 Good morning everybody and welcome here at the Moon Library in UCC. My name is Alison O'Connor. I'm absolutely delighted to be moderating here this morning. I am a cork woman that lives in Dublin, a West cork woman I should specify. It was subconscious that I wore a red jacket this morning and I'm surprised my family didn't take me up on it as they often do for anything. Any bit of cork pride that ever shows through. But anyway welcome to this event this morning here at UCC with the IIEA, the Institute of International and European Affairs, forging partnerships Ireland and Lithuania in the EU 27. So we're looking this morning at the question relating to the future of Europe which really at the moment unless you're living under Iraq you'd realize it's the million dollar question for all of us and I suppose within that there's the danger that Brexit we all just look sort of as we have for centuries in that one direction towards towards the UK and it overshadows all else. So I suppose if there's a silver lining here it's that we are and with the encouragement of the government and organizations like the IIEA looking around above and beyond Britain to the rest of our European neighbors. Many years ago I spent time in Paris, went to Europe in Paris doing a journalism course, doing at least on Europe which unfortunately no longer exists. It really made me realize being based there how in the middle of Europe you looked all around you whereas when you're based in Ireland you really do there's that island mentality and you have to make a big effort to to make your vision more global I suppose more European. This particular event this morning is part of the IIEA future of the EU 27 project and that's it's supported by the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade. It's the second regional event that's been held. The first one was in Manoos University last November and you'll notice that on both occasions students were involved. We have a number of students who will be speaking later on this morning and very keen to answer questions and give their view of Europe and the EU in the future. I think it's an excellent idea. Now I would like to welcome the Lithuanian Foreign Affairs Minister Linus Lincavus Vicious. Thank you very much. Now as you know our own Foreign Affairs Minister Simon Covey was built to be here this morning but at fairly much of the last minute I have to have to go to Belfast and I'm sure we'll all agree is extremely important business today and we hope that while we're suffering his absence that it will result in the restoration of power sharing and he has been very ably replaced by Minister of State David Stanton who is who is who is sitting there in in his stead. So I'd ask you all if you wouldn't mind to put your phones on silent just so that we won't have any interruptions. We'd be delighted for any of you who would like to tweet on the on the event the hashtag is future of Europe and my first official task is to invite Dr. Mary Murphy to the podium. Mary is a lecturer in politics of the Department of Government here at UCC and really is the main person responsible for this event this morning and for it being held and coming together. Mary specializes in the study of the EU and Northern Ireland politics and her next book Europe and Northern Ireland's Future Negotiation Brexit's unique case will be published in 2018. Thanks very much Alison and good afternoon and a very warm welcome to today's event and a cave meal of moisture a hundred thousand welcome to to our special guest Foreign Minister Linus Lincaevich and an equally equally warm welcome to to your delegation to UCC today we're very pleased that you've chosen to visit University College Cork and to come to Ireland second city I know that you yourself have roots in Lithuania's second city so it's great that second cities can join forces. Well there are almost 200 Lithuanian students registered as students here in UCC so you should feel somewhat at home. Welcome also to Minister David Stanton who's very very generously stepped in a short notice to replace Minister Simon Coveney. Thank you for being being here and please pass on our best wishes to Minister Coveney we all sincerely hope that his trip to Belfast will result in progress today. Both both ministers are here today to talk about the future of Europe and although Ireland and Lithuania may be far apart in geographical terms we do share some similarities in terms of our history but maybe also in terms of our visions for the future of Europe. We look forward to hearing how we might forge future partnerships in terms of articulating and defending our shared interests. I'd also like to express a very warm welcome to the Irish Institute for International and European Affairs who with the support of the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade have been instrumental in the organization of today's event. We're very pleased to welcome the IIEA to Cork and we hope you will come back soon and that you'll come back often. The future of Europe dialogue poses very important questions about economics, about security, about Europe's future social model etc etc and arguably all of these issues are particularly important for Europe's smaller member states and that's why events and opportunities like this are so very important particularly for students and for young people. The size I think of this morning's audience really is a testament to that and I want to applaud our student participants here on the stage today. We really do look forward to your contributions and we thank you for your spirit and for your participation. Abraham Lincoln may not have been European but his family did hail from England but Lincoln was born on this day the 12th of February over 200 years ago in 1809. A well-known quote of his provides some advice for us as we embark on the future of Europe dialogue. Be sure to put your feet in the right place and then stand firm so hopefully today can be part of a journey of us finding the right place to stand. Thanks very much. Mary thank you very much and I think as Mary said the numbers and attendance today really do show the level of interest and the interest in that there will be in our next speaker. Minister Linke Vicious who has been as I've mentioned earlier Minister for Foreign Affairs of Lithuania since 2012. He was elected to the Lithuanian Parliament in 1992 and was previously Minister of National Defence on two occasions. The minister has also served as head of Lithuania's mission to the Western European Union and NATO and served as Lithuania's permanent representative to the North Atlantic Council. So pleased and honoured to be here in this audience in the famous University of Cork also enjoying your hospitality and as it was said it's for the big delegation from Lithuania from my native city Colnus as deputy mayor to rectors of two new universities so we are coming and bringing some ideas for future cooperation. This is also future of Europe. I will come on thinking what we'd like to have in the future and also to take stock where we are. It's a good occasion to think about that because a lot of now ideas a lot of proposals for future development of European Union but it's also not a big secret that we experiencing very decisive period. I would say like stress tests of our unity of our values are we ready to protect these values so just to be clear. Also I would say transatlantic unity it's important. Needless to say why for whatever reasons although Ireland is not a light country but also dookie about security I presume and very active in this field so very important to have also active participation in this dialogue so everywhere we have stress tests and I would add one more for introduction if you agree it's also stress tests of our leadership of leadership of European leaders and are we really feel comfortable in doing things and explaining to the public at large what we are doing making sure that they understand or are we just enlarging this gap between institutions and people which we're always discussing. Do our people know what European institutions doing? If asking you do you know what European Parliament is doing? Do you know the responsibilities? Do you know what institutions are doing? European Commission? I hope you probably know because you're interested in these things but those people simple people that not always sharing these views and you know when you have this so to say gap or vacuum and also an ability of governments to engage with the people this is calls like lack of leadership and this vacuum filled with something which is not very welcome by populism by radicalism and sometimes people when they are voting during elections or if randoms they're voting guided by emotions not knowledge not information so I'm making no particular parallels with Brexit but also to say at least it's not a big secret to you you know your friends you know your your probably maybe maybe even some relatives living not far away who took very important decision not only for Britain but also for whole Europe and it's not also not a secret when asking what did you do and not everybody knows because it was done guided by emotions and the last period of the campaign nobody listened arguments even because they said we have to punish bureaucrats in Brussels we have to punish European Union we really should get rid of all these so to say hurdles and that will be fine life will come as a future right future for all of us and that's that's the case so this is also example how this vacuum of leadership and vacuum of information on which based on times our decisions which are very important for the future not only a particular country but all the region can make a difference which is really really very important coming back to the values you know coming from the country which in recent history experienced very difficult times we're celebrating 100 years quite soon 100 years of our modern statehood which is a big deal but half of the century it was so with occupation so it was a big gap as well break and everything except of them a lot of them of diplomatic service was working without break because of non-recognition policy we had our embassy working on permanent in the United States in DC between and flak was waving so that's symbolically very important to know but half of the century was stolen from our history from our life I'm saying this just because to prove that we really still remember what that means to liberate what that means to make a revolution what that means to to do things and to make reforms even if you do not if you even if you're not sure that that will be successful it was mentioned and thank you for kind introduction I really has ambassador NATO I remember 1999 not even year 2000 during our so to say very important period where we really try to make sure that we will be members of two very important organizations NATO and European Union it was equally important priority of my country and we were told by future allies and I was told personally I even can quote not saying which country representative saying that but said you like you like your country it's nice your freedom fight but you will never be member of NATO and that's 99 even 2000 and that was really very good encouragement as you can imagine to continue with reforms and also to plan resources adequate everything and that that means we know what that means when you are feeling deserted when you're feeling isolated when you have a choice but this choice just good sound but not protected by your allies by friends my white minded people and exactly now when we're talking about events in Eastern Ukraine just put as example which is not so far away because we're talking about Palestine very important discussions Israel talking about Syria Libya but it's Europe it's Europe it's not so it's not so far away and Europe we have precedent when some country takes courage or stupidity whatever we can call to take part of the territory of sovereign state in 21st century without very little consequences that's my point as a precedent it's not first time happening Crimea annexation it happened in 2014 not so not so long ago but it was also 2008 it was war in South Caucasus for those who know history and 20% of another territory of Georgia was annexed at that time and if you remember or if not you can Google now to be popular wise you really can see what was the reaction of European institutions of NATO what were the statements addressing to Russia what we like to wish Russia to do expect or demand Russia to do and not a single thing was implemented that's my point and in two months we got back to business as usual because of very pragmatic calls to behave to be flexible to be responsible because we have to trade we have to have dialogue which is needless to say of course we do no no doubt but at what price what price we're doing it was 2008 my country and myself I was among those who said what we are doing we are not consistent we are not respecting our own decisions and we will be wrong because sometime we'll have another crisis and we mentioned I mentioned personally as well Crimea by the way nobody listened to say you're too sensitive one of my colleagues in foreign affairs council not saying from which country said you're logically saying you're thinking you know I like your reasoning but you're too close to the region you cannot be objective you know probably you are wrong you know basically it's not so bad and life is so to say continuous and you know well let's let's be more relaxed and that's fine after all these disasters after MH17 shutting down with some citizens on board after after you know meddling into elections of some countries after ice opening exercises people started to realize that it's not so fine it really can be repeated can again something will come up this is also it's also about our thinking while talking about scenarios models tax policy let's not forget foundation underneath which we are building our building European Union this is community of values and principles to be defended not to be retreated and it's applicable not only for foreign policy or events in Georgia or Ukraine or whatever else it has to do with all policies on energy if I may mention you all will know that package we all know we all know also encouragement to diminish rely so to say dependence on single source of supply we all know our energy union policy and that's that's right but we're not implementing that and this is another example not stream to I don't know whether you're discussing that in Ireland but in Nordic countries it's discussed now region it is discussed it's in odds with our policy logically not explainable it was they were even comments by European Commission not once and not twice by those who responsible saying that this is how logical it shouldn't happen politically it's the only what you can aim just to punish Ukraine again let's mention Ukraine because it's just skipping Ukraine from the supply routes and this is the only political maybe reason to do that which is also not in line with our thinking but we are doing that at the same time so this example again it will create something get it would be in an event something else that's not for forget what what is already agreed what was already so to say adjusted and not implemented by some reasons otherwise will be not so important to discuss further steps we are not respecting what we did what we did before what we did so far so it's introductory for 15 minutes right so one more block of information just and that that one now when we are thinking about future scenarios we'll always hearing about this multi-speed right you're not always but quite often and if you agree we already have many speeds in Europe we have Eurozone the island and the area belongs we have Schengen zone where we belong but not just us somebody not we have military cooperation we are members of NATO since 2004 island is not so it's already different speeds which is not so dramatic frankly speaking it's adjustable but my point is if we'll overplay all this multi-speed thinking it really could be the centralized vector it's my opinion we can argue we can disagree but this is really important to note so I would like to see the process as inclusive as possible because it's already too much decentralized and sometimes even if you do not have reasons people at large because of this thinking so to say without not information without decent information taking decisions as it was as I said that regard to the Brexit my conviction was really unnecessary to make that decision if people would be informed so even that situation says that decisions sometimes really very very important decisive although grounded on the wrong wrong arguments so if you would have reasons even worse even more difficult so we should really avoid doing this and we would like to see changes but without opening European treaties to do that within existing treaties and as I said to do it as inclusive as possible with my country would like to be among those who are doing not not not doing as I said so far we are trying to belong to all these consolidated segments we should already have but another so whatever other option also also is possible and now we are ready again important discussions on Brexit not very successful to see friend it's very difficult to go in very difficult as one part of that it's also Irish issue so to say and not only border management but also good right agreement and the fate of that we all always however the best to our friends I talked to my colleague minister on the phone he's in good mood so let's hope it will be okay his meetings to tonight but but this is against specificity it's peculiarity because of the history and needless to say why so it should stay like peculiarity like like something which is exceptional because of the history of Ireland because of the relations of United Kingdom so that will stay but as a rule we should be as inclusive as possible we should really try to stick together when it's possible to perform together things we can be more specific if discussion will develop so that would be introductory comments for the beginning thank you minister thank you very much for those I think what you agree we're really fascinating insights I think and really give us food for thought for our question session later even in terms of what the minister prescribed is the decentralized thinking and I was quite intrigued by this idea of a stress testing various European leaders so you'd get quite a quite a variation in in your results there so we're going to move on now to our next speaker who is a minister David Stanton who's minister of state of the Department of Justice with special responsibility for equality immigration and integration immediately prior to that or most recently minister Stanton had a very successful tenure as chair of the Aráctis committee on justice defense and and equality it's not always the easiest thing to shine as as the chair of an Aráctis committee but he managed to do just that and minister Stanton was first elected to dull air in 1997 thank you very much for that good afternoon everybody good afternoon everybody deputy dog mayor minister you're very welcome distinguished guest senator calahar is here as well from an ambassador send across John Howard in here from UCC vice president it's a great pleasure minister to welcome you to car today I know you had a ramble around our lovely city not all some part of some part but you've got to come back then see the rest of it okay and it's great we have to share the stage with you today at this event really good Ireland and Lithuania may be small countries at the opposite ends of a continent but what lies between us brings us closer than we have ever been our shared membership of the European Union means that we connect across a vast range of areas economic social cultural and political in ways that we never did before and I will come back to examine how we see those shared connections developing in the future very soon I understand you you do St. Patrick's day in Lithuania as well and the river's turn green excellent faces as well and what faces and faces too excellent good good good perhaps the most visible way in which we today are connected however is through the large Lithuanian community who make their home here whether permanent or temporary and they represent a human connection which which can only bring us closer together and increase our mutual understanding because now and we know what it means to have significant immigration the very human pain it causes but it also provides opportunities opens up new horizons a new connection I want to assure you minister that we value the contribution that your country men and country women are making in Ireland to our economy and to our society and we hope that they feel welcome here indeed we share an interest in finding ways to maintain connections with our respective diasporas and I'm very pleased to see that our ministries have been active in exchanging experience in this regard this sharing of knowledge is valuable for both of us and we will be happy to continue to share our experience and to learn from viewers in the coming years and as you know we have a very large global diaspora and we are building those connections now with my colleague minister Canon doing a lot of work in that area because we value our diaspora as you value your diaspora as well now before I look forward to our common future in the European Union I would briefly like to look back it is a matter of pride to us in this year which marks the 100 anniversary of Lithuania's reemergence as an independent state that Ireland never recognized the Soviet occupation of Lithuania or of the other Baltic states here in Ireland we are halfway through a decade of commemorations during which we remember the significant events of our own independence struggle we wish you well therefore in your celebrations although I have described Lithuania as a small country there was of course a moment in the 14th century when the Grand Duchy of Lithuania was the largest country in Europe this should perhaps serve as a reminder of the big ambitions small countries can have for our shared continent that partner foreign affairs is working closely with the Institute of international and European affairs and European movement in Ireland on the future of Europe agenda the government sees this debate as an opportunity rather than a challenge and on their behalf want to acknowledge today the cooperation about IEA and EMI decisions we take today will have far reaching consequences for the future so it is vital that we have the benefit of the in-depth analysis that forms the basis for some engagement with our own people indeed later this month my colleague Helen McAtee TD the Minister for State for European Affairs will be hosting a citizens dialogue on the future of Europe in Cork County Hall she and the tarnished are keen to get your views on the type of Europe you want in five 10 or 20 years time and our slogan says it's your future your Europe so get involved we do not want to preempt the debate that is already underway but the Europe we want is one of our small countries like Ireland and the Republic of Lithuania are respected for their contributions and encouraged to fulfill their ambitions even their big ambitions in this debate we have no choice but to think big and as the Taoiseach and said last month in the European Parliament we must focus on the big new challenges facing Europe and its citizens when it comes to big issues such as migration climate change and the asymmetric threats such as cybersecurity what's the point of 28 member states coming up with 28 different solutions if Brexit much and all as we regret it has served one useful purpose it's to remind us that we are better together Minister Cork is the home of the Tyndale Institute a leading European research center the center is a research flagship of this university UCC and implies over 500 researchers in engineers and support staff it is named after John Tyndale a 19th century scientist who became renowned for popularizing science indeed we could say he was a populist rather than a populist he is best remembered for working out why the sky is blue and today the color of the sky is known as Tyndale blue when we come to the debate on the future of Europe we should have a healthy mix of pragmatism and blue skies thinking I say pragmatism because what we need most are initiatives that connect with the citizens and make a real difference to their day-to-day lives but we also need blue skies thinking when I say blue skies thinking I do not mean pie in the sky thinking because the effort we make and research and innovation today is vital and will reap real dividends in the future it is a chosen to say that we are living in a changing world in fact the pace of change which is already disconcerting is only going to get faster children starting out in school today in Cork are once are likely to stop their working lives in jobs that do not exist yet half of the jobs we have today would be automated in the coming years decisions we now take will help our children great red get ready for those changes in fact the best thing we can teach them now is how to cope with change because they are going to have plenty of it I'm pleased to say that the European Union has been very helpful to Ireland in terms of support for research and innovation here in Cork a local company clean grow is looking at the feasibility of growing crops in space and examining whether this might provide astronauts with long-term supplies of food and oxygen there's a character as we know since last week as well as people you see he's a partner in a 3.3 million project already funded by the EU's horizon 2020 program which is looking at the chemical makeup of our oceans this is the sort of research which will give European countries the edge which will allow us to keep one step ahead of the competition in the new globalized economy I understand that Ireland and the Baltic states including Lithuania are part of a like-minded group working together to ensure the completion of the digital single market by the end of this year like Lithuania we also believe in investing in energy transition to allow us to the challenge of climate change and to turn that into an opportunity to transform our day to day lives post-Brexit we in Ireland are keen to deepen the friendship we enjoy with our European partners and I want to assure you that one of our strongest alliances is with the Nordic Baltic group with whom we have so much in common not least our commitment to the completion of the internal market especially the market in services equally it is at all our own interests as much as in Lithuania's interest to develop closer relations with the countries of the Eastern partnership it must be a priority for Europe to work with our friends and neighbors in the east to develop stronger diversified and vibrant economies across the region likewise we have a real opportunity in May at the Western Balkans summit to put renewed vigor into our strategy for that region and to pay more than lip service to the European perspective of the countries of the Western Balkans closer research and innovation need investment and resources and this will have to be devoted to bring peace and stability to Europe's neighborhood there will be some of the new demands put on the EU's budget when negotiations on the multi-annual financial framework begin in earnest what a balance will need to be drawn between new demands and traditional policies and with that in mind it is a source of great consolation consolation to know that Ireland and Lithuania will be at one in ensuring the common agricultural policy and cohesion funding are adequately resourced very important for us here and for you as well minister Ireland and Lithuania giant Pesco are permanent structured cooperation together at the end of last year Lithuania is a member of NATO and as you reminded us earlier on Ireland is not but what we have both have in common is a shared commitment to undertaking international peace support missions to prevent and resolve conflict in support of the United Nations membership of Pesco's voluntary it provides a mechanism to meet an identified need for closer cooperation between partners to ensure the availability of the military capabilities required for these purposes and to ensure that our personnel serving on future you missions will be well prepared and as well-equipped as they should be this is the sort of solidarity the European Union of the future will depend on with this type of solidarity we are better placed to try and shape the new competitive multi-polar and globalized world of the future without waiting for the rest of the world to shape us. Ireland greatly appreciated the solidarity shown by Lithuania and all our European partners during phase one of the Brexit negotiations and we know we can count on your support in phase two as well. We hope to see the first draft of the withdrawal agreement later this month and we expect additional guidelines on the future of the future relation of the framework sorry for the future relationship between European Union and the UK to be presented at the March European Council. These negotiations will continue to move at a rapid pace and the government is fully prepared to ensure the best interests of the people of this on this island are fully represented and protected as the process continues. The future of the EU 27 will be about forging partnerships and your visit here today minister since a very welcome signal about the strength and depth of the relationship between Ireland and the Republic of Lithuania because in unity there is strength or as we say in the Irish language it is my pleasure to be here with you today minister I know Simon Kobney my colleague can't be here he sends his regards to you I know you spoke earlier with him he's looking forward to meeting you I think later in the week in Dublin. Tomorrow morning. So thanks for being here thank you very much. Minister Stanton thank you very much for that really interesting speech which I think as I said earlier also gives us plenty of material to be getting on with I think just to do things slightly differently I might ask the people who are really here to listen to this morning might ask each of you just to say your name and what you're studying to give us a sense of where you're coming from and then we'll get into the questions. So my name is Rob Byrne I'm a master's student of international public policy and diplomacy. Hi everyone my name is Danielle Gateson and I'm a first year student of government. My name is Lean Angel and I'm doing government savvy here. My name is Paco Keith and I'm in fourth year of government. We might finally get the correct pronunciation with you. I'm going to start with Lean with you and I'm going to ask you in terms of your studies and you were telling me earlier that you had spent some time in Brussels which I'm sure gave you a really a really good insight into being at the heart of the EU that what positive or negative impact do you think that the EU has had on on your life? Do you mind if I ask how old you are? I'm 26. 26 okay so when you're 26 years what impact do you think the EU has had on you? Well like a lot of people in my age I suppose you can say you're available of travel you know you can go breathe free to different countries and work as well and obviously this was a big thing for me last year being able to just arrive in Belgium and I was only staying for three months so there was no need to kind of declare yourself or go through a whole load of paperwork with the little cubics for college and stuff but it was just the ease of that is is huge and it's well like I've got family who live in Europe my brother is in the Netherlands and being able to again get on a train and just go straight from Belgium to the Netherlands nobody stops you know protect your bags nobody you know there's no customs and something like that so that is all very beneficial and I suppose even the leisure aspect of it is not being able to go on holiday and the other side of that is because there are people maybe who can't avail of these things as easily as some of us can it's sitting in this room you know we're in the university and we're encouraged to go away and we're encouraged to explore and maybe I can understand why some people fear the traffic from that and so yeah kind of great thank you Robert if you might pick that up if you yeah I mean from a personal level for me being a European being a member of the EU has been absolutely wonderful and back two years ago or three years ago and I just went off and moved to Croatia for a little bit and I worked in Croatia for a little bit and after that I worked in Slovenia for a little bit and after that I worked in Italy for a little bit and after that I worked in Austria for a little bit and Germany for a little bit and then the Czech Republic for a little bit and then Hungary for a little bit and all of this came absolutely no problem I was crossing borders there's no issue there's nothing so from a personal level maybe but it's work and travel freely has been absolutely wonderful and now I never felt it myself but when I was doing my undergraduate I had many friends who did the Erasmus program where they took a year in to study which was absolutely wonderful and that addition to them as well so to answer the question to my personal levels the ability to travel and work with absolutely no barriers except language maybe because I would never be able to speak Hungarian but yeah yeah just the ability to travel and work across a huge continent which is such a different history you know every country has its own history and its own unique past like I said language but the ability to travel would have to be no restriction or minimum restriction and it's something that we're going to have to body greatly looking forward to going to the EU or saying the EU. Thanks Rob you might just pass the mic on there to to Danielle what has your experience been Danielle? Yeah so for me I suppose I'm only 19 so I haven't heard the opportunities for Erasmus like everyone else has had so far but I have had an opportunity to do a bilateral exchange with the Association of Activities in Greece so that was a brilliant opportunity to experience a whole new culture with young people in Greece we travelled for a week and then days after they came back but I've also been lucky enough to be asked to speak at the British Irish Parliamentary Assembly multiple times over the last few years and all of this has been thanks to Erasmus funding so none of us there was no problem was funding for anything it was all ready to go for us we just got to go and represent the voice of young people throughout the Brexit process was the main key issue with that time so it's been brilliant to be able to do this and I know in the future when I get to my third year in government I'll be able to do Erasmus as well. I'm curious to ask you there then without having you as a spokesperson for all young people but your involvement in in in Brexit you know was there a sort of a a genuine feeling amongst you yourself and your and your colleagues and friends regarding Brexit or was there diversity of views? Well for the British Irish Parliamentary Assembly I was representing Youth Work Ireland and we worked alongside with Youth Action Law in Ireland, Youth Scotland, Youth Cymru in Wales and UK Youth so there was a mixed feel because some people we had some people who voted to remain some people who voted to leave and then we had ourselves the Irish representatives who didn't vote at all so it was very mixed views but we were quite into voting. We can't. Oh sorry I thought I thought in this particular forum that everybody got it I see I understand I am stupid question. At least somebody's got one out of the way. We were lucky enough that throughout the youth facilitation we were able to come to mutual agreements as to what we want to achieve on various topics out of Brexit so it was a brilliant opportunity to represent young people on a racist forum. Okay thank you for that. Patrick in asking you this question I'm also curious as to again put it in terms of pitching it that you know the opportunity of being in a university and that there are people of a certain age that the sentiment towards you know towards EU membership that you'd think that you'd have yourself and that you'd pick up amongst amongst friends and people in your year and that. Me personally anyway I yeah I yeah I feel strong kind of union towards Europe considering myself very European I was kind of like Rob as well I spent a lot of time away and just even getting a PPS number I went to Spain and I arrived in Malaga and I had my PPS number probably two hours later when I went to Finland it was literally five minutes it was going into an office getting it and just the ease of everything and amongst my friends they would consider himself quite European as well yeah I think in Ireland it was I spent some time on Brussels as well and if you're talking to young people in Brussels they're European first they wouldn't call themselves Belgium or think they would say I'm European. Do you think you'd get that do you get that here? That's what I'd say like even myself I'm a very proud Irish man as well so I think if someone asked me I would definitely say Irish first but European would be extremely close second and I would consider myself European but in Brussels obviously it is very European and you're at the heart of it you're at the heart of it so of course they all say that they're European but I know I definitely consider myself European as well but strong as well I would say. Lee I'm going to move on now to ask you about a development policy which is a key component of Ireland's foreign policy and how best can Ireland promote prosperity and security through the EU? So I was looking into this a little bit and the question itself is quite there's a little different little buzzwords in it so I kind of try to just break it down a small bit for myself but not for too long or too much later but as a country Ireland contributes quite a lot to foreign aid development aid and there was recently more given in the budget last year towards it and I think the principle of foreign aid is definitely a good thing and there has been a lot of successes there was with the millennium development goals we did reach quite a few of them you know to a great extent and there is a lot of room for improvement and since then we have had chance to reflect and kind of come up with any one so this development goals and I think as a foreign policy measure development is a very good one and because it kind of promotes like the question says it promotes sustainability and it promotes prosperity and what I will say is the word security in there did throw me a bit because like when you think of security it's not the same as prosperity well in my my view security and prosperity security kind of has that negative connotation to a lot of people Irish people anyway you kind of oh oh god no European and you can't talk about that can't think about that and that is one thing I was nervously talking talking about today and so I'm kind of going to skip over the huge part of getting into that nitty gritty but and to you can I ask you briefly do you have a sort of an instinctive gut feeling on the security thing though that it's a good or a bad idea for Ireland to get more involved is there something that would worry you well interestingly enough I this is kind of going off my point but I was talking to my friends I said we were in a whatsapp group and they just said oh my god I'm about to think wow and they text back and I would say that there was five of us in the group and two remains island and then two replaced and their replaced were totally different and we went to the same school we were all college educated and one of them was totally like I love Europe your asthma erasmas you know this that the other and the other one's like no my grins brexit er you are me you are me like and my problem is that I sit in the fence and I say hi see what you're saying and I can see what you're saying and I can't make up my mind and my one of my pilots who was very poor Europe said if somebody invaded Ireland tomorrow you know we have Europe on our side and they couldn't kick their ass or or anything like you know I get that and it is very suffocating but if you don't I'm going to say relationship has to be symbiotic and it has to be mutually beneficial so if you're not putting in you can't really take back so and this this gets to the heart of a question I wanted to put to yourself minister in terms of there I think I don't think it's over stretching it to say that there would be very different attitudes in Lithuania compared to among Irish citizens in terms of security and as you highlighted yourself and your speech in from your point of view very much to do with I suppose a feeling under threat or even under physical threat which is not something that we we feel here and we're more you know we have a we we have the luxury if you like of being able to give more thought to it and as opposed to bringing bringing fear to the equation you know I can't say but first coming to my mind that when we're talking about this nice life traveling talking with people no borders no no sort of serious restrictions it's fine but this is also something we chew together in the European Union it's our asset and it should be defended but this is not given that's my point very important and you you think that something as you said we are more exposed to some maybe maybe dangerous and maybe it's true but on the other hand we all are exposed when they try to say that this is precedent or something wrong happening even if it's far away from from cork it doesn't mean it's not reality and doesn't mean that cannot be precedence and this has to do with the mindset not only the physical activity or some some events it has to do with the resilience especially nowadays when we're talking about threats we are not talking necessarily about these conventional threats you know tanks missiles it's also important but we're talking about hybrid threats which are here and now even if you're not noticing them cyber threats yes energy energy blackmailing information or propaganda or as I saying brainwashing brainwashing effect it's very huge because our friends in the east today spending billions of euros or dollars with the European government for that activity and doing that very systematically and focused and with some success I would say and a very smart way and this is not applicable only to eastern Europe if somebody thinks it's also happening to eastern Europe and through the channels like Russia today or I'm calling sometimes Russia yesterday or something like that this is this has some effect you know and brainwashing after brainwashing you're really demotivating people you make them more lazy less less so to say principled while voting in the own parliament or governments or whatever and this is really a fact so it's illusion that we still have this zone of comfort it's over and there are many examples you know even you can notice the terminology some countries let's not mention Ireland let's say Sweden sometime ago Sweden was neutral then it was not a light you cannot say neutral because Sweden is very active and very active by the way in the security and the operations and peace operations under by the way in the NATO Aegis including although not members of NATO so I can really understand talk about that but my point is that it's not just we are exposed maybe we feel that better we still remember that maybe we have the exercises so in the vicinity of our borders it's a bit more recent yeah exercises very close 30 kilometers from our capital of course you can feel that sometimes even you can hear that so this is really this thank you very much minister that picks up on a question darling I want to ask you about the role the EU should play in tackling disinformation in member states and even in the candidate countries for accession yeah so in my own opinion this can be a very dangerous question because while the EU may be able to decide what is and isn't disinformation they can't just go and censor it in my own opinion if its responsibility of journalists and publication media publications to ensure that they're adhering to high journalistic standards so if the EU gets involved in censoring this then it can lead to a lot of problems and maybe even increase your skepticism but for example as well in countries coming into the EU and countries already here education is a key part to this and the EU should be trying to ensure that every member country and country for accession has a strong EU section of their curriculums and the key part of this then is that young people would be educated with the facts and then it's up to them to decide what they choose is accurate information or disinformation because it is people's own opinions at that stage but say then take Africa from one of our own lecturers today Emmanuel Dr Emmanuel Jean-Quinlowen is out teaching a group of private school children about the European Union so it's starting them from a young age learning about the key aspects of the EU what's involved in being a member of the EU and that in the future then when they hear something they can decide well I learned when I was 12 that this is accurate information so I think that's the key part can I ask you something that the the minister spoke about in terms of active disinformation as he said in this instance is coming from the east we've already about it in terms of the US election and the ramifications of that and even in terms of Brexit and that again to ask you the level of sort of knowledge I mean it's people your age that are the who you know the digital natives and how much awareness there is of what that what you're reading what excuse me you're checking the source that you know verifying it that you know it's sound information I think a key part of it is it's all online it's all Twitter Facebook it's all links to whatever papers or your papers international papers and there is an assumption that it's going to be accurate information that it's not biased but we know that this isn't true journal like every person a journalist will have their own opinions and it's very easy for this to play into the articles that they write and that they publish so while everyone may have the knowledge that they're reading no one really is aware how accurate this information is because different people of different biases you're reading various articles about the same topic in one day from different papers and you're getting very different views but I suppose the thing is that I can hear it anyway and it's it's inherent in your answer that you're aware now that this is an issue maybe much more so I'm going to ask Patrick a question now and I think I might come to minister Stanton on it afterwards Patrick what role the EU should play in relation to taxation which is a particularly you probably know this already minister an interesting question in Ireland and yeah no it's a very interesting question and the new commission proposal the common corporate tax base and it's basically to harmonize the tax base within the EU I actually think for Ireland it would be a very good idea and basically our corporate tax rate as we all know is 12.5% and I'm quite happy with that to be honest as an Irish person but we're kind of we're getting into ramp from other European states has been almost known and almost mocked as tax even and stuff like that and I actually think this CCC TV could actually rectify that yeah it's not changing our corporate tax base from 12.5% it's going to stay the same basically means that our effective tax rate will be hopefully getting closer to 12.5% from the multinational companies instead of in some cases 1% or 3% and yeah I think it's a brilliant idea and I think it's something that we need to be if we want to kind of harmonize Europe and if we want to be involved and if we want to be sitting down at the table I think this is a good step and how do you view or how do you think our reputation is viewed on these taxation issues over in Brussels just even pub talk viewed that well to be honest and even my boss my boss was French and I know the French I'm so good at it either but he was quite he was quite adamant that generally was the whole Apple thing was coming up as well during the summer so it was it was hot topic over in Brussels and not in a good way for I have to say so I think this is a good step to kind of move on from that kind of get our respect back in certain areas and make a bit more money as well thank you Patrick so minister hot topic how do we how do we move on and repair our reputation in this this area yeah well we're a very small country on the edge of Europe as an alienation and we have a lot of disadvantages for instance at the moment getting goods in North Ireland it's difficult it's expensive and now we have to be competitive and obviously we live in a very competitive world our competitors out there are using this as a stick to beat us with but it's been very successful for us in actual fact many countries are lowering their tax time it's happening in the states as well that's actually lower their competition tax rates so I think that we have to be very vigilant here but we don't actually know the situation where we are forced into days are not competitive and that people are using the reputation kind of stick to beat us as well the taxation is a national issue and in Germany and Seoul and but this this new debate that's helping you over something we are watching very carefully and engaged with but we have to be very very vigilant as well because we have a lot of disadvantages we actually brought forward the 12.5 percent in this war for us along with all the things as well I mean our education here is quite good here in the U.C. is an example of that we have a very young workforce we have a very hard working workforce and but I'm very English-speaking and we probably be the only English-speaking country in the eurozone that breaks the course again which is an advantage but our island status is a disadvantage and we have to be very careful of that now listen carefully to the minister said about security cyber security and other types of security and the minister maybe you know he's on the edge there and you know certainly where the digit age is concerned you know we're in the center as well so you know it's it's it's it's a it's a changing world all the time but I wouldn't be working in any major changes for the past well I guess if we if we had more time on this particular issue Patrick give you a good run for your money and on that but I'm going to move on to a different this is a final question from from the panel and then we'll move on to to a question from the floor and it's moving to a slightly different area and Rob it's to ask you that would you support a path for membership of the EU to countries in the western Balkans yes and yeah I think the EU should always be seeking to expand within reason and the western Balkans is a very interesting area of Europe as I briefly mentioned I was there for some time and if you think about it across Croatia, Romania, Bulgaria, Hungary and Greece and the western Balkans is surrounded by members of the EU and it should only make sense that they should one day join us and so the question being do I think they should join do I think they should there should be a pathway yes I wouldn't be too confident that they would be ready to join immediately. What would be the issues that struck you when you were there or what you've read? Well yeah there's I mean you're looking at the western Balkans as an area that just over 20 years ago was absolutely ravaged through this one of the biggest conflicts it's certainly been the biggest conflict in the European mainland since World War II. I have made friends there and there are still tensions there between the countries there are still bilateral issues I mean even if you look at Kostov the EU 27 doesn't uniformly recognise Kostov with Ireland and Lithuania have since 2008 if there are some nations which still don't recognise that which obviously will be a massive issue but I think the idea of getting the western Balkans into the EU would be great it would be a huge ideological victory the EU itself was born you know from the aftermath of World War II so to get these members to get these countries on board the former Yugoslavia would be great success at the EU if we could see Serbia and Croatia the members once again and it would be it would be absolutely wonderful to get all members in you would have I suppose you'd have Bosnia as well which would be the first EU nation to have a really strong I suppose numerous indigenous Islamic population which would also contribute to the diversity that we celebrate for the European Union too and so from an ideological point of view I think it would be an absolutely wonderful success however there are challenges that didn't be overcome and in Yonkers address last year he stated that there would be no more enlargement in this tenure which I would have considered quite demotivating for these countries however as the minister said earlier it was 15 years ago when the Danes were told that they would not be members of NATO all that did was motivating further to really abide by the rules and really get the regulations in place and I would hope that would happen for the Western Balkans as well once they get all these regulations to be a key in it would be great so yes I would fully support it however I think there are a few strongly blocks and groups that are really good thanks Rob thank you very much now we've heard I think you'll agree some really interesting points from the panel and whether it's something you want to pick up on that the panel mentioned or a whole new area and if you wouldn't mind just identifying yourself you put up your hand identifying yourself if there's somebody specific you want to address the question to or or you can keep it more generally whichever you prefer I saw just this gentleman here I think was the first to indicate there's a microphone just behind you there John Ryan is my name hi John the question I have is regarding pre-trade given that Ireland and Lithuania are two chairs around the European 27 in the Council of Europe and given that we now know that the TTIP the Transatlantic Trade and Investment Partnership is in the deep freeze is do you think that Europe should consider other methodologies or a separate plan to promote both free trade and fair trade or as I fear that there are too much putting their eggs in the one basket hoping that they can patch together TTIP at a later stage with sticking plaster and glue and somehow get it across the line later thank you okay very interesting question anybody any of you that we have to go for it minister it's really not a good time for free trade especially with the United States but I do not think it's forever and maybe other issues also discussed as you know also not very good time but I believe time will come we are trade nation we Lithuania seem as if Ireland most bulk of our GDP gets from from so to see our trade and we're free trade in favor for whatever direction comes and when talking about transatlantic rates we also know in the process of reprifying treated Canada so also very important so this is not over and that will come what we have to do really to find more arguments because in my view it's again has to do with the leadership and ownership frankly and sometimes disinformation is spread not backed by by arguments but people think that this is wrong but when it comes to the substance when trying to ask concrete questions what do you think it's wrong quality of food what do you think is wrong no barriers protectionism what do you have in mind and we're addressing these issues it seems artificial but it's too late because the conviction is already here and very difficult to remedy after that very difficult expensive sometimes even arguments not working so we have to change our tactics and to explain before doing things and to be proactive in in in providing arguments people should be people deserve to get information frankly speaking while the politicians discussing and deciding some things and then angry that people do not understand that's because they're not engaged duly in in due time so that's the point so it should be some lessons drawn but I shouldn't say that we should change something or invent something we have to come to that anyway it's unavoidable if you talk to business people in the United States some of them let's say not all maybe some of them still believe that this is also not over it's not not that thing and time is not not easy now but not forever okay thank you I suppose that gets back to the what you were saying in your speech about vacuum vacuum being being allowed to develop passive passive so to speak we have Senator Colette Kelleher in the in the audience Senator Kelleher congratulations to UCC and the IIA for organizing this and the title is forwarding partnerships and I'm the convener of the Ireland Lithuania Friendship Group on behalf of the Calcora so I've been working with my colleague here the ambassador we're about to launch and very open to ideas and suggestions on how we carry on the conversations from today the minister if you've got any ideas or suggestions either minister or indeed the panel or the audience very open to hearing those as we embark on continuing the conversation between Ireland and Lithuania to the Friendship Group so thank you okay thank you Senator Kelleher any yep just there gentlemen there there's a microphone just beside you there Madam Moderator and Minister Likvikius good afternoon um minister Stanton has already alluded to the size of Lithuania in the past but it hasn't actually quite covered what the area was it actually covered an area from the Baltic to the Black Sea an area of some 800 000 square kilometers compared to its present day 65 000 kilometers quite small a bit like a bit smaller than Ireland and at the present time you have a northern neighbour Latvia and you have Poland by Ella Ross you have the Russian Federation in the form of Kaliningrad Oblast and then you have the Baltic Sea do you at times think that Lithuania is actually holding a tiger by the tank in its relationship by the tail in its relationship with the Russian Federation good question thank you for excellent knowledge of our region I mentioned all neighbours and you're quite right it's indeed impressive and actually we also looking at these old maps of nostalgia but I'm of course not serious now we're in different situation and neighbours are all neighbours are important although they are quite different with regard to the Russian Federation is really specific because it's enclave you know separated territory so it's not main land of Russia and traditionally I can tell you it was always I'm always saying it's not a problem it's a challenge because we had very good relations usually with Kaliningrad region because they need us as a trade partners our food products were very popular after embargo was introduced by both sides because European Union sanctions against Russia Russians against the European Union and neighbours of course suffered the most and we are in particular by the way with regard to the food production transport sector this also not a big secret but our food products were very popular in Kaliningrad Russians invented invented terminology replacement of import or something like that and Russian that themselves were so to say kidding about this terminology because terminology was invented but products were not invented because shelves were empty at the end of the day and the consumers suffered basically a lot so this is also kind of litmus test of not just relations with the Russian Federation keeping the tail or whatever you can call it but also also in general and we feel responsible and sometimes we really feel it's our duty to tell to our partners because we know that country and we know these people and that doesn't mean that we do not respect we do respect these people Russians are decent people they're getting clear messages they really from time of the no half a century ago they claim taking clear messages is if message is not clear it's taken like provocation sometimes this is not understandable by somebody but this is true believe me if you're behaving if you're being flexible if you're retreating doesn't mean that other side will do the same it's why vice versa this is the main main philosophy and sometimes when you say don't be provocative don't make harsh statements on don't act something well i would say it's provocative not not acting it's provocative not making statement when it's necessary to make this is the case and we're experiencing through our relations in the in the neighborhood you know paradoxically we we have restrictions in the political level relations we're not queuing to kremlin to meet leaders but practical level of cooperation taking place last year our export increased to Russia 27 percent the areas which are not covered by by sanctions there's cross border cooperation in the context of European Union regions you know it's taking place tourists increasing number of tourists coming from from Russia despite propaganda about us in Russian media people do not trust they are coming this is also also kind of experience we can share with others but they are taking clear messages and if we will be not smart enough to not to be consistent with our policies in the future they will use that in the proper way as i said adequately feeling weakness feeling that it's possible to do something wrong with the little price and this is again again the point so we really feel quite interesting job job job political position quite well it certainly is that i think we have time maybe for one one other question and you were the the first to put your hand up there question for both ministers sweden has having a tough time they have a lot of problems against the migrant crisis and gang violence skyrocketed there were 300 confirmed shootings last year alone the 53 so-called no-go zones in sweden sweden prime minister has suggested that they bring in the army instead of the police to tighten things up does this situation concern you as a foreign minister and a minister of state for immigration and does it pose a threat to the future of your do you want to start yeah the um migration issue is uh very much top of the agenda in your meeting seven in in Brussels and so on it's there um and i suppose we have to have your question is is it a threat um we have an integration policy here migration integration policy and i'm trying to pass across on that and one of the one of the things we've discovered is that integration is very very important and that means getting to know people and making sure you don't demand this make sure people don't be isolated and making sure that people come here from other countries that they're welcoming and that they feel at home and that's there's not a work environment and it covers a whole lot of different spheres now you have people who come in as refugees as asylum seekers and as as legal migrants different levels and each of them then will have a different need we need a different response to that language acquisition is quite important that people we already have to communicate with each other and at the moment we're gathering refugees and asylum seekers we're looking at community sponsorship for instance which is very very successful in Canada and as you know Canadians will contain migrants and refugees from huge numbers and they've integrated successfully so along that has to do with integration and i mean to me that if the integration is worked on as successful and is embraced and the threat that you mentioned is dissipated and the juniors constantly and it may be even limited and i think that's important but i think the the genesis of your question is we we can't become today since we can't just say well people are coming we'll come here and and we have to think for themselves and that help people to actually integrate to make lives of their children for themselves and for their children and also as a Lithuanian friends here here know and we have a lot of Lithuanians in Ireland at the moment maybe between I think officially 36 000 and unofficially they've even doubled that but the Lithuanian community are integrating extremely well here working very well in Ireland are very welcome here and are almost invisible in some ways as i said the ambassador last week and and that's what we'd like to see with other communities that they integrate but not lose their own identity they were a cultural idol which is also important so it's challenging definitely so parallel and here i think it's working pretty well we don't have the kind of issues and problems that you've enunciated in Sweden and i'm not sure whether there is as dramatic as you've said or what i've seen but the ambassador's thoughts of what ministers thought to it so perhaps you know more about what's happening in Sweden than i do but what i've seen i don't think it's as difficult as maybe we might have seen some media reports i am going to finish with the minister but i'm wondering whether any of the students have any views on on on migrations um yep um when we think of migration uh so it's first of all the people's heads just off the top of their mind might be called the Syrian crisis and what we've seen in 2015 2016 but migration is something all across the borders of Europe the big number of migrants this year was actually from Africa from countries such as Nigeria so in terms of targeting that and the EU has to look at aid programs in these areas and with regards to people who are coming here it is quite complicated in the EU because of that Dublin regulation of course which crooks that was uh wherever you registered to be an asylum seeker that is where you have to stay which has caused numerous problems with places like Greece like Hungary and other places on the periphery of Europe and geographically speaking so um i know Deputy of Hungarians had a a referendum two years ago and it was a very very poorly worded question i think it was along the lines of should there be migrant quotas should countries take uh certain levels of migrants in should the migrants be shared essentially across the EU and that was almost unanimously rejected at 98.3 percent Hungarian said they did not want this to happen so in terms of migrant crisis this is really um really really hot topic when it comes to the future of Europe because um certainly these peripheral states um there's been massive issues and these peripheral states are states which have had economic difficulties as well in the past so i suppose an answer to the question of the little migrant crisis and we have to look at helping uh with the base actors with the root causes of migration we have to look at where these problems are coming from what are causing these people to come here and uh deal with it in that sense because we deal with that base and there won't be as much of an issue there won't be these issues arriving and when these problems come to our shores so that's just like. Thanks Rob. Now we uh kicked off with the with the ministers i think it's appropriate that uh in this instance he'll get the the last word it's the issue one of the major challenges but not not in my country because not very hot issue for many reasons we are not on this track of moving all these people and all even those who we are receiving they are going to Germany or also to Sweden so they're not commodities they're not criminals they have a right to go and basically reuniting with the families many other reasons but in general terms i can tell that we are our people are quite quite well normal attitudes this phenomenon so to say maybe it's something now genes and you said the Grand Duchy of Lithuania and that multinational multicultural religion so to see the atmosphere it was always prevailing but as i said in our case it's not a very hot issue but coming back to your question it really could be a big threat if it mismanaged if not not not controlled because we really have to distinguish those who are refugees and running away from war zone they must be treated adequately and those who are looking but basically for better life they cannot afford to receive in Europe everyone because living standards in North Africa the fears from well-developed European countries 40 times with all consequences you know fees subsidies everything so it's understandable not possible we have really to both to to gather our borders more properly we really have to have this return policy also active and in terms of the with the with the possible criminal cases or terrorist cases we really must make sure that our intelligence services they are sometimes very reluctant to reluctant to interact but they must cooperate also more closely everything should be in parallel not to get to the edges so to say but asking for my case it's not a hot issue in Lithuania so far alright minister thank you very much i'd like to thank minister Stanton Rob, Danielle, Lee and Patrick. I also have one or two others particularly like to thank UCC for hosting the event and Mary Murphy of the Department of Government and Politics it's safe to say it would not as I mentioned earlier have happened without her the Lithuanian Embassy and the Ambassador who was mentioned Dana on a few occasions today the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade who are also key in assisting with the organization also other people in attendance such as the Deputy Lord Mayor there Councillor Fergo Dennehy the UCC Vice President John O'Halloran and to thank you actually the audience for listening I think it was really good quality listening and I think that reflects very well on the interest in the in the subject matter but also I think on the preparation particularly on the part of our our four students that that went into their topics and we certainly have all been left with the plenty of food for thought so thank you very much