 A mystic, yogi, visionary, humanitarian, author and poet. Sadguru is a spiritual master with a difference. Traversing seamlessly from the ancient to the ultramodern, he bridges the gap between the known and unknown, enabling all those who encounter him to explore and experience the deepest dimensions of life. Making a clear break from the mere customs and the rituals, Sadguru presents the inner dimension in a scientific manner, as it is relevant for our times. Through the mystic art shows Sadguru in his various facets in conversation with eminent personalities from various walks of life. Exploring a vast array of topics including business, politics, design, architecture, sports and ecology. This week's episode features Anupam Kher, Padmishri Award-winning actor and social activist in conversation with Sadguru. Noted for his versatility, Anupam Kher has played just about every kind of role in the course of over 400 films and 100 plays. He's also the founder of the Anupam Kher Foundation, which aims to create a brighter future for children from less privileged backgrounds. Watch as Mr. Kher and Sadguru discuss various aspects, including the state of India's democracy, the power of attention and the children of today, losing their sense of wonder to the W-W-W. I feel very proud to be an Indian and I'm sure a lot of people feel. But corruption bothers me and I'm sure you also spoke about it. How… do you think spirituality can help get rid of corruption to some extent? So let's understand this corruption because it's a very important thing that everybody understands this properly in its right perspective rather than reacting against a bunch of people who are in an advantageous position. Why I want you to understand this is because for the first time in the history of independent India, the sixty-four years, that means two generations of people, they have at least fifty to sixty percent of them have had such a bad deal. Today you and me will talk all this and go home and eat well. There's a whole bunch of people, almost four hundred million people who cannot do that. So if we handle the next five to ten years' right, we can change that. It's a tremendous possibility which is on our threshold. There's an economic possibility sitting on the threshold. If we conduct this right, we can change their lives. Those people who have not eaten properly, those children who are malnourished which have the highest level of malnourishment, those who are not educated, those who don't have opportunities, those who are in that horrible social and economic pit, their lives can change in the next five to ten years if we conduct our act right. Every Indian should understand this. It is not just about economy means stock market. It is about hungry people who will have food on their plate. Economy does not mean stock market. Economy does not mean foreign cars coming into India. Economy does not mean you wear better clothes or this and that. Improving economy means there will be no hungry children in the country, which is something all of us should do something about. And that possibility, that possibility is being jeopardized. Wherever I go, I speak to various economic and political leaders around the world. Everybody says, we want to come to India. India is a big possibility but the humiliation of corruption, we can't bear it. Because it's not just about money, they're willing to pay a percentage and get the work done but the humiliation that they put through on a daily basis, which we have gotten used to. They're not willing to go through that. They said it doesn't matter if we don't do business, but we don't want to come there and go through all that rubbish. So this possibility is being jeopardized by a handful of people or it is wrong to say it's a handful of people. It's a nation full of corruption. Correct. Because how many people in Mumbai streets, if there is no policemen will start at the red, stop at the red light, I think only ten percent will stop. So these ninety percent are corrupt people. If they make, if you make them the chief ministers and prime ministers, you know what they will do. So instead of just calling it by one bad word called corruption, we need to understand we as a society are trying to move from a feudalistic way of managing our lives to a democratic way. The democratic way has still not sunk into us. So I am saying in our psyche we are still feudalistic in nature, but we are trying to run a democracy. Democracy will not happen with an active sense of education as to what is democracy, what is the power of democracy, what it means, what is the responsibility of living in a democratic society. This has not been done. We just took democracy from the British and we think if they just put their oat and get their fingers dirty once in five years, everything is settled. No, we have not educated people. We are still a feudalistic society acting to be democratic. So how do we, how do we do that? No, no, no. It is only because common people are not participating in the democratic process. Participating in the democratic process does not just mean once in five years you cast your oat. Most people don't even do that. But I am saying even if you do that, that is not enough. Democracy is a, is an active sport. It's not a spectator sport. You can't sit back and say, let somebody do democracy. Democracy means you are the boss. You can't sleep on it. You have to be active to everything around you. If you do not bring that consciousness in people, that awareness and activism in people, it will not work. At the same time for everything you protest, for everything you call a band, it's our culture. People have understood the technology of how to stop the nation. But how to run the nation, it's a different technology. I am saying, at least once a month in your street, in your region, whatever is the sticking points in your area, in your street, just make a list of that. Get a few people together, whoever the councillor, the MLA, call him for a meeting, once in five years is not good enough. Because you employ somebody and you don't see that he works. That is not... That makes sense, isn't it? Do you get angry? You want me to write now? It's not that I'm incapable of anger, I'm capable of everything. It is just that I have not given this privilege to anybody that they can make me angry, they can make me happy, they can make me unhappy, they can make me miserable. I have not given this privilege to anybody. If... if somebody need to be shouted at, boom, I'll go. So what makes you angry? It doesn't make me angry. If they need a shouting, I'll give it to them. See the different kinds of people in the world. There is somebody here, if I just look at them, they'll understand why they're being looked at. There's somebody else here, if you tell them gently, they will understand. There is somebody here, if you tell them gently, they won't get it, you have to shout at them. There's somebody else here, even if you shout, they won't get it, you have to knock them on the head and tell them. Different levels of sensitivity in the world, your action should be appropriate to the situation in which you exist. I am not bound like this, I will not say this, I will be gentle, I will be nice, I have no such things. I am just appropriate to the situations that I do. What's my problem? What's your shortcoming? My shortcoming is, I'm not tall enough. You are the tallest man right now, you're here. We know that. I came little short. Do you feel lonely? Lonely? When you're alone, if you feel lonely, obviously you're in bad company. It's a great journey to be talking to you. If you have to describe yourself in one word, what will that word be? So if Sadhguru has to decide, and if he has to tell me to describe himself in one word, one that missed, apart from mystic. Okay. Would you consider wildlife as two words or one word? What is the word? Wildlife. It's, for you it's one word. One word. So life, life uncultured, uncultivated, just wild and as it is. Touch me. You're very warm also. Just life, nothing else. It's been very enriching talking to you, I must say that I feel it. I grew up in a lower middle class family, small town. As a child I had a great sense of wonder about everything. I till today have a great sense of wonder. I'm very happy to be talking to you. I don't see that in today's children. I don't see a sense of wonder in today's children. I think because they're Because they replace the wonder with www. Exactly. Exactly. That's right. They know the whole universe before they're six. Exactly. How do, and I'm sure parents, they know everything. They just have to press Google and all the information, but information does not necessarily translate into knowledge at all. So how do, and they always say this, that's the way I am. I don't see my grandfather even at the age of 84 said, that's the way I am. So what is this, that's the way I am. God, dude, cool. I think that to be bad is being cool. If you say I'm a good man, he's a boring man. Usually they are. People who claim that they're good people, usually they are boring. Yeah, they are for the world, for the marketing part of it. We are becoming people who are constantly made to fail, suddenly in India also that we are living in a world which is not very, very peaceful, which is not to be, which is a dangerous world. We are becoming, pardon my saying, like America, where we don't look at somebody for a little longer. I was in America two years back. I was looking at somebody thinking whether should I ask him my hotel, because in my hotel there was a mall. So I went into the mall and when I came out I could not see my hotel because I must have got out from somewhere else. So I was looking at somebody to ask him whether should I ask him where my hotel is. So he said, what are you staring at? I being an actor I said, am I staring at you sir? I'm sorry, I did not know I was staring at you. Poor fellow actually dropped me to my hotel. What my point is, how do you retain, how does one in today's time, in these times retain a certain amount of innocence, a certain amount of sense of wonder, how does one do that? See now there are two things you said, wonder and innocence. Wonder does not necessarily come from innocence. Okay. See for example, when you were a child, you definitely looked up at the sky, isn't it? Absolutely. Did you ever count the stars? I used to do that in similar to nothing to do. How far did you go? Oh no, no, nothing. I could not go beyond hundred or two hundred. So I meticulously sat down and the terrace counting, counting, trying to make, you know, segments of the sky I have gone up to seventeen hundred and then you get mixed up, what was there is not there, what was not there has come, you know, it gets all mixed up. But today that itself was wonder, seventeen hundred just blew my mind. Today scientists are telling you there are over hundred billion galaxies, not stars, hundred billion galaxies. So as you explore, as you know the wonder will increase because you realize the nature of the existence, then wonder will just explode. So wonder is gone not because of lack of innocence or because of innocence because what we call as knowledge, stupid conclusions about life. Nobody is, today people are carrying their attention deficiency like a qualification. See existence will yield to you only if you pay attention to something. Anything in this existence will yield to you only if you pay substantial attention to it. But now people have become like this. They can't look at anything, everything is chuck, chuck, chuck, chuck. Now in this condition there will be no wonder only conclusions in your head. There is no perception, there is only, you know, monologues going in your new head there is no perception. There is no perception. If there is perception, all noise in your head will just stop. If you're looking at something absolutely beautiful and engaging, everything stops. Why people are enjoying your cinema is just this, you switch off the lights, they're focused on the thing for those whatever few minutes or ninety minutes or whatever their usual monologues are gone, something else is happening. It is the attention which is making the difference. It is not what's playing on the screen. It is instrumental in grabbing the attention. But it is the attention, continuous attention which is making the experience of being there. So this is a rudimentary form of meditation. It's called dharana. So how does one in today's time retain that attention? One simple thing is everybody must do something about themselves. Every child, every school should bring this dimension that a child is required to pay attention to something continuously. It could be music, it could be dance. See you cannot do music or dance unless you pay attention to it, you know. You'll make a fool of yourself if you do not pay enough attention. But you can pass an examination without attention. That's right. Above all, if you just, I've seen this simple thing. Children came to us, we have a Isha homeschool which is a very, run in a very different way. I one day went to the assembly of your old kids. They're all like this, like this, like this. I said, why are the kids like broken tops? Why are they shaking around like this? Then I just brought this thing. Simply every day in the morning, sarigama padanisa, fifteen minutes, everybody must do. You go there after two months, they're all sitting like this. That's all it takes. If you just make them walk in the forest in the night one night, in the darkness, you just make them walk, you will see they will become like this. Their ability to pay attention will become like that. Their sense of wonder will explode. You just take them into the jungle, make them walk for a night without torches, without cell phones, without anything. In a protected atmosphere, you will see within one night there will be tremendous transformation in the sense of wonder in the child's life. But we are making them physically incapable of these things. Sitting just in front of the computer, they will be incapable. When physically it hurts, they will protest. They will not do anything. So it's something that parents must take care of. Bringing up your child does not mean just sending him to school and getting marks and grades and nonsense. Your child, in the body and mind should grow up to full capabilities. That is when he will manifest in his life as success. A hopeless cultural and economic situation. But no systematic way of taking the rural masses to education has not been done. As part of Satguru's vision to improve the situation in rural Tamil Nadu, Isha Vidya offers affordable quality education for children to create joyful, fit and capable youth. Eight Isha Vidya schools are creating a bright future for 4,050 rural children, many of whom are first generation schoolgoers. Around 40% of the students pay a nominal fee and 60% are supported through scholarships or educational support. Midday meals with 11 essential nutrients and protein help to address malnutrition. Isha Vidya schools strive to make children understand their system computer skills while preserving their tradition and culture. In 2012, based on the success of this schooling system, the Government School adoption program was launched. The Isha Vidya team are training teachers from 31 Government schools around the state to improve children's English, provide special attention and hygiene into school life. The Government School adoption program has reached over 26,800 students around Tamil Nadu. If you have 1 billion people illiterate, uneducated, this is a huge liability for any country. If you have 1 billion educated, focused, disciplined, committed and inspired population, it could be a miracle. For the first time, we have this opportunity, this generation of people. We can take this whole mass of below poverty line 700 million people from one level of living to another in just a matter of 10 to 15 years. Never before such an opportunity has presented itself to any generation anywhere on this planet.