 Welcome to the special liquid margins. It's number 28. And it's social annotation showcase a look back at liquid margins. So we're kind of jumping on that gravy train of looking back at the year, except we're looking back to 2020, because it's all like one big year. We started liquid margins in 2020. And so we wanted to have a chance to talk about the entire uvra. Right. Today's guests are Franny French. I don't know if you've heard of her. She's the digital marketing specialist at hypothesis. She's wearing a tie today. I'm not going to a wedding later. And I didn't plan to wear ties by the way, fi I need Angel is also here with us. He's the director of marketing at hypothesis. And like I said, we have Michael de roberts. And he's going to be in the chat. And Michael agrees with what I just said, thank you Michael. In the episodes that we're going to be talking about today. We will be going across the entire 27 episodes but we're not going to have time to highlight clips from all of them. But just from some, but not because we don't love all the other ones. With that, I'm going to turn it over to Nate. Thank you. Okay, one more thing there. So yeah, as Franny suggested, you know we've had over the course since we started liquid margins back in 2020 spring of 2020 if I'm not mistaken. We have done 27 episodes this is the 28th episode of liquid margins. And we as in preparation and preparation for the show Franny and I went back and looked at them all, believe it or not. Oh my gosh there's just so much great stuff in every single one that it was impossible to choose, you know, just a few clips and the time that we have here today, a few to highlight. So we're actually going to walk take you down through a trip the memory lane through every episode, starting with number one but we're going to delve into a couple of episodes in a little more depth. And kind of explore, pull out some some highlights from those episodes in particular, but I'll just say, first of all, our huge thanks to all the different presenters and guests who've come on liquid margins and shared their thinking and their practices, because what a rich trove forget social annotation for a second just like what a rich trove of people talking about their teaching practices, especially during this time of the pandemic when I think teachers and students were especially challenged and so you know our hearts really go out and our thanks to all the people all the guests who joined, as well as the participants. So there have been so many great folks who joined liquid margins live to be part of the audience if you will, and more here today. So really thankful to everyone who has participated so far. I said sorry to interject, there's going to be a lot of that going on here but I just want to second what you said and I feel a little remiss that I did not say that as well. And it's just been a real pleasure to be around so many thoughtful and educated and smart people, you know and it can be a little intimidating and not that I don't think that I'm smart but you know, sometimes I just hide hole because things are going over my head a little bit. Well you know if any you are smart and call dang it people like you as well. We're going to keep it kind of light today with our normal banter that some of you may have experienced that are I annotate social hours. At any rate so it's not to not to delay that the trip down memory lane any farther so they're like I said before there's 27 episodes, and each one is you know between 45 minutes and an hour so that's you know, more than 20 hours of watching so as Alex suggested in the chat if you're going to binge binge watch liquid margins over the holidays, which would be a great thing to do I think you're going to be spending over 20 hours doing it just so you know. So I wanted to just highlight a little bit from liquid margins one, our first episode first of all because it was a great episode where on both Kyle and Michael came on and these are two folks that are super experienced, not just in working with hypothesis and bringing information to their schools, but in just in using educational technology and different pedagogies in general, and they, they just speak really thoughtfully and, and, and really intelligently about those processes and when you grab the slides there's links to every episode record up here, you know where it says liquid margins and the episode number. So you can, you can dive in and see some of the other resources that were behind each episode in this case there was a great blog post about how to, how to pilot anything really in a thoughtful way. And so but the clip that I wanted to play which I'm just about to do is about something else. It's about liquid margins itself and so let's let's pause for a minute and hear what the clip has to say. So coming up with a name for something is one of the hardest things that you can do and so we went through a long process of trying to figure out what to call the show. And here's a few of the names that didn't quite make the grade. I was, I was pretty, pretty psyched for a couple of them I went margins last on the door yard, I thought was pretty good title, or maybe even puff the magic margin. I'm actually decided that I'm pretty much going to be known now as the sheriff of Nottingham, which is really a great show name but I thought it would be a cool title. None of these, none of these names for the show made the cut. And so we ended up with, you are at episode one of liquid margins, and that's how it all kicked off right. You know, it could, the show could have been called Naughty McNote face or border hedge as we like to say, but no, or it's not butter it's margin. Another great one there were a lot of great name ideas, but we ended up with liquid margins and 28 episodes later. Here we are. And so, um, actually, I ended up, it seems odd that we're going to do this for each episode I ended up picking a clip from episode number two as well. And this was, you know, this was when we were just first getting started with the show. And the second episode, just also blew our minds because it was just such great conversation about how composition teachers use, use social annotation in the classroom. And I'll just say that. This was a really interesting episode that actually had three guests, one of them doesn't appear on camera and that's why they're not in the, in the thumbnail, they won't be on camera, but it's actually, it was Chris Gileard that I picked for the clip. And one of the things as I was watching through the shows is each episode is packed with all sorts of great ideas about how to use social annotation and, you know, like really specific teaching practices, both within certain disciplines and across disciplines. And this episode of course is packed with all of that. But I was also looking for when people stepped away from the details and thought a little bit more like a big picture about what this all means. And I think Chris's quote here pulls out something that I thought was interesting that came up in many episodes. And that's this idea of people have an anxiety that when there are annotations in a reading that somehow infect people's first reading of something and that it that it's like, it's unfortunate that people don't read without other voices in the margin, if you will. And so let's hear what Chris has to say about that I'm not going to blow up the screen because he's not on camera. But I really liked the way that he talked about that particular topic. Because no such thing as a blank slate, you know, I think that when we encourage students to buy into some of these myths. You know, they're intensely problematic for lots of reasons. But mostly that notion that it somehow spoiled a text to know what someone else thinks about it, rather than enriches it, you know, I mean it is not like a way of thinking that I share. And in fact, again, like I think so to draw another example if you're in a lit class, and you're reading, you know, so Tony Morrison song of Solomon. What I used to do when I taught lit is you give like them also some criticism of that work, right. Well, again, like I, I'm not familiar with anyone saying well now that you read that criticism right give them the novel spoiled. I mean that like, so I think I understand where those notions are coming from but I think they're really mistaken. I think that's, that's a theme that we saw come up, you know, we kind of asked a lot of guests about that about, you know, when when students come to a text and there's already voices in the margins. You know how does that help or hinder their meeting and they're thinking about the text. And that's, it's an interesting theme to just explore throughout throughout the shows and throughout the whole practice of social annotation. So we don't have a ton of time so I'm going to press on. But in each one of these episodes in this case I didn't pick out a clip. This is fantastic episode as well focused on the discipline of history, really to really smart historians talking about how they use social annotation. But I will just say that in general, like, even if history isn't your discipline watching the history episode can be really valuable and interesting. And that's, I'll say that for all the episodes because people really thought about things in ways that cross disciplines in every case. So if you're a historian. This episode is a must see if you're not a historian is probably going to be packed with really valuable things as well. And the same thing is true about this next episode episode four about science. It also had a couple of guests, one who didn't appear on camera and that's why they're there. They're only one person in the, in the thumbnail, but in the science practice they actually opened up one of the themes that I want to explore in a later clip, which is about how reading itself is such a social act. And so we'll come back to that when we get to the next clip. We did this special episode on social annotation in the sky learning platform, which is one of my old favorites and was a really valuable kind of exploration of some of the technical details but then some of the teaching practices associated with that as well. Then in episode six. This was a really great episode. I'm going to say that about everyone, don't I. But in this episode to instructional designers talked about their practices working with faculty in order to kind of, you know, evangelize for the adoption of both really good pedagogical practices and social annotation. And oh my gosh that the energy and the conversation this episode or just stellar. I love this episode. I'm looking up a little bit. Brandy knows how it is. I've got kind of emotional but this one almost brought a tear to my eye. But what a great episode so sort of like the last episode number six was about engaging with teachers this one is about engaging with students, and again really great thoughts and voices from Danielle Michelle here, both. I recommend that episode as well. So we now come to the last clip that I picked, which is from this really fantastic episode on math with with Matthew Salamone, and this is just an amazing episode, partially because it, it really gets into the piece of how social annotation works with math which is not necessarily a thing that most people, you know, jump to is their first idea of what social annotation, like the discipline that social annotation would be most comfortable with right people often think of humanities, social sciences, English composition all those things. Matt talks about that quite a bit, but what's even, what's even more powerful to me is the way that Matthew talks about math as a practice and, and our kind of our human relationship to math and math pedagogy in general. So I want to play this little clip from him it's a little bit longer, but I think it touches on a lot of the things that he brings out in the episode as a whole, and it's really powerful so let's listen to what Matt has to say. Because what the practice of mathematics looks like, not just at the teaching and learning level but at the professional sort of research mathematics level is that mathematics is an inherently social enterprise. So how we figure out whether a mathematical idea is even true in the first place is we don't submit it to some all knowing all seeing Oracle in the sky somewhere right is we submit it to one another, and we engage in a conversation and we assess, you know the success of a new argument or even the success of a very definition in community with one another. So what it looks like to sort of practice mathematics. I think one of the things that's telling about math is that other disciplines get different verbs out in front of them we can practice and art we can conduct a science experiment we can investigate a question and social science. What is the thing that gets attached to math what's the verb that gets attached to math. We do math. And the reason that we do math is that it can be done, and we can then do something else with the rest of our day right just the choices of words that we use there. And it sort of glosses right over the fact that we don't do math as individuals most of the time in math classes. That's what it looks like. In the field of math we are sort of plagued with this myth of individual genius right we celebrate these individuals who have made contributions to our fields who are almost invariably young white and male. And so there's this this folklore that builds up around math that that's what doing math for the sake of having it done it looks like is is one person that's brilliant. Usually a white guy sitting in front of a piece of paper almost monastically and sort of elucidating it all on paper, but that's not what real math looks like. It's not what it looks like for professional research mathematicians, it shouldn't be what it looks like for first graders, you know, learning basic facts in their classroom. This is what the practice of method. Sorry I sort of flubbed up at the end there stopping that but um. So this is this is a theme that that Maddox was really powerfully with with math, but that we saw people surface across all the disciplines and that's that every practice is inherently social every academic practice every research is the act of reading itself, even if you're doing it all alone in a room, you're always in a social context, you know the world around you. Things that people have said about those books as Chris Gilead said, you know the criticism that you might have read or the fact that someone suggested it to you. And so I really like the way that Matt applied that to math here but it's something that just stretches across all the difference, all the different disciplines in a really powerful way. So if you do binge watch all the episodes, I recommend that you keep an eye out for people touching on that issue. For instance in the sciences to about how the sciences are inherently social and not some sort of you know, you know practice that someone just does all by themselves in a monastery like the one I'm in here right now yeah for any unmuted Yeah, I wanted to say that. Yeah, it is all learning is collaborative and also the arts are collaborative to and I something that Chris said, or that point that you're pointing out that Chris Gilead said earlier. I think of when I meet a writer and they say well I don't read anybody else because I don't want them to influence my writing, and it's like all writing is influenced all art is influenced by other art so just make me think of that. And it's, I mean I think that's just something that that annotation helps us surface right is we, we like Matt talked about the folklore of the, you know, the lonely white male mathematician working in front of the blank piece of paper. Same thing with the idea of a book like the lonely reader in front of the, you know, white black and white book. That's not, that's not how actually most reading takes place, and even when it does your own, you know, your own engagement with the reading is already a social activity. So, we don't begin, we can talk about that all day but we need to press on. Oops, I went backwards instead of forwards. So, you know, and I'm just about to hand the baton over to Franny because she picked out selections from the second half of all the episodes. But just to say a couple of quick things, you know, we had folks who spoke specifically about using social annotation with high school students, as opposed to college students. There's a lot of plastic stuff there really powerful and proof that you can, you can use social annotation with really any, any age group in fact I've heard of people doing social annotation, you know, all the way down in kindergarten and preschool. Often they won't be digital then it will be analog, you know they'll be using crowns and markers and stickers and stuff but they're still reading together on the page and that's what's important. The language is such a powerful use case that we talked about an episode 10 right where not only can you annotate a document in any language but you can also make your annotations in any language. And so, there's just such powerful use cases for for world language study with social annotation. And so about liquid margins would be complete without a shout out to really clear our good friend and the inaugural scholar residents and hypothesis he's done so much great work, not just here but also for annotation in general, a great scholar and thinker about about annotation. And you know if you don't know Remy and his work already. You should, because he's he's an incredibly, incredibly accomplished and powerful voice. And so in 2012, I actually did pick out a clip here we don't have enough time to delve into it right now, maybe at the end of we can come back to it. This is a fantastic episode on kind of thinking about how students can be made successful or can be enabled to be successful with the help of social annotation at a college that's near and dear to my heart as a Colorado and Colorado college and really great, some really great thoughts there. One of my all time favorites that I didn't pick a clip from because just the whole episode is fantastic. Is this idea of, you know, not even focused on social annotation but the idea of how do we build, you know, equitable and hospitable learning environments, and how do we deliver equitable and hospitable learning environments for everyone and for anyone. And so we had three really thoughtful thinkers here with me and an autumn, kind of addressing that which is quarter their work. That's a really great episode and it's worth watching in full. I couldn't even pull out a clip from it. That brings us to an end of the half of the smaller half of the shows that I went through and picked my favorites from. So let me open the floor now to my colleague and friend Franny French, and have you lead us through this next bunch of episodes. Great. Thank you. And I'll just go like that when you're supposed to go to the next slide because Nate's running the board, or whatever you want to call it. Thank you to gum at the same time. The social annotation and teacher education one, also another great one, and I think it just does a really good job of showing how, you know, teachers also like aren't necessarily used to using social annotation in their teaching. They also need to be to have experience with that. And so it's just great having the teacher educators educating teachers who can then pass down social annotation practices to students who can then share with each other. That's another thing that went through all the episodes right I mean, Matt Salamone talked about that in teacher education and math to about how, how teachers can, you know, try to help people get over the kind of math anxiety that builds up when they're young, when they're so young. And so he brought that into his practice of teaching teachers right. And social annotation bridging theory and practice. I do have a clip from this one, and there were so many good things it was, it was really hard to isolate, you know, clips and ignore the other ones because I knew I wouldn't have time for but this entire episode is great. So Nate if you would go ahead and play this clip. Thank you. Okay, I learned about it through a workshop this summer where Shauna Crossen was there, a technology consultant at the University of Minnesota. And I think maybe Shinwon was there and Hong and Bodong you may have been there too. And I remember getting really excited about this idea of hypothesis and social annotation, and I pursued getting the integration into my canvas site. And I went to this special training, just for hypothesis and social annotation, which was exciting to me. Probably the most exciting thing I learned about online teaching this past summer. And I was excited about it for a couple of reasons. I was going to be teaching I was developing a course dance history that I inherited that I was wanting to change up and really think about it it's a writing intensive course. And I really wanted to think about how to teach writing. In a way that students could really pay attention to the texts that they were reading in order to learn from the writing strategies of those authors, and then incorporate them into their own writing. So that was one thing that was exciting to me. And another was just really focusing on how do you read the one of these university level texts. It's hard enough to read by yourself. And so, when you get to read with your with co students. It's really wonderful for the students to share their knowledge with each other. So I wanted to incorporate one this cooperative learning model that I used to use when I taught elementary school, and also I used to teach reading so I had all this training on comprehensive strategies. And so I would include that as as prompts for students to annotate so things like using prior knowledge you know what's familiar identifying the main idea or the argument, asking questions what's new to you, making connections and then another time we had a an annotation based on what in this reading sparks your curiosity. So that that's how I got excited about all of this. Yeah, and I mean I should I just want to add I should have set that up with what Cindy was going to say but I'll just do it backwards but I love the idea there of connecting reading with writing, but starting with how you read. So teaching someone how to read and the questions that she asked I think are really instrumental and in my own reading that I do outside of work. I can use those questions and I do use those questions. And then I also love the term cooperative learning. So that was a beautiful quote. I just going back to that idea that you know we're all learning a social right and ideally cooperative as opposed to say competitive competitive competitive social learning be a different kind of thing. I think she, she also brings up some really specific points about how she uses annotation with with specific readings which is, is really powerful. And that team at Minnesota has done a lot of really interesting research and kind of diving into the, the, you know that, you know how social annotation can afford sort of like, even more intense learning outcomes than other things. Next slide. Yes, please. Right and I also really like this one but I didn't pull from it. I mean I didn't pull a clip from it. But community and composition so again, going back to that idea of community and annotating in community or how annotating leads to a sense of community and how that can help and kind of core. English like foundational English courses. And of course, it has raining in it to we love and also people members of their research team at Indiana University who we've been partnering with over the past year and change to do research into social annotation so if you're interested in social annotation research definitely check this one out if you haven't seen it or give it a review it's great. And then I do have a clip from this one, or run Jacob's talking about social annotation and then you'll see what happens at the end of his speaking and I like this clip because it really, it pulls in the idea of community like in real time so I'll kind of let the clip speak for itself. All right, you don't want to set it up. Well, I mean I was kind of setting it up. I mean just to say that it's what he's talking about is, you know, looking at reading as something much broader and all encompassing so I'm not just annotating in the margins with like I disagree with this or I don't disagree with this but like, opening it up for people to be creative in their annotations. Let's give a listen to a room. The way I might think that through is it's it's not just reading the text it's like how our social cultural reading practices look like right now. We don't just watch a TV show, you got to, you know, have the build up to the TV show and then you've got to go find out about it. And so in that way we don't just consume text in isolation anymore. It's the recognition as educators that these texts come with paratex that the reader is consuming so the so annotations are a way social annotations are a way to recognize that and to fold that in to teaching praxis, which was happening in other spaces anyway. And if that is incorporated into it. That could change, you know, the way that teachers are thinking about reading it's like if every bit of literature that you assign comes with other tech I mean fan texts that are associated with it. And then let's let's fold that in and in the annotations is like, Oh, these students are going to generate X number of words, along with this as well, and account for that and then count that as reading material as well. I love that idea of thinking about like bringing all of that into the classroom. That's where you wanted it to end for any. Well actually no there's a bit more. Okay. Well because it moved away from him. The whole, the whole world has become one giant book club in a sense right. Okay, you wanted to get my last word in there okay. Yeah so it was kind of, I didn't want to spoil it but I just, I love that it's like a little, you know, Haley says, Oh I'm going to steal that. And then Nate sees he makes his own kind of cognitive leap there to the whole world is one giant book club. And so it just sort of shows like the power of that collaborative thinking in real time, but but yeah also like what we kind of goes back to that question like what we're bringing to the text, and I like that a run is in his teaching is celebrating and also making that he's enabling that for students. Yeah, and I think, I mean, I think there was a sort of meta happening there that you've calling out right it's like the conversation that we all were having in that episode was an example of people thinking together about something that illustrated how social annotation can also be a conversation of people together thinking about something in that case of text right. So we're all thinking together means it's one big brain right. It's a board. It's cyborg cyborg. It's a meta all the way down as I'll accept. If you can hear my cat in the background sorry for that. We can. Hi, William. It is like. And this is this is my second the last clip I'm going to try to go quickly here because we're going to run out of time but I'm, this is Maritaz, a P go and she's what I like about this clip is, and it's a little bit longer, but bear with it because there are so many great communities in it so she's really focused on sort of practical things that you can do with annotation and in particular at the community college level. And you know community college colleges, typically have you know just a really broad spectrum of students of all ages and all income levels and, and, you know, race creed and color and everything. So, it's, it's a great episode just in that sense so it's like, it's almost like annotation for the non traditional college student, let's just say, not exclusively but I'll shut up now and play the clip. One of the things that we do at the very beginning is I introduced to them six reading comprehension strategies. And they are making connections so you know I asked students to. As they read make connections to it and that could be connecting what they read to their lives. It can be connecting it to other books or articles or movies or songs events. So you know as you're reading think of like what this reminds you of. Another strategy is to visualize so I asked students to, you know, create pictures in your mind when you read. You can picture, you know, as you're reading what can you visualize. Or what's the movie that's playing in your head as you're reading. Another strategy is to ask questions because good readers ask questions before during after their reading so that they can get a better understanding. So these are to infer so really teaching students like how do you read between the lines, how you draw conclusions based on what you're reading. There's another one on determining importance so teaching students how to pull out the big ideas, especially when students are asked to summarize something that they read their have they're having to determine well what's important. I just sift out all of the unnecessary details, and then synthesize so how do you use what you've read to start creating your own ideas and form new ideas and interpretations. So those are like the six reading comprehension strategies that I teach my students at the beginning, and I've been using the reading apprentice apprenticeship framework for about two decades now. And it's been a really fundamental part of my, my pedagogy when teaching reading and writing, and I started using this when I was teaching high school. And I'm still using it when I transferred over to the California Community College system. And I can drop in the chat, a link to the link to the reading apprenticeship information in case anyone's interested by West Ed. You know they're incorporating four dimensions of reading social personal cognitive and knowledge building, and it's really about getting students to have a met a cognitive conversation about what they read. So to actually make their thinking be aware of their thinking. So one of the things I do when I teach these six reading comprehension strategies is I kind of fuse in the reading apprenticeship framework into that and I first a model for my students, how I read. And so I'll do a think aloud, where you know I'll read a piece and then I'll stop and actually, you know, vocalize my thinking out loud so that they can hear what's going on in my brain. So they can hear me ask the questions they can hear me visualizing, they can hear me synthesizing out loud. So when I do that modeling and thinking aloud. Then wanting them to start incorporating those strategies into their own reading when they when they do it on their own. So I use hypothesis to practice these reading strategies. And you know I asked the students to tag their strategies that they're using as they're putting them into the margins, you know tag when you're asking a question tag when you're synthesizing. You know also for ESL students, you know we incorporate some kind of vocabulary building in there too so that students as they're reading their identifying any unknown words to them. So, since all of our you know readings connect to what they're going to then be writing about. I encourage my students to also make little private annotations to themselves as they come across any possible quotes that they may want to cite later on in their writing. And so, they can always go back when it's time to write the essay and already have kind of some pre selected quotes. Oops did that cut off planning. It's a very long clip so I mean we sort of got to just that those are the important parts that. Okay, right there. Great yeah she she really goes into some depth about my cut the details of her actual practice which is great. She was informed by the fact that she does have ESL students and so when I thought that was interesting but also like the, you know identifying words that you don't understand could be also for non ESL students, I mean, that particular episode if I remember correctly focuses in on a particular case in California, where there's legislation now that says that it's no longer okay for community colleges to, you know, end up with students who are stuck in a sort of school to sack of developmental learning where they're trying to develop college level skills and instead asked colleges to fast track people into normal college study and give them the support that they need to get there in ways that that don't sort of, you know, put them in this separate category, and these people talk about how they use social annotation to help make that possible really powerful stuff. Yeah, very interesting. And we are running up against the clock but let's, I say we keep going because we still have some stuff to cover. And if anybody needs to leave, including Michael, you know, thank you for being here. Hopefully you can just hang out for another 10 minutes while we went through this but if you can't, this recording will be available probably next week. So then we traveled up to Canada, you can see how cold it is up there by Fergalo hey guest Fergalo Hagan photo. This is a really, really good episode to. And I just think that like, it's interesting how it is being used up in Canada but it's not so much about Canada but just like, this could be any episode anywhere. But there's a lot of really interesting stuff. That old, especially Andrew. I know I just butchered that but that she talks about, about history. So anyone interested in history and Soviet history in particular will want to definitely catch this episode. It's almost like Canadians are humans too right Alex, we have a Canadian in the audience so I just funny. It's funny, but you can't take the practices in Canada, would they be so different really I mean. That's what I was saying they're not really, but yeah, but we, you know, we love the idea that that social annotation is, you know, spreading out around the world and in fact it is already around the world and we have other episodes like the one which, you know, she's in Cairo. And using it there and then we also have, we haven't done it yet but we're going to do at some point, all in Spanish liquid margins, focusing on. Rosario, Rogel Rogel, and, and how she's using it in in Mexico City. Yeah, and I was just going to say to there's a really great episode on on the use of social annotation in Armenia from one of the I annotate episodes. So it really has spread around the globe in a really interesting ways. Yeah. Okay, and then this episode and you might have noticed previously that we did have an episode on annotating science. This is more focused on, you know, annotating scientific primary sources in science. And it's also just fantastic. And I think that I just want to say like in general this is a really good time to be annotating science history. Right, I mean, because there's so much sort of misinformation but just this is more there's so much history going on right now. We're in history right now. There's more history than ever before I think. So yeah, but yeah check this one out it's it's especially interesting in the sciences but also can be applied to any other disciplines so just good practices in there. Next slide please. I love saying that. Okay. And this of course, you know as the pandemic ramps up again, we don't need to go to the dark side here and talk about that but you know gosh, every day I hear about schools, going back to full remote. And I'm sure there's going to be some hybrid there as well. This is like how you can use social annotation anytime, whether you're online or on campus, as the title says. And, you know, there may be differences in the way you use it in the clock when you have everyone in the classroom. But, you know, that's up to you I mean it just this one just sort of shows how flexible social annotation is as a pedagogical practice. That's an important point I think, because so many people in the flip to remote learning for the pandemic, kind of glommed on the social annotation as a tool for that. It, it's sort of overwrote the fact that, as many of these teachers talk about social annotation is a viable tool, regardless of the circumstances it's not just a tool to use during remote learning for the pandemic it's a tool that can, you know, that can bring those powerful pedagogical, you know affordances to any kind of experience. And then literacy and learning with social annotation in high school. You know, again, how I mean I think that people should be starting to annotate in grade school, but in maybe they will at some point you know. But this is just really interesting about how Morgan Jackson and Joe Dylan are just such thoughtful educators and really brilliant and warm and kind and just in the way that they talk about social annotation in this episode as it relates to their students learning. It's really inspiring. Yeah, and to connect that back to what Matt Salamone was saying about you know how people's anxiety around math starts to build up almost from day one in school right you know school is actually like a factory that helps us build up anxiety about math, or we're reading in English right and so to have to have these practices go back in time into earlier parts of people's you know school experiences to help them, you know, realize that yes everything is social everything is a conversation. I just can't happen early enough in my book. Sorry, I'm not enabling you to say. Next slide please. Should I go back. Yeah, I'm going to go back and then you can say it. Hi, please. It's like when you're a little kid and you get to press the elevator buttons. But in this case, I don't have to press button so I just you command the buttons with your voice. I just give the orders. Yeah, but successfully implementing social annotation at your school, you know, again, and these are all, you know, are involved in instructional design in some capacity. And so it's really great to hear from them in this episode to because they, you know they've sort of got a finger on the pulse of, you know, how best to do this how this works, and they're really invested in not just social annotation but other powerful ways to use ed tech. Not that they talked about it here but I mean, you know, I just think it's, it's a very important thing now to recognize that tech is part of the learning experience. And there's good and bad tech, obviously, but, and just how social annotation fits into that. I mess the slides again before I was ordered. Thank you. I keep trying to anticipate you but please advance the slides Mr. Angel. Yes, Miss French. And again and this might seem like redundant because we just talked about how you can use social annotation in different configurations of classrooms. But I would say that this one really, really delves into that and it's also guest moderated. But a genetic cone guest moderates this one. And again, she's just one of these very thoughtful educators. And is super invested in what she's doing and David Cerna the other guest is extremely, you know, well versed in how to use social annotation in whatever kind of classroom you're in. So, again, because we are moving into this, you know, COVID feels like 100.0. You know, it's worth sort of looking at these episodes in particular that do have to do with using social annotation in different settings. And great for anyone who hasn't used social annotation yet. Yeah, I think Janae is Janae has some great things to say here she wrote this fantastic book on on reading strategies as well and so she really bring some of that perspective to the conversation there. Next slide please. And then this one is is mostly focused on student writing, but not exclusively. So, just like that clip that I picked from Cindy Garcia earlier, where she's connecting reading and writing. And this is a great one for that. And again, fantastic guests, like, I can't say enough like how lucky we've been to have such great guests. And we're not paying anyone to come on this show, you know, it's completely volunteer. So anybody thinks you're going to get rich when we ask you to come on to liquid margins. But you will get a gift in the mail. Thank you. Yeah, and I think this is another theme that really came through in a lot of episodes is this idea that, you know, we think of annotation as being a practice around reading but it's so often a practice around writing as well. A lot of people really speak to that how helping people learn how to read differently can really can empower their writing as well. And it speaks to kind of what we were talking about earlier too about, you know, reading is as much a conversation as writing is. And so if you're going to be a good writer, you have to jump into that conversation of other texts to get to get your foundation and to also, you know, to be in the conversation. And as a writer, you're at least in a conversation with your imagined reader, right. So it's already conversation. Oh, dang it. I keep waiting. Next slide please. There we go. We'll get it right by the end. We've got one more slide to go before. I, I, after I pulled my clips of which I have one more after this. I was like, dang it, you know, I really wanted to pick a clip from this, but I just couldn't make it work. This is actually one of my all time favorite episodes of liquid margins. Now you're getting choked up. Yeah, I know I was just going to say, you know, make the big cry or I'm like, I can cry. I think I did cry during this one a couple of times. And it's, you know, it's about, you know, basically, you know, teaching nurses how to do what they do through social annotation and also touches on that like, you know, reaching them in remote ways, you know, but there's just such beauty in this one in terms of how, how much they care about their students. And, and I know everybody who teaches cares about their students, or, you know, probably almost everybody. Yeah, but that just really comes through. And then also they have stories about, you know, what different students did in response to those annotations and how community truly was built in the classrooms that where they taught with social. I remember correctly I didn't, I didn't rewatch this one just recently but this is another example like the math one maybe where people are like nursing annotation like what why would you use annotation and the nursing course and these folks really illustrate why it why it was so powerful. Next slide please. See how I waited there. And then this is going to be my last clip. This was a show that I said during the show this was a long time in the making. And this, you know, we are is so important to what we do as an organization and how we think and fits in with our philosophy and and with our, you know, with our social annotation tool. And I'm really proud of this one and it was this was guest moderated by the great Robin de Rosa, and I hope she's watching this, she hears that but it again it's chocolate really great stuff but the clip I picked. Because it really makes this connection. It's almost like blurs the line between social annotation and we are in a way that just is great so neat if you would press the play button. And just for anybody who doesn't know we are stands obviously for open educational resources for people aren't familiar with the lingo. And where I ever made or used was an OER that I created with students called the open anthology of early American literature. I was really lucky to be in a field where almost everything was public domain texts. So we made this anthology. It was digital. And it was kind of okay you know it didn't have a lot of things that the paid version had in terms of like footnotes and notes and so students weren't actually loving it. And that kind of changed when I layered in hypothesis to this open textbook that we had made. And I put in the chat of the sort of origin stories of this of this project and you can you can take a look at it a little, but hypothesis was new when I was doing this. And somehow you know they were so new and so small that they would like talk to me every day about like how's it going over in your class, and they would watch. They would watch my class like do a kind of beta thing. So it was this really cool thing because I was not a techie so I really felt like they were watching actual students to develop the tool which was cool. And then my students love the idea of like being in on the ground floor or something but the textbook itself really took off when I put hypothesis in there. And you can see from the little write up I shared that I think hypothesis was the reason that this we are became a living organic place, rather than a replacement for a textbook it was replacing the heat anthology. And that was kind of a game changer for me so in some ways I think hypothesis is what pulled me into open pedagogy. And this idea that using open resources, allowed for my students to have a different relationship to learning materials than they had before. So, that was like, pretty transformative for me and again at the time I was new and open I was new and everything. So, I was just I felt really lucky to be hooked in with a community of people that was discovering the potential of using an open license, making no we are using social annotation, all this kind of one posse and I think it's hard for me to separate out who we are from the social annotations so all the stuff I've done since, mostly through rebus has had hypothesis, you know, plugged into it and I think it's been. Keep it going or if you, if you want I didn't people probably got the gist of that. I think it's just, yeah it's fantastic how she, like I said she doesn't see any separation between we are and social annotation, which I think is so interesting and I kind of want to hear a little bit more about that so I mean we've, like I said this was a long time in the team but I think it would be great for us to do another episode with social annotation and we are maybe with different people. Just to get different perspectives but yeah it's a really great one and in case anyone's wondering to the one of the things I love about it is that the thing on the wall behind Robin is is, I think her husband is an artist and he made that sculpture and it's an ice cube tray. I didn't really hide and even totally decided to play but I like every time I watch that. I love that. Yeah well I as Alex is saying in the chat to you know there's such a deep connection and as you mentioned Franny there's such a deep connection between open educational resources and open education in general and social annotation. I think part of it has to do with the fact that, in my experience, having worked in that field, quite a bit. There's a real, there's an intersection between the kinds of educators who are interested in and practicing open education, and, and those who are interested in tools like social annotation and, you know, going beyond that kind of ed tech solutionism that Alex mentioned in the chat. They're using social annotation in ways that really, you know, empower students and those learning communities as opposed to just kind of throwing a tool into the mix with the idea that it's going to just vastly improve learning because that's a new tool in the mix. Yeah. And also just want to say, you know, in her clip she talks about how hypothesis sort of, you know, was listening in on the class I just want to make it clear we don't do that as a regular practice. We're not into surveillance that totally goes against like our, you know, our ethos, but, but she you know that seemed like kind of a neat thing and I like the idea that the students enjoyed that too because they knew that they were trying something new. And, and just the fact that like it really enlivened the process for them, like, you know, they weren't enjoying it and then with the advent of this they were. So that also just, you know, it didn't fall it gets students involved in their own learning and it gives them agency, I think, to be able to socially annotate what they're reading and, you know, it all kind of ties back to what we talked about earlier in the show. There is nobody who does some genius thing in a vacuum. I mean, I don't even like the idea of genius. I think it's, you know, I think we need to go back and examine who, who did we call a genius and why did we call them that. And what did we think that they were doing they weren't just tabula rasa, you know, coming up with an idea. That's not how it works so we're all standing on the shoulders of giants. Yeah, and I think so much of what we're doing is undoing those old beliefs right and this is a perfect time in many ways in life to be like deconstructing these old beliefs and saying huh well what what actually is this you know what is history what is science what is English literature what's the canon, who's a genius, you know, it's very interesting time. There's so much history going on right now. There's more history than ever before. History in multiple universes as well right not to mention the metaverse oh my gosh. Yeah well this has been. I just have to say what a valuable experience it was just to go back and revisit all the episodes I want to, I want to give a big thanks to Franny who's really been to she's access the she is the producer behind liquid margins that makes it all happen and whoa it's a lot of work actually, but wow what great fruit comes from the seeds that you planted. If I may carry the metaphor too far. Anyway, thank you so much for for have all the good work that you put into this and I mean now with you know this is will be coming up on our second anniversary, you know in the spring I guess and it's just been so powerful and amazing. It's a rich trove of material that, as Randy once suggested that somebody, somebody needs to do some scholarly work, delving into the material that's collected in these episodes and, and really bringing out in a more scientific, or in a more thorough way that we managed to do in this show, you know what the, what the big themes and takeaways are. Yeah, and it's just nice to see to what started with an idea. And then we're brainstorming on zoom from our border hatch is and we were trying to come up with a name and everything. You know, it's just really nice to see it come to fruition and to see, you know, to get these great guests that, honestly, I mean I'm so humbled by, you know, and they're excited to come on the show. It's not like, I guess I'll go on the show. I mean they're really excited about it. And nor do we ask them to, you know, specifically even mention hypothesis. It's really a show about social annotation. It's not a show just promoting hypothesis but then after time they're really promoting hypothesis and saying how great we are. So it's like, okay. It makes me feel a little uncomfortable sometimes because they're so comfortable. I'm like, you don't need to do that. Yeah, I mean it is really awesome but yeah, I know it's fun. Well, you know you've been with us for over an hour now at least those those folks who took some time out from their holiday schedule to be here so thank you so much for doing that. I guess we should probably bring it to a close and put this one to bed so it can be edited and shared out with the world. Yeah, thank you so much for coming. And again, there'll be a recording of this. Hopefully, next week we'll let you know. I hope everyone has a wonderful solstice and we'll just see you in the new year with some new liquid margins shows. Yes and remember, the days will be getting longer from now on so once the solstice passes. So that's positive right. Thanks Alex we appreciate your congratulations and you may have the award for the person who's been to the most episodes yourself so we appreciate it. Thank you. Thanks Nate and thanks Michael. Thanks everyone in the chat.