 Can we begin? We can. All right. I'm Mary Riley and tonight from the Ward 6 NPA Staring Committee we have Joel and we have Michelle Maraz. We have Nelson Martell and that's all we have. We have Caroline Hauser. She is on a phone call in and possibly losing connection but she's here right now and Matt Grady is unable to be here this evening. So thank you to everybody for coming. This marks one year. Although the last March was our last meeting that was in person so this is our one year anniversary of COVID meetings and hopefully we could meet in person sooner than later. Yes, yes. Oh yeah, that'll be sharing a meal at the church. We can all just go in the same room. What a concept. So all right, so this evening I guess first off we have to have our public forum. If anybody has anything to say in the public forum I don't see any hands up but I'm not sure. I was just going to say if anybody needs to present or do anything like that, like share their screen just let me know and I'll make you a co-host. Yeah, I've got a file of the slide deck that we've been presenting to NPAs and the zoning meeting which I could try to put up. I've got my IT tech wife here next to me just in case I need some help but William's also very capable but I was looking at this as an experiment tonight to see if I can actually do this. Doing it solo Dave. Come on we want to see you do it. Yeah. So Liam could you make John Franklin's video active? He's providing our musical prelude this evening. Sure um yeah I can ask him to start his video but he himself. Oh okay I thought all right I misunderstood. Anyone else um any other announcements in the public forum? So next up we have music. Wait I have a public forum. All right um so I was acting word clerk for the election on Tuesday. Becky Lavasser was an acting inspector. Oh and now she's an elected inspector. She's got a three-year term as inspector of election in word six and I um just wanted to give a shout out to Becky for running a fabulous writing campaign and for everyone in our planning team and all the election officials and all the workers who worked long and hard to pull off an incredibly smooth election for word six. It was incredible. I was home by 9 15 p.m. which has never happened at an election so I just want to say hats off to everyone who contributed to that election uh including Karen Paul who stood at the door getting blasted by cold air every 60 seconds. So anyway I just wanted to shout out to all who were involved in the election in word six. Thank you you folks did a really nice job Michelle. I I don't know how you folks do it. It was seamless. It was it was it was just really really easy and it was nice to come down. Any other public comment? Karen? Hey I can't let that one go Michelle. You know the the and we all like to think that word six does everything the best. They do elections the best and it was great to have so many people who volunteered. You know a couple of years ago we had problems finding people to work at the polls. It was really hard and um now we have so many I think it's really an embarrassment of riches that we have as many people who want to come and um it's a fun it's a fun way to spend part of your day. You know on election day you see a lot of people and uh uh but they were really well running. I am so glad to know that you were home about two hours after I left. So kudos to all of you. That's wonderful news I'm glad because there were it wasn't that long ago that you were there until after midnight. Maybe even longer but but way too late. 2 15 a.m after the general election in 2016 and I'll just to follow up on that Karen. We haven't had a trouble finding volunteer workers. That has actually not been a problem. It's been a problem finding people to run to be an official. So inspectors and ward clerks that's been a challenge but um Ward 6 has found a workaround for that and it's working really really well and so we have a lot of leadership and we have a lot of support from volunteer workers so yeah it's working out. And the only okay I'm going to chewed our horn. The only ward who has gotten back to City Hall returning all the materials at the end of the night faster than us the last several elections has been Ward 8 and Ward 8 has about half as many voters as we do. So we're doing great. Yeah yay. Yes it's awesome. All right anyone else? Public form? Public comment? All right now we are fortunate enough to have music again this evening and our music will be by John Franklin and I see. Hello it's okay that I'm from Ward 5. We'll let you in tonight. I could do it was a shambles here in Ward 5 I gotta tell you. So I just want to make sure I understand the concept here's like I'm just gonna be playing you're gonna be listening you want to be sitting in a meeting for longer than you have to. I see on the agenda it says 645 to 730 normally what we do is we have music for about five minutes and then maybe after our city place representatives present maybe you could play again if you're willing to stay a little bit after that presentation if not. Well yeah I think I can do that because I gotta reach my kids and stuff but play for as long as you want at the beginning. Five minutes is is lovely that way as people come on more we can enjoy your lovely music. Okay well I'll give a shout out to my collaborator Debussy. I'm gonna play a piece by Debussy that's a little over my head which means I'm gonna play it more slowly than it should go and there's still gonna be a few passages that are reached for me but I'll do my best on that. Thank you. Thank you. It's from a suite of pieces called Cease Epigraph Antique six ancient inscriptions and this one is for invoking pan god of the east wind. Okay is that I don't have any minutes that was should I play another couple minutes? That is I think that was perfect and lovely thank you so much it's so nice to hear live music. I really enjoyed it thank you so much. Thanks for crossing the war boundaries for us. Okay. All right next up we have uh John Vickery no we do not. Next up we have City Place thank you for coming and Joel's gonna introduce you I just want to say one thing um my son is the most excited high school junior in the world to be going to VHS downtown tomorrow thank you so much from the bottom of my heart I and I had the luxury of volunteering in it the other day and it looks fantastic it's got soul it's not your basic boring high school I I think it's fantastic there's no other high school like this in the whole country and thank you so much for all the effort you put forth and now I'll let Joel introduce you. Okay so next up like Mary said is City Place Update um with us tonight we have Dave Farrington um I haven't seen Jesse Beck is Jesse Beck on tonight. He can't make it. Okay so um in his place we have um uh William Fellows is here he's he's our on the development team he's the project construction architect the you know construction administrator uh actually he was involved way back when when he was just a little boy with the first presentation when when uh when Don first came to town it was William's firm from New York City that had made the initial presentation of the City Place project. We designed the 14-story building. Wow. Which is now a nine-story building. And is is Don with us tonight? I see what's that is being here Don Sinek is he here? I don't see him. I don't see him yet he said he was going to join he might yeah I sent him the invite but um okay well you guys have the floor okay all right so yeah you can put the ticket yeah so somebody who's gonna allow me to share right see here share screen yeah yeah you should be able to share could I could I ask people is how familiar you are with the project have you would you participate in the public meetings we had in January just to get a sense of how how you've been following it and so forth did you see the presentation that we did in January in February? I didn't I didn't know okay I think uh Karen Karen's seen I sent her the slide deck a month or so ago and I think I also sent it to Matt Matt and did they send it to you Joel? No if you did I just haven't had time to to to look at it yeah so um no I just I opened it I don't know if it's up there or not. You you just have to share your screen through zoom when you head back to the zoom meeting there should be a green button down at the bottom um that says share screen for you there you go there we go okay so what are you seeing okay there you go you got it all right the city place Burlington Vermont team the whole page is up now I think there we go I think you're good this this is a first here and William can do a test to my uh you got it you got it you got it so yeah this is exciting uh so this is our our presentation we've been making to uh the NPAs we presented to four and seven last week obviously we were presented to two and three when we were going through the the original um hearings and this is basically the set of plans that was presented to the zoning office as part of our permit package that um again tooting our horn tonight we got through the DRB last night with a five to zero unanimous vote and approval of the package which lets us move move ahead on the next steps um so this this first slide just uh calls out our um team here uh the Freeman French Freeman Jesse back who can't be with us we're using local civil civil engineering firm uh engineering associate um down on Flynn Avenue um and um the environmental landscape people SE group is is local ATC is a local firm and then our development team which is uh led by Don um myself Scott Ireland Al Seneca and William and Matt Young is our um consultant who's been working on the estimates and the scheduling and some of the presentation packages um so this next slide shows us just kind of locates where we're at um you can see the the slide or the uh place in the yellow is the whole project site that's bounded by the existing cherry and bank streets and shows the new proposed st paul's green on the right hand side which is the dotted yellow line going up the the right hand side and the new proposed pine street extension on the left hand side that ties the existing pine and st paul through to where they used to run up to cherry street um and then the pinkish color over on the side is the the new macy's project which new berlington high school which we just uh completed uh yesterday and the kids are back today so that kind of gives you a layout of the land next slide shows um in these light gray colors the the proposed buildings that we're going to construct um this u-shaped building which is on the north side of the project at front cherry street all the way between the old macy's building and where the l l bean building now sits um the entire frontage of cherry is going to be a u-shaped building uh we're proposing to build it in two phases getting going this fall on the northwest side which is going to be like a l um which has got about 170 or 180 apartments in it and then following up with the remainder of that building um which is the kind of seven shape that comes back down st paul street uh continues long cherry down st paul and that's got the about the same number 170 or 180 for a total of 350 apartments in that first building the north building as we're calling it the last phase of this project which follows up um after this north building's built and the parking garage that's kind of an infill that's like the donut hole in the middle south building has about 70 units in it for a total of 400 and what's the number will you 426 the the blue colors show the new roadways on the the left and right side or the east and west of our building lot showing the new pine street extension that connects from right by the corner the intersection of 100 bank the old chitin and bank building and the macy's building it used to continue right right alongside there and we're going to reconnect that as well as uh on the east side the st paul street um new road extension that will come from the existing nbt bank building alongside in between the bean building and our new project and tying in at that intersection that's right by the the new bus center um that's about it for this slide there's a couple of uh it's elevation this is looking boy where's that william that's um it's looking down the new pine street across cherry looking uh i guess southeast looking that way from the north these is just off to the right church is just off to the left yeah okay so our total project we've got 426 units of housing throughout the the two two buildings and three phases of it um with the 20 percent inclusionary housing puts us at 85 affordable units that are um the 20 percent of whatever we have which is like a studio or one bedroom or two bedroom 20 percent of those become this inclusionary housing we've got about 40 000 or so square feet of retail space at the ground floor circling the entire project so all the street front is active with with retail spaces like i said in between all the buildings there's kind of that donut hole in the middle and that's where we've got the parking garage we've got 420 or so spaces for cars and 350 or so spaces for bikes um in there and um the total size of this whole project's about 700 000 square feet which is about 30 percent less than the original proposal that um was brought brought to the city say four years ago that was a little over a million square feet this is now uh the highest level here's a 10th floor that's a restaurant i believe over on building two um and these this building that's shown here's nine stories high um here's a here's a little click on it yeah yeah here's a depiction of the old versus the new or the we'll say the the um you know devenwood brookfield version versus the new city place version so the light gray that's kind of towering over everything was the original proposal that had it topping out around 14 stories and now the new new height the highest thing is the mechanical penthouse on top of the the south building which is on your right hand side this is like a slice right through the building if you're standing at macy's looking east so there's been about a 50 foot drop on the north and about a 20 plus drop on the south from what it was originally i'm gonna go down here hold on so yeah this is the uh the lowest level of the parking plan we've got about 215 or so spaces 214 spaces here um this is below grade which you drive in there's a couple of ways to get into the parking levels but you come off of either the new pine or the new st paul and you get down below grade to this parking um and it has storage for the tenants and some mechanical spaces some m e p electrical electrical rooms and boiler rooms and kind of utilitarian stuff in the basement this is the uh the plan at street level all the the yellow colored boxes you see are different retail stores um different sizes that are available and this this isn't really totally fixed in stone there's flexibility and how these different sizes can come into play if somebody needs a little more a little less space we've got basically storefront all the way around the four sides of our project which is retail you know glass storefront you walk in into these various spaces um there's other entryways into the parking garage or loading docks that allow you access to the various parts of the buildings next level up there's uh additional parking all the way around um the yellow shows the stair towers that access with elevators each each level and then above that we get into um apartments and on the u shape building that's the part of the uh the cherry street frontage uh that building's all residential once we're above uh the the commercial retail space and um it's a layout of different size apartments uh studios one bedroom two bedroom apartments all the way around and they'll be looking out over a courtyard um that is the top of the the parking structure in between the buildings with the south building that's the building that runs parallel to bank street the second floor we've got some community space that was uh negotiated in the the development agreement that is open meeting space for whoever um it'll get scheduled through the CEDO office all the different wards can can use it if they want to have their meetings there it'll be um open space there'll be some private offices a co-working space which is kind of open and um open to the public it'll be like uh by subscription and some more kind of utility space around the perimeter of that next level up two three four five six I believe are all um different varying floor plates I just showed the different options for apartments the one bedrooms the studios two bedrooms on each level in each building right through the eighth floor looking very similar I'll let William explain what's going on up here he's he's been more involved in this well this is the roof level the north side is uh has a green roof and there are two mechanical penthouses the green roof is related both to the the city requirements as well as dovetailing into our lead gold application and on the on the south side we have an observation deck which is part of the development agreement along with the community space that we saw below and and with that is a restaurant in with its kitchen that is part of the observation deck and people can come up and either use the restaurant or use the observation deck um have a few of the lake and can events William can events be scheduled up there on the observation deck yeah as well as in the community room and I think the restaurant probably is going to have a schedule of having private events or public events depending on what they are so the whole thing could probably be used as one thing as well as they could be used separately some in a simultaneous manner yeah so like somebody could have a wedding up there out on the on the green space observation deck and then have it catered inside right yeah or a political event yeah we've had enough of those you've had enough of those for a couple of years or a community event yeah all right next this is the tippity top roof right here and um this is showing uh we've I think we got like 150 kw pv array and we're trying to to bump that up a little bit more but um that's actually with the revisions from the previous design till now we've actually been able to grow this pv array which is a sort of a benefit of having a smaller building yeah these these are the solar solar panels that'll feed into to our house electrical system and and help cut to cut down on our electrical usage somewhat yeah then next stop uh that's kind of another just the perspective we're kind of standing at like the uh across from yellow bean at the city or the state office building looking southwest at what's going to be the new building at st paul street that's going to be kind of cutting down between bean in our building you can see the the light gray building over on the kind of in between bean in the red building is the building that's on bank street and this is the corner of the building on cherry and st paul the bus station you can see the the old cathedral bell tower on your right so that kind of gives you that that corner perspective this was done that you can see the difference between this was done to show the change in height and massing that we had before into what we now have so it sounds like height was a really big issue yes definitely was joe definitely was and then the next one where are we looking here this is a long just looking back across cherry yeah so part of the form-based code is has a lot of emphasis on storefront clarity transparency into the stores so you can see that from st paul to to the new pine street it is mostly glazing mostly retail there obviously some building entrances that go along with that but it is along this view corridor which cherry is designated as this i think is going to have a big impact in terms of making the connection between battery and church street right they're trying to encourage a lot of traffic from church street back down to the waterfront along this road and and connecting connecting the waterfront to the marketplace so a lot of shops along this lower level on cherry street will give people a chance to at least draw them off of church street or draw them off the waterfront and get a mixing on this street yeah see next one where are we here just looking down pine street at 100 bank yeah 100 banks the brown building over in the the right hand corner so this is the corner of basically we're standing at the corner of macy's at the new high school looking east next shot this is down on bank this is the barb magru shot right here right well she'd be up a little higher i think yeah right we know that but yeah this is from the key bank building or the old emerald city water beds looking north oh who remembers that you can see the rest on top yeah this is the standalone building that is on the corner of st paul street and bank street and it it goes to the west and stops just short of the existing 100 bank street 7 brunington square building the brown building that's standing there on the corner right now street level shot of the same this is you can pass this these are two-dimensional images of the streets the streetscape this is looking at it from st paul yeah this uh slide deck was put together for the um d rb presentation yesterday i believe this is looking along bank street elevation you can see the massing comparison to 100 bank this is um observation deck should have a clear view over the top um of 100 bank right along here yeah there are some mechanical pieces on top of 100 bank but i think you'll definitely be able to see across it the the views to the north are actually as uh as interesting and and uh as the views to the south right yeah beautiful mountain views to the uh to the west uh east yeah this is looking along cherry street elevation and looking down looking at it from pine street right so if if you're standing in the new high school looking east that's it is it wow very impressive so are we going are we ready to open up for questions do we have any hands for questions so mary i'm not sure how to let the questions come through michelle is our our hosting she's got control so michelle will be able to let it however speak i think mark has a hand up and i think everyone's been promoted to panelist so i think mark can go ahead and ask his question yeah thanks dave that was a very interesting presentation and delightful to see uh the advancements made over the past months three really quick questions number one uh what is your estimation about whether these will be rental units or will they be uh buying of the apartment space that's the first question the second is uh do you have a retail interest uh already uh in these uh spaces and then third i'm interested in that solar array what percentage roughly do you think of the energy demand will be met by the solar array you may not have that answer and that's totally um understandable but it's the first two questions set a lot thanks so much yep the on the questions of the the rental they will be all rentals now at least the first phase of the building that's on cherry street and we intend the the second building which fronts on bank street to be rentals with possible conversion to ownership opportunities you know at some point we're not sure uh right now the um the financing atmosphere is um and it has been for a while condominiums are hard to get finance because you don't have a whole lot of pre-sales and and the banks rather have one person responsible for paying back the loan than say 70 people that and that's always been been the uh conundrum with condos versus rentals until it's full then the banks will lend you all kinds of money so it's um that that's in the play but um definitely you know on the table um but it's generally seen as rental and as Dave says possibly converting to ownership at some time in the future for the southern building and then the second question was um do you have any interests people wanting to rent um retail space um right now you have do you have any interest in people wanting to open stores well in the past as you go ahead well just from day one people have been interested in you know an expanded retail opportunity in burlington some of the existing shopkeepers that may want to open additional places other people that have always wanted to place downtown so it's going to open up 40 000 square feet i think we've got what about 11 separate units right now but it could be more or less but um yeah downtown burlington is that we we get a lot of great people out there shopping and um it's it's um interesting for people and um i think so William did you understand the third question about the grid well it that is a sort of a fluctuating thing i think it's it would be somewhere in a 10 percent range of capacity for the solar array we're trying to increase that and we have started to have conversations with BED about converting to an all-electric condition in terms of trying to work with their their uh zero carbon plans and we've we have in the past been come participating the 2030 initiative which is part of that um and and i think as in going into that with them the the photo array becomes a little bit more important than it was before so but it's not a large one so okay well thanks a lot much appreciated we're also kind of pursuing some other options on additional uh pv sites within the city that we we could partner with or potentially bring in the output the production from and help contribute towards our base load um but again you know we're the project was originally planned primarily as like a vermont gas based heat source but we have kind of come to terms with the administration in brunington electric looking towards trying to divert from carbon-based stuff and getting to more the electrification side of it but there's there's a lot of balls in the air there and we're working on all those trying to brainstorm and and see where we can you know get some traction but uh it looks promising though i think that we should be able to make progress with it in terms of our translating certainly heat to electrification which is the BED's main goal okay well thank you um who do we have another question yeah it looks like i think Liam has a question hi folks uh yeah i'm just i had to leave because of my um internet so um nelson would you be able to try and make me into a host um i'm just worth doing some troubleshooting behind the scenes here with michelle so thank you very much michelle i don't think any of this is behind the scenes i think all the participants get to see our communications about this problem because everyone's a panelist hey i have a question can i answer i think karen had a question first i'll let michelle go god's okay oh thanks can you say a little bit more about the green roof i uh had to step away for a minute i may have missed part of a broader explanation of that well the green the green roof is um i think the the local code is asking for 10 of the roof to be permeable the um i'm not quite sure the percentage from the lead gold but they they're very compatible in terms of overlaying one on to the other and the green roof as i hopefully some of you know is is a is a more of a visual thing and not something you walk on but it it does detain a certain amount of the storm water or or it slows it down and um we see it on the the garage roof we see it on the upper roof and there's some setbacks on the southern building where we also are going to install it i thought maybe it was rooftop garden space for the tenants but it's there is a when davis showing the the plan that had the amenity floor the the um the northern building amenities are at the garage roof and we're looking to have access to the roof for some outdoor activity well that roof it will have a large portion of it will be green and then some of it will be for mechanical equipment that would be screened from everything but so we see that that that has outdoor usage as well as the the rooftop observation deck which is on top of the southern building would have access as well yeah but to be clear it's not like a soccer field up on the roof though it's it's something that's designed to absorb a lot of rain water and hold hold some and then dissipate over time and also you know not be a stark like white roof or black roof like you see on a lot of flat top roof buildings it'll be kind of neutral and taking some of the energy and retain storm water so for instance the you can go from the amenity space out on to what would be a wearing surface on that that lower roof on the garage roof the southern building which has the co-working space in the community space there's a setback there some of it just it would be accessible to go out on but then the red remainder of that will be green roof that you can is it the north building amenity space are you saying that there could be some gardening there well not gardening like like you mean like a vegetable garden like container gardens or right you know we haven't thought of that though it's not out of the question but most of that roof is most of that roof is being spoken for in terms of the green green roof which is required for the storm water as well as for like paved areas for people to be able to be outside on the roof and then the mechanical what's left over is more likely going to be for mechanical so if you wanted to grow tomatoes you can't really do that in a container I wouldn't say it's out of the question Michelle but it's on a larger scale it's not clear to me how that would be done but certainly there may be opportunity for some people to do that on an individual level yes yeah I know the up at the hospital there's a green roof over the oncology building and the nutritional services actually does grow some you know cherry tomatoes and basil and that kind of stuff they're they're not out there with a tractor you know that's not what I think the Burlington airport also has some examples of green roofs with guard with not with gardens but with flowers shrugs and then Washington DC and New York of course are doing that on the tops of buildings a lot right maybe that's what we show the design of the roof green roof on the the airport garage roof yeah yeah so mark is right I was thinking about what we read about about New York and Washington where they utilize rooftops for container gardens or be hives or other things like that and that that's not in it right now no yeah I think that would be a real selling point as part of your gold certification seems to me that would be very very attractive Karen um thanks Joel so I have a couple I have a couple is that mine I see you you do turn your and thank you there we go Megan yeah that's no that's no problem on so first of all uh congratulations um I as a policy because the Development Review Board is a quasi judicial um since being elected I don't go to DRB meetings um so I was not aware of what went on at the DRB meeting and congratulations on that five to zero I get it um so uh the two questions that I get asked the most are um one um you know what the what the the timeline is from getting through the DRB to um some cement mixture showing up and starting to pour foundation which I assume is the first thing that would be done but you can correct me if that's not true and then the second is um you know since the settlement agreement um with the city council just a week ago um where are you or has there been any developments that you can speak to with regard to financing well I'll I can start off with thank you for you being instrumental in our not just five to zero but twelve to zero unanimous approval of getting the development agreement revised development agreement through um and I know you were working hard yeah ten two to nothing um you worked really hard because you believe in this um and and uh you've been behind this from day one we really appreciate that um that was a that was a big win and again last night um was a big um confidence booster in moving this thing forward there's still a lot of work to happen um you know we have weekly uh scheduling meetings and we talk about this we've been talking about this since September um William could probably walk us through the the next steps of you know there's a little bit of review period and then go into um this whole the final design stuff that has to happen before we see trucks on the site but uh William want to walk them through a little bit of that? Sure the um we you know we've we've been pushing the TCO schedule through um kind of bumping it down the road till uh till we finally got in and reviewed by DRB but that schedule shows the construction start in the middle of September of this year and uh different from our previous plans we have segmented this uh building project into three basic pieces the northern building as David earlier said is broken into two parts so the northwest quadrant would be the first part along with the garage second part would be um the northeast quadrant and then the southern so the the the completion I don't know the I can't end the top of my head the completion of the northern building in its totality would be in 2024 and the completion of the southern building would be in the fall of 2025 so that uh there is some overlap between the the first two segments and the second but the idea that we would be in the ground and putting apartments in the northeast quadrant um into uh occupancy in I think as early as um late 2023 and the northeast quadrant in late 2024 so um the the there are some things that we need to do now we we are in we have engaged most recently with DPW and we have to get through some things with them we need to get our documents in order but I think that um I think we we're going to have to run a little bit but I think September start date is not out of the question now and we have previously had a much earlier approvals um sort of date in the end of January now that's at the end of we can say the end of February right even though it's the beginning of March but so we're we're looking to sort of collapse a few things that we didn't want to do when we set that plan out initially but I think the schedule still holds against what was issued as TCO schedule completion did well it would be very exciting to see this happening um in 2021 and then I just wanted mostly Dave for your um for your information I mean William's William has been around since the beginning um but I did want to acknowledge mostly because Mark is here um that there really was no greater um uh advocate an ally to see city place become a reality I mean the there were many elected officials there were you know a lot of community members but when you talk about community members um probably this one of the strongest proponents of seeing city place become a reality was Mark Freudenberg's wife Karen and I can't even begin to tell you the amount of time and energy she put in to seeing some of these um issues passed by the city council and by the voters and I I have to say this because Mark is here I hope he's listening um and uh just to say um to Mark that um I'm sure that Karen would be overjoyed to know that this project that is um certainly you know still a part is done is still a partner but the three local partners are um more committed than anyone that we have worked with to making sure that this project happens and um I hope that I hope that you would say that Karen would be overjoyed to see that we've reached this day so thank you she's clocking in heaven that's for sure I'm sure she is well that's nice nice to hear I mean you and I have talked a lot and you know uh our our commitment to this I was I was born here brought up on you know South Muskie Avenue moved to Shelburne lived on Spear Street went to Christa King school Rice High School UVM haven't left five miles of my uh epicenter here and this is this is uh really important and to me personally and to be able to to do this um you know just a little glimpse of just this last week down at uh BHS at Macy's people coming in and saying oh my god thank you thank you thank you for doing this and you know just once once it's in play it's like let's get this done and that's how we all are um you know and William he's now uh an honorary member of Burlington he he decided to move up here two years ago bought a house he's committed 100 to seeing this through um I'm a member of ward I'm a member of ward six right so uh and Karen you know uh you you've talked with Scott and now and I enough to know we're going to get this thing done and it's going to get done right it's going to be great for Burlington and uh once once we're behind something there's it's hard to hit the brakes well I think that is one of the things that you know for those that are listening is that you know I I have been supportive of the project because of what it will bring for downtown Burlington um and when I had spoken with um you know the many people that had been involved with Brookfield and others um and had said to them um you know just just build this city build us an amazing building and the usual response that I would get would be we'll do our best and the response that I get from Al and Dave and Scott is you can bet on it and I think there that's the that's the big difference is that you're talking about people that are truly committed um they're truly committed and they live here they've got families here their business and reputations are here and uh and hey Dave you know we know where we know where to find you yeah you knock on my door anytime long as the white truck's in the driveway I'm here question we're thinking we know where to find you I I have a question you know um okay and then we have another we have a written question as well so was that and I have a question too hi actually Megan's had a question for quite a while I think she ought to go first we can allow both of them so I will read Megan's question how's that uh Megan Epler would wrote I follow the issue of electrification of heat for new buildings where you have construction budgets and plans include electrocution of heat uh what what did you say Karen we'll do our best yeah I think I think uh I think we're headed in that direction and it's it looks good so I think we're gonna do it okay Mary was next Andrea had her hand it's a very small question I came in really late so I saw it missed a lot um but is is LL being still committed I know they're adjoining I guess they adjoin your the development but are they a committed player for the future in Burlington well we hope so it hasn't been articulated or well they've weathered it out so I know I just so I would say that I'd like to believe they're gonna they're gonna continue time will tell yeah maybe they've really had a lot of things so yeah maybe some reaching out is in order anyway just wondering thank you okay this is probably the last question go ahead Neil hi um you didn't answer Karen's question about financing and I don't want to be a Debbie Downer but how can you be comfortable that you're going to get financing when Brookfield who is million billions of dollars of assets could never get financing for this project yeah well I can I can make a statement as of last night at maybe seven thirty it made things a lot easier um and along with the city council vote the week before um we've had many conversations with financing institutions and they've never wanted to take it to the next level with the understanding like why is the city suing you and and why why why don't you have permits and so we're working through all those those roadblocks and hurdles and and every step of the way we're getting better and better um and last night's vote um is really going to open up the doors to more people that um we've had conversations with and it's not like we're just waiting for somebody to come to us we're out there every day talking to banks we're talking to private financing equity groups there's a lot of interest in the project but there's a lot of questions about you know initially um from day one when we bought the project back from Brookfield I think it was I think the date was September 7th September 8th the city sued us um bankers don't like that and it's kind of like a hands-off and they're like what's going on and I thought you know you had some some support there we worked through that we got through the mediation we got through the MOU we got through the revised development agreement that's all big steps to moving ahead and every roadblock that that we cross over and kick out of the way makes um these conversations with with the banks and financing organizations a little more real um the um the story with the financing it's not not a story but um Don had arranged for financing with the first phase project the the million square foot project and when presented to the Brookfield people they were not particularly fond of the terms that were presented and they said no no no um we can find a better way and then it devolved into them not finding a better way and them wanting to leave and that's where we got involved so I I've got a lot of confidence that um over the next couple of months we're going to have some good news as to finding a financing partner and keeping this ball rolling thank you guys and uh William can speak uh parallel to the the private and the the the banking the institutions uh William's been working hand in hand with Don on the HUD approval process which is this huge process that um you get through eventually um we're we're continuing to put the effort into pursuing it it's a long lengthy difficult process but we're staying with it as a parallel path because we always want some options but William you were you've been involved in the last couple of days on some of that with them um early this week and uh that's several meetings in actually with them so the process is um been taken a certain distance it has some more to go obviously given the nature of the beast but they're looking at it fair in a favorable manner you know I think it's unfortunate and obviously it's water on the bridge but we were able to get as Dave said we had financing for this project it was unfortunately derailed and we had a term sheet ready to go for over $200 million so um it was not uh and it and it go goes to Don because Brookfield balked at it and he he took it he took it and ran with it and was successful getting it I I think as Dave says what we have our approvals we're moving towards our documents I think things are good things we're going to be able to get the financing that we had before not necessarily through the same entities but we're going to be able to get it and I think part of the um the part of the way we've sequenced it now which is a little bit different than before is that this is in more particularly to HUD the fact we segmented it into three parts they're in the 60 to 70 million dollar range of um for each building project so this is a much more manageable financing profile well I guess we're out of time but um thank you gentlemen for for coming on tonight it was it was it was interesting it was it was thorough and it was um we're all excited we're just we're just everybody you know you can feel that the city's ready yeah he's just ready for this yeah so well thank you and Karen thank you particular you've been it been very helpful it couldn't have happened without you so yeah and we'll keep in touch and happy to do updates as we go along you know uh anytime you have a question or you want to pull one of us in for uh q and a we're happy to be there we're we're not going anywhere I would say that as things develop that part of of getting the the general public understanding what's available for rental purposes to help us with creating um people of interest who were looking for an apartment that it it works both ways and it'd be very helpful to come back and talk to you about what are the apartments and what what are they looking like and so forth and they may be an accessible way for people to see well I could live here this would be a place I would like to live so thank you man on that in the future that sounds like a great idea we'd love to hear more and then you can get the word out more so yeah yeah yeah thank you thanks thank you thanks everybody yeah thank you good night good night bye see you later bye bye next up uh john vickery at the city assessor's office hi john I think you are on right now you are not I believe you had wanted to do your presentation are you okay with sharing the screen do you know how to do that yes I do okay share the screen I'll pull up my presentation you can I believe at the bottom of your zoom presentation you can see if you go to the bottom or there should be a green button that just yep perfect yeah there you go oh is this you is this uh I I'm not seeing it in front of me this should be the leader in the 2020 Gartner magic quadrant for meeting solutions no this is not it this seems like somebody else somebody else's presentation hold on let's try this again I thought I grabbed the right one there we go and I will set this presentation does everybody see that Burlington Citywide reappraisal project 2021 thank you yes hi I'm john vickery and um I've been the Burlington assessor for almost 19 years wow 20 years we're doing a revaluation we're in the second year over the revaluation and um we're moving forward regardless of COVID and uh so there's lots to let everyone know about uh first I want to just explain the market um this is a graph that we looked at the median home sales of single family homes and and duplexes from 2016 1718 19 and 20 and you can see how the market is has increased um about six percent so we're projecting in 2021 um another six percent increase what I'll do is um I'll just chat and then at the end I'll take questions okay ward five and ward six I grabbed the sales from those two wards uh because it's in the south end and the the median house value in 2020 is five hundred sixty four thousand there is a non-waterfront sale of 1.2 million and a waterfront sale 1.7 the lowest sale in that list of sales was three hundred and thirty three thousand this is higher than the citywide average of three hundred and seventy thousand dollars uh the the median in this in these two neighborhoods is higher than the the median overall in the city uh we are doing this reappraisal I said this in other presentations that we were mandated by the state tax department uh for good reasons we weren't meeting statistical measures and uh that measure equity of property values so we're straightening them out that's that's the goal of this reappraisal is to reset values put them back at market and therefore create equity the valuation tables were outdated they are going to be updated and the last reappraisal was done in 2005 so many years ago now here's the timeline up until we received tax bills in a few weeks we'll send out letters to every property owner of the change of value and that letter will have information on it to telling people what their value is how they can review their value against other property values and if they choose to have a hearing they can schedule that that'll those hearings will be with the board of assessors in April probably for the entire month of April and because we're in this COVID environment the hearings will be held by um by zoom meetings and or you could phone in if you'd like um and you can file your appeal uh online everything's electronic now in May and June we'll spend the next two months uh reviewing all of the those appeal properties making last minute changes and resetting the values uh resolving those valuation issues for the July tax bills um I also want to just give you some information we set values as of April 1st and the values are going to be based on the current market as it is right now Tyler Technologies Incorporated they have a reappraisal division and they're conducting the general property reappraisal for safeguard organic analytics it uh specializes in commercial valuations and so they're doing the commercial properties I think I mentioned that um letters will be mailed in about three weeks and I hope that everyone reads the letter um our website is not fully updated but it does have a lot of information on it right now and um we've had property information of individual properties online for many years now and that's a great way to take a look at your own property make sure the data is correct and also to look at other properties to just to for good information it's used a lot um we also have just general information on what a reappraisal is and what it does and and then we have another page for the valuation appeal process with the board of assessors so appealing your property value if you choose to I wanted to lay out the steps for that it's um all going to be electronic you can file your appeal online electronically we'll take mail as well but we prefer electronically because it makes it easier for us to communicate back and forth with the property owner a Tyler technologies administrator will call or email every single person that is filed an appeal to to set them on a calendar it's going to be a scheduling system like Calendee whereas people will have slots that they can and put their their hearing time in and then the hearings will be virtual I of course through zoom meeting software except that we're using right now and that's my presentation does anyone have any questions I John Joel Fitzgerald there's a lot of folks in my neighborhood that are getting up there in years is there any concerns about them navigating through the appeal process online yes um we are going to have a 1-800 number set up and that'll be in the letter so that if folks are not comfortable filling out the form online they can call that 1-800 number there's the Tyler staff will answer the phone and they will actually fill out and schedule for that those those folks okay yeah I have a question John will the valuation the new valuation be in the letter yes that you originally send out yes it will okay I have a question is it based on April 2020 or 2021 April 2021 so how how does it work I mean obviously there's been this huge increase in value because of the pandemic and all kinds of people coming in that weren't here before does that just mean things sort of readjust or does that mean we're all going to be looking at a greatly increased tax well let's separate the the market it has been increasing there's no doubt about that yeah it's been yeah right and and by law we're supposed to appraise property values at their market value estimations and so we have spent an extensive amount of time reviewing every single sale and building our valuation tables through statistical analysis of those sales and we're also adjusting those sales for time and change so values will be an estimation close to their market value if not at their market value I mean that's the goal the tax rate will readjust and it will go down it's there's a revenue neutral provision in the city charter where it is supposed to drop it's not a supposed to be a windfall so I'm not I wouldn't be accurate if I said that no one will have an increase in their tax bill but there may be folks that actually have a have a lower tax bill others with a tax bill that's about the same and others with an increase it depends on partially the change of your value from what it was and the actually the taxes that are needed to be raised any more questions about it also the relative I mean the relative change relation in relation to everybody else right it really is the relative change right so if we're at 3.8 billion in total value in Burlington and work this reappraisal results in 5 billion in total values of Burlington the tax rate if it's at 90 cents right now the permissible rate it'll probably drop to about 70 cents we I don't know what that number is exactly but there'll be a rebalancing uh that has to occur John I have a question um I'm a little confused okay go ahead Neil and then after that Greg after what we'll we'll have his question so go ahead Neil I'm sorry Mary that's okay John I'm a little confused about the process because I think you came to us before maybe a year and a half ago explaining that we would get this form in the mail which all the information about our house was on it which we did yes thank you also asked if we wanted a personal appraiser to make a personal visit which I did at the time because of certain circumstances about our house that I think the appraisal process needed to know that of course COVID hit I have never heard anything and now you're telling me that I'm going to get an appraiser appraisal without having that benefit of an individual inspector coming to the home did you did you not have an individual inspector come to your home no sir okay well we can set that up what they what we're not doing is doing individual inspections of people's homes but the Tyler company what was calling people and asking them for a virtual inspection with like an iPhone or Android they they bought iPhones and Android phones so that they could have a conversation with the property owner and the property owner could walk around the house with the video camera and talk to them and so I didn't do that but I could set that up with you and and make sure that that's taken care of just send me an email tomorrow that I will do that and in fact it has to do with the something with the outside of the house so if they're willing to come and inspect what I want to explain on the outside of the house they can do it otherwise I'll do a video chat with them and yeah we'll make sure that's taken care of thank you so much I appreciate that and just to note I did I filled out that form too and said there were things that weren't correct on it and I did have a call and and I did have a a digital tour of the house so you know that was just letting you know that that happened I missed all that's good to hear we had a lot of response responses from the the mailer that we sent out and we collected them and then the changes were entered and if there were questions basically Tyler would call them up and ask them questions about what what they were what they were showing on the on the form that they filled out what can I say I thought it was maybe didn't answer the phone because I thought it was a spam that's possible but email me email me directly so I'll get back to you I will thank you so much thank you welcome okay Greg Epler would has a question yeah it was basically the same question I was just he didn't John didn't mention the that letter that Tyler sent out a year ago I was just wondering I did I too did answer that and I hadn't heard anything after that not that I'm eager to do you know a person video tour of the house you know I you know that's fine you know I'm proud of the house but I think you've already answered the question thank you most folks didn't they just wanted to corrections of certain data but it didn't it didn't rise rise to the level of asking for an inspection so will the letters show all the assumptions all the data that went into the appraisal for people who aren't attending the meeting who were wondering about whatever happened no the letters just going to give information to where to find the property information as well as the new valuation itself so someone will have to go online and pull their their data up like we've had that the property data online for years now it's the same it'll be in the same place we'll just be updating that with the new valuations and new data John can we make changes online or self did I hear you say that correctly no no what I would suggest I think this is good advice it doesn't hurt to if you notice something is is an error to contact the Tyler and actually request an inspection not an inspection request a hearing and get the data straightened out okay can you put that information on the screen again or just say the number or contact info again um I don't um okay I'll see what I can do I don't have the phone number yet it's uh Tyler is supposed to have that that they're going to give us oh Tyler technologies you just Tyler technologies is the appraisal company oh I'll go I'll go to the where is it that's the schedule here it is Tyler technologies is the general and residential property appraisal company safeguard organic analytics is the commercial company that's doing the work I missed all of this okay thank you welcome are there any other questions I don't see any more uh any more hands raised any more questions and so I believe that's it yes when we send the letter out I hope that everyone reads it and looks at the data spends a little bit of time this is their opportunity to correct errors and also to it's the public part of the process is coming up in April so we want people to participate we want a good solid database thank you okay well thank you very much um all right and next up uh Karen Paul thank you for coming Karen and thanks for being flexible I think you have done sorry about that um so goodness I know that everyone at some state o'clock I'll try to be brief um I uh was going to start out by talking about the election and uh thanking um thanking in particular not only all the volunteers that came but also the election officials those that got elected um those that are already elected um and certainly for um Rob Michelle Isaac uh Kristen Becky um and Greg um who spent an enormous amount of time getting the elections uh together to uh uh together for us went to a number of meetings there's a lot of behind the scenes stuff that goes on and uh just wanted to thank them one more time um the only other things I wanted to mention is just simply um all of the ballot items um don't recall this happening before um that we had number number one that we had so many ballot items but also that they all passed um so if you're wondering what the response was you don't have to wonder what happened on one and on two and on three the answer is that they all passed um and so now the charter changes will go forward to the legislature to the government ops committee um they will be looked at there there is a long process that they go through from there to then going to the full house and then into the senate and then must be signed by the governor so there's a long road ahead for these charter changes there were four of them um the others were are not going to go any further than what they were one was an advisory question and one was the cannabis question um those are just simply questions that um will stop at the city level for the most part um then just wanted to mention um something that I think is amazingly exciting because it has been going on for not quite 15 years probably about 12 and that is that believe it or not unlike the Champlain Parkway what's been going on been going on for 40 years when we keep talking about it the roundabout is actually going to be built and it's going out to bid now it's going out to bid now and they're hoping to be able to open up those bids in like two weeks and um they're coming to the npa in um in april they're doing a significant amount of public engagement it's going to take two seasons for them to get this work done so we're you know we're not talking about this happening instantly but there but it is going to get done and um that is a an example of a pro a public um uh highway project by the state of vermont that is almost being done in less than a decade but we are going to get our roundabout and I think it's going to be an exciting I'm excited about it I think it's it's just it's an enormous we've been through an awful lot getting rights of way um and uh uh the amount of conduit cord that is underneath the roundabout if you looked if you were able to unzip the pavement and look at what's underneath there it's just an amazing maze of all sorts of wiring and all of that wiring has to be put in one place and that means you have to get agreements from every single utility that has wiring there and it's just been I won't bore you with all the details just simply know that it's on its way and by the end of um uh 2020 by the spring of 2023 we should have a roundabout um and I think you know going into the next council year um we're only going to have one change on the council um one um new counselor elected uh last uh on Tuesday there was one uh counselor in the new north end franklin polino that chose not to run for reelection and he that seat is being taken by a new person on uh who isn't really new to the city he actually served on the school board um but it's now going to be the north district city counselor and that is uh mark barlow um and as far as things that I think will be will come up very soon in the month of april um I think the first is that uh we need to hire a police chief and um that was supposed to be done um and a committee was formed um over a year ago they were starting to form a committee and given the fact that um we then went into a pandemic it appeared as though a police chief probably would not be starting in terms of if they had to relocate their family or themselves um would not be starting until probably November or December it was going to get be difficult to get someone to move it during a pandemic and uh we might see a change in mayoral leadership so all of it was put on hold back in april of last year but now here we are at next april this april and um john murad has been an acting chief for some time and I think that will be a major priority going forward is to form that committee and find a new police chief um as well um the issue of police oversight um was vetoed by the mayor uh month and at two months ago um there is still a need to move that issue forward and I think that's probably going to occupy a fair amount of our time uh starting in April and then the other um uh which is something that I'm hoping to do I'm hoping for the council to be able to do a little bit better than it did in 2010 is that we may very well see enough of a shift in population in the city um due to the census in 2020 that we will need to do redistricting um again and um the last time it was done it was arduous it was way too painful um it took way too long it took really five years and we didn't end up actually enacting it until 2015 um and that's when the warden district system was created um we don't know what the what the census is going to say clearly there have been some shifts in burlington and population um and because of covid um normally those figures come out april one they're presented to the president they then go to the states they are not going to be presented to the president of the united states that is um until um uh until the 30th of april um I guess that's the by law it has to be by the 30th and the states will not be getting them until the early fall so it's going to be a slightly longer process but we'll see um there may not be enough of a shift that there would be a change that does happen um but I think there is a desire to try and find hopefully a better system than the one we have now which I think even to this day there are people who question the the warden district makeup um so that will probably be discussed at some point in the next couple of months to come and then I'm sure there will be many other things but I'm happy to take any questions or um let you all go and have dinner at 804 any questions I have I have a question Karen okay um on the on the city police chief because we've had a person serving there for a year is there a possibility that it would we could just make this person permanent and it would um just soften the process a little bit I mean do they do an evaluation on the current chief right now and do we say hey this guy's doing okay or this person's doing okay well it really depends on whether or not um acting chief mirad wants to be the police chief and I don't honestly Joel I don't know the answer to that um you know it the last time that we had a search um which was in I think 2014 on one of the deputy chiefs did apply for the job that was Sean Burke who did not get the position and then went on to south burlington is now the chief of police in south burlington um I don't know if john desires to do this um there would be there will be a a search um and certainly if if he's interested in applying I hope that he will I mean wouldn't it be nice just not it seems like the city has had so much controversy recently would it be nice for one thing just to go smooth and just say okay boom we're all happy but um anyway it was just well we're very you know in burlington we are very uh very big on public engagement and um I think that to go and appoint a police chief something as important as a police chief not only now but just always um there needs to be a search and I I haven't spoken with the mayor about it I know that he was committed to doing that a year ago and would assume that that his position hasn't changed but we'll see yeah okay any other questions well I guess my president I have a question oh somebody has a question how wonderful let me drop mine yeah uh Karen just a very I hope a very quick question I was just curious about the roundabout um were there any problems with um gaining I don't know what it would be called easement rights away with any of the adjacent property owners the majestic rental the catholic school the and so on well it's funny you shouldn't ask that Greg because there were there are a lot there were a lot of on adjacent property owners more than more than I would have thought there's there were quite a few and um because it extends beyond just the roundabout on or the rotary just the rotary you would think that was only like three or four properties but it's quite a few more on most of the property owners were amenable to um you know the the very small piece of land that was needed and um the the state reached out to them made an agreement with them the vast majority of them were done very quickly um Chris the king was also a rather it was rather speedy um uh the only one that was uh difficult with in that regard was majestic car rental um they um they felt that you know their loss of uh the fact that they are going to have to change where customers come in and are going to be affected by that by this perhaps in a bigger way than a lot of others is that they felt that that loss of business should be something that they were compensated for and there are rules about that on the city council about well it was a while ago because we were in person so I guess it was probably in the fall of 19 we took a tour got on a bus took a tour and uh and you know and had to rule on on a necessity you know on a hearing and uh eventually they did settle with the state of Vermont um for uh you know I think they they compromised and came up with a settlement on unfortunately a loss of business is not doesn't is it one of the things that we that the state compensates for as long as there is another way for people to get into the business um so that was that was that probably the just the negotiation and getting the rights of way probably took almost a year so you can see why this has been a long process yeah okay thank you very much but hopefully hopefully we're gonna have it in in two years not like the Champlain Parkway when they say another two years but like for real all right well thanks Karen I'm glad we had a little extra time it's nice hearing you give us updates and keep us informed so thank you thanks so much we have thank you to make oh sorry it's going to say Michelle wanted to make one final comment before we end the meeting go ahead Michelle um yes thank you for your service Karen thank you for all you do on behalf of Ward 6 residents and all Berlin Tonians I also just wanted to acknowledge that Joan Shannon will be our city councilor for the south district for two more years so we won't have a change in representation to the council for the next year anyway so thank you to you both for all you do for us thanks thank you Michelle all right well thanks everybody have a good night see you see you next month when we will be talking about Champlain Parkway come back to hear about Champlain Parkway next month