 I have the exclusive and I don't do a lot of these right Todd. We're life Never here. We got life. All right Hey, everyone. This is Todd Latoury from Queens Rike and world-renowned producer Zeus. We're here with the legendary Jimmy Kay from Guys take it away Jimmy. All right, so Todd I know that sponsored by Rejoice in the suffering And you know what guys I'll show you this right off before we begin. I know it has nothing to do with Queens, right? I just got this. Okay. This is like insane It's exactly James. Do a holy diver. Oh, it's like the real issue remaster. Look at it. It's like a book Oh, it doesn't it have I think it has another new mix on it. Yes, it does Fantastic, I just a little product placement and thank you very much to the team that sent this out to me Just want to say thank you. It's beautiful. I highly recommend anybody who's a Ronnie James duo fan pick this up brought to you by Holy diver folks. I got about Queens, right? Let's talk about let's talk about that. Holy diver Well, whatever you need to know I'm here. We ever want to deviate to this look at that cover. Look at that That's sick. Yeah, look at that Who would you know? I want to store. I watched a story about the guy that painted that Who wanted I think he like got in water and had a photograph and then basically painted himself in this water like It wasn't just like oh, I have a concept in my mind like the guy actually did stuff and then painted it You know kind of gave gave him the start for that Guy Zeus the question is who's the evil one that was is it the demon mankind of the priest Who's the priest right the priest? Yeah, probably, you know, is he punishing that guy for doing some wrongdoing right? There's always another story to everything. Hey. Hey, Jimmy, you know what this is, right? You go under somebody's arms. You do that That's called a full Nelson. Yeah, you know what this is with one arm. No called a half Nelson, you know what this is That's called that's called father Nelson Zeus it's a pleasure having on the show. I hear this is an exclusive Getting you, you know, look you're in the production chair there. I see all the lights flickering behind you Todd has graced this room before and when he had the the cast Yeah, who else is recorded in that room well actually this room not not too many actually Some of the guys and he then have been in here some of the guys of revocation have been in here But this is my home studio. Hey, breed Well, I mean I've recorded all those people but not necessarily in this room, you know, I had an old I had a studio about 12 years ago That was more of a commercial studio that most of those bands recorded in But I do all my mixing and mastering in here All right, so just to give name everyone a couple of bands that you've either mixed or you've produced or you've mastered These nighter for the love of metal. Correct. Yeah. Yep. I mastered that overkill the wings of war Just the ones that people really know I make that. Yeah a few sanctuary albums, correct Correct. Yeah, I did the last record with of sanctuary with war old Dane Yeah, so that that was a trip working with war old you've done ice earth stuff, which is yeah I did some I did a record with with iced earth All right, Rob zombie, of course. I'm gonna be up to the last record with him So all my stuff actually one album that I think that I really always loved and I didn't always you until actually I looked it up yesterday. It's Huntress. You know, yeah, our bound beast. Yes. Yes I did starbound beast and that was a special record, too. I thought that they were super unique and Jill and Jill Janice just had a unique voice and a unique take. She was almost like the female Ronnie James deal on that record to me Zenith is probably the all-time one of the greatest videos and one of the greatest songs ever Recorded and performed. I don't know if you've heard it Todd Zenith by Huntress buddy after this show you put it on put on that video. It's just It's everything I love, you know great music very iron maiden ish in a way, but still its own, right? Yeah, I'll check it out All right guys, so band I guess Todd we could both ask zoo some questions. Sure. Oh boy Yeah, yeah, I guess we could just kind of riff off and I want to start off with For people who don't know what the producers role is today versus yesterday I mean in the olden days it used to be the guy who had the big budget arranged the team You know sort of sometimes he was very hands-on other times He was very sort of shadowing the band in a sense But what is the producer doing today when somebody says hey Zeus you're the producer of this album. What does that mean? Well, like you were just saying back in the day you could start off with the producer just made sure the schedule was running good and Got the band to the studio on time Made sure that they had food, you know all that kind of stuff like this like almost like a manager Or delegating Delegating roles to the engineers or right? Yeah, that kind of stuff then it started to turn into okay Now you're working with the songs But he had an engineer right so He would work with the like the Beatles they had an engineer that was also kind of like a producer But then you know, they also had a producer that solely worked on the songs And then it kind of you know, that's a change but morphed and it all depends on who you are You know, sometimes you're the producer working with the songs, but you're the engineer as well So you've got to be the guy that's figuring out all the technical stuff with the equipment and the mic placement and the choices and Getting the sounds that the producer You know in the band want to achieve but you're also the producer so you can kind of cut Down the time With getting to that goal Okay, so do you have snacks for Todd? That's what I want to know If you ever wanted to refuse to make any snacks for Todd, that's what you're telling me right no snacks So so anyways, you know the way that I did it was was I just tried to learn how to do it all at one time So when a band hires me They talked to me about what they want to do and then all the way down to here's your physical CD or Whatever, but also let me interject because Zeus Zeus lives in the New England area out of Massachusetts He was in Heavy bands as a guitar player, but he also plays bass. He does some key stuff, but Having a producer that can actually grab that guitar and say what about this chord? What about this progression? If you don't play an instrument and you're trying to say well now something, you know It's hard to translate that idea to a musician when you're not one I don't know how to show you but I hear it in my head Zeus is able to take that instrument and actually play Those guitar parts, I mean, oh or hey when you're going dig dig it in dig it in dig it in You know, what if you don't get it and did it and did it and did it and did it and done done done done done done done done Right he can I can probably show you that yeah, and it makes it it just makes it a More easy process and fluid when you're talking about how to write a part or changing a part And I don't know how many producers out there also Are ins or our musicians, I'm sure many are but I know that some aren't Yeah, and I think that that's also an added bonus as well All right, so let's break it down for it There's a lot of miss miss communication or misconception of what these are defined these these sort of like stages of making an album Are right, okay, so there's the performance or actually I shouldn't say before the performance the setup Well, my king and all that before that before that you got a pre-production you need to have the song Okay, so okay, what's demos? Okay, the demo start with it with a drum beat. It could start with one guitar riff Mm-hmm. It could start with one little la la la vocal part and the chicken before the egg You never know how it's it's what's gonna make that Pre-production we'll call this pre-production Pre-production that's not pre-production would be when when you have your songs sort of almost there and then you go into Pre-production and it's the final like all right. What can we tweak before we have to start recording this this album or okay? So demos demos right at this stage a Todd will hand you the demo of an idea of a song What do you do with it? You say, you know, I like it. Let's work on this or what do you know? It depends on how far along that the demo of the song is like I said, it could be three guitar riffs String together with with a simple drum beat So then you have to discuss, you know, do you like those riffs? You know, what can we go? Where can we go from here? It could take a while right, but then I could get handed something that's almost finished, right? And then I'll open up the you know the conversation on Where does the song need to go in its current state? But like on the New Queens Brack record it started with from nothing From like Michael writing some riffs with Katie doing some drum beats. So we had just on take his phone He goes listen to this little la la la. He's just like a little sort of little vocal bits Yeah, sometimes we'll be hanging out and he'll think it's something and I'll go record that right now Todd if you're ever like in the middle of the night Yeah, and I know and this is real in the middle that you go I got an idea or you just woke up and you I got an idea or you just wake up and you got to put that idea down You know, it's that happens all the time, but there's times where I literally have a full song Intro verse structure core ill in my head while I'm like in bed Mm-hmm, and I'm almost like in a coma where I I can't if I move I'll lose it and I'll just I'll wake up and be like I don't remember what I had But I do remember it was a really great thing, but on my phone. I'll go to the voice recorder and I'll go Queens rake song or I'll just go song idea blah blah blah and I'll go and if it's a Guitar thing I'll talk the guitar Or I'll go I'll create the click track And then I'll talk the guitar part or if I have a melody I'll go chorus melody idea Like yeah, one of the songs we get it on right here on the melody or when we're songwriting Zeus will say get on there and just blah blah it and I'll literally go out there and go Down and down about a beat in battle do the bye-bye Go ahead Let's hear this. Let's hear this sucker. Let's go That's one of my We were driving in the car and Any had something I go. Let's record it right now. It's good. It's good. Okay All right, so we define the demo stage and then now we're moving to okay The band says we want an album. So now we're going to pre-production, right? Let's define that Okay, well and hold on you want to go? You can take over but what he's missing is we have demos a Did we record our demos? Because that's how we did it on other stuff on this record True Zeus was a part of the writing Sessions and he recorded the demos So that meant that meant that pre-production Was more streamlined because we we caught out the fat as we're creating like oh, I don't like that versus Me writing something and then showing it everybody a demo and they're like, uh, I don't like the bridge We already knew that the musical Parts were there and so I just wanted to get to that then we actually get to the recording after Sorry, go ahead chris. I just want to say well Todd's correct like Say on the verdict, okay They had more chunks of music written, but they were they weren't really songs yet So when we went into pre-production I had to figure out with the band like how to make the songs And it was a lot more work whereas this time They brought me in from square one. So like Todd was saying We weeded out all that crap As we went so when it came down to we did have about a week of pre-production And it was like I can remember doing the email like this is it like we got to Work out the majority of the kinks and we actually talked about I think What needed to be worked out because we all kind of knew at that point And we're referring to the you're referring to the new album now, right? Yeah, we're referring to the new album And I think the hardest part with the new album was Choosing the songs because we had a lot of good stuff this time Yeah, we had like 20 23 24 songs song ideas Song ideas I would say yeah, some of them might have been not as far along but But but they could have been probably made into a song. So at some point Yeah, go ahead at some point we had to exuse was like guys we have to Commit and pick the songs and then we'll refine those and if there's a chunk from something else that we really loved We can try to find a way to incorporate it, but it's hard to commit to just You know those songs to but we also have to think about like how the album is going to be So sometimes there was a choice on picking a song. It's not that it was better than another one It was like, all right. Well, we need a up like a faster-paced song on the record Because we have like six mid tempo songs, you know We didn't we don't want it to turn into this like mid tempo boredom And that that's another good point too. I mean Todd. We're talking about this the other day I mean, you know, you want to have a variety of different keys. You want to have a variety of tempo you want to have a variety of You know genres or maybe in a sense, right or sub genres So that's important to pick like in the overall, you know And then and then jimmy once once we've picked the songs And and i'm skipping ahead. We'll go back to the recording process, but Then you get into sequencing which we can talk about but yeah, there are key things where you say Here's a here's a heavy hitter right out of the gate. Here's another one. Here's another one You say man that next one that we thought would be the combo Starts out in a different key and it rubs you wrong Shit because you wanted it to flow with the key that the song ends in that goes into the next song You want to have this flow? That's that's all but we're jumping ahead. You're jumping way ahead Todd Well We're back to demo And now we've defined what's what right right zoos In right the songs that you kind of want to and that's your job right Sort of being that third party and saying, you know what guys you thought that was a good idea But I don't think it's such a good idea I mean Where do you draw the line between the band tells you what to do and you tell them what to do? I mean it comes down sometimes to something that I really believe in i'll i'll keep on it I'll I'll keep on them about it, but a lot of times I think it just gets worked out amongst everybody But yeah, there's some times where I mean there was even a few times where we had some choruses on on the record that I was just like it's not good enough We got to revisit it and that's hard sometimes because You get it in your in your mind. You're so used to hearing that old chorus How do you like shut that off and rewrite another chorus? Yeah Todd you Todd do you lose perspective? You're here one song over and over and over again You don't even know if it's good or not anymore sometimes Sometimes but you know when when something is good It hits you in a special way and you and and If the next day or the next day or the next day or a week later It's you're still like no man. This is solid. Then you go with it I mean, yeah, you want to critique yourself and you're always going to second guess things Because you know that there are other options But at some point you got to put the paintbrush down and go this is the best I've got for this And you just fucking move on. Yeah, you got to just you got to accept it and move on because you can always write another song You know, uh, there's a Canadian band here called tragically hip and uh, and um They created their own studio and they go we're gonna create our own studio back in the day And then we'll have all the time in the world To create our to make our album. But what they realized was when you have all the time in the world, you'll never done Zeus is important to have a start and a finish date on a project It is it gets to a point where you gotta have an end An end gain Even if you're like at the you know the the burr bring the candle at and then I've worked with I've worked with some musicians where they're still working on their stuff Yeah, I'll tell you what When when Zeus was down here right before we went out on the Judas Priest tour All his stuff was packed And we we were doing rehearsals in Tampa I was still cutting vocal tracks To finish up some loose ends Even some lead vocals Like the night before he had to tear all his stuff down. I mean he went to bed at three four in the morning It was like down to the last literally the last second Because the record label has a deadline you have you have there's a lot of stuff that goes involved behind the scenes Not just well, we'll put it out whenever we want. Well, you there are deadlines and commitments and tours routed around a release date So if we didn't put this thing out We we wouldn't be doing the touring that's already scheduled to support the record Yada yada, so there's a lot of things involved deadlines are good deadlines are good You have to commit to it But obviously if you know that that it's totally not ready You got to say it's just not ready which we've done before, you know, so When you get to a certain point like on this record, we knew that we could complete it But it was just going to be down to the wire You know, all right now now you're gonna mic stuff and you're gonna, you know Find the amps and the sound the tone of the guitar and maybe the sound of the vocals or the drums, right? so now you're into sort of We'll call it pre-production getting into the studio or you know Fitting everything so everyone sounds the way they want How much is that you and how much is that the band? So Todd, you know, you're taught I want you to sing in the bathroom, you know to get that extra acoustic or We don't do that. Well, it really like we we all discuss it together, but I bring up, you know They kind of default to me because I'm the one that's got to figure it all out with the Equipment and what it's needed and all that stuff, but like this time We did some pre-production or I'm sorry not pre-production some writing sessions in in a mansion Um in Clearwater at Paul Cogan's old house. I remember that. Yes. Yeah. I think you might have did a An interview. Yes. Yes. Yes. So we were like working there And they have this huge ass room. That's just simply amazing and I said to Todd I was like we have to do our the drums here Yeah This is gotta happen. We need to make this happen And and the kind folks that that own the house let let us go there to record the drums But it's probably some of the best drum sounds I've ever gotten And by the way To all the jackoffs out there that think they're fake or they're all sound replaced. Trust me There's a mic on the top and bottom of every drum There's so many microphones and and mic preamps for each mic and everything is dialed in so he gets He wouldn't waste all this time doing all this miking exactly if you're going to replace it So everything that you hear is 400 percent real All right, Todd before you answer this next question and the question is going to be Did you did you uh Participate in sort of the drumming. I know you're you're a drummer. You're a accomplished drummer But wait, don't answer yet. I just want to ask everybody I know that that's watching. Okay. Where are you watching the show from what city what country? We would just want to say a quick hello, but Todd answered as people get typing I'm sitting in my garage in st. Petersburg, florida and uh Yeah, that's well the question is sorry. I should I should let me rephrase that the question is No masking the people watching you're saying julie julie's indianapolis rob is from burlington Oh, I thought you were they were asking. No, no, no pepe is in norway. We got ben in greenwich new york We got denison oregon. We got Intel gen watching at home in baltimore. We got manic in india My apologies. Go ahead rain on your parade portland main Christine is in pennsylvania jeffreys and cornelias kev is in michigan rick is In alabama and cirrus is in london and i'm gonna ask you the question now Todd You're a drummer. You're accomplished drummer last time on this album. I believe you did the drum work Did you feel did did you part did you do any of the drum work on this album or was it strictly casey? It was it was a 100% casey The only thing I was involved with any drumming were just Ideas like oh man. I thought of a cool thing here and I might talk it to casey Just as a creative input idea or I would get on the drums and show them the part that I was hearing And if he liked it or the band liked it or whatever it might have been implemented. If not, it wasn't So I did not play one single drum hit nothing. This is a hundred percent casey I was just um a co a co collaborator as is everyone in the band with ideas. That's it Got it zoos When uh, when todd steps up to the microphone Do you want him to find his own voice like more than to sort of fit into that sort of queens rike? Legacy sound I mean you can say it just say it Absolutely Because because because what I'm hearing off the new song forest. I'm hearing like It's 100 cod la torii. That's what I'm hearing. You know exactly like I actually I mean Talking about the new song like I had him re-sing the chorus Like towards the end. That was one of the things I thought he could do it better I thought he could do it more intimate am I right or wrong Yeah, especially when it went to the uh the pre-chorus the I can't feel you all around I was doing it a little more um full voice And he wanted it more breathy and soft and so we went back Went back and read sang those parts We changed the microphone from the normal mic that that we use to Uh, just a different one that just is a little bit more delicate with picking up stuff Way more delicate and and it gives you that just Really intimate up close like you can hear the saliva in your mouth if you move your mouth like it's it's so sensitive Yeah, it's crazy that when you're doing that that breathy I can't you can hear the You can hear the air and we wanted that spacious quality for example on forest and all the bvs the Ah It created this different sound that the other might airy very airy. Yeah But no back to the original question like I mean I I think from the first record that I worked on with queens right to the new one I think he's come into his own a lot more on this one um just from being in the band longer, you know and and Just the way the songs were written and what was called for and all that stuff, but Absolutely, you know and and I'm gonna say something about this new song forest It kind of threw me for a loop. That's the kind of music I like I just I like you know when bands go out of the box and zoos and maybe went away in it the band did go out of the box and And it created and actually I like the song when I heard it on audio But then when I put the video on then it was more impactful It just it just brought it to another level story. Yeah You know, there's loss and I think Todd was telling me there's a connection with all the fans, you know about that loss People everybody's lost somebody, right? That song came together was kind of magical it started with just uh michael had a guitar progression And whenever we were reviewing the songs We we would come back to that and be like man, that that's what were we calling it? Uh Lioness. Yeah lioness or something. We had we everything every song had a working title Yeah, we needed we don't go song on song too because you'll never remember so we all lioness We always have a there's always another name for a queen's rights song So anyways, um I remember we started working On that song again and everybody was present and the ideas were just flowing out. It was crazy like even the uh the uh There's a piano part that you did. Yeah, and it was and it was when we were we were demoing and and He's like I got this idea for these notes and we just you know, like it's just magical It's just well, you know the original song had this thing and I had michael's guitar with a slide And I did the We that you kind of hear in the intro That was for like another structure of an acoustic thing we had going on And michael was like, yeah, I really like that and then as I was we're working on the pre-chorus the I can't feel you all around kasey came up with that melody for the he would go So the drummer becomes the singer I see right Yeah Everybody in the band it has like some sort of musical sense of other people's instruments. So it's not like right We all And that solo man that michael welton solo is great. Is that like a key change right in the middle of the solo? Or what is he doing? He's going up a third or what is he doing there zoos? I don't I don't like There's a key. There's a key change there. I actually at one point if that part was longer, but That's and that was all that was all vocals the vocals used to be Twice as long right so michael we said hey What if you play the guitar part? What have you played the vocal part on guitar and then I answer you? And we just shortened the vocal into half as long so that became the guitar solo and the vocal just became a tag Just like a little passing part. Yeah, so everybody was watching. What do you think about the new song? Are you is it a sort of a nice? Because there's those hardcore fans right those hardcore queens rake fans who are saying you know what it Always, you know queen of the rake kind of too. Yeah, but there's also the opposite and we've been hearing her for years How come you guys don't write like a silent lucidity type of song or a Roads to madness or it's always something and you know what we always kind of chuckles. We're like, all right We'll give you one of those Yeah, and it comes around but then then the same people there's there's that group of people that I gotta Talk shit and then they talk shit about it's like well, you were just asking for that for years Or the last for it and then you give it and they're like this doesn't even compare to Yeah Who does tonlatori think he is Cool story bro. Show me your songs. Yeah, let's see what you got. Let's see what you can do Or what you've written I gotta you know, you know when they say everything's been done and everything, you know all the same chords When you listen to this song you say, you know what? Something new has been done. I mean, of course, it's metal. Of course, it's hard rock. Of course, there's a There's sounds that you're familiar with but it's a new Great, it's a nice song. It's a really nice song. You know what I you know what I got a touch on this This is one of my favorite songs on the whole record by the way yeah What I love about this song Is the space You know zeus will be driving in the car and we'll be it'll be satellite radio and it'll be And then he'll change it and it'll be like ricky don't lose that It will be like yeah We're like dude, this is where it's at. It's spacious. It's mature. There's layering It's not linear and on 11 the whole time. There's peaks and valleys and In love not that sometimes you don't want to hear we love that stuff. We love that I love that kind of stuff too, but sometimes it's like all right enough of that Right. And so this song to me has space It's it's a mature piece of music. It's it's simple, but it's very effective. It's profound Um, and I love the space the spatial qualities about it To me is just such a refreshing change from the constant sing high notes or chug the guitars or like that's all fine and good, but The beauty of queen's rake is the backyard is pretty big And we can do stuff like this and it's not even though it might have thrown you for a loop I I get that but it's not but a good loop, but it's not but it's not cutting it It's still within the boundaries of the yard that we have Right and a lot of another great thing about the band is that you know, I could suggest something really weird and odd And it would still work with the band because they've done so much in their career With experimenting and trying things and and they have a lot left in the tank. Let me tell you So, you know what? I'm a huge pink Floyd fan and you know the space on dark side of the moon and you know I wish you were here and you know, that's kind of that's there Right, I mean, but then you have Todd's voice that changes it up a little bit, right? It's but still hearing those deep tones of Todd Brings it Todd's really very versatile as a singer as I mean Yeah, he is like we actually have these games where I'll I'll call out a singer or a song and he'll do it Mm-hmm like to the T Okay, all right. I was gonna suggest a few we've actually have some videos on we have we have them recorded They'll be like hey Todd, you know, I'm feeling a little green day on this. Give me a little Philly Joe Armstrong and I'll And I'll do something in that sound. Hey real quick. Um You were talking about Ah, shit. I just had a really pink flight pink Floyd. So if you listen to the song like us and them, right? It's And them I'm singing in a falsetto breathy voice. So is Gilmore. It's not this Loud full. It's it's a there's a a reservation. There's a softness and there's space And for me, this is a little reminiscent of that ballpark That I love so much about pink Floyd and that queen's rake does it just works, you know and uh And how are you going to say something very sad without really turning up all the heat and all those crying inflections that are very queen's rakey To me, I didn't feel that delivery and that would have been contrived if I sang it like People would think jeff tape might have sang that song. That's not what I felt. I sang that song Exact and we delivered it Exactly how we felt it. So it is it is very authentic in that sense Zeus, oh, how does this In contrast to in extremis am I pronouncing it right in extremist extremist in extremist What was so tell me about, you know, the performance in an extremist versus this song like a forest Well, he just he just answered that question kind of like it's but I want your answer I mean pretty much what he said it's a more intimate delivery and and it's in a different register It all that stuff. It's just it's a completely different animal whereas in extremist was like, all right Get your get your pipes warmed up You know the vocal gymnastics, you know smoke a couple more cigarettes and shit Like that get that get that get that shit going Todd in extremist the lyrics like just a little background on that the theme So that song um again, you know, I write dark content. I don't usually write happy sounding stuff That song is about Being on your deathbed and you're in the hospital. Your hearing is the last sense to go when you pass away So it's about being From their perspective. They think that you're you you're uh Not responsive that you maybe probably can't hear them that you're you're just you're laying there They're talking to you, but you're not responding. So it's inside of your head All of these, you know, if you push on your eyeballs and you you'll see this kaleidoscope of color And it's kind of like so when I say prisms Will deceive you when you start to fade do not fear Prison no longer astray no longer strangled by the rules of the game because you're about to leave this world That's what those are about um In the chorus it says by my side come closer if you can I'm near the end say goodbye I'll still be listening. Don't you cry? So it's it's as much as people will be like, oh, this is just generic metal 101 These are people that need you to not only feed them But chew the food for them You have to feel back the layers of the onion queen trike is so much deeper than just scribbling some words down And I don't need to tell you everything that every what every line means That's part of art. You figure it out. I'm not going to do the work for you but That song has a profound meaning um A silent room that's the the bridge a silent room with solitude Playing your final hand with nothing more that they can do. Do you know where you stand? In other words Your terminal Now it's palliative care. There's nothing more they can do How were you as a human being in this world? Do you have regrets? Will people remember you fondly? Will they speak well of you? What's your legacy as a human being? That's what that stuff means. So that's a there's a lot more Well, also you got to remember too like the words have to have to work when you're singing melodies and when you're singing them In in the composition Like you could you could write like that's why like when you listen to rushes lyrics or like some you know some bands it's like How the heck did they think of? those melodies and those parts with those words It's mind-blowing actually The right word to set off the right sort of emotional response You could have a line written and and try your idea And you get to the last word and it's like it's got to be more syllables or it's got it just doesn't work Or it doesn't have yeah, if there's a very aggressive thing And i've said this example a thousand times in interviews, but if you're using the word cut Right, if it's a piece of music that's aggressive or it's got this bite to it You want words that are Those sounds Those plosives right those very cutting cutting and he's a cut right Versus soft Puh, buh muh fuh those are Very soft and fluffy words. They're the sound it doesn't Do that doesn't it doesn't roll off the tongue correctly doesn't bite So so we're mindful of all those things like in forest I might have said another thing and it was too like It had this cutting quality that went against the lyric that went against The the context of what the the lyrics were about so like in that second verse That that song started i'm seguing but that song started because I was thinking of someone alone In like a cabin, let's say In the woods at their Sipping on something and they're shrouded in their blanket or their robe and they're looking out and it's kind of gloomy And the leaves are falling and they're somber and they're remembering their mother or their father whoever that passed away And that's where the leaves blow away. There they go there. Okay when you get to the second verse It says uh seasons they change don't you know or nice and slow? Don't you know the tides rolling in ebb and flow can swallow you then let you go and I always had in my mind this Rough tumbling in a wave and then it shoots you out and you're It's very serene and the madness is over it just ate you up and flushed you out and you're alone So I had to think of words that Work with that kind of flow. So there's a lot more that goes into just oh, here's some cool words Or the soul is right Is the is the the way the word sounds right then you get into the delivery Or you could have a word that needs you could have something it needs more than one syllable And uh, you can turn it into Seven syllables like howard jones He says what is love Anyway, he turned one a one syllable word into seven or eight So yeah, you know a lot of that stuff goes into the vocals. I just wanted to add add that no no It's fascinating. Uh, you know and and I guess it's the producer's job to sort of you know When you're swing a little too off or correct right on point to just make sure you're you're on course, right? Yeah, uh Zeus um And actually to Todd I mean like actually I'm just going off topic here because just as you're talking about this I was thinking about this doctor who he had a patient and he wrote a whole book on this afterlife where his patient was dying And he was in another room with I guess a family member and that convert that that patient was dead basically Somehow absorbed the conversation of this other person in another room And the doctor was so blown away by this how the dead person when they came out of death They knew exactly what was happening or heard in the other room It's to your point when you hear your hearing is you know when you're dying what it's in extremis is about Yeah That's kind of like what the words are saying in that song. Yeah, like I'll still I can still hear you But I know you're taking it a step further and saying they were pronounced They're pronounced clinically dead where that patient and I guess maybe I'm not setting this up, right? There's a patient in one ride in one room that died And the doctor who was seeing that patient went to talk to let's say the the family member in another in another room And somehow that person came out of it And actually repeated the conversation of the other person in the other room Look, maybe they were speaking loud enough that the guy could hear maybe There was some kind of transcendence that science doesn't understand yet. I don't know but they're interesting concepts for sure and look That's a claim and I just I just I just and then the doctor he was so he was so blown away by what happened that he started Talking to other people who had the same similar experience and he wrote a book and I don't remember his name But that's what I just thought of when you told me no, but you know, what's interesting That song created this dialogue and when you're going Where are you gonna go with that? Zeus is the rest of the album sort of this loose concept of I don't know if it's death, but it's morning. It's It's sadness. It's darkness. Is it the rest of the album? Whatever you can tell me. I mean Todd, what would you say? I wouldn't say well because he's the main, you know, he's the main lyricist, you know I got it. I got it. You know look I Know a lot about the songs, but there's like he explained earlier You know, he's the usually, you know, usually If I'm writing something that's grim or dark or whatever or it's the it's the the A less comfortable side of life that people try to shy away from or they don't want to go there that's where I live and and There are a lot of times I will approach it with this not a pessimistic way a very pragmatic way But then it will evolve into There's light at the end of the tunnel and forest it says Help me find a way through this maze of misery lost without a trace yesterday's a memory But whatever then it says come see me in my dreams You know, it's inviting that presence to come come see me. I'm not afraid of you come like embrace that There's another song the track listing was released today. There's another song. Yeah, I didn't look at it yet There's another song on there. Um, I'm not going to say say which song of what it's about because there's a video for that song, but um Where it really kind of talks about today's generation with this constant, um Almost like a lack of respect, you know, there's this overstepping. There's this all this This traffic and moving those millennials those millennials. Yeah, get off my lawn kid. It's all this It's all this fast-paced stuff and stopping it reflecting on things and being You know, just very kind and and and it and it taught it and it talks about this social change That's happening with People on tiktok. Look at me. They don't promote anything. You know, they just look at I look at how I look They they're there's this sense of instant. Maybe they think I I'm attractive So I'm just gonna post a selfie or I'm gonna dance in front of a camera Because I want attention everyone is so attention starved and and few of those billions of people that are on A platform like that are really promoting anything Um, and it's this influx in this bombardment And so this there's a particular song in the record that talks about it reflects on that That you know this newer Kind of age that we live in so it's not all grim It's dopamine related right these see the likes you get and it's kind of like working at you know Or going to a casino when ding ding ding ding ding the lights flashing and Approval and uh, you know, if you don't get enough likes, let me tell you something. Yes, if I didn't have If I didn't have to promote Queens rike or my music I would be I would delete my facebook today I would delete my twitter today. I'm not on instagram I'm not gonna be on instagram that as far as I can tell I don't give a shit about it I'm very thankful of the interaction and the feedback the positive feedback and the support that people give through those platforms So it's not to undermine Oh, well, you know if he didn't have it. He would write me off too. That's not what I'm saying What I'm saying is I have no need to say look at me Just because I'm I feel like I need attention. Believe me. I would rather be off the grid But because I do have this thing that I'm trying to promote and it's how I earn a living That's why I have it if I didn't have it and that's not knocking other people that don't have anything to promote That are on it that support the band or another. That's just you that's just me personally I do engage with the audience that Supports what I do That being said I really could I would be totally happy probably happier if I weren't You know involved on the grid on the grid But but to touch upon what you originally said like as far as the compositions and how the record is Yeah, there's there's a lot of variety There's a lot of ups and downs There's a there's a few surprises for sure Zeus Zeus was actually the one who said Dude, I I think I would love it. I think it would be great if you guys put forest out as the second video we always thought that Portrait on the last record should have got the love that we feel it deserved and had done a proper video But it didn't and that's okay because dark reverie was amazing that parker wrote and we did that and blah blah blah But but for this record, I think everybody was expecting another rocker And we were like, you know what? They're gonna get all that. Exactly. Let's let's really Put this out because we believe in it and it is something different. There's a million bands doing hard heavy stuff We are not we're gonna cut right through all that Because we're just doing something different on this song. And you know what? It's it's such a Important topic You I'm blown away by the support and the the feedback people are sharing their stories I just lost my mom two weeks ago. My I buried my 15 year old daughter You know a year ago all these stories that people want to share and they're grown men Man, I'm crying as I type this. Thank you. You really this is this is that's what music's all about That's what it's all about. That's what it's all about. Right? Zeus, okay We've moved from the demo stage to the pre-production stage to the performance that you're trying to get out of each member, right? Yeah, how hard do you work them? How hard is it as hard as I need to honestly like Look, it's not about like Making somebody do I always say this do 50 takes When you have everything you need and you make them do 50 more for no reason It you're just old school. You're gonna you're gonna. Well, what is it? What is it gonna achieve? It's just gonna burn somebody out make them frustrated It's like I need these people to deliver on multiple songs and you know days and days and days You know, I don't I don't need to be like our you know, obviously if I don't have what I think We need like I'll I'll definitely make somebody do it again for sure or we'll do it another day like have I say dude Right, like if I notice is if I notice his voice is starting to go after a long day of seeing things How many how many hours would would I be singing chris? I mean you could be singing four or five hours that you know all you know Continuously yeah Wow, and it's a lot of and when and when you know, we don't just say Oh, we're just gonna try to fix this like no we we try to really nail everything you're hearing is We got to do that again. It's just not good enough. Yeah There's only so much computerized techniques you can use if I'm saying even if you wanted to Yeah, but we're very authentic on queens right records That's good to know the drums are real right now like they're not they're real Yeah, yeah, that's good to know Totally tell you that and I know Todd there ain't no auto tuning. I mean if you know, I don't know if you punch stuff stuff Punch constantly Constantly punching and stuff sometimes sometimes he nails a whole thing It's perfect But it just depends. You know what I mean All right, tell tell him about the guitar amps chris Yeah, we uh This time because I'm whenever I do Another record with a with a band or artist that I've done records for in the past I'm always like what can we do that we didn't do last time so With Michael I was like, why don't we because I know he's got a ton of amps and guitars and all that stuff And not that we didn't use some of this stuff in past records, but I was like Let's not worry about here's our main guitar sound and we're gonna do this and double it and do that I was like, let's just bring in a bunch of stuff and however we're feeling for the song Let's try different things. So He started it was it was actually very fun He started bringing in all his old marshals and all his old classic amps and there was a story behind everyone He'd be like, well, this is the one that I used on the warning Or this is the one that I used on rage for water and I'd be like There's little grease pan marks On the knobs and I go are those the settings you had Like when you did that record, he's like, yep They're still on there. So it's kind of creepy It's cool. We used all of his old classic amps that he used on all of those classic records and sometimes you'd be like, okay, let's try the mine crime Marshall and the promised land Marshall and and all that didn't work. Let's try the warning Marshall And so we had these combinations and we would try them out And you know, sometimes depending on the the tuning or whatever we we were using different guitars on different sides and so it was just It was it was fun, but it was also something different And not worrying about like on the verdict. It was more We had our sound for the most part for like the rhythm like the rhythm guitars The rhythm guitars were like, okay, here's our sound and and that was you know consistent throughout the record Which a lot of times that's what I do But this time I was like who cares. Let's just try a bunch of stuff And it was great. It was it was it just made everybody kind of like I don't know Enjoy the moment more and make you want to be in the room and and record and experiment You know, we were trying different guitar pedals on this record and some of the stuff like he's been he's had sitting around Um for years like we used this flanger that he used on the lady wore black on the ep the exact same one Tell me I'd be like, well, how would you like set that up and he would like this is kind of how I would set it up and Stuff like that Zeus tell me and then Todd. Tell me tell me if you had to summarize this album sort of style To someone who completely doesn't know queens, right? What would you say? What what's this? What's what what does this album sound like if you had to compare it to something? I'll let chris it go with that. You go with uh, I mean I would say it's Well to somebody that's never heard them um That's kind of hard to explain Because I would I would say that this has like a lot of elements of all their best material all their best Well, someone who hasn't okay, let me rephrase that. That's why like I don't for somebody that has never heard them I I really don't know how to answer that. I would say It could be heavy at times it can be intimate at times Uh that you got uh in the vocal range you got it's all over the map as far as you know range Um, there's dual leads for for the guitar players out there There's really some classic creative right dueling harmony solos, but he's saying for somebody that's never So that's why this is this is very hard to answer. So i'm trying to answer what it is for the guitar nerds Yeah, there's like there's dual solos that are harmonized Uh, there's creative drumming Um, like I said the vocals, you know thought provoking lyrics, right? Yeah, there you go I mean, I really don't know else with what what else to say. Yeah Todd, what would you say to someone who's never heard of the band? This it's not easy to answer this question. Who's ever heard of the band but says what does this sound sound like? I'm curious. I'd like the best fucking band you've ever heard I would say it's a melodic hard rock band with Metal and progressive metal elements Mm-hmm. And like chris said there's there's um There's Softness and real heavy stuff and there's everything in between. So there's a nice. It's a variety When you hear like when you hear one too, huh? There's some actually some deep some interesting keyboard work on the album too, which there you go Which you know, you just did some really cool stuff You'll you'll hear that on especially one song where it's it's uh prominent Yeah I don't have the track list. I mean I it was that it was released Okay, I wish I would have called it up. Um, I don't have it on I I have the list right here if we want to just we can run down it really quick. It's uh, just see if I could find it So it's um In extremis is the album opener that everyone's heard Track number two is a song called chapters Track number three is called lost in sorrow Track four is called sick death Track five sick. Yeah one word s i s i c d e f d e f d e t h five behind the wall six nocturnal light seven out of the black eight forest nine realms 10 a song called hold on Number 11 tormentum and then the bonus track that we did Is rebel yell from billy idle. Hey, I didn't know that that's cool. Very it's very cool all right Um, okay, you know what it also did also this record has some really cool like industrial Ish, you know, uh your candy Yeah, like, you know, they that's the cool thing about queens were like you listen to rage border and they had all this like sampling and Programming and and and sequencing and stuff like that and there's there's some of that stuff in this record too and uh You know, they let me run with a lot of that kind of stuff, which is cool So, uh, I get to really bring some of that stuff into the songs. Um, why rebel yell for it But there's some interesting stuff in that Style on the record as well. Like I said, this record has a little bit of everything Um going on. Okay. Let me let me flip the question on you now Now the person has he knows the history of queens, right? He has all the albums, but he has never heard one song from this album What would you compare it to? The Sort of the back catalog of queens, right? Where does it fall? It depends what song you're Listening to I would say if you had if you took all of the songs, right? It summarizes from album one to six for sure Okay, all right. All right There's a little bit of this a little bit of that, you know, and it's not like we're like, oh, let's do this because it was You know, they did this before it was we know we don't think like that We we you know we the songs come together And sometimes, you know, we come up with an idea and and maybe later on we might be like Oh, that's kind of like rage for order type era stuff or whatever me and Todd will be, you know, cooking dinner On the grill or whatever and we'll laugh and be like, yeah, it's kind of like a little bit Ragey or something, you know and but we don't we don't go out go. Oh, we're gonna make another Killing words or whatever that that's never the case Right. Well, I could I could say one thing Yeah, and this was the first thing that I always wanted to do when I started working with the band Is get the fucking guitars back Okay, that's good. This band started with fucking guitars and guitar work That was my number one thing I wanted to do and bring back with the band and I think that we've succeeded on that I think you have too, you know, I mean come on Yeah Todd it seemed it seemed like the guitars were getting lower and lower in the mix softer in the mix to like, where are they? Where's the fucking solos? And then people were spitting on each other and phones were flying and In the mess You know, like all the cool elements of the band that everybody loved like just started to disappear So that that kind of you know concludes on what you were asking. Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. No, I and you know what? You've done great, especially the last album. I haven't heard the new album yet But I you know, I've only heard this is a great production. It's a great album And I think people look I have the special edition I've showed Todd before I don't even know if I have I don't even I don't even have that. I don't I just saw it in the store I just bought it. That's that's actually really cool Yeah, but what's what happened? What's inside it? Well, I'll open it up. There was a little bit. Let's see that the unboxing, you know, I'm still a fan too Hmm. Okay. So that would that would be the verdict the album itself. Okay. Yep. Okay. There you go There was some goodies too like like oh here. They're still here, but this is a live This is actually a bonus disc in there And I see I dream of infrared and open road and okay. Yep acoustic recording of the first two Right. Yeah, and then 46 degrees north mercury rising I didn't know that. Oh, wow. Espirado, minoru, maruto. Oh, Espiritu. Desperado So those are, hey, my Greek is better than my Spanish. You want to know you want to know what those songs are Yes So there's more. There's more and then there's Queen of the Rite enforcer prophecy and eyes of a stranger. Okay. Well, there was There was three on there. Okay that When we did the condition human record they Had all kinds of bonus songs and stuff. So that's that's fine and dandy But for the longest time for years after that record came out Nobody had heard 46 degrees north and What's the other one where Espiritu muerto? Yeah, it's right and and the other one mercury rising Which I really liked and that was those three songs were we I like those a lot actually they were They were cut, you know when we had to think of the sequence, which we're gonna probably talk about but Um, I would always go to the band, you know, where did those songs end up and somebody said Oh, one of them ended up on the vinyl release and I'm like It was an even it was a seven inch vinyl. I think in Japan. Yeah, and then I was like You know, nobody knew they existed. Nobody knew they existed. They weren't even on youtube. They're still not Right. So anyways When the conversation came up for bonus material, I was like We got to get those like those songs heard like nobody's even heard those songs. Yep So that's so I didn't even know that was on that so that there's more there's more So we got we got we got the bonus disc and the disc, but wait a second. What do we also got in here? You see that there's more stuff It's very exciting I have a pin Or a magnet. I think it's a magnet From a refrigerator. Oh Yeah, yeah, I think it's a magnet or oh, no, it's a bottle opener Is that it a beer bottle opener? Is that not one? Is that not it? Look matching carrying an add around with you. Look at that. Look at that. Hey, man. Look at me. Look at me I maybe it is a magnet too, though Me I don't know like I I think what does this do? I've never seen it. It looks like a bottle cap opener, but it may be magnetic also since it would oh wait There's some words Yeah, it's a What what what does it say there? Can you see that? I can't read that I can't read it neither can I because I can't it looks like a bottle opener Yeah, but it says it says something opener does it want to see that Should uh rob is saying should be a magnetic bottle opener So I guess you open it and then the the cap stays there, right? So there you go. Look at that. There's more Oh, wow. There's more We need one of those man. I know there's more hold on look a patch That's cool. Yeah. Yeah, and it does say queens right not backwards, but because it's Oh, no because I'm holding it like this. There you go. Look at that. I don't I don't I'm gonna put it right here I'm gonna sew it on and get my wife to sew it on right here. How about it'll be like a star track thing Yeah, wait, there's more You guys want to see what's left? Yeah. Yeah Yep, there might have been a guitar pick maybe I don't know what this is. Oh, here's the magnet This is the refrigerator magnet right here At first I thought it was like a piece of gum, but no, it's it's a it's a magnet of some sort. Nice It's nice though. So and you know what when I actually bought this It was it was like 29 bucks or something. So it was worth the good I would have bought that for 29 bucks. Yeah, it wasn't like it was like 70 dollars or something Right now probably it's worth, you know a lot more than that because It has it like man, I want it Where were we? Okay. So Zeus you've you've got everybody, you know, now you're sort of mixing right defined mixing for everybody who doesn't I know but it's taking okay. You have all your separated tracks kick drum snare drum Symbols, uh, you know Um bass guitar could be five six seven tracks of bass That combined make the final bass sound you have All your guitar parts separated, you know, michael will play a little Guitar part and there's a track there All your vocal parts you could have background vocals you could have Special effect vocals you could you know, so there's could be 60 tracks of things so then you have to combine them all into a left right final mix That you hear that everybody hears. Okay And so how do you know like you have to place everything on the Everything at the right perfect volume so that The drum sound, you know, where you think they should be relative to the guitars and the bass and the vocals and then There's eqing involved like something might need to be have more treble or more bass to it or What not or more mid-range and you have to figure out. Okay. Does that work on that instrument? And then you have to combine all the pieces together So it's a very tedious and time consuming and process Okay, and here's my final question on the mix that taught and to you You know when you listen to music when you listen back to the mix Is it does it important to have it on loudspeakers or headphones because you might lose something on headphones? Versus playing it in the car like you listen to it in the car and you go that sounds good or I'm gonna play it on loudspeakers in my house, you know, there's difference, right? There's a difference It's all tested on multiple speakers, but there's limitations to certain sets of speakers where You know, like I'm not going to mix it so that it sounds perfect on my iPhone like on a mono speaker That's filtered because the low frequencies just aren't going to show up So I'm not going to try to recreate Low frequencies that don't exist on a on a phone just to make the mix better So everything's pretty much mixed full range so that when you hear it on A decent set of speakers or your car or whatnot, it works well But then it's checked on smaller speakers, you know As you go down the levels and stuff and sometimes you might hear things Even on a phone that you didn't hear on The full range mix that you might want to check out and investigate I've done that, you know, and it's like, oh, I never would have heard that popping out so much if uh Or if something's missing, you know, if I didn't hear it on us That's a set of speakers or or whatever But for the most part it's all it's all made for a full range and then the limitations like I said of the speakers will dictate what You know, uh, you might or might not hear on those speakers like on a laptop, you know, if the speakers are tiny It's not gonna You there's some things that are going to be missing and that's just the way it is Yeah, and and Todd You know in the olden days and I don't know how old but they used to have the radio mix because the frequencies on the radio And the sound that it comes out on was different than when you're playing it at home Maybe even zoos or you can weigh in on that You know, I I think that It's interesting because in today's world People like to throw around it's so compressed and Based on what based on your laptop based on your, you know, so It's uh, you know, what I love about zoos is mixed is he does leave that headroom Where you can turn it all the way up in your car and it's not I mean unless you're speaking there's there's dynamics left in there's dynamics, you know, so um, it's nice to have that that Still have some room on the top of that mix where some people like maybe it was a popular thing where where Mixers were were just pounding the shit out of it and it sounded like everything was kind of clipping or You know that people would call it rick walling or whatever, but uh, you know, it's um I don't know the mixes he puts out are just amazing. I'm just a fan. I'm a big fan of vinyl, right? So when I was a kid listening to records The loud parts are loud the quiet parts are quiet. There's a christmas crispness to it um Everything had its place and then over the years it got to a competition within the mix of like As you as you you know compress it in turn and make it as loud as you can to compete against everybody else's stuff You you lost a lot. It's at the same time but now that um Everything is kind of reverting to like a streaming thing and whatnot that people don't realize this But if your mix is at a certain level Above a certain threshold the algorithm automatically turns it down Right off the bat So at this point What are you competing against when it's going to get turned down anyways? So, you know, there's a point where you want to you still want to be Up there with everybody else and and all that and make sure like it's not too quiet when when you're listening And that's more than all this is more of like a mastering thing anyways But yes, we we like to have a little bit of room left where Like todd said you can you can actually turn it up In your car if you want a louder and it doesn't fall apart. Yeah break. Yeah, um Here's here's my last question on the mix Do band members only hear themselves selectively and always think they're lower Then they should be so Todd's listening to the song and he goes man I'm so low and then michael's listening to the song man Why am I mix so low? Is there a so is that why the producer has to be there to tell everybody guys? You you're perfect where you are in the mix. Well, it I guess it depends on the band really I mean, I've worked with on some records where I've had the more me. I call more me guys like They just want their shit louder. Like you said more me Yeah more me like where's my fucking I'll get the notes and it's all their shit is fucking turn this up You know, I mean, oh, you're the drummer. Yeah, you want the kick louder than everything else, but anyways, um The queen's right. It's it's never been like that They're they know when it's right and when something isn't heard or is too quiet or is too loud Like it's it's an obvious thing where everybody can hear it, you know, so They're actually very you know, they've they've done this enough where When something's not right, they'll they'll say something All right, but for the most part they trust me to to make sure that it's It's it's all gonna work. Yeah, because I could see, you know, that that is a common thing You know, look at the live evil the the most famous, you know I'm too low in the mix and everybody was arguing about that. All right. Now. We're moving into a sequencing, correct Sure. Yeah, we're going from mix to sequencing and then we have mastering right mastering and sequencing is kind of the same thing really It's it's all it's all related. So I would say both of those things are the same topic So talk about sequencing. Yeah define that Well defining that is okay, like how do you want your record to open? Like what's the first thing you want people to hear? sometimes people are like You know, we we need an introduction before the record starts like a movie, you know We need like an intro or whatever sometimes. It's like let's just hit them hard right off the top boom Something fast and furious, you know, which is kind of like what we did on this record Um, you don't want to start with your ballad or your, you know, slowest song first. I mean, maybe that's been done Uh, maybe sometimes on the vinyl record It might have ended up that way where that's the first song on the second side or whatever But so you have to say, okay, here's the first song. All right. No now that goes into the next song How do you want your mood to be when you're listening and again? This is not skipping around per se It's listening to the whole thing as a whole piece of work Yeah, so What what what do you say you come out of the gate hard? Like what do you want next? You know, so and how and how many seconds Until that next song starts great great point. Like do you want to pause or do you want it to be connected where? uh, say there's a little bit of feedback at the end of the song and you want it to leak into the The very beginning of the next song and it's this one long We're not not long song, but it's linked. They're linked together Right, and then it's like, okay, you get to the middle of the album. Like, all right Did you just have like three mid tempo type songs? Do you know you might want to pick it up? So you got to think about all those elements and then you think about your clothes are like, what's the What's the a good good climax for the record? Queensrack has always had like that one song. It's like, all right, it's the ender So, you know, have we sort of over Done or metal bands have overdone the intro song I don't think so because I I have several records where there's no intro. Well, you know, I mean like that 30 second You know, that's what I'm saying. Yeah. Yeah. Well, even on on my solo record. It starts out with a swell It just there's no long Symphonic thing where I'm going come on. Okay, you know, I just wanted to but sometimes that's called for and that's what you want Do you want like this is crazy introduction and then something kicks in So it really depends on what you're going for. Maybe that's what the concept of the record is all about like We, you know, even think about in a live situation like um There's there I I'm trying to think of something off hand now where there might be like uh an intro or whatever and the band will use Hell yeah There you go Right and That's the intro of the concert as well. You know, so yeah, it's great Todd what the the the album title I actually just before but I just we got sights um What what's the album title? But what is what's what's the whole sort of meaning behind that? of the album It's actually it's actually more complicated Then I can explain it But it's it's certainly um More complicated than I'll probably sum up here But you know when we you look at the dna of the tri-rack and you're like, what does that mean? And how how are I got the garbage truck coming. Hopefully it won't be too loud. No, I don't hear it. It's good. You have you have the um This evolution of society And again, we are in a digital age. There are people that meet online that never met in person before there are people that are part of support groups online That they feel comfortable whether it's they were abused or it's substance abuse problems There's a lot of support and help with groups and things that are online People might not have the courage to go in person But there's this buffer because they're behind their computer, but they can still be part of this network There's so many things that are intertwined with The digital aspect of the title It's it's how we're evolving as a society right um The noise aspect It's pretty noisy out there. It's there's a lot happening Um social media is an example social media is is a big example If you if you took away the internet What would the What would the political divide really be like in the united states for example if you took away the internet Take away the digital age And how much People uploading cell phone footage of riots or police brutality or People attacking police or you know, all of these things that we are bombarded with So many times a day There's a lot of there's a lot happening It's a very noisy environment And then the alliance, you know, we we are queens rike and We are evolving societies are are evolving um It again, I'm probably doing a disservice to the title right at the top of my head But it's it's it's all encompassing of Of a very of society geopolitical things human nature And and the evolution of the human species and the human condition And all of that is encompassed in the lyrics of this record And and that was one of the things we loved about The album title and zeus was there coming up with the album title with us when we were talking about these concepts And he said, you know, what about this this this sounds really cool. And we were like, wow There was there was there was some comments made about And then somebody Messaged me a fan message me and he said something about the dna of the band And I kept bringing up dna not digital noise alliance, but just dna as a as a topic And michael and the guys have always said, you know, it's in our dna. They say, right, right. So I was like, I wonder if we could like Take that as and run with that somehow and it ended up working out But like so that's how it kind of started was like because of that Right, but you know the low and we were we were all like hanging we we always talk about stuff like when the session's over We hang out like my cook on the grill. We were we were we were we were in my backyard on my patio grilling out when the The digital noise alliance thing came to be and we were talking about different artwork concepts And one of the ideas was having this kind of tri rite mothership brain with some some strands hanging down almost like a jellyfish and The the the the tri rite was the was the pinnacle of of evolution and Like a guy trying to reach the summit of the tri rite as this thing And then we I'll tell you like That then we thought After we had some renderings were like that's gonna get lost in a thumbnail on a phone. Okay What about this dna thing and so our good friend, um, eric lorman Who was uh designed my tlt logo and was integral in part of the shirt that you're wearing he um he had worked on this mock-up of The dna tri rite and he sent it to me that he had never shown me But I was explaining this concept and he says what do you think of this? And he sent it to me and I was like that is bad ass and I sent it to to zoos and I go do check and michael Do check this out and we're like that's that's it So we revisited that concept and had what is now the the album cover and there's little nerve endings And that are like, you know And even even it's a living thing even the colors like we talked about like It sticks out you see a lot of blue like who does that now really it's it's it's a unique It just pops right out you boom and there's so much art What one of the things I love not to tout my own stuff But what I loved about my album cover was everybody's doing black covers and it's all dark and there's so much artwork Okay, look at that cover It's white it catches your eye The tlt is there the oroboros that was hand-drawn. It's all it's very Identifiable there's enough information there, but it's not overwhelming to the eye and this this dna logo You can see that on a thumbnail. Boom. You don't have to figure shit out. It's there And so I was just interviewing someone else. I'm not gonna name names and I go tell me about the album cover and that person goes You're gonna have to ask the artist. You know, it's kind of like it was a little Like you didn't put much thought of it. It looked cool and did look cool It's a great artwork, but he goes you have to ask the artist what the meeting behind it was We just thought it was to me. It was kind of like I was a little disappointed It should be the other way around it would the the artist should say What was your concept and I will try to convey that So the artist should have said this is exactly what it means even if it's not so literal You got to dig a little and find those connections And you know, I still love the band. I still love the band I'm just saying just saying I was a little disappointed and you know what look it's like a tattoo Sometimes you just think something looks cool. And that's what you want to get doesn't have to have some deep meaning But when you're asked either say It doesn't really we just love the way it looks and that's what he said And here and here's what you could say The attitude that emanates from this Is what we were looking for and it doesn't have any more meaning than it just has attitude And to be fair, that's kind of what he went at, you know, and and and in total respect, you know I'm not gonna make games total respect But I just kind of was just a little disappointed that they didn't put it was like you said it was the other way around It was sort of like the art dictating it to the artist right should have been the other way around So are there any songs in this album like hit the 20 minute mark? No, much longer songs 1958 is that count? Well, there's one that there's one that's kind of long because they again I don't know. There's like six seven minute eight minute songs something like that All right, there's a couple of you know, shorter ones too really it's it depends on what But when the song was being written, you know, what worked and what didn't sometimes a long song works Sometimes it's like, all right, this song got to the point and it should be done Right. Yeah, sport. All right. Yeah On that note, what do we got left in the sort of, uh, okay, we've done to sequencing We're at the mastering and then the product's done, right then the artwork, but so mastering Let's go to the mastering. So you might be hired just to do the mastering, correct? Zeus, correct, correct. I think we already kind of talked about that extensively with like I said Something the mix might need more travel more base. Uh, you got to make sure it sounds good everywhere Um, and then you got to sequence it. That's that's pretty much for mastering To polish it polish it, right? We were talking about what if the yeah, but what if it doesn't need polishing? That's that's the whole thing. But let me ask the mastering guy is is is basically the last set of years on everything He's subjective to the point where it's like, all right, this doesn't need anything It just needs to be it the songs just to meet need to be leveled out Could there be could there be instances Zeus where The mit like I know when we hear the final mix not mastered I don't hear I'm not probably going to hear a difference between the final mix and the master, but aren't there certain frequencies or these artifacts that could exist that I may not hear but if you just Do a few little things and strip some things away or do some shelf I don't know. Are there some frequency things that exist in mastering that may just Enhance the overall mix because it took some anomalies away that didn't need to be there In some circumstances. Yes. Sometimes you need to bring something out in a mix that Is is just lacking, you know our mix now when you master are there automations or are you manually riding a fader? How does that work? Well, it depends again, um, I've been in some mastering sessions where Say you need to lift the core or the chorus a little bit more. It's just not hitting you So in mastering you can you can actually raise that section on a mix Or or whatnot. So yeah, there's there could be some of that on there Like I didn't have to do any of that on on the queens the new queens record Because I already kept in mind like the course is if we're talking about that topic Needed to lift a little bit and rise a little bit in the song You know, so I didn't have to correct it later. So you could have a perfect mix You're gonna sequence the record exactly from a to z how it's gonna play it gets rendered as one complete play And as a particular type of file for example, is it one file? That's it Well, it depends on how and how your workflow is but some people like to do that where they'll don't make one long File and then chop it into parts for during the sequence You know, so that all depends on on how the mastering so how do you so how do you As a mastering guy, how do you have song number one? Song number two with a feedback that links into song number three How do you have that flow without the breakup when the song index is on the cd player in your car? For example, is that one continuous play it would that well, right? Well, that's that's when you get into the into the a separate function and part of the mastering where You have to take all the parts and id them and then that software kind of does all that stuff for you But yeah, you have all your mixes. They might be longer Like Todd said they might have you know a feedback that goes on for a minute. I might tell the band keep it going We don't know how it's gonna fade in or out later So, yeah at that stage of the game in the mastering process, you're in sequencing you would get that all correct What about uh, you know, everything's done and finished I mean, are you nervous? Are you nervous, you know, like the the the reaction the acceptance? I'm sure there is No, I I don't I don't worry about it. No, okay. All right. I would be worried. I was like, oh man I gotta I gotta question your season bro. Well, because listen that the record this is the the artist This is their songs that they wrote for this is for them Yeah, this this is an expression of them Yeah, you just hope that people like it Right. Yeah, you don't know I I have a question that I think a lot of people would want to know First for someone like Zeus. Yeah, which would be What is the pro what are the pros and cons? What what is it like? Okay, let me let me give you an example. I was an upholsterer for 25 years before I joined Queens right I also did insurance adjusting for many many years yada yada But the businesses like rooms to go I couldn't compete with redoing their furniture For what it would cost in my labor and materials to redo something So I ended up doing work for a very very high clientele that would spend $10,000 on a new sectional To have redone because it's a solid piece of furniture. Maybe it was a family heirloom, etc But I couldn't compete with the big box stores that were blowing out furniture for their living room For what just the material cost me alone let let alone labor my question to someone like you is With everyone that has their own Home recording platform their DAW right that their their workstation. They're recording What's the upside and the downside to everyone now being able to record on their own? Well, I mean it kind of you could always kind of do that even in in the day with like four track cassette recorders and stuff so he it To a certain extent you could still record your own material um And I I have no problems with any of that stuff sometimes people will release their own music and It's exactly how they want it and it's exactly what they want, but it should be what it should be and there you go And then sometimes it's not so um, but when people are getting a seasoned uh engineer mixer Producer here's the main thing really you're really getting someone's experience as well that of course. Yeah It's like having all the tools like if you put me in your studio, which I've been in many times I wouldn't there's no way I could make something sound the way that you do Well, I think it's also this When you hire somebody as a you know producer engineer, whatever And you're a musician you don't have to worry about that Because that's what other people are doing. Okay All you have to worry about is what you have to do and it takes a big load off of you And I think that's the biggest one of the biggest things that when you hire somebody else to do it You don't have to worry about it unless they're absolutely Atrocious at what they do Right. Yeah, it's interesting how many people have really great gear Um, but they just they're never going to get out of it what it can really do Even if you have good ears Knowing where to notch frequencies knowing knowing how to properly mic a drum set to get certain sounds I'm sure you've ruined a lot of stuff in the very early days where you're like damn it But that's how you that's how you know what you do. You're paying for the experience. You're you're actually you're you're 100% correct I I mean, I'm still learning. So I mean, it's it's never gonna stop But yeah, I've done some stuff like one time I taped a quarter on the drum head Where the beater would hit to get it. We heard we heard a story that that's what pantera did Right, so and everybody when when those records were coming out was like everybody wanted that kick drum sound And I and I did I did it. I put the fucking quarter on there And then when it was all done all you heard was this tick And everybody was like, what's that tick and I'm like, oh shit. Oh, well, you can't get rid of it You can't get rid of it now, man I'll never I'll never do that again But that's how you learn, right? That's how you learn. That's it. That's right. Just like any profession, right guys We've been on for an hour and a half Yeah, are there any closing remarks? Anything you guys like to say, okay, you could I put in the description you could pre-order the album Cool, uh, you know in the video description. So if anybody wants to pre-order boom you go watch the two videos that are out now Zeus if you want a lot of videos too bud Yeah, yeah, there's more comments a lot more to come so so many more videos you've got going I'm not going to tell you the number but I could tell you this We've shot more videos than I think queen's rake has ever shot for an album in their career. I think Okay All right for an album release We've got we've got videos that are going to carry us into next year And the release is in october october 7th. Yes, we go out with judas priest as well Yes, we have a proper supporting ground tour for the record also that will be happening Next year. I believe that's about a six week tour I want to say march through april mark something like that But uh, I have to look at the dates, but we're doing a good six week ground tour First part of next year We're going back out with judas priest when the album comes out um I expect that jimmy will buy two special deluxe box sets for for zeus and i since we didn't get the ones on the verdict And what else I zeus how can people get in touch with you if they you know, they're in a band and they want Google me google me and and I have a management and And you have a website that has a website. Sure. What's your website called zeusproducer.com zeus And you know what look at this. I'm gonna definitely go out and get that this week Look at this. Yeah, that's nice. It came out on vinyl too, right? I think so. Yeah, I got to hear the new mix These are this is the sort of like the tracks. Did they remix the whole record? No, there's two versions. Yes There's a remixed version and then the original mix which I think what's in the mark. What's in the box the original in a remix I I think so Maybe there's some outtakes or something right there is. I mean, what oh that it is Yeah, yeah, yeah, where'd you get that? Well, I got it from the uh, you know, they're label. Oh They sent it to me Oh, jeez. I something we didn't talk about and I know it's late and zeus has a live disc do But one of the things I We're we're talking about the state of music today If you carve out an extra five minutes guys, yeah, yeah for sure. I'm good. I'm good because you know, are there trends that everyone's seeing? Are there is anything sounding really unique and original? You know, I just thought that was an interesting topic where Again, where the song forest cut through so nicely. I gotta throw this out to you guys Okay, so there was some recent stats saying that catalog music is outselling New releases. All right, and we're talking about all genres So in other words a bands with new releases are getting less sales at least last year or last quarter then catalog music so you know, you know the old stuff so you could say A band comes out with an album today. Well, he sells 10 copies. Well That same band their catalog sold 20 copies, right? So it seems that the younger generation or the buying public Is more inclined to go back into the band's history versus take a chance On newer material not saying they don't buy new material. I'm just saying Old material seems to be ruling zeus. Do you have any thoughts? Well, I mean, I think a lot of it is is streaming like A lot of people are like, you know what? I paid $9.99 For the month and I can listen to their new record When it comes out And I like their record but what they're saying is that catalog and buying it's it's it's it's we're taking into into account streaming We're taking into account to you know buying lps CDs all the mediums that we listen to music Old music or legacy music is more popular or being bought more and stream more Than new releases. I mean, I don't know the answer to that I don't know Maybe I think a lot of it like I was just gonna get into is you can And I know it's with the catalog and it's all your the topic is about the older music um I think that now that People are maybe people might be discovering the older catalog because it's on those platforms now Is it weaker music is is the music weaker today? The the songwriting is it weaker than it was in the past and not everybody not everybody. I'm just saying in general You know I I don't I don't think so. I mean I'd listen to some newer records from from artists and bands that I think hold up very well to the old stuff I think the bar has been raised especially with metal bands in the guitarist and drummers and probably bass players I remember, you know a fast drum beat was, you know was one from metallica the kick work or Something from racer x, you know or mr. Scary from, you know docking now the You know the the meshuga and all of the extreme drumming and the footwork and A lot of younger people you're seeing these these kids that are, you know playing old engvey or Paul gilbert stuff or and you're like wow like You just didn't see that back then and you've got tutorials online I think the level the the level of the advancement of guitar players and drummers is Is way more But but is it that is the sort of guitar and vocal gymnastics actually not vocal but let's say instrument Gymnastics is that what's killing the music the newer music today? Everyone's just focusing on you know being the best and that Sort of on that instrument versus Thinking about the whole song in general Because to me the biggest difference between the olden days and today and not everyone Is the singing I mean you can every death metal singer or extreme singer they all pretty much sound the same So it's not really I know a guy That was looking is looking for A singer in a metal thing and He couldn't think of anybody Do it did I know anybody and I and I was able to name two names of possible people And I'm thinking to myself Now if this guy's band was a scrimmo kind of a thing There's a million of them, but looking for a real legit metal singer That never mind that they sing like that But then finding somebody with some unique characteristic of their voice like a warl dane or a midnight Jeff Tate Bruce Dickinson d.o. You know there are those howford. There are those guys that had that identifiable thing Now you're really Skimming the surface and looking for something That to me is kind of a dying Thing in in metal it and that's saying it doesn't exist It certainly does especially in europe. There's a lot of you know power metal bands that that do that kind of vocal but in relation to the The metal bands that are out there You hear a lot of screaming and that's really to me what I'm hearing is the weakest link the singers are the weakest link I'm hearing a lot of over playing And maybe that's why I'm resonating more towards something with some space and a little more dynamic A great musicians Doesn't mean you write great songs, but then again that's purely subjective because don't get I love extreme music You see extreme music resonates more live than it does in sort of It doesn't hold up well over the years extreme music. That's the problem. I think it's it's look it's always been the underground scene The underdog and it's very subjective. I don't think there's a right or a wrong answer But I do hear from what I'm hearing. I'm hearing a lot of over playing But wait a second. There might not be a wrong or right answer But the reality is there is a right or wrong answer because if everyone Statistically is moving towards the older catalog versus the new not saying that they don't Appreciate the new but as a as a popular global population They seem to always go back to the older stuff and and zeus Clark says the biggest difference between the old days and today is the songwriting in general How many bands that they put out songs that are still going to be around in 20 years? Well, there's truth to that for sure like Pick a song that's 20 years old and then is it still Something that people want to hear, you know, I mean Well, you also you also everybody has a different taste though. So but you also have a psychological component because When zeus and I are driving around in the car and we're listening to moonchild or somewhere in time We're those 16 year old kids that are there's a there's a psychological component not just I'm just listening to music. There's a connection with those great Days of old that we that we still embrace right? So that's why I think there's there's a There that's that that's why the back catalog. I think still is there's a connection to those people now if they've never heard it Maybe there is something to that where you know, I mean if a band put out a song like pink floyd put out a song now or led zeppelin Or queens right put out sweet sister mary now I mean Majority of people might would probably hate it. They would skip. It's like this is so long It's this Right now. So it isn't it isn't there's a cultural There's a definitely an attention span thing that's different. I might why isn't listeners have evolved like like I mean imagine when you were listening when people were only listening to like Elvis and and you know Artists like that back in the day and now listen to what music is now Yeah, I think I think the the singers used to carry the songs a lot more and the melody used to carry the songs A lot more and that at the end of the day, that's what people remember is the melody. That's why pop That's why pop is so huge. It's all about the vocal melody and there's a good there's a good groove, right in metal What I'm hearing is it's primarily the riff and the groove and you could literally mute the vocal and it It's still It's that attitude and that drive of the riff and the percussive elements that foundation Whereas like you said the aor stuff is so great because It's all this big vocal melody and I think and this is a question to zoos Do you think that the record company, you know, they have their in the olden days they had in their mind They had you know what we need a hit we need a hit We need one or two hits and the band saying no man. We want to do what we want to do That dynamic is what created the long lasting songs of the 80s and 90s, right And the 70s for that matter Is that what we're missing today somebody putting, you know The arguing that dynamic of arguing and fighting for what they believe in and sometimes it worked and sometimes it didn't back then but Is that the missing element? Don't forget the record companies there. They they want to sell the records. That's what they're for That's what that's what they do They're they want to make money to sell the product But that dynamic that arguing well, you're the dynamic you're speaking of is they might they would get in there and say You know, we're not going to be able to sell any any of this stuff because there's nothing there's nothing there for the listener that They're going to want to buy the the product But people are buying singles now. They're not buying albums. They're buying singles they're they're they're they're captured in the single People the people that are into albums or collectors people that are listening on the streaming platforms. They're listening to singles In general, okay, here's my last sort of question. I put it out to everybody out there radio All right, a song like forest you would think You would think this would be played by all the radio stations and you am at FM, right? But somehow these songs don't end up on our typical radio stations, you know our 50,000 watt radio stations in every city What's Why do we keep hearing stare at a heaven and we don't hear anything by queens rate on for it, you know Like like well, how about well, how about this? How about when a band? right like queens rike Comes out with a new record and they have songs that are comparable stylistically To back catalog stuff, but yet the radio stations play the song from 1989 So that's what you should be saying. Yeah. Yeah, why why why would they play, uh, you know Whatever song from the back catalog but not want to put on something new Yeah, you'll hear like silent lucidity played over and over again, but they'll never, you know tackle something like forest, right? Which is equivalent, right and you know what that's why dollars. That's why that's why the radio stations aren't what they used to be and That's why it's if it's pop. It'll be brand new if it's country. It'll be brand new if it's rock You got a tiny little handful of people that are getting stuff played on that not only that you got the gatekeepers on on serious or satellite or whatever You know radio like that that you got to play the game and you got to you got to schmooze You got to pay money. There's deals with the labels or however that works In order to get your stuff played unless you know You're in bed with the program director and they like you and then they'll play your stuff Strange I would start it started off as paolas. It started off with paolas Then they go, we can't have paolas anymore and it become all it came became all ethical And then suddenly went back there listen. It's still all bullshit And people are gonna listen to what they're gonna listen to And I don't even give it really any attention anymore as to Well, why don't they play our stuff? Why don't they play, you know, certain outlets will play our stuff and we're thankful but The the greater context of what we're saying is yeah journey puts out a new song You're not gonna hear it and why not But they're gonna play, you know, don't stop believing or whatever and it's like as great as those songs are It's a disservice to the band That they're saying oh, we love we love this band Here's the classic blah blah blah if you love the band you would help promote what they're doing now Because people, you know people are gonna Take in what is pushed off to them. So put out to them. So if if stations aren't really promoting What current what the bands are currently doing? It's it doesn't help the bands, you know, you know what it is. I'll even go one step further They're all see when when I was a kid Our local FM radio station, which was a Shom FM. It was independent. It was a private company And they would just go with what the people loved, you know, because they didn't have to please, you know, all the other markets It was just one market here and they pleased everyone and when everybody went wild because they love the music That was they're playing sure they put a couple of hits here and there but and then as the Stations got bought up north in North America. They all became one And statistically speaking if we place they were to heaven over and over again You know, the numbers seem to be a lot more steady than if we start Risking playing some new music, right? Just in a nutshell guys. Yeah, interesting times We hit the two-hour mark. There's a lot. There's so much great talent out there And uh, we're all just trying to make an honest living and have fun doing what we're doing Absolutely, absolutely. You guys are doing great looking forward to the rest of the album Hearing the rest of the album Zeus Phenomenal job congratulations on all the work that you do. It was a pleasure having you today And picking your brain And Todd only says great things about you by the way, he always speaks very very highly of you Just want to add that folks And thank you everyone for listening and tuning in and supporting queen's rike and the things that I'm doing and Zeus is doing and supporting the metal voice dude You're you got a you got a lot more new Likes and following, you know on your on your page. So Congrats to that your viewership is expanding really well. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you very much and thank you Oh and happy and happy Happy uh, 46th birthday 46th, I love it. I'm 54 Yesterday, yeah, we still got it on Jimmy. Thanks for having me man. All right guys