 Welcome, everyone, to the Depression 2 Expression podcast. We have Dr. Andrea Orta back with us again to talk about mind-gut connection, diet, food, and mental health. This is so extremely important, my friends. We need to know, and she gets into specifics as in what kinds of foods to eat, what kinds to avoid. We get into a little neurochemistry, and, you know, I explained this in the podcast. If you're listening, that's great. The audio is going to be throughout the entire episode, obviously, but if you're watching, what we do is we travel back in my condo hallway, and we're going to use the whiteboard to just write down some things. So as you're listening, the audio quality is going to change a bit. That just means we're walking through the hallway, and we're using my camera's microphone rather than these beautiful yetis. So if that's cool, sit back, relax, and enjoy. Now since I don't have any sponsors and there's no ads on the podcast, maybe I'll say this podcast episode is brought to you by Deodorant, or some. How's that for a pitch? Also, you know, I have to say thank you every single episode to the patrons that make this possible to our Depression to Expression members. You can join Depression to Expression at Patreon.com slash Depression to Expression, a couple bucks a month, join our live streams, join the discussion, join exclusive podcast episodes. What Andrea did actually is she did a specific video just for members after this, a 15-minute video answering their questions. Yes, the more you give, the more you get, my friends. Not just for Depression to Expression, but life, of course. So sit back, relax, and get ready to learn in three, two, one. Okay, everyone, we are back in a part two with Dr. Andrea Horta. And she is here on the couch, different angle for everyone. For those of you who are listening, we're going to be obviously doing this via audio, obviously, because you're listening to our voices right now, but we're also going to use the whiteboard behind us in my condo to just show a few things. So if you really want to see what we're doing, we'll feel free to just jump over back to YouTube while we're doing the whiteboard stuff and doing some dietary... Interventions. Yeah, dietary interventions. Okay, so for the first episode, we spoke a lot about obviously mental health and just some quick tips for people with their diets, what they're eating, to actually have that mind, like mind-gut connection. Mind-gut connection. Oh, those are connected. 100%. Both ways, bi-directional. Yes. Okay. They confirmed it. Research confirmed it. Research has confirmed. So I had a really, really troubling, and it made me sad. I did a community post on YouTube, and I just said some quote-unquote motivational words, just what I was thinking. And someone said, you know, your words are nice, but they're not good enough. At the end of the day, people with mental illness need medication. Wow. And I was like, that's such a sad story to hear that we don't know that there are other options of it. Yeah, or other support. I actually just videotaped this. So I was walking, this is a little interlude, but I was walking to your house. I saw a sign, and it said, road closed. Okay? And there was no way you could get through that road, impossible. And I stopped there, and I was like, I'm going to videotape this, because just because one road is closed or one road doesn't really work for you or one road has you feeling a certain way doesn't mean that there's other possible roads that you could go on to learn. So literally you could dig a tunnel and go underneath the road block where you feel you're stuck with your depression and your anxiety. You can go and look for another road next door. You can take a plane over. The point is there's other interventions, and if you only keep in that little area of possibility, then you don't see other possibilities, and there's so many other doctors and researchers doing work that can help, right? Well, exactly. And, you know, people, they get defensive when they discover something new, because they automatically don't believe it. Like I was shocked and almost scared and disappointed in myself, where I'm like, oh, there's other things other than pharmaceuticals for depression. Oh, chemical imbalance isn't really a thing. And there's basically so little evidence for that when that whole thing came out and, oh, all of these pharmaceutical drugs and these testing. It's obviously funded by the pharmaceutical industry. There's just a lot of layers that we need to discover. And again, just as you said, there are other roads and other options. And it's just cool that we're able to discover that with the power of the internet and people like yourself. Right? It's amazing. It is really cool. And I think it's important just to say that, like, as a naturopathic doctor, I'm totally for medications as well, not against anything. I just think that in this society, we've kind of lost touch with what's important and what's important is the patient, right? So if you're going through a flared up situation, then yeah, you should be on medications because you need that support. And who knows you and your doctor can decide how long you're going to be on that support, but then there's other pieces of support that can come in just like going to counseling, right? Just like doing yoga, doing meditation, doing your nutrition, really fixing your brain from the inside. Those organic foods that we can eat that can help your brain. So there's so many different things that can help where our medication is just one part, right? Yes. So that's that holistic approach, too, which is great. You see your clients, patients where they're at and you work from there. And what you do with your patients, too, is something that I haven't really experienced with a doctor, to be honest, like not a family doctor or not a naturopathic doctor is you actually do like some counseling when you see these people? Scott, that's a secret. Oh, you don't have to say the specific names, but it's not like you just they come in and you're like, OK, take this and this and this. You want to learn more about them. Is that fair to say? I'm totally I'm just being sneaky with you. 100 percent, 50 percent of what I do is counseling, but it's counseling body, mind, energy. And it's just based on the stuff, the tools that I've learned and how I've helped myself, everything that I do with my patients. I've done it on myself and it helps me. And so I try it on them and see, maybe this is one tool that will help them, too. I'm not there's no guarantees to anything, but. But this is what I was going to say to you. Remember, we were talking about this, the most important part of you getting better is you deciding that you're going to get better. That is the key. It doesn't matter whether it's a pharmaceutical medication or it doesn't matter if you're doing acupuncture. It doesn't matter if you're seeing only a psychologist. It's you, your decision inside your body, you talking to you. Sitting in meditation, saying, OK, I've had enough and I'm 100 percent committed to healing, no matter how long, even if it's going to take 10 years to heal my brain, I'm committed and I'm doing this. And I think that's when the change happens. When you finally say, I don't care what this doctor's telling or this doctor or this person, I'm not listening to them. I'm listening to me. I'm committed to getting better. I'm going to lean in and it will happen. That's so powerful. And I wish I never like it took me years through depression and all that to learn that. And now that I learned that, I'm like, oh, my God, it's you. It's you. It's not me. Right now, a healer like a healer just activates healing in you, right? Because some people are like, oh, you're such a healer. And I'm like, no, I'm not a healer at all. I activate healing in that patient, but they have to want to do it. Right. Right. So I think, you know, we want to get through a few things, a few really, really important things, but the first thing before we get into that really quickly is, you know, the last video and whenever I, even when I do video sometimes people are like, that's a cool idea or glad that works for you. But where's all the evidence? Show me the evidence and we have evidence. We have tons of evidence. But also what's wrong with trying something on your own and not digging into the literature so much and just seeing if it works for you? Yes. What do you think? I love that. Like you, you're an inspiration at this because you were doing the whole fasting. You were trying the fasting thing out, right? Yeah. So I, that's the number one thing that I say to patients all the time, whether there is evidence, whether it's a folk, whether it's just one case study, whether it's a friend of yours that tried it and liked it. You won't know if it applies to you, if you don't really give it a try. Right. So number one, you have to try it on yourself for a certain period of time. And number two, if possible, be properly managed, have either a naturopath, a therapist, a medical doctor, have someone guiding you through that change because you want to be able to talk about how you're feeling and you want to be able to properly assess it. It's not just, okay, I'm going to, so for example, fasting for your brain. If you just fasted all day for 30 days, then what? I mean, you want to do a proper assessment before make sure you're feeling good all the way through, maybe check in with, you know, that, that doctor, whatever, and see it through. Yeah. That's the best, I think. Right. But we shouldn't wait. You can't simply wait for all of the evidence to pile in. So it's a hundred percent sure and safe and then safe in quotation marks and then to finally do it. There's evidence. That's the beauty of science. There's evidence continually coming in and then other evidence that contradicts this and you're constantly, you can't just wait. You have to take the thing is you have to take action and see what works for you. I think that's what safe action. Safe action. Yeah. And that's what we're going to talk about today. So as far as research and action, people can take towards their mental health when it comes to something other than another road, other than classic pharmaceuticals. What are we talking about today? OK, so really quickly, just before we start to this, just remember that everything I talked to you about is for general information. It does not replace assessment, treatment or diagnosis. You got to go see a proper doctor disclaimer. You got to go actually see, sit with a physician to do that. OK. Now that that said, we can say whatever we want. Yeah, exactly. So let's hear we go right now. I'm reading from an article called it's from the front frontiers in psychiatry. And it's a mini review that happened in May 2019. And the title of it, it says, what is the role of dietary inflammation in severe mental illness? And it basically reviewed all experimental and all observational studies and a couple of main points that I just wanted to I'm going to read them. And then we're going to talk about them basically, right? So number one, it says severe mental illnesses, including major depressive disorder, bipolar disorder and schizophrenia are associated with increased inflammation. Given diets role in modulating inflammatory processes, modulating means changing. So given diets role in changing different inflammatory processes with excess calorie dense, nutrient deficient processed foods. Intake may contribute towards the heightened inflammation observed in these severe mental illnesses. This review assesses the evidence from observational and experimental studies to investigate how diet may affect physical and mental health outcomes in people with severe mental illnesses. Cross sectional studies indicate that individuals with small with mental illnesses, particularly schizophrenia, consume more pro inflammatory foods and fewer anti inflammatory nutrients than the general population. Then other cohort studies indicate that high levels of dietary inflammation are associated with increased risk of developing depression. But there is some lack of evidence for schizophrenia and bipolar. So what is it? I guess we can just kind of like sum that up. So core studies indicate that high levels of dietary inflammation are associated with increased risk of developing depression. So very interesting. They've so they've done a lot of work for the last few decades with omega three. So that's the one thing with fat intake and brain health. That's the one thing that is really studied and a lot with B vitamins too. But this is really recent. What year is this? This is 2019. This is May 2019. May 2019. Yeah. So basically, they're trying to say that pro inflammatory foods, foods that increase inflammation are linked to the severe mental illnesses. And then they're saying inflammatory foods, sorry, anti inflammatory foods will reduce those symptoms. Beautiful. This is like in several, several studies. Yes. OK. So what do you want to get into certain foods? Like what what would be considered for those watching? What's an inflammatory food that's going to cause inflammation? OK, because that's what we have on the board over there. Yes. Yeah. So things that cause inflammation. Well, specifically from this article, it was saturated fat and simple sugars. Simple refined sugars, saturated fat, saturated fat are fats that come from usually meats, right? Like heavy meats. But I mean, I'm talking about like the meats that you're it's conventional meat. It's meats that are fed, like, for example, if you have a cow, that's like, I don't know, at a farm or whatever. And meanwhile, they're inside a factory and they're being fed corn or they're being fed wheat, because we know that corn, wheat, soy, canola oil, those are specifically like like really bad inflammatory oils or foods. And so when those cows eat it, when they eat corn and wheat, they actually blow up like you can actually see if you look online, you can take a look at like a beef that from like a cow that eats grass, which is an omega three food versus a cow that eats corn and wheat. You'll actually see a big difference between the two pieces. One looks very swollen and very wide and big, full of fat. And the other one's very lean. So an omega three meat, like if it's a grass fed cow. So when I go to Portugal, all the cows are outside of eating grass because of the temperature, right? So we're always eating high omega threes, right? It's probably one of the reasons why my grandparents in their nineties, they still have great brain function. It's crazy, right? But meanwhile here, we're getting meats that are like basically forced into these factories and these factories, they're feeding them corn, they're feeding them wheat. I remember I talked to an Alberta farmer and he said, yeah, he's like, we have to fatten them up in a short time. So that's why we feed them all this extra wheat, just to like blow them up. Just to actually be able to export them and get people fed. What's wrong with, you know, the canola oils and vegetable oils and these refined oils? Yeah, that's what's used all the time. Like the Beyond Meat Burger, people are just so convinced this is this save the earth, save the diet kind of food. Yeah. And it's like all canola oil. It's like the second ingredient. Yeah. So with canola oil, I remember one of the research papers I had to do for school, it goes through 32 steps of processing. And one of the steps in canola oil making is bleaching. And so you sit there and you're like, OK, so if it came from the canola, like a plant and you actually got pure, pure canola oil, it would have a little bit of omega three. Right. But because of all the processing, it actually changes into an inflammatory oil. And it just because it's so easy to use, because when they manufacture it and they process and they make it thinner and longer or whatever, it becomes inflammatory, right? And they can use it in everything. Soy bean oil is actually one that's used a lot. Corn, soy and canola. Well, there's a lot of soy is just in Ontario. So much soy that's grown just for that specific reason. Yeah. But, you know, I'm ignorant to the fact where how these oils are actually processed and made. But it seems to me like canola plant versus olives. It seems easier to extract oil and fat from an olive rather than a plant. Just seems like a fattier substance. Yeah. Like, you're like, right. So it just seems to me like the olive oil, but the olive oil is completely different fat. It's not an omega three. So I think it's an omega nine. OK. So it's still it's still anti inflammatory. It's still very protective for the cells. It's an antioxidant. It helps with healing of tissue. Like, olive oil is amazing, but it's still not it's still not an omega three. OK, so that's why we have a list of like what omega three is exactly. But yeah, why is it so important for us to get all this fat? So you're saying simple carbs and that refined sugar. Not great for brain health. Why that's what this document says. Anyway, it says saturated fat, simple carbs can affect the system. And then they also found that high diets high in fiber and high in vegetables reduced inflammation. So diets high in fiber and high in vegetables. And that's something that I like. I ask every single patient to put fiber on their food. And they're like, how am I supposed to put fiber on my food? And like, if you're steaming some vegetables or if you're doing a stir fry, you just buy some psyllium fiber or you buy inulin fiber or you can even do flax seed fiber. Flax seeds is an omega three, right? And you can just literally just sprinkle it on chia seeds. That's the fiber as well. Literally sprinkle it on. But remember with fiber, you want to go really slow. But if you try to give yourself too much fiber, you can get sick because fiber actually binds toxins in the body and will carry it out. So I had one patient who got like literally he just took too much fiber at one time and he was very nauseous and ill. And I was like, that's your body detoxifying. You know, so that's why you have to be really, really gentle with fiber. Like I would suggest if you've never had fiber on your food, one teaspoon per meal, one teaspoon, that's it. OK. But high fiber really makes a difference. And you know what? This totally connects to our first talk because if we feed your body fiber, if you put fiber on your food, fiber feeds your bacteria. That's it. It doesn't feed anything else. It doesn't get stored in your body. No, it goes and it's the fuel kind of like pupae and spinach. It's literally fuel for your little bacteria. That's what it does. And so the bacteria gets strong because it's eating this fiber. It then turns out to have a de-inflammatory process. Like it kind of calms everything down in there. And your body can start making more acid and more enzymes to help you actually break down your food, right? Because the stronger your gut environment, the better your digestion, every time you eat, guess what's going to happen? You're going to absorb more nutrients. Your brain's going to wake up. Right. We spoke about, again, that's perfect to last time. We spoke about people not actually being able to absorb these nutrients because the microbiome is just completely out of whack. Yes. And no wonder, right? Because this says high fiber will improve your depression system. Exactly. And we're, you know, with high carbs, refined sugars, we're not getting like, come on, we're eating bread and we're having processed foods. We're not giving our bodies what it needs to actually function and to have our brains working at an optimal level. So why is so fiber amazing? Why is fat so important? Remember how the years of the diets of a low fat diet? That was like the thing. And we were saying, fat is so bad. And now we're reversing that saying, no, we need fat. Sugar is the enemy now. So why is fat important in our bodies now or more in our brains? Well, I mean, your brain is made up of 60 percent of fat. We're all fatty creatures. Your brain could probably float. Like seriously, it's made up 60 percent fat. And that's when we talk about what types of fat we talk about omega threes. Omega threes. We wrote it on the board, but the type of omega three that you really want is something called EPA and DHA, your body. I think your brain actually has higher amounts of DHA. I don't know exactly the ratio, but it's higher amounts of DHA than EPA. Those are the type of omega threes. It's a really long word, so I'm not going to try to pronounce it. But those omega threes are what actually keeps the inflammation in your body down and it keeps everything down. You name it, every inflammation from your brain to your gut, to your joints. Right. And then also the fact that those little fatty acids, that the omega three fatty acids, they actually make the membrane of your cells. So let's say your whole entire body has millions of trillions of cells. And each one of those cells, if this is like, actually, we can, you can look at your egg. Imagine this right here on your shirt. Oh, I might have an egg on my counter. So like this is your cell, right? Yes. Outside of the egg is the fatty acids on the outside. And it's like a membrane. It's a thick membrane that wraps around each cell. And those membranes are what allows for communication between the cells. So, so messages can be sent. So electrical like exchanges, you know, energy exchange, not just every cell in the body, including all of our neurons to have those smoother synaptic, that communication between neurons. Every single cell has a fatty acid layer, including the brain. So like it affects your immune system and affects your hormones because you need fat to make hormones. It affects everything. Your mood, you name it. It affects everything in your body. Energy exchange. You need fatty acids. So obese people are the healthiest then. They have the most fat. Yeah, no, because depending. Wow. I'm just, I'm just asking, I'm just throwing it out there. Usually if a person is, has obesity, obesity is actually considered an inflammatory disease. And why? Because of the fact that they have inflammation in their body because the types of fats that they've been intaking, or the high sugars that have turned into fat, like that is what's caused them to be in an inflamed state. So high sugars, processed foods, all that stuff, or like even having basically not having a good balance of food. So in other words, if they just eat like pasta, or if they just eat cereal, a lot of people just eat cereal in the morning, that's going to cause an insulin response, a hormone insulin response. Insulin is very inflammatory. Okay. That guy going off, he does, he does his job. He's trying to protect you to keep sugar out of your blood stream, but it is inflammation. That's the opposite. We're talking about Omega 3s, which are anti-inflammatory. Good fats versus bad fats, or then refined sugars, then being stored as fat. Okay. And that's huge because a lot of these foods then that we're talking about, that are, you know, we talk about the fibers, complex carbs and fats, those don't cause as much of an insulin spike. No, not at all. Fiber actually does the opposite. When you eat fiber, it actually slows down your sugar absorption. It keeps you sustained for longer. So when you start having fiber in your food, you're actually going to feel pretty full for like a longer time. Beautiful. Whereas like a sugar, refined sugar, it's very fast molecule, so it absorbs and quickly, quickly, quickly gets used up. And then all of a sudden you crash and you're hungry again. That's the same thing with sushi. You eat sushi 30 minutes later, so full, but 30 minutes later, you're hungry. Yes, that's right. It's all the carbs, all the sugars. Well, so with cereal though, what they tried to do is like all brand, they'll brand it as a high fiber cereal, but there's still nothing, like you need fiber and something else then, right? Yeah. So the fiber, the all brand cereals, yes, they do change your fiber numbers 100%, but I like this is my own opinion and I don't really like my patients eating, I don't like them eating out of a box. If it comes from a box, if it comes, if it sits on a shelf or I don't know how many years, okay, what do you think it's doing for your own internal gut, right? Because it's not a natural plant. If you buy, for example, psyllium fiber or flaxseed fiber, it's actual plant that's been ground up. And so when you eat it, your body knows exactly what to do with it. But if it's a cereal that's been processed and milled and a lot of the nutrients from the actual grains have been pulled away and they've added these things in, right? And most cereals have canola or some type of processed inflammatory oil. So you're getting the fiber, but really it's not, it's not the right, I would not be my first choice. You could have it, but it would not be everyday choice. Right, not an everyday choice, not to start your day off with that. You know what really frustrates me? Is someone who's trying to be more health conscious is everything, if it's, if it is in a box, sometimes maybe I'll want some granola or something, but there's always added sugar in everything. There is added sugar. Any cereal, you look at all brand, there's actually a lot of added salt in these cereals too. But what if I just want a granola? It's like always added brown sugar and always added this and it's just so frustrating that I can't help myself from just, OK, I just have to stop buying these boxed things and I'll just go to the produce aisle, I guess. And so why do you think they do that? Yeah, it's addictive. Yeah, because it tastes good and you want to eat more and more and more. And then you remember how good it feels because every time you eat sugar, there is a release of dopamine and serotonin. You feel good. So you have these brain chemicals telling you I feel good and then you're connecting a feeling with the food and all of a sudden you want to go back to that feeling and you know the food can get you to that feeling. But then the wear and tear on the body and the inflammation over time. It's not good, right? Yes, that's like what I remember I was telling you about, OK, this is a really embarrassing thing, but I'm going to tell you guys. So the Nutella store opened up. This is like such a long time ago, but I'm going to tell you anyway. So basically the Nutella store opened up. I saw it and I was like, oh my God, I have to have Nutella. So I went there and I had one meal with Nutella. It was a really bad idea. I decided that I was going to have another meal because I was like, oh, it's so good. It's my first time here. So I had another meal the next day. I went back and I had two more meals with Nutella. This is so bad because aid has high, high processed sugar and it has vanilla and vanilla and is an MSG, which is really bad for the brain. MSGs are killers for the brain and mood. And you're also having the Nutella on bread. You had a waffle with that bread and croissants and stuff like that. OK, so you were feeling good, though. So I felt amazing. Yeah, when I was eating and I felt amazing, I went back because literally it brought me back there. And then when I stopped after that second day for one week, I was sick with so badly sick. I couldn't go to work. I couldn't go to school. I couldn't do anything. I was sick. It felt like the flu, but it was just my immune system just got knocked out with the amount of sugar, had no motivation, had no focus, had no energy. It was awful. Yeah. So I think that a key is we have to go through that to know, but we need to listen to our bodies, too. I had at our car working space. You know, I didn't have a big enough lunch protein. I didn't have enough protein in my lunch. My sister brought me a lunch and I was just like, I'm hungry. So I went to dollar M and got a pack of nibs, like the licorice and felt good for like 15 minutes. And then the rest of the day, like from 3 p.m. until I went to bed, just dull, more anxious. Like it's just the connection is so clear to me now. And we have people on our Patreon community. If you want to support the channel, patreon.com slash depression to expression. And we're going to be doing a Q&A with Andrea, Andrea on there, just to answer some of their questions about diet and mood. But there's a few people that have just switched from processed and like high sugar foods to just I told you one of them, David and he's just he's changed his life and he's and he loves salads now. He likes like chicken salads and he has some steak and he has like high fiber veggie just and he's doing so well. Yeah, I know. I like so good. It's just those stories of stories like this. Yep. And like the added bonus is when you start eating for your brain or eating for your health, your mental health, your body changes, too. Like most of my patients, if they came in with anxiety, depression, they've lost weight. They've lost 18, 20, 22, like one patient lost 28 pounds. And she had to get off other meds, too, because it just didn't help her body anymore. Right. Right. Great when you see those changes taking action. So great. Yeah. So do we want to move to the to the whiteboard and show people? Yeah, sure. Or we can. Oh, yeah, because this is the last one, right? Yeah, let's do it. OK, so everyone listening, we're just going to go to the whiteboard. So the sound's going to change just a little bit from the good mics to the camera mic for those of you watching. Come for a tour in my condo to the whiteboard. So let's go. OK, we're following Dr. Andrea. Yep, just turn on that light there. OK, so walk us through what you have on the board here. So we know that in research, low omega three is linked to depression, anxiety, it's linked to bipolar. It's linked to ADHD, autism. So when we're looking at fat in the brain, we talked about this already. Omega threes are your EPA and your DHA. It causes pentanoic acid in this other one. Anyways, and 60 percent of your brain is mostly fat. So that's important. So that's what we need fat in the brain. We need to eat healthy fats. That's why it's so important to end. In general, we were talking about the omega six, those other corn, soy, sunflower, canola. These are all omega six fatty acids. And normally in the environment, you want to want to you want to one to one. It's normal to have one to one. But because of all the, you know, what is it, factoring, farming, farming, all the process stuff. Now we're like most research will show that we're a 10 to one, omega six to omega three. And some research will even say we're 20 to one. And meanwhile, this is where we need to be in terms of being healthy. And it's interesting because Scott asked me, why do we need omega six and omega three? Because I think it's it's found in almost every food has a little bit of a balance. But omega six is kind of like it's, it's what is it, pro inflammatory? And whereas this one's anti inflammatory, hopefully that makes sense. So omega six is pro inflammatory and we want a little bit of pro inflammatory because it kind of protects and goes and kills some bad cells. Does that make sense? Kind of like a plant has a protection protection mechanism. Our cells are the same way. So we need a little bit of omega six, but we need more omega three now only because the ratios are off and the ratio is off because of all the processing. Right. All the foods made with corn, all the foods made with soy, just like you were talking about the meat, all this vegan meat. Like I get, I try to get people off of that. Like it's so much better not to be on a regular because it's too high low, too high omega six, especially for the brain. Right. So when we're talking about omega three, some of the key, key, like easy foods to go for is any type of wild fish, any type of games, game is like venison, bison, grass, bed, beef, anything where they're eating grass outside. Right. Algae has some omega three flax seeds. And then, um, you know, Scott and I were looking up some nuts and like hep hearts have omega three walnuts, cashews have really high omega three macadamia nuts. I'm still on the fence on that one. And there's something from Peru. I just learned about it. It's called Sacha Inchi. Sacha Inchi. Sacha Inchi. It's like a really small little, it looks like a nut. It looks like a peanut actually. And it tastes like it. I had 10 in a row and it made me so sick because it's so high in fat. It's so high in omega three fat. So it's the highest omega three source, but it's a seed. It looks like a peanut, but it's actually a seed and it's so cool. It's a super food. You only need like two or three. That's it. You don't eat like a, like a regular peanut open in your mouth. No, you just have like two or three and it's more than enough. So these are all ways to get omega threes, right? And that's why we need fat for the brain. So do you want to talk about protein in the brain? Let's talk about protein in the brain. So I think, no, this is great. Okay. So hopefully you guys got this. Why we need fat for the brain is because the brain is made up of mostly fat. We have your omega three types of fats. That's what we want because they're anti inflammatory. And we know that inflammation is linked to all our brain conditions on top of other conditions like obesity and other things like that. So hopefully you guys got that. Hopefully you got low omega, dropping the omega six, dropping these foods. And now we're going to talk about protein in the brain. I talk about protein all the time because I do a lot of weight loss as well. And protein is, if we start, let's say a piece of turkey. Andrea, can I put you on the spot? Yeah. I'm going to put you on the spot. So a lot of, a lot of those oils are great because they have such high heat tolerance when you're cooking. Yeah. What else can I, what else can we use for cooking? Oh, I love that question. Okay. So this is kind of my little trip tips for cooking. Okay. Number one, one of my patients taught me this in a pan. If you're using a pan, you put just a little bit of water and then you add your olive oil. So what are you burning on low heat? You always cook on low heat, but what are you burning if there's water first and then the oil's on top? Yeah, you're just burning the water. Yeah, exactly. But everything's still, the food is still getting warm, right? And you're always doing, so that's one technique. Another technique is using avocado oil. Avocado oil has a higher temperature, higher boiling temperature. I don't know exactly how much it is, but I do know it has a higher. Some people don't really like it. It's a little bit expensive. But, and then number three, you can use coconut. There are so much discrepancies on coconut. So I would just, if you can just buy an organic form and also cook it on low heat, because I think it's still denatured. That's my own personal preference because oils, they heat up, right? But this one specifically does have a high temperature. So that's what I would do. And then the other thing that I do all the time is I steam and I bake. And I don't put any oil at all. I add it afterwards. So the olive oil that we were talking about, that's anti-inflammatory. It's great for your brain as well, but it's not an omega-3. That olive oil, you drizzle on your food after. So your food's done afterwards, then you put it on top. So steam, bake, and then put it on top. Beautiful. Yeah. Awesome. Yeah, that's great. So those are kind of like little tips and tricks. And it really works because you can actually taste your food. It's kind of weird, right? Yeah. Anyway, so when we're talking about protein, this is an example of protein. It's turkey, right? Everyone had turkey. Hopefully, hopefully people had turkey for Thanksgiving. And when you eat turkey, what is, it's a protein. Protein breaks down into what? Amino acids. Oh, of course. And there are 17 main ones. And so amino acids are the building blocks of everything in your body. It's building blocks of your skin, of your muscles, of your brain chemicals. Do you remember what the brain chemicals were? We talked about what the fats and the neurotransmitters. Neurotransmitters. Yeah, brain chemicals, the same word as neurotransmitter. Neurotransmitters. I know they used interchangeably in medicine. Beautiful. Brain chemicals and neurotransmitters. So we have the one that you for sure know about, serotonin, right? It makes you feel happy. We have dopamine, which controls how your motivation, it controls how your energy. If you feel tired, a lot of people say, I can't get up. Usually they have low dopamine. Gabba. Have you heard of Gabba? I have heard of Gabba. Gabba is another neurotransmitter. It's like a stop sign to your stress. How does it two Bs? No, one B. As soon as you start getting stressed, you feel tension, especially during anxiety. When you're feeling anxiety, you get tension in your neck, your shoulders. You don't even take a deep breath anymore. When Gabba gets released in your system, it says, stop. I don't want to get any more stressed. The cells are relaxed and you're able to actually come down a little bit from that anxiety. Gabba is amazing. Then the other neurotransmitter is something called acetylcholine. Acetylcholine. This one is for our focus, attention, and memory. Fam. Okay, so we have one, two, three, four brain chemicals. All of these are really, really important because these guys, dopamine sends messages to motivate you to get you to concentrate on things. Serotonin sends messages to your stomach, telling you, hey, be happy, be content. It actually controls your appetite too. People that have really bad serotonin usually are like hungry all the time for some reason. And Gabba controls your stress response. And then acetylcholine controls the focus, attention, memory, everything having to do with your brain. So all of these are so important and what do we need to make all of these? So we start with protein. Protein gets broken down to amino acids and amino acids make these brain chemicals. Beautiful. Does that make sense? So for example, dopamine, one of the amino acids that dopamine needs to be made is something called tyrosine. I know this is like a lot of words here. Serotonin, for it to be made, you need what? You probably heard of it, 5-H-T-P or tryptophan. Serotonin is the actual amino acid, but this is the next, like after it breaks down, it makes this. Gabba needs an amino acid called theanine, have you heard of that one? I haven't. It's found in green tea. Oh, beautiful. Green tea has really high theanine. And acetylcholine, number one source of acetylcholine or the molecule for it or the amino acid? No, I can't remember. Is it choline? I think it is choline. I'm going to double check this. But anyways, it comes from organ meats. Organ meats, really, really good. So all protein, every single protein gets broken down to these little amino acids, many different amino acids, and they are the building blocks to your brain chemicals. Right? This is fantastic. What about, I thought coconut oil had a bunch of fatty acid chains, fatty acid amino chains. Yeah. It's a fat, it's not a protein. It's called a medium chain triglyceride. Yes. So it's a type of fat. It's not. They're not amino acids. They're not amino acids. No, amino acids specifically come from protein. So completely different. This is a fat. This is a whole, that's a whole other topic because it's a, the length of fat compared to the omega three fats. So anyways, it enters the brain, it enters the liver a little bit differently so we can talk about that another day. But this is really important. So we have fat that's really, really important for the brain and then we have protein that's really, really important for the brain. Why? Because it's the building blocks. So even though we're giving medications, medications are awesome, but we need to make sure that your structure, your foundation of your brain, of how your body actually uses these things daily is there. And one, a doctor that I follow, Dr. Mark Hyman, he wrote a book called the Ultra Mind Solution. Actually, I have it here. I'll show it to you. The Ultra Mind Solution. It's such a cool book. I really love him. I've seen him at conferences. He's written tons of other books. He has an amazing podcast called Doctor's Pharmacy. If you guys ever want to listen, like as much information that you want, like take it because he's, he's awesome. He's done the work. He's an MD in the States. And so he talks about this all the time and it's so, it's so true. It's like, it's like going back to the basics. What are the basics? The basics is how your brain is actually formed, right? So what's really interesting, this ties into our first conversation. When you eat people that eat protein, right? Usually it's, you can eat protein and then you kind of feel like you don't get anything from it. And this is usually a question of digestion. That's why it's really nice to work with someone that can like assess your digestion because to break down protein, you need really high stomach acid and you need some enzymes. So if you are eating lots of protein, but you're not really feeling any changes in your brain, then that's because probably your stomach needs some support. And that would make sense for people that are under stress because whenever we have high, high stress, whenever we're in fight or flight, go, go, go. You're being chased by a bear. What happens is your stomach turns off acid. It turns off enzyme secretion when you're under stress because you're, you're running away from a bear. It doesn't want to help you digest. It just wants to get you out of there. So you'll see this pattern very often. Yeah. What about probiotics for, for that, for these enzymes? Does it, does that affect your acidity levels in your stomach at all? Yeah. So that ties into, remember when we talked about a gut and brain and remember when we talked about fiber, when you eat fiber, it feeds the bacteria in your gut. So your bacteria gets stronger and then it can make more acid and enzymes because it's a healthier environment in there. And so when you take, when people take probiotics, you have to be really careful what type of probiotics you take because there's a lot of stuff out there. But probiotics is just giving new bacteria into that gut environment. And so the gut and the bacteria gets healthy, gets stronger in there. And then yeah, you can make more enzymes and more acid if it's a healthier environment for sure. So, okay. So what are some takeaways? Okay. I think that's important. What's the action? The action for omega threes is increase this. So I would love to see minimum once a day you're having a high omega three meal. For myself, I have two meals of fish daily. And if I don't have a meal of fish, then I take an omega three supplement, right? Like an actual fish oil. And there's so many different types and we can actually do a talk on the different types and like what to be careful with. But if you're not going to take this, then you have to get it in a supplement, right? Because you actually need to have high omega three to change the brain, to change the inflammation. So I would say at least two servings a day of one of these. So wild fish, grass, bed, beef, algae is kind of hard because you'd have to like buy the seaweed and like throw it into things, flax seeds. So I'm going to have a little handout of all the different protein and like the amount. So like one ounce of shrimp equals this much protein. I'm going to have a handout for you. And maybe what I can do is I can adjust it to add the omega three in each one too. So you can have that extra information, but you'll be able to download that handout. It'll be easy. So then you can just put it on your fridge and say, okay, did I have my, you know, fish? Did I have my flax seeds? You can kind of check it off. So two servings a day of omega three and then protein on average for depending on how big and muscular you are and how much you work out, I would say it's usually 1.2 to 2.2 grams per kilogram of protein. So as an example, if I'm a woman that's 145 pounds on average, I'm having about 100 grams of protein a day. So I would have four meals, 25 grams, 25 grams, 25 grams of healthy protein. Does that make sense? That's pretty realistic. Three, four. And one of these I always suggest, especially if you work out is a shake where it's just protein. But not way protein. Do you want us to get that protein from dairy? Well. Oh, that could be a different talk. Yeah, it's a little bit different because weight does give you significant benefits for muscle. So it depends. It's inexpensive. I don't. I think if you're not allergic to, to casein like the actual protein, I think you can still take away. Okay. Because there's some really good protein cutters out there that are actually very clean. They're a given ante at the grass fed beef cows. So even though the milk protein is there, as long as you're not sensitive to the casein, the actual milk protein, you can still have grass fed beef protein powder with no antibiotics and stuff. So, and I actually have a list. So I can give you that list too of protein patterns that I like. I think the viewers would find that. Yeah. So I mean, that's like a general for 140 foot. If you were a little bit higher than you'd want to increase your numbers. So just remember that in one meal, if you're going more than like 35 to 40 grams, I don't know if you can see that per meal, that's two, it's already going to be too high for you to break down. So you want to really like, this is like maximum protein per meal. If you're the average, you know, office worker, you're maybe walking to the office, you're coming home, you're doing a quick, maybe workout, sometimes you don't work out during the day. Are you closer than to the 1.2 grams per kilogram? Yeah. If you're like an average and you don't really work out that much, I would say it's still be about 1.5. Okay. Yeah. I would say 1.5. I like being higher because I'll be honest with you, every, like I've seen so many cases of anxiety and depression, every single time their protein is not even high. When you look at their nutrition records, protein is really, really low. Always. And it's like, okay, hold on, well, protein breaks into amino acids, makes all these brain chemicals. Why are we having enough protein? But then if a person is having protein, then maybe it's their digestion that's not working. Right. So there's, it's many multiple factors and we just going to do a little bit at a time. So a little bit of omega threes, eating some more fish. This takes us to this journal. Remember this one? The World Journal of Psychiatry, 2018, September 20th. Do you want to go to the mics for that? Oh yeah, sure. Do you need the barred anymore? No. And for those of you listening, you know now we're back on the couch because the sound quality is just that much better. Thanks for bearing with us again. If you want to watch the video, it's at youtube.com slash depression to expression. But I'm sure you got a lot of great info and in the description below, there's going to be links to these worksheets that Andre mentioned. And what are we on to now? And also the research. And also the research. If you look at it. Yep. You can check out the research, the articles that we mentioned, the journal articles, which are fairly recent. The first one was 2019, where we're going over is something from 2018. Now what's this? It's from the World Journal of Psychiatry and it's September 20th, 2018. And they basically, what they did is they wanted to look at antidepressant foods, that actually help decrease your depression. And it says here in evidence based nutrient profiling system for depression. Now this is in the world of psychiatry journal. Was it psychiatrists that actually put this together? Psychiatrists looking into diet? I know. Evidence based diet. So that's what they wanted to create some way of like measuring. If you ate these foods, these symptoms would decrease. It's kind of cool. So what they had, they created something called an antidepressant food score, A-F-S. Isn't there like an acronym? A-S, A-S-F. Yeah. I don't know. A-F-S. Not A-F-S. Oh A-F-S. What's A-S? As-beep. Oh yeah. Yeah, I do. That one. No, clean language for the viewers. Okay. So what is A-F-S? So A-F-S is an antidepressant food score. It was designed to identify the most nutrient dense individual foods to prevent and promote recovery from depressive symptoms. Love it. Depressive disorders and depressive symptoms. And so it's kind of cool, but basically they found that there was nutritional guidelines that were published in 2018. They recommended following a traditional dietary pattern such as the Mediterranean diet which we know, high olives, high fish, high vegetables, high fiber, consuming adequate amounts of omega three, avoiding all processed foods, for example, anything with carbohydrates or sugars that were processed in a box, for instance. And they said that this is like the best for decreasing and promoting reduction in symptoms. So okay. I wanted to show you this list because you can actually, we'll give you the link, but it's a really cool list. I don't know. I guess you can't see from that far away. So this is the anti-depressant... The list of foods. Yeah, the list of foods. Sorry. What is it? A-F-S. A-F-S. So it actually, as part of their recommendations, it shows every type of protein. So the first one says oysters. And the oyster A-F-S, antidepressant foods, is 56%. So oysters... Johnny, can we get a shot of that? Johnny? I've hired a cameraman. Depression to expression is really successful. Johnny, can we get a shot of that? Zoom in on that, Johnny? Okay. You were... Okay. We got a shot of it. Okay. So oysters apparently are one of the best things for your brain. And it kind of makes sense because they were talking about zinc and folate, all these things that your brain needs in oysters, they come from the sea, right? There's so many minerals in the sea, just like algae. We said algae was a really high source of omega-3 as well, and that's on the list as well. Right. And then like every wild fish. Yeah. Like a bunch of fish. Shrimp is on there. Liver and organ meats. Yes. We said those are really good because those have the base molecule for your brain, for your acetylcholine to make your memory. Oh yeah, this is it. It's no mistake that we're surrounded by ocean. There's a lot of good things in there. So what is it? Vegetables, number one. What does it say? Okay, so the antidepressant food score, we have the first one, vegetables, okay? Get your veggies in. Your parents weren't crazy. They knew what they were talking about. Get your veggies. Organ meats, as you said. Fruits. What's your thought on servings of fruit every day? Because they're high in sugar. Two. Two servings and on average it's like one piece of fruit or a cup. Right. So I shouldn't be drinking four glasses of orange juice a day. I'm not saying I am. I'm not. Yeah. It's a lot of sugar. A lot of people like juices. It's funny because when you actually drink orange juice, there's like no benefit whatsoever because it's been pasteurized. It's been heated up. So a lot of times they have to fortify. They have to add the vitamins in because it's just plain sugar. Unreal. So yeah, it's not a good idea for your brain. It's a lot of shame. I guess same with apple juice and everything. Like it's just a lot of sugar. Like one cup of orange juice probably has something like 30 grams. It's really high of sugar. So next on the list, we have seafood and then legumes, meats, grains, nuts and seeds. And the last on the list for the anti-depressant food score is dairy. What? I'm so happy. I want to like frame this and put this up because a lot of patients don't want to give up dairy. They love it. I get it because it's comfort. Yeah. Right? As a little kid, what were you giving? Milk. Yeah. You know, to comfort you. But dairy is not, it's not on the high of anti-depressant foods for a reason. But cheese is just so good though. Right? Cheese is delicious. So even for example, I had a patient coming in and she was like, oh, I'm having 1% milk. But even 1% milk or even lactose free milk has 11 or 12 grams of sugar per cup. Yes. Right? Yes. And ideally for a healthy brain, I would say minimum 20 to 30 grams of sugar a day. So if you want your brain and your body to stay lean and healthy, you want to have 20 to 30 grams of sugar a day. Is that including sugar from fruit? Is that included? Yes. Okay, it is. It includes everything. So if you do have that little bit of chocolate or if you do whatever, then that adds up right away. Right. And one of the key things that I see, lots of high sugars and like dried fruit that has crazy high sugar, cereals that has lots of sugar. We talked about that. Yeah. And dairy, because dairy has hidden sugars. It's weird. You don't see it, but then it's hidden. It is. It is. And in your yogurts and your cheeses, yeah, and milk. Yogurt. I know. Well, even with bread, like away from the carbohydrate sugars, like even bread has a lot of added sugar and that salt, I said too. Yeah. Maybe salt would be a different talk. Oh my God. That's so true. Salt. I remember one of my patients, he was eating a quiz nose. He ate a lot of quiz nose, you know, that Subway store. And when we looked at the values, I'm like, okay, no problem. We'll look at the values. We put it into the database. We use MyFitnessPal and we put in what he was eating and the sugar was through the roof. He had no idea. Sugar was like 90 grams of sugar a day from like two sandwiches that he was eating. Yeah. It was just super high because they're making it tasty, right? Yeah. Yeah. And you just don't know any better. Sugar in the bread. Yeah. So what about, so let's just end off here, Andrea, because then we're doing a separate video for Patreon to answer all their questions and just a few bucks a month everyone and you get to support the podcast and the YouTube channel and what we do here because there's no ads on the podcast. We want to make it as accessible as possible. So thanks a lot for tuning in and listening. Before we get to Patreon and answering those separate questions, what are a few takeaways for the viewers and listeners? Okay. Kind of what we talked about on the board there. Anything else you want to say too? Yeah. Anything else? Like repeat of kind of like just bringing it all together. Bringing it all together. Yeah. And then I know you're always great in the, you know, giving people that motivation and that maybe that soft and comforting push that they need to take action. You're always good at that. So anything else you want to say? Yeah. So I guess going back to the basics, your action steps are your Omega Threes. If you don't have a list and if you download this list so you know, but basically just eat your Omega Threes, at least two servings a day will really, really help you. Protein. Make sure you're getting enough because I tell you people are not getting enough. So get enough protein for your day. And then what was the last thing that we want to talk about? Oh, it's all about you. It's all about you deciding that you want to get better and that you're committed no matter what they say. Because I cannot even tell you a case after case of people or patients that I see that come in and their doctor and their psychiatrist and whoever else has told them this is it. This is all we can do for you and you still don't feel good. So there's got to be another way and it starts with you deciding that you are going to do it and you're going to find all those other roads to get there. Yeah, that's it. Thank you. Amazing. Dr. Andrea Horta, thank you so much for coming on again. Everybody, leave your comments, leave some questions. Say hi to Andrea. All of her information is in the description, her Instagram, her website, the worksheets we're going to put in there, everything that you need to get in touch and to of course join the community on Patreon as well. Thanks, everyone. Stay strong, keep being you and express yourself, my friends. Bye-bye. Bye, guys.