 We walk together down an important street. That street was Constitution Avenue and only 27% of the 52% of the American people voted for our president. America has gone to sleep. Collective talent sensibilities should be utilized by all of us in order to try and help make this world a better place in which to live. Hello, hello everybody. Welcome, welcome, welcome. This is the NBT at home unbought and unbossed reclaiming our vote conversation series. This is the final part of our series. And I'm your moderator, Chelsea D. These conversations have been happening in tandem with the release of our digital commission series, a series of public service announcements created by black women artists letting you know what's really real today, okay, in conversation with history. And the complete collection of commissions has been released. So check it out on our IG, our Facebook, our website and bask in the glory. Okay, last week we released go tell it on the mountain by Diane Smith. And this week we've released about her, me by Hope Boykin, and we have the great privilege of three of our guests from the commission series being on the show tonight. So we will get to dive behind the magic dives into the minds of those who brought us some really, really wonderful art. This series is in partnership with Michelle Obama's when we all vote a nonprofit nonpartisan organization that is on a mission to increase participation in every election and close the race and age voting gap. We're going to talk a little bit later about what your voter to do today is what we would like for you to be using the resources that we're going to provide you with to get some action steps and direct action steps around how we're approaching this election season because it's right around the corner. And now it is my great pleasure to introduce to welcome our guests for the evening with the magic of stream yard. They are there. Hey. Hello. It's so good to see everybody's just beautiful, melanated, shining faces. You all look wonderful. The lighting is spectacular. Welcome. Well, thank you for having us. Yes, great to see everyone. Yes. So let's just get a crack in with our check-in. Maybe Diane, let's start with you. Diane, just tell us a little bit about yourself, your art form, what you do. And when did the political become personal for you? I am, Diane, of course, you all know that. I'm a multi-disciplinary artist, so which basically means that I figure out what I want to say and find the best medium to say it in. And that doesn't always mean that I'm versed in that medium. It's just what I need to use to articulate my voice at that point in time. The political became personal for me. The first time I was able to vote, being a child of two immigrant parents who had tons of immigration issues. And quite frankly, if we were in these times, like this type of stuff was going on then, my parents would have been caught up in this whole immigration fiasco right now. So it became really, really important to me to have a voice in terms of voting because I understood they couldn't. And when my mother finally became a citizen, voting for her was one of the most important things on her to-do list as an American citizen. So, yeah. Thank you. Thank you for starting us off. Lady Dane. Hey, so listen everybody. My internet is acting up, honey, and it is turning it. And so we've been having rain and storms all day here. I am down in what we call D.C. but we understand it's the land of the Piscataway peoples. So, yeah, we've been having rain all day. And so my internet, it might cut me off and I'm gonna try to hop back in and y'all, it's like hopscotch, right? No, double dash, double dash. So, hey, everybody. Lady Dane, Big Roa, and Dee Dee. My pronouns are she, her, hers. Can you repeat the question, Chelsea? Yes. No worries, no worries. Okay, that's what we're here for. That's what I'm here for. So tell us a little about your art form. What do you do? What's your, what's your, you know, what brought you here? Yeah, so I, you know, as far as like the art forms that I utilize to, I remember back in the day a friend of mine said, you're a healer and you use art to heal, right? And so the art forms that I use are, you know, song, dance, spoken word, you know, writing, movement, all of those types of things. Understanding that my existence is revolutionary. And so to be able to actually experience my body in space is a revolutionary act. And so I, a lot of my art combines, you know, song, dance, spoken word, literary word. And the, you know, the personal, I understood the personal was political at a very young age. I grew up in Baltimore. That's where I'm from originally. And my aunt Liz, who I talk about a lot, is Figaro. She was one of the first curators of the Great Black Sun Wax Museum in Baltimore. So I was a child growing up in this museum. And my, you know, my auntie, she was, she was an academic. She was a jazz singer. So she was an artist and she also was an advocate and an activist. So she taught me that the education that I would need would not be given to me from an oppressive education system. So I had to be invested in an expansive education that went beyond trying to seek it within institutions of that were already designed and built on oppression. There you go. There it is. There it is. Thank you. Oh, boy can talk to us. Tell us about your art form and when did the political become personal? Well, thank you. And hello, everyone. I'm pleasure to be here. Someone asked me, they gave me a task to put my mission statement into four words. So I've started to say, my name is Hope Boykin and I'm an educator, creator, mover and motivator. It kind of rubs people the wrong way a little bit because I'm newly retired from the Alvin Ailey American Dance Theater. So 20 years with this one company, people expect me to say that I'm a dancer, but I'm all those other things as well. So as a choreographer, as a creator, which really encompasses everything, I tend to try to speak. I say that I'm sharing my movement language and I've included a great deal in the last five or six years. My text, I was never just newly getting courage to call it spoken word or poetry. I actually just joined a memoir writing class. So it's all of these things are part of the creative person that I am. And the political became personal for me, I think rather late in life. My family, my mother was the first person in our family to go to college. She graduated from high school when she was 15, from college when she was 18, and she was an educator. And what she didn't want me to do was struggle. And so I had different advantages than she had, which is what every parent I think wants for their child is to remove the riches and the potholes so they don't have to step in them. But I found that I floated on that a lot. I knew that I always knew my life mattered and I always knew that I was a dark-skinned black woman, but I was surrounded by people who just saw me as black. It didn't matter what my color was because that's what most of the time I was surrounded by a full room of white students, white people. I always went to private school from third grade until I graduated high school. And I said, I want to go to Howard University because I want to be surrounded by people that look like me. And so at 18, it was kind of cool. I was thrilled to see so many people, but then it turned into something when I started to realize that it was my people who were differentiating me against everyone else. And I say against because we often do that. We pit ourselves or pit others against one another. And I feel like our learning in this time has to really start with us when we want to make a larger change. And now my goals are to encourage and to grow. I can go back and recall all the aggressions and macro things that happened to me, but I started to feel the punctures coming from my people. And so we have to fix that as well as fixing all of the other things that are on the long list to continue to be better people. Yeah, that was long, but that's true. But right and planting all the seeds that I really do, I really would love to circle back and talk about this within the community, the violence, what is happening? How are we able to heal within us so that we can offer greater healing to the larger whole? We got to talk about that name best stuff. So let's get into being unbought and unbossed. Okay, MBT reached out to y'all and was like, you know, here, here's, here's, we want you to create a micro commission about around truly chisms run bid for the bid for the presidency, and also the centennial of the ratification of the 19th minute, like, what does it mean to be women of color black women who have been heading a lot of these movements and social changes and yet not necessarily the beneficiaries of all the things that we have spearheaded the society to learn about. So tell me, tell me what was the inspiration behind your commission, the commission that you did. If you could tell us the title of your commission, and then a little bit about the inspiration, whether it was a historical figure or movement, you know, I would love to know what what inspired these pieces and whether whoever would like to start us off. All right, Diane. I, first of all, I was really excited when I got the commission. And I didn't know what I was going to do, but just thinking about Shirley Chisholm, I started thinking about the women who came before her. And one night, Fannie Lou Hamer popped in my head. I thought, besides, I'm sick and tired of being sick and tired. What do we really know about Fannie Lou Hamer? How much do we really know? And that included me. And I did a quick search and then that even I became obsessed so much so that my friends know it and my friend Bo McCall made me the shark. Is that Miss Fannie Lou Hamer? It is. It's a triple T with Miss Fannie Lou Hamer. So I became obsessed with Fannie Lou Hamer. You know, like stalker like obsessed, right? She was here right now. They'd be like Miss Hamer. There's a lady in front of your building. The reason why, just thinking about the start of her life, you know, from the time she was six years old, she was working on a plantation. She quit school at 12 years old. She spent most of her adult life on the plantation until her and a small group of African Americans decided they were going to go register to vote. And the more things that happened to her, the more determined she was. So when I hear people today, particularly women and those who look like us say they're not voting, what does it matter? I'm like, are you freaking kidding me? Are you really, you know? Yeah, I just can't, I can't imagine squandering that, right? Because there's a certain amount of privilege for anyone that looks like us right now to say they're not going to vote. Because Fannie Lou Hamer didn't have a choice. She didn't have a choice, nor the people around her at that particular time. What they went through, all of the obstacles that got, and the fact that she made it as far as she did from her food, what she did for those who were food insecure, creating farms. I mean, this woman was freaking amazing with little or no education, but her intelligence far surpassed anyone that I've read about in a long time. So your piece was in dedication to her life. It was in dedication to her life, her roots, but it was a testament to black women in general and all of the ways in which we are out here even today. You know, for me it was sort of a contemporary statement too in terms of how all of us are collectively making change and working in the background. And then sometimes there are those in the foreground that are just taking all of that and making it their own. Fannie Lou Hamer is virtually unsung in the civil rights conversation in terms of curriculum, in terms of celebration, in terms of just talking about her. Again, I'm sick and tired of being sick and tired. That is the single most thing that we know about her. But the fact that we are sitting here today in this quad, having this conversation is in part due to the work that she'd done. She did her work in the Delta, but that is still trickled to impact us all. Shirley Chisholm would not have been Shirley Chisholm if there wasn't a Fannie Lou Hamer. So Fannie Lou Hamer to you is like the epitome of being unbossed. Absolutely. I mean, from the fact that she went in to have a particular surgery, you know, female, and they gave her a hysterectomy. It's still happening. And it's still happening, but that happened to her and it did not stop, you know, she kept going. When she was arrested was 1963 and taken to the jail and the way she was beaten and she was like that made her even more determined. She's just free, free from fear in a way that was like remarkable to be under that level of oppression because it was the beatings and the description of the beatings that really stuck with me about Fannie Lou Hamer's tenacity. Tenacity? And I'm like, wow, you know what I mean? Like, what does it take? What are you calling upon? What are you calling upon? To that point on Sunday I went to vote and I'm standing on the line, right? And I'm cold because I didn't dress well. And I'm out there shivering and I'm like the ancestors and right here I'm like the ancestors, my little fingers are shivering. I was like, this is a small price to pay. I must stand right here and not even complain. I'm going to be cold. This cold is temporary. No one is beating my ass physically. I'm a little chilly. I'm going to stand here. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for starting us all. That was just the, oh, actually, Dane, can we talk about your piece next? Can we talk about your commission? Because I just, I feel like it so encapsulated my anxieties around voting and what it means to be a participant in a society that also like we see with Fannie Lou Hamer will brutally and savagely attack you for asserting your citizenship. You know what I mean? And so what the legacy of that, the trauma, the need for release from that trauma, you know, all I really was picking a lot of that up from your piece. So can you just talk to us a bit about your inspiration? Yeah. So it's, you know, I'm someone right who is was told at a very young age, you better vote right because because because ancestors bad for you to be able to vote. And so I literally can y'all hear me. Yeah, I can. Okay, okay, awesome, awesome, awesome, because my screen is a little bit delayed. But, you know, my answers were like, you know, my, my elders were like ancestors died for you to vote so go on and vote and all these things, along with also telling me the history right of the fact that the idea of democracy did not start with white men. The idea of democracy, the truth of democracy, the reality of democracy right actually originated with indigenous peoples. And that white men stole those ideas from indigenous peoples. And so that's number two. Number three, you know, it's, it's one of those things where you know I live where I live right which means that during the Obama administration. I had the ability and and I and I was often at the Obama White House for specific events. And I watched the ways in which the nation, because we had a black president, sort of, and not everyone right but a lot of people became lulled away from our commitment to dismantling white supremacy. And that really, really pissed me off. So, and, like, you know, I remember right I remember black and brown and indigenous trans women being at the White House, being at some of these, these state buildings saying it white supremacy is the thing that is trying to kill us all. Being told, shush, give credit where credit is due. Why y'all always angry. Why you always got to make a fuss about something. Can't you just understand that everybody's doing the best that they can go slow. Nina Simone talked about that go slow. Meanwhile, literally we were witnessing people dying because of a system that was born in white supremacy genocide and cattle slavery. And so, and then 2016 happened. And that was a rude awakening for some folks. And so my piece was really about the fact of saying, okay, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm a vote right like vote vote yes yes yes we got to vote. But what's the work that needs to happen because there are a lot of people. Perhaps some people watching on this on this call tonight, who thinks that voting is it. And it is not baby. It is not voting is is really the beginning. Because the work of dismantling white supremacy internalized and systematic is something that we must be committed to and we must be vigilant about, and no amount of. And you kind of brought this up earlier Chelsea as we were talking because I said it before right our salvation does not rest in the system. Our salvation. We are our salvation. Build community care about community. It is like, literally I just heard today about another black trans woman who was killed. I heard on Monday about another black man who was killed by the police. This is ridiculous. So yes, you know what I want to Biden Harris in the White House yes yes yes yes let's do that because I can tell you this four more years that this other man. Oh no. Oh no, the United States has always has always been played by fascism fascism is white supremacy by another name. And while there are some folks right now who are talking about authoritarianism and fascism. When I think about people like Fannie Lou. When I think about people like Francis Tom Thomas Thompson who was a black trans woman in the 1800s, who was an abolitionist. Yes, fighting. Right. He was fighting for black women. When I think about us. I think about the fact that there are some of us who have never enjoyed liberty in this country have never enjoyed freedom from oppression. And so what else going to do on the 4th of November, what else going to do on the 5th of November. Because no matter who wins white supremacy still got its hands around America's neck. And we must dismantle it and destroy it completely. So that's really what my piece was about my piece was about the fact that I was I was like how do I, as a person who believes in abolition and a person who believes in creating a system where really, you know, I asked the question does the United States deserve to survive this. If it won't change if it won't. These are the questions. So as a person who is like wrestling with these questions, but also understanding that four more years of who's in the White House right now could mean death for so many more people. But but but wanting to also speak to us about us really being committed to dismantling white supremacy internally and systematically, but also going to vote. Yep. And I love that piece was born from from all those all those feelings. Yes. And honoring right like honoring. Yes. Absolutely black and indigenous women. Contribution and who have already been doing the work. Yeah. That white women just got hip to. That's that. Okay. I hope for unbought and unbossed or not. Okay. Because that's what we really want tonight. Oh, talk to us. Talk to us about the inspiration behind your piece. Well, it's, it's so interesting because I really was trying to wrap my head around the women in my immediate life or those women that I'd seen work. And I wanted to make the thing that I love so much happen. And I, you know, growing up in Durham, North Carolina, my mother let me and I love my mom. Sometimes I, I get frustrated with someone, someone brought this up to me. I'm just going to go back. They said that our, our family there, my mother's parents fought for a certain amount of freedom, and then didn't necessarily understand the freedom that they had that they used. My mother fought for, and her generation fought for another type of freedom, the freedom during civil rights movement and, and all the things that are happening. And she doesn't really quite understand the freedom that I have now, or maybe it's too far, or maybe I'm not saying all the things that I could say in the right way with subject verb, with subject verb agreement. And then now young people have a different type of freedom. They post all the time freedom. The, let me say whatever it is, I think freedom that is a little bit frightening to me, but that is what I've been working for. And so I wanted to think about the women in the dance world in particular, who I watched create businesses and struggle and fight and, and build up the, the black dance community. And it took me right back to Joan Myers-Brown of Philadelphia, Geraldine Blunden of Dayton Contemporary Dance Theater, Lula Washington of Lula Washington Dance Ensemble, Cleo Parker Robinson St. Denver, and then, and then Anne Williams who founded the Dallas Black Dance Theater and Joe Myers-Brown and Cleo Parker Robinson and Lula Washington are still living founders and working founders. And then I was hired at Alvin Ailey by this woman, Judith Jamson, and if anyone has ever even laid eyes on her, she looks unbought and unbossed. She just walks in and you're like, and unbothered. And all of those things are muscles that I feel like we have to learn to grow. And it's not something that necessarily came naturally to me. So in my work, I was thinking, well, here are all the things that I wanted to say, but I needed to curb my words. I needed to make sure that I wasn't too loud or too demonstrative or don't be boisterous. Once I believe someone gave me that as a nickname, one of the teachers growing up, boisterous boiken. Well, maybe I just had things to say, but you know, but boisterous is looked at as a negative. So why is it that I'm curbed by that? What is it about me that imposes some type of threat on you? And so why can't I do all of the things that I want to do? Why can't I say that I want to do all of these things, especially when I'm watching and I can look at women who are pioneers in the dance world, who have created and founded the International Association for Blacks in Dance. Why can't I look at them and say, well, I can be that unbossed and that unbought? And learn to grow the muscle to be unbothered by the things that I need to say, the way that I choose to vote, how I look at you. I don't believe in that because the work that we do, the work that we all do, we get punished for little things. And then we do the work anyway. Someone says, oh, it would have been better if you had been that. And then we continue to do the work anyway. Hope you could be a little bit more of this, a little bit less of this. And you say, okay, and you do the work anyway. So how is it that we are not hugely powerful with the muscles in our arms and in our hearts because we would do the work anyway? And like you said, Fannie Lou Hamer was beaten and bruised and did the work anyway. She was told she was knocked down and over and over and did the work anyway. And so without that future, and like I said, I was thinking about the people as an inspiration who were in the field that I love so much, how they did it. I really don't know. I mean, it's shocking to me. How do you have these buildings? How were you, you know, creating these companies that are 50, 60 years old when, like, how were these women doing it? And so if they've done it, then they've opened up a path. They've taken that, I don't know what that tool is, but they take that tool and they've chopped, they've moved a path for me. And now I can take this and shift out and create more room and more space for more young people. And it's my duty to do it. And that is part of my work. And if I stop working, then I stop giving people encouragement. And I'm supposed to do that. And that is just a beautiful segue into my next question, which is about sustaining ourselves under work and sustaining ourselves in the resistance because if we're talking about dismantling life supremacy beyond just election day voting, we're talking about uprooting in a radical way the roots of colonialism, which is what we're dealing with, you know, globally. You know, if we're really talking about doing that, that's a long, long haul, long haul game. And how do we preserve ourselves in the midst of this? So something I talked about in the previous MBT at home series and had the great pleasure of meeting Adrian Marie Brown to talk more about this concept of pleasure activism, you know, of letting the information that you learn from pleasure and joy and erotic and what feels good to you, using that information to root yourself in not taking anything less than pure joy, pure relaxation, being able to rest and thrive and be full. So in the vein of pleasure activism, what's making you bloom right now? What's bringing you pleasure? And it can be small. It can be, you know, the merry-goals in my neighborhood, or it could be huge. Like, I can feel a change of common, like whatever that is for you. Who likes to start us off? Diane? I asked you and then I just... Why not? What's making me bloom is the ability to create and share. I think that as a creator, I have an unbelievable gift and not only a gift for the world, but a gift for myself. That I have a space to articulate the things that are most worrisome for me, the things that rest way down inside that I don't always have the words for. But I can transform that into something and then be able to articulate this is why I've transformed that into. And what gives me joy is the fact that I can do that, whether it's photography, whether it's film, whether it's painting, whether it's sculpture, large-scale installation. I have multiple modalities to bring my voice forward, unapologetically so. What brings me joy is my love for black people. I love black people in all form, shape, everything about us. I love us. I'm right or die. I love black women. It brings me joy looking at all your beautiful faces. These are the spaces that I find with everything that's going on in the world. This makes me feel like I'm home. I feel like I'm home. When I can talk to even my girlfriends on the phone, that brings me joy. The people in my life brings me joy. There's so much that we have to contend with out in the world. So I find joy in all the things that are in my lived experience, in my day-to-day, all of it makes me happy. The people that I am fortunate to spend my time with brings me joy. And no orange man in the White House is going to take that from me. And white supremacy is not going to take that from me. And what I say about that is, in spite of that, all of this beauty exists. In spite of the ways in which we have been knocked down in communities, bulldozed, men and women beaten and hung. We are still freaking here. We are here. I mean, look at us. And to be able to recognize that and embrace that, that's a space of joy for me. And that is with the backdrop of all the things that are happening from the police brutality and all of the ills in our communities and our societies. Which even, like Hope talked about, the ways in which we pit each other against one another. With all of that, the counter for that is the ways in which I move through my life with all of the things that are around me that I've been able to hold on to. And, you know, yeah. Thank you. Thank you for starting us off, Diane. That's just so beautiful. I mean, you're getting so much action in the comments here about people are really appreciating what you're saying. Can I just say one more thing? I'm so sorry. And I have to tell you, being a part of this group of commissions, I mean, that has been, I do a lot of work and put up a lot of things. And during this particular time, I've been really, really fortunate to be able to make work and make a lot of work. And I would say this particular commission amongst this group of women has been something that has been so profoundly, profoundly impactful for me. And it has, yeah, it just makes me feel good looking at all of that work. Like I was waiting every Wednesday for the release. I mean, it's pretty special and I'm really honored to have, you know, been on this stage with you and on the bill with you. Thank you, Diane. And if you please put in the comments, what is making you bloom right now? I won't. And we're collecting, we're creating our toolkit of what's going to keep us sustained and thriving in the midst of this. And so please let's collect, let's gather comments from the fam who are watching. Hope. I tell you, the blooming, some days I feel like I need to like reread all of the things I said I wanted and look at the list of things that are just happening. Like Diane said, she is fortunate enough to have work now. The work was coming so much that I didn't want to even tell anyone because I didn't feel like I was like it was right to be happy that I was able to work. Especially with COVID and then the other huge crisis, this racial crisis that's ongoing, but the one that everyone saw. I said, you know, I would say often that George Floyd wasn't the first black man that was killed unnecessarily by the police, but he's the one that the entire world saw. And so that's why so much happened across, I mean, my friends from all over the world were reaching out. But what I feel like I didn't was hard to put into words was the ability to reach so many people. I would hear people, I've heard people who've just joined Zoom for the first time. I'm like, you're kidding me. This has been a lifeline to me having cameras. I wouldn't even see Diane walking down the street with her camera on her, you know, on her shoulder. Having cameras, having lights, having a monitor, being able to do this work because I was gearing towards something else. And then it opened up into the life that I could use. So this morning, I taught choreographing for a university in Virginia. And then an hour after that, I was with a dancer in London. And then right before this, I was in LA. There's no way I would have been able to do that. And so as tired as it makes me and as frustrated as I sometimes get from, and I need to get a real chair and not this stool. That's why I keep shifting. I mean, literally I had a knee surgery in August, the middle of August. And I was like, well, I don't know how I'm going to work. I have an assistant who logs on demonstrates them. How much better could it get when I didn't know what was going to happen after my retirement? And now it just doesn't stop happening. So that's the blooming. And the thing that's giving me joy are those young people. They are winning. They are logging on. They don't have teachers. And if they are in person, they're dancing in boxes with masks on. I can't recognize them, you know, like they literally have these rectangles on the floor. They have on masks. Only one student wears the same shirt every day, every week that I see her. So I know her name, but I've got to go through the list and say, who is that? You know, but watching them knowing that they are going to change. They've taken things so seriously. They know that they can't be frivolous with their lives and that COVID is real. And they're making these sacrifices to do this work. I tell them all the time that they are winning. And that is what's really, really giving me pleasure. If they can show up, then I can show up. And I'm just so blessed to be able to reach young people in this way right now. Oh, wonderful. I like this question. I'm going to keep asking. Lady Dane, talk to us. Okay. I was like, okay, did I press it? I do. Okay. Um, you know, everything, everything that Diane and hope said is very affirming, right? And absolutely beautiful. And I, and I agree. I agree. It being a part of, I remember our first meeting, right? Where it was us and we were talking about the piece and we kind of talked a little bit about what we were going to do. And the ways in which love, love was in that room. And not just, not just like, oh, we're artists and we have that kinship, but a love that goes, that, that has its roots deep, deep, deep, deep, deep, deep, deep to the beginnings of time. And so when I think about, you know, the things that, you know, that are, that are assisting me and blooming. Um, it's, it's like, I think the things that are assisting me and blooming are also the things that are bringing me joy. Which is ancestors, right? My, I often say that, you know, I'm here because my ancestors imagined me into being and then put into my DNA the, the, the gift of imagining so that therefore I could imagine myself into being. Um, I think community, right? The ways in which community continues to pour wisdom back and forth into one another. Um, art. Uh, something that really resonated with me that, that, you know, saying I was talking about was like, and hope as well, right? Like this, this, um, time where I am, I am not only making art, right, but that there are, um, many, many, many of us who are artists despite what's happening in the world that, that it feels like there is a, um, disconnect because we can't physically touch one another, but that we are still connecting. Um, and we are still, uh, we are still giving birth to art. Um, and that in this moment, what is being recognized by the world, if not always honored by the world is the deep, deep, deep necessity and a centrality of art and the artist. Um, and so, yeah, that's my, that's my short of my long. I just feel like the, the answering this question is a piece of art in and of itself. It's, it is, it's the next commission. You didn't know that, but it's the beginnings of the next commission. Uh, so, um, Dane, actually, you brought up a really great segue talking about ancestry. So let's dig into Fannie Lou Hamer. Let's dig into what she did with the dynamics of this woman, the dynamics of this woman. Diane, you gave a really great, um, you know, setup of the, of the biographical, um, like really, uh, that was really actually really great. And so you've done some heavy, heavy lifting for me. Um, and I actually zoom in on her activism to battle food insecurity in the, in the Delta and like her creating. Oh, let me actually pull up exactly what it's called. Um, she was a co-founder of the National Women's Political Caucus and then her food sovereignty activism started the Freedom Farm Cooperative. And this was a farming collective to feed the community and battle food insecurity. And they had, I just want to talk about a specific program they had called the pig project where they would raise pigs and then give a family of pig. And the only thing that they needed was for them to give them a piglet back when that pig had a baby so that they could keep this kind of, um, system going. They're able to give communities protein and feed people. And so I have two quotes from Fannie Lou Hamer that I would love to share and then we'll dig into it. But one thing she said was when you've got 400 quarts of greens and gumbo soup canned for the winter, nobody can push you around or tell you what to say or do. The next thing she said is if you give a hungry man food, he will eat it. But if you give him food, but if you give him land, he will grow his own food. So just to start us off, you know, going with this metaphor of land and having land and creating systems that sustain the community from a local place, you know, you're not trying to like get the global perspective going. You're trying to help the person who lives next door to you. You're trying to make sure that that family has a pig and that we get their piglet. We get that piglet to them. And you know what I mean? So how are we, how are we building this? So the first question I have for y'all is you've got some land. Okay. You've got some land. What do you want to grow? And this can be literal. This could be whatever. But what do you want to grow on this land? Whoever wants to start us off. Oh, take it away. I love this question because I often share and teach about the list of awesome and not going, not always pointing out all the things you'd like to fix, but let's add to what you already have. And so with the land, the more you do, the more work you do on the land, the more you, am I saying the right term? You, you till the ground. You are the soil. I'm not a farmer, but I do believe that the more you add, the more you can share. And so it's funny because people would often say, hope you're really generous. And I would say, oh, I like for you to have your own, not necessarily some of mine. And that is, that is twofold, not because I'm being selfish, but let me give you your item. And so if there's something that I would build, it would be, it would be a place. I would probably build a colony or community so that artists could continue to create. Diane McIntyre, Jowalee Willa-Jozalaro on a panel once, and they were talking about some place in Harlem, and I'm sorry I don't know this history, but they were talking about how dancers would just come and perform and rehearse or sit around and I'm thinking, where is that place? Where is the location where we can have an artist community? We can have a house, a Harlem house or something, where you can just, oh, I need a studio, or I need a place to come and paint, or I want to have an interview with Lady Dana. Lady Dana, I like to talk about that. Or Diane, could you help do something for me? Could you mentor me? If there's a place for that, then people will continue to grow. And I just, I just feel like the arts are the, the art itself is something that is, that breaks barriers and has no language barrier. I've been in museums around the world. I've met people and not known a lick of English and been able to communicate with sound and music. And if we can continue to do that, then we will continue to build. Mm, and that housing piece, that housing piece is Harlem house. Let's do, let's, let's Harlem house, yeah! I mean, just how many generations of stability are created by having a place to live, you know, and not having to worry about where you, if you're going to wind up on the streets, you know what I mean? How much stress does that take off of you? I just want to give big ups to sis Mariah Moore in Louisiana, who's working with trans communities to provide housing and bought land and is building homes for trans folks. And this is huge because this is housing is, it's like, if you don't have housing, this is the opening the door to all kinds of vulnerabilities and casualties. And I think that being able to provide housing for folks is setting up generations, you know, it's giving generations a chance to actually thrive and go and be because I don't have to worry about where I'm going to sleep tonight. So I'm with you on the housing. I would want to grow sunflowers. Sunflowers detoxify the soil and they just make people happy. I don't know that out there. Who else? What are you growing on your land? Have you just got some acres? What's up? Two things come to mind for me metaphorically. The idea of the mustard seed and lemons. Those two things. Lemon trees. You know, just metaphorically having, you know, what you can turn the lemons into lemonade kind of metaphor. You know, what can you do, right? With a little, you take a little and you make it into a lot. Our ancestors had so much faith in just doing that. You know, that unbelievable to me that that was a hard question for me because there were so many things going through my mind in terms of sowing something to make it grow. And there's so many things that could be so to make it grow that I couldn't really focus on one thing. And so the mustard seed and the lemon came to mind only because those are things I heard throughout my childhood. You know, like you can turn lemons into lemonade. Like she was not that, she was that person that if you told Granny something was wrong, she'd be like, you better go figure that out. Yes, yes. I got time for you sitting around here belly ache and go figure it out. We are our own salvation. There it is. Right, you know. There was just so many things that were running through my mind in terms of need and want. I think of water and the lack of water globally, particularly, you know, there were just so many things, you know, and to so you need water and people are struggling from Flint, Michigan. Like it was just so much. And I know you said to think about the immediate but my brain just doesn't work like that. You know, I tend to think about the diaspora. And the connectivity of it all because it's all, you know, it's all connected. Yeah. Okay, so you're just like, let me start with the symbolic crops. And then of course, I went through that whole thing in that short time of like thinking about what land ownership meant to black and brown people in black people in this country, the enslaved Africans, you know, what, what land meant, you know, and. Yeah. And the idea of owning land, like, isn't that an invention of colonialism? Right. I mean, is it really owning land? Is it private property? Is that really important? You know, and thinking about the ways in which, you know, I mean, land is such a, I mean, such a bedrock of, you know, systemic racism and white supremacy, you know, when land makes you think of from redlining, all of the ways in which land has been this thing that we as black groupers told to own, but it was always a barrier in terms of our ownership of land and property, you know. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah, it is. It's a, it's a, there's lots of layers to untangle with that. Lady Dan, what do you want to grow? So I keep going for my, for the mouse, right? To unmute myself. And I'm like, wait, you want your phone, girl? Land, oh, this is such a, you know, it's, right? Because it's like, does anyone actually own land, right? Right. Or is it, or is the, or is the question for me, right? As I think about, as I think about the question, as the question for me is, what would happen if there was a piece of land that I was able to create a personal relationship with? Uh-huh, uh-huh. That like, that was not, that was not interfered with by white supremacy. When I think about that, I think about food, right? I think about what are the things that we actually need to sustain our bodies, our hearts and our minds. And our minds, herbs, right? Herbs, you can make medicines from herbs. I think about, I also think about, you know, what is this building homes, right? So that like, folks don't got to worry about, do they have a roof of their head or not, right? And then I also, you know, I also, because we have the, we have the gift of imagining, right? A place in which we can so love into the land and that love actually grows and spreads out. A place where we can sing songs of freedom into the land and that the land actually cultivates things for us to be able to sustain our freedom. A place in which we are able to do ritual, ritual that perhaps is in some of our DNA. And it was hidden there by our ancestors who had to hide it there because they were forced to worship a white God. A place in which we can celebrate each other, hold each other, heal with each other, heal ourselves without the sense of capitalistic urgency. A place that could feel perhaps like a heaven on earth. A place where we all free from a profession. Yeah, being in good relationship with the land and good relationship with the land. That's what I think about. I mean, but I also do feel like, Dane, you just kind of laid down an incantation that was like going to bring this forth. Okay. I don't know if y'all heard the intonation and the intentionality, but I heard it. I felt it. So I feel like it's coming to us now. Thank you. Thank you, Dane. That's fun. So going back to this idea of if we are our, you was on mute. I've been trying to say that you was on mute. Oh, Dane. What you saying? Oh, Dane. Oh, sorry. Now I was going to say that there, I mean, I just read recently there, there a group of black folks that did just that. They bought a lot of land to build their own Right a land to build their own town I was just dain just made me lady dain. You just made me think With what you know, I was envisioning that that was their planning meeting I was like that must have been their planning meeting. That's how they got Because that is the and you know, but that brings up a good That brings up something for me diane in the sense of I was reading about this town that they want to start in georgia as a safe space for black folk and I mean not exclusively black but like it's Centering blackness and and and being protective of it But then I was a little concerned because I was like but I know what state it's in and and I know what they look like and If I did some research maybe at the fire and where this place is and so then my mind starts going to Safety safety safety, right? How do we make those what comes up black wall street? You know those things start to Then we start to go. Oh goodness to be to be to be isolated in one space is that You know, that's a good best. I mean that it is you need a fortress, right? You would think because I mean we this is I mean talk about land. I mean central park right Central park was bulldozer in a village in a domain to be, you know To make the park so What did yeah, what does it mean when we are on land? What does it mean when we are developing a relationship with the land? We are so in love into it and the the legacy of that being Interrupted or there being some type of Violent disconnect with that but at the same time, you know, I don't want to necessarily stop dreaming and stop sowing seeds and stop Trying to find cultivate and create space just because of the of the threat of violence and yet it is ever present Well, I mean we're under threat of violence every day, right? That is our our daily Reality that's our reality, you know violence and trauma and we are moving through it in the midst of that So, you know my question and this actually segues into my question, which is if we are our own salvation What do we do to protect ourselves and community? Um every day and so that's the question I'm posing to y'all and this could be as simple as you know, I'm You know, I'm making sure that I'm drinking enough water or you know, I'm I'm Here's an organization. You need to reach out to you. I'm organizing and activating with them You know, what are what are we doing to keep each other safe? I'm thinking about something Dane since you're you're you're where I'm at you're in D.C The the the karan hilton incident that happened with MPD Monday or it was very recently Um And the the unrest that that that popped off in response to that and black lives matter dc Created this hashtag. We keep us safe or they're using this hashtag We keep us safe and it made me think about this conversation of how are we keeping ourselves safe? And then I think about hope what can you talking about earlier being pitted against one another and the violence that comes with um having to You know turning all of that anger or hatred or feeling of helplessness onto one another How are we how are we healing that and I think dane you mentioned The rates of murder of black trans women is unacceptable It and it is it is us within our community that is committing these murders This is the most horrifying thing when I you know I can't why I can't watch all of the videos But when I when I can bring myself to The familiarity the familiar familiarity of these women the familiarity of these community members who are attacking these women. I mean, this is We have got to name that you know, we've got to name that and we've got to we've got to We've got to deal with that because how are we keeping us safe? How are we our own salvation when this violence is what is you know cycling through cycling through the community? so, um What was the question? Let me actually go go go. The question was Uh Where's my cell box? Let me get off of Uh But what are you doing? What are you doing to to to make yourself feel safe? What are you doing to? Um, you know build a sense of safety and security for for yourself for your family for your community What what what's that look like? What's safety look like for you today? I think it's basically what I'm trying to ask Well, I I want to I want to say something though, right because I I want to say something I recognize right that that transphobia as we experience it today, right is that it's roots um and homophobia and classism and anti-blackness and and biphobia and ableism You know that all of patriarchy Massage noir as we say right But all of these things find their root within colonization and imperialism and so That I often tell folks I say well, listen if you are a black person and you are Transphobic, you are actually doing the work of your oppressor You are actually perpetuating a white supremacist system And I need for you to heal whatever trauma you need to heal So that you can operate within clarity True liberation True liberation I want to address I want to address that too, right because I think that Um, and that's why I talk about right. It's not just about we must we must go and we must address systematic white supremacy We must also address when we internalize it, right? We must also dismantle the internalized white supremacy And so um my work um is about uh When I think about like what keeps me safe, right? What keeps me safe? Um, I Build community with people who are invested in not just my survival, but my thriving um because I am not invested and um giving time energy or priority to folks who are not And I think that as I think that when I was young Right, like I was told I was uh I was given an idea of love that was really abuser dynamics And so You know the healing work that I do for myself and recognizing that I have the right to dictate to other folks How you how you are in community with me? So one one way that I keep myself safe is that I prioritize My right to say if you are going to be in community with me You must be committed to dismantling white supremacy and all of its ills period No matter what color you is um, I Um, I think for some other folks, right? I think that I tell other folks who are More willing Um to arm themselves in different in other ways that they have the right to do that um, I tell black women Indigenous women in my life That you have the right to your rage And you have the right to defend yourself against harm Um, and so I I I keep myself safe by Making sure that I'm also when I'm in conversation with other women um that I am Centering and celebrating our right to be safe And saying, you know, you don't gotta you don't gotta let somebody in your life, baby just because And I and Just because they shared blood with you Just because y'all went to high school together Just because y'all took that class together You have the right to dictate the terms of love So that's you know, that's a word I'll say They take the terms I'm gonna need to trademark that then I'm gonna need you to make the question and also fighting for a world Right and also fighting for a world that actually Where white supremacy does not exist because I understand that my black trans sisters are being murdered Not simply because of an individual but because of a system that has that has tried to exterminate us Since before 16 19 Since the minute that white men stepped their dirty fleet feet On mother Africa And on this floor so yeah Go off Okay And this is and this is and I cannot stress enough Dane what you are saying about the right to feel safe You know, we're gonna talk a little bit about actually, you know what? I'm just gonna drop it right now The voter to do is make an election day plan Right make an election day plan And I I want to talk about this at this particular moment moment because I do want to center safety What makes you feel the safest do you need to go with others? How can we do that in a coveted? You know a aware way are there do you know what to do if you face discrimination at the at the from a poll worker You know what I mean? Do you do? Do you know the numbers to call should that happen? So making an election day plan is you know, yes making sure you have something to sit on say for instance if you're planning on standing in line for a long time or A lot of those types of comfort things but also safety And that you have the right to feel safe and your safety should be centered in everything that you're doing I can't I can't support that more I can't support it more All right, who's that next who's that next we're thinking about safety. What are you doing to make yourself feel safe? What's that look like for you? I Hope you want to take it next or you want me to whatever you'd like my friend Um, I I will say that um, I don't always believe that I'm doing enough for myself um, and I know that the only way to continue to Uh, do those like I guess there's that there's that never feeling like you are enough and What has been giving me a security is that I am a part of the It's not really a steering committee. It's like a working group of um The agma which is the american guild of musical artists. We they we now have a black caucus and so being surrounded by uh So many people who are interested in dismantling white supremacy And I tell you lady dane your words are just like you were in this meeting last night and it was like you were there I mean everything you were saying I was like, oh, yeah, and I was taking notes by the way That's why I'm always looking down because I'm writing I'm taking notes, but I don't feel like in listening to you even that I'm doing enough and um, I if I if I am not if we are not then we can't continue to pass on the words like you are passing on And so I I have work to do In surrounding myself and in surrounding myself with people who will continue to help me So what you're saying to me is a lesson um That I need to work toward All the powers of the people oh, yeah Diane let's dig in get into it yeah feeling I mean for me safety means being able to be my authentic self And to always communicate Spaces of discomfort in any kind of relation whether it's a A platonic relationship a friendship professional spaces um I'm always very clear to articulate Where there's a problem and that is something I grew into um over the years of of dealing with the trauma Those things happening and I just decided my job is not to take care And because the only place I would feel unsafe is outside of my community around white people And that's just a reality for me And so I no longer feel unsafe in those spaces because I have a clear articulation of where the problems are when they are there Yeah, I'm no longer quiet. I don't have the need to take care of Blanche myrtle susie tom dick or harry. I don't I don't have I don't have that need to do that and um, you know in thinking about this idea of safety It's making me think of the last place Where I was the director of a particular department and the ways in which everything I did um There was someone trying to get in my way and Trying to box me in make me feel uncomfortable make me feel unworthy of being there I'm challenging my whole sense of being and I remember going into my boss's office and I said Everybody in this institution gets to be exactly who they are You hired a black girl with a hyphenated identity Who is afro caribbean? Who's from the south bronx who lives in harlem? Who's the daughter of immigrants? That's what you're going to get Everything i'm not going to come in here and not be the black girl that lives in harlem That is what i'm going to do if everybody gets to be Their authentic selves all the ways they are seeking to oppress my being And to make me feel unsafe Than I get to be who I am And for that So I no longer, you know, I you know, I I would sit in meetings and say I don't have time to play with y'all Y'all are doing too much and not enough Like I don't have time for this So safety for me doesn't exist in in that you know feeling unsafe in in those ways don't exist for me Where safety becomes an issue for me Is when I watch what's happening to men and women who look like me on a daily basis Is when I begin to feel This sense of urgency for the work that we've got to do to To cause a real shift in this country like like lady name said it's not just about november 3rd If we really want to talk about safety is the work that we have to do come the fourth the fifth On and on and on if we really want to talk about what safety looks like in this country We have to talk about the continual work And I think that's why for me family new hamer was so important because somehow she understood that It wasn't just about her getting into office. It was all of the work that she was doing In addition to getting getting into office That is the work that lady dane is talking about I want to you know just talk it, you know lady I mean everything you said was spot-on and particularly about this idea of trauma and What we're facing within our community is that many of us don't know that we're experiencing trauma And we don't we don't know and we don't have the language to articulate What's welling up inside of us? So a lot of the things that we're putting off on each other is the pain and the pain that has been handed down And it's been packaged nicely for us and that pain is rooted in all from the systemic racism from the jim crow days from jim crow laws to uh White supremacy all of that has been packaged so nicely for us, you know It's like the equivalent I remember I was taking care of a friend once and the aunt came to the hospital and this girl is like She's she's dying of cancer and the aunt comes To bring all this stuff and I told her she needs to take a little tiffani box of pain And if she ain't going to wrap it here she need to take a little box of pain and take it on back with her well been really good as Good as a community Is handing down the pain Is handing down the trauma And we've been good at it because we don't even recognize that that's what we're doing So what you're talking about lady name is really getting at the heart of that and really having people And that's another thing about safety feeling safe enough to even talk about I'm in pain and I don't know why I'm hurting and I don't know why You know, I think that there's been so much So much put on us and and that's not even our own in the ways in which we move through the world and We have to be strong and we have to like I've never subscribed to that strong black woman thing I don't know what that is. I don't know who she is But I've never subscribed to it and you know that for me is where pain resides also and we're feeling unsafe resides that you just always got to be like That's the stuff that we got to chip away at Oh That's this idea of perfectionism. Yeah That has to be swashed. Yeah That's wonderful everything Everything and all things for everyone right and the one mistake Then there's something wrong with us We don't and it's unfair, you know and a lot of the work that I I do I look at a lot of video footage that's surrounding some of the stuff that's happening you know culturally and socially and What has been striking me is when I look at how black women are affronted in Out in the world in society and how She begins to take on this vibrato almost from a very map like she's emits emulating How a man would respond to such things And it always makes me think of such inner truth ain't I a woman right Because at some point that black woman no longer sees herself as a woman because she has to protect herself And I've watched this these videos with this kind of thing And oftentimes there are men sitting around Watching this woman having to defend herself in this way and it's it's really it's It's a lot. It's a heavy heavy burden, right? It's a heavy armor It's a heavy armor Dane, I see you. I think Yeah, my my y'all my camera is over here. My mic my mic was coming on and off. I was like, hold on Child Honey, she's doing stunts and shows tonight. I child if y'all could just see my phone right now The top row is like gone and I'm like So No, I was Child No, I was gonna say, you know, it's you know, this this idea right of like packaging pain, right? It's because also that pain that trauma also sometimes it makes us rich literally Literally how many how many plays have we seen where it's just trauma porn How many movies have we seen where it's just trauma porn where it's just violence on black bodies for the sake of violence on black bodies Absolutely, which is which is what which is right, which is like which is um And then we're told and then we're told That you're only noble when you suffer And I reject that I reject that notion of us needing to suffer And as artists, that's the other thing because when you think about suffering right and and as artists this idea of We're supposed to be suffering for the work. I'm like, look I'm literally not missing any news Like I don't like those those things just don't make sense to me. Like why are we doing that? And I want to say this too just to reflect on what you said Diane I actually think you know, this is the thing when we peel back the layers I think what we call masculine and feminine and actually that I actually think what happened because we really look back in the history There were warrior goddesses who were as comfortable in the bedroom and as comfortable to make up on As they were with taking a machete to somebody's neck And so for me when I when we're talking about You know, I'm talking about masculine feminine and just in contemporary times just looking at how um you know Young black women are having to fend for themselves and take care of themselves in situations They clearly can't win in and it's an unsafe space for them to be in and you know Just thinking about that, you know, and why should they have to be in that position? Right. Why should why should someone um take liberties on their Person in that way to begin with Right, and then why do they have to be in the position of having to defend themselves in a space that they clearly cannot win in because They're overpowered. It's a it's a it's a really it's a serious issue And I think this comes back to lady dang when we're talking about what's happening to trans women. It's the same thing It's it's no one should take liberties over our bodies the way that they do and there's something about, you know, I think patriarchy that allows that to be true and because there's that for black men too And it's real and we have to talk about it if we're talking about really, I mean healing And um from a holistic perspective, we have to have all of these conversations. No matter how difficult they are You know, I wonder what the role of community is, right? Because I think that you know, oftentimes would have what has come up y'all I also I'd still my my phone is being shady. Um, so So all I all I see right now are my hands And hope You have your whole your whole self insight Awesome So I you know, I I so I wonder right because like even as even as we talk about, um You know this idea we take care of ourselves What does that mean really? Because if we really want to get down to like the nitty gritty of it, it's like, you know, if you see a girl Who is being attacked in the street If you see a man who is being attacked in the street Are you going to put on some boxing gloves and go on defend that person? Are you going to go on and and and and mediate the situation so that there is peace in the community? Um, if you know somebody's hungry You go on you go and get food for them If you know somebody needs to leave an abusive relationship because also I think sometimes I'll say this in this space Because you know, we are all Um who we are There have been times where it's like, you know that there is a person who is being abused in a house Are we going to really do as a community what we need to do to make sure that when that woman when that sister leaves that abusive man That she has a place to lay her head That she has food on her table And so like for me Um the the questions that I ask in regards to the work that needs to happen After the four and the fifth and on the fifth and the sixth and the seventh It's like what does it mean for us to create a community of care? That transcends And that is not invested in patriarchy As the saving grace or even capitalism as the saving grace Well, I was How do we love on each other in a way that is transformative? Go ahead. Hope. I'm sorry Well, no, no, no, I was um, I was just going to say the one thing that I think That can be overcome But the the issue of it is that the one thing that I found is more addictive than sugar is power And then people want power so much that they intend Uh to do good But then that takes over the power takes over because then you have to relinquish it to someone else So maybe you have to share it or it tasted good or it felt good the power that you had And that's when community breaks down to me when when someone is so in charge that they can make decisions and rules And then they're wearing a cloak and they're wearing a crown and they don't want to give it up Whereas power really is in this conversation powers really in your comments lady dane your Comments diane are all on this paper that i'm writing in that is collectively giving me What I need so that then I can continue and grow So this community is the way is really the only way But then community needs to be redefined. We need to redefine And dismantle our training so that we can start to build up again And it can't just happen one at a time. It has to happen as a unit well, I mean to to both of your points, you know when I think about community and um and I think about how I move through the world and how I live and I'm fortunate I'm very fortunate that I have a community that um I don't care what's going on. They will move heaven and earth We will do that for each other and you know, I hadn't talked about this in a while But one example is two years ago when my mom passed I didn't know what I needed but I had about like my girlfriends They came for nine days and nine nights. They sat with me. No one they wouldn't leave me alone They were here like, you know The things you see in the movies with old church ladies come and they sit around you all day That's what that's essentially that's what they did. They cook they clean one day. I got out by myself and they were calling He said well, who let outside like That love But I think that that's really powerful and I in this conversation I'm realizing just how many communities I'm fortunate to have That is in that way I live in a building that I've been in for 20 some odd years. There's a community in here my neighbors like Someone was staying here. I was away. They were like, who lives there and they were like miss diane Okay, then you're fine. So the that's the kind of community you're talking about hope and We have to be able to give our ourselves also in order to find that kind of community Right, so we cannot talk about wanting Um community all of us collectively But we're not able to be transparent enough And vulnerable enough to allow community to find us I have my transform True. Yeah, absolutely. I'm laying on the hands honey I was missing something I'm laying on the hands not a laying on our bodies, but I'm laying on the That's what I was thinking. That's what I was mother goddess into talking. Yeah And I mean this is like I mean we're at we're at time, but this is This is what I am so proud to be a partner This is what I'm so proud to to to be able to call as tochi rating says call a circle You know, because this is this is where the transformative love This is where the community saving being its own salvation starts. So I want to thank Hope Diane lady dane. Thank you for being here to close us all close us out for this series This was like the perfect way to just bring it on home And I want to share one last quote from from fanny lou hammer Which is you can pray until you faint But unless you get up and try to do something god is not going to put it in your lap See right there That's the last bit from this Fanny Lou But thank you so much for joining us check out um mbt's facebook page instagram Website, I'm so filled with love. I don't really I'm struggling to find the words but Thank you so much for joining