 Good evening and thank you for joining us on Y254 news updates and tonight we'll be talking about sexual violence. We try to see so far for people probably who have reported such cases, what has been done. We try to see what role can the church do in making sure that we don't have cases of sexual violence and joining us tonight to help us talk about this. We have Winnie Obure who is a founder of Tin Seed and an activist. We also have Brenda Kimuto who is going to be with a nurse and she's also going to be talking to us today about sexual violence. You can be part of our conversation tonight by sharing your views and comments on our social media platform that is on Y254 channel, hashtag Y254 news and you can also reach me at Patricia Muriuki. My name is Patricia Muriuki and let us begin our discussion for the night. We've had very many issues in different places in the world. Sexual violence is a global problem and we've had people who have come and talked about the experiences as far as sexual violence is concerned. We've had cases whereby maybe someone has listened to the problem and we've seen a solution but we also have cases whereby nothing is done at all. I would like first to bring you Winnie as an activist. What is sexual violence and what does the Kenyan law define? What is entailed as sexual violence? What do I do to you or what can someone do to me and I'll call that sexual violence and I'll go report it. So sexual violence, first of all thank you very much for having us on the show. You're welcome. Sexual violence is abuse of someone without their consent. So it's literally needing to get sexual with them without any form of agreement or consent and it's usually not only physical, it is sometimes psychological which includes sexual harassment, incest, intimate partner abuse as well. So I would like to bring you in Brenda. In 2016 the UK came up with an hashtag whereby an hashtag called Ask for Angela. We earned the Mitu hashtag that was really running in Hollywood after we had very many cases of very senior people in Hollywood feeling that they have the power and they've abused people. We've had people who have been abused probably when they were starting up their career in acting. What do you think we can do as Kenya to make sure that we try to end sexual violence? What do they maybe, you can even maybe suggest something tonight during the program which you can push and make sure that people adopted to make sure that we end sexual violence in this country. For me I think how we can end the sexual violence basically starts from childhood where parenting is involved. If you Patricia has a kid, you talk to your kid on when they have an issue, when they feel threatened, they have a way they can wink at you and you know they are not safe. If it's land through your family, there's a way you'll save your kids yourself and then maybe in school the teachers can have girls and boys clubs where they teach on science that they can help save each other. Maybe in school, maybe for myself, I have friends, I'm in trouble, I can't call them, this is what I can say and they know I need help. We need to talk about teen seed, what is teen seed all about? Before I speak about teen seed, Patricia, I just wanted to add something into what Maya has said. I think for me sexual violence in Kenya should be a national disaster because we have very high rates of sexual abuse and violence in this country and no action is being done, no action is being taken whatsoever. When you look at the cases that have been reported for instance at justice systems, it takes a very long time before you get justice. The women and girls that I work with sometimes are reluctant to report because when you go to report cases of the police station, the police officer is laughing at you, you know what I mean. So even the attitude of the police who are receiving these cases is an issue. And when they get to the court, it takes a very long time even when they are doing investigations on the staff, it's just endless. So the frustrating way of the process, it's really really crazy and I think for me that has to be hastened. If we need to fight and if we are really really up to fighting sexual violence in this country. And also that this issue of kangaroo courts, like your child has been defiled or a woman has been raped and then you want to discuss it outside the court. That's a crime. You don't discuss issues of rape and defilement, you can't. So I think for me is once we strengthen our justice system and say when you have been raped or defiled or gone through any form of sexual violence, you can be able to get justice. Okay. So Tinsid Africa is, as you say, teen and seed is that we look at teenagers as seeds of greatness. And so we work with adolescents and young women on sexual reproductive health issues and preventing sexual gender based violence. And that is part of it. Like she said, engaging the parents, engaging the community to just understand what is sexual violence and try and come up with solutions. And one of the things we do is to do referrals, we do counseling. It's very important to do counseling for people who have gone through sexual violence because it's too much for someone to hold, whether it's harassment at a workplace or it's abused by a relative. And statistics show by the way that one in every three women have been abused. And mostly by people that you know very well, relatives or neighbors or something. So I think for me, even as teen seed is to continue speaking to the girls about understanding themselves and speaking out and raising an alarm, right? But also that the officers that are mandated with the task of following up investigating and protecting us do their work. I mean, why should I be worried of walking at night along this avenue because of security issues when like the other gender is not worried. Okay. We are really going to get to that whereby the attention is shifting from the victim to the perpetrator. But let us talk about creating safe spaces. And I'd like to bring Brenda on these. How do we make sure that we create in safe spaces to make sure that for someone who has been sexually violated, they have a place where they can come, they can talk about their story without being judged, they can have someone who is going to take them through the recovery process. And as you talk about this, I really like us to focus on man because I feel that most people are very willing to share their stories. A woman is going to come out, a young lady will come and say and tell their mom, someone touched me in this way. My boss said certain things or my boss touched me or maybe I was going from the market and someone did. But man don't talk about it. For a man to come out and say that I have been raped is very difficult. So how do we create these spaces and I would like us to put the man at the forefront on this, Brenda. Like what we are doing in Kibera with a lady by the name Pauline Juma Leslie. We are starting something, it's a rescue center. It's called Rebirth of a Queen. We are basically starting with the ladies. We started with the ladies. We get them the victims of both gender-based violence and sexual violence. They talk their story without being judged. We help them through counseling and apparently we have a man, we have a gender. The opposite gender, one man in the group. He has talked about his story. We help him walk the journey. Once we are together like the three of us and I have an issue. It's way much easier walking the journey together the three of us without unlike me walking the journey alone. So when you have the rescue center, we don't basically do counseling the whole day, the whole night. We just try to integrate them back to the society. Most of them feel like the society does not like them, the society does not love them. They are abandoned. So we can have maybe people doing modeling, photography, catering, small courses that will just brighten up their days and make them feel like if I do this for my society, if I do this for my people, they won't judge me. They won't say she is a victim, they won't say he is a victim. For the victims who we have, the ones who call them conquerors. I hear the word victims. Ya, they are survivors, they are conquerors. So for them, apart from them speaking their story to us and those who are ready to help them, their story helps get others who will talk to them and they will be the ones who are helping them walk the journey. Not me and you. Not me and you, Patricia will be helping Winnie come out of the trouble. We'll have someone else coming to help Winnie because you've helped me, I'll help Winnie. Winnie will help somebody else. So we're trying to make it a network. Okay, so Winnie you've really mentioned something that hired, really intended to make sure that we talk about. We've had issues whereby when someone talks about I was raped, the first thing someone is going to say how are you dressed, you find out it's the first question someone is going to ask you, what time was it and it was at night. So we have issues whereby the attention is shifted from the victim that is a person who has gone through the sexual violence and this person now, the perpetrator, is the person now, we don't even get to talk about them very much. You get to hear a young girl was found at night working and she was raped. So the guy you get to hear very nice, the adjectives that are used to describe the guy are so nice that by the time you're thinking that this is a person who has raped someone, it really takes you time because we paint the guy as a very nice person and then just put, we rape someone down there and then when it comes to the woman we start with what was she dressed, what street was she working on and all that. So how do we make sure that the society, because we have also seen people in the society bring out such sentiments, how do we make sure now that the person who has committed the crime is apprehended and we make sure that that is the person we get to follow. Yeah, first I'd like to say and just so that we watch our language is that people who have gone through sexual violence are not victims but they're survivors. I think that needs to be very clear because when you say victims it contributes to even stigmatizing them more. The other thing I would like to comment about is that the government has the role to make sure that all citizens are safe and that if you are not safe you are able to get a safe space. We have women and girls who are going through a lot of abuse and violence but they do not even have a safe house to go to. When the government has, they take our taxes every other day and instead of giving us safe houses that are not our priority. So I think right now I'm telling you like in Nairobi if you were trying to locate a safe house to take a survivor, you're going to have a headache. I used to run a safe house myself in Kambiyu. It closed down because I didn't have resources for it. It was self funded. So I think in addition to what Brenda said is that we need to ensure that the government has the safe houses that they're fully equipped and the homes are working. Other than that we'll just have women who are afraid of even reporting or coming out because you know you have to deal with your perpetrator at home. You have to go back to your home. And when you talk about like justification for violence for sexual violence like what did you dress? What time was it? Where are you? That's crap, right? I mean why should it be safe for a man to walk in the streets of Nairobi at 3am and not a woman? I've had a woman who is like 70 years old who was raped, right? I've had a child who is 3 years old that was raped and my friend Florence Kea runs a safe house as well in Nairobi and it's frustrating. It's really crazy to see a child who's 4 years who was defiled by the father. So you can't blame the dress code, right? And I've seen with all due respect I mean some people think that Muslims are well dressed, right? They put on everything and cover except to the eyes. But they're still raped and defiled. Is it the dress code? No. So I think these are excuses of getting to justify rape and defile many sexual violence which should not be tolerated. It's not about where you are and what time is the question of national security that I must be able to walk wherever anytime when I want to without feeling threatened without feeling unsafe. That we have to look at sexual violence in this country as a national security issue. So then we go into it knowing that we are protecting our own because women rights are human rights, right? But the other thing that I wanted to come into lastly is the question of men and boys. I think globally we have 14% of women who have gone through a form of sexual violence between the age of 15 and 19 years and it's only 6% of men really. I'm trying to say that men do not go through it but I encourage even in our programs that men and boys are part of this conversation and for me to be able to achieve violence free country or society if you like is to try and push for gender equity and economic empowerment, right? Because women sort of go through violence more because they don't have the power in control and these are the things we are trying to fight so much so that the women can have some sort of power if it's financial if it's work, if it's jobs and stuff so that we are equal. So ultimately I think for me is gender equity. Okay, so I would like you to talk about the process that is the steps of when you maybe probably have been sexually violated the process of reporting all that but before we get to that I would like to bring you in Brenda let's talk about support whether it's family support, whether it's your friends whether it's the people around you how do we now as a society support someone who has gone through sexual violence, what are some of the things that we should say to them probably how should we even deal with these people in terms of when they talk to us, what are some of the things that we're supposed to tell them because it's very difficult sometimes when you have to talk to someone and you've not gone through whatever it is that they're experiencing but maybe you could share with us what you think as a society we could do to make sure that people who have gone through sexual violence feel our support and our love during that difficult time. I'll start with most people most people don't like the word sorry even if I have an issue I would like you to tell me sorry why it's my crime so many people don't like the word sorry you just encourage them you tell them they'll go through it they'll fight it and they are here it's not a fate it's not that it was written that someone will be raped did you have to understand that because they always have that question why me day in day out they live why me we've said we should ask them of how they were dressed, what was it those are the many questions we forget many people out here ask where were you what time was it, how were you dressed what were you doing on the other side there are people who are raped when coming out of the bar not that the bar is the one that caused them to get raped they were having their own pleasure rape is like an accident accidents do happen it was not planned for so if you ask them what they were doing on the other side they'll feel the guilt I'll get guilty of when did I come to the studio because the accident happened outside I'll be like why did I go to the studio I'll be no guilty inside myself we don't need to make them guilty we need them to fight the guilt in them because they're already fighting a guilt of being they've lost their virginity they've lost their dignity they're fighting that guilt already we have to make them strong to overcome the guilt then we shouldn't let them be alone most of the time because most of the time when they are alone they're in a dark pit they get flashbacks of what happened they get to have memories which torture them emotionally physically we need to bring on this we're running out of time but I would like you to talk about how now do I get what is the process what is the first step that I'm supposed to do if I am sexually violated who do I go to what are the procedures that I need to follow there are different ways of going about that we'll talk about the most common and what is supposed to be done in Kenya is that once you get violated sexually the first thing is to make sure that you're safe it doesn't matter what it is just to make sure that this person is not abusing you more is not violating you more when you get out of that space is to make sure you access a medical facility that you can be able to be checked by a doctor because for instance if you're like raped today or right now when you go to the hospital they can get you medication that would prevent for instance HIV with the cold post exposure prophylaxis they get you meds that will help prevent pregnancies and want pregnancies and stuff once you get through the health facility then you can run if home is not safe you can go to a safe house or a friend place or somewhere that you really think you are safe yourself and then after that then you can go to the legal one which is to try and start the process but all this time you require counsellings like social support you require somebody to keep speaking to you so that you can be able to reconcile with yourself and get back to what you used to be but I also want to bring us to the fact that we have a lot of sexual violence and abuse if you like on the internet so for instance you know facebook what you're doing whatever and somebody is say babooling you or internet shaming you and this happens a lot even with the apps and you know online there's a lot of abuse online which I know right now is still not very easy to penetrate because there are not enough policies around internet abuse sexual abuse so for this case is to get to make sure you report it somewhere I know once it's reported the zole is going to be followed it might take long the way our justice system is kind of screwed right now it might take long but eventually I know we'll get justice also just to encourage everybody to report some of these cases because everyone is going through a form of sexual violence mostly women and girls and if you're able to remember me too right the one you raised earlier is that people keep it to themselves because they blame themselves because you start asking oh but what will they say how will they react to those discriminated they do what so I think just to make sure that everybody gets to a level where when something has been reported somebody says this happened to me is believe it first of all believe her because she's not crazy she can't come out and start saying that she was evaluated sexually when she wasn't right so I think for us what we can do to encourage people to encourage everyone in our families our work places is to believe someone and work with them through these steps if they need more counseling if they need to like a lawyer pro bono and stuff is just to get to work with them and amplify some of these things because the perpetrators are right here we know them in the community so the only way we can stop them is to come out report get help when you need it and then keep supporting the people who've gone through this kind of violence sexual violence brand I would like you to share as you wind up you've talked about the rebirth of a queen I think this is a very it's number one the statement alone is very strong I would like you to share maybe for someone who is watching us tonight maybe they know someone who has gone through sexual violence or even as an individual the person watching us today whether male or female they have gone through sexual violence if they need help how do they get to reach you so that they can probably get help from the center that you're coming up that you guys are starting I will start with giving out my our page on Facebook it's Rebat over Queen rising to konga love and love to konga and lover okay wow we have that page we speaking out on people we've started the journey okay we need for you kindly also share your contacts maybe for someone who is watching us tonight and they like to reach you how do they get to reach you because I'm very positive that someone today who's probably journey or recovery process has been made easier so kindly share your contacts with us tonight I mean I'm on all social media platforms with the WIWNY or BURE that's Winnie Obure but I would want to just say one thing as I close is that we need the judiciary the government to really speed up cases of sexual violence in court cases yes but we have police officers who have been trade like to deal with that maybe we go there this counseling because that is the first place that you get to maybe we should have a sex crime unit in this country we should have it like yesterday really and you see like lots of police officers have been trained on gender issues being you know abuse and whatever but they keep being transferred all over the country so you can keep track right so these gender desks are not working anymore we need to figure out and even including a sexual violence unit in their training curriculum in Kigancho so that they can come out of it understanding really what this means and also how to handle survivors of violence and also lastly is to say that governments need to support the safe houses that are existing because people have voluntarily giving this service out of love and you don't need to do it out of love when you're paying taxes money when we are supposed to be taking care of our citizens so women are Kenyans and girls are Kenyans we need them to be safe we need safety now thank you I'm very sure we've been able to we've tried to at least tackle the basics of this we're going to be having a detailed conversation on sexual violence so please stay on the lookout on Y254 news that is on health health and lifestyle Wednesday that is all we hand for you tonight on Y254 news all I can say is that if you've gone through it don't be scared speak up about it there's always someone who's going to listen and who's going to help you and if you're someone who's watching us tonight if you find yourself in a space whereby you're living or your friend has gone through sexual violence please be very supportive and be open and not judgmental thank you very much for joining us my name is Patricia Muriuki do have yourself a very good night