 Well, good morning, good afternoon and good evening to everybody from the three ITU regions and welcome to the third episode of the ITU satellite webinars. Probably most of you, because we have seen the list, have been participating and following us during the previous ITU satellite webinars. The first one dedicated to interference with satellite systems, and the second one to non-GSO. And today, we have the pleasure to keep you tuned with the ITU regulations and satellite innovations. And for that, we will count with the expert from the GSO community, which will give us a nice introduction and comprehensive information about, as you said, satellite regulations and innovations. So it will be dedicated to GSO satellite systems from high throughput satellites or high capacity satellites to mobility, and also to give us a nice insight of the WRC-19 outcomes and WRC-23 study cycles in the related issues. We will count with the Director of the Regulation Bureau, as well, in the opening remarks, and with Mr. Nelson Malaguti, who is a consular study group for satellite issues. Before to go to the opening, let me give the usual technical announcements, which are that this meeting is going to be, is being recorded, and it will be also posted in the ITU and YouTube for further consultation, as many of the previous YouTube's and the videos. We are going to post some polls and some questions so we can get your views on different issues concerning GSO, and we'll share it at the end of the session. And please use the chat session for any problem with the connectivity and the Q&A for the questions addressed to the panelists. So now, let me give the floor to Mr. Mario Maniewicz, the Director of the Regulation Bureau. Director, please. Yes, thank you very much, Jorge. Good morning, good afternoon, and good evening to our distinguished speakers, as well as to the participants who are joining this ITU-R webinar from around the world. Over the past two months, we have hosted two episodes of our series of webinars on satellite-related aspects, which were dedicated to preventing interface to satellite systems and to non-GSO large constellations for broadband applications. For each of those episodes, we gathered with distinguished speakers from the space sector and an impressive audience, the passing 500, 1500 participants who connected from different media platforms from more than 120 countries. I have noted with great pleasure that participants from industry and universities come equally from members and non-members of the ITU, and I hope that these webinars may convince non-members to have a closer look at the opportunities offered by an ITU membership. We are eager to welcome you to the ITU family very soon. Today, it is my pleasure to welcome you to this third episode in the series of ITU satellite webinars, this time dedicated to GSO satellite systems. As you will know, geostationary satellites have a long history from the first GSO satellites launched over the Atlantic in the 60s for interoceanic telecommunications until today, when they are used for internet access, broadcasting, mobility, backhaul of telecommunication networks, emergency communications and meteorological purposes, reaching every single populated corner of the world. Certainly, the resilience and broad coverage are playing an important role to achieve our goal to connect the 3.8 billion people without access to the internet today. The latest World Radio Communication Conference, WRC 19, took a number of decisions to improve the regulatory procedures for GSO satellites, so that administrations are better positioned when coordinating, licensing or operating earth stations in motion, with the objective to enable broadband connectivity to citizens on board of ships, aircraft and land vehicles, as well as to ensure their safety and security. Also, the conference resolved to study possible additional resources for earth stations in motion in the KU band. In preparation for WRC 23, studies are not limited to space-to-earth or earth-to-space links. The second meeting of ITU Study Group 4 and its working parties that ended last week is evaluating ways to improve space-to-space communications, including with the GSO satellite, so that the growing demand of traffic can be absorbed by using inter-satellite links and improving the efficiency in sharing the spectrum. In summary, GSO satellite systems have both a long history and a bright future with the innovation in technologies that the industry is bringing, as we'll see today in these webinars. Dear friends, we are proud to count on distinguished experts and organizations supporting these webinars anew as our valuable audience. Once again, I invite you to enjoy the webinar, participate actively in it, and more importantly, to apply the concepts that you will learn to assure that more and more citizens will have access to solid telecommunications and innovative services around the world. Have a nice webinar. Thank you. Very much, Mr. Director, and good morning, good afternoon, good evening, good day to all of you. Thank you very much for all those that are attending this webinar. So in order to introduce the or let's say to set the frame of the discussions we are going to have with our distinguished panelists, I would just like to make a brief presentation here on some relevant results of WRC 19 regarding the geostationary satellites and also just briefly touch some of the agenda items of the next conference, WRC 23 on this issue. So I'm just going to share my screen. So thank you very much. Sorry for this technical problem here. So as I was saying, you can see here in this slide the two main decisions that were taken by WRC our last conference in Charmer Shake in Egypt, WRC 19, which are related to geostationary broadband satellite networks. So the first decision was related to the use of the frequency bands 17.7 and 19.7 gigahertz in the space 12th direction and 27.5 to 29.5 gigahertz in the earth to space direction by earth stations in motion, what we call in short ECIM communicating with GSO space stations in the in the FSS. And the second one was related to the allocation of the frequency band 51.4 to 52.4 gigahertz to the fixed satellite service in the earth to space direction for geostationary use. So coming to the first one, dealing with earth stations in motion, what we call ECIM. So what is that? Earth stations in motion are earth stations, which are communicating with the fixed satellite service stations, geostationary stations, but they are installed in moving platforms. So they are earth stations in motion, as we say. And so we have three types, basically three types of ECIM. We have those earth stations installed in aircraft, so what we call aeronautical ECIM. They are installed in ships and vessels, what we call maritime ECIM. And also installed in land vehicles, that's what we call land ECIM. And all these three types of ECIM can be used for broadband communications and in particular internet connectivity. So the conference, as you can see here in the first bullet, the conference defined the regulatory, operational and technical conditions under which those bands can be used by ECIM. So this is contained in a resolution approved by the conference. And what is important to say is that those conditions will establish for all regions. So it's a worldwide decision, I'll pick about all regions of the world, which is really very important. So that's why we believe that this decision on ECIMs will certainly increase the use and foster the development of ECIMs at the same time providing appropriate protection to other GSO networks and known GSO systems, as well as protection to terrestrial services. All these conditions are established in this resolution approved by the conference. So we believe that this will enable the broadband connection, as you can see in the third bullet here, for people on ships. That's a summary of ECIMs, aircraft, aeronautical ECIM and land vehicles, by ensuring their safety, security and comfort while in motion. And one last point in this last bullet that I would like to draw your attention is that this decision, in fact, extends the possibility that was offered by diversity 15, the previous conference for ECIM in a similar decision for the bands 19.7 to 20.2 GHz in the downlink and 29.5 to 30 GHz in the uplink. So what I wanted to draw your attention is that if you compare the bands mentioned in the first bullet with those bands on the last bullet here, you will see that we now have 2.5 GHz in the downlink and 2.5 GHz in the uplink for ECIM in all regions worldwide. So we believe that this is really a significant achievement if we look to the results of the two last conferences. So regarding the next slide here, the next decision relating to the frequency band 51.4 to 52.4 GHz, that the conference added an allocation to the fixed satellite service in the Earth-to-space direction in this frequency band for use by geostationary networks while protecting, while providing again the appropriate protection to other services. In that case, the Earth stations are limited to Gateway Earth stations with a minimum antenna diameter of 2.4 meters. So we also believe this is an important decision to foster the provision of broadband communications using geostationary satellites. And finally, I would like just to draw your attention to three main agenda items. As you know, the conference also approved the agenda for the next conference, which will be WC23. And in the agenda of the next conference, we can find three items that are related to geostationary broadband satellite networks. As you can see here, the first one is agenda item 115, which will, similar to the other one only, seem will establish the conditions for the use of the frequency band 12.75 to 13.25 GHz in the Earth-to-space direction by Earth stations on aircraft and vessels communicating with geostationary space stations in the fixed satellite service globally, again for all regions. The second one is agenda item 117, which is dealing with what our director mentioned, this satellite-to-satellite link. So under this agenda item, we will study the technical and operational issues and regulatory provisions for the provision of satellite-to-satellite links in the frequency bands mentioned here in this slide. And we believed, of course, among those satellite-to-satellite links, there are geostationary stations, which will establish links with non-geostationary satellites. So this is another very interesting topic or agenda item in the agenda of the next conference. Finally, agenda item 119, which will study and consider a new primary location for the fixed satellite service in the space 12 direction in the frequency band 17.3 to 17.7 GHz in region 2. So these are three main items in the agenda of the next conference related to the topic of the discussion today. So with that, I will now invite our distinguished panellists to elaborate on their ideas, on their views, on the decisions of WRC 19, and how they see the opportunities related to this agenda items of the next conference, WRC 23, as well as the innovations on their respective networks. So in that regard, so I will first start with Mr Dario Hunter from Viasat. Mr Dario Hunter is currently the Chief Technical Officer of Regulatory Affairs at Viasat. Mr Hunter is a leader in the legal regulatory group, which manages the licensing of satellites and nerve stations for Viasat worldwide, as well as participating in national, regional, and international laser regulatory groups. Before joining Viasat, Mr Hunter worked for GT SpaceNet, satellite business systems, and the US Army in roles which included system engineering, product development, product management, and application sales support. So Dario, thank you very much for your participation again. The floor is yours. Thank you, Dario. Okay, thank you, Nelson. And good morning, good afternoon, and good evening to all of our guests. And also thank you and welcome to the other panellists. Let me get started on my presentation here, see if I can share my desktop and start the presentation. So a world of innovation for GSO satellite systems. As Nelson said, we had seen really a number of applications that were offered by the past three WRCs, or the past two in the current coming WRC. So it's really a tripling down on satellite activities in the 28 gigahertz band. So as Nelson said, the WRC recognized the satellite use and K-Band was well established with many new satellites and services being developed. The WRC considered K-A as a place for growth for satellite services and chose not to study this band for IMT. The conference approved the resolution on GSO eSIM in the 295 to 30 gigahertz band. They also assigned the agenda item just to study GSO eSIMs in the 27.5 to 295 gigahertz band. And WRC 19, we studied the issue, approved the GSO eSIMs as Nelson said in the 27.5 to 5 gigahertz band. And then WRC 19 has two additional items related to the 28 gigahertz band. One is not related to GSO particularly, but it's the non-GEO stationary eSIM in the K-A band. And then also as mentioned, the satellite to satellite links in the K-A band as well as some other frequency bands. So as a result, satellite operators are responding with investments of millions of dollars for new generations of high-throughput satellites and new services that are really going to benefit the global customer base. Visat 3 is really a game-changing innovation in that. So we started with Visat 1 a number of years ago and I'll talk more about that in a minute. Visat 2 up there, Visat 3, which we'll launch at the end of 2021, the first one. And the second, Visat 3, the first one will cover the Americas, the next one will cover Europe, the least in Africa, and the third one will cover Asia. So the first one will launch at the end of 2021, then the next one in 2022, and then the third one will follow after that. These satellites have two global, two visible Earth coverage for each satellite, then the three of them in the constellation will have global coverage. So at each satellite, we'll have greater than a terabit per second of capacity. So how does this happen? So the advancements in the satellite for increased throughput speed and coverage really happened as a result of improved integration, miniaturization, and just a lot of technical advancements that we made. So on the right hand side of the slide, you can see the communication panels that were part of the Visat 1 payload, and you can see the people standing around the payload to give you an idea of the size of the communications panel. Visat 1 had a throughput of about 140 gigabits per second, and at that time was the highest capacity satellite in orbit. So now you look at the same thing, the Visat 3 module is now down to hand size with the person standing next to it. Similarly, this improvement technology allows us to reduce the size of the gateways from a traditional, 11 to 9 meter type of gateway down to the Visat 1 and 7.3, and the Visat 3 were down in the 1.8 to 2.4 meter range. So this enables us to provide services here, there, and anywhere. So we can operate in the air, we can operate on the ground, and we can operate at sea. So we provide service to commercial airlines, business jets, VIP, government aircraft, and cruise ships, private yachts, and commercial vessels, and then direct internet to home providers, businesses, and then we've got some land-based vehicles, emergency services vehicles, and busses, mass transit, and so on. So ECIM, which is something we've been really working on for a long time at Visat, and as well as with others in the industry, they've been providing services to mobile broadband for over two decades, starting really back with the connection by Boeing, and even before that with some some equipment that was done by Leekabit in the KU band. So we've been operating GSO ECIM in the KU band for nearly a decade, and we brought that work to the ITU, and the ITU has recognized that these ECIM stations can operate compatibly with other services, and we've approved them in the past two WRCs, and so now they're really considered just another typical ER station. And we meet with that aircraft passengers, we can provide crew communications, we can provide gate-to-gate service for customers, and then some enhancements for the fleet to operate and provide their internal communications, similarly for passenger vessels, freight vessels, and that for married time. And importantly, Visat has about 270 mobility authorizations today, which we've been working on for a long time, starting in the KU band, and now in the KA band, which we have about 120 countries rise so far, and more authorizations are coming soon as we're working on that very hard. So it is really a very good chance that you've already used KA band GSO ECIM service if you've flown on most commercial airlines today, use if not Visat service of another satellite operator, because satellite's really the choice for in-flight connectivity. We've got an installed fleet of about 1400 commercial aircraft plus several hundred other types of aircraft and a backlog of about 750 aircraft, and to give you an idea of kind of how much this is used, we have annual flights with Visat equipped ECIMs of $1.83 million. We've got 145 device connections per year, and that's films, iPads, PCs, and in many cases we have more connected devices than passengers and sometimes because passengers will connect multiple devices, and we deliver to approximately seven and a half petabytes of data. And so next I'll play a short video. Yes. I think you have to share the computer audio. We don't hear the audio. Oh, okay. Sorry. Go back to restart that. Go back and stop sharing, and make sure to check that each time, I guess. Okay, let's try again. Sorry. So that was a video from one of our launch customers for our commercial aviation Wi-Fi, JetBlue, and they're very pleased with the service, and we've got a number of reports of feedback on that. So regarding the licensing for ECIM, I think one of the things that we see is we know that there are more than 120 countries that have already authorized a KAA band, ECIM, and we found that countries should really feel comfortable authorizing ECIMs across the band. We really have a lot of practice operating these stations and running them compatibly and controlling them. I've been the regulatory contact at Visat for 25 years, and so I'm the person to call if there's interference. And so far, I've never in all these years received a report of interference from an ECIM. So streamlining is really the approach that we see with this. A lot of countries will authorize ECIMs in kind of a blanket fashion where they're able to file one license application, which will then cover the rest of the stations of that similar type in the country. And in many countries, we'll allow guest ECIM that are licensed by another administration to operate on a licensing that basis in their own country provided that we follow the rules of that guest country. So the next thing I want to talk about was our Visat community internet, another thing that's provided by the bandwidth and the broad coverage the satellite has, we've got the ability to reach hard to reach places. We can quickly bring internet to locations with limited connectivity or no G service. They don't have 5G, 4G, 3G, they have zero G. They have to get in a vehicle, drive away for some distance in order to get some coverage to get services. And so we're able to come in and drop connectivity into that location really just within a day and provide that. So cave-in coverage and capacity are the key that makes it that's inexpensive to install. It offers a service to users at an affordable price and we can scale to meet coverage and capacity demands. So one of the videos I was going to share with this covers something in our moderator. I think we'll appreciate some service that we're providing in Brazil. So we'll get to that. Next one. So and that's the conclusion of the slide. So with that, thank you. Then I'll turn it back to you. Thank you very much Dario for this very very interesting presentation. I think we have time for just one or a couple of questions. There was an interesting question here though. I think it was answered but I mean it's interesting in any way. Is it regarding the size, the physical size of an ECM? The question is, is it bigger than handheld? But I would just, okay, first that question but then then further elaborate how do you see the evolution of the ECM for the free applications regarding this size? I guess it will become smaller and smaller but just to get your views on that. Thank you Dario. Yeah thank you Nelson. So the size today we are operating ECM the smallest 30 centimeter. So these ECM are mounted on the tail of some of the smaller aircraft that can accommodate the larger fuselage mounted antenna. So they'll be up on top of the vertical stabilizer in many cases. We also have installations where that that same antenna is mounted on a emergency escape hatch on some of the aircraft that are used in a number of applications and for example some of the firefighting aircraft that can dump water and things like that that can get communications that way without having to have a full installation of the aircraft. And we've got Visad and others are bringing to market low profile antennas that are that are nearly conformal to the top of the fuselage they're very small but ultimately you know we like to keep them as large as we can to keep the beam width down so that we limit the the you know any emissions towards other satellites. But that's that's what we're at right now today about 30 centimeters is the smallest we think we can get down lower than that was with spectrum spreading which we do use on that 30 centimeter. Thank you very much Dario and just one other question that just came here how different are ECM from began satellite terminal that have been there for for quite some time the began so what what are basically the differences. Well the frequency band in part so the began operate down at much lower frequencies than we're operating in the KU and KA band they they are part of the mobile satellite service so they they have antennas that are you know broadly directional generally upwards and and some antennas are a little more directional than others but they're not the very narrow beam widths that we use for communicating with GSO satellites that are down in the you know the fraction of a degree range and they can't support the kind of data rates that we do with the terminals today so there's in fact something I saw the other day one of the maritime terminals that we're trialing on is called Delos and you can watch videos of that online YouTube and when they installed the terminal and tested it here they did their initial download speed test was 126 megabits per second and then the the upload speeds are more modest because the you know the terminals don't need to generally transmit some traffic so I think the throughput speeds would be one of the biggest differences you'd see. Okay thank you thank you very much Dario so I think now we should go to the our second presentation our second speaker which is Ms Kimberly Bound from Echo Star so Ms Kimberly Bound currently works for Echo Star Hughes as vice president of regulatory affairs her role covers all aspects of regulatory affairs including maintaining the spectrum rights for the company's satellite fleet defining and executing spectrum strategy domestically and around the world and acquiring new spectrum prior to joining Echo Star Hughes Ms Bound held regulatory spectrum positions at SES American Motorola and Astrolink International so Kim thank you very much for your participation at this webinar and the floor is yours thank you very much Kim. Thank you Nelson and good morning good afternoon and good evening to everyone. Let me get my slides up and running hopefully fairly quickly here so thinking about preparing for this panel I knew that my my colleagues would likely talk a lot about mobility and so I'm going to focus on other aspects of our business but certainly you know we agree with our colleagues that mobility is certainly a very important and growing sector you know for our company as well so I'm going to speak about the Hughes part of our business and that's the part of our business that develops broadband satellite technology and provides broadband services to consumers you know either in the home or to offices and Hughes net is at high speed satellite internet service and it's the world's largest satellite broadband network with more than 1.5 million residential and small business customers across the Americas. We serve six Latin American countries with 364,000 subscribers and those are growing all the time and in the United States we have about 69 percent of the market share and who are our customers they're typically people who live beyond the reach of fiber and cable but our services allow people to to live where they love you don't have to move to an urban center you can stay connected and you know still work and provide world-class education to your children and unlike terrestrial build out to the last mile we can get service up and running in a matter of you know a couple of days with minimal infrastructure cost and you can see on our slides here that we have the ITU Gold Sector Member we're proud to be sector members of both ITU R and ITU D then I wanted to just give you a snapshot of our network here our satellites we have two Hughes owned and operated satellites Jupiter 1 and Jupiter 2 and we also lease capacity on Hughes 63 West and Hughes 65 West and those are satellites actually owned and operated by Telestad and Utilsat respectively and today we deliver more than 400 gigabits per second of capacity we're building a new satellite Jupiter 3 which is going to launch in the first quarter of 2022 and with Jupiter 3 we'll more than double our capacity are available throughput today and with Jupiter 3 we'll be able to deliver broadband speeds of more than 100 megabits per second and we'll reach 80% of the population and have more than than 50 gateway earth stations in operation so as capacity is increasing the satellite broadband market continues to grow in 2019 satellite broadband revenue grew by 19% and the subscribership grew approximately 10% to 2.6 million and most of those subscribers are in the United States today with numbers growing steadily outside of the US and as the capacity has increased over time you know since approximately 2014 revenues have been growing steadily and if you look at this chart here on the right you'll see that by 2026 NSR predicts that there'll be approximately 10 million GSO broadband subscribers so this is certainly an area that continues to grow as we bring you know more satellites to the market so I wanted to give a few real-world examples here and I truly hope those parents aren't interfering with reception of our service here I think that picture is from Columbia but here we have a couple of statements from some of our customers in La Iguera in Chile about 500 kilometers north of Santiago a teacher Thomas Rodriguez said that there is no distance anymore and there are no remote places so our services really allow him to feel connected and then northern Brazil a video blogger Fran Adorno stays connected to her two million followers and in the Peruvian jungle our services allow Javier Albuquerque to gain information and support his son's studies my my favorite shot pictures here is one of our installers on horseback and you can tell it's a fairly recent photo because he's wearing a mask but you know our network of installers will do whatever it takes to get our services to customers so if horseback is the only way to get to a new customer then you know they strap our dish our equipment on the horse and and off they go to get it to those remote customers and next I wanted to talk a little bit about um a topic Darrell discussed as well um that satellite enabled community wi-fi which is also a growing opportunity for GSO satellites so to to recap what the service is um it's a way to provide internet connectivity to a lower end user point so you would put a v-sat antenna at a central location in a town um perhaps on a government building or on a store and then the modem is connected to a wi-fi access point that would provide wi-fi connectivity to customers in approximate hundred meter radius around the access point and then the retailer would sell wi-fi service data packs to the public um end users would buy like prepaid data in affordable bite-sized chunks um or the service in some cases may be subsidized by the government and if you look at the chart on the left um by 2027 NSR predicts that um approximately 40 percent of the overall revenue for satellite broadband will be um from these wi-fi hotspots so it's certainly a growing um a growing segment and for Hughes um our satellite enabled community wi-fi hotspots meet reach more than 25 million people and just looking at the Americas with um we have 22,000 wi-fi hotspots in Mexico reaching more than 22 million people and that's a government subsidized program so it's really providing free connectivity to many many people and then similarly in brazil we're reaching more than 2 million people with government subsidized wi-fi so i think this is really an exciting opportunity that you know allows us to bridge the digital divide and shows how different technologies like in this case satellite and wi-fi you know are complementary and really working together to connect people around the world and then i just wanted to show one um one case study of a wi-fi site in brazil we're all very focused on brazil because of our moderator nelson um and this site i probably won't pronounce it correctly but is Puracau in brazil about 1.5 hours north of um south palo with a town with about 35 homes look closely there it's hard to see but you can see the the v-sat on the roof you know i've labeled it and then also the access point and um user data packs are 70 megabits to four gigabytes or sold hourly or monthly basis and it was a very popular service to the community with a fast ramp up of usage so i just i like this um i know it's a little bit of a fuzzy picture but it's nice to see um you know the services i think in in reality and perhaps not a glossy marketing shot and finally i wanted to talk a little bit about wsrc's impact on satellite broadband and what you know certainly all services need access to adequate spectrum to continue to grow and the same is true for satellite broadband and in particular you know we need capacity in the forward link so that would be the gateway up links to the satellite and then down to the user terminals so looking back at work 19 certainly i agree with nelson that issue 9.1.9 was very important in adding a new gso fss allocation in 51 4 to 52.4 this is already it's contiguous with an existing fss allocation below 51.4 which makes the implementation on the satellite cheaper so it's quite valuable and we're already planning um qv band feeder links on the new satellite i had mentioned jupiter 3 and while it's too late to to add this band to that satellite at this point you know we're certainly planning to use it on our future satellites perhaps jupiter 4 jupiter 6 then also um agenda item 1.6 addressed qv bands and while it was focused really on ngso gso sharing it also looked at whether or not the gso limits to protect the earth exploration satellite service in 50.2 to 50.4 were appropriate and we were able to negotiate changes to those limits that still allow gateway earth station to access you know the fss bands immediately adjacent to that frequency so you know that was very important to you know continue to be able to use those bands already allocated to the fss and then finally certainly agenda item 1.13 was a big item um looking at identifying additional frequency bands for imt and it did not identify two key satellite bands 48.2 to 50.2 gigahertz which is identified for high-density deployment fss earth stations in region two or 50.4 to 51.4 gigahertz which is an important band um at a minimum for gateway uplinks um around the world and in the bands that were identified for imt like where there was a satellite allocation um there are some protections for fss for example they identify the identifications themselves recognize that a country may not identify the entire band but portions there of um there are also some provisions um encouraging down tilt of antennas and avoiding pointing towards the gsor as well as just general recognition that administration should you know consider and accommodate other services such as fss um you know so certainly it's important um to maintain access to these bands even when they're identified or used by other services for the fss and then looking forward to work 23 um again i i agree with nelson i think agenda item 1.19 is an important one for satellite broadband it's looking at allocating 17.3 to 17.7 in region two to fss downlinks and this band is really ideal because it's not shared with terrestrial services so it could easily be used by user terminals or gateways it's also contiguous to an existing um fss allocation of global one that starts at 17.7 so i think it's really an attractive band um for the satellite community to expand into and under other items that nelson mentioned agenda item 1.16 looking at ngso esims and k a band and 1.17 looking at satellite to satellite links in both parts of k u and k a band you know we feel like an important part of that is going to be ensuring the protection of you know gso links that are already operating today and that they you know continue to be able to operate as planned and then beyond the wrc um actions itself um you know there's other important ongoing it work that i wanted to mention um so currently you know in working party 4a there's work going on to look at potential revisions to recommendation s 1503 which provides the description of the software that determines um whether or not an ngso system meets the epfd limits to protect gso's so certainly you know we think that work is important um while it's important to provide flexibility where we can to ngso systems it's important that you know the limits to protect gso's you know are met and then there's a few follow-up items from work 19 that won't necessarily go to a conference but are certainly important work for the it you are to undertake and that includes some items from 1.6 looking at the aggregate interference from multiple ngso systems into gso links and also how to validate the gso supplemental links and finally there's some follow-up from agenda item 1.13 and where the it u decisions from the conference may not have included a lot of detail on how to accommodate sharing you know the it u r is asked to develop recommendations or reports to help administrations in you know ensuring successful coexistence between imt and fs s so that's certainly important work um that we're glad to see it started at least in the the 25 to 27 gigahertz band and then finally and this may be a work item um so perhaps i should have had on the other slide but i had more room here um there's a task to follow up and look at number 21.5 which is a general um power limit of terrestrial systems and how it applies to imt systems using um more advanced antenna technology so we feel like that's an important one to ensure you know um we don't have significant increases in the interference on fs s or satellite uplinks so that's my last slide now i'm gonna hand it back to you and thank you everyone thank you very very much uh kim for this very very interesting presentation and uh just we have a bit of time for one or two questions so so one question you you mentioned about these decisions of wc and the decisions relating to imt and to um satellites so one question that i think it's coming every time that we go to any presentation or any uh any event is regarding this sharing so so clearly the the frequency sharing is increasing as the spectrum becomes more uh congested with greater demands for all services to meet expanding customer requirements so in your view can satellite broadband share with other services what are your views on on that point thank you so i think um you know we need access to some frequency bands for user terminal operations you know i had said that we can deploy a new um broadband terminal in you know two days well to be able to do that we don't have time to go through a site coordination process so we really need access to spectrum um you know for those user terminals that that isn't shared um we can deploy quickly um and really in a given country but i think on the other hand like for our gateway spectrum you know there are ways that we can share a through site coordination or other means for locations where we can take more time to do coordination and activities thank you thank you very much kim and just a quick question this is uh regarding this issue of latency so there's a question that you just received here is in uh related says that in the competition with non-gso players how do you address the the latency issue how critical the latency from geostationary satellites impacts your customers needs so the vast majority of um you know internet applications you know aren't latency sensitive so we think that's um an important um item to point out you know certainly there are a few applications like gaming or something that is very um latency sensitive so you know we don't feel like the the general user that latency is a you know a critical um showstopper you know certainly there are just factual differences in the latency of different systems okay so thank you thank you very much kim for the very interesting presentation again so moving to our next speaker which is mr jonas enneberg from imarsat um jonas enneberg is currently the vice president of regulatory engineering at imarsat where he has worked for the last 25 years he is responsible for imarsat spectrum regulatory matters including it war activities such as wrc participation and frequency coordination of imarsat satellite networks and before joining imarsat mr enneberg worked at the national post and telecom agency in sweden so jonas thank you very much again for your participation in this webinar and the floor is yours thank you jonas yeah thank thank you nelson uh let me just see if i can share my screen first of all everyone can see that i think my presentation will focus on some giving some information about imarsat's global express network which is our uh k a band satellite network but i'll start with uh actually changing my screen a slide uh start we're giving a little bit of a brief very brief history of imarsat and overview our operations in in other bands as well so as you may know imarsat has been around for about 40 years now and for most of that time we've focused exclusively on providing l-band mobile satellites um operations it was um originally set up as an intergovernmental organization to provide maritime safety communications which eventually became part of gndss and since then we've expanded into other markets including aeronautical safety a msrs as well as commercial operations to all all types of mobile terminals land maritime aeronautical um so we've continued to evolve and improve our l-band services over time uh the graphic on this slide gives an outline of uh when we launched new satellite generations and the improvements in capabilities of each of those generations so you can see that we've each generation has improved increased data rates and also provide more capacity and of course that allows us to gradually improve the services we provide to our customers the next stage in that evolution is the launch of a couple of satellites over the next couple of years which is will be our fifth generation of l-band satellites which is called imarsat 6 uh so um l-band continues to be important to us and we're continuing to maintain and improve those services but we did realize uh well more than a decade ago i suppose that uh we can't meet all our customers needs in l-band alone um because of band uh we have available to uh for mss in l-band is uh pretty limited so we looked at other frequency bands and decided to develop start developing a uh system for k-band which we call global express and that development started about 10 years ago so gx is basically in terms of uh our strategy and and uh you know to provide global connectivity to mainly mobile users is basically an evolution of our l-band services but of course it provides much higher data rates and overall capacity thanks to the spectrum allocations available in in k-band compared to what was there in l-band so um as several people have mentioned already to realize specifically our plans for gx and other operators as well we have similar plans uh had some regulatory challenges over the last uh uh period a couple of conferences so now some presented already the e-sim decisions which were instrumental for us uh um and uh that that's that's been something that's uh um that uh been very important for my son come back a little bit further to that in the latest slide as well uh finally we also have an s-band system uh we participated in an e-u bidding process uh probably a decade ago we will uh for access to the s-band mss spectrum two gigahertz and we went out one of the two licensees that were awarded spectrum so we um decided to use that spectrum for aeronautical service in europe which we've called the european aviation network and we launched um our satellite in mass rs uh in 2017 it's actually a payload on the heli satellite and uh we have also developed and deployed a network of terrestrial base stations across europe so-called complementary ground component uh in the cpt terminology the ean is now operational and provides broadband services to airline passengers across europe closer at gx specifically um we have invested substantial amounts into developing the system and so far we've launched five gx satellites all of them are geostationary satellites and we have plans for several more satellites coming up in the next few years all of which are fully funded and under construction so the first four satellites that we launched um gx 1 to 4 they were all identical satellites with um global footprint or field of view footprint and uh together they provide us with global coverage uh up to about 65 or 70 degrees latitude uh and this as i mentioned uh important part of our strategy is to provide global mobility so we that was the first stage in in our um development to um to make sure we have the global coverage we're now adding satellites to that to increase the capacity and performance in in particular in key hotspots and high traffic areas the first of the additional satellites university x5 that we launched last year uh that's how i will provide service in europe and in the middle east and uh after following that we'll have seven more satellites that are on the construction and they will be launched in the next three or four years uh so those satellites are beginning with the gx six satellites which is also called inverse at six as i mentioned that's the next generation of l band satellites these two will be launched in next year and in 2022 and they have uh um stereo beam clusters that will provide uh coverage and extra capacity in in high traffic areas uh following that we are launching starting in 2023 the gx 789 satellites and uh they're very high capacity satellites higher than any of the others that we we've launched um they're also designed to be very flexible so they're able to allocate spectrum and power and change coverage real real time across the field of view of the satellite so they're very flexible and uh in able to do to have this ability to dynamically adjust the deployment of um of the satellite capacity it makes the operation of the satellite much more efficient so we can maximize the field rate of the satellites uh much more than we can forward for satellites with fixed beam patterns or with other constraints in those in many cases a lot of capacity will be unused um in low demand traffic areas especially for mobile markets because uh the traffic patterns of our mobile users is quite dynamic and varies a lot across geographical areas and over time also just similarly in comparison to leo constellations we believe that these flexible satellites flexible geostationary satellites also uh more efficient because they don't um they don't they can avoid having a capacity covering areas where there's low traffic demand and the final piece of our gx current plan gx deployment is gx 10 this is a collaboration with space Norway and it consists of two helo satellites which will extend our gx coverage into the Arctic above 65 degrees north and uh those satellites will be launched 2022 or 2023 and um so they're likely to be uh in place before gx 789 have all been uh been launched okay moving on to uh little few words about the spectrum we're using for gx um the core user link spectrum that we use is uh 295 to 30 gigahertz and 19.7 to 20.2 gigahertz of course these are the bands that were uh discussed at wrc 15 um with the development of resolution 156 and uh so we have those satellite those those bands available in full on all the satellites that i've mentioned in addition we uh also have user links in the lower part of the k band 27.5 to 29.5 gigahertz and 17.7 to 19.7 um there are slightly different so the satellites vary a little bit between them but substantial portions are available on all of them and on gx 789 we have the ability to operate user links across the full band in addition we have payloads in the 30 to 31 gigahertz and 20.2 to 21.2 gigahertz which are intended for our government customers uh so regarding feeder links we have k a band feeder links on all of these satellites that i mentioned um we also have added q and v band 40 50 gigahertz uh field links for some of the latest satellites um and uh this is to uh in order to uh first of all get more spectrum for our feeder links and then be able to increase capacity in that way and also to free up some of the spectrum in k band for for more efficient use of user links okay so for my final slide it's just to go a little bit um to give an overview of um ITU studies that we are following as i've alluded to already we've been very busy over the last couple of study cycles with all the work on ronnie sims and the two resolutions that were adopted at wc 15 and 19 are quite important for us as for us others that have talked about it as well they give us a good platform to to use the k band spectrum for gx as most of our most of our market is is mobile so uh following on from wc 19 and we are now following closely national discussions and implementation of resolution 169 um and national rules for allowing us as we also did the following wc 15 and we're also participating in um in the work to develop a methodology for br validation of the aeronautical e-sim pfd limits that were part of resolution 169 another subject that we're following closely is national spectrum plans in the bands that were identified for int at wc 19 of course some of those bands are shared with satellite services particularly for us the q and v band are important uh from that's why we initially at least plan planning to operate our fiddling some hopefully in the longer term future uh also use links to uh have a dialogue with administrations about which part of the of these bands will be made available for i m t or 5 g and what sharing conditions will be adopted uh in the band active also in the preparations for wc 23 uh just listed some of the items here that are of interest to us fiddling's here since many years in extended c band so uh under a general item 1.2 and 1.3 we're um keen to see uh that that those operations will we continue to be protected uh on suborbital vehicles which is of interest to us and items that have been mentioned already uh non-gso well we we follow non-gso e-sim um we will have as if so a barrier couple of non-gso satellites so that directly affects us and also of course the sharing with gso is of interest to us and studies on inter-satellite links again uh potentially no interest to us but also in terms of sharing with with our gso satellites and of course the item 7 has some interesting topics that we will follow closely uh outside of the wc process we have several other studies that we're following uh and uh there's quite a lot going on with regard to non-gso operations uh so we are interested to see how that develops and in particular in relation to sharing with gso satellites and then we have some mss related items that dealing with uh sharing or compatibility between i and t systems and mss in l band and in s band so uh it definitely continues to keep us very busy and we uh look forward to continue the work and that's that's the end of the presentation thank you thank you thank you very much Jonas for this very very interesting presentation you had a lot of work a lot of developments uh so we just quickly got a couple of questions um so one interesting question is regarding something that you mentioned regarding the work on national implementation of this famous resolution 169 adopted at the last conference so what are the aspects of that work that are important to imarsat thank you okay thank you Nelson um well well first of all this to be a trigger for administrations to uh to adopt licensing rooms for e-sins in those bands if they haven't already done so and i don't know many countries have already have already done that i also know that there are many countries having discussions and we've been engaging with some countries to to discuss these issues so we hope that they will see this as an opportunity to enable e-sim services in their countries are shared but we urge administrations to make as much spectrum as possible available exclusively for satellite we believe at least some substantial portion of that is needed i think other speakers daryl perhaps mentioned but it's uh it's essential for some some services to um you know to have to to be able to operate uh across the whole coverage uh to have uh bands that are not shared others other things like gateways etc can share perhaps but mobile terminals like e-sims need access to exclusive spectrum um and of course there are sharing limits in resolution 169 um and they apply in the portions of the bands that are shared with the rest of the services uh but those limits of course impose some restrictions on e-sim's in particular that maritime e-sim's can only operate up to 70 kilometers outside the coastline and aeronautical e-sim's need to meet pfd limits which restricts the altitude that you can operate at so um yeah these are you know it's again about how the administrations are uh segmenting or or uh what what allocations they they apply in these in these bands and of course we're looking at discussing the benefits of e-sim's with those administrations thank you thank you very much Jonas and very quickly one point that you mentioned in your last slide regarding this inter uh satellites to satellite links so you mentioned about uh i mean the the interest of imarsat in following that uh that agenda items just a question that i found interesting i think it was maybe partially replied but in any way i think it's good to bring so how do geostationary fss service providers view the market potential for serving non-gso user space stations via satellites to satellite links if wc-23 provides the necessary regulatory recognition under agenda item 117 so how do you see this market's potential for that thank you uh well i think definitely that there is a market and i know imarsat has been had discussions with the non-gso operators about providing such services so there's an interest in that we also you know focused necessarily on the k-a-band side but more on the l-band side in terms of providing these services but yes in principle is the same same market as or similar market uh so we will definitely see a lot of interest from from some non-gso operators thank you thank you very much Jonas again for your very good presentation so now moving to our last speaker of today which is Mr. Hasen Morkit from Intelsat so Mr. Hasen Morkit is currently the Vice President of Spectrum Strategy at Intelsat he is responsible for shaping Intelsat's strategic long-term positioning in the marketplace and for managing in forts that protect optimize and leverage the company's spectrum assets working closely with the company's business development asset management and innovation teams to analyze and identify emerging growth opportunities prior to joining Intelsat Mr. Morkit served as Vice President Spectrum Development at O3B Satellite Networks and also as Director of Regulatory and Spectrum Affairs at Yasat so Hasen thank you very much again for your participation in this webinar the floor is yours Hasen thank you very much thank you Nielsen good morning good evening good afternoon everybody thank you for being here and it's an honor to be with you all to be among friends and colleagues and without further ado I would like to share with you what Intelsat is doing from an innovation standpoint that is that would be of interest to the attendees to know about so let me start my presentation all right can you see it everyone's good all right so as you're all familiar you know Intelsat has been around for well over 50 years right now we started essentially we started satellite communications this sector in the early 60s with the launch of Early Bird and along this history there has been many many first many many unique events that really helped shape the industry for years to come so starting with the 1969 the televising the first landing on the moon to the first voice of data called 1974 to the to a Queen Maryship going on and on the Olympics setting records for four number of viewers watching the Olympics around the world and then launching the first truly global HDS system in 2016 and last but not least was the mission extension vehicle where we successfully docked two two commercial space stations in space so so we really do have a long history of innovation in this field so Intelsat has an unparalleled global footprint in terms of number of satellites we operate 53 geostationary geostationary satellites around the globe providing services so that that are that are there that our people are living and using so so this is something concrete that that that is that is being relied upon globally for for valuable services this is not to rest on basically on traditional on traditional satellites we we also operate like I said a global network of high throughput satellites that are in operation right now providing services to to to improve people's lives so and this this is this this network is growing there are more satellites under construction in this class of fleet so our philosophy for for innovation so so we believe that innovation starts at the at the connection at a connection so first the way we look at it is that we try to expand the role of satellites expand and broaden the the how satellites are being used to provide broadband connectivity so our next generation mobility solutions will enable 5g will enable iot and enable rural connectivity we're also transforming or transforming our business model where we are becoming vertically integrated providing seamless services to to our customers add to that our our our expertise 50 plus years of experience experience in in managing a global fleet and then we're establishing partnerships with with with with 5g providers to to and then integrating our network to provide a hybrid satellite wireless service so that's that's our philosophy when it comes to innovation it tried to leverage on our experience and and our leadership in the markets so i would first would like to kind of to take a quick look at the mission extension vehicle this is really the first ever commercial docking of two of two space stations that are in the commercial world in the commercial world obviously this has happened many times in the space stations but for for for satellites this is this is the first time and what this attempts to do is to extend the life of existing in orbit satellites so earlier this year we the the in partnership with north from grumman mv1 docked with intel sat 901 which was already in in at a higher orbit successfully docked with it then it brought it back to service and it's currently operating at 27.5 so as you know normally geostationary satellites have a lifespan of 15 years but in some cases it may be necessary to extend that life and this allows us to do that with this with this innovation we have another mav mav2 that is on its way to dock with intel sat 202 again it will provide an additional five year of service to to that satellite now talking about our effect 2.0 so so as i stated before we have a fleet of traditional satellites that provide c and k u band services then we layered on top of that fleet of high throughput satellites that operate again in c and k u band those those hts those high throughput satellites were you know our digital they are very flexible but what we wanted to do is that we wanted to take it to the next level and with that we we we decided to to to go to software defined satellites those software defined satellites again leverage the the the the intel sat infrastructure but also deliver high throughput communications anywhere in the world software defined satellites are extremely flexible whereby you can change frequencies you can do beamforming you you you manage the power on on the satellites so it really provides you this unparalleled flexibility in terms of in terms of providing services and surgically targeting the areas that you need where you need the capacity unlike the prior generation satellites where the the design is baked into into the satellite where the coverage this allows you to shape the coverage move the beams change the frequencies as you as you as you see fit to really to meet the to meet the demands on the market and this targets in a big way the the mobility segment providing services to commercial aero to merchant shipping land mobile and government military and mobile network so so it targets this mobility segment those satellites also i must say they are going to operate in in kuban in addition to k a and q and db and we will rely on on the the added allocation of the the that was added in wrc 19 and the 51.4 bound so what does what does what does epic 2.0 do what does what is what are the changes that that are introduced in this system so if you look in the middle here so whereas when you look at the architecture of traditional satellites we're going to go from complex designs to really simplified simplified and an integrated design in terms of technology we're going to go from hardware based proprietary inflexible to completely virtualized and and standard based design in terms of operations again going from manual laborious reactive mode into into an automated proactive and integrated so really the attempt here is to try to to become more seamless and to become more integrated into into into the into the network into into the broader network we're going to go from selling megahertz and megabits into into managed solutions that that that emphasize service and value in terms of pricing pricing and scale again we'll go from the the the older rigid pricing models to to more value based pricing and multi-tiered slas that really mimic what what customers expect right now in the in the telecommunications market in terms of user experience again into transforming from a complex multi-step systems into into into a plug-and-play approach so so this this software defines satellite to be attempting to really get closer to the customers and to become more seamless much like what customers expect now so so the the sd those sds satellites are going to really be a platform to to leverage the to leverage the the the the intel set network they are going to serve multiple verticals we're going to serve the aero and maritime the the military and enterprise and the mobile industry this will then integrate with the with the 5g network so it's where we have a virtualized network that's that there's seamless connection among all the various components providing satellite broadband and then serving serving rural communities media companies enterprise and government so this this really attempts to combine all of these networks and and integrate them seamlessly epic 2.0 also emphasizes user experience so so if you look at at three pillars you know we we look at enhanced portfolio of space space platform so we're going to have the epic 2.0 satellites we have also have the diversified space base infrastructure we're going to focus on enriched user experience so smaller terminals plug and play and in user engagement and then it will also emphasize it automation and interoperability so those are going to be systems that are backward compatible and they're software defined and also interoperable with with 3gbp core so on the commercial aero intel set is is one of the leading providers for commercial aero services and this attempts really to build upon it where we enhance the service now we would have an always-on service available in more planes enabling streaming and cellular roaming and and then as you know until sat recently acquired go go so this fits greatly with this again with rural mobility we partner with seven of the top 10 mno's around the world to extend their coverage and provide high-speed access maritime again we are providing services to all vessels with different service levels different addressing different needs different quality of service and for the military it'll sat is the is the largest provider of capacity to the to the US military so we provide unparalleled security and and and service so how does this all connect with WRC so my colleagues have really done a great job in talking about all the WRC agenda items from WRC 19 and going on to WRC 23 but one agenda item in particular that is of great importance is for at least for us is agenda item 1 that's 15 which attempts to harmonize the use of the frequency band 12 7 5 to 13 to 5 by air stations on aircraft and vessels so so as you know this band is the 12 7 5 to 13 to 5 is an appendix 30 B band which is governed by the you know the infamous plan of of country allotments the current rules of this of this of this span preclude the possibility of using of using mobile air stations so what we what we attempt to do with this agenda agenda item attempts to do is to enhance the flexibility of this span to allow the use of mobile terminals so so this is in line with the other agenda items that that have been dealt with before for e-sams in WRC 19 so again what what we what we attempt to achieve in the satellite industry really is to enhance the flexibility of spectrum that has already been assigned to satellite so there are bandwidth allocations there are spectrum allocations where satellite is already allowed to use what we attempt to use is to enhance the flexibility in these these in these bounds to to ensure efficient use of spectrum so with that i would conclude my my presentation and thank you very much thank you very much hasn't for this very very interesting presentation a lot of innovation also in your in your presentation just a couple of questions to you so yeah so this seems to me there is a lot of interest in this mission extension vehicles that you mentioned so so again why do we need mission extension vehicles and what value do they bring thank you thank you well as you know satellites have have a life expectancy and often there are cases where we lost the connection but get pleased to see if we reconnect with hasn't thank you okay can you hear me i'm back yes yes yes thank you yes so so there are many cases where where satellites reach end of life and the the business situation delays the replacement and yet there are critical services that are being provided this gives us opportunity to to to extend the life of a satellite as you know when when when satellites go out of service it's often not because the electronics on the satellite have have ceased to operate it's because the satellite runs out of propellant and if if there is a way to to to keep using the satellite and then that's that's again that that improves the business case and it improves the the the efficiency of of the of the overall business offering so yeah okay thank you thank you very much hasn't and another interesting point raised about software design satellite how do you think this will make the industry more responsive thank you thank you so so as we witness the evolution of the satellite industry over time i mean i can go back you know 15 20 years ago when when in the satellite industry we would get a certain customer profile where we are providing capacity and we enter into five year or 15 year or sometimes you know longer commitment with customers to essentially to wide capacity on and on and on as as as the business evolves we're we're seeing more and more customers looking for really short-term commitments and we're also seeing that the that the the needs change a lot more rapidly than than they used to be so you if you design rigid satellite today to cover to cover a certain area the need in five years or even three years may be completely different so this flexibility is really necessary we we need to have the flexibility to change this this space asset to change the configuration so that we can meet the demand of customers otherwise you know even with even with high high throughput satellites you you know way you still bake in the the design of the satellite at the time of launch and this is not while it can work in certain areas but the the what customers are looking for is is more flexibility and it allows us to to improve our return on investment and and improve our offering to our customers and also allows us to integrate better with with with their networks thank you thank you very much hazen we still are receiving lots of questions but let me now i think then address those questions to everybody but before that let me so thank you very much hazen again for this very interesting presentations and presentation and let me put you just mention to you the results of our pose so regarding the first question in your view what is the main challenge for GSO satellite operators in the years to come so one one challenge was to secure spectrum being used and to identify more spectrum in higher frequency bands in order to make use of current and future innovation in satellite technology so 33 percent responded in that way uh another challenge uh coordination with other systems we had the 23 percent responding that and then the majority 43 percent responded to remain competitive vis-a-vis non-GSO satellite systems being deployed so this is the uh the first question the second question how long satellite television broadcasting is going to remain the most popular telecommunications satellite application for the general public so we had 20 percent replying that it is already not the most popular telecom satellite application we had 36 percent responding in the three to five years 25 percent responding five to ten years and then 17 percent more than ten years uh and then the third question do you consider that the GSO FSS and BSS fixed satellite service and broadcasting satellite service systems should continue to benefit from the regulatory advantage contained in the the radar regulations number 22.2 in light of the increasing sharing capacity of non-GSO systems so we had the majority 53 percent replied yes and nine percent no and then we had the 38 percent of the replies saying that a sufficiently long transition to put GSO and non-GSO systems on an equal regulatory footing should be defined very interesting uh those results so now I think we still have a few minutes for a general questions I see many interesting questions just one first which I found very interesting with it's I think addressed to to all of you we have heard in previous presentations about the advantages of low latency can you try to give a picture of how GSO and Leo systems and applications might complement each other so I don't know which one of you would like to start replying that question I can say something thank you thank you so I mean latency is certainly an important metric you know but it's it's it's and there are certain applications that that that rely on low latency but it's not the only metric when when it comes to providing services so so there is something to be said about about you know using using the right tool for the for the right job and in in some cases if latency is is important then perhaps GSO may may not be suitable but again it's it's one metric not not the only metric in our view don't know if the others would like to say something well yeah certainly and I would agree with with ours and and also a point made by Kim earlier in that the majority of the traffic that we see on our system today is not really latency sensitive it's it's you know principally video and and and some other applications there are certainly latency sensitive applications some some gaming some telehealth you know not all telehealth is latency sensitive but but certainly some of that and and there is some opportunity to complement the the GSOs with with NGSOs and I think a number of us operators actually have filings for NGSO systems advice that does and and others do which will work in in you know complimentary fashion to our global fleet once they're up there so we have some applications that when they really are latency sensitive can be steered towards towards those NGSOs and one point is that at a global level in fact latency over satellite becomes less because anybody who has tried to do a pink test to to a router that's in a different continent we'll see how long it takes you to go through the terrestrial network and in those cases actually if you bounce over satellite if you bypass a lot of this all these stops and you get out you get out you get a much faster connection so so it's it's uh it depends on what you're looking at you you know we can't generalize and say it's it's bad or it doesn't work so every case is different um we uh so we have another interesting question here again relating to this hot topic of inter satellite links so such questions that says what type of inter satellite links radio or optical are more feasible from the technical point of view what do you think about about that well the satellite to satellite links that we are looking at in the context of of WS23 are or radio links and really the the ones that we're looking at and studying are are essentially going to look just like additional user traffic on our satellite so we're providing connectivity when the the MGSO satellites are within the cone of coverage of our of the service provider satellite and they look almost you know like another visa or almost a and like an ESAM as they're passing under that the host provider satellite the types of satellites that we're looking at and their ESS missions they're looking to offload a lot of their their earth observation traffic their space science missions and uh as well as others but but certainly the radio links are the ones that we're looking at now in the current diversity study cycle thank you thank thank you very much for those replies there's another interesting question regarding in-flight connectivity here so we will see will you see more consolidation between satellite operators and in-flight connectivity services and i think this is linked to one of the agenda items of the next conference what is the key strength of KU band for in-flight connectivity so i can speak about KU but i think i'm the only KU operator so so so so well i mean it's it's uh i think there's there's always a in my view a myth about the disparity between KU and KA in terms of model spectrum because if you look at the at the amount of down downlink spectrum that is available to KU it's it's about two gigahertz of you know of spectrum from one 10.7 to 12.7 so uh so i think in the at least in the forward direction there's uh there is parity so and then on top of that you have the added advantage of better rainfade obviously for aero it's less of an issue but i think there there is the there's also the legacy element of it that the number of planes that are fitted with KU systems you know so there there's certain design elements about about phase array antennas and KU so i mean it's it's i don't think that we can say that one system is better than the other you know there's there's two ecosystems they have advantages and disadvantages and uh and it's it's uh you know it depends on on what is being offered and what's the overall system what is the overall value proposition not just the you know i think we we we become so you know narrow focus when we only look at the band as the determinant of which system is better you know i think what's important to look at is the entire system and to end what is the what is being offered what is the value proposition and this is how the system this is how you you make a better judgment so thank you thank you very much it's another interesting question here this is a topic we discuss in ITU is this how how do you see satellite integration into IMT so this is one of the issues a lot of issues so IMT seems to devour spectrum in all bands at the expense of other services for example satellites how how do you see this integration and somehow competition with IMT i don't know who would like to take that one so nelson yes um so i think we look at it more as satellite integration into 5G you know so being part of 5G network of networks um you know it's satellite systems that are going to provide the connectivity everywhere and filling gaps um you know between terrestrial networks so you see it really is complementary and that satellites are critical to um like enabling the full vision of 5G so i mean one thing i can say that ntlsat is very active in the 3GPP group where we try to integrate this satellite component into these discussions so so whereas before uh satellite was thought of as a as something you reach out for on the shelf and then you try to make it work with with uh with the mobile network now now we're becoming more integrated and more into the definition of 3GPP so i think that's important so we are fully integrated you know as a case as a use case within with the 3GPP thank you thank you very much so i think we still have time one more well interesting question here about this uh integration in between geo and leo the question is are large uh geo operators uh ntlsat and others considering leo constellations to augment geo geo networks or gso networks how do you yeah so that's one that that um we addressed earlier and that that uh i think several of the operators have both gso constellations up there and then filings and and preparatory work to support uh leos or or meal constellations and uh you know i think it's it's uh a different different type of use case when you're looking at a gso who's got a global constellation and looking to augment capacity with uh and capabilities with uh with an ngso system versus someone who's got a standalone ngso system who has to make that whole system do everything because each system has a little bit of their strengths and so we can really put a lot of capacity at a very low cost per bit uh on the ground with the gso satellite but there there's some things like latency and also some of the higher latitude coverages that are more brought by the ngso that really complement the system so there's uh i think there's room for for both and and some operators are looking at both thank you thank you thank you very much i think well maybe maybe uh one uh one very very last question for closing so this is regarding the future i mean there's a question about the 6g i mean we have not started discussing this in itu we are still in 5g but i don't know if uh any any of you has any plans or already thinking about uh any uh satellite uh development for what would be after the the 5g i would say have you any idea already on that or or not yet thank you but maybe maybe too early too early to to to think to think about that and uh so one last question i mean regarding this mission extension vehicle is this uh the question well what is the average cost of a mission extension vehicle mission i think i will have to uh i will have to check for you i don't know honestly i don't know but uh yeah okay so i think we're now getting to the end of the uh our webinar so i'll take this opportunity to thank you all very very much again for your participation for your very very interesting presentations and reply to all those uh interesting questions i thank the audience for uh following us all those presentations and raising this very very interesting questions i think uh we learned a lot with that and there's a lot of work to do and the studies to to conduct as we as i mentioned in you all mentioned in your presentations i mean the regarding the results of labracy 19 and all the studies that we are going to conduct towards the the next conference conference and the opportunities that will be open for all those developments and the innovations uh in your networks so thank you very much once more at this point in time i will maybe call my colleague uh uh alexander valet the chief of the space of the department just to make some announcements regarding future events just before that just to highlight one point that again regarding this studies as the the director mentioned in his speech lots of these many of those studies are being conducted in in the radio communication sector of itu and more specifically in itu r study group four and working party for a so i just take this opportunity to invite you to consider participating in our becoming a member of itu to follow those interesting studies so at this point in time okay i will ask my mr valet the chief of the space of the department to make some announcements regarding uh future events future webinars and other events uh of itu r thank you very much thank you very much next listen um yeah just to mention to the participants that we will put all the material of these webinars online uh in the itu webpage and i have shared the link of this webpage in the chat so we will do that in the coming days and you can already go to the page to see the material of webinars number one and number two um i would like to of course thank you all and just mention that we have in the coming weeks the world radio seminar happening so this seminar is going to present much more in-depth the details of the satellite procedures as well as terrestrial aspects of spectrum management this is also a good opportunity to learn about the functioning of itu for the first time ever since we are going virtual the first week of this seminar will be open to all uh participants interested so you don't need to be an itu or an itu members to participate you can fully join the first week so it will start on the 30th of november and i invite you to look at the the webpage on the itu website uh world radio seminar 2020 to see the program and see what can be of interest to you there will be two sessions per day to accommodate the different time zones so normally everybody should be able to to join without too much trouble um the next event this was the last last webinar the itu satellite webinar for this year but we have received a number of requests to continue next year so we will do that we will start again next year and we have already think we have already talked sorry about some topics like iot by satellite also something around kubesat maybe around amateur satellites uh some so there are plenty of subjects plenty of topics to address and um i hope that you will continue to to join us so it was really a pleasure for all the the radio communication bureau to uh to have you not only uh the great panelists that were always very keen and very supportive of this initiative and i would like to thank them for that but also all the attendees that also contributed to the success of this webinar by sending many questions many interesting questions i know that we have not been able to answer to all of them but um this is unfortunately a little bit the the rule of the game always is webinar thanks again and i hope that you will join uh the world radio seminar in three weeks now and and um i wish you a good day or a good night for some thank you