 Good evening, everyone. All this September 19 development or re board meeting to order. I'd like to start by introducing our members starting at my right. Vice chair. Kevin O'Connell. Meredith Crandall staff. Rob Goodwin chair. Captain Burgess. Joe Karen. Michael is Orchid. And Michael was our check remote. Thanks. And then, uh, Jean Leon. Hi, everyone. Remote. Perfect. Okay. This time Meredith is going to do a brief overview of our remote meeting procedures. Where you get to go in. Yeah. People, we actually have on remote night now or Michael and Jean. So this isn't really for them because they know the spiel by now. But anybody that we have on via Orca media is watching this. This is give you a little information in case you want to participate in tonight's meeting. If you want to do so and be involved in tonight's development review board meeting. You can type this link here into your zoom platform or into your web browser, and it'll bring you right into the zoom platform. And I will see you wanting to come in and let you into the meeting. And then you can, we can see you. You can talk to us. We can talk to you. It'll be great. Other alternative is to dial into this phone number. And when prompted put in the meeting ID. And then you'll be able to at least talk to us, but you won't be zoomed in over the video. If you're trying to access the meeting and you're having problems, please email me at mcrandle at month pillar hyphen vt.org. I will be monitoring my email throughout the meeting. If somebody does log in who is not on right now. Please know that turning on your video is optional. And we do ask that everybody re keep their microphones on mute when they're not talking in the event. The public is unable to access this meeting. It will need to be continued to have time and place a certain. I'm now going to hand a meeting back over to the chair. Thank you, Meredith. We have a motion to approve tonight's agenda. Motion by Kevin second by Sharon. Everyone's. Hey, I, if you are approved. I hear two eyes on the zoom platform that is unanimously approved. Thank you very much. So, I guess a couple brief comments this evening. One thing I just forgotten to bring up at other, you know, meetings that remind folks that we usually at the beginning of the meeting, just if anyone has, you know, made a site visit to the site or has any, you know, information that they wish us to review as far as any conflict, potential conflicts or anything like that. But I think it's helpful to let folks know if you've been to the site or not. So we know if you have additional information that might be helpful. And other than that, I have anything else. I would now move on to a motion to approve the minutes for nine six 20 22. Does anyone have any comments on that for a motion? Motion by Sharon. Second. Second by Joe. All those in favor say aye. Aye. So unanimously, including two votes on our zoom platform. Okay. Minutes for September 6 are approved. Okay. So that brings us to our first order of business to this evening, which would be application for 23 pleasant few street. And are you David. Okay. So if you want to come up and sit in front of them, the laptop there and make sure you're speaking into the microphone. So that way both people remotely can hear you and. The recording picks you up so that our minute taker can. Excellent. So I'm David Macfaker resident of 23 pleasant few street. Perfect. Thank you, David. So we're just going to swear you in real quick for your testimony this evening and then we'll get on to business. So. All those interested in providing testimony on this application, would you please raise your right hand to be sworn as a witness. You solemnly swear or affirm that the testimony you are about to give is the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth on their pains and penalties of perjury. I agree. Thank you. So I think to start things off, we're going to have Meredith give a brief overview of the application and then we'll let you sort of present and sort of tell us what you're going to be proposing and then we'll kind of open it up to questions and try and keep it a little informal. So as summarized in the staff report, this application is before the board because as zoning administrator, I don't have the authority to approve a second driveway on parcels unless they're on the corner. I mean, this is not a corner parcel. So as we've seen in some other situations, the existing driveway seems to be hemmed in both by slopes, both on the side of the road. And so there's not a lot of red in here. So there's not a lot of red in here. The key thing is that. I can't approve it. So the board has to take a look at the factors. And so the applicant needs some additional parking. And it's proposing to create a second driveway that's really just to a parking spot on one of the, really the flatter areas that can be accessed from the road. And so there's not, you know, there's not a lot of red in that area. And so that's a, that's a good point. And so I think there's a lot of red factors. Allowed for when. When approving a second residential driveway. That's what I've got. Any questions for Marit? The applicant's presentation. All right. So basically, like she said, we're asking for a second parking spot on our property. like within a week or two I believe, if schedule goes right, and the spot we're looking at we currently do park there already when we need the additional parking spot when friends and family are there. We also have two teenage girls that are just about ready to get their license in another month which is going to create another vehicle for us. And with the repaving done we're really looking for this spot to not have a curb that within that one section and then eventually we'll put some gravel down underneath I don't you don't need to know this but underneath that area when we rebuilt the house 11 years ago there was already a hard not hard pack but stone put down under the soil for trucks getting back so it is a solid spot already. In essence we're really just looking just what is it just south of our current driveway to have a curbed area not without a curb and put in another parking spot. Instead of parking on the street which that I don't know if you've been down Pleasantview street at times it can be pretty narrow and we're looking to go south of south of it because right next to our driveway there's an ideal spot but there is a telephone pole there and if our neighbors are pulling it out of their driveway it would actually kind of almost be in their way a little bit at that time. So we're looking to go up past that. Were you able to get a copy of the staff report and review some of the comments? No I did not I'm sorry I probably would have had access to it but yeah I'm sorry I didn't realize I have it. You do but did you have an idea of where they're going to be asking questions? Okay hold it up to some of the early part. Thank you. So I guess just to more general information about the project here did you so as far as like you know alternatives you know an additional parking spot that's your goal here. Did you consider you know any other options or was this it that's not saying that I have any idea of anything better just to for more context here. Did we look at a different option? Yeah. I'm going to say no other than considered north of the driveway but we would have had to remove a retaining wall. There is the the water main to the property is behind that wall so that would have had to been cut down lower to being out of the way at that time. And where we're proposing it that pleasant view is a little bit slow but this one spot is actually flat at that up above where we are so it's an easier spot without having to deal with any slope of the property right in terms of a driveway. Oh and so so there's a couple of comments in the staff report one little bit back and forth with the city about the angle of the parking spot I don't know if it was a concern it's just to needing to sort of specify exactly what angle the why it looks like it's angled a little bit. So this is something sorry I didn't call this one out to you but it's in the staff report. The department public works as a v-trans standard that flows down where how the driveway meets the road so perpendicular yet can't be at an angle of less than 60 degrees. So you might need to you'll need to measure that angle right inside triangle and then maybe realign it so it is at less than 60 it's more than six or more it can't be less than 60 degrees at the narrow is you see what I mean yes because this is because right so that's 90 degrees so that part here where it can't be less than 60. It could be arranged that way easily. I'm just also trying to avoid a tree that's already there not having to take out at that point. That's likely that we could you know put a condition in there that you don't foresee it being that angle that you're referring to currently. It was something that was flagged by department public works because we didn't actually have the angle noted on the site plan they just want to make sure it's 60 degrees or more as the angle where the driveway comes off the road to the road right where it meets okay. So is this supposed to proposing one additional single parking spot? Yes one additional parking spot at that time no no more than that. And the you need the 20 feet width? I just guessed 20 feet looking at a neighbor's driveway it doesn't need to be that wide. But listening to the angle I didn't realize the angle was an issue but I was thinking more of an angle coming when you're coming up the street to turn into the parking spot and then backing out thinking the little wider at that spot would have made that easier to get into but if there has to be less than 60 degree angle. The DPW an applicant coming to coming up with a specific plan that meets the V-trans standards because they have actually the the central line driveway. So I've worked for V-trans I actually drafted the B-71 standard residential drives so it's the center line of the driveway and then typically a driver would have radiuses on the corners and that's how you're able to get in on the sharper angle easier instead of just making the driveway wider make the driveway narrow and add an apron angle you know a radius there. But then what I'm looking for is the curb not to be there so then right you would still need that 20 feet yes to that the driveway would not have to be 20 feet wide. No the driver would not but the opening would be right between 12 and 24 feet wide. Meredith what so you're saying there's an additional curb cut permit that goes to sort of there's not a curb there right now so there is a curb there or maybe it's okay maybe it's with whatever they're putting in new is going to be there anyway yes there will be an additional Department of Public Works construction and access permit that's part of what we call the curb cut permit the whole need to get. So yes this could be conditioned on the final design being per that permit instead of the angle specific conditions. Four members are up and moving forward on the technical details I think that we can you know sort of discuss and and push those off to the Public Works review and whatnot and move on to the other items of this. There's nothing about this site to stop you from putting in a compliant driveway I don't think seems perfect fine. There is a curfew. Yes sorry I'm working lots of different driveway issues right now this is the the first of three. So I guess Meredith this question is actually for you know for for you so this is a single family home and the minimum parking requirement for a single family home is one spot typically yes yes um and that can you refresh us on the maximum parking requirement so and this is something that's I sort of I think I in this one I tried to lay out in the staff report so in the regulations there is a maximum number of off-street parking spaces that a zoning administrator can approve before it has to go to the DRB to get those extra parking spaces and so that's typically double the minimum. However if you look at that language in conjunction with the fact that residential parking is allowed quote in any residential parking park in any residential driveway and that there is an authorization to allow stacked parking for residential units there's some conflict there and in discussing with the planning director who was part of drafting these regulations he said that there was no intent to limit the depth of someone's driveway especially for single and two family homes to just one parking you know to be able to just put one big car in there of course they're going to have guests they're going to have they're going to need more than just that one little space for homes and trying to mandate the length of someone's driveway really isn't what we're talking about um you know there's a requirement in here for making sure your driveway is long enough to avoid queuing again that's more for commercial so and we've dealt with this before where the board has authorized more than two parking spaces quote for a residential home if you just measured out the length of the driveway that's not that's not what we're supposed to be doing from and Mike and I have actually talked about amending the regs and the next next go around to make this explicit he was like oh isn't that clearly implied and we're like no we don't do implied anymore Mike it needs to be explicit because otherwise somebody's going to come and poke holes in it but for these purposes it's because there's clearly that conflict the board can authorize the second driveway without running into that maximum parking space issue right because if you look at the holistic aspect right it's allowed so I guess one thing we're under consideration here is you know on street parking and limitations and how that impacts your need for a proper extra parking space um so I saw here in the staff board that it was mentioned that Pleasant Street at least in the winter months is restricted parking it is yeah um so that's a factor board members have any other things to add about this general idea of an additional parking spot yes I've done a site visit and that's in my district I'm very familiar with that okay and um it is very narrow I mean it makes sense for the applicant to uh you know want to extend expand on on his driveway it's parking necessities once you know when people do park on that street on the actual street it does cause significant amount of congestion this would help definitely alleviate such congestion it's a really narrow street and I'm glad that the city's finally going to repave it because it's uh it's been in bad shape for years that's all I wanted to comment all right thank you Gene um so I don't know I guess we talked about the 60 degree angle um in the specifics and of the technical details um I guess I'm still a little bit hung up on the 20 the 20 feet for one parking spot which is that has to do with the angle um or is that it I'm not concerned about a 20 foot wide continuous driveway as long as it's wide enough for the one vehicle to park my concern is making sure that the curb is not so narrow that you're still driving over the curb going in and out of this driveway yeah that is my concern and if if it's an if it's an arc coming in and out then the 20 feet I is I that was an estimate off of another driveway down the road in terms of a single-lane driveway that I was looking at is where they had the curb cut that's where I measured that from it does not need to be the continuous driveway 20 feet wide I guess maybe to to guide the discussion for the board you know some context here I I'm inclined that to say that this is you know okay but I think for discussion uh if come time the next meeting we have five extra permits for additional parking spaces for driveways on you know Pleasant Street uh you know that would be a different situation than you know than one you know than one driveway um so I guess just taking a step back and making sure that we got our t's and cross our eyes to make sure that we're not setting a precedent here to say that like everybody gets an additional driveway in there because Pleasant Street is narrow and there's no you know on-street parking not to say that this applicant is you know perfectly reasonable I just want to make sure that we discuss that for in that context and I'm fully supportive of that but I do just want to yeah for the sake of the record uh we're dealing with Pleasant View Street rather than Pleasant Street Pleasant View Street yeah right it's a different location and different set of conditions and there is a Pleasant Street but yeah there's a 23 Pleasant Street as I found out so Pleasant Pleasant View is what we're reviewing uh I guess for the sake of discussion looking at it from my point of view you already parked there right we do park there at times yes then there's nothing to stop us from parking on his lawn right yeah so I'm basically asking for when we put the curb in not to have this curb put in right when the construction happens and with the construction happening soon yeah it's not going to change operationally anything that's going on um they're already parking there they're already pulling in and out of there and we yeah there's nothing Pound's gonna do about that so it's not changing anything other than I guess what is the word memorializing the or cementing the literally the the space so I think this was before you joined the board or maybe just as you joined the board we did have a situation where we had a multi-unit residential situation where people were parking somewhere they shouldn't be parking where it was into the public right of way so there are instances where zoning is going to come down and say you can't park there um that was also a situation where there were enough residential units that it triggered site plan review which has a little more teeth to it um but it's also they were in the public right of way so that that was a situation where we did say you can't park there anymore um and made them actually put up a fairly high granite curb but this is a different situation for sure you did say that this um he's gonna have to get a curb cut permit from the dpw right so that's also unlike another sort of set of protections even if five more parties show up with it you know that we're gonna be chomping only at the curbs that we can there'll be some slowing down there too so and they'll they'll make sure that the final design of the curb cut the width of that in angles all meets up with the v-trans standards as they build it um and then you know if the board wants to put a maximum width on the interior part of the driveway they could but i think it's also if they're good with the up to amount that's on here it's sort of how you how you want to go with that which is why i raised that as a potential issue potential point so just to summarize here i have us up to 20 feet the condition of curb cut width up to 20 feet an angle of um you know meeting the v-trans standards and we're conditioning it to have that dealt with with a you know in the curb cut permit process with public works um and that the board seems to think that the multitude of factors that we've discussed um make an additional driveway permissive um and i feel okay with that if anyone has a motion i have one question um since dpw is doing the paving through here have they considered you want to put in like sure pack or something some kind of gravel eventually you have some gravel in the spot after the probably won't happen till next spring or next summer but okay because usually for a gravel drive there'd be five feet per v-trans five feet worth of pavement apron that comes in off the roadway um and it may be smart to coordinate that while the paving project is going through that's basically they they shifted this all came to planning through dpw okay so um i think that that's i'll make sure i talk to them downstairs about it okay um because you know it's the the city part they can go in on the city part before we actually get the decision out okay because that's their dpw part of their their paving project and then just you know his part would be the gravel afterwards so i can definitely talk to them about that okay thank you joe um and is there a reason you want to go with 20 feet just because he said 20 feet or do we want to just leave it up to the standard where the maximum is 24 feet i mean i think that they were 20 feet was probably getting more than sufficient for dpw for one you know one residential drive but yeah you could do okay um i guess i could make a motion then a motion to grant approval for the construction of second driveway at 23 pleasant v street as prevent presented an application z dash 2022 dash 0105 and supporting the supplemental materials subject to the following conditions of approval the new driveway meets the standards uh the v-trans standards v-71 residential drives and approval by dpw a motion by joe sounds good second by sharon um okay start the roll from my right sharon how do you vote yes kevin yes joe yes abby yes michael yes jean yes rob votes yes yeah that's eight yes so next step is the the yeah the dpw permit that i need to get in time yeah and so what's going to happen for that so yes i will verbally let them know that we've this is all happened there is a drb written decision that has to come out and be processed before we can actually issue the zoning permit yep um but your your construction part of the zoning permit is the gravel which you're not intending to do right away anyway so dpw can can move on to to their their work um and i'll talk to them about that five foot i may also just email around so that you're copied on that excellent thank you everybody thank you jenny jennifer jenny and john perfect same field from what two hours ago come on up come up sit in front of the microphone oh you gave me the microphone give me the microphone seat again so you both want to introduce yourself real quick and then we can swear you in since you weren't weren't here for the prior i'm jenny shan shan shan five west street i was interested in providing testimony in this application would you please raise your right hand to be sworn as a witness do you solemnly swear or affirm that the testimony you are about to give is the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth under the pains and penalties of perjury yes thank you very much so meredith go ahead and give us a brief overview okay so we're going to be going back to the minimum parking requirements um so as you said before minimum parking requirements for dwelling units and it applies to accessory dwelling units as well is at least one off-street parking space um this application came before the board previously although the board didn't make an official decision because they came before the board to put in a second driveway they are corner parcel so typically i would be able to approve that but their original applied for design the driveway was going to be too close to the corner to the intersection between the that whole process and actually getting to the meeting and discussions with department of public works they shifted it so the board didn't actually make an official decision on that application we just ended up administratively approving it so it was like remanded back to our office um since then we now have a situation where they don't want to build that second driveway anymore they have one off-street parking space that's in a garage that garage is so close to the street that there's not actually room for a standard sized vehicle parking space between the front of the garage and the road so they're asking for a waiver of one parking space so that the accessory dwelling unit wouldn't have an off-street parking space um and that's just that's not something i'm allowed to approve so i've laid out some things in here for the board to consider um and i think one of the one of the key things is there's very specific criteria that the board is supposed to consider when looking at waiving the minimum parking standards and one of those is drafted to really only apply to to commercial situations where you have a business and a plant providing um secure bicycle storage for employees and with the city's push for walkable bikeable downtowns and all of that and a discussion i had with the planning director we really feel like that's excessively narrow um plan is to try and tweak that but he also really didn't feel like that's what was intended when this original passage was happening and that you know it it's not especially if there's some other factors that come into play like the types of um you know public transit things that are available having a factor of there is secure bicycle storage even though it's a residential situation right bicycle storage for your tenants that's not something that that that is something that the board can consider um whether or not there's enough factors here for the board to waive that parking space in this particular particular you know particular situation is up to you but i tried to lay out all those different factors we'll just review what those are so you're talking about the factors for um it's 30 11c yes um so they are that um well i didn't list all of them in here and the staff report give me a second yeah if you're asking me to actually say it didn't come into play so i didn't put them in the staff report pretty sure um so you have sorry access is a really long section so um the board may waive some are all off street parking requirements to the extent that the applicant submits a parking study demonstrating that less parking will be needed and these are all oars the applicant meets the requirements for shared parking so that's off street parking on somebody else's parcel there is adequate on street or public parking available when within 1000 feet of the proposed development to meet all or a portion of the demand there is an existing or proposed public transit stop within a quarter mile of the proposed development or the proposed development shall provide secure enclosed bicycle storage and shower facilities for employees who bicycle jog or walk to work now clearly parking study shared parking those don't apply um and we aren't really looking you know there's there is some on street parking there is the current version of a public transit stop nearby um you know and you have you have our our current you know we don't really have them on pillar commuter at this point but there are right now i can't think if i wrote it in the stuff yeah there's the my right option which is very similar to public transit and it's not going to be just like an uber where you call and it shows up right away it's you're going to have to coordinate um but that is a public transit and then you know it's not for employees it's for residents but they're proposing secure bicycle storage but those are the factors i think you think that that's been focused here so i think i want to give a little presentation on your project here and sorry that was long sure all right that's great yeah i think i mean in addition to what rand said that's the big uh the big piece of it i think the kind of the background for it is when we moved in just before the start of the the pandemic sorry closer to the microphone here and um and uh and we're you know planned and moving in i think the turning that garage the workshop space over the garage into the into an adu was the main thing i think they got us started on that um that project which had to be more of a project than we maybe bit off as they always tend to maybe particularly during the pandemic and so forth but in the process of it that was what brought us to i think is your reference to originally put in the request for the um you know for the for the driveway based on seemed like that was you know was a normal way of of doing things and then in the process of building adu and talking to neighbors saying oh it'd be a be a shame if you put in a driveway and into the garden there and so forth they said well you know we have to that's the requirement and so well actually it's you know there are with the waivers for it and i think that's when we had the conversation looked at the details of the waivers and i think particularly looking at that standpoint as well thinking that originally we're thinking of renting out the kind of the whole building their garage um and apartment but obviously you know for for affordability and obviously that being a big piece too if you're just renting out the space above and seeing a lot of people particularly looking for downtown walking you see in front porch forum people you know looking for something walking saying they don't have a the car and so forth having a studio apartment that that isn't required to have the whole garage with us have it retain the garage have it be shared garage space being just a one-car garage but being ample room as you mentioned to have bicycle storage or have other things that um tenant could have in there shared storage seem to make a lot of sense so that kind of brought us back around um to the decision to to submit uh to submit the waiver so i'm happy to go into more details but not unless there's anything you want to miss i think as we noted in addition as you said the secure bicycle storage the parking i mean being a corner lot you're obviously going to have more more parking than something that's not a not a corner lot um and you know with being walking distance to to downtown having that high high walkability and bikeability score on on the walk score website and in the web and as you mentioned with the my ride but also the st j bus comes up that way and i think jenny printed out a couple of the other bus maps that go through the neighborhood so it's the unit currently occupied no no just just finishing it up yeah so it hasn't doesn't have that history yet it hasn't been occupied okay correct let's make sure i understand is the entire garage haven't been made over or is there still one parking spot in the garage yeah there's still the parking one part okay so there's still one part and then the idea is that's a tenant there's been instead of a built over the garage there'd be a tenant there and there'd be some storage room or bikes or whatever for a tenant yeah but it's a but it'll be a one car we would we would retain the parking spot in the garage but the garage space would be shared space where they would be okay to keep a bicycle another other gear so the existing parking on on street parking on street parking on both streets west street and first have um yes on on west street it's um in the summer it's just on the the college green side of the of the street and then in winter it alternates like that so he does and then on on first half the part of budding our property we have the city gives us permits permits for two two spaces um there it's it's uh we have permanent permanent parking on the stretch of first half of budding our property i'm not sure why or the rationale behind it but when we when we didn't have them up the city parking came back streets in that city that have no i would parking i wasn't aware of that at all that's so how does that play into i mean i feel like there's no permanent parking in my backyard so yeah i i haven't i honestly have no idea and you didn't put that in your application otherwise i would have been like wait highlight they have one car and two on street permit parking that's they asked us how many we need i mean there's space for about six cars along that stretch up there from our driveway and up there's usually nobody parking there i mean we've had neighbors ask you know they could park and i'd say find myself the city isn't we didn't have the permits in our probably for the first he came to get the permit up and here's the permits i'm not sure the story yeah students right they they park alongside our house and then i wanted to share too just the history a piece back on the history was that we put in the proposal for the driveway because we thought we had to have it meet the regulations of having a another unit but we were concerned about aesthetically in the town and how that would look to along that street to to have cars like in front of the house so that was that's part of the reason not to have a driveway or that we're hoping for a waiver yeah that is one of the like locational standards is that if you were just building like a parking lot for something you wouldn't put it between the street and the front of the house typically a driveway is a little different but yep well we have to paint it down specifically we sort of have a totality of of criteria here under section 3011 part c um board members get to think about that list and information in the application there that um i can kind of go through here um yes so marita this is for you so if we do grant a waiver in this instance there's nothing that's preventing them from going back and and building constructing the driveway if that's needed in the future oh well i mean there's the life of the permit yeah right yeah i mean within within the life of the permit the life of the permit they already received right yeah they can't yeah this and this won't extend that time period of that prior permit yeah so okay yeah abby is your question did you get the answer you're you're looking for because i the way i heard that it was that so we grant theoretically uh the uh one parking space permit can they come back at five years and undo it or a new owner undo it well yeah i mean they'd have they'd have to wait if they they'd have to get a new permit right so somebody now wants to add a second driveway to get the second off street parking space they'd have to come back for a new permit yeah yeah right yeah um you know i mean if they if they find that this really isn't working they lose the on-street permits something like that they would need to come back and get a new permit for whether it's a second driveway or some weird expansion of what they have there which would be really really difficult um they would need either a permit an administrative permit or a permit from you depending on what the actual layout was yeah but i mean what they got before was pretty much the only space they could put a new off-street parking space without general question about the permitted parking which also i had no clue about um so you guys have two permits for two vehicles to park on the street on first ab there and they just gave you two permits yeah they just gave us so does that allow you to park through the winter there um well on the on the alternating days so it's uh that's the uh even that's the even side of the street so even number days we could park there but we couldn't park there with the parking permit on the odd number day okay it's only on your side of the street um correct yeah the other side of the door oh wait yeah gotcha yeah i i have no i'd never heard about these yeah it's interesting i have no idea either i was just wondering if a potential tenant could just get a permit also on the street there i mean your personal question i mean just given the nature of this oh if that was something that was available to them that makes it a lot easier to okay a accessory dwelling unit that doesn't have a parking spot if i mean this brand new concept to me that we have permitted parking in mob failure i had no idea um i i honestly have never heard about it but as far as like the board is concerned i mean it makes it a little easier to make that decision knowing that that's an option for a potential tenant right but the the permit would be to the tenant you know so yeah i mean they walk in and they ask him how many cars they have they say one and they just get one permit sounds like so there's a sign that says permitted parking only by by there too okay it's because um our home used to be part of the college and the now that wouldn't be it i don't know i bet that has something to do with it when there are more kids going there and just to make sure that there are spots for people traveling into school that's probably what it's for but now that the college is essentially has no one coming to it now they have all this permitted parking that's just available so they will hand them out to anyone who asks not a question i'm newer i'm not sure if um this is an appropriate question i was curious whether you thought about uh for advertising the tenancy you know whether you will explicitly note that there is no parking space you know you know beyond the you know there's a advertising the apartment as an apartment with the ability to get that on street parking or there's just advertising the apartment as an apartment and that's it's an ad u with you know it is for a resident without a car or for someone who is you know looking for that walkability maybe they you know have other means of getting where they need to go when it's a regional yeah we haven't thought of the exact listing of what we'd say in there but we did probably focus on what we were renting out which is the you know the studio apartment and and shared garage space not not including parking for a car but including parking for storage for a bike and so forth um we hadn't thought ahead of whether we would just say about parking around or assume no i think a comment for the record too is there's a lot of other uses for ad u aside from a tenant you know like granny flat child care you know there are many uses in which you know someone might in fact be a member of the extended family or whatever else and not necessarily be requiring their own car so and it would just comment for the record not necessarily your situation yeah and there is one space for our car so the tenant potentially have that space in the garage if you were to give it out to them so then you would have nowhere to park though in the garage you park them generally the list things would advertise if there's off-street parking so the absence of that would they would figure it out i'm sure it's also a question that yeah the tenants ask that's potentially more affordable unit if it's not coming with a parking space yeah so yeah right sorry i'm just looking at this i'm looking i'm looking at the interactive downtown public parking map and i'm not seeing anything about first av and permits or anything interesting i'm gonna have some questions have lots of questions for dbw after tonight's meeting i don't think they're gonna change that anytime soon okay so we've um in our criteria here under 311c we've discussed um on street um or public parking within a thousand feet of the development um which is the you know the property that we're discussing tonight um like the public transit stop um within a quarter mile um we've discussed that some um the bicycle storage in the garage um which is says employees but i think that it's reasonable here to um you know translate that over to using our criteria and um then there were some other criteria that um maybe are applicable but i feel like i have the information i need um how do board members feel i have one last question mostly from narrative would they be able to put a business in there if they so chose so that's a whole other change of use permit and we reevaluate parking again at that time because commercial right if it's a home business where nobody shows up that's one thing if it's a business where people show up you have to have more parking it's a it's a ratio based on the amount of square footage used in the space for the business multiplied by the frequency of customers i just want to make sure that you are blank and saying that was like a this is serious on the end this is for this residential use great that's uh answers my question i feel like um they admit the burden of showing sufficient alternatives what thank you very much oh no i think you guys hit it off thank you very much go ahead joe oh joe wants me to make the motion i'll make the motion uh motion to approve the request to waive one required parking space at five west street and to construct a new 100 what so we did never talk about that it's in the staff report it's administrative and design review right the whole permit as a whole covered both of those things okay you didn't talk about this because there's absolutely nothing in here the board actually needs to make a decision on but the permit has to cover everything okay sorry it was like a surprise all right motion to approve that's we're here at 5 30 fired parking space at five west street and to construct a new 192 square foot shed as presented in application z 2022 zero one zero four and supporting and supplemental materials motion by abby second by kevin um is there any discussion on the motion okay i would just say that i think it's uh i mean we were treading on new ground here but the applicant wants to forge ahead with a with a different concept which i think is good i think we should encourage that uh there's nothing that we're voting on that would be irrevocable as per abby's question earlier so i'm i'm in full support of this yeah i think i'd like to just highlight a couple things i think that um yeah there is this concept that maybe it's the concept kevin's talking about about the idea of decoupling parking from a rental unit um as you know some way if you don't have a car why would you be paying for a parking space um and so um you know i think that that's you know it's a new concept that we have all sorts of parking issues in montpellier why not try something new and i think that this falls well within the bounds of our um authority to give it a give it a roll um i i think that it's it's not specifically related to this application but i would flag concern i know that in other municipalities you know talk about like uh you know airbnb and short tune rentals um and that's not on this application but i'm just gonna you know throw it out there that um in my mind that would be a different story um as far as us reviewing this application even though that we don't have the short term rental uh regulations in montpellier you know yet um but um that's something that you know i did think about um and uh yeah i know we're working with the housing committee and they did it for long for long term yeah for long term housing absolutely thank you on that one for the record agree with your statement on kind of infill and walkability and decoupling housing from parking requirements it should promote more affordability and uh yeah enable more people to enjoy a really great walkable downtown that we have so and i think one just general point i'd uh be interested to see how you know the longevity of my ride you know with i think my ride right now is arguably more convenient than a transit station located within a catchment area of a of a house of a housing location so you know but then i suppose there's some questions around um yeah frequency and all that thing right call the roll unless anyone else is anything bad Sharon how do you vote Kevin yes um abby yeah sorry patterns yes yes yeah and uh uh michael yes jean yes and uh rob would say yes that's unanimously approved uh thank you very much for coming in thank you so good luck with that same routine written decision and we'll be able to issue the written decision and the permit on the same day once it's the decision signed because there's no conditions okay perfect thank you so much thank you okay don't pack up just yet next uh next meeting meredith uh she does another roll hold on oh take a time well i did take this is fine but next regular meeting monday october third anybody know that they're not going to make it now we do have applications yes monday october third or if you if you don't know off the top of your head you can just email me um and that's yeah the only other business that i've got yeah i posted on the team we're done defending applications page i can't remember right now oh no i do it's um demolition of chimneys on the roof of a historic building oh no that was a different historic building then there the agreement was they were going to rebuild them this is actually complete demo no plans to rebuild them at all is it a residence or a business it could be either ultimately it's you know look on the pending applications page on their website you can link to the original base application okay i will uh accept the motion to adjourn so moved all right all those in favor say aye aye we need a second on that okay motion by joe second by abby all those in favor say aye aye