 Welcome back to Scorecast NX. It's Tim. It is and Jaco. Is this a playground session or a Q&A? Both. Yes. It's always playground. Hi, should we get into it? Yeah, I think, is there any reflections that we need to have on recent times? We've been a while since we've been formed. The last Q&A that went out, I listened back to it and you sounded rough as guts. It was something where it snowed, you were proper sick. Yeah, fever. You were struggling. I went after that. That was a Thursday. Friday I was then actually off work. In bed. Two coats on. Joey's special. Two coats. And shivering under the duvet. And then would wake up hot. Yeah, my voice wasn't great. Since then, we've had some amazing guests. Gifted us with their knowledge and presence on the playground sessions. As we record this live now, some of those aren't yet out. But when this goes out, they will be out if that makes sense. There is some knowledge to be had. Yes, and why the excitement. Right. But today, we are talking about muscle-ups and helping you solve your muscle-up problems. So there's quite a few things going on in the muscle-up. We've got a lot of questions about them. Yeah, sit tight, because... And your ears back. This could go on. I've got a coffee. We're going to try and keep this to the 20-minute mark. No promises. So the first sort of specific question coming in from Candice, who's actually Candice. Hello, Candice, if you're watching. Has been to one of our workshops in London, and it was great to see her progression just during the workshop, as well as, like, going on from there. Stopped with any compliments? Did she kick us off in the way that we've become accustomed? Not really, by the looks of it. No, she didn't. You've done well, Candice, because she came to the workshop, that obviously was a compliment in itself. Yeah, which has meant that it's ended up in the... It's been chewed out by our... Hi, Tim, I think you're amazing. And the best coach I've ever seen. And I love everything you do. And I also watch the Instagram video about muscle-ups. And I'll slightly paraphrase that her... Problem that she's realised is that her shoulder posture is compromising her pull-up position and the pull-up being that sort of first phase of the muscle-up, whether it's on the ring or the bar, it's the first phase, we've got to do that pull-first. And how can she work on improving that... Or can she... It was more, actually, it was a redefining possible question, I would say. She was asking, is it possible to get those pull-up mechanics back if she's had poor posture for such a long period of time, she's talking about sitting at a desk, which is a lot of that sort of stuff for all of us do. Not all of us, but most of us do. So, can she get some help with the start of her muscle-up being phase one, the pull-up, and how can go about improving that posture? Or even it'd be a good one, because if other people weren't beginning, now listening and going, oh, I don't know, is mine short. How can someone identify his shoulder posture and issue for them, and then what can we do about it and how that affects the pull? I think that's a great question. I've just laid that on you there, haven't I? Shall I? Yes, sit back and enjoy this. I'm going to make some notes. Candice, you can take heart and some comfort that you are probably within 95% pit situation with the rest of the population. I don't phrase that very well. You are probably in the same situation as 95% of the population. Having worked as a strength conditioning coach for 10 years, there are very few people that I see that don't have some form of shoulder dysfunction, shoulder postural problems. But from me, when we look at movement quality, it might be that there's some issues going on and we might call that a movement compensation, movement dysfunction, but essentially posture is what it often comes down to. Everyone's different, though, as well. Structurally, in terms of our skeleton, not everyone has to look the actual same in terms of what's perfect posture for that. We like to take anatomy textbook and we see symmetrical bone structure. The reality is, if you peel back the skin of 10 different people, the scalp will be slightly different shapes. The size of the fossa on the scalp where the human head sits, that will be slightly different. Bone lengths are different. Everyone's got some individual variations in what they're just built like. Everyone's beautiful on the inside. That's what I like to say. I've got this thing, actually. Beautiful on the inside, but I'm fairly squeamish. There's surgical programs where someone's scalpel-ing somebody. I've watched my own, when I had my shoulder operation done, I had a camera put in and they gave me a regional block so I could watch what was happening on TV. If it's happening to me, I'm all right with it. But if I watch somebody, especially plastic surgeries where they're sucking fat out of people, it's that properly I have to turn it off. I'm a bit soft with stuff like that. I can't handle horror movies either. I had a problem with my rear end one time. Yes! Sit back! What happened, Dave? I had to lie on my side because someone put a camera in me to see what was going on in my intestines and I was able to enjoy the view on the TV screen. I thought you were going to say something. You told me this story. You didn't give you much warning, did you? When the camera was... It was just a week of my life where three different people inserted their finger. You told me. You didn't give you a countdown, did you? I can't remember that. I thought you were lying there all of a sudden. I don't know what it is. It's actually tickling your belly. Good news is it was all fine. But we're all beautiful on the inside. Even you're intestine. I've seen me on this. So you contradict your end point. Back to muscle ups. Crikey, we've just lost half of your audience. Are we keeping that in? Yeah, that was brilliant. We all like to think we move in a perfect way but posture is all perfect. Reality is that it's not. You've got to understand what your basic structure is. However, that doesn't give us an excuse to get away with poor posture because we can optimise it. A lot of what you touched on is something that people struggle with today. Sitting at desks, driving, watching too much Netflix, playing too much Xbox, whatever. All of those things tend to bring us into these slouch positions. Shoulders internally rotate. The scapula is around the ribcage. Shortens the muscles on the anterior or the front of the chest and shoulders and it lengthens the ones at the back. That's really important from a mechanics and force production side which is going to be critical to your muscle up. But that's the first part of understanding where is my sitting shoulder posture links in with thoracic spine. You're probably sat there now going, Crack it, that sounds like a lot. But to undo it is massively possible and you can make definite improvements. One of the tests that we used to give yourself a bit of a gauge of where you are is if you were to go and stand up against a wall feet flat against it and then just bring your hands in front of you and then just lift your thumbs up to see if you can touch the wall with your arms straight. Whether your arms stay straight and how far you get to the wall whilst making sure that your ribcage doesn't pop up and lift up away from the pelvis that's going to give you a rough indication of what the shoulder length is like or sorry the shoulder mobility is like and where your potential restrictions are. And the other one is can you sit into a deep squat with your hands overhead. We call that an overhead squat position, unloaded with no bars but if you look at yourself side on a mirror and you're in that squat position, you try and keep your hands up do you find that the arms are sort of falling forward and they're not on a nice straight line of the torso. That's going to give you a bit of an idea about whether you've actually got some decent range of movement. The second part of that then comes onto what you're going to do about improving the posture if you have got that but do you want to talk about that? I just first wanted to say there's three men and four qualified doctors. Going backstage. He wasn't yet. Because I got caught up in this like years ago when I first started getting into the whole S&C world and learning a bit more about going from being a rugby player not bothered about posture just did I play well at the weekend. You have to say that tighter is better because you feel like you're going to hit somebody in your mind. In my mind as a sea coach I'm going out to recipe for disaster. But then coming out of that and going into something where it was actually what your shoulder like Candice has noticed like your posture or shoulder flexibility but it's where we call it is restricting your ability to do this new cool cast. Don't you want to do like a flag or handstand whatever it is. But the important thing is that I got caught up in then trying to what we said right at the beginning going and like what's full range what's perfect and trying to chase that perfect rather than going if you've got a bit of and it's a bit of restriction if you make that a little bit better it's going to it doesn't have to be perfect for you to then be able to do if you're struggling with pull-ups and muscle-up doesn't have to be perfect for you to then be able to do it for it to be good enough and safe enough for you to be able to go muscle-ups about tracking your progress and working on just improving it gradually and like those two tests you said is going to give you some feedback straight away you've shown before you can make changes within a session let alone over the course of weeks and months. There was a time when you were doing quite a lot of work on your shoulder posture you were struggling with a few niggles weren't you but like literally he just couldn't leave himself alone every time I sat with him you would sit there and you've got this like shepherd's crook thing which I still like you like but you sat there the whole time like feeling like trying to release muscle-ups it's like when you've never done maybe yourself Dave if you've never done and you like self-myofascial release so self like massage and then introduces it to you and you do a bit and you go crikey that feels better and you find these trigger points and then you get upset like I've just got probably quite an obsessive mind and then it's like I'm not going to find all these trigger points they spend all day finding endless days of trigger points let me finish off on that one so once we've kind of got an understanding of where posture is we need to start to think about changing it so there's a couple of things I would suggest you have a look at one of them is going to try and increase the range of movement that you've got in your pecs as a priority we've got some exercises in our beginner's guide and we cover these quite a lot in the different e-books of exercises or strategies which you can use to start to improve shoulder range of movement so that could be using a tennis ball putting it up against the wall or on the floor or on a squat rack and placing it over the front of the the deltoid on the front of the shoulder and the pec having to hunt around until you find something which feels lumpy gristly, painful that's a trigger point where we've got quite a bit of tension accumulated in the muscle using the tennis ball as a source of pressure on that is just like going to get a sports massage or seeing a physio where they would just release it with their hands, we're just doing it for free and it's something we can do on a sessional basis I'm going to give Steve Bateman a shout out for this one who's sports therapist course leader at University Staffordshire who we're doing some work with and he was saying as well you really want to kind of get towards a tendon stage of that as well so get towards the ends of the muscles and that's where often you can find some of that tightness that's a great little tip for the belly of the muscle to go after the connective tissue another one to think about is lats and posterior shoulder so lying on the side or on your back and just hunting around anywhere where your lap runs side of the ribcage, back of the shoulder corner of the armpit, you don't want to go into the armpit but on the back edge of it is pretty safe and have a look for the videos on those because once you can see where we're trying to get to with a tennis ball or a lacrosse ball it massively helps and then so that would be one thing to start to decrease from the tightness we can then use some stretches to start also mobility exercises to start to loosen or increase that range of movement the foam rolling or the self-myofascial release using trigger point borsa release trigger points doesn't actually make the muscle longer it just decreases the tension at which it's sitting at so we can then use a mobility exercise to start to increase that range of movement and my last thing before that Dave I can see it's itching to jump in on this I've just got one little thing on mobility? I think it'll be I'm guessing I think it's going to go on top so once we've loosened off that anterior shoulder the things that are internally rotating the shoulders our job is to strengthen the muscles which have got long and to hold that muscle or hold that joint in place so that's going to be our rhomboids our mid-low trapezius our rotator cuff all the things we're starting to actually hold the shoulder into a more neutral position so it's just a posture to balance it out you've got to get the right length tension relationship so the right muscle length on the front and then we've got to do something on the back to strengthen to hold that if we miss that activation phase the body is just going to go back to what it knows because it hasn't got anything to actually to structurally keep it in a better position and some of that exercise like the YTW is something that would be good for activation wise building maybe on top of the YTW making it a bit more specific to the actual pull-up position I was going to suggest and Tim will be able to hit us with the statfrix I don't know if it's something we had about retraction at the top of a pull-up that if you've done some nice work releasing off and then YTWs to get a bit of activation but then actually going into your pull-up and maybe use a band to assist you so you can actually comfortably hold the top really work on making sure you lift your chest and actually get some of that retraction happening and get those shoulders back peel them back but get a bit of an isometric strength like so hold a little bit at the top really feel the shoulders squeezing together behind you like you're holding a pound coin between them and then slowly lower down you could use the strongest band you ever want but just to get you going through the range but actually starting to be aware of what's your shoulder position like at the top of that movement because it's often at the top where we really round forward get yourself used to pulling them back once you've loosened off the front and you've activated a little bit around the back just to finish off that sort of a bit of a corrective exercise what it's for the thing we must of which is a bit unique in calisthenics is that we're taking the shoulder through full range of movement so the hand over the head full shoulder flexion we're going to finish in a dip it's not quite full shoulder extension but relatively we've come quite a long range of movement so because of the nature of the shoulder joint, gluteal humoral joint we need that range of movement because we want it to move smoothly we need the humor the bone in the upper arm articulate nicely around the shoulder so it actually can create good quality movement some of you will be sat there going to stop talking about posture boys like boring I don't want to stretch we put this movement preparation phase in the beginning of our framework because it is so important because if you're trying to do a muscle up and you haven't got access to the range of movement that you need either two things are going to happen one, you're going to achieve it a muscle up but it's going to look grotty and sooner or later that movement pattern you'll get injured, pretty confident with that or two, you're not going to be able to achieve the position at all because you can't move through the range of movement that's required and that happens a lot on the rings which we'll talk about particularly so when you're pulling through if we can get the shoulder into a good posture position one it's safer, it's going to produce more force because it's more stable and we're also going to decrease our risk of injury and put more force down if we can do those things then if you need more reason to focus on your posture basically towards the muscle up I've got more and I think the nice thing about and I've banged on about this recently I feel like people like you say, people sometimes being a bit bored of I couldn't touch my toes my hamstring was that tight and I pulled my hamstrings between the both and probably ten times but I didn't make that connection in my head probably a bit tight, like do some stretching do some mobility work boring, like we didn't want to do it but if you're in that position if you switch your mind around going like it's going to help me unlock or it's going to help me be able to do this cool thing I want to do but you're trying to do a muscle up and it's that that's restricting you and it gives you that motivation to stay actually consistent because that's the thing with mobility work an improving range, you need to be consistent it's not about doing it once so it really does help you stay focused and motivated to actually adhere to doing some consistently it brings us on nicely to the next question which was and we've got actually quite a few of them so I'm going to just put them all together around this transition phase in the muscle up and it's relevant for both bar and rings, it's the bit of the whether it's not a bar, it's the bit of the muscle up that people find the hardest, so we've got the first phase of a muscle up, the pull second phase, the transition from the end of a pull up to the start of a deep dip and that's the bit that people find the hardest and some people ask it a variety of questions asking about why is it that part so difficult and I wanted to sort of kick off that with the whole mobility that range because it just goes on nicely from what you just said getting into that deep dip position where we have got internal rotation of the shoulder and internal extension where people are typically and that's restricting them getting into that shape I actually said before, when you're finishing your dip position, you're actually not in full extension but you're right, through that transition you've got to hit full extension in the shoulder and then you've got to press back out so you're going from full flexion, full extension I've started to I don't know if I am pictorial or visual learner but I'm starting to think of the muscle up, these three phases like three bars I've got a pull up at the bottom which is like a bar a little bar on top of which is the transition and then another bar which is the dip and what I want to try and do is take my pull up as high as I can and bring my dip as low as I can to squeeze the distance for my transition as small as possible to make that most difficult bit the easiest bit so the higher my pull up the deeper my dip the easier the transition part becomes and there's that if you are tight in through your shoulders you won't be able to get high in your pull up and you won't be able to get deep in your dip but it's also strength, if you're not strong enough getting high, not strong enough getting deep into a dip there's two things that need to go together but it is definitely my theory and it is, make the most difficult bit as easy as possible the irony of that is if you can increase the pulling power so you get high above the bar, you don't need to dip as low but that actually becomes quite important if you want to put multiple reps of muscle up together having that deep dip position in the locker is great because as you get tired you're going to progressively pull less high not as high above the bar and therefore you're going to want to access that deep dip position and that's relevant in both the bar and the ring that's the point where if people pick up niggles and issues around the shoulder doing muscle ups it's not the top of their pull as they go into that dip as they go forward, if they haven't got room the head of the human shoots forward and that's when we start to get some issues if you go back to what we were talking about before if you sat because we've been a lot of desk work and computer work on it we've got this round shoulder position if we then go from a pull up position we pull high, we need to transition which means flicking the elbow behind the body into extension that's going to roll the humour head forwards if you're super tight in the front of the shoulder and you haven't got much strength to stabilise the shoulder that's what we're talking about that humour head is allowed to move around where it wants it just rams itself into the front of the socket so now it's actually not in a great position at all there's compensations around the shoulder it's not stable because the musculature at the back isn't supporting the scapula well either and now we're in a really nasty position this is when we see people learn to muscle up the sender's videos, particularly in the bar and we see what has kind of seemed to be accepted term as the chicken wing because what's happening in a bar muscle up is when you pull high we then to get into the transition we need to effectively throw our head and shoulders over the bar so we can shift our weight distribution on top of the bar there's something I really like about this in my mind, it encourages people to train with a proper progression rather than just going through a chicken wing kind of muscle which is one arm above and one arm below and then they wrestle with it and all of a sudden the other arm comes up on top I'm sort of my guess for educated guests would be for most people the chicken wing is their non-dominant arm which is the arm left below the bar so if you pull up my right arm goes over it creates the right position, the bottom arm my left arm, the one that's stuck below the bar is the one which then gets stuck the reason for that is because as a child or as a grown-up you've done a lot of work throwing which is into a rotation of the shoulder so we cock the arm and then we throw, if I try and throw my right arm I can throw way further and grab the ball in my left arm so actually I don't have the motor skill or the speed in that into a rotation to be able to actually throw a ball so on a muscle when I pull high it's logical that just neuroly I'm not connected to the point where I can actually create enough speed in that split second that I'm above the bar to get that left arm above it and go over so if you're going to just try without a band for example as a useful progression to try and nail that muscle up all you have to do is leave the ego behind get a resistance band on and train with enough support from the band or assistance so that actually means you can fire both arms at the same time the body loves symmetry where as soon as we've got asymmetry in a position, in a shoulder, in a posture in a movement that is not controlled like a muscle, it's happening at speed when with force you're asking for issues the body is like this asymmetry does not go well for your own shoulder health because I learnt badly and I was like come out of it and the tension in that position bicep is just going nuts and you come out of it like I did a muscle up but we call it a chicken wing because it literally feels like you're going to snap it off like you're pulling a chicken wing off a leg so I don't know where my point of that is but train with progression and understand that your job is to get above the bar quickly but you've got to move with quality otherwise it's not beautiful as train the muscle with one arm alone, one above is not beautiful and that, it's almost seamless because the final question was around we put a YouTube video out why you can't muscle up and it was all about particularly for the bar, that speed and that's what the final question is from John who says he's asking about speed training how do you build up his eyes to go I don't actually I only have one speed why is it important how does he actually go about doing it effectively like you said before a lot of people go I can do 15 pull ups but I can't do muscle up but the pull up is slow but you haven't created enough velocity to get high enough above the bar to give yourself the biomechanical advantage to be able to actually shift body position and forget his name came to a class in Nottingham on two weeks ago and he was really close to the bar muscle up does a lot of climbing so he's like good at pull ups and I asked him what he did in his training he was like he does 15 kilo pull ups but really slow he's doing really controlled 5 seconds up, 5 seconds up but I was like 5 seconds up, 5 seconds down with 15 kilo I was like that's been good you need to start doing it fast you want to start doing it fast what did you meet there was a question when I did an Instagram live this week where it was like should I train fast depends what you want if you want to do a fast movement you need to train fast if you want to be super slow in control if you want to hold a static position like a lever or a human flag you need to practice staying still so he did do some fast pull ups do some weighted ones but try and move it fast and then do some fast pulls with a band and then I thought he might do it the following week but I don't want to pressure him I said do that for two weeks then he came back a week later in one week so it was just wasn't training the stimulus that he needed what he was lacking was lacking speed there's a really interesting bit about that if you've never really trained that if you're not moving quickly you expose yourself to a neural stimulus like speed or skill the body just goes sweet I thought you wanted me to move slow yeah if you're a 100 meter sprinter or something where you've done a lot of speed training trying to eke out another tenth is flipping hard but if you've never trained speed you're going to make massive improvements in a very short period of time it's just neutrally teaching the brain to create force faster so there's some quick wins there I think it's definitely it's that signalling isn't it a bit like the patterning work when we talk about hand balancing you can make a change really quickly because you're learning whereas building genuine strength because of what's actually going on at a cellular level takes time from a strength and conditioning perspective we're working on what we call a linear periodization but we're trying to peak towards a major event the job would be to go out, add some basic capacity within that and then we have a phase called specific strength before we move into competition prep specific strength would be our strength like typically a maximum strength type work so that would fall into doing pull ups with heavy weighted so you're trying to increase how you put down a lot of force and then we get competition ready by just training speed because power is going to be the one thing which in a lot of sports differentiates people in between the opposition so you've gone through those phases and if you've got those things in place when you've come to train speed you've just put an icicle on the cake you've got all the things that you need you've just got to train those now to move quickly so it makes sense that it's a real simple progression I think you're going to give an absolute beauty on here because I didn't know that you were going to say that but let's then go give that periodized model someone's starting so that activation work the stabilization work because actually that works beautiful for a muscle up so how many weeks would typically stay in each one what might that look like really loosely ok so Dave's added on there really loosely because my next point was people have written whole books about periodization so in a nutshell is it like for four weeks or is it one week? 3, 1 and 10 to reinforce what you've talked about today posture work, movement preparation mobility work, release work improving your shoulders capacity to move through range of movement, that's consistent that happens from day one to muscle up graduation the first stage of that would be some stabilization work so it's just starting to get the shoulder moving well, activated and I'll throw some basic strength in there what you like at body weight rows start getting some decent pull up strength within you so can you start to build those numbers up a little bit let's simplify and just go that's a general preparation phase get your pull ups nailed, get some horizontal rows nailed down because they're going to be good for your shoulder posture rather than just pulling vertically all the time don't worry too much about the specific attributes for muscle up, you need to be able to pull up you need to be able to dip and I'll just do something which is going to keep the posture looking tidy 8 to 12 reps, 3 to 4 sets and that might be for 4 weeks depending on where you're starting and that's all relative so it could be 4 weeks, you might spend if you can't do a single pull up or a dip you're going to spend 3 months in that preparation phase where it becomes individualized but you're going to have a block off time I then start moving towards going right I need to move at speed so I've never trained heavy pull ups before I can do 10 pull ups so I'm going to put some weighted vest on, I'm going to put a weight belt on and I'm going to start doing work I'm going to feel like I'm moving slow because I've got heavy weight on but I'm trying to move fast that cue there is really important because of training impulse I would have to do the same with my dips I would start at that phase to start to program a bit of the transition so it might be that I'm starting to practice a negative on the transition or an eccentric just to start to learn that movement pattern I would throw in a little bit of maybe some banded work as well in the movement pattern just again to start to teach that assistance your main focus would be on that building that maximal strength so 3 to 5 reps 3 to 6 sets depending on what you want to work on how long would that block again? it depends but I've probably put 6 weeks together you'd be doing pretty well depending on where you're starting from if you already got some of these attributes you can shrink these down you can be selective of your stages and then the last bit is really just to start the magic bit is the bit where you're going to go this is now movement specific so our competition variation would be very specific to what we're trying to do so we've got some wheelchair races that we're prepping for competition at the moment it very much looks as much as possible like wheelchair racing we want our train now to look like muscle ups so the job then is to take that strength that you've developed and now train the body to get fast so in your pull ups you want to start pulling as high above the bar as you can so if you can get the bar to your rib cage even better hips you want to practice that don't worry about the transition because when you start a muscle up when you start pulling high if you're thinking about completing the muscle up you're already worried about the transition the same happens in a clean or a snatch you're already starting thinking about it you want to break those movements down as well so get high above the bar start just getting comfortable once you can dip that's not the hard bit, dip is fairly easy and then we have a nice little bit where you can start to get some we call it post activation potentiation work but you go heavy pull up so take that sort of like 5, 4 rep max, 3 rep max heavy pull up with some extra weight on do a set of those give yourself a minute get a band on which is going to catapult you upwards but like Jaco said if you want to be fast you've got to train fast but what we're then going to do is use the band to complete that high pull position you don't need to worry about the transition the band needs to be thick it needs to be leave the ego it's not like a band that means it feels okay it's a band that makes you feel like you're moving so fast that it's too easy it's that type of speed what we're getting with that combination is the brain is getting a stimulus of heavy weight it's getting used to producing high amounts of force and then all of us get everything shooting and then what we do is you change the environment and go put that same kind of force down but now in a position where I can move explosively it'd be the same as going heavy back squat, vertical jump same kind of complex and I think there's a line there write that down and sell that those that are making notes you've got yourself a little periodised plan if you don't want to write that down that is all and more in the muscle book but we're talking about a power movement we're talking for this combination between force and velocity and we need to be somewhere in between if we're going to be able to do both is that alright, that's a nutshell and it might be that if that equation for power it's four times faster and you go you know what Tim I am actually the fastest guy in the world and genuinely you are the fastest puller-upper in the world then you might need to train the strength part more but that's very likely that 99% of people it's going to go even more it's the missing the velocity part of that equation so train the thing you're weaker my last point before we go and we're getting signals to wrap it up is you've got to go from dead hang don't pull from short range you've got to open out into that setup position you've got to allow yourself to go into full extension overhead and be able to create force from the bottom position so when you finish your pull ups don't finish in the end you need to go all the way down dead hang, active hang and then restart the movement because that's what's going to happen you've got to wrap out multiple reps and I would say whether you're training pull ups, muscle ups even if you don't do calisthenics you do something else go through full range of motion always, forever amen I feel like it like and a lot of sand going through full range yeah so we did and it was good it was good well there is I hope you've enjoyed that as a whistle stop saw off some muscle ups and some common problems that we're seeing go back and have a look at what you're doing film yourself doing them, work out what your sticking points are take your time, leave your ego at the door train effectively and progressively if you haven't answered your muscle problems or your muscle questions then send them into us, comment below with those it'll be something we've never heard because I think we've covered everything when we wrote the muscle book we put a lot into it and if you like science give it a read there is in two sections but they've said if you've got a question about muscle ups and it's not covered in the muscle book then it's not a question about muscle ups because we literally put everything we know that's in there and it covers both the ring and the bar so check it out so I think we've been coming on journey we've talked, we've reflected we've talked about you being violated we went deep didn't we I don't know where that came from but it was amazing I intentionally said that so now how have we had to keep it in the edit otherwise people go date and violate what's that about it's going to be probably its whole own section right, that could be next week's Q&A send questions in about that actually violation questions so when I was experienced that it felt my pain I think there'd be plenty of people out there whether you would have missed it on camera to you does this thing make you drink beforehand to sort of clear the airways then until next time