-hmm and he catches up with like basically the named he he catches up with the named people from the original invasion okay okay so like the named bloods a crater and the named blood fat whippy guy yeah yeah yeah you know blood stoker there we go yeah that's two years ago right so he catches up with those two like he's literally hunting the people from the first book okay and he personally dispatches the blood stoker and I'm like wow big big effort there buddy you know like whatever like a it's fine like there's a named blood stoker blood stoker gets a little stab in on him and then just gets his like literally gets his clock cleaned like literally uh in that he's holding a clock and vandices like let me wipe that for you because that would be literally now metaphorically he gets his clock clean because he gets his entire head caved in from his jaw to the back of his skull and snaps his neck off with one blow all right it's cool description um and like his jaw gets pushed to the back of his skull and then snaps his neck it's great it's great fun blow from from vandice he doesn't screw around with these guys vandices are still being overwhelmed uh vandices are and he's worried that like too many of his people are going to get sent back and it'll delay his mission right because a blood secretor has now summoned a blood thurster right and then there's a shadow overhead and down out of the clouds comes ionis okay and ionis like in a thing that can only happen in the story ionis jumps off his mouth and right and he goes over and just like beats the living daylights out of the blood secretor while his mount goes and just kills the blood thurster like lights him on fire and then just emulates him like the more the blood thurster moves and fights the more fire he gets lit by so he just self emulates because the blood thurster can't stop fighting as he gets angrier and more rage he just wants to fly it and more and rage it and more and the more he moves the more he just catches on fire that would have been a cool role I like that idea were expressed in the war scroll right and then the mouth flies back and he's like no problem dog just handled that greater demon I got this like without my writer didn't need that dude right and then they talk they actually have a fun conversation it's really interesting because ionis is like I have a new purpose sent from sigmar himself and and he's like you you're he's like your mission is stupid like he straight up tells vandus your mission is stupid and he's like this path of revenge is going to lead you nowhere valuable my mission is sacred and charged by sigmar himself and vandus is like listen old friend because they're they like they're they're the original two guys right like that's right and he's like listen old friend I'm not stopping this I won't stop until court this is dead right and I was just like whatever that's fine I have a writ from sigmar that says any stormcast I want work for me now I'm taking some of your forces and and he's like I'll let you be for now but eventually I'll come for you to and then he leaves okay he also makes a really cool reference he's like how many times have you been reforged to vandus and vandus is like I don't even know and he's like when's the last time you saw the lightning man and vandus gets real quiet and won't explain he's like it's not important and they have this like really cryptic conversation so I don't know what the lightning man is it sounds like you think he's referencing sigmar but if you read it he's not referencing sigmar interesting anyways I wonder I wonder if it's the the lightning geist thing from back in malign importance you remember I do yeah yeah a long time ago that like that's never paid off right yeah yeah of the of the lightning ghost from the reforging absolutely you're right it hasn't and that's like that's vandus sees visions right that's this whole thing and honestly the most interesting stuff in this were all the asides okay we're like this this exchange between vandus and ionis because they feel more like actual developed characters like real motivations like vandus is doing something ionis is doing something they have like a purpose you know what their end is right like ionis is trying to fix the flaw in the reforging and save the souls of the stormcast vandus is trying to stop corgis call right like these are these are tangible goals not we're trying to walk to a place there okay I mean real motivations yeah real motivations so then the now combined forces of like nave and her stormcast the city's expeditionary force and the fire slayers get attacked by few thin raiders from the eyed nests deep again because we gotta have one more pointless fight and this is order on order this is order on order and so the few thin attack and they're raiding for souls and then the fire slayers are like enough of this stupid fog and they like summon a fire rune and burn away all the fog and then all the all the nether like they're in the middle of the fog now that their covers gone they're like ah crap and then they just get demolished right and their leader who's a guy named Mopin Mopir sorry Mopir I had to read my own notes I want to read his name as Mopar because he sounds like a car parts brand he's like Kelly and King he's like he's down and the problem is they're negotiating they just broke the treaty like what's his name the achalion king the like main one the named guy he has a deal with he has a deal with like the city's leaders that he won't attack them for souls ok and they just broke that truce and so Zanestra's like ready for his head right she's ready to cause a war ok like cause she's a lunatic meanwhile Nave and her mentor what's his name the silver guy or whatever the older member she has an IDK wizard with her though she does yes and that's how they know the IDK were coming before they were coming by the by it's cause the IDK wizard with her is like oh my people are coming but she's an outcast or whatever and anyways Hendrik the silver wolf yeah Hendrik who's like very wise right is like if we kill this guy straight out we're in trouble we're going to break the truce and cause a war right and so Mopen is like look fight me one on one Nave like this is the stupidest thing but he's like fight me one on one and if you like whoever wins like we'll call it a draw call it a truce then cause that will be how we settle this grudge so he fights Nave one on one and gets rocked like you know the way she's portrayed is so deadly like she is just a hurricane given form this is the appropriate opportunity to call her a Mary Sue like she's I mean she's great in the story like she's really cool how they have her fight in a very distinct fighting style when they have her I'd love to see again makes me want to watch that black talent show when I watch what I read the script she seems pretty cool so she spikes this dude and kills him and then turns the rest of the eye and they're like okay you want to settle the debt you work for us now go get your souls go attack the trolls and grots and they're like oh yeah that's right there is a whole another army of souls from so Lord's gonna go get those instead okay bye and then they take them and that's it that's the end that's the end of the auction crusade story in this particular book okay so as we leave off they don't actually get anywhere they don't actually accomplish anything correct nothing is accomplished they got in three fights they lost a bunch of troops and that's what's accomplished and they sent the Aideneth after the goblins which bought them time then the Aideneth will just draw them away and then they can actually rest meanwhile in GuyRam okay what's going on over here well we're leaving Fort Gardis and all the Stormcast Eternals are like look it was great fighting with you peace out we're gonna go take care of these innocent people cause there's a bunch of like innocent people who are in the fort who need guarding right there's people who live there and so the hallowed knights or whatever their leader is dead but they're like we're not about this weird mission you're on good luck with this stupid mission you're doing but peace and chicken grease we out and they ditch okay however the Sylva Death stay with them so the war song Revenant who's with them whatever his name is he's still hanging out okay and remember the GuyRam side is being led by a by like a martial person from cities but who's from GuyRam who's like of the Jade Order right who's like very close to GuyRam and so you know the leader of the war song Revenant is like we gotta get our people more comfortable hey we're like dying maybe you could use some of that sweet Sylva Death healing magic and go around and heal the humans which apparently at this point they weren't doing I'm like real nice job Sylva Death way to make friends so the Sylva Death are like relent and they're like okay well we don't like your weird humans but that's fine you agree not to shoot the trees when we get in fights like don't fire your guns at trees and we'll heal your people so that's the deal they strike and then that eases some of the tension and they make their way into an area where like they make their way into Bahamut's corpse so there's this big area of Bahamut's corpse they make their way into his rib cage yeah it's like his bones this is Bahamut himself where he was felled right and in there that's where by the way that's where King Brod lives just so we're all like inside Bahamut yeah inside the corpse of Bahamut this place had been I'll talk about this place because this is where the whole rest of the story happens in this one place like they walk forward to this place and this is where the rest of the story happens okay but that's where King Brod lived and it's been taken over by ogres and there's a big dumb ogre Glutton who's now opening maw pits everywhere because that's just a thing they can do now is explain what the army of renown works just maw pits open all the time he just opens little maw pits all over the place and they just eat people okay and so he is like he's in there and so they get in a big fight so there's a big fight between the ogres and the cities people and the silver okay now that battle's happening the ogres are kicking the crap out of the humans who stand no chance even with their silvaneth allies that is what is currently going on okay because the silvaneth force is pretty small at this point it's just like a war song revenant in his people draka and her forces left out cut to gobsprac who is hanging out with cragno still talking to him cragno is still like he's cragno is roaming around a city of the drug scar like his people and it's all abandoned and no one's there that's what he was trying to get to that's what was on the other side okay and meanwhile gobsprac goes into a cave and finds a bunch of writing and he like memorizes it and then he has his people scrape it out because it's directions to something okay and one of his people is like wouldn't cragno want to see this and gobsprac is like that's why I ruined it so he can't we're not here to help cragno's we're here to kill him okay gobsprac is real clear with his intentions he wants to kill cragno's he wants cragno's dead okay so he said cragno's and his people sorry I may have missed something so then in his people die like when they wiped out his race the race that he's part of he's the last of his kind his people were wiped out by the draconith by basically the big dragons that are now the storm cast dragons yeah okay okay so basically gobsprac says we're not here to save cragno's we're here to kill him right I'm trying to make him angry and then I'm gonna get him killed okay gobsprac was trying to break his spirit to demolish any hope he had that his people were still alive and like fill him with rage okay so then we cut to another aside we go from one side to another aside yeah that was interesting I like that idea that's kind of cool now realistically there probably is some of his people still alive that's probably what the directions were to right but again gobsprac erased it so now there's like no record of it this is like the only location in the universe where this would be so we cut to us to the council of life the council of life is a lauriel lord croak crondus and carzai okay and the four of them are having a little chit chat they're just talking and a lauriel and crondus are the main two people talking because carzai is off just like being angry because that's what he does and lord croak is a mummy okay so a lauriel is having a conversation like basically they get into a little discussion about who's to blame for kragnos and because crondus is like will you woke him up with your life spell and she's like will you made him into a god by going on a genocidal mission as people so we've both got a hand in this homie okay and crondus is like yeah okay fine you got me there dog we did do a genocide right the good guys everybody the good guys okay the council of life alright as the dead frog is sitting there watching the whole conversation and basically what you come to learn from this is like so we're in agreement we're going to kill kragnos and carzai is like I was never not in agreement I've been on the let's go kill this guy train since the beginning carzai is just ready right and crondus is like I suppose this is the only way and lord croaks like sure you know like he does what lord croak does he gives them all a vision of some place that they're meant to lure he gives them a vision of carzai fighting kragnos at some particular place right and so they're to understand the nature of you know lord croak's great plan his great turning of the great plan right and again that's like all whatever the interesting part is then you get this really cool conversation like crondus and carzai take off to go start executing this plan and you get this like really cool conversation again this is the stuff that's really interesting in the story where a laurel is just like kind of talking to croak which is funny she's like confiding in croak because she's there's like very few beings in the world she can confide in because there are people who are on her level and croak is like one of them and she's like if there's any spell I could manifest I did the spell of life to try to bring kernoff back she wants kernoff back right because she loves kernoff and back her partner or whatever right news right like that's news to us that's for a laurel I'm not sure where this got mentioned but it's here and she's like I would do anything that I could you know to bring him back but if my great life spell couldn't bring him back then I don't think anything can right she's like I don't have the magic to turn back time I don't to that to that point if I could make a different choice and I don't think even you can and croak just floats there silently like listening to her and then one of the little skinks like walks up and like touches her stick like you know one of his little one of his little attendant skinks walks up and like touches her stick okay and gives her a vision okay and in the vision he gives her a vision of Belfinos the first talon of kernoff fighting and helping the humans and working along with them right and she sees this vision and she sees this mighty kernoffy hunter and the working with it and she looks at him and she takes it and basically the meaning she's like so hope is not lost and croak is just like a dead frog but that's what I'm saying here lady you know and so like basically gives her hope that kernoff could be restored so okay so that's that aside which is cool a little character moments between these people are actually the most fun stuff yeah so then we get back to the fight and the fight that was already going so back to that fight okay so two things happen first thing that happens is Belfino shows up and kills all the ogres so like he and his hunters show up and kills all the ogres like all those fight writers and he shows up and that kind of thing also the head of the city's force can do magic now she's like a wizard being in this place like she's portrayed like a martial hero when you first meet her but then like as she goes deeper and deeper into Gairan the Jade magic that she has wakes up because it talks about how she's like the daughter of a of a Jade Sylvanthi wizard and a human aristocrat from Hammerhog Gairan whatever so now she can do magic so she does magic and saves her life and stuff like that and so they're like celebrating their victory and then Belfino because like all the ogres are dead and then they realize that the sound of the drums has not stopped the rumble of like the has not stopped and then their rearguard gets smashed into by Cragnos coming in like oops god a god is attacking you now okay and so Cragnos and all the cruel boys show up and they're just like smashing their way through the Exhibitionary Force the humans are helpless they can't do anything and then out of the skies comes Crandas like this really does happen in like this kind of succession it's really like this fast okay it's not even like a page between these things occurring Crandas comes down and like starts using magic on Cragnos which doesn't work because obviously Cragnos has the magic shield that shuts off magic right and so he goes down and tries to melee like Cragnos is like oh you won't fight me fair okay I'll start killing these little humans oh you care about them don't you bam bam bam I kill some humans then Crandas is like no I care about humans and then he flies down and Cragnos whips around and just like smashes him in the face and then catches him in the throat and is gonna like choke him out and for once the one thing the humans do well in this entire book their only moment of actually being the saviors as opposed to the savies the humans spend this entire book just like screaming for help okay and getting saved at the last minute they're just like gonna hurt our dragon nah we can do that they turn all of their guns on Cragnos so just like fusiliers and cannons and steam tanks everything just opens up and wounds Cragnos bad enough that he has to let go of Crandas and Crandas flies away and Cragnos is like you won't get away from me this time draconith genocider which by the way I'm like I mean he's not wrong like this dude that dude did do a war crime so like I mean his indignation is not misplaced that's all I'm saying okay you're like I can see his point yeah he's literally attacking one of the beings that killed his entire species so like you know justified to some degree at any rate he chases off and drags a bunch of the cool boys with him and then the cities are like left there in the thing right and we're left basically with we then go to Karzai who's sitting there with a bunch of seraphon like all lot and they're all starborn and the description of the starborn seraphon is really cool because croak made them so fast that most of them aren't even formed all the way and so like there's holes missing from them like they're lizard people but then they'll just be chunks missing that are just like galaxies and the void and stars inside of them okay so like each of them just has pieces where you can see into the universe the vastness and the nothing right yeah hell of a paint scheme to see in an army sure sure Jesus well I've actually seen like my local store owner did something like she did like a a constellation and they were all like made out of like it was it was edge painted where they were basically black models but everything was like constellation so all the like nexus cars and then edge highlighting so it was almost very crony so yeah so and then amazing yeah so I've seen I've seen some page jobs like that you know it can be done hmm so Karzai is up there and he's just waiting he's just like crouched waiting right and then he sees the stones at his feet start to rumble and he turns to the seraphon who are all like mentally bound to him and he's like it's time and they all just like turn is one and he's like let's do this and then and then that's where and then story cut okay so like that's that's the end of the guy running crusade the humans made it as far as that that rib cage and just stopped like that was it they just kept fighting people right there hmm okay and and then and then you know so like that's kind of the end of the story now as usual we get some interesting asides so here are the quick asides from around the mortal realms it is is doing an I'm actually on the order of genocide sure look it was a bad situation I'm just saying that it's not great okay yeah like I understand why crag knows is angry at any point in time somebody's got to put down their weapons or or you know and I make the whole world blind of course but still okay so just some other neat stuff um titans rest the place where they are is pretty cool they have a couple r pieces of it that's that's what they call the where behemoth felt titans rest and it's just a really neat stuff the art of it looks really cool it's built in uh behemoth's rib cage and yeah Kelly said build a city in behemoth's rib cage funny you mentioned that it used to have one so it has been occupied by many different species over time um when since since uh behemoth fell and so it was um at one point a um Skaven city and they they had taken it over and then it was it also in the age of myth it had it was actually like a relatively successful big um human like settlement um under before the age of chaos returned like there was a huge cool city there and above it they built this thing called the great green torque which like again the art for this is really cool it's this giant floating um uh what do you call that shape that that sigil is it's like uh you know i'm talking about a torus torus it's like a big torus almost finished it's but it's a torque because it's like there's a space that's there and there are castles built on the edge of the this giant floating thing this is like massive by the way up in the sky and it casts light like it's it is the source of light if you're in that area um but it's all like replete with life and hanging vines and there is a beanstalk that goes up to it but but nobody will like climb up there because you when you climb up it doesn't it doesn't come back down um but so just they the little background that kind of thing was actually pretty neat seem like a very cool setting in the art made it look cool um couple other notes from around the realms um you get a nice missive from the uh from some some storm cast who talk about how they got in a fight they've done this thing this weird this we were we were losing we weren't sure we were going to be able to complete our mission but then this weird dude on an old dragon showed up and killed everybody he looked kind of like iota's cryptborn weird and then he took off and so like whatever and the the interesting part of that is they're like we were unable to recover nine storm cast out of our lot that died and we we know that they weren't received back in azir and there's no bellicor clouds around okay interesting so just like nine storm cast souls went missing somewhere in between the phone call between death and reforging not many in the count of all that died but like some small number which they found disturbing and so they're going to try to locate where those went so no real direct clues on what ionis is up to no other than we we know he's after fixing storm cast reforging philosophy on that okay we don't know how he's going about that or anything okay okay um and then we pick back up with astria soul bright she's actually like the last one of the last people we pick back up with she went to the charnel court in shaish explored that in between books found a magic painting that was really a realm gate walked through the magic painting and is now back in gyran in a castle that seems to be where the summer king is okay because and she's like huh this is weird I didn't expect to be back in gyran and you know because she's trying to track down the summer king right uh and then our final two cutaways asides are the expeditionary force from oxy is at rest they can finally make camp all their foes have been sort of disappeared or whatever right and stuff like that they're sitting down and from the hilltop overlooking them from the mountain a silhouette a single silhouette looks down upon them stroking his his chin it's corgis call and he's like interesting and he's like I could strike them now but there's no point to it he's very measured he's like he is basically the speech he gives is like vengeance has fueled me long enough now I have a greater purpose I mean to make a real offering and like and so like you don't know what he's talking about he's doing this as he's stretching out the skin of his lieutenants okay like to dry it out like he has skinned his lieutenants because they all died and so he's just like stretching out their skin to make cloaks and stuff and he's like these are people who were fueled by yeah thank you for clarifying that because my next question was what skin is he stretching out he's like these are the people these are foolish lieutenants too fueled by petty war and vengeance who don't see the greater like glory of what it means to make an offering to corn right and so like he's portrayed in this moment as like very pensive thoughtful like but there he is so you know and so that's he's watching that and then oh meanwhile the guy ran force does move a little farther they move out of the ribs in this like tiny aside at the end and as they go forward nobody's around everybody's gone there's no enemies there's no nobody and they're like and all they see is written in blood in the abandoned city that they go into for rest is the summer king has saved us all hail the summer king and a bunch of them are like great we've got to find this summer king guy and see if he'll help us out and they're and they're like some of the detractors we're not sure about the trustworthy of this message given that it was scrawled in blood in blood and I'm like you think there is a I don't know if you watch did you watch Bumblebee the Bumblebee movie okay it was good it was really good and it's a shame that it was came on the back of all the bad Transformers movies because no one else watched it because they thought it was another bad Transformers movie but there's a scene in there where John Cena is very funny a very funny actor is like hey are we sure we should trust these guys their names are the Decepticons doesn't seem weird to anybody else I remember that and I'm like yeah exactly man exactly so anyways that's where we leave off in book 3 so there you go their story time that was long but fun yeah there's some good stuff in there you're right though like the asides are the most interesting but yeah so obviously the summer king is here so are we getting Usher on mm-hmm yeah yep he's here like just over and over again like it got it got hammered pretty heavy in book 2 but now in this book it's like yep it's clear that combined with the thing alright story time over let's get into the rules that was fun I like story time it's fun thank you all for indulging me it's I know that takes a long time but it's it's I don't know it's fun to badly recount these stories they're just hilarious okay I do think I have said in the comments I do think we should do a show sometime the obvious answer is probably Doug but somebody Doug or like Doug where we actually try to go through a lot of the lore and someone who's capable of pulling out like best of examples of stories of lore of characters you know because yeah I'm one of the seemingly thousands in the community who doesn't read the lore and just feels like there's not a lot of reason to engage with the lore of this world and it's always felt weird and I've said this before on the show but I've never made I don't know I feel like we could make more effort to try to put the let's steelman the AOS story still met you know the lore the characters there's got it I mean there's a huge amount of stuff that's out there yeah that could be a cool show to try to pull together yeah it's ironic because the interesting parts of the stories are when they actually focus in on the characters and just have them like talk right and like express motivation the least interesting part is when it's just like oh another fight okay cool this guy these guys smashed but then these guys smashed harder it's like oh great okay cool stuff cool story bro okay alright Sylvaneth let's get into it so the evergreen hunt that's what we're dealing with here so on a perfect pace Tom great pace buddy okay to honor curnoff friendly evergreen hunt units that do not have the hero keyword have the battle line battlefield role you might ask who can go in this army well I'm glad you asked that this army can include it's obviously has to be Sylvaneth and then they have to have it in the arch revenant curnoff hunters revenant seekers or spite writer Lancers keyword so bug writers curnoff and arch revenants that's who you're allowed to to have okay yep cool cool alright so so but then all those people become battle lines so like you can really just build out of whatever you want basically out of those units okay the rhythm of the chase after deployment before players have determined who will take the first turn you can pick one enemy unit on the battlefield to be the quarry if the quarry is destroyed at the start of your next hero phase you can pick one enemy unit on the battlefield to be the new quarry so you're picking something you're hunting by the way you are going to be trying to kill multiples of these over the course of the game it will actually be the goal then other rules will trigger off of this as we'll see okay fine and then harmonies of the hunt at the start of each battle round after the priority role has been made each player commanding an evergreen hunt army must determine their hunting harmony for that battle round starting with the player taking the first turn a hunting harmony is made up of a number of cords you start with zero cords and receive one cord for the following if a friendly belthenos is on the battlefield for each friendly evergreen hunt unit wholly within the same large quarter of the battlefield as the quarry and I think one got cut off here I'm sorry that's my fault I think I cut out text cause uh yeah sorry and then for each quarry destroyed during the battle I apologize I accidentally deleted too much text there so every quarry you destroy adds one every evergreen hunt closing in on the quarry i.e. in the same battlefield quarter yeah and then belthenos just adds one all the time okay okay alright that's good yeah missing that it was looking a little rough yeah that's that's good to know that that helps out okay that's my fault sorry when I was preparing this I that's not how you spell that two Rs my apologies everybody okay so then you might ask alright so I get this number what happens well this is what happens so the hunting harmony table at zero your discordant there's no effect which is impossible if you have belthenos and he hasn't died right you would just always be at one mm-hmm so one is at one to run in charge two is at one to hit rolls within the same large quarter as the quarry two is at one to hit rolls and wound rolls that target any enemy unit in the same quarter as the quarry three through five so the fat middle as it were of this right is plus one to attacks characteristics while they're close to the quarry within three inches and they don't have to be fighting the quarry they have to be within three inches of the quarry right and that's for the whole unit just somebody in the unit has to be within three inches of the quarry and then at six plus it's mellifluous boy what a word yeah while a friendly unit is wholly within the same large quarter the battlefield the quarry is eligible to fight in the combat phase within six inches instead of three they get they get six inch pylon long story short so obviously you're really just trying to get to three right mm-hmm like six is great but three is where the magic happens mm-hmm because then you're getting these effects are cumulative by the way so then you're getting one to run in charge one to hit and wound and one to attacks so quite a lot of bonuses yeah really good and then finally abundant growth you you don't have woods you don't set up selvineth woods mission accomplished boys you got it yeah you got your wish you were calling that out that's what you're looking for yeah we got there yeah instead you just pick three train features they're overgrown you get to heal wounds if you're close to an overgrown train feature blah blah blah mm-hmm fantastic man you might actually play this army I know right yeah this this now you have to buy bugs though yeah this is a problem for me it would just be all like arch revs and and balthanos and kernaughty I wouldn't have any bug people because yeah I don't like I don't I don't really love the bugs the bug flyers that's the problem I can't win I love kernaught I think kernaught are like the coolest thing they're the bees knees I just like trees I think the tree people are the coolest part of the army mm-hmm okay uh and then the other stuff so you have a heroic action um that if you're that you can pick a unit within nine inches of a hero and they become the quarry so if you need to move the quarry off turn because you normally wouldn't get to pick it until your next um uh hero phase um this you can do at the start of the hero phase so like off turn you could pick the quarry a new quarry which is cool kind of interesting how that incentivizes an aggressive arch revenant I like that as opposed to like an arch revenant that's hanging out as a buff piece uh so yeah it's kind of interesting yeah I just kind of put in a spot where your a lot of armies are going to have to engage you right they're going to have to have something that gets within nine inches of an aggressive arch revenant that you can then switch over as far as the quarry so yeah that's kind of neat yep uh what if a quarry is partially on two or more quarters of the field well then I assume I'll sell it in those two quarters would count because you're in the same large quarter so it's if they if they happen to be on a line then then it's great for you well it's not a holy one you have to be but they don't have to be correct correct it says you have to be holy within the same large quarter as the quarry but the quarry doesn't have to be holy within a large quarter is my point so uh and then merciful strike is your monster's rampage for your your evergreen hot monster which given what that this army can consist of it means the big giant bug guy that else knows right you can have hence the picture hence the picture yes if the quarry has any wounds allocated to it and is within three inches of this unit roll a dice and add the number of wounds allocated to the quarry to the roll if the result is greater than the quarry's wounds characteristic one model in that unit is slain okay hmm it's like okay feels pretty eh yeah it's it's pretty eh yeah because that is correct you're not picking though if you're picking the model that you might have something there but yeah yeah it's just that I mean yeah but this could actually like gig a foot hero well if they have wounds allocated to him sure right like at that point you might just kill him with stomp but sure maybe maybe are you doing this instead of roaring I don't know uh let's say that here let's let's let's play hypothetical let's say that there's a there's a magical Christmas land I'm ready no let's say that there's a monster next to you that's down to its final bracket uh huh right sure um statistically it's got a few wounds left yeah like um on a d6 let's say that's three wounds left sure you have a better shot of killing it with this than with stomp sure yes I mean you you if it had three wounds left yes you're statistically more likely you're correct yeah you're gonna roll a d6 and if you roll a four five or six it's gone I understand in because you had the wounds characteristic I allocated I get it in magical Christmas land that works nine times out of ten with your only monster in the army you're gonna roar because roar is the best action in the game and you get what you're only gonna have one monster section this army it's gonna be right which can't fail this can't I understand why they can't you can fail the role you could fail the role but if you succeeded the role you remove the model as opposed to you and you're killing it off turn but if you're fighting a unit or a lot of things that don't have allocated like the vast majority of the time you're the vast yeah not to dunk in Idaho you but majority of the time you are fighting things it will not this will not do anything sure sure I mean what I would say is that it there are circumstances where it certainly will and there are corner cases where it may be more effective or potent than like a roar or stop yeah I agree with you in one out of 20 times you fight with this guy it might be more valuable so okay interesting example like yeah I thought of that like sure I get I get what you're saying yeah yes you yeah you can't stop a monster but sure sure it's more effective than titanic tool or whatever like right yes um and there is your turn by the way you would kill them before they get to do their monsters action yeah sure sure sure um it's it's most interesting honestly that's not the situation that interests me the most what interests me the most about the situation is legitimately like some really hard to break elite melee unit like an OBR stalkers or something like that if they have like three wounds allocated to them before they like you then that would be your best case scenario because then you do kill one of those like nearly unkillable idiots right like that's actually the place where it seems the most useful to me yeah and as mentioned you can't stop a monster yeah I just said that yes okay but you can't stop those those guys but at any rate it's still wrong okay uh your command trait um which you can't give to a unique person which I was sad to see yeah um nor like often what they've been doing with these is allowing the unique people to actually take them so you so if belthenos is in charge of belthenos's army which you wouldn't think would be something you would want to do right uh sorry get that kind of those kind of toys yeah um so basically this is arch-revenant only yeah and in that case you can heal d3 wounds allocated to the arch-revenant instead of one if you're standing near a wood yay I'm sorry what's the generic command traits in the base book because that's what you're going to be using it's trash uh your artifact is the heartwood hunting horn once we're battle at the start of any battle round the bearer can say that they will blow their heartwood hunting horn if they do you receive one additional hunting for the harmony cord for that battle round it's fine I like that yeah I think that's pretty solid sure I mean if it pushes you up to like in the round you need to get to three or it could push you to six or something like that right that's actually super strong if you're in the round where you're going to capitalize on that yeah my first stop was round two this is one of those where you really need to play it to get a feel for it there's various weird elements that are going on with the timing of some of these things but like you end up so round one you're going to get one with Balthanos that's more or less all you're going to get right okay so round two let's say your opponent goes first you have to do the quarry at the you have to do the harmony cord to the start of the battle round so you're still at one and then they go first and then they move let's say the quarry into this area where you're going to engage it I don't know maybe they get aggressive with it long story short I could see you know it's like there's misalignment on the timing of the chords for round two so I'm going to pop right I'm going to pop this in round two where okay I'm going to fix that misalignment I'm going to get up to two get my plus one to hit and wound start doing some work like it's just a timing of a lot of games I would imagine that would be a common sequence with something like this yep yep so no I think it's okay battle tactics some pretty interesting stuff actually trophy kill kill the quarry with a melee weapon that's it that's what it is which is pretty easy because your quarry could just be like that unit of shaft then I'm definitely going to kill yeah right there's no reason you can't fish for easy quarry at the start of the game yeah man that was my reading as well like yeah I would think that's what you're going to be doing pick something that's slow that's like they're there to die so yep fulfill their purpose kill them to get your quarry going right right exactly just just ramp that number up yeah and circled all friendly units are in the same large quarter the battlefield is the quarry you got to get everybody in your army into that quarter that disincentivizes current off bow hunters I think very much in this army because they're often going to not be able to get into the right quarter like they just won't be able to take advantage of a lot of the bonuses they can't trigger a lot of the battle tactics like clearly you want sword hunters or or side hunters yeah and then finally spring the trap four more friendly units made a charge moving this turn and one or more of those units made an attack with a melee weapon that targeted the quarry in this turn actually pretty easy to achieve I mean four units is a lot to charge admittedly in this army theoretically especially if you've got a lot of bug riders that's not that hard to to pull off so yeah potentially yeah you just need one of them to swing at the quarry right oh just one okay all right good all right cool yeah that makes that more Bible all right yes I really think you got like two pretty achievable battle tactics in this which is great so I need if you've got two achievable battle tactics in your army you've got five battle tactics yeah let in the melstrom intimidate the invaders surround and destroy those three immediately would be viable with magical mayhem or whatever because theoretically you could like or not magically I'm sorry I'm magical dominance yeah potentially you'd have to do arcane tome on an arch revenant but yeah maybe you can do that sure I mean you were probably taking arcane tome anyway so it's just backboard it and mr. shield and call a day and get two points right whatever yeah and then finally your grand strat is the grand hunt you complete this grand strategy if you've destroyed four or more queries cool so again that does incentivize you to pick like um like small garbo units and things that the enemy is meaning to die their chaff and their stuff like that right all right and yeah exactly tough like I would guess most games are not killing a quarry in round one unless well not necessarily if you're so you're probably going to be a one-drop I would think with a lot of these lists and okay so then yeah make your pony go first you're really fast so maybe you could kill a quarry I just point being right I mean it's if you're just doing one per round that could be challenging but maybe you have opportunity to double up in a round yeah because you could always reassign off of that if you're using like Belthenos he's pretty forward so like then off turn if you know your people are going to finish off another unit you would just move the like you you'd re quarry some new unit right right like this hunter's mark is basically what's going on here like all I can see is the giant arrow from World of Warcraft like bobbing up and down over this this target yeah so okay and the last piece here to discuss is of course Belthenos himself I'm interested to get your take on this guy Tyler being our resident Sylvanth expert 12 inch move he flies former expert but that's okay thank you I still count you still you get it forever once you get it sure 12 inch fly move 14 wounds 3 of save 9 bravery so obviously a pretty great stat line 4 attacks 2s and 3s neg 3 rend 3 damage and then 4 attacks 4s and 3s neg 2 rend 4 damage 3 damage 2 damage so on and so forth so you know pretty decent profile the force to hit on the bug hurts but he himself's profile is very strong rend 3 damage 3 is obviously great and then he has nature aetheric in your hero phase you can pick one terrain feature within 6 inches of this unit and roll a die on a 3 up pick one scenery roll from the mysterious terrain table to apply to that terrain feature for the rest of the battle if that feature sorry if that terrain feature already has a scenery roll then this rule is replaced by the one you pick that terrain feature is also considered by you to be an overgrown terrain feature pretty cool ability actually this is the first time we've ever seen somebody play with this where you can like you turn something into mystical terrain arcane terrain dammed terrain those are getting ready to three things you would ever potentially turn something into get a word save get a bonus to cast take damage for plus 1 to hit yeah 100% yeah so you can be on immediately plus 2 with your bunker wildwood what am I thinking I'm thinking of the war song revenant who gets a plus 1 yeah if you have a war song revenant plus 1 to cast by a wildwood so your bunker wildwood you do this you get up to plus 2 immediately off the go so yeah pretty interesting I really like the dams yeah kind of hit that with the kernothe unit or bug unit whatever to get the plus 1 to hit and then they go off and kill something he has the magical 7 words this unit has a word of 5 yes wow amazing the magical 7 words I love to see him um kernothe war horn friendly silenith units holy within range of this ability can attempt to charge even if they ran in the same turn including himself which is great I mean this is a very fast force like if you do have the bug riders and him you got a lot of 12 and 14 inch fly move that can also run and then they can also charge right and his horn has like a very big radius initially at 18 inches so like it's pretty great and then you can use this command ability at the start of your movement phase the unit that receives this command must be a friendly silenith unit the unit can retreat and still charge later in the turn um is this guy better in a normal silveneth army yes yeah by far right yeah this guy Tom I could talk for 30 minutes about this guy wouldn't you want to say a few things about him before I start rambling I mean he seems fine oh man oh he is so much better than just a Tom lion's fine my friend I mean yeah go ahead dude guys I think this is one of the most consequential individual war scroll releases that we've had maybe all this year this war scroll transforms this faction this war scroll in multiple ways expands this faction like never before so number one right with run in charge holy with an 18 that opens up a wide variety of lists that were not on the table previously the faction has always had this uh Rube Goldberg can we roll that two up on this lovely in the spell called Spites from Hive right and if we can't yeah now that's not every single list right but we've been in that domain for years now over at least two books I think we've had it second second edition third edition so it's huge this also obviously pairs well with War Singer War Singer can command trait you don't see a whole lot an amazing command trait a plus three to move I don't think it's charged I think it's just plus three to move bubble from your your general so that pairs really well with this the unending hunts to retreat and still charge especially amazing I think on bugs bugs really turn off if you're able to pin them down like Brendan and I we got a game in of all wars I was the ringer and around one we actually got to play over the weekend and he had six bugs that I was able to pin down and just yeah so if if he had had Belfanos in his list like that game would have been well very very different uh five up ward on 14 wounds with the three of save with all the healing that you can do this guy like he is amazing or 360 I think he's under costed a little bit I don't you don't want to get carried away with them but I think 360 is an absolute bargain he's practically an auto-include in my mind with most of enough list at this price point and everything that he does so anyway I could ramble on forever about this guy but yeah I think it's just phenomenal I will only say I agree completely his army of renown is cute but this dude in regular Sylvaneth as a Haas somebody else can you take War Singer in this army not in the army of renown you can't but in the regular but he can go in the regular Sylvaneth and again then it opens up the doors to what you're talking about Tyler like hey you got the normal plus to cast now you're standing next to arcane terrain blah blah blah right even regular Kernoth on foot becomes so much faster because now I could potentially move 11 and then charge yeah right like it's just it's wild what this guy enables yes the repositioning of the retreat in charge like I think he is an amazingly tough good piece decent offense he can actually crack he can crack some nuts because he's got the run to get to get there he like he's offensive enough he's not like a crazy hammer but he's offensive enough to make it worth it he's tough as he'll heal like mad yeah in Sylvaneth just like like wild healing and that's a snow horn mobility yeah 14 wins 3 ups save with the 5 that's a stone horn yeah correctly like a few less wins but yeah yeah because a stone horn in their invulneran obviously 16 wins or whatever yeah are you concerned about him only having a 12 inch move because he has an 18 inch I know well I mean if you use the command ability on him yes no he always has charges that's always he has an auto 6 like he's 12 plus a d6 right unless you unless you use the other one but you if you do that then you can't then you can't grant retreat in charge of somebody else I having an average of a 15 inch move I am never concerned about an average 15 inch fly move that is so fast I understand like I just but it's it's 12 plus a d6 I understand yeah and and again Tom maybe with War Singer as well obviously he's not carrying War Singer but an arch revenant probably would be a natural holder for as a as a power pair with it with this piece you could do a different one no he's good I mean don't miss a don't like I'm not saying he's bad it's just I see that 12 movement like I recognize there are other factors that are invisible and it just you know because on because he's on a what 120 mil base I believe so I don't know I believe it's on a circle is any on a circle I thought he was on a circle look yeah sure just thinking about like flying on that base yes he can run okay yeah I think this dude's a house just a straight house I'm so happy with this guy's role I think he's amazing yeah he Tom he strikes me like I don't think you're Lero you know doing a Lero Jenkins with this guy and you're not necessarily saying that he's is he on a 150 oval oh is he there you go you know he's a he's an early buff piece I mean he certainly is capable of just doing work and combat but there are a number of build directions you can go on this guy I know we don't want to spend the rest of the entire show talking about him but the first thought would be this guy can certainly turn on a hammer a hammer play like a nine spy right Lancers nine size type direction right like it immediately opens that up if you can get levitate on that kind of unit you know it with like nine sides this guy with levitate on him yeah there's just there are a number of directions you can go in with this guy Ivan sat down and started to try to think through the different builds I could see a Derthu play with this guy with you know two very powerful pieces yeah so yeah I think he's going to show up all over the place and competitive list going forward yep I agree complete yeah I I mean I agree with that certainly yeah I'm just thinking about like the spaces in which he might and if his base really is that big then that could be problematic just to get him in right like because if he has a big base with a 12 inch move getting that over the line and past like so like screens getting big bases over screens sure always a problem yeah I guess someone who's had to manipulate a mall crush this is he's not that it's a much smaller base than that okay I do just want to call out guys like this to me is a home run this war scroll on so many levels again we can quibble over the point value and whether it's I do think it's a little too cheap but whatever yeah this war scroll and some other ones we're going to get into I think that they just knocked it out of the park with this within the context of the faction overall agreed yep beautiful model perfect stats great utility awesome that it opens up new play styles everything you want like absolute home run I agree cracked it into the upper deck with this guy yeah all right storm cast Eternals okay let's talk storm cast there's a little bit of a little bit of meat here so we've got the draconoff Skywing who goes in this one well each unit your army must have the storm cast Eternals keyword and the draconith keyword okay pretty straightforward so uh dragons you get dragons so there you go cool so that's storm drake guard crondis and Karzai by the way that's that's what we're saying here uh and and I own a script born himself obviously yeah of course all right so friendly crondis Karzai and storm drake guard units that have two models have the battle line battlefield role so everybody's battle line again that's in your army it's fine whatever don't worry about it just do what you want uh sorry that's just to clarify Niger conus right is part of this yes the Niger conus well yes he doesn't count as battle line but he can go in here yes sure absolutely again um draconith guardians uh I thought I got rid of all the dumb flavor text but clearly I missed some okay there it is if a friendly Ionis crypt born is within three inches of any friendly storm drake guard units before you allocate a wound or mortal wound to that hero or instead of making a ward role for a wound or mortal blah blah blah it can it can go to them he's got a four up body guard for for storm drake guard okay so he can pass off his wounds sure it's fine uh and then exemplars the start of the combat phase if there are two or more other friendly draken off skywing units within six inches of a friendly hero add one to the attacks characteristic of melee weapons used by that heroes mount until the end of that phase so okay it's fine I'm sad it limits it to mount because I want to give that to Karzai sure I wish that that rule was written as that heroes mount or the monster if it doesn't have if it doesn't have a writer I'd phrase it but Karzai and Krondis should get the bonus I want Karzai to get plus one attack from flying with storm drake guard that would be nice they have two mount profiles if I remember on Krondis I'm starting to remember how many mount profiles they have on Krondis and Karzai let's see well they are they are the thing they are okay they have no mount they are just a monster they are just a monster they are just a monster that was a fun brain fart but it is interesting for your nitrokonas it's cool that it can the dragons can do work as we all know if you fight in a pack then cool your mount gets somewhat better and then storm drake champions for each drakeneth skywing hero you include in your army you can include one storm drake guard that has one model cannot have the battle line battlefield roll this is basically covering your night this is allowing you to do the nitrokonas when you build them out of the box you only have one storm drake guard left so blah blah blah this is just covering for the nature of the kit yeah okay that is all there's a little bit more as far as it goes but this is all the standard battle traits which means what's missing here you can't deep strike you can't deep strike no krakow no lightning strike so you are what you are you are on the table you also don't have the explody wound thing and I don't miss it who cares like the thunder strike armor the explody armor when you go boom yeah does that feel like a lore breach because those storm casts specifically were crafted with that new armor well it's not just thunder strike thunder strike just gives you a bonus oh okay yeah the storm cast explode is a base roll storm cast and thunder strike armor explode harder yeah and yes it does feel like a lore breach I don't miss it because it's a stupid rule anyways sure you forget about all the time alright so then we've also got some thunderous roars and we've got heroic action two monstrous rampages again these are at the start of the hero phase with any dragon and skywing hero thunderous roars pick one friendly dragon and skywing hero and roll a dice on a two up until the end of that turn enemies within three inches that hero cannot receive the inspiring presence command so heroic action to turn off inspiring presence gives you terror effectively okay not bad kinda wish it would be maybe like six inches as opposed to having to be in combat but you let's see within three oh right okay so yeah you can do it on your turn and then you charge in there you go you're within three so yeah it's kind of a proactive thing that you're looking to do that's okay the real problem buddy if you let's say okay let's let's craft the ultimate scenario what you want to do you send your guy who does a lot of damage some dragon maybe it's Karzai maybe it's a juiced up ionist maybe it's a juiced up nitro conus send him into some zombies or whatever some big melee unit like that I don't care some massive unit you kill 20 of them there's a bunch way above your weight okay alright how are they gonna pull those casualties exactly yeah you're gonna quickly find yourself not within three inches yep so yeah yeah that's what's gonna happen there'll be some use cases but yeah you're right for the most part this sounds better than it actually is people will just pull casualties okay I'm no longer within three all inspiring presence the unit the other 40 are fine yeah I mean you just need to make sure that you strike first well you want them to strike first you mean no you want to strike first they don't have to pile in I can pull the casualties and then just not pile so then they don't participate in combat okay live sure who cares so they weren't gonna do any damage to you anyways like when you went in like those kinds of units aren't gonna hurt you and melee they hurt you through like murder rolls or zombie die rolls or whatever you know like they're not what what are the grot poke is gonna do or clan rats sticks gonna do nothing nothing zero zero to that unit right yeah like yeah okay I'll just not fight so like you want them to fight first right so that that way like in a perfect world they fight first pilot on you in such a way that if you even if you wreck them they have to stay within three inches and can't hopefully don't kill enough to get out of the way anyways that's the situation okay won't happen all the time but be aware of it it can happen and then monster strand pages stun pick one enemy unit within three inches this unit and roll a die three up subtract one from wound rolls for attacks made by that unit in the following combat phase holy crap we got a fantastic monsters rampage ladies and gentlemen this is a good one no qualifiers no one wound or only two wounds or four wounds or less on a Tuesday if your name is Steve okay right so like just a unit they're there you roll the die three up neg one to wound fantastic neg one to wound is one of the most crippling penalties you can get there's almost no way to get out of it yeah like that's stupid that's a little harsh the new griffin and cities of sigmar with his artifact or commensurate whatever it is you can only wound that guy on a four up like that's that's really strong yeah I played against that thing the other night yep it matters it matters a lot so I love this one like great and by the way remember everybody in this army does a monster's rampage right every unit all of these yeah you're just going to you're going to use all of the base ones and these like someone stomping someone's roaring someone's titanic dueling you'll probably smash some terrain just for good measure right like you just got monster's rampages for days for days son okay and then impact tremors pick one enemy unit within three inches of this unit and roll a die on a three up in the following combat phase models in that unit can only move up to one inch when they make a pylon move instead of three yeah again decent it's fine solid yeah especially against like you're going to use that against the mass infantry unit to stop a bunch of them from getting in on you yeah great we're going to tag it on the corner or whatever yeah I would like to engage one model of the great guard unit or yeah this is like what the nitro conus does or whatever he does this the big infantry unit and then you basically gum them up if you've ever played against limiting pylon stuff which is lots of this in the game you just really really impactful yeah so again two great monster's rampages very happy with this like I'm here for it yeah seeing these guys it's like okay this has competitive play like again it's probably not going to 50 but like just in the back of these two alone it was really interesting on these things what I think smart play could go a long way yeah yeah and no it is all dragons yeah oops all dragons still good so pretty good Tom when it said impact tremors what did you think a bunch of one damage to a bunch of different units nearby exactly every time new creature comes into play I'm going to do one damage okay great impact tremors one of the most busted two-man enchantments in history it's great okay magic reference you're going to catch up with them soon Tyler with your commander journey you're going on don't worry it's on the to-do list all right talk about command traits and stuff commander of the skies draconith skywing general only again can't go on unique I don't know why they decided in this book suddenly we couldn't do it on unique when in the last book we couldn't it made sense but whatever it's fine I mean not that you don't have a good hero give me the general it just kind of sucks to have like this cool named guy who's supposed to be in charge of the force and they can't take the command traits that's a great question can you have allies with these horses no wait so are you are you saying that Ionis cannot take the prayers here draconith skywing priest only uh yeah at the moment he cannot I clearly that's going to have to be FNQ'd so maybe it's just a miss on all of them I don't know but yes at the moment he can't take I mean unique characters can't take enhancements and take enhancements and you can't have any other priest in this army correct yeah okay so clearly this is yeah this is a noops okay that's a noopsie do so I don't know if it's intentional or not it's like clearly the prayer thing is an error but I don't know if the command trait is an error they could go like in the other one maybe they're like we want you to have an archer have an archer have a charged and you have Ionis and not Ionis but that feels kind of crappy because I want to use Ionis I want to use the Ionis right I don't know so any who after this general's fought for the first time in the combat phase no enemy units within three inches of this general roll a die on a two up this general can immediately make a d6 inch move and can finish that move within three inches of enemy units cool ability it does help counteract that problem with the heroic action i talked about earlier right but like it's pretty cool ability post-combat move is neat oh yeah gotcha actually it's the first time to come up with an a is not immune three okay yeah yeah i mean yeah that's that's solid tie up tie up a shooting unit or just the usual tricks right like you do with blood tubes or whatever so murder lusting is pretty good part of lust i'm glad to see stormcast doing it too let's go let's just spread that broken ability out so it's good yeah this one's not as good as that because obviously it's not just any time you want apparently it's your commander too yeah but still i like the ability yeah the artifact is the cellist and and some and sign and sign once for battle at the start of any phase the bearer can say that they will raise their celestium thingamajiggy if they do so you can heal up to d3 wounds allocated to each friendly dracon at the unit holy within nine inches of the bearer so i don't hate that i do kind of because i hate holy within nine that is such a small range on those bases yeah bases are big i thought you said within nine yeah no holy within nine it should be within nine for for a once per battle ability sure this should be just within this should just be within 12 is what it should be okay that is not a lot of healing once a game with an incredibly tight range it's garbage yeah that is garbage uh so arcane tell them then cool all right great you can make it work you have to do more effort than you should have to but i don't know it depends on terrain like it i could see making it work on both sides as somebody who's played like dragons a lot yeah dragons don't group up they like splitting up they're they're independent operators you're all over the battlefield yeah you're looking at an army of like seven or eight models here so right yeah you can't like have you're not going to have your army in this tight pack right yeah yeah just be i mainly think like a round one round round one area of effect you're like you're doing some healing against you know that lovely things of so-tech that i was yeah sure i mean i just didn't set up like that i would be set up spread the hell out because i don't have a group of right i mean i'd be all over the place yeah like that that that that so-tech thing is i am very unafraid of with oops all dragons one because i have a spelling for most of my guys and two because my army is spread out just like right good luck getting two guys at the end of your bubble right like i'm i am from end to end baby okay yeah spell lore dragon of the skywing wizard only assumingly this is meant to say unique as well because this would be for crondus mm-hmm i assume and not i don't think they're assuming you put an arcane tome on your or you can even take it in but anyways you like because that's not gonna work yeah so it's for crondus um regal authority is a spell that has a casting value of seven and a range of 18 if successfully cast pick one friendly dragon at the unit holy within range and visibility cast her until the start of your next hero phase each time that unit issues a command will die on a five up the command point to issue that command is not spent okay cool i get a third of a command point for casting a spell great uh yes but if you have an issue commands in a bunch of different phases sure um you could i could eventually get up to one free command point for casting a spell it's very exciting that's how lucky you are yeah yeah sure statistically you'll tend to issue about three commands likely to this unit over that course which means you get about one free command point out of the spell on average yeah yep definitely well no it's the unit is issuing so if that unit continues to issue right then every time you're doing it you're checking to save that sure main point sure i mean you're often just issuing to yourself in this game now because the way it works sure sure yeah um especially in this army you're often issuing to yourself um because again c previous statement about everybody being spread out Keith Rogers does this a or lose access to the sce battle tome spell or yes yes you don't you get nothing from the base book throw the base book in the trash it's irrelevant to you nothing this is your army all the armies of renown it's that's how they work you take the base book we're not using that it's what's on these pages only complete replacement okay all right prayer scriptures you got uh you got three of these wild for your priest you're one say more grace prayer that has an answer value of three at a range of 12 one friendly unit holy within range invisible a chance or heal three wounds okay so heal yourself so heal yourself all right you can heal yourself i only can theoretically once this is f a q heal himself three wounds uh sanctification uh answer value four until the starting next to your face attract one from casting rolls for enemy wizards and extract one from chanting rolls for enemy priests that's just period so yeah hard to answer prayer but pretty decent we'll talk about why it's actually not hard at all for him to do in a moment when we look at ionis's scroll and then sovereignty uh answer value four in range of 12 pick one enemy unit within range until the start of your next hero phase that unit counts as a maximum of five models for the purposes of contesting objectives oh boy yeah say good night sons of bad mutt that your counter has finally arrived uh i'm sorry you count as i'm sorry king broad you count as 25 models nobody that's five models maybe we're gonna go ahead and borrowing this objective so quick question um and that's a weird a weird one does our store uh our storm drakes technically considered racking us yes storm drake guard yeah storm drake guard they're in the army yes now i'm sorry um uh star drakes no they're not nope they they are not part of his army no star drake he's for you no star drake he's and no drake gods either the like fulminators and stuff they're not they're not the same they're all different things there's lots of different drake related things so it's basically only the storm drake guard storm drake our carzai in the carzai yes that's it and then i own it and nitrokinus right who i'm just calling an honorary storm drake because basically what he is yeah he's a hero storm drake yeah yeah right yeah yeah i love these these prayers those prayers are are amazing like yeah love the prayers and i own this is like a legendarily good test uh it was like when we get to him uh skywing maneuvers concentrated force you complete this tactic if the same enemy unit was targeted by attacks made with melee weapons by three or more friendly draconist skywing units in the combat phase of this turn so group up a thing i just said we don't do very often so okay i mean it's doable i'll say this it is automatically doable basically as long as your first two guys don't absolutely wreck the unit and the third one actually gets to swing that's actually you could you could lose for winning sure right carzai goes in kicks the crap out of them the second unit goes finishes them off the third unit's like we got nothing to fight or can't get to the remaining guys even with the pile in and their reach right like that kind of thing you'll this is the way you're gonna lose this is by losing for winning you did too good you killed them too hard yeah this is to me this reads like okay you have one like anvil unit left on the table from the enemy that's when you right like where you've like you whittled it down and you're you're already winning and this is just another example of you winning harder yeah focus destruction is used three different monstrous rampages on the same unit so it's the same thing like group up and go to town with monstrous rampages on the same unit it's it's the same as the previous one um so similar thing although more achievable because it's highly unlikely you're gonna like remove the unit right yeah um so and you don't have to succeed you just have to make the attempt with three different yeah correct they just have to be picked as the target right exactly so like roar fail stomp fail neg wonder wound fail complete the battle tactic yeah great now you just have to over commit resources is the key right exactly um and suddenly on the concentrated force i mean that might be an argument for the single like trying to get two or three of the single storm trade cards just yeah or heroes are just the single single by themselves sure just like minimize you're trying to like minimize your output um spread out over three activations well this reads like wanting to do like two heroes two solos and then units right yeah yeah sure and then cleansing strike you pick two enemy controlled objectives and you kill all the enemies on them so it's it's like super dude that used to be the the whole what was back in like early 3.0 there what was it called where you had to like it was pick an enemy unit on an objective and you boot them off of that objective yeah clean one off that was a battle tactic now it's we've got that we've got we've got inflation going right here because now we gotta pick two units and kill them yeah and then finally your grand strat on wings of death when the battle ends you complete this grand strategy if three friendly tracking at the units are wholly within nine inches of each other so i guess end of the game grouped up and have three units left that's so that's fine i mean it's achievable as long as you don't think you're going to get tabled right so yeah could be a big ask but i mean obviously the definition of one more there potentially it's the hardest core definition of when more i've ever seen yeah where like it's at the end of the game you can afford to take three or units and just have them fly over and stand next to each other yeah you don't you're not trying to do anything else in the last round you're not worried about your guys having died you're just like literally like yep we're just in we're just in cleanup mode now boys just float and stand together okay let's talk about ionis himself he ionis starts with 14 inch movie does go down uh he has a 16 wounds a three up save and a nine bravery um he has his little spirit scouring flames nine attacks three threes neg two one damage allegedly this is apparently what kills blood thirsters look out for that um and then he's got soul breaker his ancient claws and his time worn fangs of course um he's fine enough in melee the time worn fangs are two attacks on threes threes neg three rend three damage so it's good but it's only two attacks so whatever um neither he nor belthanos are war masters which kind of makes me angry um it feels like they both should be um spirit scouring flames each time a wound is caused by an attack made with spirit scouring flames is allocated to an enemy unit the unit is soul burned at the end of each hero phase roll a dice for each soul burned unit if the roll is equal to or less than the number of the current battle round that unit suffers d3 mortal wounds when a player uses an ability that allows them to heal any wounds that have been allocated to a unit instead of healing any wounds allocated to a soul burn unit that unit is no longer soul burned so okay he puts a dot on him yeah neat uh draconic horror enemy units cannot receive the rally and inspiring presence commands while they're within 12 inches of this unit now we're talking now that is how now this is pod racing okay that's how you shut off some command abilities you show him my onus get that get that garbo heroic action out of here uh it's hilarious to me that they have that heroic action in here when he has just like the vastly superior version on his scroll yeah well it'll let him split up is the key sure yeah i i understand i'm just saying like this is so it's funny how bad that one is compared to and it's a and it's a yeah whatever yeah it's an extra thing whereas this is just on the scroll yeah scry intent subtract one from the attack characteristic of melee weapons that target this unit to a minimum of one so cool just like big crondis and carzai and then the important part arch relic tour that's right he is our first super priest super priest he's super priest aow in your hero phase this unit can chant two prayers we got their folks we got there they have broken the seal we have lost containment the raptors are out of the cage okay they have breached the fences this was a un breachable wall we had spellcasters you know wizards casting one two three four 15 spells who cares right you got to gosh over there just going nuts read the nine books he's having a grand old time casting every spell under the sun he's got a 22 minute magic phase uh just on on like his spells alone right but the one prayer had been a sacrosanct rule no longer for the arch relic tour has arrived okay and anyways you can chant two prayers instead of one at the start of your hero phase you must say how many prayers is unit will chant if you say one uh it's automatically answered with a chanting roll of six if you say two you make chanting rolls for both prayers okay and at the start of the enemy hero phase you can pick one in the spell or in vocation within 12 inches unit roll a die on a two plus he he's like no he gives you the old decambé mutomo no yeah love it it's awesome i wish he could on a two up destroy and incarnate sure do i just banish that thing forever from the game right right as an aside you can never have him in the same army with crondis or carzai yeah it's not awesome because um you'd need three battle line units and the singles don't count as battle line and so it's ten crondis and carzai are a battle line in yeah crondis and carzai they're battle line oh in this sorry yeah i'm i i miss that sorry okay so i guess you could do like two units of two and then crondis or carzai and him and a hero him and a hero exact that's the exact list tom that i wrote initially yeah crondis because of the magic uh mystic shield etc you got a hundred points basically left over to get like comets or and if you do arcane tom on the draconis you go two in the spells right but yeah draconis prondis ionis two by two storm drake guard or maybe a two or and two ones well i guess no you'd have to be it'd have to be two by two yeah yeah you have to be two two by two two two by city yeah yeah yeah that's i don't know i that's a fun list like i'd love to play that i'm gonna be a lot of fun and then and then again a hundred points of endless spells but anyway yep uh and then lightning tempest lightning tempest is a prayer that has an answer value of three and a range of 18 inches if answered pick one enemy unit within range that unit is struck by lightning they've been thunder struck and they take d three mortal wounds then roll a die on one of two the tempest clears and the sequence ends on a three plus pick one other enemy unit within three inches and then their thunder struck and repeat this process until either there's no other enemy units or you fail the roll and you can't affect the same unit more than once per hero phase so yeah pretty good cool stuff foreign points he's not as absolute i rate this guy i don't think he's as amazing as um both on us yeah uh yeah he's a little expensive for what he's doing but i rate him yes yeah i would start by switching their point values uh 360 for him and 400 for both on us and see how that goes correct like that is actually the correct um the correct points they they are inverted yeah yeah uh so getting a lot of thoughts on this guy but tom do you any any thoughts on this no i mean he's really interesting like the thing that interests me the most i think is the um like beyond the obvious stuff like the prayer like his and his like there are a bunch of obvious easy to understand tools right like the prayers and the battle shock and the room reducing attacks and yada yada that's all fine um but the spirit scouring flames is actually something that's really interesting to me because it's nine of those shots in any of them connect have the ability to tag and and start burning of mortal wounds right it's not going to do a lot of work but i think it might end up doing more work than you anticipate because if he splits like like um those nine attacks and goes fours and fives like four on one five on another unit you'll likely tag both of them was with neg two rep like one of them is going to statistically get through on both um and so there just might be some really interesting um play with that that i think that people just aren't thinking about yet sure yeah yeah the fact that it shuts off healing the next time they try to heal they only just remove the soul burn is actually the most interesting part of that more more so than the dot itself yeah big fan of this guy uh so from a list building standpoint the first thought that came to mind was this guy is your alternative to what has been a main stave a lot of list lord relic tour or night relic tour high priest translocation translocation re-rolling either on a three up or two depending on the night or lord this guy gives you an auto translocate he does so so he he immediately can slot in instead of the lord or night relic tour that's really interesting and that then means that you can have your cake and eat it too from a list building standpoint so as we've often discussed the go-to grand strategy for stormcast the season has been spellcasting savant yeah particularly on like a lord arcane on griff charger because it's got the healing spell it's got the teleport hopping around you can generally it's got eight wounds so it's decent against aoe area area of effect damage and you can just do a pretty good job of keeping it alive during a game you fall off a cliff if that's not your grand strategy and you don't have a piece like it gets really rough for stormcast so you yeah iowness opens up the ability to do spellcasting savant on the right kind of piece still have your auto translocate uh yeah i he's another war scroll where like the hole can be great in some of the parts he really i think it's quite nuanced he adds up you know he's one of those pieces where he's a he's a toolbox in himself and yeah so i'm starting looking at a lot of different lists and kind of how we can slot in but i think he's got a lot of play one potential downside i mean he's four hundred points so he's gonna slot into like maybe what had been a hammer spot in a list right it's like you're taking out a hammer potentially in your list building to get this guy in there and he's not really hammer so you know he is additive he's doing things that you need to get to add up right uh you may also need to be looking at pray doors with him where maybe you like translocate pray doors pick the spot he then starts lighting people up on a side i don't know yeah i could see him as a harasser uh but i find him a really fascinating piece in my mind and very very viable if he were a little cheaper he would be absolute yeah like you would see him a lot do the base prayers in the stormcast book allow for unique units to take the prayers oh gosh am i getting that wrong i have to look i don't think so because it was the first book that dropped yeah i don't think the unique exception ended up in a lot of the later books but i'm not sure the stormcast actually has it in there like oftentimes they made exceptions for spells and prayers for unique units but i don't remember correct melly pointed out uh brawn who makes us yes they do specifically so i don't know why so there you go but the good news here is as brawny noted is that he's not faction law right he's not actually yeah yeah totally yeah he left the hammers yes he's he's out yeah talk about that in the story slash of indicators he's got you know anyway this guy has got a lot of play in my mind yeah so okay good yes they do so yes he can he can translocate no issue there you go i couldn't remember whether they created that exception for that or not um yeah by the way hit like everyone for awesome myonus kriphorn coming back into the game or just because it's been a while since i've said so and clicking like is a good thing to do uh all right let's keep going we got we got we got more stuff to cover and we're going a while all right the black talons so this is all taken as one big thing and it's three units it's neve the black talons and then the idk caster it's 340 points for the lot okay um neve's attacks got a lot better with her whirlwind axes so she's three up eight inch move six wounds her whirlwind axes are now seven attacks twos threes neg two rend two damage uh she gets one she gets uh she goes to three damage when fighting heroes she can run and still shoot and or charge later in the turn and uh immediately after this unit has fought and slain models uh if any uh have been removed from play you can roll a die on a two plus remove this unit from the battlefield and set it up again more than three inches from all the units and holy within three inches of a friendly the black talons unit that is more than three inches from all the units so she can like fight go out fight slay the crap out of something and then whip back to to them as a home base which is pretty amazing mobility yeah very hard to bring her down so uh you know pretty cool um sickness is better but still not what she should be i mean this is a pretty good scroll my my problem is i totally take her alone for like 120 points i'm not sure i love her for 340 as part of this little contingent but we'll see then you've got neve's companions who are all three wound models right um there's three of them in this in this grouping um so hendrik uh rostus and uh shekana right um and then they've got their weapons and stuff that they've gotten right um overall they make you know some attacks they're okay is is what i would say um it's not amazing nothing here is amazing on their their actual profile they're fine their elite they can issue orders themselves um they can bodyguard for other black talons heroes um for neve they can keep her alive which is cool right on a two up so they have like a very strong bodyguard rule for her and um like the head shot neg three three damage thing is only against enemy heroes so you have to use rapid shot otherwise head shot it's fine right and then larai um which is the the idk she's a wizard she does wizard things she has a ward of five up you know um she has nebulous sea fog um until the start of your next hero phase shooting attacks the target friendly the black talons units that are wholly within six inches of this unit only score a hit on unmodified roll of six that's pretty okay you're taking a lot of stuff that's ostensibly just making the black talon go kick butt right because you can set up the spell to make the black talons basically immune to shooting so they can sit back behind the line and uh you know be like um be deck chair sitters on a back objective and then they can keep teleporting back to them for safety right so okay i like it uh yes sorry sickness larai does larai could be bodyguarded as well she does have other black talons um keyword so yeah what do you what do you what do you like it tom what do you think um i think that it so it's funny because both of the because it's a unit of three models right so they end up yeah yeah so they look out sir both larai and nave right right and then they also bodyguard and you can give them only being shot on a six and so actually it becomes this really interesting little unit um that's going to count for two four seven seven models on an objective so they're going to outscore a like a monster that comes in like not a giant obviously and nave can put some real hurt and be really hard to touch like from the skirmishy standpoint like i just i think that there's actually like there's a little bit of play here even at 340 um and it's interesting because there's hammers of sigmar and a normal me like uh do these do these set up all independently yeah they're independent units yeah yeah because then technically you could thunder strike you know you could drop some of them from the heavens in a standard stormcast army um not not the wizard but the other the the unit and nave i don't know like i think that there might be something here is what you say yeah you could like have two different uh treat the three the companions as an independent operator or vice versa with larai uh like like what you're saying scions neve's companions put larai on the table and so that you have two different points where you can fall back to with with neve as one example of what you might do obviously you're highly incentivized to keep them all together but yeah yeah they're just like it's just interesting to me that like um i think that there could be some really interesting plays and i think that there's probably some synergies that even like at first glance i haven't thought about um that that's probably here yeah that's kind of where i'm at honestly i mean i do agree events you can make a strong case that 340 is a little high obviously yeah yeah it's a lot to be paying when you're but you're getting three units you're getting heroes uh a separate nonhero unit yeah that can all deploy maybe if you break it down it's not too bad and i mean yeah and like that's the hero is a good high damage foot hero like navy's gonna put out real damage and and you're not gonna be able to pin her down because like if you don't charge her she is going if you don't charge and attack her first she's going to attack and then teleport away every single time hopefully yeah you're obviously you have the opportunity to roll the one with a with wind rider so well you always do but but which i do like that they had that in there you know i mean like the first thought was again leeroi jinker and her into is just even a screen immediately round one throw into her screen she's got a 20 what a 8 16 21 inch threat range yeah 21 inch average threat range uh that you're gonna probably get into a screen with a lot of these maps and but then yeah you could roll that one and now she's potentially dead so i like that that's there uh but i i like this war scroll are these war scrolls i like this package i think it's really cool design uh she's she's a nice piece i think she's going to be an ally piece for a number of lists uh this is just another example in my mind of design where you really have to start breaking it down adding it all up looking at different use cases it doesn't scream like right it's it's not linear it's not obvious necessarily how you're going to get great value consistently out of this but you start adding everything up six attacks from neve's companions three attacks from her shots uh even the profiles on what the the companions themselves can do right there's many layers to this in my mind uh levitate potentially on neve to be able to fly over the top of the screen get into some juicy bits he needs a delivery mechanism with her uh maybe beyond just the 20 minute average threat range but that's really good in itself so i don't again i could ramble forever about this but it's another one i really love the design of this personally i could easily see playing this in a list and feeling pretty good about it so yeah i like it yeah like it feels like a fair go track that's interesting yeah i mean i well boy that's a stretch of a comparison that is like when people say it's basically a time walk that's what you just said um but like it's um it's it is a like the the cap is lower because she's not rolling rolling all hits and right like go track was um and she's not dropping more like a d6 mortals on a natural hit of six but she's doing a lot of damage particularly against heroes and she's going to be hard to kill period i understand yeah i guess yeah i i mean my with her bodyguard with a two-up bodyguard sure i understand if i was paying for navel alone at 150 i i put navel in a ton of armies and think she was super cool 340 is a lot of points on five dinguses it just is in this army it's like the way you go rolling in stormcast is over investing into heroes this isn't magic okay because there's a very simple road to hell on for stormcast and it's well over invest in bad heroes right and this feels like exactly that like that's that it's that simple you're paying for three you're paying 340 points for a decent melee foot assassin the worst role in the game okay she's good at it i mean i don't know that she's like al-tharian good or sigvald good but she's pretty good right and she's up there like i'll give her i'll give her top five of the worst role in the game and then your rest of your points are for a bad caster and three deck chair sitters that if they ever get in combat if the enemy ever gets in combat with them your teleport beacon just went away um because she can't teleport back to them if they're in combat right but she could go back to laurine like even if she can't go to them like you just you keep their some distance between laurine and and the foot here yeah i mean not much you don't want lauri to get shot off the freaking table sure well but lauri even lauri alone is sitting on a five up board as well like a four up five up it's not terrible i get it i get it yeah it's just i don't buy it for 340 if you told me this whole package is 250 here's here's here's my condemnation of this if you told me this whole package is 250 i'm still not sure i'd take it yeah pretty hard to screw that there for what it's worth like i that's that's how that's how much i'm not into this now model wise these are like the best models they've ever made in the storm cast range they're incredible every one of them talked about it was gorgeous if we don't see one of these at golden demon done as a unit then then we have a community we as a community have failed we have failed you we have failed this city okay let's keep going ogres uh all right oh graze uh boom all right so oops the roving ma the ma pits of gur at the start of each battle round after determining which player will take the first turn you must determine the hunger status of the ma pits on the battlefield by rolling 2d6 if you included a ma pit in your army add the number of models slain by its head butcher ability during the battle to the roll if the ma pit is garrisoned by the head butcher add one to the roll then pick one result from the ma pit table that has a score equal to or less than your modified dice roll to apply for that battle round a unit is vulnerable to ma pits if it is on the battlefield unless it is wholly within one inch of a terrain feature that is not a ma pit or it can fly this ability has no effect on roving ma units so congratulations night haunt for being immune to this to this feature that's fun that is so much ridiculous math 2d6 one for everything you killed one for the head butcher then roll then select your one thing off the table a lot of text there a lot of text like i just okay there has to be a better way driven by starvation friendly gorge units that are not wholly within one inches of terrain feature at the start of your charge phase can attempt to charge even if they ran okay cool fine just don't run them near terrain great so and then all your gorgers have run in charge so that's cool for each butcher including your army you can include one gorge unit as battle line okay it's cool i like that that's simple enough uh raven is brute if a friendly ogre unit is more than three inches from all enemy units it's hungry if it's blah blah blah this is just the the hungry eating rule and then might makes right is just the we count as two slash you know whatever whatever right okay two five blah blah blah we have advanced capture and then gobbling bites the same gobbling bites rule okay who can be included in the roving maw you might ask well i'm glad you did thank you for asking you have to be an ogre maw tribe's keyword and either the gut busters or gorgers keyword heroes can only be included if they are not unique okay okay okay so gut buster or gorgers and heroes that are not unique okay so that's our that's our that's our team here so no i can't even think of a unique maw tribes hero uh the the um pirate guy out of underworld's pirate guy okay all right okay that's a technicality but fine we got him all right we keep we keep going sure uh all right yeah and then there's another named underworld's hero too as well but the pirate was the funnier one for the joke um at any rate um the hunter is the other one okay okay yeah the roving maw uh so you're rolling 2d6 plus theoretically always one because you could always have a headbutcher like garrison in the maw pit theoretically so like so so like that should be fairly automatic because you're doing 2d6 plus one and then if if the score goes up then you you know i could go up in there right okay on a two or three rolled snake eyes basically nothing happens otherwise peckish subtract one from the bravery characteristic of units that are vulnerable to maw pits so minus one bravery let's now remind ourselves who's vulnerable to maw pits because this now matters again not dragons and not uh night haunt holy within one inches of it uh it so how do you get immune how do you how are you not vulnerable to maw pits why you fly or you be holy within one inch of a terrain feature you walk on to other terrain so you be sylvaneth where you're always in your woods where you're just like setting up woods and then walking in it right okay or or fly yes oops all dragons immune to all effects on this table night haunt immune to all effects on this table right okay cool uh because everything here is about vulnerable to maw pits right so four to five is minus one bravery who cares six to eight uh is on a five up they take a mortal wound nine to eleven uh is actually quite strong units that are vulnerable to maw pits that do not have the hero keyword cannot issue commands so like shuts off unit champion issuing pretty pretty strong ability certainly and then 12 plus ravenus uh a d three mortal wounds for all those on a four instead of a five up and for units you said it was gorgers and what gorgers and gut buster keyword so that would be your basic ogres uh your like your ogre gulletons your um iron like iron guts iron man eaters man eaters yeah exactly okay sagnus maximus said can't your units just walk arithmically that is correct well if you walk without rhythm you won't attract the worm as we all know so uh so this is this i mean okay i really don't like these rules let me tell you i don't like these rules let's assume you're fighting something that's completely vulnerable to maw pits okay like you're fighting i don't know like a cornless without a bloodthirster there you go nobody's flying they're not gonna tend to be on terrain right unless they just walk on to terrain but like which they certainly could do with all their years they care about but let's just assume that you roll that rumbling you've got to roll every unit on the table for them five up five up and then mark a mortal wound it's the same reason i hated spirit gale yeah right um so like i mean it's cool because it's battle wide like army like table wide i should say right but uh but this is like a lot of words for not a lot of effect okay it's fine it's fine yeah exactly command traits master maw feeder this general knows all the spells from the lore of the great maw in addition to any other spells they know okay cool it's fine like you're gonna have a butcher or um uh slaughter master general so okay uh i probably still wouldn't take that one but it's fine it's not bad it's fine uh your artifact is morsels from the maw pit uh once for battle at the start of your hero phase you can pick one maw pit in your army that's within nine inches the bearer and that has been affected by a rule that says you cannot use the scenery rule in this war scroll and roll a die on a two up that maw pit is no longer affected by that rule and you can use the scenery rules on his war scroll once more this is the trace buster buster what are we doing what are we doing here that's what this is i know i'm aware this is a trace buster buster share with share with the class so it says no i refuse you either audience you either get this reference or you don't and if you do you're cool and buster buster yeah by the way everybody keep the comments coming given this guy a hard time about how much you hate him talking about a game you have no idea what the hell he's talking about i love those comments so much when i see them i you know it's it's so fascinating to me like on so many levels um because there's there's already like anti anti smash durable tech with the maw pit itself yeah right and so now they're like no dog if they're going in you can really make sure it's not going trace buster buster buster this this ball pit is so essential to the functioning of this army we have got a stick we have sunk so much this artifact is like the definition of sunk cost fallacy we have thrown so much good money after bad by investing all of your rules into this dumb terrain piece that we better make sure you can always use it and the best part about it is you know how they would have gotten around all of this is just say the mall pit is immune to this master rubble feature how much text could have been avoided yeah absolutely exactly 2016 movie the big hit all right google uh 2016 oh son oh oh that is definitely not 2016 1998 yeah we're all 18 years that is a correct statement yeah that is like mark that is some peak marky mark right there oh wow i miss this movie all right it is you did indeed miss this movie it has aged like cottage cheese left in the sun mixed with the finest of wines it is a singular experience at any rate this isn't a movie review show but yeah one of one of my favorite movies of all time that is also deeply problematic okay great jacking oh Jesus christ yes okay at any rate let's keep going because this has become me quoting that movie it is very quotable uh battle tactics uh you complete this tactic of an enemy model uh sorry you complete this battle tactic if any enemy models were slain by the mall pits head butcher ability this turn okay we you have to remember how the mall pit works but we talked about it in a previous sort of show a little bit in the news and like it's i don't like it but okay um slavery ambush like that's it's very swingy is the answer to that battle tactic you complete this tactic of a friendly gorgers unit was set up on the battlefield using the ambushing hunter's ability this turn and made a charge move great complete this tactic by rolling a nine up okay awesome very fun uh and then we eat at them all pick one objective controlled by your opponent you complete this tactic if you control that objective at the end of this turn and there are no enemy models contesting it the only reasonable one just kill everybody on an objective sure okay fine great uh there is like two bad battle tactics here and one that is good that's like fine achievable but with combat in the way then you've got your spell lure uh okay so what if I took the lure of the great mall I get these three spells that's my command trait what am I getting for that command trait well I get mall meat cast about a six range of 18 pick one terrain feature within range invisible to the caster for the rest of the battle units on or within one inch of that terrain feature are vulnerable to mall pits so it's your once again with this this counter your weird play play pattern technology oh you're going to run on terrain to save yourself I've got a spell that will stop you and make you vulnerable to my minimal effects great what was the other spell you get a six in the regular ogre book like plus one to attacks right something like that plus one to rent I don't know that feels that I'm those are what they are I'm being I'm being funny those feel better sure then you ran on terrain so now I use a spell that makes you vulnerable to my middling level effect yeah okay I had a I had a friend who told me he predicted that you're gonna hate hate this we're on pace so far oh I hate I hate everything about this like absolutely hate this army yes this is everything wrong with the design of an army I like just which is just me personally I'm speaking for me if this is something that you love and like this really speaks to you I'm excited that this is a thing yeah that speaks to you I just want to know one thing why please share with me in the comments below or right now he's being really negative again Tom what about this this thing is good to you I am very deeply curious maybe some people like having all in on their weird dream piece I don't know maybe you think having a a big giant tooth I can't say it I'm sorry I just broke myself okay I don't I don't think I've ever seen that I've never seen that happen that that's a new experience I like that oh Jesus okay here we go so what I'll say is this this is all inherently flawed and not for any of the reason that we've articulated so okay like so in the bundle box do you get one of these mall pets you do yeah okay it's in the thing with the gorgers and the hunt the hunt people or whatever no ho ho that's what I wanted to know so no I'm back on here's the inherent flaw it's not even for this game oh what you just articulated comes in a box for a different game that contains a unit for another army yep that's where I was going we're gonna need to they lost me they lost me publishing this feature in a box for another game with a unit for a different army sure all right let's keep going that explains the entire problem like there is no there is no regent around we're now box with this army with this piece that's the problem we got to keep we got to keep moving yes you warp zone you can take other models you can take all the gubbusters units and non-unique gubbuster heroes okay at any rate retcher casting by seven successfully cast until your next hero phase improve the rend characteristic of melee weapons used by the caster by two hard pass cool on the butcher or the slaughter master guys I'm not getting into combat okay also garbage awful bringer casting by of six in a range of 12 successfully cast pick one enemy unit within range invisible to cast her your opponent must make move up to six inches oh Jesus Christ I start thinking back oh man I've never seen him lose it like this before I just can't I in I can't I started watching this show in 2015 July 2015 laugh so hard with what's in my head right now but I can't say it anyways it is after midnight within range invisible to the caster your opponents must make a move up to six inches with that unit all the models in that unit must finish that move within three inches of the caster if it is possible for that unit to make a move if it is impossible for that unit to make the move it suffers d3 mortal wounds instead after that unit has moved if the unit is within three inches of the caster and the caster is within six inches of a mopet in your army you can immediately use the mopets head butcher ability you must pick that enemy unit to be the target woof yeah okay so you're trying to pull a unit in so you get extra use the head butcher thing that's I mean that's that is a lot of text to effectively that's what's gonna happen okay I don't like it you might this might surprise you Tyler but this was not the spell that turned me around on this garbage spell list okay I'm I'm getting like serious 2017 vibes from this some of the rules here the writing 20 2017 2018 all right yeah and then the empty stomach when the battle ends you complete this grand strategy of six or more enemy models were slain by the mopets head butcher ability okay cool yeah all right so let's talk about the units the gorger mopet we talked about these on a previous show so I'm not going to cover them too good or too too deeply but sorry too deeply I like the gorger mopet I don't think it's interesting in ogre units 220 points I don't think it's too bad for five of these guys they're five wounds each so it's 25 wounds for 220 points they don't they you know obviously they can become battle line in this army right mm which is cool um because you're gonna have butchers so like there's no reason you wouldn't that you're not going to get some of these guys battle line I like their ambush ability I think it's pretty good um because they can they have they have classic good ambush set them up anywhere nine inches away that's like yeah yeah and they shut off commands like they're and they're they're like decent in combat three attacks each three three snag one two damage okay yeah not bad yeah like they're fine and they have a champion need so I don't know this army at all that's why I'm being so quiet uh is that you guys know if there's a delivery mechanism for these guys to actually make a a charge as opposed to just roll lines nope no it's all right at everything's a coin flip great okay the whole army the whole army runs on coin flips okay spell the buffs all of its point yeah lovely but I still think like it's a pretty meaty ambushing unit to drop down that's what's interesting about it so it's not too many points like it is a good wound to to again oh yeah it's a good wound to point ratio for an ambushing unit mm-hmm so like I don't hate this in regular in in regular ogres or uh like this army for now which I would never ever play or could not recommend in good conscience for anyone to play um but like yeah it's fine um since it got referenced so much we should talk about the mop hits head butcher and refresh everybody as to how that works okay the way it works is um if this terrain feature has a head butcher which is just a butcher garrisoning it right that's that's how that is working mm-hmm you can say that an offering will be made if you do so pick one enemy unit within 18 inches of this terrain feature and roll a d6 if the roll is more than twice that enemy unit's wound characteristic one model in that unit is slain if the roll is more than three times that enemy unit's wounds characteristic three models in that unit are slain that's the head butcher ability okay the reason I hate this so much and was so dismissive of it is because what I'm picturing you going up against is like the obr stalker uh uh mortis guard army and it's like okay there are zero valid targets in that army you cannot achieve it on the dice these guys started five wounds right yep mm-hmm uh the sons of batman army nope got nothing there the storm drake guard army was just talked about nope no target like there are there are many armies where you will set up against them and across the table half to three quarters the army is just not a valid target for this ability your allegiance ability does nothing right and so like the battle tactic relying on head butcher the spell that does an extra head butcher activation all these things that care about being a head butcher it just it does nothing there are zero to very minimal valid targets in the enemy army that is my problem fair yeah I don't have much to say yeah about trumps next yeah with apologies to monstros players I I need to learn that army I mean you don't it's fine I mean I play gut busters actually um here you go I like my gut busters it's it's I'll probably try yeah yeah I've been right I've played monster trucks but yeah good it's a great army to practice painting okay fair I love that army it's very well very well defined musculature I need to get Eric to do a sprite for for Larry the yogurt because he's just as much a mask out of this channel as anything else I like I'm out of easy man probably 40 videos so you know okay he's appeared in almost as many videos as Tom so you know it's pretty good uh all right the loft I've been here I've been here since 2015 I'm just messing with you um the loft near droth keepers okay so this is a fire slayers army so who is allowed in this one every unit your army must have the fire slayers keyword and unique units can only be included if they have the loft near keyword all the units in your army gain the loft near droth keepers keyword in other words take a fire slayers army and it's now loft near yes you can't take the uh you can't take the named heroes is the key like uh the warband stuff right yep yeah that's right but like you otherwise can build with your army right nothing is cut out I mean fire slayers is a very small range to begin with but to be fair you you get all of it right to be fair to be fair so no go trick no go trick daring tamers the strike last effect applies to enemy monster units while they're within three inches of two or more friendly Vulcan flame seekers units so kind of cool um you got I mean it's it's fine uh honor bound droth masters friendly Vulcan flame seekers units have the battle line battlefield role in addition for each Vulcan flame seekers unit including your army you can include one auric rune sun on magma droth as a battle line unit which is fun uh and then flame filled beasts you can pick up to three loft near droth keeper units in your army to have different mount traits instead of one so you get three mount traits um like like loft near would normally do um skilled droth wranglers um once per turn in your movement phase you can pick one friendly Vulcan flame seekers unit holy within six inches of a friendly magma droth that is not yet moving in that phase and say it will hitch a lift on the magma droth if you do so after the move that magma droth instead of making a move with the unit remove the battlefield and set it up again on the battlefield holy within 16 of that magma droth and more than three from all enemy units so very much like what we talked about with the um what you mentioned with the ko thing you know the hitching right but this is actually pretty cool like this can actually move these little Vulcan flame seekers around the unit around the around the board and then protective family uh like that's a huge amount of movement you just got because it's holy within six so like that's you're really slingshotting these guys to the other side because the magma droth run so i mean like six inches back plus a run plus six inches ahead i mean you have just whipped these dudes across the battlefield and then protective family while a friendly Vulcan flame seekers kindle droth is within one inch of a friendly magma droth that Vulcan flame seekers unit has a ward of five up wow yeah pretty it's actually really interesting this is the most impactful thing because when i read the Vulcan flame seeker scroll originally i'm not gonna lie i'm pretty unimpressed with that scroll base oh sure yeah but if you give that scroll a ward of five up i'm suddenly much different on that scroll uh so like it's and basically you just need to then run them in little power pairs right like rune sun and on magma and this guy so for these guys okay it's cool i mean which makes sense they're probably hitching around on on one anyway so yeah so the key is is that the magma droth like the kindle droth gives the the the flame seeker it's a five up ward yeah the little they're a little dog yeah so yeah the magma droth doesn't get a five up the magma droth doesn't get a five up but the but the foot unit gets a five up correct which is what makes me hotter on the foot unit hotter get it yeah fire slayers yeah um but yeah like i don't like them base but them with a ward of five up that's pretty good actually it means you it means you got to keep the little doggy alive but just don't get your dog eating or whatever so sure sure um all right and then you've got new monsters rampages of course because it's a you're gonna have it's theoretically a pretty magma droth heavy force right i mean ideally i think the way they imagine you building this is with you know multiple ruin suns on magma droth and multiple vulgar flame seeker units right correct and so uh rearing punches pick one enemy within three inches unit roll two dice add two to each roll if that unit's a monster for each five up that unit suffers d three mortal wounds so like second stomp but actually good against monsters instead of batting it instead of unusable against monsters well it makes me sad that you lose your d six um your uh or your d three plus three monster rampage by take sure like you're losing your actual good one yeah your base fire slayer one which are good yep uh magma fueled grasp pick one enemy monster within three inches unit roll a dice on a three plus improve the red characteristic of melee weapons used by other not weird uh at any rate uh pick one enemy monster did you get the whole read you pick a monster you roll a die on a three up everybody else attacking that monster gets plus one rent well not everybody else just your draft keepers so other heroes other magma droths don't get that rent only the keeper i mean that's that's everybody that's everybody in your army has the loft near droth droth keeper keyword oh okay sorry i was thinking of the the flame keepers yeah it's that no this one isn't tied to the flame seekers yeah this can be anybody this could be hearth guard berserkers if you had them sure why not flame seekers flame keepers yeah yeah whatever and then eruption of ferocity pick one enemy unit within three inches unit roll a die on a two up ward rolls cannot be made for models in that unit until the following combat phase entirely excited about that rule i'm flipping it off right now you just can't see it it's it's happening i got got uh got to enjoy my prime having his war shut off by student sigmar the other night loved it now now you get a two up shutting off them ward saves for all the neural units siding as a monster's rampage that this is definitely going to happen like this is a good monster's rampage yeah all the magma droths i mean yeah this one's great like legitimately great so especially because it's on a two up so what is happening i'm seeing some good stuff here with farce layers so the funny thing is is that you get three extra mount traits yeah but do they get distinct mount traits here or uh yeah they do yes we're about to get there one yes boop here they are here you go okay so your command trait uh is improve the rent characteristic of melee weapons used by friendly loft loft near droth keepers units that do not have the magma droth keyword and are wholly within nine inches of this general by two if the target is a monster that's right so like your flame seeker units or hearth guard berserkers or whatever like because you're god you will rip monsters apart yeah that is wild yeah really strong uh i mean given you got to fight you know fairly close to the general but okay you know so my my only issue is so much of this army is really built around fighting monsters as we'll see again in the artifact in a moment and like if you're going up against the aforementioned obr army extremely high performing right now the ko army extremely high performing right now um the the good seraphon bombing army extremely high performer right now very little monsters little too none you have zero targets for any of these special abilities right so but i mean hey if you fight like some sunspam or something boy are they gonna rue the day rue it rue it okay and yes that is neg three rent total it's crazy crazy rent like you'll have because hearth guard or what neg one base well you still have your room do you still you still get your room you don't know no runes buddy it wasn't in the battle traits you ain't striking runes in this force no you're striking that feels like a mess i mean quickly yeah explain to me again the loftner thing like this is a loftner army but it's not a loftner army this is just an army of renown that's is it replacing everything from the fire slayer's book or yeah i didn't i didn't take any units yeah you can take anything any nonunique units as long as they they uh the okay sorry the unique units can't they have to have the loftner keyword which i don't think any of them do um okay but like that's that's it it's just you can you can build this as you could pick a completely normal fire slayer's army and build it as this like i got it this is still all self-contained this is all you're getting as usual with armies of renown otherwise correct okay yeah no no striking your runes no none of that this is the whole i just wanted to double check that okay cool yeah and it's funny because like grim rafts don't get their thing because that's an illegal yeah it is yes correct that is gone yeah um which is why in the story they only mentioned doom seekers and not grim rath berserkers yeah i don't know like i yeah yeah okay um grim nears gift while the bearer is contesting an objective each enemy monster contesting that objective counts as two models regardless of any other abilities that would allow that monster to count as more models such as mightier makes rightier they even put it in there so now king broad you thought you counted as 25 you count as two wow yes no pizza oven either correct no pizza oven no runes no none of that if you if i didn't say it here you don't get it because the normal book ceases existing yeah yeah i just wasn't clear what exactly you were getting but okay thanks for clarifying that nothing yeah well you're getting the truth the troop choices you yeah you're getting anyway we already went over it okay uh that's really good yeah i mean it boy again like take that sons of badmont like you're you're getting hacked low that's for sure uh mount traits all right so we got uh three of them because you get three of them so you're gonna have three of them so here's the three of them pek dross in your movement phase before this unit makes a move you can pick one friendly vulcan flame seekers unit to hit your lift on this magma dross see the skilled dross rangers battle trait even if another unit has already hitched a lift on a magma dross in the same phase the same unit cannot hitch a lift on a magma dross more than once per phase and multiple units kind of hitch a lift on the same one so effectively you can do this with two units instead of one that's all it is i don't know why you didn't why this i do not know why this rule isn't just you may use the skilled dross rangers ability twice on two separate units sure but okay uh red hot fury at the end of the enemy charge phase before carrying out monstrous rampages if this unit is more than three inches from all enemy units it can attempt a charge it must finish the charge move within half an inch of an enemy unit that is itself within three inches of a friendly vulcan flame seekers kindle dross okay that's that's good it's a little dog so yeah off turn charging okay yep that's really good and then scalding steam breath if the target is a monster the damage characteristic of this unit's blazing maw is three instead of d three okay it's fine uh and then battle tactics circle of the circle the magma dross you complete this tactic at the end of this turn any friendly loft near droth keeper units are within six inches of the center of the battlefield and there are one or more friendly loft near droth keeper units wholly within each large quarter of the battlefield seems like such a mistake so you gotta you gotta get to the middle and then yep be just from a mobility standpoint like that will basically never happen well you you'd need to have the pack droth and you would run your two dudes to the center and then they would drop the guys on the other side like the magma dross would like imagine this is the center of the table they would pull them up the they'd pull up in their taxis the magma dross would stop they pitch out the guys on the other side of the line and now one two three four that's how you do it right so like it is doable with with that thing right are there small quarters yes there are actually they never really never gets used as rules but it is a core rules defined thing as is a large quarter um you have four small quarters in every large quarter that is a rule they could do that um even though they're not actually quarters they're 11 by 15 or whatever okay sulfur seam pick one objective that is partially or wholly within enemy territory and one terrain feature or faction terrain feature that is partially or wholly within enemy territory and more than six inches from that objective you complete this tactic if you control both of them at the end of the turn so go control terrain go control one objective actually super doable uh there's a little bit of map dependency here based on sort of the the nature of some smaller deployment zones um yeah like uh geometric pulse with four in the middle those four the only the four objectives are not in anybody's territory yeah right um so uh like that's where you'll run into problems and and so it really matters this it really like the scenario impacts this a lot yeah because there's somewhere this is just like auto doable and there's somewhere it's literally impossible fun um which one is it who knows uh igneous wranglers pick one objective partially or wholly within enemy territory um and one other objective anywhere on the battlefield you complete this tactic if you control both objectives at the end of this turn and both are contested by friendly Vulcan flame seekers units same issue again same issue yep same issue uh and then finally the grand strat when the battle ends you complete this grand strat if there are no enemy monsters in your territory okay that seems like that's actually a pretty good grand strat because again if you set up against all those armies I mentioned autocomplete three free points and like you have the stuff in this army to kill monsters like crazy right so I mean it is just like this is this is a much better version of slaughter the sorcerer or whatever yeah sorcery yeah yeah yeah just because you're set up to do it well yeah you're set up to do it extremely well and many armies you set up against you'll just own this you'll just like you will start the game up three points because they just don't have any monsters in their army right okay and then finally the Vulcan flame seekers themselves two wounds five up save we did review these guys before they get their little kindle droth guy he is cute I mean I'll give it to him he's a cute little boy I love a dog and uh 140 points the models are nice the models are really nice these are absolutely the best looking fire slayers they've ever made in fact I would go so far as say they are the first non-ugly fire slayers so that's and I'm a known fire slayers hater so there we go um they shut off monsters rampages there are 140 points for um you know for for yeah for yeah 18 wounds uh yeah that's right 18 ones yeah which is not bad like they're only on a five up save they're very fragile but again when if these guys are five up five up I don't think I'm I think I'm back on board for these dudes like I think I like them in the army of renown actually quite a bit I'm not sure I love them in the the base fire slayers army I'm not sure what they're doing no it's kind of the opposite of the other ones I don't know what they're doing in fire slayers they're not doing anything in normal fire slayers like you have to be running them in this unit yeah um because they're I mean they're a touch cheaper than like volkites or whatever but their profile is nowhere near what you like okay I mean yeah but in the army of renown where these guys could potentially be anywhere between like rend one and rend three right yeah yeah I mean that's what I'm saying like in this but in this setup it's solid um you're losing all your runes which is problematic but but it I mean it may be a worthwhile choice you just need to accept that there are sometimes your your abilities are simply going to do nothing against the enemy force because there's just no monsters yep I mean if this unit's rend turns on because of the command trait or the the monster rampage or whatever you know etc etc um this unit does make 25 attacks yeah uh 25 attacks I mean I think the thing that I struggle with when I look at this is that in order for me to run this I need to buy 60 you know like I have to buy six boxes a model hmm because you're likely going to run 60 or you know like you know 9 18 9 18 18 9 or something right like something along that that lines and then a bunch of magma draw because you're not going to use almost any of your normal troops in this army when you've got these guys like you might use some uh some hurt card um probably not oryx but your your magma dross are you know like you're gonna be primarily magma dross in these yep um and in light of that like I just don't know I don't know yeah I here's what I'll say I don't hate this army over now and it's my honest answer I never really liked the runes that much anyways um like I just I hate weird bookkeeping things like that I never I never cotton to them as an that is an allegiance ability um I kind of like their allegiance abilities these guys do seem to have a pretty clear play pattern they are very good at something like it they are very good at killing monsters like really really good at that thing which is cool and they do have a lot of mobility which I appreciate it actually they they compensate for one of the fire slayers sort of main weaknesses right and you can still have uh you could still take like a rune smiter earthguard berserker total combo thing in there if you wanted that piece in there too so it's not like you have to go all in on theme right you do still like other than losing your grim wrath and and the that kind of stuff you you still do have access to a lot of your normal tools so I actually quite like the army over now and I think it's pretty cool I like the command trait yeah I like them I like the monster strand pages it's got some need abilities I don't think it's bad yeah I mean again and I guess the chat might not fire slayer players it's for non-fire slayer players right because you're basically going to be repainting an entirely new army um if you want to do this because you have to go deep in to really make it worthwhile and then even then like you're going to do 60 of these guys probably you're going to do a father and two sons um and then you have like 160 more points or 160 more points sure um and so you could drop you could go down to like you drop one unit of these guys and get 300 points but again like I just like I like I struggle with how you're gonna outfit that if that's the route you go right um yeah I don't know I just I think I don't think that this is going to be realistic that's all right let's close it out let's close it out here right because we're this has gone long very long so dawn bringers book three overall I want to want to get your final thoughts Tyler final thoughts on dawn bringers book three final thoughts I'm definitely a fan of so they knocked bell funnos and anus out of the park I'm intrigued by neve and company I want to try that out I think they could be a nice ally in some armies the aor on sylvaneth and stormcast are solid the sylvaneth one is a little wonky with a few things but I think if both of them are excellent entry points they're doing what they need to do I think a great army with the so I didn't say this would be like six by right of Lancers two by three revenant seekers six swords three swords bell funnos arch revenant that was the list that I put together quickly great I'm gonna solve this you don't have screens but whatever you're there have a good time uh yeah so a huge fan of that part like I didn't look too closely at the other parts and I really enjoyed your story time so thank you then very good tom what's your summary what's your final I mean I already have uh stuff on pre-order right like that that's where I'm at like I like it that much not fire slayers but um so uh stormcast stormcast yeah there you go good man um because between that and storm a stormbreaker storm whatever uh I'm getting draggard I'm getting dragons there right right right pondis and it'll be great um yeah no I uh yeah I'm interested I'm interested I like what they did here um and uh I like how they are using the these books to explore new design space like it's very clear that like when you look at um sylvaneth like that is a differently designed arm 100 so they're they're pushing pushing into those other spaces see that with fire slayers even I don't think that it's successful in that or I don't like how they've done it it's pushing into other designs this was the first book tom where I was like okay I get personally AOR armies of renown with the sylvaneth and this is the the first two that really hit for me I think the the gets one with the trolls is pretty good as well on on that account I mean yeah yeah that one hit for me too I'm yeah mine is built nice right so yeah so I don't agree yeah yeah overall my answer is I like this is the best on bringers book so far I think I enjoyed it the most the story was pretty underwhelming but I really liked a lot of the interstitials I thought were really interesting like gobsbrack turning on on trying to get cragnos killed and the like council of life thing and vandals and Ionis like seeing these two classic characters kind of interact and talk and and you really like these two characters who really like know each other it's pretty cool bell thanos and I and Ionis I agree are just like absolute just great the models are amazing the rules are pretty good I think I mean if you had to ask I think bell thanos is like a upper-deck home run and and Ionis is like a in the park double or something like that right you meant triple but that's fine it's okay we'll keep going no I meant double I meant what I said I said what I meant what I said aren't those the same no and so the the ogre thing is absolutely terrible I hate it from top to bottom it is wretched it is just everything I hate about a weird like is it's everything wrong and rule in a rules writing when they when they just get like completely right wasn't that like we like a blast the past a lot of that absolutely it felt like the worst aspects of the history of AOS like written into a thing like let's tie everything to these weird rules these overwritten overwrought ridiculous rules why does it always have to be destruction why does it always have to be over to get the short end of this stick I just I really want to see hey whoa read through this I don't know if he's done a review yet I didn't watch his stream this week he did stream I didn't see it I didn't check and catch notification I hope but I please hey well do a review of these rules for the love of everything holy please I just I need it I need it in my life um and the fireslayers thing was kind of cool so that so all in all three out of four for me pretty cool and so yeah there we go and with that I will say hey but what I really do love is all of you out there thank you so much for watching this was a super long show if you're still here man you're a hero uh hit like hit subscribe do those things if you haven't done them already we appreciate it if you have any thoughts on what we said drop it down in the comments below if you want to support the show there's lots of ways you can do so there are links down below to buy your hobby supplies you can do that um that on most of my videos now you'll find like little amazon links you can just click through to amazon doesn't cost you anything extra but it helps uh provide the channel with some money there's new merch as my wife mentioned earlier in the show with the her uh the my wife now has her own shirt with the canines of chaos so check that out as well as of course team tyler and team tom still here still rocking and rolling uh and then of course there's our patreon which is focused on hobby and taking your next step on your hobby journey something uh tyler is doing right now uh on the hobby journey so lots of ways to do that but it's always just liking and subscribing and sharing the show is deeply appreciated and thank you so much for watching tom tyler absolute pleasure gentlemen as always and uh for all of you out there we'll see you next wednesday