 This episode is brought to you by bespoke post stay tuned later for more information in the show. We have a sponsor So the show I have notes the show with where with where surprised people with surprisingly full IMDb pages discuss everything Animation creative and internal development. I'm your host Isabel Iola and with me today is my lovely co-host I'm Carrie Shotcross. I'm giggly today. I Think we just start just going like IMDb creative go With us we have two very special guests returning from last week Aaron Wynn and Returning from it's been I think it's been like two years Jordan swears Hi Yeah, I Into into mixer streaming You really had the the mixer eye-racing cornered I just don't know what you're gonna do now. Yeah, it's all downhill from here, baby Anyway, good to be back It's good to have you back. I missed you because this is like my one chance to talk to you every week Well, what do you want to talk about? Nothing really We have a lot of talk about actually I'm excited we do There's some there's some cool new stuff coming out there's some stuff But do we I mean we have to start with how's everybody's week going? I? mean it's Monday, so So far so good It's Thursday or Friday. That's true. Oh, that's weak production weak projection Not it'll be okay. It'll be here's where we're hoping to go. I just lifted the curtain. Oh, no People will know that we record on Monday They are there's no difference in the weeks. They're all a blur I'm like I'm trying to figure out like what I can do To like change up my office like every day or something like I moved furniture around Do you feel like you're in like a whole new world? Not really. I just it's easier to see the television Okay, so it's like an easier world Also, I have this old chair that I bought from Amazon that I was gonna use as my office chair and I hated it so I like put it away I Was gonna like sell it or something and never got around to it And then I pulled it out of the closet in here the other day and now my cat just sleeps on it all the time So now it's a cat bed See you bought a cat chair. That's fine. That's fine. I mean, I guess yeah, it's just a thing for a cat to sleep in It's just this like little like bucket chair like it's not even really It's with like swivel and like change height and stuff like this whoa It didn't at all it comes with a handle and it doesn't do anything. It's Jordan. I think Jordan. I think you bought a home depot bucket Is it bright orange and five gallons because It has like no cushion so I hated it, but it was like really cheap from Amazon So it wasn't expensive enough for me to like warrant. Oh Actively selling it. Hang on speaking at cushion. Oh You got you got it Here's the weird thing though, this is the back. It's a fart hole It's so they don't get absorbed I don't think that's exactly why carry Name one other practical application of my my butthole being exposed like Prevents hemorrhoids, I don't know. I guess maybe yeah Okay After last week's episode we Toilet reminds me Randomly I was looking we were looking at houses today and there's this one we were looking at specifically to rent and I mentioned to Yes, I was just like hey, I only just realized the toilet has a wood cover It's like that was troubling where it has the wood lamp in it and I'm like, that's that's weird Yeah, I don't know that I longer in style. I don't know that I want a porous material My uh growing up my friend had a Toilet seat that had a cushion on it. I was gonna ask about people's experiences with these gonna be honest not a fan Not a fan. I don't like I don't like sitting on the toilet seat and it already being warm. Yeah Yeah, I'm not those cushion ones do. Yeah, Derek. I love you. I fucking hate your toilet man No, I ain't doing it. It's it's I want I want that cold Sterile porcelain. Yep, cuz you know, you know, it just feels cleaner. Yeah And it can warm up With your war I Yeah, let me do it. I think that is for me with somebody else's This is the last gross thing we're gonna say and then East is gonna talk about a cool soccer made soccer anime, but I Think that is the thing that I miss the least about being in the office is You know, oh, you know a hundred plus people Or, you know, I don't we have like probably like 60 dudes sharing three stalls And just like I don't have like any stalls. How unfortunate with three sweet three stall We have with three stalls in two years. Well, I mean, yeah, and seven showers That's weird. You know, you need the shower Used to be a gym The showers make sense that why they're there But I don't know why we didn't convert them because we definitely need more stalls Yeah, with toilets then we need showers cuz you know what the worst, okay? This is not the worst fucking thing ever. No, it is Gary own it one of the worst fucking things ever Is waiting in line for the stall and then they come out of the stall and you just look them in the eyes I know what you did and they just give you this knowing nod. It's like Your turn For you I've slacked somebody afterward before and I was like just what the fuck This is why I don't poop at work If I have to poop, yeah, I mean I'll go poop, but I just Okay, I don't An emergency it's happened to maybe one percent of the time I'm a big believer I poop on company time as much as I can Slightly slanted toilet seats Just uncomfortable enough for you to not want to sit there on your phone No, is that like things that companies are sounds like torture devices. Yeah, yeah, they're putting these in in offices and workplaces like Like Walmart and stuff to like better control how much time they spend in the bathroom What's an Amazon doing it too? It's possible Amazon just just sets out boxes for you to use They have enough Home Depot has Home Depot buckets. Yeah Sure, he's a he's a please please talk about a soccer anime Captain Seabass is coming. Yes. Thank you. It's not just a soccer anime. It's a soccer anime game Y'all not watch the trailer. Oh, no, I watch the trailer, but it was but to be fair it was not a lot of game play In Soccer I bet I could get Jordan to look at this I Totally looked at it and yeah reminded me of what did I say shell and show a shell and soccer and Dragon balls. Yeah, I was on Scott. It's got like a very like 90s face art. Yeah Or that like yeah, oh, yeah, super retro looking cuz yeah, I don't know. I just thought it was charming Yeah, I'm all for like an arcade Over-the-top version of soccer games like FIFA is too much. It's too simulation I want I want something crazy. You want to stop whatever comes your way. Sorry Captain Seabass is like a very old like Kind of timeless anime It's it's definitely it's one of the most credited Anime manga series that got like the country of Japan into soccer. Yeah, hopefully hopefully it'll be fun Hopefully we'll see more gameplay soon. Oh, Erin you have a switch now, too. You can play it. I do I mean, I've had a switch. Oh, that reminds me guys. I finally got animal crossing Whoa, I know I got it as a housewarming gift for my brother So I haven't actually started to play it because I'm still like in the process of unpacking and organizing everything So but it's well, we're all over animal crossing. Yeah I I'm so afraid I'm so afraid because I haven't logged in in Three weeks And I'm just so afraid that everybody's gonna be needs everywhere. Oh your villagers are dead now. Yeah I think every day since the game came out. I could just real quick. I think Mike's got it I just want to show off my new goals for my Is that not Amazing thing you've ever seen I can't figure out what this facial hair is. I don't think you're supposed to So go to go to a single on me So if he's supposed to have a mustache that goes like this Yeah, but instead it's going across his face like this Yeah, so all of this is like shaved and it's like real thin down here and it's just connect. It's like It's like he just like outlined a beard Yeah, it's like this is this is the Perimeter of where my yeah I Talks about this sometimes but like his hair when he's growing a beard will grow like all the way up here on his cheek I'm gonna my dad. So he could probably You know, let that grow out and then just shave everything that's not here and he'd be fine So you're saying is get that look we need to tweet at Gus and say I Make it happen goals. See he's got he's like me. He's got the I call it the the reverse Hitler No hair right here Mascara and filled in nothing Now I wear it with pride You know that also makes me think That'd be a really good style to have now because when you go out in public and you're wearing a mask Looks like you have a full beard underneath. Yeah, and without all the problems of like the scratchiness of the of the hair rubbing on the mask, so The high you never know what's underneath you get you get all three you get hygiene you get sanitation, which is the same thing And you get style And that's what's important. I feel like men normally grow beards to hide a weak chin But this man's quite the opposite like it's somehow he hides shows his chin off more Like it just maybe that's the back that he has a very long chin Shaved an arrow like I don't care how weak his chin is because Very strong chin his soul is strong show off my best features. Yeah, I Know you guys are talking about his facial hair I'm too busy looking at how his sunglasses look like two eyepatches Any day that sponge all comes up is a good day I have no idea who Just saw him in the in the keys just in the stands We'll have to play the game and find out. Yeah, I'm very excited. I hope he's a playable character. I Hope he has speaking rules. Maybe a maybe he is you Nintendo here are please If your mailbox is anything like mine, it's kind of sad 90% of the time you got a lot of political flowers Utility bills lots of coupons. That's actually not sad is it? But once a month I do have a reason to be pretty happy and that's because of my box of awesome from bespoke post I know you're wondering issa. Why are you talking about a box? That's usually made for men. Well, I say gender is a construct I want these things bespoke post sends people the best stuff every month no matter what you're into style grooming Barware cooking tools outdoor gear box of awesome has carefully built collections for every part of your life The week under bag was really cool I ended up choosing the mixer box because I think some alcohol is actually kind of nice during these trying times So to get started take a quiz at box of awesome calm Your answers will help them pick the right box for you and they release new ones every month across a ton of different categories So it's free to sign up. You can skip a month or cancel anytime each box costs only 45 dollars But has over 70 dollars worth of gear inside get 20% off your first monthly box at box of awesome calm and enter the code I have notes at checkout. That's box of awesome calm code I have notes for 20% off your first box Thanks guys Speaking of Interesting art styles. Oh, yes. That's my second. Yes. Hey, this is a good segue They we just got some stills for the new G. Blee film. Yes, and it looks different Very different. I'm gonna the record saying I think it looks pretty cool But yeah, I can also understand how maybe it doesn't look very G. Blee Yeah, it took me a while like the first in the article we were looking at It showed like very I guess just like character driven shots like the main character some of the secondary characters I guess and at first I was like But at the end of the article it has like a full like promo Full color much more interesting to look at sort of like poster or pinup. I'm like, okay I'm sold on this and then you just kind of took me a minute to get used to those first few images Like put me off, but interested for those who maybe haven't seen it yet it's It almost looks like avid children's art style We're interesting. It's a it's immediately. So it's just it's these, you know Anime classic anime proportion characters, but with more realistic shading They look they look very clay like to me. Yeah, almost Yeah, figurine. Yeah, especially with the way the hair is Yeah, the hair is got a lot of interesting stuff going on. I don't like that one of them looks like Howard Stern, but You know, you can't see that That's all I'll ever see now They also give me like slightly older Team Rocket vibes. I think it's the hair color. Oh, yeah They look like they look like they have a like a silver the the Howard Stern looking dude Robert Robert firm He's got like a silver pokeball on his belt. Oh, maybe I have to look at it again. Yeah, David Blunt It looks it looks interesting it's I think I think for them to foray into Like this 3d style is gonna be really cool to see and I'm glad it just just doesn't look like everything else You know, that's what I liked about spider-verse like taking chances and doing breaking new ground on style and stuff So we need more of that. So If there's any, you know Studio to trust with with a look like this. It's probably Ghibli. Yeah. Oh, I don't think we said the title of the movie. Did we? No, it is a a Doing along for an adaptation of Diana when Jones's novel earwig and the witch So they're they're tied on a get Aya and the witch is that you can't say cool Yeah, or I had told module. Yes If you're into that kind of thing, I can't I can't look at it right away Are your eyes? Okay, but is that the same? Well, I mean I would Google it, but is that the same author who did? Hell's moving castle because I know talking about her books. I believe so. Yes. Yeah, he's just given a firm. Yes It's interesting if you look historically as well Japanese 3d movies It's only the past five to ten years. Yeah, they really started not I guess Embracing is a word to use but maybe more utilizing full seat full 3d in the same way that Though I think the way that they've always done 3d is always still trying to make it look 2d because yeah, it's our 2d the regular 2d hand-drawn. It's such a popular style. Yeah, it's been is like a auxiliary to Sorry, they're too. Yeah. No, it's I think In easier bridge to get to between audiences and the uncanny valley And it's only recently that they started doing something similar to like what Pixar has been doing for years Here which is fully stylized character designs in that like 3d rendering lighting without lines So I'm kind of curious. I personally don't know if they're actually gonna adapt the story well But I think it'll be visually really good. Yeah, definitely. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, you know, that's all their movies though If it doesn't if it doesn't hit on storytelling It's you know, that was Hell's Moving Castle, but I talked about a couple weeks ago. Yeah, no comment No, it reminds me a lot to have the the loop on the third movie. I was about to say I'm very excited for that movie too Yeah, and it's very very similar. So the Dragon Quest movie. Oh, yeah, that is on Netflix I need to watch it. So but I'm very excited for that one. Also, yeah, are you excited for the two new amiibos? Jordan, I'm like, I'm making space on the shelf See them very well, but that's what those side like the port the vertical shelves are. It's all my smash amiibos Did you did you watch the the direct today? I showcase I okay, this is the house shitty of a person name I I was working on something I'll talk about in a second But I was working something last night and I was like, man, I'm tired you know, I'm just gonna wake up early and I'll finish this up like, you know, fresh start, you know, that helps me a lot sometimes and I woke up You know, I casually at my breakfast. I sat down. I was like, all right time to get some more. Oh smashes I just clicked on it and I just watched the whole thing And then I worked I love how soccer I did the reveal where he was like You've been wondering about the Joker amiibo here it is and he like holds it up It was on his like table in front of him. It was was why he was behind a plant the whole time No, that was hero because he was like, oh, that's right And so logically hero would be next so you're probably wondering when's that coming out and then he reaches over behind a plant Well, he did that too with There's something else he put like back behind a pillow. Oh my god It was very like I love sacrifice so much He my favorite thing about it was they showed his living room and he He's the person that has now let me know it's okay to be 25 over 25 and have two TVs in your living room He's like you might notice I have two TVs. Sometimes I like to watch things while I game I was like, oh me too. I do that brain energy. I would have never thought to do that Just stuff that you can absorb on the peripheral. Yeah Cole Cole talks about his little sister and how he's like she's the coolest person I know because she has like five monitors running and she's like playing a game on one monitor And she's watching like twitch and other YouTube videos at the same time. I'm like, oh god. She's such a zoomer Yeah, I guess Monty was he was the trailblazer because he would always have something run and he would like He'd be working and then have like his like stream of like cool anime clips going and then over here He would have water the rings commentary Yeah, and just absorbing all of it. Yeah, you see like he'd be doing something He obviously he would stop and then like rewind a little bit And then go back like I Yeah, it's I have like there's certain things I can't do that with but as much as possible I try and like always have something going on the background just because it's like there's not enough hours in the day Yeah, we have to we have to go beyond Is that working for you? It's I mean, you know, I'm tired, but yeah But the thing that I was working on I Would tell us I have notes breaking and breaking and now it's We just started writing a volume nine Jordan it's gonna be Jordan It's gonna be okay. Yeah, it's uh, it's June. It's the end of June of 2020 We're working on volume eight in volume nine. It's a it's a good feeling. It's scary, but it's good Yeah, so I was trying to finish up a script this weekend Yeah, I'm Smash Brothers happened and it's not really this happened so volume nine officially delayed It's sacrifice fall, but it doesn't mean that Ruby is going to be the 11th DLC character So it's all I I'm not gonna I I'm gonna I was gonna say I'm gonna stop doing this, but I'm gonna keep doing it what we did a In two weeks ago on talk Ruby to me. I made a joke. Yeah, Joe Mack was our like a camera lead was talking about 1917 Which I haven't seen yet. I just saw a bunch of behind-the-scenes stuff and then they did like a big like One-shot kind of thing and I was like, oh, yeah, you hear here first volume eight all one shot and Obviously, it's a joke Just gonna pause on that for a second But the Ruby Twitter account tweeted it out and was like you heard here first everybody and the number of people they were like That's gonna be amazing so then of course I doubled down and said yep, it is Because I thought oh I'll double down I'll pull up all the old Eric Badour I'll just like really lean into it and then people will understand that I'm joking and then the first two things that happened after I Double like I doubled down on it where two people quote retweeting me saying it's true And I was like, oh, no, what have I done? So I had to be like it was a goof. I just goofed everybody. I'm sorry Now when the volume comes out, they're gonna be like, I can't believe Carrie Shawcross lied to us. Yeah Bastard he gave it. He said he was gonna give us one continuous shot It is it's one continuous shot if you just imagine that every cut is a character blinking That's how immersive we are Erin I can't stop watching your cat Go to town. Are we gonna have to wear that? No, it's not her butt hole is her belly She's just real bad guys here. I'll censor it. I'm pretty sure if I started licking my own belly We might we would at least talk about blurring it Oh Official thing you can quote me on volume 9 writing has started and we're excited Two shots and at least yeah, there will be there will be at least let's say three shots Breaking that's just That's all I really brought to talk about today, so I'm kind of done now He's sleeping Let's go say show your cat Nah, I don't want to It's look, how would you feel? If you were napping peacefully and a giant lifted you Yeah, I mean I want to tell myself I would be very upset, but I think that would also be kind of dope so I will gladly welcome a giant There he is That's me. Uh, somebody photoshop a giant Yeah It'll Sam will have as the thumbnail before I keep like I keep looking back and forth. I'm like, where is he? Just waiting any minute now Do uh Do we have any other maybe internal things we want to talk about wink wink nudge nudge Looks at I have a show What's it called? Give us all the deeds It's called recorded by aris all and it's being released july 13th Whoa, that's so soon. That's so soon. Uh, yeah Oh god, I'm so excited. I am also excited. Yay I'm happy because it's Mostly done, but It's mostly done. Uh, all the animation has been has been done for months. Um, but now it's kind of putting together all the final bells and whistles, uh, but my current when you're asking is like, how's your week? And I'm like, oh man, I have been um Having like this consistent anxiety stomach for the past. Oh, no. No Uh, it's partly I think it's a lot of I I understand now carry kind of carry adjorted to um, like the whole like stressors of being showrunner of Like preparing all this material um And especially since it's like the first time kind of like you feel like you really want to do it, right? Um And there's a lot of it's okay that you won't though Yeah Nothing wrong with that Thanks, or you could just be like me and just don't prepare And then you can't fail Because you you did in a show. Exactly. Also. I'm the only non-showrunner here feels bad man. So far So far. Well, watch out breaking news Aaron coming out with the show right now As a cat with a big old leg It's it's uh, it's all about weird beard That's our hero He uh, he runs a cat grooming business. Um But he uses his own tongue Well, that's why he has all that bald spot around his mouth Yeah When when my beard is like still growing in and it's like kind of scratchy I'll like rub my face on the cats and be like, is this what it's like to get groomed? Is this the same My cat will just like he'll just like Rub his face like on my chin like over and over again And I can't I feel like I'm being used but I'm like, okay with it because it's a cute cat It's cute Is there more you can you can tell us or there's probably is there a trailer coming out? Um, what is it gonna be? I don't know. Uh, I don't know trailer. Um So the with recorded by rsl it is a short We call a prelude series to a story that um, my co-developer josh and I've beat before and uh It's short format. So it's less than five minutes and there's only four episodes So really have fun making a trailer out of that That's very fair. Yep. Just watch the first episode. There's your trailer Just be clear. This is me saying this and not and not easy. Just just fucking watch it It's short It's a very low commitment. Yeah, just go for it. He says amazing. Watch it support. He says show and maybe we make More show That's how it works. If this is the prelude that means there's a lewd wait There's a post it's it's a different jordan's face. It's spelled different. Yeah, it's it's lewd, but it's l u d e I'm all about that post lewd I'm done now. I like that. I like yeah, I'm really excited and we should We should keep talking about it and again, I'm saying this is not isa I would love it if you watched it and shared it because I think isa is really great And I'm really excited for people to see this and because I want there to be more because I I know about more And it's interesting Yeah Yeah, we like we like trying new things Yeah, it's it's it's wild because this is also like coming right at um Uh, what is it right in a an awkward personal time because I have to uh find a new place to live soon And it's just like oh god Everything's just like coming down all together. Yeah, it's fine. It's okay. Hey if I can do it. You can do it too Thanks. Finally made it a new spot new place No crusty old man Here's do you want to know do you want to know my uh my trick for how I deal with uh The like the day an episode comes out So you don't get as stressed Tell me here's what you do ready So let's say the episode comes out at 10 To oh well, okay, this is easier for me because it's the weekend But because ruby comes on saturday norma. So what I do is I set an alarm For 20 minutes after the episodes come out So that way People have watched it by the time I go to look at the comments And I look at the comments for two minutes and I make sure the episode's not broken And that nobody's saying it's the worst episode that they've ever seen And then I go back to bed And then later in the day I go back and I'll read through some I'll go like oh cool or oh, that's a good point and then I don't look at comments ever again Sometimes that's a good approach to it. That's what I try to do and then sometimes I spiral but uh Oh, I know I know that Yeah, and usually what I do is I just go full into the spiral. So I open I open the the website for uh roostertooth comments Uh subreddit look at those comments Tumblr look at any like tags and posts And like if it's on youtube open youtube and then when i'm done looking at all the new stuff I just go back to the first one and then Go through the site reddit tumblr youtube Website jordan. Oh, no, jordan. That's what I do too. I was trying to lie to her I was trying to get her to not do that Because camp camp would cut out on fridays and just watch me do that Yes, I would I would see it with you talking about that kind of Triggered me back into like my seat in the office And I would look over and it'd be like oh jordan's on tumblr and then I'd look over and go Oh jordan's I read it it would make me think maybe I should check out the comments too Oh jordan's crying Oh, he's smiling their tears of joy. Oh no now he's sobbing It actually turned into my well fun fact that ended up turning into like a good team building exercise between our teams Because um jordan would post a funny comment On to one of our slack channels, uh where we have the team uh on with us and then they'd start also looking for other comments and it would be really fun We like looking for like positive comments or like kind of uniquely positive ones and then Ones that are kind of weird. Our favorite ones were ones where they spelled, uh, naris's name I don't know We compiled all of the different like naris misspellings. There was like naris noris Naris naris, uh, there's one r. There have been like two s's I think. Yep. Um, yeah Sometimes they swap the vowels. Have you ever gotten like a maris? With an m? Probably Statistically That was me Actually, I was the one that did that I just can't remember. Thank you. Yeah, it's uh, I think it's gonna go great Uh, there's always gonna be negativity, but Fuck them. Yeah Speaking of that, I was curious how y'all as creatives dealt with either On like criticism or hate quote-a-quote. Um, like how you deal with that and like Yeah, that's my question There's quite a spectrum there because Criticism can usually be helpful and constructive And it gets you to think about something that maybe you didn't think about before and something you want to apply to the future um That's probably the best you can hope for Like I mean that's not going to make you feel good, but it's going to be like Well, at least you know moving forward. Yeah, and then there are the comments that are just like It's sole purpose is to make you feel bad. Yeah It gives you nothing. Yeah, if you can even call it that. Yeah, it's just like I hate this show and the people who make it. Yeah, like that doesn't tell me anything You just made me sad I Yeah, I I I don't know. I still don't have a good answer after after all this year because I mean like I mean like yeah, like serious answer is like I Like I do try and read as much as possible um I typically I don't watch a ton of videos just because uh, I just don't have a lot of time But I'll try and read like, you know some reason stuff um But I mean it's like it's like Jordan says like I think you got to take everything And kind of file it away and the the the tough thing to do But I do feel like it's important is even the ones that are hyper critical or I mean just just Mean because there are there are people that are just mean is like still try and understand like where they're coming from and why they got To that place, you know, or you know, why they have that thought even if you Think it is nitpicky or don't agree um Because even you know, even if you're still happy with your Decision knowing that somebody took it a certain way or took it the wrong way or took it a way that you didn't think that You they were going to Is still helpful But I mean I I also Uh, I don't know that I've ever met a creative person that That didn't get bummed out by stuff still, you know, yeah, I don't I don't think you're human if you're like Oh, just got a death threat that doesn't bother me in the least but like I don't think people like that exists. So yeah, I think being bummed out by comments like that is a totally rational and normal feeling I I like I think the way that you're looking at it or the way that you had described to carry I like that if only because I think uh That sounds like the harder route to take because you to me it sounds like you're still trying to be empathetic um throughout Kind of this like hurt I to me and I I would prefer empathy um or the empathetic Look versus kind of just Stonewalling Yeah dismissing it. Yeah, and it is it is hard Yes, you yeah, that that's the hard route for sure Well, it makes it a little easier to process because like there's the initial like Reading it and being like, oh, this makes me feel bad And then if you do take that extra step to be like, well, why Why would they write this like what is it? You know with either like this person or the content or something that you can kind of like reach some sort of understanding to To give it some sort of value Where at the service it maybe doesn't have value Classic classic we're just such good friends I hate it. Thanks He said go first like I'll go. Um, I think that's also something It it's easy to try I think and put logic Or try to understand To me any way what other people are thinking and at least like to talk about it But I think too there is that um dissonance between your mind and your heart And it's something I actually I'm still working on as a person and like with my counselor Is Is kind of like why I understand why someone would say this and I understand even in just like regular life, um, even if it's just a criticism towards like uh, how I'm thinking at at a certain like personal aspect even not as creative, but Uh, I can understand if that's still parallel to um online criticism or hate is like I can understand maybe why someone would say this but I still feel a certain way and whether or not it's like well Do you accept that? Do you what do you do about it? Like you have all this like energy now? So Uh, yeah, they've given you like a a basket full of emotions and you're just like How do I hold all these emotions? What am I supposed to do with it? I will say to you I mean there are there are like periods of time or like They're there definitely been And I don't I don't remember who they are at this point because it's been so long But it's like they're there will be times where I will notice like a single person being consistently Like maybe they did have some good points to them, but they were being consistently rude about it Yeah, or mean and toxic. Yeah, and I as there's a certain point. I just went it's not worth Because I I take I take that stuff seriously Um, because I I want to be better But you know when when every comment is You know, why did you do it this way? Which is very valid You you you were a terrible creator. It's like, okay Well, if I read if I'm reading that every day, I'm just gonna perpetually be in a funk and not Be able to actually improve. So it's I'll just I'll just mute people Yeah You know, I like after a certain point of like it's it's like, okay, it's clear everything you say is gonna have something Mean behind it. I'm like, okay. Well, I just I don't want to be satisfied. They want to they want to be hyper critical That's it. Yeah, it's it's you know, I'm helpful There I think there are just some people that this is what That's what they enjoy to do is like they enjoy Being no matter what like trying to poke holes and something. Yeah, and you know, I I can't stop them from doing it I I certainly would not spend my time doing it I I got one time I tweeted like I don't understand I think I've talked about this before like I one time I tweeted. I don't understand why people You know watch And and hate on things so much if they don't like it Yeah, like hate hate watching something just to be like, oh, I hate this so much Oh, this part this part's so stupid. I hate it And and and I got a lot of I got a lot of flack of people were saying I didn't want criticism And I didn't even like there's definitely a difference Yeah, there is and I just like I like if if if it is if it is a hobby of you to Look at something and and pick it apart then go for it. I just like I can't do that I would so much rather take all of that time And just put it into making my own thing then Then making I just I just can't like I'm at a point and I have been for a very long time It's like if I don't like something I just go, okay. Well, I'm just not gonna Watch that. All right. Yeah, and then like I just like I move on You know, and I'm not saying people shouldn't criticize our stuff. I think they should But um, also like a certain point like if you don't like it, this this is true for everything So you don't like it. Just don't Stop torturing yourself, please Yeah, yeah, and I think I think There's also a way to go about it and presenting like what you dislike or what you wish was better, you know and usually when somebody comes in just Very aggressively and root lee That's like nobody's gonna listen to it's like it's like that line in the big lab basket. It's like no, you're not wrong You're just an asshole Yeah, like that's why we don't like you. Yeah, it's not because the points you're making are invalid. It's that you're just I think there's actually a pretty interesting Discourse about around this as well that you guys just reminded me about where it's like If people I think the idea of it is that um, the concept of boundaries And how I think when you present yourself online Um And when something is available online like that the cut boundaries just kind of don't exist anymore. Yeah, exactly. Yeah um, and it's not to say that Uh, we're putting up boundaries. Uh, we love our community, of course and research teeth The company that we all work at is based on that community um of Like friends and people and networks that we've met along the way Um, but that it is kind of like that boundary of like, do you know you're actively hurting someone? Yeah, you know that there are people behind Yeah What you're directing at. Yeah, like Like we all we are all people. So when you say something like You you are stupid or something Or some dumb tweet You know the the person you're tweeting at is reading it and they they are a person Yeah And I feel like it's a very easy thing to for people to forget It's very easy for people to assume that anyone who's like worked on something and has like put it out there for everyone to to consume is somehow like uh Immune to like Hate or like vitriol or something and I don't really get that and I feel like it's It it it affected me to a point where I had seen like people Who had created other shows like, you know, like rebecca sugar and stuff and you know get Get certain like attacks and stuff from people on twitter where I wanted to be a little more detached from Uh, the optics of what i'm working on like i'm still very much involved 100 and like You know guiding everything and it's it's all of me in there But I don't want people to watch it and be like this is such a classic jordan thing. Oh jordan who I You know 100% Analyze guys with The show I like, you know, this is so classic him. So that's why like I try to like Not be the face of a show and let the show be the show but You know, I just I don't know But I mean it's a solution Yeah, the thing that stinks is like on because I'm right there with you the the flip side of it is To you know to talk positively for a second like the number Of times at a convention or just on twitter or on our site or anything like that Did somebody said to me like hey Like I started writing animating drawing whatever because of you and your show Um, and that's like incredible and that's like that's the that's the best thing That's yeah, that's worth it. You know and like if if I have to get shit on To to let like that happen too like so be it just because it's like, you know, I think I mean that's like That's what I liked about You know rt before I was part of the company is that like I watched it versus blue but like I I could not tell you if I've seen the first five seasons more By themselves or we're watching the commentary. Yeah You know like I used to I made you feel like you were there with the guys and one of them Yeah, 100% you know and it's like I like that's what that's one of the things that like made me want to get into this industry was like going Oh, there's something I like and they're the people that make it They're normal people Like I like I want to be like them. So it's like, you know, I It by I struggle with the same thing Jordan and sometimes I have just like All right, I'm just not going to twitter for a couple months. Yeah, you know, um, just because it's like I All it's gonna do is Prevent me from growing um and that's what's but there's um For I haven't finished yet, but for any any readers out there um Eddie Eddie Rivas one of our co-writers for ruby Um, he recommended this book to me called uh, big magic It's by uh, elizabeth gilbert who did uh, ypres love Oh Did I I can't remember. I don't know. Maybe you told me privately. I can't I can't remember anymore No, no, I we may have talked about before but it's it's it's a lot of it's her talking about her creative process and how how to be brave creatively and how to you know You know for a lot like she doesn't say this directly but basically like Tell the world to fuck off and I'm gonna make my own thing and You know, if you don't like it, you can go make your own But I'm gonna make something that is special to me and represents me right now, you know, it's uh Um, she puts a lot more eloquently. She's a novelist I kind of feel like that's how I approach a lot of criticism personally like I also have the luxury of not being a showrunner so when people Uh, criticize my work. It's mostly in reference to like character designs or just like anything visual um, but my approach is usually just to be like Like if y'all don't like it like, I mean feel free to make your own like I've seen plenty of like Ruby redesigns that are super cool um And even then Like if there's like one example was like when John's hair for volume seven was shown and everybody's like, I hate this fucking banana boy I can't believe you did that. I know I I fucking murdered this this poor innocent child And turned him into the sex god. He was meant to be Anyways, I kind of make it a joke like I think I even made a twitter post about it saying like with every like I will pluck one hair off the john's hair Just stuff like that and like This was criticism we got like right when we released him and then once the show actually rolled around People just either seemed to got used to it or they just didn't care anymore. So sometimes It seems like criticism isn't that big of a deal in retrospect. It's just kind of a way if you have to ride Yeah, definitely and like in that moment You lose a night of sleep over the biggest deal. Yeah, you know, yeah, and like I know like I value everybody's like comments and criticisms, but there's definitely a point where I'm going to uh, maybe favor some comments over others just because of The people behind them. Maybe that's kind of asshole-ish, but If like a 12 year old who maybe doesn't have the most character design experience is saying Well, I think john should have a bigger dick or something like that But have you thought about that erin? Hey, I'm not funny story I'm not 12 But yeah, I mean to be clear. I gave the note to make his package smaller I also did. You did too. Yeah. We did. I was like, you need to kind of identify him. He's too He's too bulgy too much. But anyways, like I'll read these comments And they're sometimes from really young fans and I appreciate them But it's at the same time like well, I've had I feel like as an industry Professional like I appreciate your comment, but I'm going to be respectfully disagree Um, so it's just that's how I deal with them usually but again, I do have the luxury of just doing Art mostly I was just gonna say like we were talking about a lot, but like Criticism in general is not the worst thing About no about doing this like And and even if it if it was it's Totally worth it for all the all the benefits, you know, like that's something You know, not everybody always focuses on is like the positives and stuff But like Carrie said when when somebody is like inspired by our work or something Then you know that really makes all the other shit worth it All like even like the late nights and stuff, you know, like we're just trying to Put ourselves into something that like inspires other people. So I gotta say too like it uh It took me a really long time And this is this is talking more like internal criticism like amongst peers and stuff Like it took me a really long time to turn the corner on Wanting feedback And like recognizing how good of a thing it is Like I used to to you know dread and I still get anxiety over it I used to like dread when I get like feedback on scripts or like When I would send like an export to isa or something and be like, what do you think it's just because it's like I I'm like I'm so worried about all of the things you're gonna say and like what you know, what if like the whole thing's bad like I like It's it's funny like even uh Miles and eddie both like said something really nice to me afterwards because they could tell I was nervous like Even with this like this volume nine script I was working on. I was like, yeah, here's the first draft Let me know y'all think you know and like always like if it's just terrible I can just rewrite it like no big deal, you know, it's just because it's like I was but Now I'm so happy to get feedback. Yeah It's so great. Yeah, I feel like in this industry you need to definitely be more than willing to accept feedback I don't think you'll get far if you don't personally Yeah, it was yeah, you was hard at the beginning You can't throw the first thing out there and be like, what do you think and they're like, well, I think you know This this and this could be better. Maybe if you focus more on this and then you'd be like, you just don't understand Right, you don't understand my vision And I would be like, yeah, horn it is There definitely is that like um You you do have to At least from my experiences, it's the idea of uh trying to understand That the work is not you and you work out the work. Um And even if the work is so personal to you, uh, i.e. recorded by rsl, which I always tell everyone like it's just a giant self insert everyone Um, even if it's not if it's you or if it's like if you think it's you it's really not And um, and also there is an argument for the other part of that death of the author x y z We can go into literary theory all we want, but um I'm too dumb for that At the end of the day, um If if you can successfully like separate your yourself from your work and just be like, well, that was just old Me maybe new me can be better. It was even yeah, they're all just versions of of you, you know, like Season one of x-ray and vav is a totally different person Who directed that that then I owe now 100 I think every personality and like experience. Yeah Yeah, I think every artist and creative should and Uh, definitely want to like continue to grow like I don't think should ever be satisfied with where you are So that's why feedback is so important Don't be afraid of it It's a snapshot of where you're at and you know, you're gonna mess up and you're gonna look back and go like yep I wish I've done it differently or even as the episode's coming out, you know, you probably knew for like two months Like yep, I wish I'd done that thing differently Um, but also sometimes you just need to move on and you just apply it to the next thing you do I think I feel like that's like I mean this is like my personal opinion on a lot of things and obviously it has like boundaries to it But it's like it's talking more about that the creative field like it's it's one thing It's one thing to make a mistake It's another thing to make that same mistake a second or third time Yeah, you know, like, you know, if you if you, you know, make like a Like I'm talking like story stuff or you know, like shot composition But like, you know, it's if you're repeatedly messing up and people are telling you no, no, no Don't do that and you're still doing it And you're just being obtuse about it. Then you should feel bad But, you know Yeah, I mean, I don't know. I don't I also don't like I'm sure I'm sure there are things that people have told me not to do anymore I'm still doing I don't know sometimes this is all perspective. I appreciate it. I'm going to record that and Play that. Oh, put it as you're like soundboard Erin says Carrie's doing great It was awesome I think the the big thing that we could all take away from this is just like, oh, we just Criticism is good, but we also want to learn and if there is Nothing to be learned from criticism from this particular thing and it's only just hurt feelings then Just got a deal. Yeah, I'm a person. Yeah If you're gonna post something salty, like just just maybe think twice, you know You don't have to tag us Yeah Yeah, just sub tweet. Yeah, just sub tweet. Yeah, that's fine I've never I've never done the like tweet deck Just like have my name up running like I don't do that. No, that's like I could never I've never even thought about doing that. I do have more self-love like that's too much I can't Yeah, that's that's a little rough people who go that far need to tone it down a bit. Yeah for your own sake Well, thanks for the cool questionnaire and I think I hope no aspiring artists or creatives are like intimidated Like I feel like everybody and anybody if we have something cool to show on and you want to show it online You should like definitely go for it. Like The internet can be scary, but it can also be like a really cool place I hope that helps That was a good topo chico Ah Joe Well, actually that kind of wraps up our show awesome Thanks everyone for tuning in. Uh, if you haven't already, please like and subscribe to I have notes So you guys can watch out for the next episode. Thanks. Kerry, Aaron Jordan and me for appearing We appeared That's that and most importantly our new fifth member Give a give a round of applause. Oh, no, where was he? We have to we have to figure out what his name is stash chan There we go. That's a really good soccer name. That's really good. I said I said stash chan Oh stash. I heard Sebastian My cat's name is Sebastian His name is Sebastian Viola No, his name could be Sebastian the stash chan We're done Okay. Bye everybody