 And really what they do is understand the brand so deeply, and the product so deeply, as well as pop culture that we're able to move really, really quickly with them. So, you have a really interesting and varied background. I would love to kind of understand your journey from kind of your origin story feel like all the way to now as CMO of Intuit Mailchimp. Yeah, certainly not a straight path, right? So, I'm originally from Israel. I spent two years in the intelligence force there, mandatory military service. For lack of better words, I fell in love with how people make decisions and just try and understand that. And so, against all my parents' wishes, I decided to not go to law school and study product design. I went to the UK, did my undergrad there, interned for some high-end design firms, realized they were doing cool stuff that wasn't necessarily based off of what I now know as consumer insight. And I am so passionate about. And so, went to work for a company that touched people's everyday lives at the time New Balance in Boston designing shoes. I still joke that I look, well I shouldn't joke, but I look at people from the ground up because I'm really intrigued by their shoes. And there I learned a lot about commercialization and bringing products to market and P&L's and brands and managing a business. CPG at Unilever spent quite a few years there launching iconic brands in new markets, launching new brands, working on challenger brands. But really wanted to move to a digital company where digital marketing was moving so much quicker. Was humbled to move to Intuit to relaunch and reposition QuickBooks as a global brand where you can run your business, rather than just accounting software as we were expanding out to a suite of tools. From there took on product marketing and market research and about 18 months ago took over the Intuit MailChimp CMO role as we acquired MailChimp. Intuit MailChimp feels like it's gone on a bit of a journey because I remember it as kind of a B2B brand. But it feels that it's broadened out in recent years and kind of actually much more of a sort of consumer play. Really it's about, we talked to humans and over time historically this brand has been focused on entrepreneurs and growing small businesses and empowering the underdog. And we sort of took that and added to it the intent to create momentum for every ambition and go up market. And to do that we have continuously sort of fueled what is so special about this brand which is, we like to think about it as high growth with a soul or the Nike of SaaS. So you want to truly talk to your customers on and off platform and what that means which may look like a consumer brand is we're thinking about our advanced marketers when they're in their inspiration moments, when they're not necessarily in the work. And what we find is that marketers, and we're a skeptical bunch, they like to spend, there are two things that sort of move them. One is creativity and then when they're in the business it's all about the business. And so when we're talking to them about the business we're talking to them about our advanced AI functionality and segmentation and all of the nuts and bolts of how we make them successful from a revenue and customer perspective. And certainly doing much more with less in these days. And then when we're off platform we think about what is it about creativity that gets them excited. How do we pop into pop culture in a way that is very natural for us and very distinctive. So if it's New York Fashion Week where we launch a capsule with five up and coming black designers and really taught our audience how to launch yourself on such a big platform with educational tools. I love that. Okay, so if I understand it correctly, we think about sort of B2B but you've kind of gone, let's think about them more holistically. Let's talk about humans. You use the word human which obviously I product design background I guess. It's actually thinking about that. So that world is human centered design is like the big focus. Did you think about kind of your role and marketing it into a MailChimp? How does that kind of idea of sort of customer centricity play into it? How do you build sort of marketing? Yeah, well first of all as a company we are customer obsessed. Everything we do starts with the customer. But as we think about customers we're looking into what are they facing day to day? What are they fearful about? What are they happy about? Where do they engage when they're like I said off platform and on platform. We think about not only you know creating awareness and consideration and obviously conversion but we also think about moments in product. I'll give you an example. Our brand we tend to be a very bright yellow and a sea of blues and greens of B2B. Taking a break is not something that's natural to us. And so providing that sort of little break, little moment of laughter, little moment of connection. That's what we think about end to end. And then in turn creates retention and active use and nurturing of a different kind. So it's a game. Love it. You mentioned earlier an exhibition at Design Museum. All these things, it feels like making the brand kind of culturally relevant. For sure. Like what else are you doing to kind of ensure kind of the brand pops up in culture? So we constantly, our teams are constantly ingrained in what's happening in culture. We truly believe that the intersection of culture and conversion is one that we need to be on to break through. We also believe that as a brand that's marketing to marketers, we need to stand out and provide an example for marketers of what it's like to build a great brand, why brand building is important. So we'll do anything from create content for historically underrepresented groups to really help them sort of bloom like bloom season that just launched our second season this month or content that helps you extend your business, grow your sales. We'll also help you understand, how do you essentially utilize your first party data? We talk a lot about the current recession or the current environment where marketers forever are getting told to do more with less. However, if you take that data from your sales throughout the year and you utilize it to further segment to provide insights, you understand who your high value customers are, you try to resell to them, cross sell, nurture. Right? We know that your current customers, it costs 5X to get new customers versus retain and upsell to your current customers. And if you're smart about utilizing that data, you can make your paid media then more efficient because you're starting to create bigger, lookalike pools. And so just starting to help them understand the holistic marketing funnel and all of the tools at their fingertips. And then lastly, we're living in an amazing era of AI where as marketers, the first thing that we've had to do is figure out who's our target and focus. So it's a fun time to be a marketer for sure. Absolutely. So I get a sense of your continuously kind of looking ahead. So as you think about Intuit Mail, Trimban and the next five years, what is next for you? What's kind of occupying your mind? Yeah, I think we just launched a survey and some research with Forrester. And what the research suggests, it's really interesting. Everybody's talking about AI. We see in the research that nine out of 10 marketers would agree and say that AI is going to grow their business and is going to be a key contributor to that growth. However, we only see 50% of them using AI. And about 50% of them would say that the first challenge that they have is scale. So I think that the next few years will be about how do we expand those AI capabilities to really unleash that scale for them. We're the number one email and marketing automation platform in the world. What that means, other than an amazing claim, is that with the billions of emails that we send a day, we have the largest database of data. And so when we talk about AI, it's only really as good as the data that it sits on. And so for me, it's just that opportunity of unlocking the insights in industries. So understanding how do we provide the best subject lines, the best content that's generated, the most efficient attribution and tools so marketers can run at speed. So I did want to ask about Wink, because I saw one at-age in-house agency of the year. So tell me about that in its formation and its focus. So Wink is our secret sauce. They are a group of 40 creatives that are phenomenal, but they truly believe that creativity can change the world, and especially the world of business. And so they do everything from the relaunch of our website that we saw last September, to our Guess Let's Sell More campaign, to activations like the New York Fashion Week, or the London Design Museum. And really what they do is understand the brand so deeply, and the product so deeply, as well as pop culture, that we're able to move really, really quickly with them. And it's been a really interesting process for me, having never worked with an in-house agency. We launched them formally about a year and a half ago, but they've been in existence for about three years. And they just continue to move so quickly. And talk about AI and tools. We've used so many, in so many of our sessions, we've had very quick conversations about this concept could look like this. Five minutes later, you know, there's an image from mid-journey that helps us all sort of concept and understand together. So it's really been helpful and impactful and creating very quick and agile work for us. I love creative people. Some of my best friends are creative. But what I always find, there is always a, it's difficult because they operate and think differently. And so when you put them inside a corporate structure, sometimes it's hard for that structure to kind of absorb creative people and their way of being. How do you ensure or even protect the creative people in your team? Such a good question. I think first and foremost, you take risks. You know, Annie Burke has a book, Thinking in Bets, and she talks about thinking in small bets and sort of, and I think that was my strategy coming in with this team of if we could take small bets and get wins that compounded, it would build on the confidence on both sides and it would create psychological safety. And it did, I remember one of the first things that we did was we, there was a HubSpot conference in Boston and we decided that we were going to color Boston yellow. And so we bought all of the out-of-home outside the conference. We also took all the calves and sort of made them yellow, are yellow. And in the cows we had videos, both inspirational and product videos, because it was very targeted for mid-market marketers, which we were going after. And it rained the whole time of people and we gave them free rides from their hotel to the conference. And it was just such a creative way to get ourselves out there. And it got the juices flowing so quickly and it was done in two weeks. Includes of media buying. Very, very quick, right? This ability to concept and then also take bets that then pay off. And then I think there's also what I'm finding is that the creatives, one, really like knowing what's going on with the business. So they like to know what happened once they launched. And oftentimes they don't get that other side or they get very little. And then the other pieces, they're really close to our media teams because they're part of the same team. And so when an idea like the Boston Idea comes up, it's very quickly a conversation down the hallway of, hey, what do you think about this? And so thinking about the next generation of marketer, like what one piece of advice would you give to an up-and-coming CMO? Proceed and be bold. Just, you know, take action and don't play it safe. I love it. Don't play it safe. Great advice. Yeah. Thank you very much. Thank you.