 It should be working. Hello, hello, hello. So the previous one didn't record. I don't think so, actually. Do you need it or you don't? I don't need a microphone just to amplify the sound, because it's a small broke. But I'm just wondering, because all the screencasts are recording, and then it's not recorded, probably. Let's go to the screen. End screen. Here it is again. Do you have a laptop to connect? Do you have a laptop to connect? Yeah, I have a laptop here. One, two. Yeah, it's a bit odd giving someone a microphone. It's not working, you know, actually. Oh, it's going to come across. Oh, hello. Okay, that's interesting. Did you take this one for lunch? The adapter, sorry. Hey, how are you? We just arrived here. Oh, was that mine? No, no, no, no, no. Oh, were you there before? Yeah, that's me. Did it record last one? Yeah, we have recordings of that. Oh, if this was working, probably, yeah. Yeah, I was just explaining, because it's not going to actually project anything in the speakers, because it's just a small room. It's for the recording mostly. So it'll be a much better audio quality to do. Cool. But you need this for the duration? Yeah, for this talk, yeah. No worries, I'll leave it with you then. So that was Drupalese Marketing, and I need the other presentation now. That's Drupal5Benefits, all currently organized. Hey. And there was no issues last time? Sorry? There was no issues with the technology back then. Yeah, let's get this to PC for you. Yep. Da, da, da, da. It's like looking at something. So long as you're getting e-mails about this adapter, I came in here thinking it would be here, and it wasn't sound. Yeah, oh no, that's right. Two seconds. Two seconds. Oh, sorry. It's coming back that way. Yeah. There we are. Fantastic. Anything else? Are you okay? I'm okay. Brilliant, I'll leave you to it. Yeah, thanks. It's all right. It's missing ten minutes and five minutes as well. That's right. Ten minutes? Have to wait ten minutes? No, it's missing ten minutes to the end. Oh yeah? That's fine. Yeah. We need to do it. Yeah, all right, all right. Thank you, sorry about it. Cool. It's red now, instead of... You can't even leave it on the table, and it's gonna be there. Now it's green. It's green. Mara? Yeah. All right, now it's taking notes. You're gonna take notes? Yeah. All right. Okay, I'll put you on the sticker. Uh, yeah, I got to put it on. All right. Okay, you're on the sticker. Take it for sure. Yeah. Excellent. Thank you. Is that where you want to put your stickers? Yes. Okay. All right. That was yours. Yeah. Hello, good to see you again. Let's start in minutes, or... So, all right, let me start. Um, some of you have seen my previous presentation about why Drupal needs marketing. Um, this presentation is about the five minutes fits to get organized as a local Drupal community. Um, my name is Michel Vanvelde. I am the co-founder of One Shoe, a digital agency from the Netherlands. Um, I started with Drupal 12 years ago, over 12 years ago, and was one of the co-founders of the Dutch Drupal community. So, I've been around for a long time, and for those of you who were not here at the last presentation, I'm not a coder, you know, I don't code. I'm a marketer by background, but I fell in love with Drupal over, so, years ago. Um, so, I'm gonna tell you about what the benefits are to get organized as a local Drupal community. Um, and first we go into a bit of history. Um, the slides are, there's a lot of text on the slides, and I've done this on purpose, so it can be distributed easily via the internet so people can read afterwards, you know, what the story was. Um, okay, so, in the Netherlands, um, on 16 November 2007, the first Drupal GM was organized. Um, it's like a Drupal camp, but then only in a day. Um, it's basically, uh, people from the Drupal community came, they all came together, uh, to talk about Drupal, and actually it was a small classroom with some pizzas, and there were sharing ideas around, you know, how to, uh, well, basically drove Drupal and adoption of Drupal. Um, I attended the second Drupal GM, and that was at a university, and there was about 12 people sitting there, 12 to 15 people, and a stack of pizza and boxes, you know, they were discussing about Drupal, and suddenly this guy comes in, in a suit, and he says, yeah, I'm here for the Drupal GM, you know, I found it somewhere on Drupal.org, and there's a, it's supposed to be a jam, but I can't find it, so as well, there was a piece of boxes, he said, who are you? He says, well, I am, um, an IT manager from KPN, which is one of the largest telecommunication companies in the Netherlands, and said, okay, you know, if those big boys are interested, maybe we should professionalize the way we organize the Drupal GM. So the next time I started organizing the Drupal GM, I created a roll-up banner, and like, okay, here we are, you know, and I created classrooms, actual classrooms and breakout sessions, and we had presentations, so, and we left the pizza boxes for afterwards, you know, and I started professionalizing it, and started growing adoption of the Drupal GM as well, and promoting it properly through other channels than only Drupal.org. Eventually, the Drupal community, you know, with a whole lot of help from the community, drew to now over 500 people in the Netherlands, and that's quite substantial, quite big. But as the events grew, money was needed for locations, and, you know, I had my bank account, and, you know, okay, so I decided, okay, we need some responses, you know, and there were seven responses where, basically sending money to my private bank account, I didn't feel comfortable with that. It's like, okay, this is community money, which should be given back to the community, it should not be in my personal bank account, so I wanted to create a separate bank account for the community, and came up with the idea to get organized as a local association. So we set up the local association. That was organized. So, on Friday, March 2010, such Drupal association was officially announced. And let me see. This is the first Drupal jam, you know, sitting there with pizza boxes and stuff, and then we got the roll-up banner, and it grew even bigger, and eventually we had large venues, you know, with trees at the time, attending, you know, the local events and local cultural events and stuff, before he was heading out to the United States. So the local association was founded, and it was organized by other Drupal community members, and they were only organizing the Drupal jam, and I thought, okay, there's more to be done. You know, if we want to grow the developer community, if we want to reach out to new potential clients, we need to do marketing. But, and I addressed the local community, the local association, like, okay guys, we need to do marketing, so we're marketing, you know, we're just organizing the event, you know, we're here for the Drupal jam, and that's it. We need to create more adoption, you know, and so I decided to get organized from a marketing and business perspective, and I founded the Dutch Drupal Business Foundation. And there was a bit of a shocker for the community, because hey, well, we have our, we have a local association, and now you're having the second association, purely for business reasons. The interesting bit was that the local companies, the local agencies, the Drupal agencies, were like, hell yeah, cool, so now we can start promoting ourselves. So we got around 35 agencies to chip in money, and suddenly we could promote ourselves at large tech events. So there was Adobe with the booth, and there was Cycler with the booth, and suddenly we had a huge roll-up banner, and I still remember one, you know, the guy who made it a bit too big, it was a roll-up banner, it was about three inches high, so it was a huge one, you know, and we had to stabilize it before tipping over, but our booth was bigger than Cycler and Adobe, and they got scared, it's like, okay, now this is scary, you have an open-source community, and suddenly you are commercially, you know, promoting yourself, you know, it's never been done before. So that was, it was really cool, and some of you had a lot of clients, you know, enterprise clients, large clients coming to the booth talking about Drupal, and how we did it, I'll explain later, because you probably wonder, like, okay, how do you do this commercially, but I can explain this later. So we introduced the, what we call, Stichting Drupal Bedrijf Nederland, which is the Dutch Drupal Business Foundation in English, and we were really happy to set it up as the, from a legal perspective, we were signing the contracts and stuff, we got a bank account and money came in. So what we did, actually, we knew there was a demand for new professionals, there was a demand for drawing the pie, and I gave a talk in the Netherlands about the blue ocean and red ocean theory. I don't know if you know the blue and red ocean theory. It's a theory, in short, we have a blue ocean, there's one shark swimming in that blue ocean and there's a lot of fish out there. So the shark is the Drupal Agency, there's a lot of fish, there's a lot of clients. And because he's happy, he's getting fat, so he's growing, and some of these other sharks comes in this ocean, there's a lot of fish here, and another shark, and another shark. And in the end, there's so many sharks in this little ocean that they start competing for the same amount of fish, and then they start attacking each other. And whilst they're attacking each other, you know, there's blood coming out, and the blue ocean turns into a red ocean. And I foresee, at the time, I foresee that for some, that we had to grow the number of clients because the number of agencies were growing. So we had to grow the number of clients as well, growing the pie. And it was a really famous chat we had in Belgium with a lot of business leaders there, so we had to grow the total pie and how are we going to do this? Well, this is basically what the Business Foundation did. Okay, so we had to attract new clients and increase the market share in Drupal as well. It increased the market share in Drupal as well. And it worked. It actually worked. There was a bit of friction with the community association, because they were doing the Drupal Jam, and suddenly we were really successful. And that spurred them into action. And they came up with a hell of a lot of ideas on how to work for the local community. They started organizing training days, which was awesome. They started and invented the Splash Awards, which was, from a marketing perspective, awesome. That brought in new clients and a lot of PR. So after about two years, we decided to merge all together into the... Oh, sorry. Okay, so we merged them into one association. What really was important at the time is transparency and trust. If you decide to chip in money, me as an agency, I chip in money to the local business association, and they start promoting Drupal at an event, what's happening with the leads. You know, because there's large companies coming to the booth, and we made an agreement. That's all about trust and transparency. What we did was we created flyers. I'll show you some examples later on. And we shared those flyers with all logos of all participants on it. And at the booth, we were not allowed to have our private business garden with us. We're not allowed to give them away. We're not allowed to talk about the agencies we're working for, because at the time, at the booth, we were working for Drupal. So people were asking us, okay, so which agency are you working for? I'm sorry, I'm not allowed to share this, because it's not a control thing, and we are working for Drupal. And it worked. It worked really, really well. You know, even when participating agencies would join us at the event or passing the booth, they would not share their business cards. And we actually grew the pie. And more agencies came in, and more larger clients came in. So the transparency was really important. And then we merged into the merging two foundations into one after about two and a half years. And now this is the end result. You know, we have a massive community. We have huge events in the Netherlands where business and community are joined together. This is the Drupal Gem, and it's basically like Drupal Camp. We have sponsors involved. We have businesses coming in, having talks. So let's discuss now the five benefits. So what are the benefits of having a community? Well, basically your benefit. You know, when you get organized as a community, it creates transparency about who's doing what and for what purpose. I know in the UK there's been some discussions about organizing events. There was a couple of agencies working together organizing events. And the rest of the community is like, hey, why are we not part of this? There is also been discussions about the number of camps in the UK being organized at the same time. So they started competing with each other over camp issues. That's not how you work to organize a community. So the transparency and the open source of it, that's really important. So Drupal can be promoted through a variety of channels, and financing this can be done via local associations. So the second one is growth. I was telling you about this before. Growth is needed. From various perspectives. And Drupal, you're probably thinking like, okay, you need growth in terms of revenue and that kind of stuff. No, I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about number of developers, which is really important. We have to grow the number of developers. I see a few great people here, great have, I'm getting great as well. So we need new people coming in, with new ideas, fresh ideas, talking about new technologies, how can we have React and Drupal work together, all that kind of stuff. So yes, we need to foster and grow the community. So we do not age as a community. Growth can be realized by organizing local tech events and promote Drupal at local tech events. By recruiting new developers, by organizing tech talks. There's a lot of ways we can generate growth from a central point, through a local association. So there's a lot of benefits for the community, for the agencies, and for Drupal as a whole. Because if new developers come in, that means new contributions will come in as well. All right. So knowledge about what works and what doesn't work can be shared amongst local associations as well. So we can foster growth around Europe, or globally. So this is interesting as well. For example, we started in the Netherlands with the special works, and it was a huge success. That resonated into Denmark, and now Germany is organized special for the second time in Austria, together with Austria. So, and the special works, that basically generated a lot of PR for the projects that were sent in. And we had a lot of happy clients. That's what everybody wants happy clients. But we had proud developers as well. And I still remember when I was at the first Drupal special that was organized in Hamburg. And I was sitting there, and I saw this huge website built for I think it was Fitness First, or yeah, Fitness First. I was like, are they on Drupal? That's an awesome project. And I was really proud to remember that. Everybody within, you know, in their room looking at the special works, and all the projects came out like, wow, you know, this proudness, feeling like that. That was fostered by and organized as well. And so yeah, please share that ideas throughout the local associations. Okay. I've been talking about, and this is my previous talk, about Drupal news marketing. I'm not going to show you the examples I gave in my previous presentation on how Drupal is represented throughout Europe. But if you look at local associations and the local communities on how they present themselves, some are okay-ish, some are appalling, some are, well, not even promoting themselves, you know, and they don't speak the same language. They don't resonate the same, how do you say it, the same benefits for the end users. They don't speak to the different personas. Because we have different personas we're talking to. We're talking about the CMO, the CTO, we're talking about the developers. And everybody is doing something, but it's not orchestrated centrally. And it's not shared throughout each country on what works and what doesn't work. So we should work together on a uniform presence so every country is telling the same story to its end users and the different personas. That's really, really important. Okay. Then there is efficiency in organizing events. By creating a network of ambassadors throughout Europe, we can also create a network of event organizers. So this morning I heard those keynotes, you know, really touching story. In two weeks' time there's a trooper camp in Essen. Why can't I get that same story over there? There are tech talks. There's a lot of technology talks here today. And every camp developers start creating new presentations over and over and over again. So how cool would it be you're from Pakistan and you organize a camp in Peshawar. So you have this awesome talk for example at your camp and you share this throughout through the investment network of the local association. I get this awesome talk about this subject and a local developer from either Germany or the Netherlands or France or Italy says it's a cool talk. I adopt the same talk saves me a hell of a lot of time so I can spend it on contributing code but I don't have to make the whole presentation myself about this guy in Pakistan or a girl in Pakistan already made it for me and I'm going to tell that same story because I believe in it. So sharing presentations could be a way of sharing knowledge and make it a lot more efficient than it is right now. So we don't have to produce similar presentations the whole time. Alright. Then there is a attracting talent by organizing and promoting training days. We organized training days in the Netherlands we had about 200 students from local universities attending and we had a training day about how to set up your Drupal installation how to start programming your first module how to do the basics I'm not a programmer but I've been listening and it's a hurdle for a lot of developers to start with Drupal and by organizing training days you can get them over that first hurdle and get them enthusiastic. So this is a new way of a local community can create standardized materials to attract new developers, organized training materials and training days and showcasing of course you know what cool projects can be realized with Drupal. So yeah, training really important and if we organize it centrally in the UK there was a story they organized trainings really cool trainings if we can share this through the local association the world you know that's drawing the community that is Drupal as a whole yeah I was talking about it I was telling you I had five benefits of organizing a local community but there's six and I already told you guys it's the Splash Awards Splash Awards is definitely amazing the stuff that happened when we started organizing the Splash Awards in the Netherlands the feeling of pride amongst developers amongst the clients and I told this in my previous presentation we won at a time as an agency the Splash Awards for DHL and DHL was so proud like oh wow we won an award we invented the award ourselves to be honest but we had an independent jury actually going through all the projects and we won it was really cool and then they published the fact that they won an award in their global newsletter and suddenly the whole world knew that the Netherlands was running on Drupal and the rest of the world was running on Adobe and then it became interesting then boom when they had the qualities it became interesting in what we were doing we were really proud of all the successes we generated for a hell of a lot less money than we would spend on Adobe so yeah so Splash Awards has a lot of benefits on it and I suggest start organizing it do it but you need sponsors for organizing it locally and then it's wise to have an association so all the money goes into the association local association with a bank account so it's all transparent so please start organizing it it's awesome and you'll love it so I'm going to give you an example this is the German business association in Germany basically this is what they state on their website we have the deepest need to work with the community to create ways to empower Drupal and expand the opportunities Drupal developers use for Drupal developers and companies we consider a functioning and healthy Drupal market to be an essential part of Drupal's continued adoption in all areas likewise we understand Drupal companies as an important integral integral part of the Drupal community which could not exist without each other in this successful form so what they're stating is yes we're part of the community but there's also business needs and we have two closely worked together and they're doing it they have regular talks with the local because in Germany the business the business association was started besides the local association there was already a community association so now there's two association but they're communicating which is good but there's a stronger focus on business in Germany so when you look at the purpose the German business the Drupal business Germany E-Vow sees its purpose in promotion and dissemination of the open source content management system Drupal in Germany the Drupal business Germany E-Vow works closely with the existing organizations such as Drupal E-Vow to complement them meaningfully so there is they are working together the community focused association with a different focus so what are the goals there's a whole list actually and it's challenging the marketing of Drupal has business solution representing the Drupal business community at trade shelves, conferences and other events the promotional Drupal for potential customers and influences promoting collaboration between the general Drupal community Drupal users and professional service provider as well as national and international association that specifically or generally support or promote Drupal the support for further education and training measures in the Drupal environment the provision of marketing materials to position Drupal in the commercial market the direction and support of events to increase the market share of Drupal as well as the operation of internet sites for marketing of Drupal and Drupal service providers so if you decide to set up a local foundation I would take this list as a guideline this is good this is good stuff you're doing okay so when we started I remember this we kicked it off because there was a symphony con and symphony con offered the business association to have a booth over there to promote Drupal which is good because then you can attract new potential clients and new developers so we created a a booth which basically told about okay what is Drupal and how can you promote it so it's flexible it's open source, it's an active latest version and we had flyers as well so talking about what Drupal is and this is basically our first well basically way of communicating Drupal from a commercial perspective in Germany so we had a lot of quite a few agencies stepping in from day one so it was about nine of them and we had a flyer and all of those agencies they chipped in money so we could create the booth send the booth over to Berlin where symphony con was and we had a lot of these flyers so if you're looking for a Drupal agency just pick one and google them find them and see which is preferably the agency of choice so we also had a website www.drupalagentulm.d this is where we started with we now have a different website because we chose not to become an association but in Fehrin which is a foundation in English so here we are at the booth so this was our first promotion effort at the symphony con and then we started organizing the splash awards this website is built by Emo Internet in German and is now being distributed is it going back to the Netherlands as well now or is it going to... it's open source so if you want to organize the splash awards it's open so we start sharing already the website for the splash awards and it's going to be behind it and then we had the splash awards which is from the Netherlands and Germany mixed together or is it just the Netherlands no, I think it's a combination it's a cool event we had clients there all being pumped up we had dinners before with the clients that we moved in are we going to win it yes or no and we had them jam promoting it and it's just a fun night and you'll see a lot of really cool work passing by because I'm not checking the website of my competitors every day you know what kind of cool project but you just sit there and see it pass by and everybody is really really proud so it's a hell of a party and I would suggest to organize it for yourselves and it will generate like free publicity this is the Thunder one a special award as well Thunder is an open source platform built by Burda yeah, it's a large publisher they have a distribution a publishing distribution and they won a special award for it and they published it and the reach they had as a media company was outrageous so this is cool work for Drupal as well so I would suggest if you're up to it you can start talking to your local community and talk about setting up a local association the reasons I already gave to you there's more than five reasons to do so and the good thing is if you get organized and you create transparency and you start collaborating then you won't have fights amongst Drupal camps you know in London in two weeks time there's one in Germany already we should have a centralized point when are you going to organize your camp because London is competing now with Essen in Germany that's not the good thing so we can centralize it and organize it in a better way and this can only be done by local associations so I would suggest please start setting it up you can talk to me so if you're interested in learning more about setting up a local association like the Dutch Drupal Association or the German business behind and how we promoted Drupal at local tech events and organized special works please contact me I can get you in contact for example with Buddy or with Boris who's been doing it in the Netherlands so yeah just contact me we'll help you set it up locally and we'll be happy to help you with that and provide you with all the tooling like a website, template and special works templates and material that's it thank you very much any questions or should we just let's do it so any questions regarding setting up a local community or local association is anybody here from any local community in Pakistan yes my question actually was should we have a country-wise association because Pakistan is a large country or province-wise so one is better or we should be more granular into it I would suggest I've been to Pakistan and yes there are regional differences between Balochistan and northern Pakistan and I would suggest to have one local association even for India for example and India is even bigger than Pakistan United States that's a different question it's huge I would suggest to have one authority association that helps local user groups in organizing events and centralizing that's what I would suggest so one association per country we talked a lot about the sharing between the Netherlands and Germany did that come about at an individual level or is there some kind of well that was I'll say it started at Drupal Drupal, come Barcelona I had no idea we were chatting and just like hell yeah, let's do Germany and we did it and now we're sharing a lot of information and now we're thinking okay, what countries are next and can we do this globally this is what we are talking about it's awesome if we can do this worldwide wow that would be awesome so that we can have and talk to for example I've created a persona interview for the CMO and chief marketing officer and I've written a story and I can send it to you in Pakistan and say hey man, I've written this I've published it on the Dutch website translated and it could be interesting because there are cultural differences and other languages but we can start sharing on a professional level now we're just doing something and everybody's thinking we need a website and just create a template and I'm going to provide my account here yeah, but there's more than just promoting your account so let's start sharing let's do it alright, so who's been involved within a local association? I have another question I've got a question I have a question when you first set up with a few companies how did you agree on how much you've achieved like everybody between the same that's really interesting discussion we had a discussion at the time okay, should bigger companies pay more we decided not to the reason why we wanted to because if I pay more do I get a bigger logo that's the question we had you know is my logo on top because I pay more we wanted to get rid of all the discussion in the beginning 500 euros a year in Holland that's an okay price I don't know in other countries what the acceptable level of money is but it was 500 euros we are now a couple of years later and I think it was about four weeks ago we had an agency leader dinner currently in the Netherlands there's 50,000 euros in the bank account because profits was made actually on the camps and they were saving money because now we can start hiring a full time PR agent to do PR and marketing for a group of professionals because we are just a bunch of open source I'm not a geek but market here open source market here but I'm doing this on a voluntary level but we have now so much money come in and it says okay then we have 50,000 euros but after a year that's gone let's raise the bar who's interested in paying 1000 euros 35, 40 agencies now 35, 40 agencies so if you chip in 1000 euros we can hire somebody part time to do PROMO and we'll benefit and it's an independent person as well so awesome so we're raising the bar and becoming even more professional so what if somebody doesn't can't afford the 1000 euros anymore yeah do you mind sorry how do you manage to grade the company we just sat down with all the agency leaders everybody agreed everybody agreed so it's not into effect yet it has to be written down blah blah blah but yeah that's how we did it so it's basically a vote this is a very sensitive topic I know that I think that we are going to have a meeting now with a group of Germany business foundation and we'll be talking about the prices and then this is just always like we can never decide on it because we don't know what is the right solution to start with you can only just agree with the group that you're working with as soon as it grows you have to adapt the thing is you have to match your goals as an association with the funding you have because if you stay in your vital debt you are going to represent Drupal at large events and the largest event for example in Germany will cost you around a minimum I think of 50,000 euros so it's a dream to be there if you chip in with 12 agencies 500 euros then you have 6000 euros and you can't be at large events but it could be a wish or a goal you want to reach so you have to look where your business goals are and how you're going to achieve them because the same thing you can do is that you can also for 6,000 euros you can buy ad-worth campaigns in general about Drupal and guide them to a Drupal centralized page and tell more about Drupal and guiding the potential buyer in his customer journey towards the right agencies different ways to spend your money but difficult discussions I would suggest to start small in Germany we start small as well 1 event, simply con 50 euros each a lot of them are going to Berlin and we just sat there and it kicked it off and then we started organizing these cash awards and I think we charged 50 euros per nomination 15 25 euros for convention specimens so sponsors and also what we were thinking a lot of this for example we were talking about the mesco conference in Germany which is really expensive in no way that the little one next internet and one shoe that little companies will ever be able to be there with a booth but together we can be there to be the booth we did this from the Netherlands our 40 agencies to be able to create a whole house at the mesco in Germany the dream would be like somebody said why do we have crowds sponsorship for Drupal Europe some agencies that are just smaller and they cannot do the big sponsorship but why do we not do this together 10 of us and then we can actually have the booth and we do a program together and together we are stronger as an impetus that's the idea behind it that's what we are trying to focus on I think you mentioned if we do this so I'm actually surprised that it's not there because I've been having challenges trying to work to fix that local community so I was always thinking maybe I'm the one that's finding the resource but it does seem even though the organization of it is discussing it now what you're talking about getting templates out we have templates already so for the the website we have templates for the special awards and more it needs to be done the flyers even that's what the German association we have to come to your website it's not on Drupal level like Drupal.org no it's not on Drupal.org that's the word that we created as part of our Drupal.org where it's like we try to post it there and see how it works out so there are now talks going on how can the Drupal association be a part of this and Drupal.org that's discussions we're focusing on any other questions shall we do it yeah from which country are you from where are you from Kenya Kenya and you live in live in London, is there a local association yet we are trying it it's a bit snow but we're trying cool, excellent you guys and local association yet are you guys going to do it we're looking into it for a really quite a while we tried it three years ago and we ultimately dissolved how much should we pitch in and that's my question from my community discussion and some people were I'm just a one person agency I can't pitch in anything so look at Drupal Germany, the community foundation they have I think it's 250 years of your company and 50 years if you're an individual so they have an organizational membership yeah they go by a solution yeah the problem is also it's all in German so how should you find it yeah we're from Romania at the moment so I'm on quite the Drupal the Romanian Drupal organization for so cool I'm just getting my hands in we'll see how this goes and at the moment we have two major events in Romania, Drupal Camp Transylvania and Head Camp one is inclusion, the other one is in Bucharest the main problem I would say is that your organization is in the capital city in Bucharest but then again you have these small companies that are not in Bucharest so what are we going to do with smaller companies you can promote them you can promote the only companies it's just that you need a seat for example the seat in the Netherlands I think it's in Harlem it's not even in the capital but events are organized throughout the Netherlands by the local association and they support the user groups they support the tech talks and promote the tech talks they do a lot of promotional effort in fostering the community and then local events so the location is to my knowledge not really a problem it's just that you need a place to register the association but it could be anywhere what I've seen and that's a major critique in the region is that you have an association but then again that association is not that focused or implied in the local community so you just promote yourself as an association but for example in the case of Transylvania the event was organized under the logo of the Magnetical Campus Association but then again it was a company that organized it and they just needed the association to pass all the procedures so that's what are you saying that the company that company was taking the benefits commercial benefits of organizing the event and promoting it via the association they were taking the benefits but then again they've had little to no support from the association oh yeah okay you will do that yeah okay so so that's why a strong organization in which more community members are working closely together you know with no direct involvement from a company and then we said events are being organized but it's always saying this is sponsored by not organized by it's sponsored by yeah so the company will change the direction and make it more like the community and not that much available yeah well that was probably in the Netherlands the Netherlands was sleeping at the time so they were organizing the Drupal Jam but there was not a lot of things happening and I said okay if you don't do it you know we just set up a separate foundation and that basically kicked them into fast forward modes I don't know so in Germany I expect to merge within a couple of years anyway I expect that to happen but just for that there's a difference of what you can do as a non-profit foundation depending on the country that you're working in or you're doing this in so in Germany there's so much limits on the community foundation or the community association but there are certain things that they cannot do for example do a lot of events and have commercial effects so therefore we had to create the business foundation just for that purpose too so it's also like all the legal problems that you have and then you have to figure out how that works in your country like do you need for the non-profit and profit status because we all it took us half a year to figure it out we were even told this foundation just do a normal company but then we said like no it's too difficult because we're going to have shareholders and we don't want that but that's just too complicated but we have a profit foundation we have a non-profit foundation because a non-profit foundation has like by law that they can only do certain things and for example certainly not organize flesh and words and promote companies and cases so the private foundation that depends there will be a lot of them I've got to finish it up my time is up but I'm still around until about 5 and then I can get to my airplane later on this evening unfortunately I was flying I hope they're flying otherwise I have to find myself so thank you very much if you have any questions I'll be around or just contact me alright cheers tickets tickets yeah free tickets 3 drinks ah I'm leaving bummer your name is very hard do you still have hockey matches no no no no it's fine something to get it so is this your connection alright that's right I'll just use it then I think I'm going to walk off to yours yeah you should have the local money right but we kind of got it and you know in Europe we have something yeah I don't know his name but I kind of spoke with him as well about this but then recently what we found last year what happened was there were like 6-7 cities they're all trying to kind of organize a camp and it all date class so that didn't happen so Gova didn't happen last year just because of this date and I started the conversation again let's ignore the money part let's ignore some kind of logistics part at least have someone representing from each city just to sort out every year who's going to do when that's good but that's the start of getting organized but like do we have something that I wanted to ask is there any process like I know in individual countries there are different process registering association but other than that part technically how would you register as a company do you have any other guidance we should follow let me see if I can together with Boris can help you set it up because what you need you need your goals which are presented to you these are your goals this is your vision and yes we want to work with the community because it's really important to work together with the local community but it's and we want to get organized and not in each other way so if you have separate cities or areas that are going to get one of those people in the board so you can start working together right and then there's a toolkit you know start organizing special work start organizing training days or things like that there's a person like I said I'm currently based here but there's a person who's attending even today he's working for a company in India he was the kind of guy who easily started this idea have you spoken to him? I'm organized as the CEO the agency Pius is the one I can handle I can talk to Pius Pius and there are a few other guys that are actually cooked from Mumbai I think he's from Delhi Argoa but there are like a guy Chennai Chennai he's part of the board I can talk to Shyamlal about it and see if we can organize I already talked to Shyamlal about it because I sent this email and I spoke with Shyamlal on the phone last year when Mumbai camp happened because then people from Goa came to Mumbai camp realized that there is a clash they just didn't admit they did this year it would be nice if we can start moving I'll see if I can create some more I didn't in the Netherlands so we sit outside because at what time are we going to give you a presentation? 3 so we've got 3 minutes so we're going to sit down and do your interview because these guys are going to interview me you're starting to know this is so awesome I will try to follow you I have your name on it do you want my business card? yes sure cool take care take this one once you take it once after it just starts blinking because they said once after it starts once you take out once after it starts blinking it does double brush