 Hello everyone, so if you're not aware, I actually had my round two debate with Pierce Morgan finally after five years. I appeared on his show when he was on Good Morning Britain about five years ago and we debated is milk murder. Basically, Pierce didn't know that cows are actually slaughtered in the dairy industry. His final argument was that I have a criminal history, so who am I to say what is and isn't murder? You don't believe in harming other human beings? I don't believe in harming other human beings or animals, no. So, in September 2011, you arrested when police found a loaded, sawn-off pump action rifle. Oh, a character attack. Basically trying to debunk my argument with an appeal to hypocrisy, which is Pierce Morgan's lobal tactic he likes to use. Yeah, so I arrived actually a week earlier to do this debate. It got cancelled and it was supposed to be with someone else. A week later, they invited me back to get this debate on the roll, but it was with this guy who banned all vegans from his restaurant, so it just changed suddenly, so I had to keep on my toes. Here's me arriving at the front of the newsroom. I even brought some vegan donuts for the crew, seeing as the crew actually really nice to me and really accommodating really nice people in there. So I was prepared for Pierce Morgan, but you can only be so prepared once the lights start rolling and it's live and it's basically Pierce Morgan's domain. You really don't know what to expect and sometimes adrenaline can get the better of you and things like that, but when it was my turn to go on, I said hello to Pierce, shook his hand and he said, hey mate, how are you? We were quite friendly actually and I said congratulations on your award that you won for your Ronaldo interview and he said, oh, thank you, thank you, no worries. But I said to him, you know what they should have given you an award for? The biggest anti-vegan troll on earth and he kind of laughed and he said, you know, I don't actually mind vegans too much, you know, I just don't like them playing slaughter footage in restaurants and I should share footage of bees being slaughtered and because they're hypocrites, you know. But anyway, that was the conversation before the camera started rolling, but you know what we're going to do? I thought maybe we could just watch the debate together and review it kind of thing, because so much happens in those debates. It's very fast moving, but fast pace. I'm getting ambushed. The other speaker is allowed to speak. He's constantly interrupting me and trying to throw me off. It's a lot easier from home thinking, oh, he should have done this, should have done that. But when you're in there, it's difficult. Ask anyone who's been in a live TV situation with someone ambushing them. So let's go. Welcome back to Facebook on Sense and Veganism, the art of issuing all pleasure in life. This is one of the 21st century's most bizarre trends when I look at it. See how he looks at it as like pleasure, like eating the bodies of animals is a pleasurable experience. That's his argument. I like eating meat. I love it. It's tasty. It's almost like he thinks that because you derive pleasure from an action, it justifies the action. And he believes that vegans don't have fun or derive pleasure from their food or anything like this or from things they do. An absolute load of crap. Vegans eat all the same foods that non-vegans eat. Burgers, bacon, hot dogs, ice cream, chocolate. And we also have relationships and go out and have fun. We just don't support the rights violations of non-human animals. But there are green plant-based shoots of recovery. The new fashion is for high-profile vegans, including explorer bear grills, to reveal the de-transitioning back to healthy meaty diets. And somebody's chef's like John Mountain, who runs Fire Restaurant in Perth, Australia, is also dealing the fight back. He's made global headlines this week after announcing, sadly, all vegans are banned from fire for mental health reasons. We thank you for your understanding. I mean, if David Rams is watching, this is probably the biggest meat flake of the year here, this guy here. One thing I didn't get to say to him, I had a few other things I wanted to say to this absolute loser, in my opinion, just a sook, softy, just crybaby. Why would you leverage mental health reasons from a small complaint that was made saying that you wouldn't accommodate vegans? You got some complaints for it. You're a celebrity chef. You go on to make this post, which blows it way out of proportion, makes it even worse, goes on a massive media run, getting all in front of the cameras. You got up at 3 a.m. in Australia. It was 3 a.m. when this debate was on, just to talk to Pierce Morgan and, in my opinion, get publicly embarrassed. But for mental health reasons, he banned all vegans. Like, mate, you obviously don't have that bad of mental health issues, right? I've suffered mental health issues. I know how bad it can be. You obviously don't have that bad of mental health issues if you just aggravated a whole community of people and then went on a massive media run publicly and then you're on live TV with Pierce Morgan. You got up at 3 a.m. for it. If you had mental health issues, you'd be like, no, man, I've got to stay, keep to myself now. This is too much. Liar. Many didn't understand. He's been flooded with fake bookings and hostile reviews. It's because he banned a whole group of people from his restaurant, people that didn't even know about his restaurant, till he banned them all. Imagine if you had a restaurant and you said to a guy who wanted some halal product there and then you promised you would give him that halal food and then when he arrived, there was no halal food or like, he gave him some broccoli on a plate. He complained and then you banned all Muslims from your restaurant. You know, that's the equivalent. And then he complains when he got a bunch of bad reviews. John Mountain, why did you ban vegans from your restaurant? Morning, peers. I banned them from my restaurant because, look, I've been a chef for nearly 30 years, but on this particular incident, it was just too much, you know? Fragile, insecure, shell of a man. Been a chef for 30 years, can't handle a complaint or two. They grouped together, which, you know, I'm very proud of the vegans for all sticking together, but they did. They grouped and bandied together and then started hammering my business with one-star reviews. Because he said in his message that he won't accommodate vegans or he just accommodates everyone else but vegans, even though he told her that he would accommodate her and she shared the post. He got some bad reviews off the back of it. It's your own doing. I saw my rating drop from a sensible 4.2 down to 2.8. They nearly broke me. It's probably not hard to break your mate, seeing as your biggest snowflake I've ever seen in my life. What was the incident that provoked all this? The problem that happened was a girl had emailed me three weeks before requesting a vegan selection. And I said, well, look, rather than saying that, what is it that you like? Tell me what you like. She sent me all the DMs. I think I'll make a separate video about this guy, actually. But he just goes on to say it was a justifiable complaint. You know, I let her down. Well, if it's a justifiable complaint, why did you ban all vegans because of it? Because you've got some more bad reviews. And now he's just brought a bunch of heat and attention. He's probably a bit of an attention seeker, this guy, that's what I reckon. I couldn't do it. I let her down. And it was a justifiable complaint. He let her down. It was a justifiable complaint. Then why did you blow it out of proportion, mate? You know, and ban all vegans because of it? Because he's a fragile narcissist. That's why. In my opinion, obviously, I'm not a psychologist and I don't actually know for sure. But he's definitely showing some narcissistic traits. Can't handle criticism. Blows things out of proportion. Blames everyone else for his wrongdoings. Can't handle complaints. And he's got a history of this. The way he reacts to criticism is not good. And I actually bring that up in this debate anyway. And she went nuts. Cool. About, yeah, slightly nuts, as they do. She didn't go nuts at all. She just left, you know, some criticism for him and he couldn't handle it. My thing about vegans is they tend to be, I don't know, they seem to me permanently hangry. Because you constantly aggravate and pierce me. Every interaction you've ever had with a vegan, you just constantly aggravate them and ambush them and they can never speak. And obviously, we see a lot of suffering and murder and killing and cruelty and things like this. Stuff that you just completely stick your head in the sand about. So, you know, you've got a nice cushy little life there. Every interaction pierced Morgan's probably had with a vegan has been where he's trying to ambush them, expose them and embarrass them. Like the lack of meat in their diet makes them very intolerant of people. And they get very agitated. And if you don't sign up to all things vegan in the way that they want you to, all hell breaks loose. Pierce, if you want to see all hell break loose, look into the farms where you get your flesh from. Vegans are very tolerant people. We even tolerate other species. The same species that you destined to get decapitated for your lifestyle and then, you know, go on to appeal to hypocrisy every time someone brings it up to you. I think that seems to be the issue, Pierce, to be honest. I think they're just missing a really good burger or a glass of milk, you know, or both, you know, they need to sleep more. Yeah, you know, that's the most childish low grade thing. It's probably the height of the intelligent argument you'll get out of this guy here. I'd love to face this guy and see how much of a hero he really is. I mean, some of the comments he was leaving, oh, my, oh, like he's acting like a massive tough guy. Guy's a shell of a man, insecure, you know, or maybe if they had a burger, well, maybe if you stopped decapitating animals and posing with dead piglets, you know, maybe you have a little bit of morality about you. You know, could have easily turned this into a vegan restaurant, but now he just bans all vegans, aggravates and takes photos with murdered animals and makes stupid remarks like this. Be a bit more healthy, although, you know, the vegan diet allegedly is healthy, just not for everybody else, you know, I think each to their own. Each to their own, except for the animals that have to walk down the kill line. Hey, what about their interests? No, they don't get no choice. Each to their own, except for that group of the moral community. Okay, let's come to Joey. It's a Joey Bear Grylls, so I know well. Here I am. So I was not expecting him to go on and talk about Bear Grylls. I was actually tuned out when he first introduced this. I was like, oh, God, I'm about to speak what am I going to say? So he's embarrassed to use to promote veganism. He now eats a diet of red meat, blood, bone marrow, as well as salted butter, eggs, fruit and honey. So has he ever felt better? Well, that's an anecdote, Pierce. The guy doesn't know what he's talking about. Well, maybe he just eradicated a bunch of processed food from his diet. Who knows what he did, but just because one person feels better from making a temporary diet change, you can't then extrapolate that out to the whole population and say that this is a health-promoting way to eat. Eating butter and meat and, you know, eggs and all this stuff. You're going to have to go with data and not your mate's little anecdote. Talking about his transition to vegan diet, he said, I was vegan quite a few years ago. I thought I wrote a vegan cookbook. I now feel a bit embarrassed about that, because I promoted it. I thought that was good for the environment. I thought it was good for my health and through time and experience and knowledge and study, I realized I was wrong on both. You mean just watching Paul Saladino videos? You realized you were wrong because you're so easily hoodwinked by Nonsense Paul Saladino bullcrap, where he just publishes low-grade rat studies and stands shouting in front of a fridge about how broccoli will kill you and you fell for that because you're an absolute simpleton. Paul Saladino thinks vegetables are unhealthy and this is one of the inspirations of Bear Grylls. When he asked me this, I was actually not prepared for it, so I'm always going to be a little bit more, just a little bit more jumpy first going into the conversation. He's embarrassed that he promoted a plant-based diet when he drinks urine and bile out of camel's stomach. He drinks bile out of a dead camel's stomach. This is what Pear says. Urine's quite healthy. It's healthy. Would you drink urine? Would you rather drink urine? Absolutely, if I had to. Yeah, but this is how much of a contrarian Pearce Morgan is. Just to take the alternative view, he says that he will drink urine. That's how he didn't even think that through. Absolutely, I'll drink urine. If I had to, nah, it's healthy though. Hey, like, go on, Pearce. How about I make you a nice, fresh, warm glass of piss, mate? You can drink it down on camera. He's embarrassed that he now, that he promoted a vegan diet and that he's not embarrassed of his behaviour on TV and he thinks that eating the bodies of un- Why are vegans so angry? Yeah, you interrupted me there, but I think this was a good segue into the next story about this guy. Well, he made a statement saying the vegans are angry and angry, but he carried on and banned all vegans from his restaurant because of one simple complaint. What a fragile man to ban a whole group of people over that. He's allowed to? Yeah, he's allowed to ban a whole group of people from his restaurant. Well, he's a chef who's just sick of tailoring to vegan people who want to have all this stuff and... They want to have all this stuff. They just want you to remove certain products to make it vegan and make it substantial enough. She got served a bowl of vegetables, bit of broccoli, a couple of chickpeas on a plate for $32. So, like, yeah, he could have made something substantial for her even though she contacted him three weeks in advance, then she contacted him five days in advance. He agreed to accommodate her both of those times, and then when she rocked up, she got to play the broccoli because he forgot. Get angry about me. Well, listen, listen, listen, wait a second. He got a two-star review when he was on a Great British menu, right? He'd ripped off his mic, smashed up the studio, and said that he wanted to kill the guy for giving him a two-star review of a fish dish that he made. He didn't ban all fish he'd took from his restaurant. Why? No, you wouldn't ban... So, the idea here was not to have a personal attack on this guy. The idea was to show that this guy can't handle criticism. So, he got a two-star review from another celebrity chef on this, on the Great British menu. And because he got a two-star review for his fish dish, maybe it was crap. And he flipped out over it. And my point was he can't handle criticism, obviously. It wasn't that he smashed the place up. It's just a reflection of him not being able to handle criticism. And then I went on to say he didn't ban all fish eaters because of this or meat eaters because of this. So, he got a complaint that he reacted to even more so than this one from the vegan. And he didn't overshoot and go on banning all meat eaters because it would be the end of his business. But he can easily ban a minority, is what I'm saying. And that was my point. But Pierce goes on to say, well, you did something bad too. Hang on, Joey, Joey, Joey. Look at him go. Joey, we're going to get personal. You were a gang member. So, don't take the high moral ground of smashing something up. Am I? Am I? Like, in a live discussion, I was like, oh, we're talking about my gang history here. But really, I made a point about he didn't ban all fish eaters. But Pierce didn't address that. And he then went to appeal to my... to a hypocrisy of me, hey, man, you were a gang member, la, la, la. I'm completely honest about that. There's been documentaries made about that. So, don't take the high moral ground about losing your temper. You were literally in a gang. I was 10 years ago. 10 years sober now. You've got to use that. I'm just saying, if you're going to get personal with him... I wasn't getting personal with him. I was making a logical, like, argument. I was saying, here he is. He's showing he can't show criticism. Like, flipping out over, you know, a bad review. Instead of just reflecting and going, you know, maybe I could have done that better. It's never his fault, you know what I mean. It's never something this guy done wrong. And then saying that he didn't ban all fish eaters because of that. I was making an argument. You didn't address the argument. You just went, go, well, you're in a gang. He was... It went over your head, piercey boy. Come on, mate. Come on, pierce. Anyways, I don't walk around with, uh, dead baby pigs facing them like that. Like, does that look like someone who really gives a damn about animals? Like, you know... This was my, um, way of trying to make it more about the animals. So, I was using this picture, a profile picture, to show this guy he doesn't care about animals at all. And I was using this picture as a segue to talk about pigs. And that's his profile picture. Looking at a dead pig. Joey. Joey. Joey. Joey. One second, I just want to say this. In Australia, pigs are killed in gas chambers, okay? They cause pigs... They're horrible. Have you seen footage from inside a gas chamber? Joey, here's the thing. I recently exposed one in the UK. They scream to death and beg for mercy. In Perth, there's a gas chamber called Lindy Valley Pork, right? And this guy serves pork at his restaurants. And why would you be more upset of a little complaint as a chef than pigs being murdered in gas chambers? This guy's got a cookbook called Pig. He once had a restaurant that only served pork. He lives in Perth where there's a gas chamber. There's gas chambers all over Australia which have been exposed and there's footage everywhere. And what baffles me is it's causing more outrage that this vegan complained about a $32 plate of vegetables. Him flipping out banning all vegans, right? He's getting all this support. Nothing is being said about the pigs being murdered in gas chambers that he sells out of his restaurant. You know what I mean? Okay, let me ask you the question that I asked a vegan activist the other day. Yeah, I knew what he was going to say. I already had a bunch of stuff prepared, but with pigs, he doesn't let the debate flow. He won't address my claims. He just keeps hammering it, hammering on the same point. But I was already prepared for this. Which is that given that 80% or 90% of the world's almonds come from California, where they're made involving the demolition of billions of bees who get murdered, how do you feel about the little guys? I don't get murdered. That's completely false. And I don't know how many billions. They do not get murdered. So this is where him and I, like, where he doesn't understand what I'm saying. He's saying they get murdered. So the commercial honey industry rent out their bees. They want the bees to come back. They don't want them to be murdered. Murder is where you kill someone deliberately. What are they doing? Going up with the bees, chopping their heads off like they do to cows? Like, the way he frames it and the way he phrases this is disingenuous. Okay, so it's trying to frame vegans as murderers. When murder doesn't take place, yes, bees die. Yeah, there are certain stresses that harm the bees. Travel and things like this from pollination. But bees die in the wild too. There's certain stresses in the wild. Like weather and climate and all these things for wild bees. And what I'm saying is it's not murder. How many billions of bees die in the pollination? I've got the 2022 data right here. They die mostly from parasites and pest. 66% die of varroa mites or other pests and parasites. In the making of almonds and avocados. Well, you could just say in the making of honey. Commercial beekeeping. What he's saying is that they're getting these varroa mites directly related to pollination. Now, the leading killer of these bees right from 2022 was varroa mites. So we got to 45%. And when you look up some of the research, like there's this study here, it's a big systematic review. It's called migratory beekeeping and its influence on the prevalence and dispersal of pathogens to managed and wild bees. And when you actually scroll down to varroa mites here, the number one killer of bees in 2022 was this varroa mite right called the varroa destructor. So some studies reported a significant increase in varroa loads in migratory colonies. A non-significant effect of the management or higher prevalence in stationary operations. So some studies showed that there was a higher prevalence of this kind of mite in operations that didn't move around. There's another study that did not find any impact of the movement of hires on varroa load when the migratory colonies had just arrived. But one month later, mites load was higher in stationary colonies. This was interesting too. Additionally, there was one study focused on the development of resistant to treatments for varroa, depending on the management of the honey bee hives, migratory versus stationary. Interestingly, these authors found an increase of the resistance to treatments in stationary colonies. So basically the ones that moved around weren't resistant to treatment for the mites. So the ones that stayed still were resistant to treatments. So if you want to see where we got this from, it's here. USAFax, how much have the USB populations fallen and why? And then you can just scroll down here to this stats statistic from the US Department of Agriculture. Varroa mites, 45% other pests and parasites, diseases, pesticides, other. I will say this, that certain things are affected by bee migration. Like there might be a more of a spread of certain pathogens or sometimes the travel causes certain stresses on the bees. But Pierce Morgan is framing the deaths in pollination as murder, which is disingenuous and not true. Oh, they do. They do. The danger is here. It's this year. Do you know what I read? It's here is dates from US Department of Agriculture. Do you know what I read this? I read it in The Guardian, The Vegan Bible. Well, you misread their article anyway, didn't you? They never said that bees are murdered. They're rented from the honey industry, right? And they want the bees to come back. 6.7% this is nonsense. You don't care about the little guys. We boycott them. Billions of bees get murdered and you don't care. Where do those bees come from? Where do those bees come from? In America, they come from all over the country. The commercial honey industry. That's true. And a lot of them do. A lot of them do. Most of them are things like two-thirds of them do. Want to beat Vegan's boycott? Go on. The commercial honey industry. Why don't you boycott Amazon and Avocado? Because I don't see a reason to. Most of the bees are dying from mice. Do you see pollination on this list? Well, pollination is not on the list, but what I was meant to say, your kind of thing is like murder from pollination. If you look at the research here, information about the varroa destructor was highly heterogeneous. I'll learn how to say that word, meaning some studies showed an increase in varroa load. Some studies showed no difference. Sometimes showed a higher prevalence in stationary bees that didn't move around. And that stationary colonies were resistant to treatments. So when it comes to varroa mites, which is the number one killer of these bees. And there's definitely other things to be concerned about as well. But these, I wouldn't consider these murder. I would consider these like risks that bees undergo and probably wild bees undergo similar risks. If they get varroa mites, they will die out. There's no real data on wild bees. Wild bees die from pests and parasites. Wild bees die from diseases. Wild bees are dying from exposure to pesticides. Incidentally, these are incidental deaths. These are not murder as he's framing it. But he's only doing this to get a gotcha on the vegans and say, you murder bees, you murder them, you're a murderer. This is his whole MO. This is what he does. This is what he thinks works every single time. It's actually the most lowest grade argumentation to go, hey man, you stepped on a bug, so I can stab this child in the face. Like imagine that. Just everyone appealed to hypocrisy all the time. Imagine going to the judge, hey, you know what, like, you're on a like, why should I listen to you about this mass shooting that I just committed when, you know, one time you stepped on a snail, you're a hypocrite. You murdered a snail. All right, listen. So you don't care about the little guys. Only 6% die from pesticides. So it's not a really a rights violation, not murdering the bees. Joey, here's my point. The bees are just, no. Big pig, big pig, a big pig makes you cry. A little bee, you don't care. If I was going to choose one to live, and I know this is just in a hypothetical situation, obviously a pig and a bee have vastly different experiences. You know, comparing experience and sentience of a bee to the experience and sentience of a pig, obviously a pig is experiencing a lot deeper level of sentience to a bee. It's questionable whether many insects are even sentient at all or experience anything to any non-trivial degree at all. Like a lot of insects, you can cut them in half and they still feed normally. But see how he likes to equate animals. Now I don't equate animals. You could probably equate like a pig and a dog and a cow and a lamb kind of thing. Very, very similar in sentience. But you kind of equate like a pig and a dog and a cow to a beetle. You know what I mean? No, listen. You don't care about it. There's no reason to be upset about pollination. Sometimes 15 billion... They die from mice. Why aren't you angry at the mice? Hang on, Joey. Barrel the mice. So I shout over each other. Sometimes 50 billion bees. Stop shouting over each other. The hypocrite. He just would not let me get a word edgeways in. When the other guy speaks, he just lets him talk, talk, talk, talk. But me, he had, he ambushed. He constantly berated. And then now he's gone back to 50 billion bees. I think he's using like a 2019 stat. I think back then there was an issue with maybe the mixture of two pesticides. I think they solved that issue. But the main killer of honeybee colonies is a Varrel the mice. So... Die in six weeks... From mice. ...to give you vegan. I've literally just told you they got from mice. Check out the... That's not true. Is it agricultural stats from America? That is not true. That's the latest data, Pierce. I gave him a copy of this, by the way, at the end of it. Are you still lying? Read the Guardian. I read it in an article. An anecdote. So it must be true. Listen. Basically what I'm saying is the Guardian, yes, a prestigious newspaper. They do a lot of good research. But like what they, in that article, they were using like opinions of beekeepers and things like this. But you do have to look at the data. And there might be some pretty good reasons that the bee pollination needs a bit of reform. And I think they're working on some of the issues with the welfare of the bees and stuff like that. But to use a Guardian article as your evidence is not good evidence. We need to look at actual data and then see what you can actually prove. And basically, Pierce's whole argument, you don't care about the little guys, he doesn't care about anyone. If there was a boycott of almonds, it would be vegans who would be the first to do it. Most vegans already boycott the commercial honey industry anyway. Now, he doesn't do any of it. He doesn't boycott any animal product at all. He doesn't care about animals at all. And he goes on to say that. Even from a welfare perspective, he doesn't care about factory farming, cruelty and all these things. I'm an animal rights activist. He certainly wouldn't care about animal rights, which is why I asked him about animal cruelty, because that's a language he can understand. I mean, you start talking about animal rights with this guy, it's probably not going to get anywhere. And most of the audience can understand animal cruelty, and which is why I spoke about gas chambers, which is known to be cruel under rights violation. So he doesn't care about the little guys. He just cares about calling vegans hypocrites so he can continue to eat his meat. And you know, this is a show. This is a show. Pierce is going to be the anti-vegan. You're the vegan. I'm grateful they let me on, to be honest. How long have you been a vegan? Ten years. Like, do you actually, because you seem quite agitated to me. Like, you want a bit of... It's just about nonsense about bees being murdered when they die from moths. They are murdered. They're murdered. And he keeps saying they're murdered. They're murdered. They're not actually murdered. Like, I don't know if he understands what murder is. Well, God, pigs obviously being murdered. He's acting like it's so clear cut, the topic of bee pollination. There's so many moving parts. I read this whole systematic review here, and there's so many things they don't know. There's so many different variables. There's so many different weather variables. There's so many different things to consider. The bee management of each different hive, or each different beekeeper is different, and whether they've used certain treatments for mites, and, you know, what time of the year it is, and what hives other hives are being exposed to. And even in the honey industry, they keep hives close together so they can spread pathogens. And, you know, there's so many different things to consider, even like bees flying over, like wild bees flying over and getting inside their hives can cause issues. And, but in any event, how would you call it murder, even if he was right? But do you think, in a way, you represent what I feel about bees? You're all quite angry. Are you against animal cruelty, Piz? Yes. Then why do you support animal cruelty when you support the meat industry? I've defended the bees for years. I don't support animal cruelty, but you promote every other animal product known to man. But you've got a massive problem with almonds and avocados, of which you don't boycott yourself and you don't even boycott the honey industry, and you're not even like a bee rights activist. By a logical extension, if you were to care about bees, you would care about every other sentient being that are of a higher sentience level than bees, so you'd care about fish. You would be trying to reduce your rights violations across the board, but he doesn't try to do any of that. He's a maximum animal rights violator, and all he does is I want to kill all the animals, eat them all. You can't tell me nothing because you eat almonds. Well, they're not murdered. They die from mice. Billions of bees are murdered so that you vegans can eat almonds and avocados. Do you boycott honey? Where they're hired from? John, let me bring in Johnny. See how, if you keep repeating something long enough, people just accept it as facts. Billions of bees are murdered, so he just keeps repeating it, and then I ask him if he boycotts honey, and, no, then he goes over to John. I don't want to talk about that. Hey, John, what I'm trying to say is vegans are hypocrites. Do you agree? John, look, here's my point about the vegans. There's a lot of hypocrisy, as there is with all these debates, right? Which is that if you want to eat almonds and avocados as a vegan... It's quite funny, too. Like, when he's saying eating almonds and avocados is bad, he's basically talking about the entire population. I mean, the reason that there's a bunch of almonds being grown anyway is not to supply the 1% of the world out of vegan, it's to supply... Let's just look this up right now. I'll show you what the majority of almonds are used for. So, cereal and granola bars for almond milk for vegans. But let's keep going. You feel virtuous. You think you're saving the planet as well. Actually, neither of those things are true. Billions of bees get killed to make almonds and avocados. They might die, but they're not getting murdered. That's the whole point, mate. And making the claim that vegans are bee murderers because of this is just a lofty claim with no evidence. And also, they fly them in around the world, or they truck them around the world, and they call that is terrible for the planet. They truck animal products around the world. He doesn't care about what's terrible for the planet anyway. Spear's small, and you're flying on a private jet everywhere. He's eating steak every day, red meat. The animal products, like I said, I jumped in, animal products are trucked all over the planet. Like, what is he talking about? Do you believe, John, that there's a kind of basic hypocrisy here with the vegans? Yeah, like you can say that with a straight face, Spear. He once mentioned he had a problem with eating dogs. He's mentioned he's opposed to poaching. He mentioned that he wanted to see Walter Palmer murdered and head decapitated and hung above a desk because Walter Palmer shot a lion. So he has spoken out against issues that he cares about, like poaching and stuff like that. For some reason, he cannot accept any responsibility or admit any responsibility of the meat industry for harming animals. There's a strange correlation that they have between eating meat and death and murder. There's a strange correlation between, like vegans have between murdering animals with a knife in the neck and murder. It's really weird. Like, it's so strange. I'm like, I don't know what they're talking about. It's a very bizarre, strange, weird correlation they just pulled out of their backside that when you murder an animal, that is murder. Which they like to keep promoting that murder aside. I think if they look up the definition of murder, you know, this is human versus human and that is it. You know, like if you look up the definition of murder, it's this is human versus human, even though there are like multiple definitions that apply to animals. I could Google them up, you can Google them yourself, check the Collins dictionary. To slay wantingly, there's to kill brutally. There's a bunch of others as well. Because his definition doesn't apply to animals, it's not a moral issue to stab a knife into the neck of an animal to eat their body. Like, is that you claim me? I'm 100% against animal cruelty and for him to bring up the Great British Menu, well, it just shows his mentality, you know. Yeah, I brought up the Great British Menu because you chucked a wobbly because you got a two star review for a fish dish and you didn't ban all fish eels because of it and you didn't ban all meat eaters. It also was a perfect example of how you can't take criticism and you blow up and overreact and start smashing up, you know, which is what you've done here. You basically blown up, overreacted and banned all vegans. It's not what we're about. I think each should be to their own and you should just enjoy your life. Yeah, enjoy your life while you're killing animals. It's okay for you, mate. Imagine him walking down the same kill floor that the animals had to walk down in order to be served in his crappy restaurant. If they're going to argue, Piers, why are you killing animals and enjoy your life? But, Joey, why can't you? Why are you killing animals? Look at this. Joey, it's a picture of the murdered people. It's a picture of the murdered people. And he's saying, that's beautiful, Joey. That's beautiful, Joey. You know, he thinks that posing with a murdered animal of which, if you look through the comments section, which we want to say, most people are against him for that. And that's why I actually used it to show his character when it comes to animals, the desecrating the remains of animals. You can't handle a simple complaint from a... And this woman, she's a very nice woman. I spoke to this young woman. She's very nice, very kind, very polite. And you can't handle a simple complaint. Joey, let me ask you a question. Celebrity chef. Joey. And it's clear. Joey. Even meat eaters complain about his restaurant. Joey. He doesn't ban all meat. Joey. Do you see how he kept interrupting me? He didn't interrupt this guy once, right? And he kept interrupting me. Three words. And he just jumps in. Joey, Joey, Joey, Joey. Because that's his MO. I'm the side of discreet with you. He wants to drown me out, make a fall out of me, do a little humiliation thing to me here and have them to just run the show. But it actually backfired on him. If you want to be, if you want to be a vegan, I don't care, right? You're an idiot. Well, goodbye, mate. Did you pull that insult out of the dictionary? Next, your definition of murder? It's entirely down to you. Don't worry about bees, bees. If you want it, they're not being slaughtered. Billions of bees. He doesn't know what slaughter means. Hey, it's weird. Everyone, go and Google. Billions of bees are getting killed by mice. Here's what I say. He's exposed. To everyone watching this, either on the show tonight or on YouTube later, go and Google bees. US Department of Agriculture staff. Right here. Avocados and you'll see the truth, the truth. Even the Guardian, where they all are compelled to eat lentils every day when they wear their sandals to work. He uses a source from the Guardian who he criticizes and thinks they're all lentil eating sandal wearers, whatever that means. When I show him actual agricultural statistics, it's actually the number one killer is actually mites and parasites. He still goes back to that source. And I've shown you with this varroa mite when it comes to like migratory bees, they're really not certain if migration has any effect on this varroa mite. And in fact, there's studies that show migration actually has a positive effect on reducing varroa mites. So, yeah. This is a gas chamber pills. This is how pigs are killed in the sport in the UK. This is my investigation. Thank you, Equestrian. Why do you play me? The reason I pulled out the gas chamber footage, I thought I'd take the opportunity to raise awareness about this issue to Pierce Morgan because he kept stifling, shutting down, ambushing, interrupting. He wouldn't let me speak. There wasn't going to be a proper discussion, proper debate. All Pierce wanted to do was shout me down, you're a murderer, you're a murderer, you murder bees. So, I didn't really have many other options. You know, he wouldn't let me finish any of my sentences. He kept cutting away to the other guy. He kept saying, just check out the Guardian this and that. He just wouldn't drop that topic, right? So, my idea was I'm going to disrupt the show a little bit and show some gas chamber footage and put the music up loud. And this is the investigation that I did at Pilgrims Pride. Why don't you play me the sound of billions of bees being murdered? I know that animals get pills and why can they eat peas? They're screaming to death. Right. Look at them. Face them. What do you think bees do? Face them. They're screaming to death. He wouldn't look at the phone. So, Pierce is like looking at me. I'm showing him in and I can see he's looking at me in the eyes but he won't look at the phone and that's why I started to call him a coward because he was looking away. What do you do when you murder them? They get killed by mice. Bees don't get murdered by me. What am I sure you're talking about? He wouldn't face the pigs. This is gas chamber. Look at it. No, no, no. You don't even want to look at it. They get slaughtered. You're a coward. You look cowardly. Look at that. I know that animals get slaughtered so that I can eat animal meat. I stuck this camera in this gas chamber in the UK at Pilgrims Pride and they scream for their lives in every single animal welfare charity her against me. Here's my problem. Here's my problem. And you're baking and you promote it. He promotes meat, right? And he doesn't even know what he's promoting and he doesn't care about... Maybe if he actually looked into this a little more, he might take a little bit of a back foot on it. Maybe he'll look into gas chambers. Maybe he won't. Maybe he prefers to keep his head in the sand. Maybe he'll look more into pollination and try to get another gotcha. You know, he promotes something he doesn't really know the seriousness of it and I just hope he does look into this a little more and just pulls away a little bit from promoting the meat industry because, man, things that he's accepting implicitly by promoting the meat industry, some of the most horrible things on earth. I love bacon. You promote it? I love bacon. And you say you're against that? I love sausages. I love it all. I love eating meat. You love animal cruelty? Yeah. I got him there. I said, you love animal cruelty? And he said, yeah, gotcha. I'm prepared to admit I love eating meat. You're not prepared to denounce avocado and almonds. Because you're making up stats. Eatings. They don't get spoiled. He wants me to denounce almonds and avocados, which I don't really see a reason to, but he won't denounce the meat industry, even though I've just shown him gas chamber footage. Actually leads to the extermination of millions of bees. Final word to John. Yeah, they want to keep the bees alive. They want them coming home. It's not slaughtering them. In fact, if you want to talk about slaughtering them, sometimes our honey bee producers in the honey industry will cull off an entire hive or a bunch of hives. That would be more like slaughter. John, is there anything that would persuade your mind to let vegans in? Just obviously he'd be a fantastic guest in your restaurant. The only time I'd go to this guy's restaurant is to bring some gas chamber footage into show as customers. It's just discrimination, isn't it? Thank you, Pierce. I do apologize. I do apologize. I don't hear you, then. It's just absolute childish behavior, discriminating against the whole group of people because of one little silly complaint. Go ahead. Joey, when's the last time you laughed? Joey, when's the last time you laughed? The thing about Pierce, all right, Pierce has got his narrative off camera. He was quite nice. Like, you know, I shook his hand and I said, long time no see, Pierce. You know, we had a bit of banter and it just seems like he's just hung up on this vegan thing and it's just a constant trope for him. What I really didn't like about Pierce is when he got all of a manual rebellion on and just completely bullied her and ambushed her, didn't let her speak, then ate a burger in front of her. That study in Oxford, is that exactly what it is about? It's not in the permit. No. Anyway, look, I'm starving and you're not going to persuade me and my response to you destroying all these things is to have a picnic because you know what? It's a free country. It's a democracy and I'm allowed to eat meat and I'm certainly allowed to eat meat when someone who kills bees to feed the avocado, have it? Minds. What we're asking you for the government is to support farm... And like, I could see her getting a little bit teary and she, it was just terrible and I just didn't like seeing that. Him saying, hey, Joey, when's the last time you laughed? I think he was trying to like lighten me up a little bit. This was my response. Last time I laughed, when I heard you say that, all bees are slaughtered because of avocados. It's an absolute abject lie. It's an absolute fact. And you can't, facts don't care about your feelings, Pierce. It's an admirable fact. He's saying bees are slaughtered for avocados, which is just not true. It's not factually accurate. You could make claims like bees die during pollination in some sort, like incidental deaths happen during pollination or during transport or something like this. Or they get exposed to this pest or this pesticide or they get exposed to this virus. But they're not getting murdered, are they, mate? This isn't a rights violation. Moving bees around, this isn't an animal rights issue. It's not a negative rights violation. They're not murdering all these bees for an avocado. Like, you know, this is what you're perpetuating. And, you know, and you see that he's seen him smiling a bit. It's an absolute fact. It's an absolute fact. Pierce, mate, you're hilarious. See his face is kind of smiling. I can't get over this bit, man. He's trolling, dude. Hard. He's trolling hard. He's the king anti-beacon troll. And, you know, the funny thing about it was that last time I laughed, I've laughed three, four times in this conversation, Pierce. You haven't noticed? When's the last time you laughed? Well, since your memory lapsed three seconds ago, dude. And facts don't care about your feelings, Pierce. It's a niable fact. Facts don't care about feelings, mate. Barrow and mites, mate. So he should be anti-barrow and mites. I want to see on his t-shirt next time, Barrow and mites murder bees. And he should be out there campaigning against the Barrow and mites because they're murdering so many bees. 50% of them are killed by just the Barrow and mites alone. You know what I mean? Yeah, John, final word to you. Hey, John, final word to you, mate. Final word is, how many vegans does it take to change a lightbulb? Go on. None. They all prefer to stay dark. Well, wait for the punchline. Look at him. Look at this guy. Despise this dude, eh? Axel, tough around, like, Oh, vegans come tomorrow. Absolute shell of a man, this guy. Just a coward, animal abuser. Like, you know, look at him. Look at his profile picture. Dude's a b***. But, like, I wanted to ruin his little punchline. You know, look at him. Trying to make a stupid joke in the face of all this abuse and I've just shown gas chamber footage. What about vegans like to stay in the dark? You like to stay in the dark, mate. You don't even know pigs are murdered in gas chambers. And if you do do, he probably does know. He probably doesn't give a s***. You know, you too want to stay in the dark. Vegans are actually more in the light than all of you's put together. And if it was anyone who cares about the bees, it's the vegans, right? It's going to be the vegans. If it's anyone who's going to care about some animal issue, it's going to be the vegans. True? Or is it going to be you two meathead buffoons who stick corpses down your throat? What's the punchline? None more? Oh, you want to hear the punchline? Do you, Pierce? Oh, did I ruin your little s*** joke? Did I, mate? Sorry, buddy. Sorry, mate. Go have a cry, mate. Do you always prefer to stay in the dark? Go have a cry about the complaint. I said to him, you know, like, go have a cry, mate. I had no time for this, dude, to be honest with you. And if anyone thinks I'm going to sit there, well, this dude, this idiot, right, this absolute idiot, coward, snowflake, no more abuser, taking photos with dead piglets, banning all vegans. You think I'm going to sit there and treat him with anything less than contempt than you're talking to the wrong activist? Go have a cry about it. Actually, the other one I like is, how do you know when someone's vegan? Look at Pierce, he's noticeably uncomfortable. That was the fakest laugh I've ever heard in my life, Pierce. Mate, as well as the award for the Ronaldo interview, you should have also got an award for the world's biggest fake laugher, biggest anti-vegan troll, and the biggest fake laugh I've ever seen, trying to make him feel better. And look at him. Look at this guy's face. God, you think he thought that was funny? He fake laughed. Don't worry. I'll show you a gas chamber footage. Don't worry. They'll soon tell you. And then I ruined his too. How do you know someone's vegan? They'll show you a gas chamber footage. Play pictures and stuff of people screaming. Oh, pigs being murdered in gas chambers? Well, they won't play you. Is bees being murdered? Oh, Freudian slip there. They're like non-human people, aren't they, these pigs? And I think I flustered them a bit by interrupting. You met his match a bit here in terms of his aggression, because you have to go at Pierce fiercely. Otherwise, he'll talk over you and he is powerful in his voice and he's quick on his toes. But I think I, because I was interjecting here when they were trying to make those stupid jokes and humiliate me and vegans and humiliate the animals. I was interjecting with my own little sound bites, ruined snowflakes, a little meat flake here's a joke and then a ruined little Pierce's little finishing joke. Joey, great to see you. John, thank you for joining me from birth. Go vegan, Pierce. Oh yeah, go vegan, Pierce. Joey, great to see you. When I left, I actually said to Pierce, here's the date of Pierce. They're not actually being slaughtered, so can please at least change your rhetoric a bit. You know, they're not being murdered. And he goes, look into it, look into it. And I said, I'll see you next time, mate. I actually got some vegan donuts from Donut Time and brought them all in for the staff about half a dozen for them. Really delicious ones too, filled with Biscoff cream, everything. I said, I've got some vegan donuts. Start there for you, Pierce. You can take one if you like. And he goes, I'd rather shoot myself. You would rather shoot yourself than have a Biscoff filled donut. Like, what does it matter with you, dude? You find drink in Pierce, but you don't want the vegan donuts to bring you. That's just, he's just a contrarian. He just does everything the opposite to what he doesn't like. If you're a vegan, I don't want to eat that, but if Bear grills, I'll drink his piss. You know what I mean? Oh God, it's just hilarious. Horrible violence and cruelty in animal rights violations. No joke. It's the most sick, disgusting thing you've ever gone on to witness, right? That's all fine, but incidental deaths in bee pollination, mate, that's horrible. Vegans are murderers. So let's look at some of these comments. This is on Pierce Morgan's channel. So I won the comment section. I actually won the comment section. So these are all black because I've given them my own little like. So if you want to go to like the top comments, actually, if you'd like to see the footage, I was showing Pierce. Let's just put that there. I don't want to over woman. Anyone want to find my comment? Like it to the top. I'm not a vegan, but Pierce definitely didn't destroy this vegan. Pierce is a little embarrassing here and has no idea what he's talking about. Top one of the top comments. I'm a meat eater, but the vegan man made Morgan look like a fool going on about bees, but ignoring other animals being killed. Where's the part where Pierce destroys the vegan? Because they actually called this Pierce. Morgan destroys vegans, but not caring about all animals rights. And people are just asking, when did he get destroyed? This is a very good example of how a journalist should not behave, appalling to witness such a degree of professional corruption. Imagine thinking you actually destroyed someone by such a poor, poor argument. I wish Pierce Morgan would let his guests finish their arguments before presenting his. Pierce Morgan is doing more for the vegan cause than anyone. I'm not vegan, but would never have a moan at them for caring about animals. I don't think this went how Pierce thinks it went. I'm not a vegan, but it sounds like the chef needs to learn to handle criticism better and Pierce needs to learn what the word destroys means. This should be the top comment actually. If I held my breath until Pierce let his guests speak, I'd be dead. Wrong title there. It literally happened the opposite. That one there is probably, I think that's one of the top comments actually of this whole video. I'm not even vegan, but Pierce and that chef were insufferable in this interview. I honestly think the vegan guy came out so reasonable and I'm no, and no, I'm not a vegan. Someone's hit the nail on the head here. Pierce doesn't give a about the bees. I think Pierce actually got destroyed in this one. Problem with Pierce is he sits there, asks questions of the person he disagrees with and then constantly tries to interrupt them while the person is answering on top of putting words in their mouth. Then he sits there and lets the guest he agrees with have their say uninterrupted and taking as long as they wish. He ain't fooling everyone with his tactics. In this case, I think everyone in this interview, including Pierce, are full of it. Oh, everyone? Okay, so he started off good and now you think I'm full of it too. Why am I full of it? Joey won this debate. You can see how Pierce is trying to hide his anger and annoyance, but his face speaks volumes. Turning to fake laughter to try to win is very immature. Yeah, that was a fake laugh, dude. I don't think I've ever seen a more misleading title. I feel bad for Pierce if he seriously believes this is true. I don't know if Pierce titles these videos. I don't think he manages the social media, to be honest. And if that's the case, this reinforces the nation that kind of are the ones who prefer to stay in the dark. I think they should leave the title. I like the title. I think this is great. It's clickbait. Bring people in to the conversation. I think this is what the kind of title that draws people in for views. Now, this debate has 300,000 views, man. So good. Don't get me wrong. The people at the Pierce Morgan show are really nice. And Pierce is actually nice to me off camera as well. Me and him disagree vehemently on animal rights. He has been an insufferable bully to most vegans he brings on the show. He couldn't bully me around, right? And I think there's a common respect there. The comment section is against Pierce on his own platform. I'm going to say this about Pierce Morgan, okay? So, Pierce, if you're watching and even if you're not, I'm still going to say it. What Pierce Morgan actually does takes a lot of courage actually. Me and Pierce disagree on many different issues, okay? Animal rights being the main one, but a bunch of other issues as well. I've also seen Pierce do very fair interviews and actually do quite good journalism at times as well. It's just when he gets people on, he vehemently disagrees. We don't want to let them talk. He interrupts him. He ambushes him and he bullies people that he knows he can. And he trolls people a lot too. So, there's two sides of Pierce. But what I will say is that Pierce Morgan gets on people that intellectually disagree with him. It's not just people he knows he can win against as well. He often gets people on that are going to win against him. So, I made a video a while back where I was calling Macau, would you only get people on that you know you're going to win against? Well, I stand corrected. They got me back on. So, good on them. Cosmic Skeptic was even doing a debate with Pierce Morgan on the monarchy before me. And now Cosmic Skeptic is an intellectual person and Pierce had two against one. Even Pierce's own comment section was against him in my video and I think in the monarchy video as well. But Pierce still goes out of video after video after video gets all of this criticism, right? Puts himself in high-pressure situations live with people who are experts in that field. And you've got to respect that. Then there's a lot of things I don't respect about the way Pierce carries himself. 100%. He's a god. Pierce, you're a proud animal. So, let's face it. You don't give a damn about the abuse that happens to animals. I mean, if you do, you're hiding it, dude. Or you just don't want to admit it because then you'd have to be compelled to change it, wouldn't you? But yeah, if someone who gets up on a public platform like that constantly challenging them themselves every single day with people who disagree with them and intellects who disagree with them and then posting it on your social media that takes a lot of courage. It actually does. And so that's one thing I'll say about respecting the respect that I have for people like Pierce Morgan who can just get up there, get wrecked in some of his debates. And he doesn't get wrecked in all of his debates. Sometimes he comes out on top. Sometimes he has really good points about things. But a lot of the time, he uses cheap tactics, you know. But yeah, so there you go. That's my positive feedback to Pierce Morgan, even though we disagree on a bunch of topics. What he does takes a lot of gusto. And if you don't think so, then try getting up there yourself. People have a lot of opinions about what they would do up against Pierce Morgan in the vegan movement and things like that. Go and give it a crack. I guarantee you that 99.9% of people would be publicly embarrassed in a situation like that. So before you sit there and go, hey, Joey, you should have said that. You should have done this. Why didn't you do this? Oh, I would have done a heat spreader, which I've got one today. I'll read it out to you. Where is it? Just an annoying know it all, right? Pierce are a piece of, but Joey can't handle it. He can't. He should be more prepared. After so many years, he should be taking this opportunity differently like Ed Winters would do. Ed can hold his own. I'll give him that. But in that kind of situation, you have to interrupt. You have to be forceful. Otherwise, you're not going to get a word in edgeways. And Pierce has got a very good strategy. And if you think you can do better, mate, why don't you get up there and do it? I said, I bet my life on it. You would crumble under the pressure of being ambushed, interrogated, and interrupted on live TV while outnumbered. Easy to talk from the comfort of your own home. But I guarantee you, Pierce would have publicly embarrassed you if you were in my position. So pipe down your little hater until you can do better. If you think you can do better, get up there and do it. You got to remember, you're getting ambushed on live TV. He's constantly berating you. He's not letting you answer. You have to try to block his voice out of one ear and try to get a point out. And it's always 2v1. That's my little response video to the Pierce-Morgan debate. It's a long one probably. But yeah, what do you guys think down below? I just want to thank the staff at Pierce-Morgan for being so accommodating, knowing that I was going to get ambushed by Pierce. But I knew what I was getting into. And you know, Pierce, I thought he would disrespect me and the animals by eating meat in front of me, but he didn't do that. So he shouldn't do it anyway. But that's at least a consolation. And if Pierce would, I would like Pierce to have a longer form discussion with me, maybe 20 minutes, like he did with Dalvince the other day. And let's get into these topics with a little bit less heat and a little bit more nuance, you know what I mean? And maybe he can present some of these arguments and we can discuss them better instead of him trying to just corner you and ambush you and just interrogate you and interrupt you constantly. So yeah, thank you all for watching. What did you guys think? Leave it down below. And I'll see you all in the next video.