 How is it? Punjab? Yes sir. Do you like Punjab? Yes sir. Very much? Yes sir. Tell me four, five good qualities. Why do you like Punjab and two, three bad qualities? Okay. So why I like Punjab? Number one, the culture of Punjab is famous. There is this term called Punjabiath which is associated with the culture of Punjab. It is an extravagant culture. People there are perceived to be extremely happy and jolly in their daily lives. So number two, Punjab is very welcoming towards its guests. The tradition of Atiti Devo Bhava. Yes sir. So number three, Punjab has a rich heritage of Sikhism and Gurdwara. The tradition of lunges all over the country started from Punjab. And number four, sir, Punjab has famous tourist places which narrate the history of the country. So bad things. Number one, sir, Punjab is dealing with the issue of drug abuse. The youth of Punjab is dealing with this crisis. Number two, sir, Punjab is still an agrarian economy to a large extent. Manufacturing and services sector have not taken the pace that they have. A lot of diplomatic activities is being done in Delhi. Yes sir. Are named some of the results of foreign dignitaries. Sir, most recent visit I can think of is US secretary, a US diplomat. Deputy NSF? Deputy NSF? Yes. Foreign NSF? Sir, I am not sure sir. Other dignitaries? Anybody from Russia? Sir, I am not aware. Japan? Last 15 years ago? Sir, I am sorry, I haven't written. You haven't been reading the newspapers? Sir, the past few days not very regularly. Why any particular reason? The civil servant is expected to be aware. Yes sir. Especially more civil servant aspirant. Yes sir. That's right sir. Sir, that's probably because my schedule has been a little busy. But I am not sure I don't repeat this. Are you working somewhere right now? No sir, I am not. Can you name the new MPs who have been nominated for RSM? Sir, Raghav Chadda is one MP. I can only think of one. You also have a hobby of healthy baking. Yes sir. So how is healthy baking different from usual baking? And what are the ingredients which are used in the usual baking, commercial baking? Which makes it not so healthy option? Sir, by healthy baking, it is not completely healthy. So by healthy baking, what I do is I substitute some unhealthy ingredients with healthier ones. For instance, if I am baking cakes or cookies, I substitute the sugar with an alternative natural version of sugar. For instance, banana mashers have natural sugar. They can be added to cakes. They not just substitute the sugar but also reduce the butter content that can be used. Secondly, dates are another natural alternative to sugar. Secondly, so for instance, if I am making a pizza or anything that uses Mehta as a base, I substitute that base with millets. It doesn't harm the taste a lot. So this way I substitute the unhealthy alternatives with healthier ones. The taste remains the same or? Sir, there is a slight compromise in the taste. So I usually bake for my family members and most of them are elderly and suffering from some form of non-communicable disease. So it is always better than having nothing at all. Having to eat nothing at all. You have not opted for Punjab as your first option. Yes sir. Sir, there is no specific reason against Punjab. Just that I wanted to work in a bigger state which has, so basically for my own growth journey, I wanted to see greater diversity, greater challenges and I also wanted to stay closer to family. So I chose Rajasthan within the northern zone as my first reference. Have we seen, maybe you must have seen, anecdotally, is there any revival of Khalasthani movement in Punjab or the separate distinctions or at least the general feeling? Sir, there has been some news around this recently but I do not believe there is any anecdote or evidence surrounding the revival of this movement. So at present I do not believe there is any solid evidence about a revival. You also read books on development. Yes sir. Can you read some books which are there? So I have read Poor Economics and Good Economics for Bad Times by Abhijit Pannurji. I have read India An Uncertain Glory by Amartya Sen. Then Fortune at the Bottom of the Pyramid by C.K. Prelad. What is the development economics and how is it defined from the others? Sir, so development economics basically focuses on the redistributive or the welfare aspects of economy. For instance, if economy is more about numbers in GDP, development economics focuses more on how these numbers impact people. For instance, is GDP growth impacting the health and education of people? Is it helping them enhance their quality of lives, enhance the environment that they are living in? So development economics is more people centric and more tangible in its outcomes. You also follow agri tech? Yes sir. Any agri tech which will help in solving the stubble burning issue of Punjab? Yes sir. Within Punjab itself, there is a startup. It is named Dharaksha Ecosystems. They are working on stubble burning issue. They collect stubble from farmers and they convert it into manual and then they sell it forward to fertiliser industries, plastic industries in other places. Many good agri tech have come out. Many startups are there, many new technologies are there. But why is the adoption not so good? Second thing, let's say if you are the security of the agriculture department in Punjab, how would you promote the adoption? So challenges of adoption and how would you promote? So the first question, challenges of adoption, I believe the first and foremost challenge is scalability. So currently R&D in the field of agriculture is not, so the R&D expenditure on agriculture is low. Secondly sir, taking it to most of the farmers in the country, currently more than 80% farmers are small and medium, small and micro sector farmers with a farmland less than one hectare. So they do not have the money or the ability or the literacy to adopt these technologies. Number two sir, extension services have not percolated to the extent they should have in the agriculture sector and agri tech would need the support of extension services. So the second question was how will I promote agri tech? So number one, I will bank on cooperators as a model to help agricultural technologies reach farmers. For instance, the Amul model of cooperators has been able to adopt newer technologies and scale better because of the economies of scale. Number two sir, I will ensure the penetration of digital infrastructure to the rural areas so that farmers are able to utilize extension services and have the requisite knowledge to be able to use agri tech. So your name, your option is mathematics? Yes sir. Very interesting, how do you find it? Can you repeat your question? No sir, I was able to attempt, it was inclined. Very basic mathematics. What are the properties of 45 degree line? Properties of 45 degree line. Sir, a 45 degree line is equally inclined to both the axis and equidistant and equally inclined as well. So you have to apply in real administration. Okay. How it will be useful? Sir, so number one I can think of for instance whenever we plot statistics of any policy, we prefer the 45 degree line because it guarantees an equitable rise for instance for equal amounts of rise in the base that is an equal amount of rise in the outcome. Different groups of different areas. Yes sir. Very good. Now what is the harmonic mean? Harmonic. You know we are geometric mean, arithmetic mean. What is the harmonic mean? Yes sir, can I take a moment? I do recall. So harmonic mean is the mean of the reciprocal of the two numbers. It has some relationship with the harmonium. You know that? No sir. You know that? What do you call that there? The way it is conceived, the harmonic, I mean the instrument, it's based on harmony. Anyway, now you have done chemical engineering from Delhi IIT. Yes sir. Very good. So what are the properties of the heavy water? You know there is a concept of heavy water, you know that. Yes sir. So heavy water has higher content of deuterium as compared to hydrogen. It has heavy hydrogen. So its properties are that, number one, it dissolves, so it dissolves salts better as compared to normal water. And so it has. What was it used? Let me put it that way. Sir, in nuclear power plant. Nuclear power plant, very good yes. Pressurized. Yes sir. But why is it used in nuclear power plant? Yes, that's the right answer. Why? Heavy water. Okay. What is the degree? Temperature. Nuclear power plant, what is the temperature? It has to be more than minus 40. Is it a product by itself or is it a byproduct or something else? Heavy water. Sir, it can be a byproduct and it can be found naturally as well. Okay, tell me byproduct. Okay. It's a byproduct of which processes are which product? Sir, I'm not aware. And when you have gas-based fertilizer thing, then you hold a topsoil technology with heavy water. Okay. Some of the fertilizer plant, NFL and all, they're good. That's interesting. That too is development economics. Okay. And guzzles. Yes sir. Whose guzzles do you favor? I mean your favorite. Sir, Mehdi Hassan, Jagjeet Singh. And there is one singer, Ali Sethi. He's a young singer. He re-sings the guzzles sung by Mehdi Hassan Sahab and other. So he's a new generation guzzlesinger. This Pagwara is a famous industry there, no? Pagwara, it is famous for generator engine parts manufacturing, sir. No, Pagwara is lagging ahead in certain industrial thing. Yes, sir. Especially sports goods. Why is it merit has overtaken Punjab? Why? Yes, sir. So, sir, Lodhiana and Amrit sir are two sports manufacturing hubs in Punjab. Lodhiana also. I was not... Sir, Lodhiana excels in bicycle parts manufacturing. Second house here, maybe. Yes. But sports goods in Punjab. What has happened? Why are they coming to Punjab? Yes, sir. So, I believe that despite these hubs, Punjab has not been able to manufacture them well because there is decentralized and unorganized manufacturing of sports goods in these areas. So, economies of scale is missing in Punjab as compared to Meerut or any other city. Is there any government policies? Everybody mentioned government policies are very positive. I don't know. The local and Punjab government policies. Is there anything in the industry policy? Sir, I... Sir, what I can think of is that labour law reforms have not taken up in Punjab. For instance, states like Rajasthan and Gujarat have taken some positive steps in the field of labour law reforms. Economic survey 2015-16 mentioned their case studies. The lack of this in Punjab may be one reason. Last question, the drug thing. Yes, sir. Yes, sir. So, what can be done? What needs to be done? Sir, I think two pronged approaches needed. One is soft measures and the other is hard measures. In soft measures, sir, we need to reduce the demand of drugs among youth. How do you do that? Yes, sir. For this, sir, number one, as I mentioned, Punjab is still an agrarian economy. We need to promote manufacturing and services sector so that the youth of Punjab can be skillfully employed. So, scaling the schemes in health education as well as manufacturing sectors to promote employment among youth. Number two, sir, awareness at school, at schools and colleges. So, youth since are the most affected by this issue. Awareness among youth, helping role models connect to these youth and making de-addiction centres available for youth are some soft measures. So, in hard measures, number one, we need to regulate our borders better so that cross-filtration of drugs from the Golden Crescent is reduced. Number two, pharmaceutical shops and industries which are also selling drugs illegally need to be countered through community policing as one initiative. Women on the lines of the Kudumbashri model of Kerala can be deployed to help settle this issue better. Thank you. So, you have worked on this initiative of smokeless stove. Yes, ma'am. What exactly is smokeless stove? So, ma'am, in rural areas, women still use the traditional chulha where they burn coal or wood fire and the smoke arising out of it is breathed directly by them. A smokeless stove is a minor modification in the design of this chulha such that whatever smoke that comes out of burning wood fire is directly channelized through a chimney into the upper air. So, this stove doesn't completely solve the problem of indoor air pollution but it solves the problem of indoor air pollution by directing this smoke from their wood fire directly to their areas. So, it's not smokeless but you were just diverting the smoke somewhere. Yes, ma'am. Rather than somebody unveiling it, it's going somewhere else. Yes, ma'am. And it increases the efficiency of the chulha. So, the amount of smoke that comes out is reduced as well. Okay. So, when you talk about social entrepreneurship, what do you mean by a social enterprise? A social enterprise is an enterprise which focuses on profit motives like the other enterprises do but it has a social, it is directed towards a social cause. So, how is it different from a normal company or a normal enterprise? Yes, ma'am. In terms of profitability, in terms of cost structure, how is it different? Yes, ma'am. For instance, one thing that I can think of is they play on economies of scale. Their profit margins are lower but their base is larger. So, they are able to gain profit for themselves but they are also... Is it only the intention which is there or is there any clauses or is there the company structure is such a way that there is a cap on the profit or something like that? Is there any provision for that in social enterprise? Ma'am, I am not aware of the cap on... What do you call a fab India? Is it a social enterprise? Ma'am, I am not aware but if I would take a guess, I think no, it is not. Then they claim that they are working for people of marginalized societies, they are getting the work done from artisans and they are going there. So, they are claiming that. So, if social enterprise is about this only, then they would be falling into the category of social entrepreneurship. But ma'am, their primary motive is profit. So, that is what I am asking. How would you differentiate? Yes ma'am. So, the primary motive of a social enterprise is solving a social issue. For instance, Avanti is a social enterprise that I was working for. They were providing free, as well as subsidized... That is when they should go for not-for-profit organization. Then why do they call themselves social enterprise? Ma'am, because a not-for-profit enterprise is not economically sustainable. If the intention is to support people, then they can also... There is another term called section 8 company where there is a cap on profit. So, which is in between this. Then why call it a social enterprise? I don't know. So, tell me that is what I am trying to understand. So, is it just some kind of marketing tool which the companies nowadays using, they call themselves social enterprise so that they can increase their sales because of the sympathy they get from the clients? Ma'am, I do believe that it can be used as a branding tool because customers today are attracted towards social enterprises as their area of purchase. So, it can be misused as a branding tool but I do believe that there are many genuine social enterprises who are working for social causes. There is a term called shrink-flation. Have you heard of it? Shrink-flation. Flation. Okay, no ma'am, I haven't. Okay. So, who got the Able Prize this time? Ma'am, I haven't. Mathematician. Yes ma'am. Yes. Okay. In Punjab, CN has, you know, they are supplying free ration to people. What's your view on that? Ma'am, I believe that free ration to everybody may not be an economical option for the country at present. I believe that something on the lines of coupons to, for instance, we already have a PDI scheme which does provide subsidized ration to the marginal sections of society. So, I believe that making this very scheme more wholesome by probably increasing the amount of ration that is provided can be a more viable and a more economically sound strategy. Okay. So, through civil services, which are the top two areas where you would like to contribute or you would like to work upon? Ma'am, my top two areas would be health and education because having a keen interest in development economics, the understanding that I have developed is that health and education are the two most important pillars of any country. So, investing in health and education today will ensure productive as well as sustainable growth for not just today but also tomorrow. For instance, people due to non-communicable as well as communicable diseases are losing their incomes. Number one, they are also losing productive years of life. Number three, they are somewhere, they somewhere become a liability on the nation. All these three can be addressed through universal access to health care. And number two, education. Unemployment is a basic concern facing the country today. So, through number one, scalable education and number two, education which is focused on innovation and can help solve issues like climate change is the viable step for our country. Yeah, nice. Okay, Surya. Yes. See this Haryana and Punjab were separated in 1916. Yes. So, 1916. Six. Six. That time, Haryana area was very backward. Yes. And Punjab was prospering. That was the main reason why it was prospering. So, in these last 50 years or so, Haryana has progressed well as for you? Yes, sir. It has. Lot of manufacturing here. Yes, sir. So, it means Punjab in the last 20 years has failed miserably. Sir, I would not say it has failed miserably but it has not prospered as much as Haryana has. So, it means as compared to Haryana it has failed. Yes. So, manufacturing is not there and Kharista movement has been there and all those things have been there. Yes, sir. So, my view on this. Yes. Sir, I believe that number one, the policies that Haryana has adopted may have been to some extent better than the policies Punjab has adopted. For instance, sir, Haryana's focus on women's education, schemes like baby bhajao, baby bhajao. So, it means all those things are missing in Punjab? To some extent, yes. Also, sir, Punjab is a little differently placed from Haryana. It has a border. So, what? Border rastanis are in border? Pujaranis are in border? Yes, sir, that's right. But some of the issues like drug abuse and terrorism which have continued to pester Punjab for the last 50 years have arisen due to it being a bordering state. Also, sir, yes. This farmer's education has it affected the production of editor's production in half Punjab? Because many of Punjab? Yes, sir, it has. And there are allegations that there was foreign funding which was funding the farmers and they did all this. Yes, sir. Leaving their fields and all. Is it true? Sir, about the allegation. Yes. Sir, I do not believe that this is true. Sir, I think a protest at a mass scale, the scale at which it had been happening for the past one year could not merely be because of funding. I do believe that the protesters were misguided in some sense, but it was because there was lack of clear channels of communication. No, it was funding. They were, can we go on AC type facilities, five dark facilities? Who will do that? Only the farmers. Only the farmers who import money from some source will do that. Yes, sir. So funding may have helped the movement sustain for a long time, but I would not believe that the movement was because of this. See, we generally commemorate good days, good memories. Yes, sir. World Women's Day, all these health day, water day and all. Now, from last year we have started commemorating some bad memories also. Remembrance day. Do you know what is that? Remembrance day? No, sir. Some horror day? Very relevant to your state? Sir, I haven't heard of it. Partisan horror, horror is remembrance day. We have started celebrating. No idea? No, sir, sorry. I guess 14th is being celebrated now. Okay. Any other such type of day? Bad day is being celebrated anywhere in the world? Sir, Black Friday is... Black Friday is what? Sir, on this day I do not remember the exact but Sir, if I were to take a guess, probably Jesus was hanged on this day. That's how it is being remembered. 9-11? Yes, sir. Which 11th September is being celebrated. Yes, sir. Then some horror past days being celebrated. Yes, sir. Tell me the difference between standing committee and concert technicality. What are these two names? Sir, parliamentary standing committees are committees established for a period of one year and they are more formal in their structure. They have a specific agenda and and consultative committees are more informal in nature. Who has these two committees? Sir, parliamentary standing committees are headed by chair persons who are chosen by the speaker from among the members and consultative committees are headed by ministers, I think. Which ministers? Sir, specific ministers in... Nanofertilizers. Yes, sir. Sir, nanofertilizers use nanotechnology to fertilize farm fields, for instance. Sir, for instance nanoparticles are impregnated... Any example? Where it has been done? Sir, I can't think. Yes, sir. Sir, I can't think of a specific... What's the difference? How it functions? So nanoparticles are impregnated with fertilizers and then sprayed on the field so that fertilizer runoff is reduced and the efficiency of fertilizer usage is increased. Okay. This last government manifesto also said that 5000 rupees per year will be given to the accounts of all women, including unmarried women. Yes, sir. Do you also qualify for that? Yes, sir, I do. Sir, this is a good step. Sir, I believe that it is a good step but probably making it universal may not be as economical again. It can... It can... Sir, it can be done on the lines of the health scheme to allow women who do not need this subsidy to opt out of this subsidy. Yeah. Mohanad is already running, I think, for a dick. That's all the money you've got.