 Hello everyone, welcome to today's event, LDC Reflections of 2020. My name is Juliet Tunstall, I'm the External Events Officer here at the International Institute for Environment and Development. Really delighted to be here with you today and really looking forward to the discussion where we're going to hear reflections from on the past year from climate leaders from the least developed countries and also look forward at the year ahead. Today's event is the first IID debates of the year for any participants who haven't joined an IID debate event before. The aim of the series is to bring together an international community to discuss key and current sustainable development issues. And that is it from me. I will now hand over to Andrew Norton, who is the Director of IID and the moderator for today's session. Thank you. Thanks so much, Juliet. It's my pleasure to be moderating this event and a warm welcome to our virtual audience. Thank you very much for being part of this discussion. And today we're very fortunate to be joined by climate leaders from the least developed countries and also by representative from the UK COP26 presidency. And I will introduce the panelists shortly. We're going to hear reflections and perspectives from the LDC climate leaders as we look back at the key events and diplomatic moments of the last year and look forward at what is to come in 2021, which has been dubbed a super year. But of course, going forward, we need a super decade. One good year isn't going to be enough. And it goes without saying as well that this past year was year like no other. Due to the global pandemic, high level climate meetings and international conventions were postponed or adapted. We don't know much about how that will go roll forward over the coming year. And that's something to consider today. But despite the challenges and uncertainties, there were many positive, significant moments for climate action that indicate major shifts. To name a few, we have the Placencia Ambition Forum organized by AOSIS, the Small Island States Forum, which focused on safeguarding the Paris Agreement and particularly its environmental integrity. And of course, late in the year, very positively, we had the US elections and a huge change in direction, energy and engagement from one of the world's biggest emitters and most important countries. And that's also enormously important. We had the Timpu Ambition Summit hosted by the chair of the LDCs and the Climate Ambition Summit where 45 nations came forward with enhanced NDCs, nationally determined contributions. And we also heard in September, very importantly, China's commitment to achieve net zero in terms of carbon by 2060, which again, like the US election, hopefully is a game changer and will accelerate action and ambition. And today's event also takes place off the back of the Climate Adaptation Summit hosted by the Netherlands earlier this week, where IID was heavily engaged on themes of getting money where it matters of delivering climate finance to the front line of the climate crisis and supporting the structures and the power structures that are needed to make locally led adaptation a reality. And of course, intertwined in all of this activity and in each of our personal and professional lives is the COVID-19 pandemic, which has generated this massive unprecedented global health, economic and social crisis. COVID has exposed and deepened inequalities. Oxfam has just published a report, the inequality virus, which kind of points out remarkably that this may well be the first time in recorded history that inequality has increased in virtually every country in the world at the same time. And we know also that at the top end, people have not suffered throughout 2020 that oxfam has calculated that it will take us nine months for the fortunes or it took just nine months for the fortunes of the world to respond to this global pandemic, government to rapid action while for the world's poorest recovery could take more than a decade. So given all of this, how did the world fare in terms of climate action and ambition in 2020? And what will it take to enhance action for people, climate and nature in the years to come? That is what our panel speakers are here to discuss. So let me introduce them now. We have Cecilia Silva Bernardo, who is the director for cooperation of the Ministry of Culture, Tourism and Environment of the Republic of Angola. Cecilia is also a negotiator for Angola and the LDCs and currently she is co-chair of the Adaptation Committee of the UNFCCC, although she is speaking here as an LDC negotiator in that capacity. Delighted to welcome Motsumi Malajani, who leads the LDC expert group and the National Adaptation Plans Unit of the UNFCCC Secretariat, which is responsible for the process to formulate and implement national adaptation plans, national adaptation programs of action, NAPAs, and the LDC work program. He is from the SUTU and is a former chair of the LDC group. Also delighted to welcome Ladis Habu, who is a UNICEF Pacific supporter and supports the work of the Pacific Island students fighting climate change for the Solomon Islands. She's a pharmacist at the Solomon Islands National Referral Hospital and you can read a great blog that she wrote about loss and damage on IID's website. Please do look at that. And I'm also delighted to welcome Brianna Kraft, who is a senior researcher in IID's Climate Change Research Group. She supports the Least Developed Countries Group at the United Nations Framework on Climate Change Negotiations. She works with LDC representatives to negotiate outcomes on technology development and transfer to benefit the world's poorest. And Brianna has been part of our core team at IID, supporting the LDCs for many years. We're delighted to have her here. And our final panelist, who I'll come to after the main discussion for sort of reflections as a discussant. Delighted to welcome Hugh Davis. The success of COP26 will depend greatly on the leadership of the UK as COP26 president. Hugh Davis is the deputy lead negotiator for the UK COP26 presidency team, who will respond to the LDC reflection after the panel discussion and share the president's plans and priorities from year ahead. Welcome Hugh, we're delighted you could join us. And to start off this session, I'm delighted to say we have some welcoming remarks from Sonan P. Wangdi from the Kingdom of Bhutan, who is the chair of the Least Developed Countries Group on Climate Change. We'll then have the panel discussion followed by Hugh and then followed by audience Q&A. Distinguished participants, ladies and gentlemen, hello and greetings from Bhutan and the Least Developed Countries Group. It is my pleasure to be speaking to you today, and I thank IID for convening this important event to bring to the fore LDCs reflections of 2020 and ambitions for 2021. The world is dealing with multiple crises, the climate crisis, unprecedented biodiversity loss, rising inequalities, and now COVID-19 pandemic. What 2020 has taught us is that we cannot deal with one crisis in isolation from others. While governments around the world are making major investments in COVID-19 recovery plans, these plans should place people, climate, and nature at its core. 2020 was a year for the history books and the Least Developed Countries faced several challenges adapting to the new normal. Increased virtual engagement has been a key element, but COVID-19 drastically impacted our climate diplomacy, decreasing its frequency and intensity. The time zone management and limited internet bandwidth in many Least Developed Countries remained acute challenges during this period. These issues impact the LDCs representation in international climate forums, and several LDCs reported delays to their national NDC and NAP processes. Despite challenges, the LDCs strove to maintain momentum, bring our constituency together, and push for climate action. We used a series of virtual interactions to draw together positions and priorities, and this all culminated when our group hosted the virtual Thimphu Ambition Summit in December. The summit showcased LDC's leadership on climate action and demonstrated the need for international community to scale up climate finance in support of the vulnerable countries. Going into 2021, the LDC group will be pushing its priorities across a number of fronts. It is crucial to see increased short-term climate actions between now and 2030 that close the emissions gap. This isn't the time for small steps to be taken. It's time for transformative changes across all aspects of society. We must see enhanced, more ambitious NDCs delivered, as well as long-term strategies that put the world on track to meeting the goals of the Paris Agreement. The science tells us we cannot delay action. Secondly, we must see developed countries scale up support for developing countries for climate actions, including through the delivery of 100 billion dollar climate finance. We look forward to beginning deliberations at COP26 on a new finance goal that is based on science and the needs of developing countries. And as virtual and remote engagement continues, negotiating and decision-making must be inclusive. Efforts must be made to ensure processes and meetings are well represented. Throughout 2020, we saw that swift and bold movement is both possible and necessary. In response to this global pandemic, governments took rapid action at scale, mobilized vast public resources, and responded to the science. Individuals changed their behavior to minimize the risk for others. It is clear that early and informed action saves lives, reduces costs, and minimizes impacts. Let us learn from this so that 2021 sets the stage for a low carbon and climate resonant future for all. I thank you and Dr Shatilek. Well, it was excellent to have those words from the LDC chair from Bhutan. And I should also say Bhutan has given fantastic leadership to the LDC group over the last couple of years. So huge thanks to Sunampi Wangvi and to the Kingdom of Bhutan for that. Let's move on to the discussion now with the panel. And to kick off the conversation, I'd like the speakers to take, well, the first question is, I'm going to go around the room for all the speakers, but will you reflect on, would you like to reflect on 2020's major diplomatic moments? And in your opinion, what was one of the greatest highs and one of the shocking lows? So Cecilia, could I start with you for that, please? Thank you, Andrew. Hello everyone. And well, very quickly, for me, it was certainly the COVID-19 pandemic delaying the climate action and the US election process that culminated with Joe Biden election and the consequent US return to the Paris argument. Thank you. Thank you very much, Cecilia. Not to me. What would be your highs and lows? Thank you very much, Andrew, and greetings to everyone across the globe. For us, I think one of the important things is that despite the COVID-19 pandemic, which crippled almost every part of our activities, parties and, of course, the global community remains committed on climate action. You would remember that we organized two big events last year. There was the June momentum on climate change events that were organized by subsidiary body chairs, as well as the UN climate dialogues that happened in November-December. Both these events were very well attended and the participants were very well engaged, very much engaging beyond what we could have anticipated as the action. Apart from that, of course, we also still see parties, despite the constraints, still submitting their updated NDCs, their national adaptation plans, the long-term strategies, and the adaptation communications. Of course, the rate is not as high as one would expect, but I think these are some of the things that should commitment by the global community on the climate crisis. Thank you. Thank you, Matsumi. We'll be returning to some of those things, I'm sure, during the discussion. Gladys, what would be your high and your low of 2020? Thank you very much, Andrew, and hello to everyone that's watching now. So I guess my greatest high would be digital diplomacy, especially coming from a third world country and seeing people making more use of technology or the e-world to help achieve the diplomatic objectives, especially in the climate space. It's really important. And a good example for me was mock-up 26, which I was part of as an event coordinator. And we managed to have 140 countries represented through 330 delegates, which was a huge success. But coming to the shocking low, I'd say, starting from the Australian bushfires to literally seeing how something small like COVID-19 can flip the world around. But at the same time, still seeing climate change intensify in our islands, especially with Cyclone Harold last year, where we lost over 20 lives and yet we still haven't lost any lives with COVID-19. I think that's something that's very shocking for me. Thank you very much and a fantastic perspective on the discussion there. Thanks, Gladys. Brianna, what would be your high and your low? Thanks. Hello, everyone. Good to be here with you all today and greeting some panelists as well. Cecilia, you stole my highs and lows, so I'm going to echo your wise words. My low had to be the pandemic and its various impacts on all aspects of life, including the climate diplomacy that we had so looked forward to in 2020. As a climate researcher, it was striking to watch the seriousness with which leaders responded to scientist warnings about COVID and the willingness of individuals to completely change their lives in order to save the lives of others. I would love if we could follow such precedent in trying to confront the climate crisis and hopefully avoid even more tragic loss of life. From the low, there was also this cognitive dissonance between how we deal with one crisis and how we don't deal with another, so that was quite a struggle. That carried on into my high as an American citizen, the U.S. election and its results were wonderful to see, especially as Gladys brought up in the wake of such visceral devastation, the worst hurricane season we've ever known, the worst wildfire season we've ever known, to be followed by nothing. From the previous administration, welcoming the new administration was quite the high and hearing Biden speak to a climate just plan that's probably the most ambitious I've ever had and known an American administration to roll out just yesterday still remains the high. So welcome my country back to the Ferris Agreement and the global effort on climate change. But yeah, thanks Cecilia for outlining those two. Yeah, no, I mean, we're all hugely glad about that, but perhaps feeling particularly for those of you who are American citizens and yesterday's executive orders had some fantastic stuff in. So that was great to say. Okay, brilliant. I'd like to now pick up on a really important issue early on in the discussion. And that's the issue of climate finance. Cecilia, I'd like to address a two part question to you at this point. The first part of it is meeting the 100 billion climate finance target promise was supposed to be a milestone for 2020. Do you think developed countries have gone far enough on this? Oh, wow. Thank you. Well, I will recognize that ports were in place. Finance for adaptation has grown in recent years, but more than with 9% identified by serving both adaptation and mitigation. So I think more needs to be done. We still need to make sure that funds are equitable allocated. Because this is not happening yet. Instead, we see an increase in loans instead of grants for the most vulnerable countries. And I wonder if it's really helping the most vulnerable that are now in addition struggling to respond to COVID-19 pandemic while their deaths are increasing. So well, I don't think enough was done. So I think we all have had contact with the OECD report. And this report found that only 21% of climate finance mobilized in 2018 aimed to help communities to adapt to climate change. Building on that, not agreeing the extension of the long term climate finance mandate at COP 25 was a major problem. It was a deficiency in that negotiation. What are your thoughts on the negotiations as we go to Glasgow? Well, I believe without prejudging the outcomes of the negotiations that finance and adaptation may be the success or the failure of Glasgow. I think this issue of the 100 billion has to be solved in the thinking that a good way of doing that should be creating a specific platform to deal with that matter so that we have information well, clear and accurate. And we find a way forward to this matter. Thank you. Thank you very much indeed, Cecilia. I'm going to put my next question to Gladys, Brianna and Matsumi. The people most exposed to the pandemic and the resulting economic crisis are also those most hurt by climate change impacts in many cases, basically the poorest and most vulnerable. How, if at all, has the COVID-19 crisis impacted your country's climate action, both in terms of practicalities, but also in terms of the substantive issues of how to build long term resilience to shocks and whole of government planning? What planning? What has COVID-19 taught us for the climate response in short? Gladys, would you like to go first? Thank you, Andrew. That's a very important question. For us specifically, I would say COVID-19 did have a very, very, very strong impact on our country, especially in terms of really staring away most of the other issues aside from COVID-19, especially climate action. So I would say we haven't really had much done because of COVID-19 is everything from finance to policy decisions to protocols were all sort of set around COVID-19 and its impact. But yet people in my country and other Pacific Island countries live in literally facing climate crisis every single day, like the crisis still exists. And yet with this new one on board, everyone seemed to have sort of forgotten about it. And that's really, really sad. We've seen people still sort of struggling to meet the months for basic stuff like food and water, because they've lost jobs. Or also because of sea level rise, they do not have enough land for gardening. So affecting nutrition status of especially children here. So on top of that, with COVID-19 in place, that has really, really affected our country. But I would say what I have really learned from COVID-19 is that this climate crisis still exists. And even with something so small like COVID-19, we can see how it can change the world, which means even if we feel like our action in this climate crisis is still too small. I believe there's still hope going forward. And I still believe that we should all be fighting this fight. And your support from across the world, especially will be needed to voice the concerns of people like us that are directly impacted by climate change. Thank you so much, Gladys. Motsumi, can I go to you next? How would you answer that question about what we've learned from the pandemic in relation to climate action for your country for Lesotho? Thank you, Andrew. Actually, I will speak more broadly in the context of the LBCs as we went with a couple of them and highlight a few things that have come out from them. Many of them, of course, were working towards producing their naps with their goal of having those naps by the end of 2020, as well as updating their NDCs. And these activities go along with a lot of stakeholder processes or consultations. And a lot of these activities were clamped because of the COVID-19 impact on how countries do their work. So for some countries, they experience delays on issues related to this. Second, also, some of the countries, my name's from the Green Climate Fund, and other sources, they were starting to launch specific activities. Cecilia mentioned an important part that climate finance is special for adaptation is a key issue. But even in instances where you had finance on the ground, countries would simply not be able to advance activities that would make their societies a lot more resilient to climate change. So that's another part. The other part is that you find that the technical work at the national level actually happens through interministerial collaboration and such kind of activities. And there are many examples, including countries where they had to address some of the feedback or improve their documents. This was not possible. And for LDCs, internet is not as special when we have national agencies working together at the national level. And it means that effectiveness in delivery was greatly affected in these cases. And also the COVID also impacted the provision of support because many of the LDCs, of course, in addition to their own resources at the national levels, rely on external support. And we know that that was not possible to extend such support to the countries during this time of the crisis. And so that brings actually myself to what we learned actually from these problems that climate change adaptation cannot wait. The very vulnerabilities that COVID brings or the very issues that COVID brings are the very problems that are actually posing severe vulnerabilities in the LDCs themselves. So if we wait on climate change, adaptation is actually going to result into a crisis that will be bigger than what we have. So this is one of the biggest challenges that we have as a global community. The second part is that it has become evident that in the LDCs, we also need to focus a lot more on building the capacity at the national level or even at the local levels. Because the models that we use, of course, to complement the capacity in the LDCs to the external means, as we have seen in 2020, these were not possible. So it means the LDCs need to be empowered to be able to take action by themselves. And, of course, if we also speak to the recent conference from the traditional conference, we had it yesterday talking about locally led action. And I think these are some of the things we need to look strongly in terms of how we strengthen actions that would help countries to better prepare themselves. And indeed, the gap report just released recently also does indicate that COVID is going to impose even severe add-in to the most vulnerable. Thank you, Andrew. Thank you so much, Matumi. Brianna, what's your take on what we can learn from pandemic and pandemic response for climate response? Yeah, thanks. I'm going to echo a lot of what Matsumi said. And just over the last several months together with the LDC chair, we've undertaken a bit of research to understand how COVID has impacted the LDC groups' plans and strategies. We surveyed the group and received responses from over half of the LDC's 46 countries, which was a pretty good sample to get. We also interviewed several key negotiators, including Cecilia and others who have a lot of knowledge about what the LDC circumstances back home and what it takes to engage in climate diplomacy, both on the international front where countries work together, but also the domestic work that goes into coordinating the strategies and plans that are necessary for the global effort. And as Matsumi was saying, the vast majority of the respondents to our survey, 80%, said that COVID-19 had delayed their LDC process. Most wrote in that NAPS had also been affected, the National Adaptation Plan process. And then an even higher percent said that other national climate change strategies that were in the works for the country had been delayed as well. And Matsumi was pointing out all the reasons why the consultations that it takes, the interministerial collaboration that it takes to get these through and properly coordinated and discussed and then facilitated through governments was largely not possible with COVID. So we did see many delays to what the LDC said at the beginning or before 2020 about which countries were going to be prepared to submit enhanced NDCs this past year. We're just not able to happen. This probably isn't surprising in terms of COVID's impacts globally, but it does stress again that LDCs are going to face yet another challenge to confront the climate crisis and going to need greater assistance to be able to do the strategies or to formulate the strategies to do the work nationally with capacity built but really owned at home. And in order to do that in a COVID safe way, it's going to be yet another hurdle they have to overcome. So yeah, echoed a lot of the points once we said. Thank you very much. Thank you so much. The next question, I'm going to come back to Cecilia and Matsumi for this. We've seen some really important major announcements on carbon neutrality net zero targets from South Korea and Japan as well as China. The EU and the UK have set out enhanced NDC targets and more. And we understand now the US is going to try to put its NDC out there before Biden's summit, which will be on Earth Day on the 22nd of April, I believe. So there's a lot of momentum, but is it enough? And additionally, more and more developing countries are putting in place national adaptation plans and some are taking ambitious steps to access more climate finance to implement those actions. How do you think the least developed countries are stepping up on enhanced nationally determined contributions, NDCs, and on their national adaptation plans? Cecilia, can I come to you first on that, please? Yes, Andrew. Thank you. Well, if it is enough or not, I would say no, but of course I would welcome the efforts that countries are putting in place. But it's important also to highlight that LDCs are also increasing ambition on their NDCs and NAPs. But the question will be, will they be financially able to implement what they meant to do? So because actions on their NDCs are conditional. And we know that funding for implementation, for the implementation phase, for the NAPs, and for the NDCs will still be the problem for LDCs. Thank you, I think. Thank you very much, Cecilia. Me too, me. Yes, thank you, Andrew. Actually, I will build on what Cecilia was saying that indeed, if we want to be honest with you, the progress is a little slow for the LDCs. I mean, this is not to say that the community, we are not doing what we're supposed to be doing, but maybe there's a little bit more that needs to be done. In the annual progress report that we just produced last year, it shows that there is progress across the whole developing countries. But when you look at the LDC statistics themselves, they still struggle with fundamental issues, including on access and support. So it makes the question on how best can we be able to enhance support and elevate support, maybe to the most vulnerable action so that while we are as a global community making steps forward, we are not leaving those that actually don't need to be left behind. The other thing is that in the process, of course, the LDC expert group under the UNFCCC is undertaking activities including mobilizing a lot of other actors and players to see and explore ways on how to address this problem, as we just mentioned. There is a lot of support around. That one, no doubt. And then there is a lot of programs to support, but to find that there's still fundamental issues. So there's some problems that we are not hitting on to them that need to be addressed. And that, I think, is an area that still can be addressed. The other thing is that we see that when we look at the LDCs, in fact, in this updated set of LDCs, the Secretary, we did a survey across the whole developing countries. Many more countries want to increase the ambition or the way they represent adaptation in their LDCs. And in fact, in the 49 LDCs that we have so far, the LDCs, 39 of them from the developing countries, almost all of them prominently feature adaptation in a better way than it was featured in the countries in how to consider adaptation. So there's hope and there's commitment, but I think a little bit more still needs to be done to continue to build on that path. Thank you. Thank you so much, Cecilia Motumi. The next question I'm going to put to Brianna and Gladys. And it's really about the lessons learned from 2020 at a process level to take into 2021. We still don't really know how much face-to-face is going to be possible in the negotiations. So these are actually really important questions. What did we learn from the virtual dialogues in 2020 and how we can build on those and ensure that we don't lose momentum over 2021 if travel and in-person meetings do remain quite difficult to organise? Brianna, would you like to go first on that? Sure, thanks. So this was something else that we in our survey asked least developed country government officials to reflect on. And what we really found was there were some benefits to virtual engagement. They do keep the conversation going. They are a good platform for sharing information. They reach audiences that maybe previous in-person climate dialogues wouldn't have. And there were some historic firsts in 2020. As you and the chair mentioned in your opening remarks, we had vulnerable developing country groups put on these virtual summits that they had never done before. We had AOSIS, the small island states with the presidency forum, LDC, the Tempo Ambition Forum at the end of last year. So there were good things to come out of our shocking push to virtual engagement. However, government officials in the LDCs reported they had many, many challenges in accessing a lot of these. The overwhelming majority of the people we surveyed, so again, 25 countries over half the group, 90% said that internet accessibility affected their ability to participate. Accessibility was no internet, no signal where they were, etc. The same numbers that poor internet quality affected their ability to participate. So that's low bandwidth, sound doesn't work, video doesn't work, connection drops, etc. So some national focal points of LDC countries reported that in 2020, they could not attend a single virtual discussion, which is a huge jump from the super year we thought 2020 was going to be for climate diplomacy. We also had examples, as the chair mentioned in his opening remarks of LDC representatives to UNFCCC forums needing to withdraw because they simply could not attend the virtual discussions that were meant to keep the conversation going to try and get some work done. They just couldn't access them. The LDC representative from Chad to the Climate Technology Center and Networks Advisory Board withdrew. A representative from Sudan on the wind, the Warsaw International Mechanism from Lassen Damage had to withdraw. These connection issues are really fundamental challenges for LDCs to engage in virtual diplomacy. That being said, we look ahead and we really don't know if in person it's going to be possible. So what do we do? The connection challenge is not insurmountable, but it certainly needs attention. And I think the first step is to, you know, we are not all starting from the same baseline when it comes to access to the virtual world. If we are really going to have inclusive climate dialogues and discussions, let alone negotiations or decision making, we really do need to get everybody up to speed in terms of being able to access the virtual world. And that really starts with the world's poorest countries, the ones who are most impacted by climate change's priority. Thanks so much, Biana. And that really should be on the to-do list for donor agencies interested in a good outcome from COP26 this year. So thanks very much for making that point so powerfully. Glad you spoke a bit about some of the positive elements of virtual engagement earlier in 2020. What do you think are the lessons going into 2021? Thanks, Andrew. I think Biana pretty much gave a really clear picture of what that looks like for this. But from a personal level being, you know, attending to events that were held virtually, it is very challenging, especially coming from a country where telecommunication is still an issue that is yet to be solved. But it is not impossible, I'd say that first. If going forward, I feel as part of our discussions to enhance climate action, I think it's very important first off to make sure that national governments ensure that our telecommunications are working well. Especially now with COVID, like I don't think it's going away, I think we'll have to deal with it for some time still. So that is really needed so that people from countries that are really directly affected by climate change are in discussions like this. And I also feel that the other challenging thing was the time differences. So having to connect with people from all over the world, sometimes I'd have to be up at 3 a.m. I think sometimes that puts people off. So that's part of the reason why they may have to withdraw from conversations like this. But I guess it comes back to one's self as well. How much are you willing to commit to making action in this climate crisis? And for me personally, with everything that my country has gone through and at least developed countries, I think now more than ever is the opportunity for us to take more stand in this action and use this crisis to our advantage to lead more sustainable practices going forward. Yeah, so I think that's from me. Thank you. Thank you so much Gladys. I'm going to put my last question back to the whole panel, which is about looking forward to 2021. What are the signals needed in 2021 to get the ambition we need both in the year and in the decade coming to show real tangible change is happening at the scale and rate required? Cecilia, would you like to go first on that? Yeah, thank you, Andrew. I think we have to see that all the events taking place in 2021 are aiming to have action on the ground despite the situation we are all facing. And of course, I think we have to join a court and not duplicate it in the different forums. And of course, focusing on the objective we want to achieve. And for that, of course, Glasgow will be a place where we must want to achieve very good objectives. And I would highlight again that adaptation and finance will need special attention during negotiations so that we have very good results for this for the COP26. These are my points. Thank you. Thank you so much, Cecilia. Brianna, can I come to you next? What would be your take of the signals that we need in 2021? Thanks. Well, I think if 2020 has taught us anything, it's that we need to tackle 2021 differently than most of us planned and adapt to everything that's come our way. I don't think we can address one crisis in isolation from another. And really, we need to take a kind of government's need to rethink climate diplomacy and diplomacy in general to confront the many crises we're facing. So climate change, biodiversity loss, pandemic, all of which exacerbate inequality, as you said, Andy, and the challenges countries face to develop sustainably. So we really need to look at these all together. As COVID-19 seems to be the imminent threat that many governments are trying to recover from, what we need are COVID recovery packages that account for nature, climate, people that really put forward a plan that's going to help us achieve all of the goals we have set in the Paris Agreement and on the other conventions that are hoping to have a super year this year and get the kind of results we need. So in addition to bringing COVID-19 packages, recovery packages, particularly from the highest emitters, we do need plans that really lay forward the sustainable future we want. Those are not just NDCs and NAPS, but long-term strategies that get us to net zero and really take seriously the challenges we face. Thank you so much, Brianna. Gladys, what would be your top wishes for 2021? Thank you, Andrew. Personally, what I think COVID-19 really has sort of hit us to rock bottom, I would say, globally. But at the same time, it is an opportunity for us to start a new beginning amidst this crisis. So help us to rethink the strategies that we've sort of had in place before for climate action. And help us to start off on a more greener angle going forward instead of going back to the old normal. So taking this new normal as our way forward. And Glasgow definitely, COP26, must happen this year. And I feel that it is the most personal stories of loss and damage that needs to be amplified at that kind of level, especially with Glasgow. So something IED has been doing, which I was part of, you know, just reporting stories of people who are at the front line and amplifying the story so that they can back the scientific evidence we have before we make decisions for climate actions going forward. I think that can really engage more of an audience all around the world to gain more support. I just feel one thing that COVID-19 also taught us is the power of people. Despite the pandemic and all the different crises that we are facing one way or the other, when people stick together, we always come to find a way and I think we should all take that going forward. Thank you very much Gladys. Matsumi, do you want to add anything in terms of your top wishes for 2021, the signals we need? Indeed. Don't want Cecilia was emphasising the need to set very clear and good objectives. I think the LDC group chair in his opening remarks did indicate that we need to achieve the immediate time goals. And this speaks to the issue of setting goals. I think both in the long term and in a classical example of the long term goals, the LDC had the LDC vision 2050, which defines what the LDC is envisioned to be in 2050. And in order to arrive at that, of course, there are actions that need to be implemented to arrive at that. And those actions need resources, need financing for them to be implemented. And to implement or to get those resources, plans are required behind that. So there needs to be a key indication of these tangible milestones that need to be achieved now that we are in the phase of the real action to address the climate problem. The second issue is on the promotion of coherence across the different agenda. Of course, the Paris Agreement already provides very good links to sustainable development. But we do know that also the landscape is weak now and we're talking about so many things that countries have to worry about at the national level. There is the issues around biodiversity, the issues around disasters, etc. And there is a need for coherence on how countries address the development issues plus this additional crisis. Thank you. Thank you so much, Matumi. And huge thanks to the panel. That was a really rich discussion. And it's brilliant that we have Hugh Davis with us from the COP26 team. And before we turn to the Q&A from the audience, I'd like to ask you who's been listening to Conversation. It would be great to hear how the UK is factoring in some of these concerns from LDCs in the planning for the COP and its presidency of COP26. And by the way, when we move to Q&A feel free to direct questions to you as well as to our other panelists. Hugh, thanks so much for joining us. No problem at all, Andrew. Thanks very much for having me here. I'm really pleased to be here to represent the UK and COP26 unit. This is one of the most important groups that we work with. We work with you a lot and the LDC group. And that will be so important in the year ahead. So thank you again. There's been a lot of rich content there. So excuse me if I'm referring to my notes a bit. And yeah, just to remind everyone who doesn't know me, I'm Hugh Davis, Deputy Negotiator of the COP26. I've been working on the UNFCCC for about five years and was both proud to be part of the UK team in Paris as well. So I've been around for a bit and know quite a few of you familiar faces that I'm seeing here, which is great. I think in summary from what I'm hearing, I think looking back to last year, if we look back to last March when the COP Bureau had to make the decision to postpone COP26, I think overall our expectations for 2020 were all quite low. We had a lot of concerns about the progress that could be made and there was a lot of calls for how do we maintain our action and ambition. And I think if I look back now, we made more progress than we were expecting. There was more action, there were more commitments, but in particular through events that took the conversation forward like the mock COP that Gladys mentioned, like the Placencia Ambition Forum, like the Tim Poo Ambition Summit, and also the Climate Ambition Summit that we hosted in December. I don't think at that point in March when we had to postpone COP26, we thought that we would see 70 world leaders coming together on a virtual platform in December, making new commitments around mitigation, around adaptation, around finance. So I think that there were positive signs there and as well as those commitments that you pointed out, Andrew, that the different parties have made. But have we done enough? Did we see enough in 2020? No. And so for me, what we need to look forward to in 2021, and I'll come to this a bit more, is essentially we need all countries or parties to deliver on their commitments. We've all made good commitments, we made those in Paris, we've made those since and we need to deliver on those. And that's not just in the the NDCs and the long-term strategies, but as Cecilia pointed out, that's on finance and that's on adaptation as well. And if we can collectively live up to those commitments, then that's the sort of progress that we need to see in 2021 and beyond. And so in terms of our kind of plans and expectations for COP26 and the year ahead, it really does focus around those areas as the COP26 president set out in his speech in December. We're looking to make progress and on not just mitigation, but finance and adaptation. And also the fourth area that we've highlighted, which is on cooperation. And as you might be aware, we've highlighted some thematic campaigns to take forward through the year leading up to COP26, where essentially the point of them is that we can all collectively make more progress towards those goals and those targets that we've set ourselves, particularly in Paris, focused around sectors such as electric vehicles and around energy, but also around those key areas such as adaptation and resilience and finance, which can't be left behind. But my area of focus is obviously on the negotiation, so I'll speak to that a bit more now. As I say, I think we achieved a lot, last year, more than we thought we could in terms of set pieces on the ocean and land dialogues and bringing together some of the constituted bodies to make progress on their areas of work. But we do want to see more going forward and we'll need all parties on board to do that. I think the leadership that the LDCs have shown so far in coming together as a group, as coordinating and being a strong voice has been hugely important, so I hope we see that going forward. And also that we see more from parties in terms of speaking to each other directly as well. We're trying to facilitate that in a variety of ways. Over the next couple of days, we'll be bringing together heads of delegation from all parties and groups to share views on the year ahead, because it's important whilst we've run many rounds of consultations with parties and groups over the last year and heard what parties have been saying, and I'll come to that a bit more moment in terms of what we'll be hoping to deliver for the LDCs, what we're concerned about in the virtual settings that there hasn't been enough opportunity for parties to talk to each other and understand where they're coming from. And as you'll all know, in a COP, in a multilateral process, you need that understanding of where different countries' positions are. Through all that, and I should say as well that we're very lucky and proud that we now have a full-time COP26 president on this. Our prime minister recognised the importance of that role and that we needed a cabinet minister, a powerful minister in charge of COP26 throughout the year, so Alok Shahm will be playing that role. And he has been stepping up over the last few weeks, consulting directly with the different groups including Sunam and the LDC group in the last week to make sure that he is cited exactly on what parties' concerns are, and that will sit alongside, as I say, different multilateral meetings that we will hold as well. And what we hope to achieve through that is obviously that we deliver on all the mandated work that the UNFCCC has on the rulebook that's needed to bring Paris to light to life, but also on a package in Glasgow that speaks to the concerns of all parties across adaptation and finance as well. And that's something that we've heard consistently from all parties. So yeah, we need to continue that good work, continue that openness and to make sure that we make that progress over the year ahead. In terms of what we've heard specifically from the LDC group and how we hope to address that, unfortunately this meeting has come about a week too early because I hope to have some exciting news for you soon about a ministerial event that we will be holding soon, which we'll hope to focus on and shine a light on issues that we've heard from parties as being very important, like access to finance, the mobilisation of finance, how we address climate impacts and also the issue of debt as well. We don't plan to do this as a formal UNFCCC event because we hope it can have a broader impact. You'll be aware that we're also the chair of the G7 this year. We work with our partners Italy on COP26, who are the chairs of the G20. And we think those sorts of issues that are important to the LDC group don't just have a home in the UNFCCC but also have a home beyond. So that's what we'll be looking to do over the next couple of months. So watch this space on that. I hope to have some more exciting and clear news for you on that. Also, we're hoping to be taking forward new programmes and partnerships that address specific issues. And crucially, what we're committed to is this, we really do want this to be the most inclusive COP ever and make sure that every voice is heard, but particularly the voice of the most vulnerable and make sure that there are no rooms or discussions take place without those voices being heard. And that's why it's so good for us that we have such a close relationship with this group and have been working together over the years and will continue that in the year ahead. Just if I may, on my last point, Gradis mentioned that in spite of the horrible events that her country experienced last year, she still has hope. And I think sort of going back to the point I made, if we see this year countries continuing to deliver on the commitments they've already made, then what we can do with COP26 is really make that a lightning rod for hope and make that a positive moment that we can springboard off to in the decade ahead. Thank you so much, Hugh. Great to hear that commitment to making COP26 the most inclusive COP ever and to seeing the voices of the vulnerable of the small island states and the LDCs and others in every forum in the COP. It's really great to hear that. And thanks so much for joining us. I think we're moving now to the Q&A and we've got a good set of questions coming in. And let me start with an interesting question to Brianna about the survey you mentioned. One of the common causes among negotiators and climate professionals the world over is the increased challenges of juggling childcare, elder care and other unpaid care work with professional paid work, particularly obviously for women negotiators. Did this come up in your survey at all? Does it compound other pressures such as connectivity issues? And that's from Mary Dupath from CDKM ODI. Thanks, great question. And yes, this did come up quite a bit in the survey. Several people wrote in that even if they had access or clear Wi-Fi connections, the ability to juggle their normal duties with these virtual summits that were often arranged at non-convenient time zones and often right in a row as well was it was just not feasible to then attend everything. There was also a very common response that when negotiations tended to happen, you would go somewhere and be away from your normal work so that you could go and focus on the negotiations. Without that separation, there wasn't a clear time to engage in this and often the national work that was needing to be done and especially complicated by COVID also got in the way of trying to engage outside of your own role. There were also complications about where people had access, so needing to travel within the country to get a secure connection and that being difficult to do after dark or with trying to care for family members, etc. It just wasn't feasible then. So a lot of the proposals on how to address this looked at can we book hotel rooms in capitals that have secure connections and allow but go somewhere to fully concentrate and engage and have a secure connection when these dialogues are happening? Can we do things that accommodate the need for care and the regular government duties getting someone to help with those so that there's a separate line of work between engaging in international discussions and doing the things that people need to do when they're at home? This came up quite a bit. So yes, in answer to your question, there are things that we could do about this if, as Hugh and others are saying, we're looking at a future where negotiations and decision making does need to take place virtually. How is it we can make sure everyone is A connected and B has the space to really engage in these conversations? Thank you so much, Brianna. Really fascinating detail there and it's a key issue. This I think one from James Shewitt. I'm being assisted in the but I take it this is the top voted question and it's an interesting one but also challenging one. James's question, the UK has failed to meet the first five year commitment to degree in Paris 2015 in its NDC. UK intends to propose nature based solutions rather than steep reductions in carbon emissions. Seeing that as business as usual and in a sense sort of there is this argument that nature based solutions can be used as a cover for avoiding genuine action on mitigation. So does the panel consider that the argument against false nature based solutions should start now and reach a crescendo prior to COP26? Now, Hugh, I know you're speaking to the presidency here rather than specifically for the UK but there's an obvious link here to article six and to the work on markets. I mean, do you have any thoughts about how nature based solutions could be real rather than fake and what this means in terms of countries mitigation commitments? Thanks Andrew and yeah, you're exactly right. I'm here representing the presidency so I'm in some way speaking on behalf of all parties so I will temper my comments in that mode. I think it's a very good question. I think the links to the negotiated element you pointed out are right and that's something we hear from parties and something we hear consistently is the need for those links however they develop and however they're agreed and finalised in Glasgow. They need environmental integrity. That is key and I think we saw that and heard that loud and clear in Madrid actually and that was very positive and I think that that will continue next year so I think that that is a fairly established principle that we hear consistently from parties and yeah, as I said, I won't comment on the questioners observations about UK commitments but I would tell you, I think we all want all solutions to be real and the idea of a false solution is a slight paradox to me so I think we're all on the same page then. Thanks very much you. Does anyone have any thoughts from the other side in terms of, I mean Article 6 is about carbon markets, it's these contentious areas such as offsets and so on. I mean the LDCs have been particularly forthright on the need to maintain the integrity or the environmental integrity of the agreement but does anyone have any sense of that? That Article 6 has been obviously probably the toughest area in the negotiations hasn't moved for a long time. There is some hope it may move in the run-up to COP26 but Matumi or Cecilia, do you have any thoughts on what we might need to see in that area? Well, Article 6, we all know a lot about this, I particularly don't follow but yes, I think it needs more attention from all of us during the discussions. Completely, do not follow this article, this agenda item specifically but I feel from my colleagues follow the agenda item and sometimes I feel like the issue is not moving forward so without making any, I will not agree or disagree with the way we should take this agenda item back to, I think both solutions, I would not believe in false solutions, both solutions can be considered since it comes and solves the problem. Yeah, it's kind of a watch this space area I think but I'm sure it's going to get much more intense over the months to come. The next question is from Inezah Umhuhoza Grace who we know well, who is she from Greenfighter in Rwanda, a really dynamic youth activist. And Inezah's question is, LDCs have experienced loss and damage induced by climate change, for example in Rwanda heavy rains are washing away people's hope for economic development. What are the existing mechanisms available for LDCs to have access to green recovery finance from COVID but also accessing the finance needed to protect the vulnerable from climate impacts? Brianna, do you want to have a go at that? Thanks, Keen to get others views as well. The loss, well first to say the loss and damage is a key priority for the least of all countries going into COP26. There was progress made at COP25 on the mechanisms that Inezah is asking about, a Santiago network was agreed, or the Santiago network was agreed to kind of facilitate information sharing about loss and damage and get a network of experts kind of up and running available to help countries who are facing loss and damage and other climate impacts. The finance for these mechanisms is still something that is hotly negotiated or up for negotiation and is a priority of to get access to from least of all countries. We know that the least of all countries struggled to access climate finance as Matsumi and the chair and others have pointed out really less than 20% of climate finance ends up with LDCs and we don't imagine that finance for loss and damage would be any different unless significant action was taken to make it so. So that's kind of where we are with the negotiations but yeah I would welcome Matsumi and others and Hughes inputs as well in terms of what the COP presidency is thinking about how to address and about standing issues and loss and damage removed this forward as a priority area for vulnerable countries. Yeah Hugh do you want to come in on that the COP approach on loss and damage? Yeah I guess there's a couple of approaches to that I mean Brianna mentioned at the end there in terms of delivering on sort of what's been agreed through the mandates and I mean that's certainly what we hope to do and what we're hearing from parties that everything that's been agreed that will be agreed we hope to deliver in Glasgow. The question is whether that matches with the expectations and desires of a number of parties as well so we'll need to balance that. I think as I said I hope that if we're here in a few months time and looking back at the first half of this year there'll be more to say because this is an area that we want to to give more space to it it is complex and one of the issues is that different languages used by different people to describe similar or overlapping solutions and I think that's something we hope to address as well is make sure that in looking at these the most complex problems we're all speaking the same language so that we can we can make progress so yeah I this is something we're focused on and we've heard loud and clear from from LDCs from SIDS during our incoming presidency and we hope that we'll we'll make progress over the coming months and rest of the year. Thanks very much Hugh does anyone else want to come in on that? Matsumi yeah please. Yeah just briefly Andrew just maybe to take the last part of the question which talks about the protecting the vulnerable from the impact which maybe talks more from the pre-emptive space before we go into the loss of damage just to emphasize the point I was making that the LDC expert group actually this year what they're trying to do with the LDCs is to try to work with them including of course with many other partners to support each LDC to at least prepare some medium project proposal for any of the key vulnerable areas and the one thing that they're trying to work through is to see whether countries can think of that and critical areas that you know that these are the the most way the countries can experience the most impacts and then to pair those and ban them into programs they can probably have to implement some actions on those so of course with that level of planning and trying to put in place those measures that would be and and finance of course through the GCF and many other channels is available I guess of course we are talking about the difficulties but it's more about how do we get together and assist the LDCs with the concerns that they have that they can have access to the finance that's available and start to implement measures that would see us at least in the next coming years speaking less of these catastrophic impacts to the LDCs. Thank you very much Matumi. The next question is from Alan Nickel. He notes and commends use emphasis on inclusivity for the for COP26 which is great and his question is is there a way COP26 can help bring the energy of climate activism into deliberations and actions going forward is there a way to bridge the divide between actors and negotiators and policymakers Gladys do you want to offer some thoughts on that? It is also very challenging as I feel even in this climate space people have very different opinions as to how we should tackle the solutions here but definitely from my side what I feel is very important is to really really amplify as in as I also mentioned in a question the loss and damage which I really hope COP26 promotes more and have more personal stories of people that are affected by climate change directly at COP26 and I feel like that should be the bridge between science that people are aware of and some people not but then also to the reality that people are going through on the ground. Thank you very much. Anybody else want to offer some thoughts on that Hugh coming back to you but the activist bridge to the COP do you have any planning for that for how that can be facilitated? Yeah I think that there's various options developing and I think what we've seen or felt that this has been one of the positive stories of the last year actually what we saw with events like and Matsumi referenced this earlier with the Jim momentum and the climate change dialogues we actually saw a far higher participation in particular types of events from a wider variety of observer groups and Joseph and activists as they say although I like to think they're all active but so I think that there's opportunities in the way that we're working now to bring in different views in a different way. Obviously anything that we do at a COP has to be with agreement of all the parties in the COP Euro and that sort of more dry process that needs to lead up to it but certainly in terms of the options that are there we're exploring them we're seeing things in events like this and various different summits that I mentioned earlier that really have allowed us a sort of quite a rich testing ground if you like to see how different views can be bought into the conversation and then taken on so that's something I'm very optimistic about for this year because I think we've seen a lot of progress even in the last nine months in that space. Thank you very much Hugh. Okay the next question is from Santa Elias. How do panellists consider that ecosystem based adaptation to enhance community capacitors towards disaster resilience can be mobilized? Does anyone want to offer any thoughts on that on ecosystem based adaptation? It may not be a specialism for any of our panellists but anybody want to have a go? I guess some small thoughts on that. Well we call EBA. EBA helps communities putting in place adaptation actions so I think it's a very important way in part of adaptation that should still be considered and funded because even actions applying EBA needs to be funded and communities are the most vulnerable they don't have how to do that. Governments normally they don't find specifically adaptation actions of course they fund small communities to solve the local problem and people is doing that and some of those actions are adaptation but of course we need to and it passes to the adaptation planning process and the NAPS countries are designing that will allow to proper specify the actions in communities and what can be done using EBA for communities so it's something that needs attention and needs to be highlighted when it comes to fund for those type of actions. I think it can it should be more considered. Thank you very much indeed Cecilia. Brianna a question about the US being back in the Paris Agreement. What's your reading of the future of US contributions to climate finance? That's from Mizan Khan. Hi Mizan, good to hear from you. US and climate finance well I am certainly more hopeful than I was even a couple of months ago given that this all branches of Congress are now within democratic control that we could see real comprehensive action on climate finance and that extends beyond what can be done through executive order. Though I think the rules in the Senate are still to be worked out on how a 50-50 split actually relates to legislation. So I guess I don't know right now how much climate finance we can legitimately expect from the Biden administration. I certainly wish and hope that the US at least fulfills the commitments they made the Obama administration on climate finance and moves us towards what would be a fair share for US contributions in the climate finance space. I know Biden has ambitious plans but his ability to actually implement them remains to be seen and even those really are not enough. I would love to see the US really focus on supporting the most vulnerable countries in their climate finance efforts which hasn't been a focus to date and I think if they are truly interested in a just transition and just solutions for the climate crisis that's what they need to prioritize. Thank you very much indeed Brianna. I'm going to go back now to the final question which is our top-voted question comes back to the issue of loss and damage. There's obviously been a huge amount of interest in that and it's from Ines Oma Hosa again from Rwanda from Greenpeace Rwanda and it's to you Q. Will this be the cop where loss and damage will be recognized and addressed with a sense of urgency or will it be the cop where we as the global community will have an opportunity for more policies without a clear plan on how to protect vulnerable exposed to climate change impacts. Again it's about how you see the loss and damage issue landing at COP26. Thanks and this is a really well framed question okay and I need to be cautious about what we hear behind closed doors but I think what I can say is that what we've heard to date is that parties are still far apart on how they address this issue and how they prioritize it in terms of what they want to see in Glasgow. As I said over the next couple of days we're bringing together all heads of delegation. We hope to get a clearer idea of what all parties want to achieve in Glasgow and to say that to each other and that will be a jumping off point that we can take through the rest of the year. I think as I said before it's really important that we continue to hear parties priorities loudly and strongly externally into each other and this is one of those areas but in terms of the framing that the questioner was putting to us is that where all parties are at the moment? No and it will take sharing of positions, it will take fresh ideas and it will take ideas and solutions from a broad range of actors and activists to get to that place. Obviously, I don't have a personal view. I can merely try and facilitate where parties come but at the moment they're not there in that same space. Thank you very much indeed Hugh. I think we're probably out of time now for more questions but let me say a few words and then give anyone on the panel an opportunity to come back with some final thoughts. I think some of the things that have come out really strongly I mean huge thanks to the panel. It was really an important discussion I think but the emphasis on adaptation finance coming through for the least developed countries was really strong from Matsumi and from Cecilia as a key element that we need to see building up towards COP26, funding for adaptation and resilience in the poorest countries and the loss and damage element as still to land as you were saying but is obviously also critical there. Some countries I particularly was struck by Gladys's point that her country had seen 20 deaths from a climate event, a climate catastrophe but no deaths from Covid so some countries are in real time experiencing the impacts of climate change and being hit much harder by that than by the pandemic. So it's that's a critical point to take on board particularly when in many rich countries the pandemic in many ways the death rates are higher in a lot of OECD in rich countries than they are in many countries in the global south. So it's really important that we get that perspective also from the global south where many countries have actually handled the pandemic quite well as a health emergency even if they've been hit by its economic impacts. This theme of finding recovery funding coming out of the pandemic but also to fund climate action is really really important we haven't touched much on the debt theme but we can see possibly a buildup of debt in many poor countries over the coming year or so as their markets and their exports and even industries like tourism are really seriously hit by the pandemic so that is something we need to come back to all different kinds of ways of funding a green recovery on a global scale. And I particularly also liked the point about the need for a long-term vision I think that was from Matsumi talking about the LDC's long-term vision but how that vision can't be made material without resources and without short-term plans to move us forward. And finally just to again say we were how delighted I was to hear you talk about the ambition of the COP presidency to make this the most inclusive COP ever and also to thank you for coming here engaging with some of the tough issues like markets and loss and damage in the buildup to that. So it's been a great session many thanks to all of you does anyone want to have a final word after my final words stick your hand up if you do. Yes Gladys. Thank you Andrew. I just wanted to say just in addition to what Brianna was saying first of all congratulations to the US for slanging back on with the Paris Agreement. Just on behalf of us here in the Pacific this is a very critical step forward especially with you know on a global scale America being very influential but also I'd really like America to continue encouraging or working closely with the government of Australia as we sort of look up to Australia as big brothers I'd say. And so if if we can have Australia on board as well really strong in terms of climate action then that would really really help the Pacific islands especially small island development states here. Yeah hopefully Australia also has an eye on China, South Korea and Japan who recently made progressive commitments as well. Any other thoughts Brianna? Just jumping on the van with that and wanted to go back to something Hugh said I think countries talking directly to each other is something that it's really needed in 2021 and hopefully it can help move countries forward particularly the ones who need to be moved forward to be more ambitious in their climate thinking. So would welcome that and again echo the praise from Andy about wanting to have the most inclusive cop ever in COP26 and just wanted to say thank you to LDC colleagues join us today. Gladys, Celia but it's so great to see you and hear from you. It's been ages since we've seen each other in person so it's just nice to see your face. And thanks everyone for attending the live discussion. Thanks very much Cecilia do you want to come in as well? We've got a minute or two left please do. Thank you for organizing this firm where we all can share ideas and to say that yes it's important we all work together to at the end COP26 a success to all of us. I think not only for the UK because all of us are part of it and that you organize more spaces like this where we can talk where we can talk about it. Thank you again for the invitation and thank you to all participants. Well thank you so much to all our panelists for your great contributions to Cecilia Silva Bernardo to Matsumi Malajani to Gladys Habu to Brianna Kraft and to Hugh Davis from the COP26 team as well. So let me close with that with huge thanks to all our panelists and to everyone who participated. Thank you.