 Hey everybody, welcome back. I hope you're doing super well today. Today's video is just an interview between me and Brandon Moren, and I went on his podcast. He interviewed me about the current market and other things that I have going on. I found it to be super interesting. I had a lot of feedback from people that are following his channel. So I thought, let me just go ahead and post it here for you guys as well. So I hope you enjoy it. Let me know your thoughts and feedback in the comments. So Ricky Carruth, good morning to you. Appreciate you jumping on the podcast this morning. Good morning, bro. How are you doing? Life is great. Thank you so much. And so I want to talk about some of the things you and I have been sharing on social media a lot. And that is the housing market in 2023. I think you and I share a lot of the same views as far as the data that a lot of these media outlets are manipulating to lead people to believe that there's this huge massive crash that agents got to be worried about and all this doom and gloom. What is your outlook? And I think I know, but like it's crazy all this kind of fear porn. What's your outlook on the housing market in 2023? Well, it's super disappointing that media is driven by clicks. It's just really disappointing. You know, and the headlines, a lot of the headlines, you'll read the article and it's the exact opposite of what the headline says. It's like homeowners are going to have an ugly 2023. And then within the article, it talks about how incredibly solid the market is and how, you know, that this is nothing like 2008. So that's what's very interesting is when you compare the headlines to the actually body of the articles, they can't really, a lot of them can't, well, none of them can back up. Every single article talks about how this isn't 2008. You know, so I don't know, man, about media and stuff. It's super disappointing to see that it's driven by clicks versus just trying to help people. But to answer your question, I don't really care what the market does. You know, it, I mean, I care because if we have like a wave of foreclosures and it gets really bad and unemployment shoots to the moon and that's not good for a lot of people. And that hurts the, you know, the working man, which that's where I came from. And so it doesn't hurt me as bad because I've been through this. I know how to take advantage. So personally, it doesn't matter to me. See, it's mother nature. I can't stop it from happening. So, you know, it's hard for me to worry about, you know, what's going to happen. These predictions that we hear from Fannie Mae and NAR and mortgage bankers and realtor.com and, you know, all the different, you know, outlets that predict and everything, it's funny because they're all kind of predicting it for it to be kind of flat down a little bit transaction wise. All these predictions don't mean shit because if you look at their predictions over the years, they've always been wrong, number one. And number two, with them kind of playing the middle, it seems like they're just trying to say, well, if it crashes really bad, at least we weren't saying it was going to surge. And if we said, if it surges, at least we didn't say it was going to crash. That's kind of how I feel like everybody's kind of playing the game right now in the middle. You know, to play it safe that way, people can't go back and say, well, you know, you said it was going to surge and it crashed or vice versa. It's just, when you look at it from a bird's eye view, you know, it's really something else. And, you know, even if you're a brand new agent, you know, in this game, you know, newly in this game or, you know, experience, still trying to build your business and stuff like that. I just want people to know first and foremost, before I say what I think is going to happen, that it absolutely just does not matter. Your job is to go out there and just build your database and the bigger you build it, the, you know, the busier you're going to be, if you're talking to the most people, you're going to yield the most transactions from your efforts. So what does all this matter at the end of the day? Sure, your business may fluctuate a little bit with the market, you know, year to year, you know, season to season, market to market, but it's always, every year is different. You know, 19 was different, 20 was different, 21 was different, 22 has been different, 23 is going to be different, 24, it's always different every single year. So what does it matter? We're going to have some down year, some really good years, some, a lot of average years. None of this means your business is going to go to zero and you have to get out of the business. You know, my goal would be, and what would make me super happy is that if every single agent stayed in the business, you know, that would be the ultimate, you know, place for me to smile really big is that nobody quits, everybody stays in there, keeps hustling, keeps trying to build their database. It's unlimited for every single person forever. You know, you could work 365, seven days a week the rest of your life and never even scratch the surface for what's available for each and every single agent. But I mean, what I think, I think that next year, I think prices are going to soften just a tad bit more over the next three to six months. It's going to kind of flatten out and then it's going to start curving flat to up, you know? I think it's going to be like a really flat U shape, you know, and where we're going to end up. I'm actually, you know, not to sound hypocritical but I kind of feel like we will be kind of flat price-wise. I think we'll kind of start out. It'll kind of come down and then it'll come back up and be somewhere close to where we started the year at. I think 2024 is going to be a little bit of appreciation. Listen, again, who cares at the end of the day? You know, for buyers, you know, like the article came out that said that 250,000 homeowners that bought in 2022 are underwater in their mortgage right now. You know, we all said that was going to happen. You know, we all said, okay, buyers that buy now, sure, prices could soften a little bit but it doesn't matter to you because you're not buying it to sell it this year or even next year. You're buying it to keep it for three to five years. The 250,000 property owners that bought this year that are underwater, they all put three to five percent down, VA loans, FHA, they're sitting on even better rates than just the regular market. You know, they're probably sitting on like three and a half, you know, it's a four and a half percent interest right now. They bought that property to stay there for a while. And honestly, you know, over the next, you know, year to two years, they're going to start, they're going to have some positive appreciation. You know, they keep that property three to five years. They're going to have nice appreciation. You can't build equity paying rent. And for buyers, we know properties are going to be worth more three to five years from now. For sellers, we're still up 40% from pre-pandemic home prices. You know, even though we're down a little bit, we're still up substantially from pre-pandemic. You know, for investors, rents are through the roof right this second and there, you know, there was an article that I think Redfin put out that said that they felt like rent was going to, I think it was Redfin, don't quote me, but I think they said rent was going to come down a tad. But I think realtor.com said rent was going to be up like 3% or something like that next year. So rent is really high. That's great for investors. That's one thing that's going to keep prices up, I believe, is the rent's being really high along with no inventory, you know? Builders are going to have a really down year next year. You know, they lag so much, you know, they're already down like 20%, 30%, something like that, something crazy in just a matter of six months. So inventory is not going to come from builders as far as like a surge of inventory. Foreclosures aren't going to happen by the truckloads. And the traditional seller isn't going to sell it sitting on really cheap rates. But I think it was Redfin, again, Redfin or realtor.com that said inventory was going to be up 22% next year. That would be great. And it's kind of like when the moratorium was, when we had the moratorium for foreclosures and we basically had, let's just say, zero foreclosures during that time. And then as soon as they open up, then we kind of have this rush of foreclosures, which is only like miniscule compared to like pre-pandemic levels, but it's still like up 300% from last year. It was kind of like, oh, it's up 300% from nothing. That's kind of how inventory is going to be. The 22% is still going to be historically low, but it's going to be up from this year, which was really, really low. So, and if inventory did hit the market, bro, it would get scooped up so freaking quick, just because the institutional buyers that are out there buying on top of just demand from the regular, everyday buyers and sellers. Demand dude, for me, it's like demand is building so much right now. Like I feel like there's this underlying historical pinned up demand. Like I feel like we're experiencing like some pinned up demand that we've never really witnessed. And it's all going to come down to interest rates. I think next year, I hope that we get into the mid-fives. You know, I'm just saying I hope. I don't know what will happen. But if we can get into the mid-fives, like earlier this year when it was mid-fives and prices were higher than they are right this second, that was like a heavenly market. You know, like buyers are still like, we were still getting multiple offers, not as many as we were, but we were still getting multiple offers, things that we weren't getting multiples offers on, we were still selling within a week or so for a really high price. Buyers were happy, sellers were happy. That was like a dream market, you know, five and a half percent. We stayed there for like two months or so, something like that. I think when we get down to that level again on interest rates, I feel like that's going to be a, just because I think when we get there next time, we're going to be at lower prices than we were last time we were at five and a half. And so if you combine lower, if you look at how great that market was and then think about if we can get there again, interest rate-wise at lower prices than where we were last time, I think we're just kind of lining up for just, I think 2023 is just going to be one amazing year for the people that have a very super positive perspective on the market and kind of see it for what it is an amazing opportunity. Yeah, listen, there's a ton to unpack there. And so I'm going to try to, you made some really, really good points. I'm going to try to work through this in this conversation. And starting with mortgage interest rates, like that's the kind of the past life that I come from. And I 100% believe we are going to see rates at five and a half percent, probably sooner rather than later, because as the Fed continues to raise the fund rate to fight inflation and inflation comes down, we know mortgage interest rates follow inflation. We know that. And so all the mortgage people are getting excited because all the people that are buying are going to refinance here in the first quarter next year. Why? Because what happens with as the Fed continues to damage the economy on purpose, because we're trying to slow down the economy, we're trying to raise unemployment, all this is to fight inflation. The worst the economy, this is what people in our industry, Ricky, don't understand. The worst the economy gets, as we get closer into a recession, mortgage rates go down. They go down. People don't understand. That's why refive booms come from is they come from recessions. And so rates will absolutely be probably first quarter of the five and a half, maybe even lower. We've had some great pricing days just in the last couple of weeks. I mean, we're pricing 30 year loans at our mortgage company of five, nine, five and three quarters, 15 years. So I think that's gonna be the case. The other thing that you said that I love the point that you make is the business is on a spectrum. It doesn't go from where we were at last year to zero. And the best thing that I think you said was, well, what I wrote down, let's put things into context because you're right. People are taking these headlines and they're manipulating the data. And when we look at transaction count coming out of 2021, call it six and a half million sides. Let's compare that to the worst real estate market you and I or anybody's ever seen in 2008. There were still four and a half million transactions. And to your point, who cares what happens? I think is the absolute best mindset to happen. If next year we land at five million transaction that's 10 million commission checks, it's a phenomenal opportunity. And so, yeah, go ahead. What do you wanna add to that? Well, I think that, I think one problem with agents and even investors and everybody, they're just so short-term minded, you should be thinking about what you can do to plant the seeds over the next 12 months to really having a massive 2027, 2028, stuff like that. Thinking about, oh, I mean, yeah, let's go ahead and close the main deals as we can next year. But you know how quick this year is gonna come and go? Next year is gonna come and go? It's gonna be so fast and whatever you accomplish is great, whatever, but here we are 2024 now, now what? The work you put in last year is what's gonna reap the rewards for 2024. I'm thinking about like three years ahead. I don't really care what I do this year, but yeah, like in 2008, from what I understand, you said four and a half million, from what I understand, it was four million, you know, just probably getting data for different sources or whatever. But 2012, I believe was around four and a half to 4.6 million transactions. And that's what NAR, I believe is, really all the predictors except for Fannie Mae. You know, Fannie Mae's calling for 3.9 million for existing home sales, which would be worse than 2008, but that's pretty far-fetched. But these 4.6 predictions, I think, could be right in line with what's gonna happen next year. But when I think about my 2012, when it was about 4.6 million, that was like an amazing year. That was one kick-ass incredible year in 2012. Let me tell you, I was there, I was selling, that's when I was building my business, and that year was like, you know, oh, like it was incredible. And like to think that we're gonna have, you know, like if these predictions come true, and we have 4.6 million transactions next year, I'm just thinking, wow, you know, what an amazing year it's gonna be for the people that, again, look at this for what it is and go out there and take what's theirs. Yeah, well, and that's really a good segue right into my next point is, yeah, I got in the industry in 2005. And so like you, during those times, here's what I've been telling new agents, Ricky. This is why I'm so much looking forward to the next couple of years. This is my own experience and my own opinion. I wanna get yours. I love selling real estate in a normal market, much more than I like selling real estate in this crazy seller's market. This anomaly that we've been living over the last three years, I would much rather sell real estate in a market that we're heading towards. Why? Well, because number one, if to your point, if inventory goes up, well, buyers have a better opportunity. It's a better experience for buyers. They don't have to get to these houses in 2.7 seconds. And oh, by the way, seller's mindset around the value in which a real estate agent provides increases. What do we know about these markets? As we shift up and down from seller's market to buyer's market to normal market, the more severe, and I know you know this, the more severe a seller's market, the more commissions get compressed, the more discount companies come out to fruition, the more I buyers, the more this, the more that. As markets shift, commissions go up. I buyers start to leave the business. These discount brokers start to close up shop. And so the value of the traditional real estate agent starts to resurface itself. For sell by owners, can't sell on their own. All these benefits, tons of expired listings because of bad agents, so on and so forth. Do you like selling real estate in more of a neutral normal market or do you prefer the seller's market that we're kind of coming out of? Yeah, and you're right. I think there was a study that was done and some data that came out that said that buyer, I think, forget which company, I wanna say Redfin again, that buyers, oh no, they were predicting that the buyer agent commissions would rise next year, which I put a video out like a year or two or something like that ago when there was all this controversy about commissions coming down and average commission rates coming down. And this is when prices were escalating. And I said, sure, like look, but we're making more per transaction even though we're getting squeezed 0.01% or we're getting 2.3 instead of 2.5 or whatever market you're in, you're getting squeezed 10% of your commission. Well, but prices went up way more than 10%. So the amount of money we made was as agents was way more per transaction even though our commission's got squeezed a little bit. And I talked about this, even though like as the market converts back to normal, where you actually have to market the property a little bit, it takes 60 days to contract a set of one day. Last year, the seller was saying, well, who's gonna charge me the least amount of commission because it's only gonna be on the market for one hour and we're gonna get 50% offers. But now it's like we get one offer within 60 days and you need an agent that really understands how to negotiate and you're gonna pay for a better agent. You're willing to pay a little more for a better agent, let's just say in a different market, which will be great because if prices end up flat, that means and commission rates increase, look at where we are. And then if we see appreciation the next year and commission rates increase because people see the true value in having a professional negotiate the deal and handle the whole thing, then look at where you are. You've got higher prices and higher rates, all of a sudden that in my mind will happen, we'll just have to sit back and see. But to answer your question, honestly, I'm just gonna go back to my original statement with I just really don't care. I'm gonna take whatever market is thrown in front of me and just absolutely annihilate it. I guess more of the question is if I had to take my pick, well, what I want, I don't know honestly, like taking a listing, getting 15 offers in a day is fun. You know? Yeah. So I don't know, in that scenario, see in that scenario, it's really hard for new agents because a new agent is normally trying to work buyers and now they have to write 10 offers for each buyer to try to get something accepted, competing against 15 other buyers on every deal. It's hard to get a listing because again, the seller is being real picky about what agent they pick and the very experienced agents know how to talk to the seller and squeeze their commission from five to 4.9 to get the deal done and they know the lingo better. So last year was really in my mind really hard for new agents. Right now it's way easier for new agents, honestly. But I think, like if I have my pick maybe as an experienced agent, maybe I want the last market just because it's fun, exciting, quick. We're getting deals done, high prices, more than full price, buyers happy, sellers happy. But for new agents, people trying to build their business and everything, I think that market's a lot more challenging and I think for an agent like that who's still trying to build their book of business, I think a normal market is absolutely right now, like right this decade, I think is just beautiful place for somebody to start their career as a real estate agent and kind of build that book of business. Yeah, fair enough. I mean, I just, I believe that we're getting back into a professionals market. I mean, my issue with the market we're coming out of, Ricky, is that you have real estate, you have every industry that is driven by the housing market that we're coming out of all time highs, right? You got every time Dick and Harry getting their mortgage license, getting their real estate license, becoming this, becoming that, because they're looking for the quick cash grab. So personally, I don't love that market because the seller just hires little cousin Johnny who got his license over the weekend because you just stick a sign in the front yard and get 47 offers. He looks like a hero. I much prefer a professionals market where all the, you know, I guess that's my next point is, again, like in my world, I hope, this is what I hope for, is that not a single agent quits the business. So let's talk about that. So tell me about that, because as transactions go down to your point, you know, everybody's calling, call it, we can land somewhere around four and a half million. Let's say we land there, right? So as the market shifts, historically we've seen memberships go down. I know your position on wanting every agent to succeed, but the reality is not everybody can play in the NFL. You know, there are gonna be, it's just not, not a real, not a reality. Yeah, it's not a reality. I understand that. So my position, and this will be some, maybe some good healthy debate, is I think the industry is due for a, a world where you get a lot of these people that maybe have done damage to the real estate agent industry and get them out of the business, get them out of the way. Because the barrier to entry is so freaking low, the debate I would love to have, either now or some other podcast, is what it should take to get into the industry. Because I don't think it's fair to the consumer that little cousin Johnny has no experience in anything, no business experience, no sales experience, no marketing experience, no negotiation experience, can hang out on the internet for 40 hours and then go list somebody's $450,000 house. I don't think that that is fair to the consumer. And I think that the barrier to entry to listing a property should be a lot higher than it is versus people's largest asset getting trusted by some dude that has no experience and just giving realtors such a bad name. I mean, you know the stats as well as I do. I mean, we're well under used car salesmen and attorneys, all of that stuff. So I am under, with great confidence to say, we need some of these people to get out of the industry. What is your position on that? Well, you know, I used to be cousin Johnny. You know, I think we all were at one point and we all had to take our first listing where we didn't really know what we were doing. So I take it back to, you know, when I started in the business and I think about, you know, what I went through and, you know, somebody has to give you that start. Nobody that takes their listing, nobody that takes their first listing knows what they're doing. You know, when you took your first listing, you didn't really know what you were doing. When I took my first listing, I didn't know what I was doing. Even if you're trained to the hills, you don't have any experience and you don't really know firsthand how this is gonna go. So everybody has to start somewhere. So, you know, what I've learned is that, and you're right, not everybody's gonna be an NFL player. And so the people that aren't gonna win that are gonna have to end up leaving the business, they're gonna leave the business. There's nothing you can do. You could spend, you know, four hours a day with them, training them and teaching them everything and they're still gonna go out there and lose, no matter how much time you spend with them. And vice versa with the guys that are gonna go win, you could spend no time with the guys that are gonna go win and they're gonna find a way to win. So the winners are gonna go win and the losers are gonna go lose. And I mean, for me, I just think about when I was starting and like the low bearer of entry. I mean, if it wasn't for the low bearer of entry, then I probably wouldn't be in the business myself. You know, that was why I got into real estate because I could have been a doctor, a lawyer or a real estate agent. And I said, okay, 10 years to be a lawyer, 10 years to be a doctor, one class to be a real estate agent. I'm gonna go with this. And this opportunity gives me the same income opportunity as the other two. However, I don't spend hundreds of thousands and 10 years of my life to get there. I literally spend $400 in a semester of my life. So I thank God for the low bearer of entry because real estate, as you know, has just been a blessing to me and my life and my family's life. And it continues to be. No, I think, you know, I see both sides of it. Let me just say that, but I kind of like it the way it is. And I think the people that are gonna lose are gonna come in and lose and weed their self out. Sure. You know, I mean, it could give us a bad name, but I don't think that making the bearer of entry, you know, any more is gonna prevent that. I think you're still gonna have- Could you imagine if attorneys had a weekend class, how many people would be in prison that are innocent? Yeah. It'd be insane. It'd be fucking insane. Yeah, absolutely. Do you know how many people would be in prison for tax violations if CPAs had a weekend class? Yeah, no, absolutely. I think the problem is with the debate is that, you know, when little Johnny's selling the house, you know, listen, when I got into the business, I didn't touch my sphere. You know, now I look back on that- Why? Why? Well, I look back on that and regret that, right? Now, knowing what I know now. Sure. But when I got into the business, I didn't touch my sphere. I went straight out. Well, there was two reasons. One, I knew that if I couldn't sell people who I didn't know, then I wasn't gonna make it anyway. So I wanted to just go ahead and get straight to that to see, you know, I challenged myself. Like, let me go ahead and conquer this, because if I can't create a business with people I don't know, I'm not gonna be able to create a massive business because my thing was I'm gonna be number one. Yeah, we agree on that. We agree on that a thousand percent. And then the, with the sphere, I thought, well, they know I'm new, so they're not gonna use me. I don't wanna make things awkward because back then I didn't understand relationships over transactions, right? I was taught, you know, the old school, you know, get them closed kind of stuff, you know? And so I didn't wanna have those weird, awkward conversations, you know, with friends and family, whereas, you know, now I gotta see my Thanksgiving and everybody's wondering if I'm gonna try to sell a house. I'm an introvert, honestly. So like when I'm out in public and stuff, I'm like, you know, I've never wore a badge. I've never, if somebody talks about real estate in public, I'm gonna like run the other way. You know, I don't wanna be seen as, you know, that the salesman, you know, I wanna be seen as a hard worker trying to help people and stuff like that. So I kinda separated my personal and my work life. I didn't really blend the two. I never really got into the sphere of influence thing, you know? But yeah, like, you know, that seller hiring cousin Johnny, that could happen and it does happen, you know? But at the same time, you know, uncle Ed knows that cousin Johnny is brand new and doesn't know his ass from a hole in the ground. And chances are, he's not gonna hire. You know, I think a higher percentage of sellers won't hire their family members who know that they're brand new. But I think where you're going with it is people that don't know cousin Johnny and that don't know that he's brand new and that he's coming into the game here, kind of, they don't realize how new he really is and he ends up getting a listing and then maybe he screws it up, maybe he doesn't, whatever the case may be. But listen, we all gotta learn, you know, at some point, somehow, some way. And cousin Johnny could be a future top producer. For sure. That's another thing. See, cousin Johnny may be one of the guys that make the business look bad and we want him out of the business, but also cousin Johnny could be a future top producer. You know, and I wanna give cousin Johnny the best opportunity that he can. See, the thing with me is I don't wanna rule anybody out. You know, I wanna give everybody the benefit of the doubt that they're gonna come in here and even if they suck right now, you know, I still feel like, you know, maybe something will happen, there'll be some kind of click where now they're on the path to becoming that top producer. You know, that's what's in me about wanting to keep everybody in the business is I feel like some of these people are future top producers, you know? There's no doubt. Let me clarify a point. I have no issue with cousin Johnny. It's more that my issue is with our industry more over is that cousin Johnny doesn't get the leadership and the support that he should get when he takes his first listing and we put new agents in a position to commit malpractice. There's not a world, there would never be a world where a doctor does his or her first brain surgery, unsupervised, untrained without all kinds of processes in place to ensure that the patient survives and yet we put little cousin Johnny in that position every day. So let me just rephrase my position on this is that the industry as a whole, when we talk about the barrier to entry, I agree that everybody has to start somewhere under which circumstances is the thing that I want to debate under which mentorship is the thing that I want to debate just letting little cousin Johnny get the license over the weekend and let him loose like most of these companies do, I think is the disservice to the consumer. It isn't cousin Johnny per se. It's that the industry sets people up for failure and I think that's the part that we've got to change as an industry to your point to help more of these people succeed and not be so quick to let these people put them in a position to do harm to the consumer in the first place. That's more what I'm debating. Yeah, yeah, and that's a good point. Like there should be, there's no hand holding. That's right. You will not find a brokerage that will literally hold your hand. Nobody. I mean, you might come across an agent here or there who might go to the listing appointment with you and do that, maybe. That is so rare. I don't care where you go. And so it's a life or death thing. You're gonna get in there and make it happen and figure it out or you're not. But I don't care where you go. I've never seen anywhere that will actually hold your hand like a brain surgeon would his protege and walk you through the entire process top to bottom. And that is a serious downfall, honestly. That's the one piece I think that's missing. And you can't do that in a classroom. See, that's the problem. You can't do, okay, let's do a higher barrier of entry with education. I don't care how many times you go through all this. And what's crazier is that at least in my state, every county has a different contract, every brokerage has a different paperwork you have to do. So it's not like you can do a blanket education process around what documents have to be signed and stuff like that because like here in Alabama you got the recap, you have to do a net sheet, you have to do the agreement, listing or purchase agreement. Then you have all the brokerage disclosures or whatever brokerage you're with and whatever extra paperwork they want. And so it's, yeah, if we could create a scenario where as new agents come in and we have a process where somebody's gonna actually hold their hand locally and the reason why that doesn't exist is because it's possible to put together a company that does that. And like if you made that your main focus, but geez, there's so many moving parts when you try to do something like that. Yeah, so that's what I'm talking about, Ricky, is just when I talk about the Barrett entry, fine. Let it stay the way that it is. It's good for multiple different reasons, but maybe they go through some certification where their first 10 listings, they have a mentor that is on the transaction. So Cousin Johnny isn't scared to go to his sphere out of the gate, right? Because he's got a mentor like you who's gonna be there every step of the way. So, I guess- You know what they do in South Africa and Australia, they have a year-long, both of those countries, they have a year-long process where you basically have to be under someone in South Africa, what do they call it? You basically have to run the books and run some deals and get serious before you can actually go out and certify it as an agent. Same thing in Australia. They have a year-long process. Once you get licensed, then there's a year-long process from there where you're basically learning the business before you can actually get that next license. You know what I mean? Yeah, and I think that makes a lot of sense. And we could probably debate that till we're blue in the face, but I just think that the industry needs to change some things like that, per se, that essentially aligns with, I think, what your core philosophy is, which is to decrease the failure rate in the industry. Well, I think what we're talking about would do a lot for, you know, do a lot more for the consumer and help more of these people getting into business succeed. So, let's kind of transition into, you know, what are you seeing or what is your viewpoint on how agents can go about winning in whatever market we're getting into, whether it's a normal market or neutral market by our sellers, what advice are you giving to new agents, specifically new agents that either come on your team or whatever that you're coaching, what's the process that you think that they need to focus on to win in 2023? Well, I think the main thing is, is not to even focus on 2023, you know, it's just another year. I think the core philosophies and principles just never change. But I mean, for new agents, you know, I take them through the process of expectations, you know, realizing that this is, as hard as you think this is gonna be, it's gonna be much, much harder than you think it's gonna be. And I wanna kind of prepare them for that so that when they hit that brick wall, the frustration and disappointment, that they're ready for it. And they know that that is normal. Every single agent, I don't care who you are, you run into that saying, well, you get your license, you're on a high, and then you ride that high for a little bit, then you start to realize there's more information than you can learn in a day, you become a little frustrated, and then after you don't produce a sell after a couple of months, you become disappointed. And so you're on a high, high, and then you hit a low, low. And I try to set that expectation that that's gonna happen every single time. And then the future top producers kind of take a look around and say, okay, this was harder than I thought it was gonna be, but look at Ricky, look at Brandon, look at him, look at all these other agents that are doing it. So if they can do it, I know I can do it. So then they get back on the horse and say, okay, I got this, now they're riding another high, but that second high is not as high as the first high. And then they had another low, but that second low isn't as low as the first low. And so they get, you know, there's big emotional roller coaster in that first, you know, six to 12 to 18 months. In the business before you really kind of get some solid footing. And people just need to understand that. What I want them to do is, I think it's super dangerous to put yourself in the position where, okay, I got six months worth of reserve to go out here and close the deal. Well, now three months in, you hadn't closed anything. Now when you're talking to prospects, you sound super desperate because you know, you got bills coming up and you got, and so it affects your communication with your prospects, which in turn prevents you from doing the deals because the prospects hear that in your voice and then go pick another agent and you wonder why. Well, you know, for me, it's like, get your bills taken care of and make sure that you can, like you should be in a position where if you don't sell anything for two years, you're good. You know, it doesn't matter. You know, you could do this, you know, you got in this business for 30 years. You know, you should have a plan for 30 years where, you know, if it takes you two years to get this, who cares? You still got 28 years to crush it. But outside of that, you know, the philosophies and the market and it doesn't matter and you know, closings happen every day forever and all this stuff. I get into all the philosophies and then we get into routine, right? So, you know, it depends on if they're part-time, if they're working this job part-time, they have a full-time job, if they're doing this full-time, you know, what hours throughout the week, what time blocks do they have available to really dedicate 100% and believe it or not, some of them don't even have that. They're like, well, I don't know. It's like, what? You're gonna do what you can when you can do it. That's not a recipe for success. You know, you have to have time that you're dedicating 100% to building this business or you're not gonna have a business. So, really gotta define when they are gonna dedicate 100% no distractions, no negotiations to dedicate to the business. And then we start to try to break down what they need to do to be most efficient, get to the first deal the quickest and stuff like that, which in the beginning, it's gonna be what a good rule of thumb for me is spend half your time prospecting and half your time on training, right? So you got post-license, you got contract training, you probably have training with your brokerage, you got MLS training, you got different trainings as a new agent that you have to get through that are mandatory. So, I like the 50-50 rule, especially if it's somebody that only has like five or 10 hours a week, you know, spend half that time calling and half that time trying to bust through all that extracurricular. Well, the mandatory and the extracurricular trainings. And just kinda don't worry about like doing marketing and emails and social media and all this stuff right then unless you just wanna play around with it. But spend half your time prospecting on the phone, half your time getting through those trainings. Once you've knocked all those trainings out, which might take you a week, two weeks, a month, two months, however long it takes, then you can transition that 50% of your time to marketing. Where now you've got a little breathing room because you're through your trainings, you're still making your calls, but now you're dabbling into social media, email, direct mail. And that's a good thing because you didn't overwhelm yourself with that day one. You're not trying to do trainings, prospecting and marketing. You know, you have to baby step your way into the business, you know? Like I say, you're gonna do this for 30 years, just take it slow, you're good. So I don't know, man. It's different for everybody as a new agent. I have to kind of dig into what they got going on, what their thoughts are, what their game plan is going into it. I can kind of help them readjust if needed, you know? Yeah, I think the thing that I, that you said that I just see it so similarly is that, you know, having- You know, every time I take a sip of fresco, I get a new listing. Is that right? Every time I take a sip, I get a new listing, dude, look. Well, when that phone rings, make sure you get this on live camera, listing. Like I hear a listing happen somewhere in Ricky Land. I love it, I love it. Well, the thing you just said, and I love that you said that, and I hope your phone rings in a past client calls and you listed a house, but you know, you talked about, you know, going through the four levels of learning, conscious and competence, coming out of that, that deception, coming into, you know, the conscious competence and all of that, which is great, but the thing I love that you just said is having agents focus on direct outbound prospecting before they start going to the social media and the branding thing, because that's what I see. I mean, they all are running away from the prospecting and they're running towards the branding thing because they see people like you and whoever else so heavy on it that they think that they don't have to prospect from day one to start generating the business, but I see it the same way you do it. We build the business first, the first priority through direct outbound prospecting that gets cash flow coming in, that starts to build the business and as that's happening, you can worry about content which is a long-term play as I know you know and you can start doing that, but prospecting has to come first. How's the, you agree with that or you see that differently? No, absolutely, you know, listen, for me the key to all closings is conversation. So no matter if you're getting social media leads, open houses, direct mail for sub-owners, expires, geo leads, networking, spirit of influence referrals, whatever it is, all the avenues come back to the same point, which is a real-life conversation. 100%. So I think agents need to really understand that even if you're building your business on social, the social needs to be used to cultivate real-life conversations. How quickly can you use social to get to a real-life conversation with someone who might do a deal with you now or later? That's right. So... And that's the difficult part is turning the social content strategy, we're talking about a new realtor, right? Like the guy that, or the girl that needs a deal, like you're saying, try to get to that first deal as fast as possible to turn social into a voice-to-voice or a face-to-face conversation is a lot harder to do than just picking up the phone and having a voice-to-voice conversation and send an appointment and go see the person. I mean, that's what you and I, I think, see it very... I think we see it the same way, but the content comes over time where people start to reach out to you, start booking calls on your calendar, all that stuff. Yeah, look, for me, it's just like, I don't care who you're calling. Right. I care less who you're calling. As long as you're calling people in your market and you're approaching it from, this is who I am, this is what I do and I'm here to help you now or later, you know, I'd love to work with you, if you wanna do something now, great, if you wanna do something later, great, whatever it is, I'm here to help you and provide you great service. Let's stay in touch, boom, grab their information. My thing's a weekly email. Yep. I mean, that is my bread and butter. And so for me, everything revolves around that. Every conversation I have is designed to, A, figure out if I can connect with this person, if I can connect with them, what can I do to help them that they're looking to do something now or later and then kind of stay in touch with them? Yeah, yeah. What are your future plans? What are you working on that's exciting that you wanna share with the audience, Ricky? How's the team going? Give us a behind the scenes into Ricky land, as you call it. Yeah, I'm really focused on the brand right this second, just trying to build that and just learn how to get better at content. You know, Instagram is blowing up right now. Like I'm getting 150 organic followers a day right this second, posting five times a day and stuff. So I'm fixing to film like 20 or 30 grills right now after this, but just trying to build a brand really, cause everything kind of revolves around that. As far as projects go, I mean, dad's handling all the day-to-day sales. With the sales, your sales business and then your sales team is he handling all that? It's just him. It's just him, it's just him. He's handling everything. He's showing, he's listing appointments. He's just an agent handling our business. We have the admin, we don't have the team. It's just him. And so he's handling all that. I'm still doing marketing, weekly email, me and him talk about deals. I'll fill in form if I need to, something like that. But yeah, I'm working on all kinds of stuff, honestly. I'm traveling a lot, like I'm gonna be at Ryan Pineda's event in Vegas speaking in Long Island, Orlando, all in January. Then I'm doing a workshop here in my hometown in Gulf Shores, doing a three-day tour in Texas in February, March, I got Chicago and Kentucky. And like, I'm getting all kinds of speaking, you know, entries and requests every day. So I'm trying to just continue to get out there and get in front of people and spread my message and everything else. One thing that I'm really excited about is buying these big commercial deals. That's kind of what I'm getting into. That's my next big thing, is going after the big multifamily. I mean, I'm looking for deals right now. I mean, I'm sifting through as many deals as I can, looking for something interesting as we speak. So I'm really excited about that because I've kind of learned the process on that end. And that's something that can create some serious wealth. That's great. So are you not building your team, like the sales team, did you get off that? Yeah. So I just, I never could make it work. When I tried to do it at Remax, it didn't work. People came in left. And then this time around, everybody had too big of egos. I had an ISA getting 15%. I had a manager getting 10%. Me and Dad are splitting the rest. And so everybody felt like they had to, everybody's had such a big hand in it that they felt like they wanted the deal to go the way they wanted to go. And too many egos in the room. And at the end of the day, it's just drama. So my thing is a simplicity. I want to keep everything super simple, easy, low stress. And I feel like a team is just as much work as being an agent. Honestly, I built the team. I tried to do the team to step out of production. Which, you know, when I built it, I'm like, I'm out right now. I don't want to, I don't want to build it and then stay in there for a year to help you guys get it going. I want to put the pieces of the puzzle in place to step out now. And so, yeah, it doesn't work like that. If you want to build a team, you have to get in there and actually get your hands dirty for another two to three to four to five years to really get it to a place where you can step out of production. And luckily enough, I've got dad who was happy to step in there and just keep closing the deals for us, you know? So, yeah, no, the team thing, you know, I'm not a big fan, honestly, of it really in any perspective. But that's me, you know? And, you know, I'm not built for it. I don't mind going out there making 100,000 calls. I don't mind going and showing the properties and doing all the listing appointments, you know? I did it for 20 years. But a lot of people did make the team thing work, you know? Like Mark Spain closed 8,000 transactions last year. They're expanded in like three or four or five states or something. It's a different skill set. It's a completely different skill set. Completely different skill set. You're not like in the sales game anymore. You're in the management of people. Yeah, you're in the management of people, you know, game and the management of people game is a full-time job. Just like sales is. And, you know, I just have bigger fish to fry, you know? Yeah. I mean, dude, I'm getting all kinds of inquiries from all kinds of different companies and publications and, you know, celebrities are following me. We're collaborating and different things like that. I look at the next, honestly, if you want to know kind of what I, over the next, say, 10 years, like a lot of people out there, they're like, man, I wish I could be in good with these big influencers like Grant and Gary and Ed and Eric and Tony. You know, I wish I was in good. You know, I wish we were like best friends or I wish I could really, you know, get on the inside with somebody like that. The thing is, that is that generation of business influencers. Well, there's a whole new generation of business influencers coming up right now. And these guys are way ahead of their time. They're way ahead of where Gary, Grant, Ed, all those guys were at the same age, let's just say, just because the advancements in technology and communication. And the thing is, is if you wanted to be close to like Grant, Gary, Ed, Tony, all these guys, then the best way to do that would be what? Probably pay them a whole bunch of money and get in their masterminds or God knows why. I mean, you know. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. No, the best way, in my opinion, is to have been there from day one. Oh, sure. Where you were like best friends with them from day one. Got it. Where you collaborated a lot from day one. You know, you see these influencers, they collab and stuff, and they've kind of been around and collabing for years and years and years. 100% kind of grew up doing it together. Even when they weren't well known at all. Absolutely. And so that's what I'm doing, like right now with these future influencers, which I'm one of them, you're one of them, these future like business influencers that will be bigger than the Grants and the Garys and the Ed, that will be bigger than these guys. I'm like best friends with a lot of these gentlemen, ladies and gentlemen. And that's what's exciting to me is I can see the future where in a world where we're looking at these business influencers and we're like, wow, this person did it. This person did 10X, this person did 100X. This is like 100X. This isn't Grant, this is 100X, not 10. And like the Lord knows what the future holds. You know what I'm saying? No, it's a really good point. Yeah, because you nailed it. All those, the big influencers that everybody knows about now to be fair, I mean, we owe them a lot because they've carved this path to guys like you and I to now, and we could do it bigger, better, and faster because of all of that. Yeah, 100% agree and what you're doing is great. I mean, you're gonna go spend some time with Panada and I think he's doing a lot of great work and other people too. I think it's smart and I agree with you. I mean, there's just a whole new level of opportunity. I mean, you see Ryan, Ryan interviewed Lever King like this past week, he interviewed Grant, he interviewed Brad, he interviewed Patrick, he interviewed Alex, you interviewed Alex. Like it's crazy the amount of influence some of these guys have. Like you look at what's gonna happen to the next, you know, however long, I don't know. I'm excited to go speak, you know, there and tap into the audience a little more. That's what's exciting. I wanna get into the real estate investing audience. Honestly, I really love that side of it. Yep. And so I'm gonna be doing a lot more of that. It's cool, man, listen, thank you. That was a great hour conversation and this is what I've been wanting to do with you and others to your point is like what I'm interested in with content is, and I know you wanna do the live thing and I want to too, but I am just so much more interested in long form content like this, like deep conversation. And we have a studio here in Michigan and I wanna have you up here and get you in the studio but thank you for spending an hour with me because this is all really I wanna do moving forward. When it comes to content is just have meaningful, deep conversations that the audience can get a lot out of, you know? No, you're doing a good job and I'm excited to see where it goes and I'm glad to be on this journey with you, bro. Yeah, same. I appreciate you very much. Thank you. I want to, I want to. Love. I 35 with the top down, quick to tell a hater that you're getting like.