 Propaganda have you guys ever gone on phases where you try to go kind of lower protein just to see how your body responds and feels So it's good to step away for a bit I I feel good when I go low protein for a day, but I'm also going low calorie for a day So it's almost like fasting so that's the same That's my only so I've done it before where it's like that a day a couple days with that And then I've done it for extended periods of time and what I find if I start stringing consecutive days together My body just pairs down muscle. I mean I I am I will I'll lose weight But I'll lose muscle as fast as I am losing body fat when I do not hit my protein intake consistently But having a day where I take a complete break a fast type of day or just a really low calorie or low protein to a day I feel phenomenal from that. I noticed that yeah And I think it has more to do with just taking a break, you know Because if it was right if it wasn't if it was a low protein high calorie day I think I'd feel like crap, you know, I mean I Same thing Adam if I go low protein for two for, you know, three four or five days in a row I start to not feel so good. I can doubt I can definitely tell in my muscle and in my energy Protein it's as close as you can get to a magical macro nutrient They just did another study that showed that a low calorie diet. Yes, it does cause fat loss But if the low calorie diets high in protein, you get better health outcomes more fat loss You keep more muscle. You got better satiety blood lipids even look better. It's another study showing that protein Makes a very big difference. Are you telling me the bros were right again? I'm tell well the bros No, so check this out check out the study. You're so bad though. I think you like literally I think we've titled an episode why protein is not the magical supplement People can overdo it Check out the study right so this was a study the title of it was relatively high protein or low-carb energy Restricted diets for body weight loss and body weight maintenance. So this is the I'll read the abstract to you Low-carb diets have been suggested to be effective in body weight management. However These diets are relatively high in protein as well So the objective was to unravel whether body weight loss and weight maintenance depends on the high protein or the low-carb Component of the diet. So they literally took two low-carb diets But isn't that kind of obvious, right? If it's if it's if holy on the holy on the muscle is more related to lower-carb or or to higher protein No, no, so so let me break it down. Right. So they thought that sounded confusing to me They found they followed people for a year Um, who both in both groups followed a lower a low-carb low-calorie diet But the difference was one group had more protein in their diet and the other group had less protein So they had more fat, right? So the difference was the protein. They're all low-calorie all low-carb And what they found was that the higher protein intake Resulted in better outcomes and across the board more weight loss more fat loss Better now hdl Lip blood lipid, you know triglycerides look better like it was just it was healthier and better for Aestheticals related somewhat to to what I forget her name that we had on the podcast talking about like blood sugar Consistent levels Kelly Kelly. Yeah, could be because also part of that study they showed that the insulin response was better in the high So what were the controls on the protein, right? Oh, you said you said just low and then high protein So what are higher protein? So what was it was was one group under their rda? Or they above it and then one group was way above it like it because that matters right because if if one group is Grossly under eating protein and the other one is just eating adequate protein or I mean, that's pretty obvious to me, right? Yeah That's a good question. It would be different. I think it would be more compelling of a study if Both groups had at least adequate protein, but one group had higher by say 20 percent or something like that Well, here's what it is It was 15 percent of the calories from from protein versus 30 percent. Oh, okay of the calories coming from protein So double both are in deficits though. So both in deficits both low-carb But the high protein group did better and all and almost every man. I mean every matrix there was Emotional eating they did better hunger score. They did better hdl They had a larger rise a much bigger reduction in triglycerides Insulin response was better body fat percentage went down more and weight went down more From the from the high protein group. So it just it's just It's just better across the board now, of course. There's always individual variances But this really does highlight that That protein is something you should aim for especially if your calories are low If you were comparing this like as if they were two diets You would use the ketogenic diet and then what other one would you use to compare that? I think you would go high protein ketogenic or more of a low protein ketogenic like the classic ketogenic, right? Yeah, because classic ketogenic is not high protein No, and the goal of classic ketogenic just so people know it was medical It was a medically applied and the goal was to get ketones as high as possible to Treat certain medical conditions like epilepsy for example But no most people who follow these days most people are not on a ketogenic diet for medical reasons Like I don't have you guys ever met anyone doing ketogenic No, they're all doing it for fat loss for fat loss, right? They're from some biohacker. That's usually how I Find out. Yeah, exactly. Uh, it's and you know, it's funny when keto was was a big thing There was even a lot of messages about oh my god. I don't need too much protein Kick you out of ketosis. That could be a bad thing. Well, no, actually it's uh, I mean unless it's it's for medical reasons No, you want the protein to be high. So this is really it's it's just another It's another study and what I like about this is they were both low calorie and everything else was very similar The only difference was this group ate more protein than that group So is mTOR really just overhyped at this point if we're going to go back and revisit uh, some of our earlier stances of you know, some of the crazy versions of How far you can go with uh protein intake and the The dangers of that versus now like seeing how beneficial I think if you go extreme So like I let's say a guy who weighs 180 pounds, right and he's high protein would be like 180 grams of protein I look I've I've known people to go two and a half three times body weight, right But what happens with that doesn't leave much room for other Other macronutrients would you really consider 180 180 really high? I would consider that like good I wouldn't consider that for the average person. It's high Oh, okay. So I'm not talking about bodybuilder. Okay, average person They're normal because the average person grossly underconsumed. They don't get close to that. Yeah, I mean almost every Like you I mean I feel like you have this category of fitness enthusiasts and bodybuilder type people And then you have the average person the average person and like they're the difference in protein intake is well Look dramatically if you're 180 pound male and you want to eat 250 grams of protein You're probably going to be taking at least 100 grams of protein in Protein powders. Yeah, because it's really hard. So there's that extreme, right? There's that extreme and studies don't show any additional benefit from going above about a gram Per pound of body weight really I haven't seen any studies that really show too much benefit Going above that so that's when I say high protein. That's what I'm Referring to but yeah, it's just another study showing the the value of eating protein in controlling insulin and health parameters fat loss muscle Controlling satiety You know, that's the direction you want to go. I mean, I'd say it's one of the most Basic strategies that I stick to Year around like You know, I there's we just came off a bunch of vacations where you know I drank and I ate out and I enjoyed myself had desserts here and there But one of the things that I've learned has helped me through those times Is not telling myself I can't enjoy those moments can't have drinks. I'm gonna. I enjoy my drinks with my friends I'm gonna do these things But but making sure that I'm always targeting protein first and getting a protein meal Like so if I'm like, oh for example, we had cinnamon rolls one night, right? I had bought these these, you know, cheap generic cinnamon rolls and had been craving and I wanted to have those But first I wanted to I had this big old, you know, 10 ounce You know chicken chicken meal with rice before I let myself have that versus in the past You know, I'm oh, I'm already starting to get a little hungry. Oh, the cinnamon rolls are cooking I'm just gonna go crush three of those or have something else quick and then that and then or fill up on the simmer's war Instead I go, okay I'm still gonna enjoy a cinnamon roll and what ends up happening is I don't even eat a full one because I I get a couple bites of it and I'm already get that Satisfied and I'm okay because I just ate before that I I have found that strategy as one of the best ways to kind of Mitigate the weight gain over like a vacation. Totally same here. It's easy too. Yeah, it's really easy And it's not restrictive. You're not telling yourself. You can't have the drink. You can't do this You're just saying like hey, I know my body needs this much protein if I all this muscle I was working I worked my ass off for Over the earlier part of this year before I went on this little three week vacation of not really training kind of enjoying myself I don't want it to all go away because I Grossly under consume protein every single day and I make bad food choices So all I'm going to tell myself is hey how to make sure every meal you get a good serving of protein Eat that first and then hey if you want to have a drink or hey And I swear that has made the biggest difference on the swings I used to go through I was just going to say so when we did the episode with the The the dietitian who works with continued glucose monitors and I talk about how eating protein first Blunts that blood sugar and insulin response Like if you eat the protein first then go have the cinnamon rolls the crappy behavioral You know the crappy feelings you get after when that crash happens Which you might not even feel a crash You just might notice more cravings or irritability or maybe your energy is a little off, right? It helps control that so you could you still have the cinnamon rolls You just had the protein first now back to what you said justin about mTOR So I'm not an expert mTOR, but I know a little bit about it And I know mTOR is mammalian target repamycin is what it stands for and it's a it's a driver of cell growth in particular muscle growth It also can drive cancer, right? But I'm going to use an analogy because a lot of there's a lot of fear around anything that can cause cancer to grow So let's use testosterone. For example, I don't think I don't think I have to argue that having High normal levels of testosterone is healthier for men. There's Tons and tons of studies on this to show that improves quality of life If men's testosterone levels are in the high normal range They're better off when it comes to heart disease or better off when it comes to dementia Alzheimer's muscle fat mobility Quality of life libido all these different things, right? If you have a testosterone sensitive cancer Testosterone can now fuel cancer. So if I have prostate cancer And I'm in that state and and I have a super high testosterone that can actually drive The growth of that cancer. Okay. So mTOR In the context of normal is perfectly fine High mTOR in the context of cancer can definitely drive cancer, but so can carbohydrates proteins and even fat Whatever is going to feed it. Yeah. Yes because they're cells primarily. Yeah. So what they do is they say, oh my god mTOR We don't get that too high about the only thing that's going to help it is fasting it, right? Totally. So that's the problem Is they'll say oh mTOR. Oh, you know, you don't want to raise that too much because then you're going to get can't No, it doesn't work that way. Well, you just cause so many of those Alarmist articles, right? And so that's why I bring that up because it's just like it's one of those things you'll get We have this split division of like wellness people versus like performance and and you know kind of bodybuilder Sphere and so I always would would then see like wellness practitioner kind of like really mentioned Like you got to really restrict a lot of the protein intake because of this and so yeah, I I kind of had that sense It was a bit over hyped. It was just like always in Sort of the the conversation though Yeah, I think it's part of the the the whole propaganda We've talked about this the whole like everybody needs to stop eating meat propaganda Have you guys ever gone on phases where you try to go kind of lower protein just to see how your body responds It's good to step away for a bit. I I feel good when I go low protein for a day, but I'm also going low calorie for a day So it's almost like fasting. So that's the same. That's my only So I've done it before where it's like that a day a couple days with that And then I've done it for extended periods of time and what I find going back to the point I was just making with my vacation is if I do if I start stringing consecutive days together Uh, my body just pairs down muscle. I mean I I am I will I'll lose weight But I'll lose muscle as fast as I am losing body fat When I do not hit my protein intake consistently, but Having a day where I take a complete break a fast type of day or just a really low calorie or low protein to a day I feel phenomenal from that. I noticed that. Yeah, and I think it has more to do with just taking a break You know, because if it was if it wasn't if it was a low protein high calorie day I think I'd feel like crap. You know, I mean I same thing Adam If I go low protein for two for, you know, three four five days in a row I start to not feel so good. I can doubt. I can definitely tell in my muscle Um and in my energy. Yeah, I think it's just a lot of work, you know for your digestive system It's to be constantly inundating it with protein and so to step away from that and allow things to kind of You know work work their way through like so I just fast or like maybe I'll just focus on Every now and then I'll I'll be like, okay. Maybe I'm not getting a fiber I need to like, you know, really address that and then like maybe back off the protein a bit Now now that advice though I'm only giving that to other fitness enthusiasts like ourselves because I feel like for most of my career Um clients that I train Struggled to consistently hit protein. It's hard. It especially unless you're naturally like, I've had a few clients that are like Huge meat eaters They love to eat me and those tend to be the clients that are easier to hit those targets But unless you're somebody who like absolutely loves eat lots of meat, it is really tough to hit 130 150 200 grams for bigger guys like a protein well day in and day out Let's put this in context adam. So let's say the average woman weighs I don't know what the average one was to say 140 pounds I don't know if that's the average but let's just say the average woman weighs 140 pounds And a six ounce chicken breast is about 35 grams 36 ounces. So that's a good size chicken breast Yeah, you'd have to eat what 12 what 18 ounces or something like that to get 130 140 grams Maybe more. Yeah, that's a lot of chicken breast. Yeah that you'd have to how much steak would that you're talking about like four Like a a typical female is going to maybe eat one of those at each meal and that would mean she needs four of those So four of her meals need to be this big old chicken breast and then whatever carbo starch or whatever that she's going to go with that And just that's not common. No, it's not common that I would get a client to be like, oh, yeah I'm definitely knocking that out every day. No problem at 135 pound female like no So they most people and most people think they eat a lot because they they're like, oh, yeah at every meal I I tend to have a protein Well, yeah, okay Well, if you only eat on average because the average personally eats twice I had three turkey slices We'll say something like yeah, or or the mystification because the kid like I was getting I remember getting like deli sandwiches You know deli's put two to four ounces of meat on your fucking sandwich That's nothing do four ounces of turkey. I'm always double and that's a that's like a large That's a large You go to like togos or one of the like one of those sandwich places and you get a large sound It's like four ounces of meat on there and even doubled up Which is a ton feels like a ton of meat for the average for just only eight ounces. I know I always feel like I'm behind Unless that's literally what I'm targeting directly first like I need to get the meat Established and like this is the priority of the meal and then I'm going to build around that Oh boy, you're gonna love this episode. We have a special treat for you in this episode But before we do here's the giveaway maps strong strong man inspired workout great workout program for free Here's what you got to do to win maps strong. I'm going to do something a little different Go to our other mine pump channel mine pump clips Subscribe to this channel to that channel turn on notifications come back leave a comment below This particular video in the first 24 hours you do those things And we like your comment will notify you and we'll give you free access To maps strong also in this episode adam actually got you through in you did some modeling pictures back in the days They're amazing very attractive slightly erotic So check this out if this video gets a hundred thousand views in the first week He will release some of the other pictures that nobody's ever seen And I swear to god everybody you're gonna want to see these pictures. You're really gonna see these pictures So share this video make it hit a hundred thousand views in the first week So we could see adam naked hugging a bush. I'm not making it up That's a real picture that he took back in the day Also, we got a sale going on right now the rgb bundle maps anabolic mass performance maps aesthetic bundled together 50% off plus some free stuff included also map suspension is 50% off So if you're interested in any one of those go to maps fitness products.com And use the coupon code july 50. So that's july 5 0 with no space for that massive massive discount All right, here comes the show Have you guys had any of the the pork chops like I just to speaking about meat Um, like Courtney started to to make it an air fryer. You know what? Hold on. You mean the butcher box ones? Yeah, this guy's been talking about it. Are they not the best? I haven't had it yet. That's right the heritage Yeah, you've been mentioning they taste better than normal pork. Okay, so I finally had it and it was it was phenomenal How'd you cook it? So it was in the air fryer, which was uh, you know, I didn't think Anyway, she found a recipe for it. It was like it makes it really juicy And it's not like sometimes the worst part about pork if you do it wrong it gets really dry and it's like, uh, yeah So it was like perfect, but Then you guys will make fun of me for this But like and she just added a little crust of like it's like a parmesan like a cheese or something with like some garlic And I was like, oh my god is so good but yeah, so that was Like that's literally my meal today again like I like my whole meal is like Okay, now I'm gonna take the meat that we cooked last night and then I'm gonna keep You know making that the priority throughout the week is like you cook this and then I'm gonna like did you watch how she So did she actually put the crust on in the air fryer and it melted into it or after the fact? Do you remember? Um, that's a good question. I think it was I think it was afterwards Okay, where she put it in like the oven to kind of crust it. Ah, yeah, I think that's how how she did it Yeah, I'm telling you I've been saying this and I'm glad you finally tried them I still have heritage pork tastes way better than the regular stuff. I am not a pork fan at all I'm not I never like pork chops everybody. Oh, I like I never liked them. Yeah, me either then I Butcher box I don't remember when it was it was a while ago, but they had like, you know Sometimes they run like specials on certain things like add-ons. That's what his box add-ons. I'm like, all right I'll give this a shot And Jessica made them and I was I wasn't that excited. I'm all right pork whatever we'll eat it because we got it And it's one of my favorite things now. Yeah, and it just tastes different I couldn't figure out why it tastes. I thought it was the way she made it and she doesn't make it good It's the heritage pork. Well, I've told you guys that I've compared I mean, I think Doug and I both cooked the ribs this weekend. So I mean, I'm I'm pork ribs Yes, yeah and consistent with them because I've tried other since that since we like I mean, we've been working with butcher box for a few years now And there's been multiple times where I've had to go get other pork because I just didn't have it And I had already used up my butcher box pork ribs And so I wouldn't get it get this grocery store and they just not even close dude Not even close to the the butcher box. It's the I've now I'm like, I won't even cook ribs unless I have that It's their breed. Maybe Doug you can look up heritage pork versus conventional I'd like to see if they look different like what's the deal? Yeah with these it's how they're raised. No It's a breed definitely different flavor. It's a different. Oh, it's actually breed. I'm pretty sure it's different. Yeah Oh, I thought it was how they were raised. No, I know that they're raised So obviously they have different standards right butcher box like grass fed and you have to be, you know, a particular way So I know there's that but I've had no antibiotics and hormones. I've had that other pork like that It doesn't taste the same. I think it's a breed if I'm not mistaken. I don't know what you're finding, Doug an original breed of pig Found on pig farms before the industrial agricultural boom. Yeah, so it's different So it's an old can you look up a picture and see a heritage So maybe it's a combination of that of not only how they're fed and then on top of that. It's also a different breed of pig Interesting. Yeah, must be more expensive then. I mean, I why wouldn't you I think it's it's not oh, wow I have a picture here. They're they have hair. Can you just pull it up? They're a little more wild Yeah, a little more wild. Maybe yeah, maybe pull up a picture and on the on the tv Yeah, because it's it's crazy how quick that happens too. If you very like if you oh, shit They look like a domestic sheep pig. Oh, wow. Yeah, they grow hair and then tusks pretty pretty quickly. Oh all pigs Yeah, you're okay So you know that if you put if you take a you probably know this because you were around farms You take a pig and you put it in the woods. It changes like itself doesn't that like the next generation? I actually didn't know that. I didn't know that. No, no, we didn't turn into like free any pigs So I don't know, you know, I mean I do got some farm knowledge, but I mean that's like wild knowledge Yeah, there was like this one. I remember reading the story really so if you set a almost like werewolves like this Yeah, they'll grow tusks and they'll go wild on the run their body adapts that fast. Yes. There was this one Okay, that's fascinating. So there was this one world record A wild hog that was shot by a hunter and it was a massive. I remember seeing the pigs was years ago Massive looked like a bore, but it was huge. I'm like, this is crazy. I don't know they got that big But then you read the article and they're like it was a domesticated pig because they get bigger, right? The domesticated ones that that went into the woods. Yeah, and then became survival mode. Yeah Yeah, and they get really big. I know isn't that weird? That's what's weird about that is like, okay So you're like their body knows yeah, and and well even that even if it did know you would think that it would take years to adapt No, like generations of having more pigs before it finally turned into like a wild pig the fact that it like that same pig That's yeah, imagine if that happened to us like going in the woods I feel like there's some there's some Science why I live in the woods like that adaptive process like we should be able to tap into it tap into that a little bit Turn us into a superhero. Yeah Man bear pig I did not know that. Isn't that weird? Yeah, you dropped some farm knowledge on me right there Super wild. Anyway, I gotta tell you guys about a new show on Netflix that I found I don't remember the name of it Cost in our audience always whenever you give I already know which one it is because okay, so you get well Yeah, I'm just gonna guess because there's like the suggested new shows out and there's one about a sex room I'm like, this is probably up sells out. Yeah, right. It didn't get suggested to me. How weird is that? I guess I'm in that loop too. Yeah. I can't deny that so this so what it is here's the premise of the show It's actually kind of interesting. So this woman, you know all these like like home renovation shows, right? We're gonna have design like whatever, right? Anyway, this woman who's in she's a top designer Goes to these people's homes And designs a sec. She calls it a sex room now some couples just want a room That's kind of like a spa where they can connect some families or couples I say families because there's like these polyamorous groups that we're also on the show That want like specific types of sex rooms with yeah, I thought it was an smm. Yeah, kind of oh some of them are Okay, some of them are wild like there's just one group that she met with where she meets with this couple And everybody kind of looks kind of different in the show. So you're like, all right. What's the deal here? Anyway, she's talking this couple and they're like, oh, yeah, all of our we have our other partners and so I guess they're a group that they're all together it was like five or six of them And they were into some pretty voltron. They were into some pretty kinky shit. And so she asked them What are your kinks? What is this? What are that? And then she designed the room Around and then the some of the rooms are great. Like this one was like a huge This is like prime time tv bro. I know there's a huge shower in this one There's like dildos on the walls and one of them Now how much of this do you think has been accelerated because of how much like pornography has accelerated in Are you kidding me pornography's changed so many things. That's what I mean Like so, I mean Would you think that something like that even like the tv show or even the profession for someone to do this Would even exist 30 years ago Uh, I think oh not at this scale. That's my no way not at this That's what I mean enough to obviously create a show or a person who has a job that actually does this I feel like it would be like a very small demand increase after like 50 shades of gray You know that whole book that came out in the movie and like it's sort of like in the the culture now Where it's like, oh, I also think ever since pornhub with with and having access on your phone Has to have accelerated that that's had a huge impact on our culture massive impact But yeah, Jessica and I are watching this and we're just like Why would you be on a show like trying to get ideas or I mean, that's why you watch home and profit shows as they get ideas Hey, some of the rooms look some of the rooms look really cool and nice. Some of them are like, why would I walk? Wow, they have attachments for drills. Oh, they got a room. It's like like there's little like just like Honey, they seem normal. This is up and down the wall. I'm like swings everywhere At some point when the room looks silly like you come in or like, okay We've had this for a few years like this is kind of looking a little weird I don't know. Plus if you have an extra room in your house, is that the direction you want to go? I mean, is this what we're going to convert garage? It's like half that half a guest room There's a secret entrance you gotta knock a few times. Where am I sleeping? Take a left at the dildo and then you got I mean, I see something like that I just think like two people found each other that were both like, you know madly addicted to pornography for a long time That's what I think I think like, okay two people that like would want to build a room like that They were both people that at one point some of the episodes don't like that like there was one where it was a Couple and they're definitely like, you know flirty and stuff and she tries to bring out the Sexual stuff the woman who does the the interview or whatever the designer But they they were both divorced previous, you know marriages. They both brought kids into the relationship They seem like a pretty genuine like normal or whatever you want to say couple And then he proposes to her in the room that they make but the room was more of a like Spa cool chill environment, but then again, like I said, there's some episodes where you're like, this is the This is gonna get messy. Yeah, this is it. This is the This is the cage you could put your boyfriend We're gonna lay out and beat him and then this is that I'm like, oh my gosh. This is going a little That's kind of wild dude a little too far. Anyway, um, let's talk about a music a band. I should say Rock band, I guess you could say that really disappointed me in the last few years. What happened raising this machine Raging against the machine. What happened to it? They're so not they are they should be called. They should call them. They are so not raging anymore No, they are the machine now. They're the machine. We became the machine They were so counter like culture and this and that and their music and this is my same irritation with punk rock and like You know back in the day it was all about like kicking the system and and you know Challenging things and like being the one that's against the grain. Yeah, you know Now it's just like No, like all the same voices are like you have to do this conform conform conform Like whatever the cause or whatever the thing is that Culture and in government is trying to impose. It's like, oh, you need to do that step in line I mean do you expect anything different though? There are all four all four of them in there from like harvard and stuff like that. Aren't they all have no idea Yeah, they all have like ivy ivy. Really? Yeah, education. Yeah, they're all really smart Oh my god, you know, look up look up the the band's education. I'm pretty sure rage has got a really high I mean, I love their music. So when I listen to it pretend from Berkeley, right? No, I think it's harvard I think I don't know. I don't know about abolishing the supreme court. Yeah, there was like, oh, we need to abolish the supreme court Like what? Yeah, two of them are from harvard. Yeah, I don't know that. Yeah. Have you guys ever been to one of their concerts? I haven't that was a bucket list for me. I mean, I'd love raging this machine I just yeah, like you said I was bummed out because my two best friends did in vegas and I missed out on it I was supposed to go on the truck. I can't remember why I think it was working Do you want a you want to know what my kids got into what metallica? Yeah Do you know why stranger things crushing it stranger things? Okay? So not only that and then the other song that was like an 80s song I forget what the artist's name is but like where she's putting. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I don't know. I know who you're talking about So yeah, so that show has done a lot for these artists and resurrected their their popularity Wow, and so their sales went through the roof metallica sales went through the roof really New generation so the bassist now for metallica. He used to be part of suicidal tendencies His son, I believe is in stranger things like jammin with that The main guy that that's like the sort of Dungeons and Dragons master yeah So I would be so curious to be like a fly on the wall in the conversation leading up to all this Like was that the intent like was did metallica like well, so okay, so Can they all did they offer like a really good partnership or deal because they thought on the back end They were get all these crazy sales or did you did stranger things at the pay them big money? I bet you they had to pay them royalties or yeah, I bet you they approached metallica. Okay, so you don't watch stranger things, right? I actually did watch the first two seasons. Oh, you did. Yeah. Yeah or at least one and a half Why didn't you finish too scary? No, it's not my I really enjoyed all the 80s references And I thought that was fun. They crush it with that, but it kind of got old for me Yeah, so they don't have the same experience Yeah, I enjoyed it the last season. I saw just got way too outlandish. I think that's what I just got ridiculous Like once you got it saw like the the monster and stuff like that It was like the suspense leading up to seeing the monster was cool And then when you got to see it was kind of over the last season was this last one that came out I thought was cool. I mean everybody said it crashed. I heard it was good But so obviously it's in the 80s Of course really good and one of the one of the characters is like this kind of metal head Right kind of nerd type of and there's a scene where they're in the what they call it the upside down Where all the monsters are creatures are and to attract or to cause a distraction They're on the top of a mobile home and he's playing the guitar in this dark So it looks super metal looks like the cover of like a an old metal bands, you know But without you know cassette tape or whatever And the song that they play of all songs of Metallica that they pick master of puppets one of their most Like metal songs, right? Yeah, and my kids were like loving it. So now my sons listen to Metallica all the time. Like thank you Stranger Things That's kind of cool. So we're like bombing like, you know, this is one of the first songs I've worked at Yeah, so back to what you think so you think that you think that Stranger Things came after Metallica I would think so because it's kind of it's because they're doing references like in the Of course like I guarantee they had in their mind like you look up dug and tell me if they have to find a metal You know like they for that particular kind of vibe Well, imagine what a huge win that is for them. So they probably got paid on the front end Introduced a whole new generation and they got a whole new generation into their music. I mean that could have A huge what you saw what that did for clean when they were in Wayne's world, you know Oh my god, I forgot about that. That's true. That's such a good point That's why I'm asking this question because I mean we've seen this happen enough times that maybe They didn't maybe they came to them and said, hey, here's a deal like we could pay you You know or or what we maybe their fans of the show and we're like, hey, you could use our Right So I'm curious if there was some sort of a deal that well And if they kind of knew that this was potentially going to happen with such a popular show That there's a good chance that it was and exactly like Wayne's world. That's a great example We were driving we were in the car and we had all just watched the episode of Stranger Things And so I'm like, hey, do you guys know what that song is called or whatever and my daughter, you know My daughter's 12 she's like, oh, that's master of puppets. That's Metallica. Oh, it's really cool So I'm like, oh, you know, that's the first song I worked out to I said, are you have you listened to any other music in that genre from that era? Am I bought my daughter again my 12 year old? She goes There's a song about a jungle coming to the jungle Welcome to the jungle Like you listen to that too. I think you know my heart's just you know filling with pride I've been on a g&r kick lately too. I've been listening to that's great That kind of gives me hope, you know, it's like maybe like the next the generation's coming up We'll start getting back into actually like people playing instruments Well, I just like hitting buttons like In the drop I feel like rock has let me down the roast Like so I love like all genres and out of all of us. I probably listen to the most genres of music and Rock I listen to way less like I listen to new there's new hip-hop. Let's do there's new country that I listen to There's not a lot of new rock. I listen to I go back to older rock. It's been pretty dry It's I have not found and I know you've thrown a couple of my way and there's a couple of fleets Yeah, there's a few that I have on my on my on my playlist that I kind of like but I mean there hasn't been Metallica, g&r a pantera. There hasn't been a band like that. I bet you'll see it now You think so now with this new generation. It seems like it's I've okay, so I hope so I hope you'll bring back something that will be that iconic that people listen to it for throwing in reverse Like uh, I guess they're they're crushing right now. Is it like a zombie one the one? Yeah, okay Yeah, well when I was in uh, uh, vegas recently. I saw A few old school Metal shirts like the concert. Oh, okay. Well, that's super popular right now, which is I think funny and trendy Yeah, but there's kids that are rocking that shirt. You give that like target. Yes There's been I've seen kids rocking nirvana shirts. So they never fucking listened to a nirvana song before like there's a lot of that going on Yeah, because trend posers. Yes, it's trendy and it's cool. That's some mega-death ones only Yeah, no, that's it's become popular to wear like 80s rock like concert shirts and then half the kids don't even listen to Stashing well speaking of music. Uh, so it looks like I may be uh in a music video or song That's right. No, I didn't I see it You didn't know what happened. Okay. So that that one journeyman is gonna be all the journeyman one Shut up, bro. Yeah, can we please make like a t-shirt or something? This one it's it's one it's a quote that I did on a show went viral and not from that show specifically But lots of pages That have nothing to do with fitness or sharing it and it's me saying, you know, it's the journey that counts That audio clip must be on tiktok somewhere or something where people can just grab it Yeah, that's what I'm curious about. How is it being reproduced? So quite by so many different people I have no idea, but I got a message from a music producer And he's like, hey, uh, I want to I want to sample this And put it on one of my songs. You gotta be kidding me, dude The man who loves walking Will walk further than the man who loves the destination Okay, so what's happened along that process? You've learned to love the journey Right, you love the journey man when you love the journey The goals just happen that the you hit milestones as a side effect, right? I mean, that's cool And it's great and I love it, but I don't love it as much as I love the journey No, I don't want it So for the audience It's like it's a running we have our our personal thread We're that we all communicate when we're not around each other And it's been the running joke that we call sal the journey journey man journey man And I say when we go places now, we're gonna get we're gonna get recognized But none of us will get recognized it'll be just be sad to be like it's journey man journey man's the journey I mean you huge pages though huge pages millions and millions of followers I've seen it on a Red Bull thing. I saw it on Caesar Milan's page. I've seen it Who else did I see it on those? I mean tons of massive pages like business pages. Oh, yeah investment pages That's the funny part remember we did those gifts where we're doing young things like so I've been recently tagged on a few of yours in mind and like one of them was like in this presentation for Microsoft they're used like this stupid Another like like commercial campaigns have been using it for all that stuff and I'm like Do people are gonna know us for all the random shit? Not like the actual content we're trying to help people educate Yeah, you know, it's funny to people people think oh if you just go viral or something like that Like you just it's like it's worthless. Yeah, it's worthless. No, it doesn't it doesn't all it does is it gets I get random messages from like family members. I haven't talked to you for a while Hey, look what I saw well He just it honors the wrong attention Unless you're building a business specifically around something that's related to that. It's absolutely worthless. I did I don't know if you guys have been watching I've been doing throwback posts of of mine pump stuff Yeah, so a lot of people have been like oh more of these I mean we're coming up on 10 years since we've been linked up So it's like now it's a little hasn't really been almost a decade Yeah, yeah, especially if you count the time that when you guys were starting to build just now We're working on level up before we even got together. So I've got content from Yeah, you know photos and things that we took and shot and did before that just like you guys do so That's 10 years plus now or right at 10 years. Yeah 2012 2013 time Is when that was all happening and so I've been sharing some of these old posts and you know I shared this one of these pictures. I've never shared and I and I'm meaning to I'm gonna share for you guys Because I know you get a kick out of the the swing or one of those stupid ones Yeah, and I know you guys have seen but no one else has seen so I'll share We all have one of those. Yeah, so I'll share with the audience I'll share for the audience because they can make everybody can make fun of me But I did a post from that from those shoots. I did a post those shoots that you know back then I didn't know what I was doing like I all I My goal at that point Justin was handling a lot of the the tech side as far as managing the all the the project managers and the Engineers and stuff like that were the thirst trap. Yeah I mean really what it was was I I saw the writing on the wall with social media I mean I saw what was happening with Instagram Twitter and all and this was before tick tock And so yeah, exactly. I wasn't stupid I knew that we no matter how amazing of an app which by the way is a mistake I see people make all the time is like you have this brilliant idea for an app But then they have nobody to sell it to it's like you could have the best app in the world If you don't have an audience to get it to get it off the ground and get it going You're never going to go anywhere So I knew that was going to be paramount to the success of what we were trying to do So Justin was handling the back and stuff My goal was let's figure out how I can garner this attention So we had an audience and at the beginning I was just throwing spaghetti on the wall I mean I'm posting my car or my watch. I'm just watching what everybody all these other kids are doing And I remember going and getting that those these photo shoots, you know So I want to let's go back and talk early days. I mean, please god If I hope Andrew posts this on the video so people can see I'm only giving them one I'm not giving them all of them just so you know, I'm not there's like a hundred that no one's ever seen Oh, except for me and you had your best friend like Yes, taking the picture. Okay. So even more amazing walk me through this. So you you never did anything like this before And you're like, hey, dude, I need to do some like So my buddy is that my buddy is a as a A landscape photographer and he's really good. He's really talented. It's actually a side hustle He does weddings and stuff like that right now and then he's this is my child We go back to fourth grade. So we go way way back And and he's he's totally he is totally not interested in anything I do still to this day Like he don't give a shit about what I do or what that like he's a principal and he's into other things And like we we actually don't have a lot in common other were adults and stuff Uh, but anyways, he's taking sexy pictures of me. Well It kind of was like that, right? So first I had to lead up to how it got to that, right? So The first thing that gave my page traction. This is I actually got into the thousands I think I'm close to like 10,000 followers this time was sharing my transformation and literally just like With my iPhone and shitty lighting in the bathroom of like this what I look like before This is and showing my progress Start a lot of these like transformation pages back then when the a lot of those fitness pages were sharing me And it was blowing me up And so that got me that first bit then I started noticing pages that were Fitness influencers that were and what I noticed with a lot of these kids that were much bigger than I What they had done is they had professional photos You could tell you could tell that mine was shot with an iPhone 4 or 5 Whatever it was back then and theirs were being shot with like real like DSLR cameras And then they were uploading it on there And I'm like, okay, I'm missing this like professional side and at that point I had gotten in really good shape So okay, I'm gonna go do all these like, you know shirt off fucking photos that I'm gonna take Yeah, but that's but that's and then this point I'm not trying to invest a lot in this because we're not making any money at this point We're sinking all this money into this app So I start I go to my buddy Said hey, you know, I have some stuff I'm trying to build my fitness business right now and you know Would you would you take some photos for me now that I've gotten down to 7% body fat? So like that and he's like, well, what exactly do you want? I'm like, well, I don't know. I think I have some ideas and like, you know It's just I'm trying to gain more attention and traction to the page and stuff like that So, you know, I'll share a couple and then maybe together we can collaborate and he's like, uh, yeah, okay You know, so I get there and it was Of all my friends too this is my buddy. That's like this too. It's just the wrong one to do this with me Because he's he's awkward. I'm awkward. Are these all your ideas? We're like, let me do the swing No, no, okay. So that is actually the second the second shoot not the first shoot the first I did like back-to-back shoots And you do the first one. You're like, it's not risky enough. Let's go. No, no So the first one I steered actually a lot of those So the very first one I steered a lot of the poses because he my buddy was just like, I don't fucking know What you want, you know, so did you make him spray you with stuff? He his wife sprayed me With like water, you know what I'm saying? Come on. That's all part of the process, dude That wasn't it, dude How awkward was that in your life? It was in his living room. It was awkward as shit. It was awful, you know I do want to point out though. Okay a cover of a romance novel came from that photo One of them turned out Yeah, yeah, one of them penned out got some attention from somebody who's some author 80 justice who writes Romance novels that it ended up being on the front So can you tell us what some of that so we know you were on a swing on one? Maybe that's the one So that okay, that's okay. I'll share that one since that's the one that you guys think is so funny Well, I haven't seen them all bro. Oh, I'm not gonna show you Come on. No Okay, listen, okay, so let me explain what happened here Let me explain the rest of the story and I'll give you some some some detail of it But I don't think I'll ever let it out So The first she was my buddy. It was awkward as hell I got you know a good amount of pictures from him, but I at that point I realized Okay, I need to go see somebody because I don't know what I'm doing. I'm not comfortable doing this I'm willing and I'm open like so I'm like, let me go find a photographer who shoots bodies Right. So I went to a uh, what a boudoir boudoir. Is that how I say Doug? What boudoir? Yeah, boudoir The boudoir first she's kind of sexy lingerie. Yeah. Yeah. She specializes in that She's really good for I looked her up found her in the bay area And and I said, okay, I'm gonna go to her and I'm not leading anything. Well, I'm not gonna lead anything I'm gonna let her tell me like I told her the idea what I what I'm trying to accomplish I said you I'm so you're just game. Yeah, whatever you say Oh, dude, so that was pushing a stroller with a bro. I was naked. I was naked by about 15 minutes in Full on naked full on naked full on a she had me do this photo. I'll never forget this I remember tell look at it can treat you but hold on a second. Hold on. Why are you naked? Are you showing your are you showing? No, no, I'm not showing it's all hiding. Yeah. Yeah So she had me she had me naked and then she had me because she asked me too. She's like, you know how game are you? I'm like, listen, I don't I'm game. I'm whatever. You know, I'm saying I'm 20 bucks 20 bucks Hey, whatever you think is gonna be good like I'll I'll do this stuff, right? So I was like totally open about it Adam down She has me, um Like hugging a bush dude. So is that her? No, that's just Our photography. Yeah. So yeah, that's the type of stuff way better than Adams. That's how I look at those Hold on a second. So you're hugging a what a giant bush. So I'm naked and I'm like Legs and arms and I'm hugging. Well, hold on a second. Hold on a second. Yeah. I was like, what are we gonna stop for a second? We're gonna pause for a second. I'm never showing that voice in your head. Was it like, yes, it was fucking yelling at me What are you doing, bro? How are you gonna use this? Yeah That voice was telling me you're landscaping buddy. I bet he Moses was talking to the fiery bull. So hugging a bush naked. Yeah, I hugged a bush naked You guys have seen the swing. Is there one of the big teddy bear or did I make that one up? No, there's one for there's one where I have like a heart for like, uh, Because around that time I have seen that one. I think you have seen that one before It was around valentine's day coming up And so she wanted to do like this like valentine's day pose because that was going to come up And so I could use it and it was like me like holding this like metal heart, you know, it was like it shirts off It's all it's So many bad photos. There's so many bad photos out of those I mean, I shouldn't say I don't want to disrespect her like she's well, that's what she does Yeah, she's created what she did and I mean she's just not you that's why she loved it She used it like advertising and she used it for all kinds of stuff. Oh, so it's out there Yeah, it's out there on her stuff like you would have to go find her thirst trap. Yeah. Do you remember what her name was? Do it. I'm not giving it to you Searching for I will I'll post one. I'll give one to Andrew. So yes, um, you guys can make fun of me Let me ask you this because uh, I I've never done that but I've been in situations that were just not me So I'm kind of awkward. Did you have to like do you have to have a drink or something before I had to loosen yourself? I probably smoked some weed before both situations. I'm sure I did because it was um Yeah, I mean, you know, it's funny too because it really goes back to that's if it's never how much That's nervous you remember how much it struggled. I mean, I'm not I'm not a nervous type of person But I also and the type person who has that voice in his head. It's like this isn't you this is not what exactly But I'm but I'm like I'm also have a guy too who can shut that down and just be like I have a mission right now Like my my job is to get through it. Yeah, and I'm like I'm that's the type of I'm game I'm like, whatever. I don't give people are gonna make fun of me people I don't care like if I if I can garner more attention for us to launch this app Like that's my job. Have you now now that you have a son Do you do you have a story to tell him a favorite fine? He's like, he's like, of course Hey dad, what what is I mean? I'll be honest and share the whole I'll share the whole story with him How it all panned out like you have to tell him first before he finds out Well, you remember like it was crazy is way back when I bear well I get more now because how my big mind pump is but probably just If you go back maybe a year ago on my Instagram and my pump was already pretty big Um, I barely am getting the same kind of likes and attention. I was getting yeah five years ago Those those pictures were getting it, but it was all the wrong attention You remember when we first started the pocket I was talking about all the dick pics I get and all the crazy shit But I mean the the likes the comments the shares. I mean it was it was really it was really good It was working But what I quickly realized and why I abandoned using them was it was it was getting the wrong attention And I mean I wasn't gonna go sell it if maybe if I was gonna transition into an only fans page It would have been a very smart strategy. Yeah, that's our backup plan by the way Mind pump ever tanks, but I mean this is a this is a common mistake. I think Fitness people make all people make that are trying to build a business and they're trying to use a social media platform So I I I understand because I went through it And I try to help people when I see this it's like if you're the way you are gaining attention if it is not Totally directly connected to how you're going to monetize in the future. It's a fucking waste of time A total waste of time for you. I had to completely stop all of that and let those people fall off of my social media platform and almost Start over Rebuilding back with good valuable content, which was a slower grind Didn't get a bunch of attention didn't get as much as comments and stuff like that But was those people were more likely to convert into customers. I did I did one photo shoot nothing like that But it was very uncomfortable for me too because That's not like me and one of the photos like I'm standing and she's like make love to the camera like the The And I you know and I did the and I did the photos and I thought maybe I'd use some of them to promote fitness But you know, it just didn't it was it wasn't me same thing Yeah, see like for me. I just immediately turned into zoo lander. He's like help myself You know like it's just like I have to like make fun of myself immediately You know because I can't I can't take any of that stuff seriously Like you're trying to like, you know dress me up a certain way and have me like look like I have to like Crack on it. Yeah, but yeah, like speaking of having to drink, you know Before doing uncomfortable things. I mean that that was the beginning of the podcast for me This is not me, dude. Like I'm like, ah trying to drag it took me a while to get through that but uh, dude Over the the last few weeks like we've been you know on vacation and whatnot and like putting it down And then I'm also trying to come up with ideas for like more z-biotic commercials And I realized that like I go to take one before we're having I'm like, oh cool I got some z-biotics. Let's take those and then we'll do like a cheers whatever And uh, it's empty every single body have it empty Wait, oh, there's none in the back either, huh? No So here's the thing once you realize z-biotics works You got a stockpile, dude Yeah, like because it's just like it's so the the worst thing is that you know It's there, but you know, you're gonna have like so a bunch of these drinks Wait a minute like this would have been so nice, but I don't have it now So this is an anecdote, okay So and because you have to be very careful when you discuss symptoms of things like hangovers and stuff like that That's actually regulated as a medical condition. So so this is my own anecdote But you know, we were in Cabo then I was in Vegas and I was averaging Literally one maybe two drinks a day max. I'm not a big drinker. You guys know that But I didn't have any z-biotics with me and I was taking Ibuprofen here and there and I'd never get headaches or anything and Jessica pointed out She's like, you're asking me for another Ibuprofen. She's like, what's going on? I'm like, it's gotta be the one drink that I had, you know, that's that's gotta be what it is And I forgot that that's I mean, I guess I didn't forget forget, but It wasn't top of mind because For I mean geez for the last couple years before I had any drinks I would do z-biotics. I wouldn't get that. I've trained myself. I mean you and I are Of the group yeah, we both have like that like I just I one drink can make me feel bad like that Sometimes I'm okay with just one for sure two will definitely make me feel that way And so I've trained myself that I even if I'm just gonna have one or two I just go I go have the z-biotic. I mean, we did the same thing this this I mean luckily the truckie house is loaded with a huge hundred pack in there And you know anytime that I was gonna enjoy even just a single drink I never once got drunk the whole trip. I think the most I had on one day It's three or four. I had one day which I consider heavy drinking for me But I consistently made sure that I had the z-biotic before and I would I'd wake up the next day Feeling like you had one of those hundred packs But like that we caught you through a party and like her friends are so now like in Tune with the fact that we have these and so they just would go into You know the pantry grab one and then you know party and I realized before I know it like they're all empty So I tell people how much they are because they're not cheap and if you don't know if you don't know that then Oh, they think this is a little little shot of looking water stuff. So they just I think they do that with every drink Yeah, I just need one. Yeah. Yeah, and I think they think it's no big deal because they don't realize it Like that little thing is not cheap. So you just they just take you like, oh, it's no big deal It doesn't get a hundred of them. I'll take four or five for me for the next time I have a party It's like lock it up. It's like stealing 50 bucks from me, dude. What easy there's my gold right there. Yeah, yeah Hey, real quick, you got to check out this company called live on labs They make supplements that your body actually utilizes and absorbs Utilizing a technology. It's a pharmaceutical technology called liposomal technology and right now You can get lipoglutathione for free When you bundle it with b complex and vitamin c that's just to our listeners But you have to go through our link go to live on labs Dot com forward slash mp for that hookup. All right. Here comes the rest of the show Our first caller is amanda from michigan. Amanda. What's happening? How can we help you? Hi guys, how are you? Good? How are you doing? Good? Good. Um, you know, I just want to start out by saying I'm gonna try really hard not to be a crazy fangirl But I have been following you guys and listening to you for about six years now And I just want to say that You guys are amazing and have taught me so much and thank you for everything that you do. Thank you. That's awesome So what I want to say is I have been Um, training consistently um for about 20 years Uh, I was like a bikini bikini competitor. Sorry. I'm like super nervous right now I was a bikini competitor. Um, my last competition was in 2018 Since then I've been really trying to grow the glutes And the legs which I have achieved using a program like five by fives and just lifting really heavy In doing that I have grown my back I have got a thicker wider back which you know, most people might really love and want but for me It's not really what I was looking for so I was wondering if there's a way of Still growing the glutes and the legs without growing like the bigger back and upper body as much Yeah, great question. Are you are you happy with your with your glute size now? Or do you want to continue to grow? It's amazing. I love the glutes. I love my legs. My husband loves my glutes and my legs Um, but yeah, I want to maintain basically without growing any more upper body Okay, well first off congratulations for getting to this point is a Most people never really get to that point. So good job 20 years of training. You've been consistent That's freaking awesome. So absolutely what you need to do to maintain is way less than what you did Uh to build so so consider that so that's number one And and now I know why this is challenging because you're talking about the posterior chain, right? The glutes are on the back of the body just like the back muscles are and a lot of glute exercises Or at least the most effective Glute building exercises will involve at least some support From the back. So you're gonna get some development in both with things like squats and deadlifts and even hip thrust Will involve some of those things But you're in a position now where you want to maintain the glutes And you want to not grow the back or maybe even allow the back to shrink a little bit Yes, in which case I would say I would stick to hip thrust I would even do single leg hip thrust and now you can do The exercises that we tend to talk down on Uh donkey kickback single leg, you know deadlifts where you squeeze glutes things that'll maintain your your glute size They're not going to necessarily build But they'll maintain and what we're doing is we're we're taking the back out of a lot of these exercises So you you may see some back atrophy, which you're okay with but you definitely won't see your back growing I would be even more specific. So I would um, I don't know if I would get rid of deadlifts completely But I definitely would get rid of conventional deadlifts So I would have you do sumo deadlifts only just because you drop your hips down in the position more It's going to be more glute dominant Uh, then then back dominant like a conventional would be Um, I and instead of squatting I would do uh, Bulgarian split squats So I that's those two things replacing that I think because that's if you're starting to do heavy Heavy conventional deadlifts and heavy squatting. It may be developing your back more than you like and so You're a perfect example of someone if I was training for bikini We would just eliminate those two movements out of your programming and then anywhere where they would normally go I would probably put Bulgarian split squats or hip thrust In that in that position and then where you would do potentially deadlifts We would do sumo or put the you know the opposite one of that of the two I just recommended for squats and I think that would be that would suffice for what you're trying to do Have you taken um, a few months or have you taken some time to do run through a good unilateral program? And and just yeah, I had a feeling that I'd be one of those viewers that know the the answer to the question Uh, I did uh send this a question and probably about a month ago and a couple weeks prior to that I did my own kind of experiment and I laid off the the traditional um deadlifts I've been doing a bunch of split squats. Um, I've been Incorporating some cardio like hit um because I know sometimes Women have that like bulky feeling and it's from just an extra layer of fat on their muscle So I thought maybe if I lose a couple pounds I might see a difference and I have so that's definitely helped a lot So um, like I said, I might have answered my own questions, but I just wanted to hear from the fitness gurus themselves Yeah, well we can sound like you're on the right track. Yeah, we have a program called map symmetry. You might really like um Yeah, especially someone like you've been working out for so long Unilateral training um can really develop uh the body in in targeted ways So if you don't have that we'll send that to you Um, let us and let us know what you think but again, you know, remember this okay because you have a lot of experience You've been working out For a long time What you need to do to build is like two or three times the volume and intensity than what you need to do to keep So if you like your the way your butt looks You can drop the weight drop the intensity Squeeze the glutes just keep them where they're at but that lower weight lower intensity will prevent you from building Any more back muscle? Um, so, you know, just consider that maintaining is a lot easier than getting there in the first place Okay, and so you're saying like take squats out like barbell squats out completely Yeah, you could do that or go really light you could do that I would replace it with the movements that we said Yeah, so I would take barbell squats out and then that becomes hip thrust, right? All right, and then I would take dead lift dead lifts out and that becomes Bulgarian split squats or vice versa lunges Yeah, I'm just living that. Mm-hmm. Yeah, but unilateral. I think you'll really like yeah That's already done in that program. So you're not going to do any conventional deadlifting in that You're not going to do any any bilateral squatting in that it's all unilateral except the last phase Which you know, it's it's only three weeks at the end of the program where you'll do some of that stuff Um, so let's send that to you I think you'll really like it especially someone like you with your experience. I think you'll really notice a big difference with it Well, thank you so much and it has been such a pleasure Listening to you guys over the past six years and listening to your growing families and just the growth of your businesses And it's just awesome. And I I gotta say I'm a sci-fi Nerve myself and I just love hearing you guys geek out to sci-fi paranormal stuff in your people Just keep it coming guys. I love it so much. You you are doing such a great job I want to give you another free program. Thank you. Thank you Yeah, thanks. Thank you guys. You got it Now I want to say this to the audience Okay, this is a very rare case because what I don't want is I don't want women listening to this Who have not worked out for 20 years who have not trained that consistently do and have that type of development To you and say oh, I better not deadlift. I better not squat I don't want to get that all of a sudden it happens huge old back That's not at all what happens for a vast majority of people She's in a position that she's in because she's trained for so long so consistently and you heard her I'm very satisfied with where I'm at. I just don't want to grow my back anymore When you get to that place if you get to that place, which most people don't get to You're in a wonderful position where you could just maintain certain things the workouts are easier in certain ways And now you're just kind of maintaining and shaping and sculpting the body Yeah, it's just at that level where she can really like hyper focus and fine tune like exactly what she wants at this point So it makes sense, you know the vice that we're giving her but yeah, not to your average She did touch on something I think is important to Reiterate too is because it's something that Katrina struggles with this because Katrina has kind of broad shoulders and broad hips And one of the things that she hates is that when she starts to put on a little bit of body fat She feels like it really Really exacerbates that And so one of the things that i'm always reminding her that it's like listen, it's not the deadlifts It's not the back exercises that are making your back feel that way It's the body fat when we lean that down Tell me what your back looks like and then decide, you know So and she kind of already kind of started a piece of that Yeah started to figure that out and I just want to highlight that because we all store body fat differently Right, even though there's like general truths that where men or women tend to hold body fat We're all still individuals and we all tend to store and we all have different anatomical structures Katrina has broader shoulders anatomically and so when she puts on a little bit of extra body fat, it looks it looks wider It looks you know on on that note High-level female athletes that perform really well, especially at track and field sports and basketball And you know those types of things they tend to store body fat a little bit more in the midsection and they tend to have A little bit more narrow hips wider waist Because that's better for athletic performance. So if you're a high-level female athlete This is this tends to be more of an issue than the average, you know, average person Yeah, I think that's why it's important to note that because sometimes we just we assume it's these exercises that are making us this way Yeah, your genetics just tend to store body fat in those areas and I always like to challenge my clients Hey, let's let's lean down first so we can really assess What your body looks like and in tell me if that's if you think it's your back is too big Or it's just that just happens to be where you store body fat and you don't like her look Our next caller is mark from new york mark. What's happening, man? How can we help you? Hey guys, this is awesome. Can't believe I'm talking to you guys All right. Um, so I just want to start off. I'll start over the question and then uh go into some background Um, so my question is if you put in the work consistently Over a long period of time should everyone be able to lift say Two plates for bench three plates for squad and four plates for deadlift Um, just some background on me Um, I've been lifting for six years now and I'm finishing up the rgb progression And I do a maps prime warm-up Um, I've gained a considerable about considerable amount of muscle and really do like my physique But I feel like not I feel like I still am lifting the same weight. I was about five years ago Um for reference is about 185 for squad 155 for bench 225 for deadlift I have tried to increase the weight on the lifts, but even you know, a five to ten pound increase Causes my form to break down and me to start twisting and breaking down form Um, I'm consistent with the workouts and nutrition and sleep Um, I just feel with that consistency. I should be stronger and lifting more weight than I am Um, I always hear you guys talk about how strength is such a great indicator of progress And I was just wondering if I'm missing anything or um, and what your guys thoughts are All right, let me answer the first part about benching two plates squatting three plates and deadlifting four plates That's true for girls Uh for guys, it should be i'm just south still can't do that I'm just kidding with you. Listen mark. There is no standard. Okay when it comes to strength How much you should lift and how much you shouldn't lift? So I want to address that first because Everybody's very different. Um, and if I use the same if I use this Let me put it this way If I use the top power lifting female competitor standards for lifting, I'd be very disappointed in myself After 30 years of of working out just so you don't want to do that. It's not fair to yourself Now the second part i'm a little confused because you said you've gained a considerable amount of muscle But your strength is the same So what do you mean by that? Like how much muscle have you gained? Have you gotten leaner? Is your body weight a lot lighter? Like I need more details and to make sense of this Yeah, so I was about a year ago now. I was 140 pounds Under 10 body fat. I was just you know, it did a lot of cardio really Obsessed with being lean. I went on I bulked through most of the rgb progression Um eating about 2700 calories and I so over that nine month process I gained about 30 pounds. Oh, yeah and Yeah, and you know, I look in the mirror. I compare myself to pictures from a year ago. I took pictures every few weeks And you know, I it's not I could tell it's not it's not all fat just by looking at the pictures um And I was just curious like how that works or and if i'm missing something on the strength side Did you get a body fat test or are you just judging off pictures? I mean, I could tell by the way He looks you don't look like yeah, I can tell right now, but I swear you look in the in your video Yeah, you don't look like you went to 20% body fat. Yeah, yeah, no But did you test body fat just by any chance so we can know how much Lean body mass you actually gained. I did not know. Okay. Yeah, it's that's interesting So you gained 30 pounds a decent amount of muscle, but your strength is identical Does your form feel different? Do you feel more under control? Are there any other changes in your workout performance? um I mean, I've I have improved my squat depth just by doing The maps prime and going through that and doing that before the workouts So I could say that I mean my lifts have improved in that regard if more range of motion on the squad Okay How did you feel during um, you maps anabolic in like phase one? For instance, like did you feel any strength gains and in that sort of a protocol or you dropped your reps down significantly? That was the most I ever increased the weight. I did go up to To 200 for squad, which is the most I had ever done during that doing about, you know, like two to three reps Okay, so and I do want to uh be clear here if you're using the same weight But you're going say five inches deeper on your squat with more control. You're stronger Not only that too, for sure Also, if he's handling more volume in the workout than he would he was two years ago, too, that's stronger Right. Sometimes we always measure strength by the the pr's. Yeah, you know, like, oh I this is the most I've ever deadlifted or squat, but but then also but I'm not counting that I'm doing three more sets of deadlifting, you know in a routine that I have ever done before or I'm, you know If your volume is increased also, right? So there's there's other factors that I think that are at play here And especially if you have something as objective as looking at a picture from before and after and you feel it You know, you've put on muscle and you look better. It sounds like you're doing really good, man Yeah, it sounds like now you might want to just shift your focus a little bit more on those big compound lifts and like Really dive into that and yeah, you can max power lifting. Yes, absolutely Direction for you because I guarantee like if that's all working out for your body's substantially changing transforming Now if that's it that's an indicator if that's a metric that you're going to seek You just focus on that for a while and you're going to you're going to see a lot of strength Yeah, I was thinking the exact same thing Justin was like, you know what would be great for you since you've gone through the rgb is now is a good time to mess with Mass power lift totally so going to maps power lift routine and I guarantee you run through that program You will come back with all those numbers will have gone up. Yeah, we'll send that to you And if you don't have it, but yeah, if if let's say you handle the same weight But you're more stable Or your range of motion increases or you can slow the rep down or you can lift it more explosively Or you can handle more sets and not lighten the load Or you can rest less in between sets and handle the same load like all of that Are improvements in strength progress. Yeah, it's not just I added weight to the bar All of you know more volume all that stuff shows that your strength has improved So it's not always just the amount of weight, especially when consider this too You're you're going through different programs Each one is is different right maps and blocks very different from maps performance and maps aesthetic is very different Each one has different phases within them. So, you know phase one for maps and a ball to phase three You can't look at the weight on the bar and one of them you're doing, you know You're resting three four minutes You're doing really low reps and the other phase you're doing super sets with lighter weight more volume So you don't want to necessarily compare it that way. You want to compare kind of apples to apples So a more fair comparison would be everything's identical And then is the weight going up the form is identical the depth is identical the volume is identical Then is the weight going up that would be a little bit more of a fair type mark. How old are you right now? I am 23. Oh, yeah, and you're you're bro. You're still growing too Yeah, you know I'm saying like you've got and it's very normal I mean you've been lifting consistently for six years So when I think back to my entire lifting career, you're going to go through phases of your life Where you kind of plateau PR wise on some of these lifts I think I mean, I've been in I've been hovering around the same deadlift squat and bench for a very long time I mean So and I can't get hung up all time like I'm I will not always keep getting stronger in those lifts In fact, I I tend to go way back down and then I have to work my way back up Just to getting back to what what some of my pr's were in my late 20s in those some of those lifts And so I've kind of reached Where where my max potential strength is doesn't mean I can't get a little bit stronger But that's kind of what my body is capable of doing that that kind of you know, I think I've the max bench I think it was at three 350 at one point my my squat was around 420 my deadlift was 550 Those are kind of my max numbers. I'm not at any of those numbers right now Because I'm not lifting at the same volume and consistency is what I was just four or five years ago And if I were to really get after it It would be I'd be lucky just to get back up to those numbers and it and then stay consistent after that for another Four or five years. Maybe I get another five pounds or 10 pounds out in some of those things So, you know at one point when you've been consistently lifting for a long time You start to get closer and closer to some of your your probably your max numbers Yeah, another thing to consider to mark is that when you look at this is true for everybody but generally speaking people's strength Peaks when they lift consistently in like their mid 30s. That's just across the board, which is very interesting I've been working out. That's where I hit my peak same here I worked out since I was 14 consistently and the the strongest I ever was Was about, you know 34 35 31 32 for me was my peak. Yeah, and if you look at um, like, you know competitive numbers natural competitions drug tests and all that stuff You see people peaking strength-wise. I'm not talking about athletic performance That tends to be much younger but that encompasses things like agility and that kind of stuff But just raw strength Men tend to peak in their 30s sometimes 40s So that's when people are hitting their their strongest lifts and this is after years and years and years of lifting. So In other words, I'm telling you you got a long ways to go. So don't freak out. Don't worry. Yeah, I think you're doing great dude same Awesome. I mean that's good to hear. I had no idea that you know strength peaks that are late So I mean that's encouraging. Um If I progress onto a maps power lift, um, so I did bulk through most of the rgb progression And I've kind of been at maintenance. Um, just you know being the summer didn't want to keep bulking Um, and it's a lot of food. Um, what would you recommend going into that program with nutrition wise? I like maintenance. That's maybe a slight bulk. Yeah, you know, maybe like 100 200 above maintenance just enough to fuel Any strength gains you're not going to see like huge weight gains on that but you should see huge strength Because you want to be a deficit just because if your goal is to try and increase strength Like you want to give your body adequate energy, but that's about it Well, that's actually how I would that's how I would let your your calories be dictated Is how you feel going into each workout. So so let's say you you start the program And uh, you you get into week two or three and you see maybe a dip in strength The very first place I would look at is my nutrition. Yeah, I would go like, oh man Maybe I'm not giving myself an adequate calories or protein or enough carbohydrates before my workout So just fuel your workouts So make sure that if you do not feel like you're either maintaining strength or gaining strength through the program That you give yourself adequate calories to make sure that the you feel good in your workouts That's how I would dictate whether I'm in a bulk of maintenance or whatever But like Justin said being in a deficit in a strength-based program You're not going to see very much strength gains if you're in a deficit So I definitely wouldn't be in a deficit I'd be in a maintenance slight surplus like Sal was saying and the way I would dictate that would be based off of My performance in my workouts. There you go Okay, awesome guys that sounds like a game plan and I just want to thank you again I mean your podcast has really helped me create a Fitness plan that fits in nicely like I was in college fight all the time in the world But now creating a plan that works fits in nicely in that morning window before work. So thank you guys. Yeah. Good for you, man Thanks mark All right. Thank you Yeah, you know Back to that statistic that I mentioned I remember as a kid you you hear all the time that a man's performance, right? Peaks in their late teens early 20s athletics and sports and all that stuff But when it comes to just pure strength, it's much later. It's totally different. Like if you're you're right, I didn't know that right? So I thought oh my god, I'm never gonna hit these. No, you don't really know your body till the way later. That's it Well, it's totally like grinding raw lifting strength is so different than like basketball tennis swimming athletics lots of agility And you can't have joint pain you gotta be able to you know react really quick Which you kind of lose the start to lose that as you get older Yeah, and that's a strength. I mean in professional sports. You're considered old at 30, right in in lifting It's completely. Oh my god in the top lifters are in their early to mid 30s. Some of them in their 40s My peak was 31 32 for strength. That was I mean that's so far. That's been the best I've ever been in a lift was at that time Was 31 32. So that was like the best year So most people I know that have been lifting for a long time would say the same thing Yeah, it's because it's an incremental slowly build and build and build and I even now at 43 I can hit Some of the numbers I hit in my mid 30 not all of them But some of them and I'm starting now to notice a little bit But that has more to do with just wear and tear on the body and it's just not smart For me to train that way. But yeah, it's like when you're 23 when it comes to strength and lifting You're a baby. Yeah, maybe not sports, but for lifting your I think uh, larry wheels has ruined it for everybody Every 25 year old sees larry wheels and goes like why can't I do well if he doesn't hurt himself He'll get keep getting stronger for the next 10 years He's crazy. He's a beast. He's only like 25. He's a baby. Yeah, he's hell. Yeah Our next caller is brian from north carolina brian. What's happening man? How can we help you? Hey, what's up guys? Thanks for having me on today. You got it. I've been on the center for about Three years. I'm excited to be here right on. All right Yeah, so let me get into it So I just turned 30 consider myself to be in you know, pretty good shape Look the way I want to pain-free Uh, you know got a lot of good things going Um, I was running maps in a ball like recently. Um, and when I got my deadlifts, I was winded after about like four or five of them Um, you know, I I generally like only lift weights not a cardio guy Um, you know, I work from home now. It's been like that for like the last two years going some walks during the day Um, you know, so my question is like, how can I improve my endurance in the gym? Um, you know while deadlifting I feel like it's costing me some strength games since I'm I'm falling short on my reps Do you notice this on the other lifts too or just deadlifts? No, it's just been deadlifts. Um, squats isn't so bad. Um, Yeah, just just deadlifts is where it really comes out. What program comes to mind right away Tell me you guys are on the same page as I am strong. Yep. Yeah, that's strong. Sure. It would be great The first phase. I know work capacity. Yeah, first phase You know, there's another part to your question brian that you didn't say here on air that you wrote in And you said that you like to keep your body fat around 10% or lower. Is that where you're at right now? Yeah, that's generally like For like the last like three years. I've been kind of hanging around that number and I've never get it tested Um, I just have you know, like visible abs. Um, like nutrition's kind of locked in Um, so it's generally we're better. Well, you could try going, you know, try adding calories too, you know Some some guys can maintain, you know, nine eight percent body fat notice no performance drops But that's the exception. Yeah, but he's also he's also he okay So he's not doing any cardio. He's also got a desk job at home all day long Like well, I mean, it would be part of the formulas when I'm saying I'm not saying it's the answer But I would say like map strong I would go on a surplus And then see what happens I know for me, for example My stamina is just better when I'm like at 11% body fat than when I'm like eight or nine That 2% makes a big difference for me Some people that's not the case But uh, like I said, that's the exception be single digit body fat tends to affect Uh performance for some people. So I would go on a little surplus with map strong And see what happens. I don't think you need to add cardio if you do map strong map strong He's got some stamina in there built in and um, you want to talk about deadlift endurance There's a lot of stuff in there that'll build that. Yeah, there's two different ways that I would go I if you were a client of mine, you said like out of my, you know, can I can I build that endurance without adding cardio? I would I would move you in the strong direction. Just do that program That's going to build the work capacity you're looking for without actually doing any cardio If you said, I don't I actually don't mind cardio if you don't mind me doing it I would say dude do 12 to 15 minutes a hit post workout After your lifting sessions and watch what that does to your work capacity I think that in itself would also do it So you kind of have two different options on how you want to approach it both options though I would agree with sal I would increase calories a little bit because the Volume and work at workload that's in strong You could increase calories and still maintain your body fat percentage and you'll probably see strength gains in that and 100% I'd go up 300 calories Yeah, and then same thing goes for hit if you all of a sudden did the other direction that I said Which is start to incorporate hit into your routine post workout for like, you know, like I said 1215 minutes on the Stairmaster or sprints or the row or something after your lifting also increase calories And you'll still keep your and maintain your body fat percentage Maybe even go down a little bit So you kind of have two different options on how you could potentially Increase your work capacity and it really would have to do with which one do you prefer as a client is where I'd push you Yeah, and in deadlifts for reps gnarly. So that's just hard for everybody I don't you know, don't don't feel too bad about that It's like I rarely go over five reps of deadlifts because it's just It's one of those exercises that just seems to work better Yeah, but you could barely run across the street to start with Let's not use you as an example. That's true. So I mean, I think I think that you they bring it to me though Yeah, so let's not use you as an example or any of us for that matter for running stuff But I mean, that's it literally it comes down to what you like to do and if you really like You know strength training you dig the lifting weights part you could totally build A cardiovascular endurance That's the one thing I think that we always are trying to preach on here because people think we're anti-cardio It's like no you do a program like strongly the very first phase you got 20 reps of deadlifts The work sessions are gonna and then you have work sessions on the opposing days Which are like speed ladder drills and things like that like you're gonna build some Cardiovascular endurance just by following especially for the deadlift. Yeah, and it's translatable And so I think that's why we first, you know highlight the work capacity part of it because you're loaded And you're trying to maintain, you know good form and technique and everything while being in a state of fatigue And so to train that way translates a lot better towards a goal of of of being better Having better stamina while you're lifting weights versus just adding in running at the end of your workouts Which will help but it's not exactly as translatable Right and I think for me It's like I'm comparing, you know Back before you know like 2019. I was in the gym like I feel like I didn't have this issue Now it's been three years later. I've been working from home more, you know, three years older Um, so I was trying to figure out and uh, the other thing is so my calories are at like 2700 I think I just bumped that up to 3000. Yeah, I would go 300 that that sounds like a good place to go But then from there feel it out. See if you need more You're you're you're also you said you're 30, right? Is what you said you're at Yep This is about the age where I hit where I started doing this thing Where occasionally what I because I'm not a big obviously runner or or cardio guy either, but I also don't want to Uh, allow myself to get so far the other direction that I can't run a mile, right? So what I would do is like, I don't know every every couple months If I notice like I feel that way like you're you're kind of explain I would get on the treadmill and just see what I can get get my mile time just to see where it's at And I always like to keep it in a range that I think is good So I want to be able to do sub eight minutes always like it's just to me That's not like a super fast mile time, but it's also that's pretty decent You know I'm saying like especially now 40 something years old. So When you I started that catch your kids Yeah, it's right to catch your kids or run away from somebody like that's kind of my my thought processes And miles only eight minutes, you know I'm saying it's I don't I'm not a big cardio guy But and I'll probably never have to run more than a mile at one time So that's kind of my idea of like, okay I'm still relatively fit enough to get after it for one mile And so I like to use that as like how Cardiovascularly fit am I at the time and so you have a baseline? I think there's a great age to do that So it isn't since you're feeling that way get on the treadmill run your mile See where your mile time is and then let that be kind of your baseline of of judging where your your cardiovascular endurance is at Okay. Yeah, that sounds good. All right, man. We're gonna send you map strong if you don't got that. All right, Brian All right, I don't I appreciate it. It's great great being on man. You guys are great Thanks, man. Nice beard by the way very healthy Small beer. You got it. Not tiny It was tiny small. Yeah Thanks, man You know, uh, could you imagine running from something scary for a mile? He said you want to be able to do that for a mile. That's a long time when we're ready for some So scary shit, bro After about a quarter mile, I'd be like, ah, I think I'm just gonna die That's why that's why I want to be able to do it I'm like, no, there's not many times you'll have to run for more than a mile Really, let's be honest here. You know what I'm saying? I mean, if you're running for more than a mile, like if you're there's something bad going on Yeah, you didn't get away You don't say you didn't get away. That's hilarious. I like the metrics this I might go for a kilometer The miles too long for me No, but you know, it you know, his question is uh, it's a good one I think also something else that's probably playing a role is is that he's working from home That you know sitting all day You know, I remember when uh, when they first came out with the body bug was uh It was like a breakthrough piece of you know fitness equipment or you know metric, I guess measure And I remember looking at my client's charts and then I really realized like oh my god You are you move for one hour a day. Yeah the rest of the day you do nothing Yeah So no wonder your calorie burn is so low or you feel the way you do even though you work out every day Well, whatever you do the most throughout your day is what your body pro or what it blew me away with that tech was I'd see a day they train with me Where we not only did a weightlifting session. They also did a half hour hour cardio But then they'd have a saturday. Yeah that they burned way more calories yard work or something Yeah, and they just went to the mall and shopping they cleaned house He just and I was like, whoa like so it is you and I Remember this transition in my life when I went from being a a full-time personal trainer who was you know Training eight ten clients every day six days a week to all of a sudden being this guy who was running a uh A cannabis club where I was sitting at a desk and I at the beginning had no no clients no customers And I just sat for eight hours out of my day It was a huge transition for me to go through that because I quickly went from the guy Who could never eat enough calories to keep up with his burn and his activity level To quickly being the guy that was just piling and it was I bet it fooled you at first It did I've shared if you listen long enough on the podcast. I've actually shared this story before Uh, but I remember when I first told you guys that like I had this realization like oh, I'm fat Like I've never felt fat before in my life because I could never put on weight for all of my 20s And when I first started to put on weight I was so I cared so much about the scale that I didn't realize that it was mostly body fat that I was playing I was just like, oh, I'm filling out my shirts. Oh the scales going up It's like a first time over 200 pounds and then I remember laying on my side in bed I'm scratching my side and like filling a belly for the first time in my life And went oh my god like I've never never put on that kind of weight So yeah, it's a it's a major transition when you go from being somebody who's just You know has a a relatively active people don't realize an active job How how much of a difference that makes our next caller is Brett from minnesota Brett what's happening man? How can we help you? Hey, how's it going good I just want to say thank you guys as everyone does and that's uh, I respect the grind you guys are on to put out You know newish content every day Um, my question is about two things the first one is um, the supplementation of eaas or just like, you know, all the amino acids or the nine main ones um, and the supplementation of organ meats For the eaas I've listened to what you guys have to say about Whether or not they're useful or not useful and how they're only useful if you're not hitting your protein targets But for me I'm 6 6 245 pounds and I only eat about three meals a day between with my work schedule And try not to eat after dinner time so While adhering to proper Protein absorption methods, you know, you can't eat more than you know, maybe 40 to 60 grams of protein in a meal Three meals a day. That's about you know, 150 to 180 grams of protein So would this be an opportunity that supplementing for amino acids would be helpful? Because I'm not getting to you know, the about the 0.8, which would be about 200 to 222 grams of protein Um for me Yeah, um, so good question address the protein absorption first. Yeah. Yeah, you can take you can eat more than that Um, that's 100 you can eat 100 grams in one sitting bro as long as you can digest it Yeah, as long as you can digest it doesn't affect your digestion negatively You can have more protein at one sitting. So that's a bit of a that's a bit of a myth Um, so it depends on digestion more than anything big guy like you you could probably eat 80 grams of protein Um at a sitting and you'd probably be fine. So I'd mess around with that a little bit If you're hitting about 170 grams or so of protein, you're probably okay You you probably don't need essential amino acids now you could test it out You could supplement with them and see if you notice a difference But the studies show it's like 0.6 0.8 grams per pound of body weight the one gram per pound of body weight That's really a number that uh, you know supplement companies push out. It's easier to measure It's you know people don't have to do math They could just say I weigh this much eat this much and if I miss it a little bit I'm gonna hit I'm still gonna hit the number that the studies show Um, so I mean I'd say this is hit or miss you're probably okay But you can mess around with a little bit um and see how that feels for you No, go ahead. I want to know what's your what's your favorite source of protein? Are you are you big meat eater? Yeah, we eat I I'm a midwest eater and we eat, you know We do half cow a year between, you know our family for so we do like a lot of red meat and sometimes chicken But it's pretty much whey protein and red meat and eggs. I eat a lot of eggs too. I love that. I mean high quality Yeah, dude, so literally just do this when you when you eat your meals Uh instead of eating probably eight ounces of steak like you probably do eat 10 to 12 So bump the ounces up of of your servings of meat every time you eat meat. I mean, this is how I eat I mean you and I are almost exact say I'm 235 240 So we're you're a little bit taller than I am but we're about similar similar weight And I and I'm only eating about three meals a day right now And so in order for me to hit my protein take I'll sit sometimes I'll I mean I'll put a whole pound of meat down in one sitting So and it's totally fine on my decision now What I can't do and so and pay attention to this because you might be like me with this Is I can't do that all in like protein powder if I have a hundred grams of pro like dairy Or like that will kind of met like then I'll be on the toilet right afterwards But like meat meat and rice or meat eggs and rice like a combo like that Man, I could I could crush a hundred grams of protein easily in one meal with that combo I did it last night. Did you did nine morning before so that's kind of a go-to staple for me is And I think I just recently shared this as a fitness tip where I'll I'll make a big meat type of dinner the other just night before last I did a huge I did three pounds of bison and rice all mixed together And then that was my dinner and then morning I had the exact same thing but then I just cracked two over easy eggs on top of that So literally having like a 80 90 gram breakfast of protein and that sits really well with me I love that so now the the only caveat would be if if you're if you the extra three ounces of meat is adding You know more calories and you want from the additional maybe fat that comes from the steak in which case Um, I would cut your carbs down to make up the difference if that's if that's your goal or choose a leaner meat Or choose choose a leaner meat. Uh, but yeah, that's that's great advice But you could always add more shakes to you know the thing about essential amino acid supplements It's always very interesting to me because you could just take a 10 literally 10 grams of whey protein We'll give you more essential amino acids than essential amino acid supplements or pills If you do the math and you look at the two It's like six grams of whey protein is more typically than essential amino acid and cheaper cost less money Yeah, I know the one one thing that got me on a uh Rabbit hole was I also listened to one of your guys's friends Oh, I actually found Sal on who's been greenfield. Yeah, and he's really huge on amino acids And he's like amino acid with whey protein is like the way to do it. So now I'm like deciding. I'm like mind pump Ben greenfield How about this we don't sell on amino acid And on top of that in ben's defense. Okay, because I love ben If you've ever seen that guy's routine what he does and if you were it's insane Yes, his his activity level is nothing I would think that the three of us in this room are are probably closer to your lifestyle or the average person's lifestyle Ben greenfield probably ben greenfield is an anomaly Ben greenfield is one by himself in a category like I've never met of all of our friends There's not another friend I have like him as far as like the way that guy trains Rigorously all the time and a lot of it is cardiovascular. So he's running All the time and doing physical stuff like okay If I had that much activity in my day Maybe I would consider supplementing with something like that in addition because he'll do sometimes where he goes on A run for an hour and then an hour or two later He's lifting weights or doing or doing archery or something else like okay Someone who's got that much physical activity on a regular basis Makes a little more sense to play with something like that or I could see that being more beneficial Guys like me and the guys in this room and probably you not so much Yeah, but I mean again the studies are very clear on this I mean I'll supplement with protein or I've even supplemented with essential amino acids only when my protein intake is low But if it's high, it makes no difference. It's like you're throwing You know, it's like you're in a pool and you're throwing water on yourself You're not gonna get any more wet. You're already in the pool. So it doesn't it doesn't make it doesn't make a difference unless You're having trouble hitting those targets But I mean, you know guy your size if you hit 170 180 grams You're probably you're probably hitting enough and if you want to add essential amino acids You can literally like I said, you could do 10 grams Of whey protein instead of six essential amino acid pills and you'll get more essential Essential amino acids from the 10 grams of whey protein, which is like a tiny, you know It's a sliver of a scoop which is why the move for me for you is literally bump every Meat meal two ounces. We're always going to go natural You go you bump every meat meal by two ounces and no whey protein No supplement pill is going to trump that now. There was a second part to your question I think we might have missed if you wouldn't mind re-asking that again Yeah, I want to throw in one little Quick closing thing first of all, uh, you said that you kind of referenced the podcast you put out Like a few days ago I'm about just meals that you guys eat that you think are really awesome I listened to that and that is super awesome and I eat Most of the things on that list So I I think that's really cool Um, and I would kind of like to see one of those for supplements to what you guys are actually using every day I know you've said ones that are good to use Ones that you could use but what are you actually using every day that you think is good for longevity? I like that. I like that for a single topic. Yeah, you really want to know what I think every day There's a huge just hey, there's a huge discrepancy between the four of us I recommend and then there's the advice I don't take that I do for myself. That's okay. That's a good That's a good episode That's a good one and then a second one too and this I got this idea from Ben Greenfield He did a thing where he went through his whole routine Which is absolutely insane took him two hours to talk through it And then one of the questions they asked him was What does your wife do and she doesn't do anything? So I think it could be cool to hear what your guys's wives do because I know you talk about You know them working out using your programs and the whole thing So I think not only you guys, but what your wives are actually soaking up from what you guys are doing too would be cool My second question I agree I think those are good episodes And I think a lot of people would gain value from because I actually think that our wives and us are pretty fucking normal But yet we're all a little bit different as far as how we have exceptional wives I mean, could you imagine being married to us how annoying that would be? I mean those people are like Yeah Other than the last question. Let's hear it. Let's hear it So you guys talk a lot about uh natural living ancestral health and the whole thing But you guys don't at all or I've kind of researched and haven't found anything of you guys talking about organ meat supplements It's really clear that Before we lived in civilized societies. We would eat organs first before we ate muscle meat We would give the organs to our women first and we would eat them You know above anything else we could eat But a lot of people don't supplement with them I think a lot of the upper echelon health people talk about supplementing with you know liver or heart or whatever But I haven't heard that from you guys. So what do you think about organ meat supplements? Why don't you talk about them? Yeah, no, we have we brought them up and we actually worked with a company called paleo valley and they have an organ supplement That I think is really good and I've recommended them organ meats are very interesting Number one, they're so nutrient dense. They're the most nutrient dense Meat first off animal meat in general is very nutrient dense, but you go down to organ meats They're so nutrient dense. You can actually run the risk of overdosing yourself on things like iron Uh for meeting like lots of liver for example, that's how that's how dense they are So it's a it's nature's literal multivitamin Very very potent. Here's the bad part about them. They don't taste good And we're talking to the general public and I could tell people eat kidneys eat heart eat spleen eat liver And no one is going to listen to me. I've never had a client Like hear me say that and then go home Cook up organ meats and be like this is amazing and I love it. Nobody likes them. They don't taste good Well, there's also a they are incredible. There's also a hierarchy, right? Like if uh, if I'm and I would say 90 of my clients I ever trained Under consumed protein same thing that you're struggling with right now And so uh, if as a as a coach I'm gonna focus on helping you giving you some basic advice Like I just gave you bumping your meat by two two ounces and that's going to become more beneficial than me telling you Hey, take this organ supplement. That's really what it so we always try and focus on the I think the hierarchy of sustainable Yeah, but I tell you what I mean, I I took just some liver pills the other day I see sal take them all the time. So we utilize things like that We've also had episodes where we've told people to take uh, I know sal talked about this a long time We actually were on like an organ meat talk kick a long time ago We actually talked about it a lot early on in the early days of mind pump And we were giving tips of how Sal would he would freeze like little one ounce chunks of organ meat and then mix it in With like his his regular like yeah, so I do like ground beef. Yeah So if I do like a like, you know 10 ounces of ground beef I'd put like an ounce of ground liver and kind of blend it in there and sneak it in and you can't really taste it And the kids would eat it type of deal But yeah, I know we're big fans of organ meat, you know in the back in the day when a child is before Supplements or multivitamins existed, you know if a kind if a kid came in And they had you know displayed low vitamin D or iron or if a woman was anemic Before we had supplements doctors would would prescribe eating liver Or cod liver oil, you know kids used to take cod liver oil He said like force it down kids throats and in fact if you watch old old cartoons You'd see like kids like fighting their mom and they're trying to force feed them a spoon of something It's cod liver oil that they would give their kids But again the downside is it tastes it's not tasty, right? So but they're amazing They're definitely amazing But now supplements exist if you have a nutrient deficiency. I mean you can technically You know, uh, you could satisfy that deficiency with a multivitamin or A specific supplement, but I'm a I'm a big fan of I want to make it clear too Like we this is none of this is new science Like we've known this for a very long time the value of organ meats and and amino acids And why you see it as such a high talking point from uh, so many people in this industry Is because they're they're normally peddling a supplement. They're selling a supplement And that's and so it is it's the truth It's uh, and there's decent margins still left in that because there's not a lot of margins in in a lot of supplements And so You know to me if if somebody is is talking to you about that the very first thing that i'm going to ask is like Do they How do they sell a supplement that is related to that and and that right away should give you this red flag of Why they talk about it so much we talk about it But we don't make a we don't I mean we're sponsored by coming like paleo valley But we make if we sell a 10,000 organ complex versus one It doesn't change the way we get paid advertising for their company So we don't push it and talk about it that much because it's not on the hierarchy of things that we can help people with Does it mean that we don't believe in it or else we wouldn't be connected to it? Well for the people that it helps it helps a lot. That's right. Yeah, that's right But that you're talking about a very small percentage of people when I think of all the things that I'm going to address and drill home to them like let's get all these other things in order And then we can talk about some other things that can also potentially benefit you And so, you know, I I would always question that first is when I hear advice like that And then they also are selling that supplement. It's like, okay They're going to drill that home so much harder because of course they make money off of it And so now that being said I give my kids organ complex. That's the supplement that I give them Most often It's got those those great nutrients that I know that their bodies will need because they're growing And my kids Hate organ meats have to sneak it in if I give them any Getting them to eat actual liver. It's like It's worse than pulling teeth and I'd rather I'd rather not create that bad relationship of food By forcing them. So I try to sneak it in and I'll give them, you know organ complex from paleo valley It's very easy to take just a few capsules. So So wait, that's awesome. Thank you guys. All right, man And I'm looking forward to your your daily routines and and what your wives are doing too Appreciate it, bro. Get back to playing golf. Thank you Thanks Looks like he's playing golf right now, doesn't he? Yeah, no, it's a You know, good question good discussion and you know, you hit the nail on the head adam And I do want to state it differently That when there's a product to be sold You're going to get a disproportionate amount of information directed towards that product And it's going to create the illusion or the perception That that is more important because you're getting so much information Regarding that particular thing not saying it's not important to look at essential amino acids But it's done intentionally. It's just it's just they're selling it So there's going to be more content more blogs more podcasts more information Directed toward this and so the consumer They the perception they get is oh my god essential amino acids are way more important than Looking at my calories are hitting my protein targets Listen one one of the things that The audience probably has no idea about that we talk about off air And we have many many times is creating our own supplement line Obviously, we have a large enough audience that that would be a a multi-million dollar side of the business if we chose to do that One of the reasons why we haven't aside from the margins being terrible and all the other bullshit that comes with it Is because it could potentially move our message Then it's hard if you have a a major revenue stream that is coming from that to not give it attention You would be a poor business person then right if you didn't So if we if we can find ways for us to monetize this business without having to pedal supplements It doesn't steer our conversation around that topical time. Otherwise, it would be hard for us not to do that You know what it reminds me of it's like when statins were invented They're very effectively lowered total cholesterol numbers And so what was the focus being placed on in in medicine was cholesterol total cholesterol Got to get that low and it was almost like they ignored all these other Because we need to look at all the all the metrics. That's what gives you the clear picture It's not just total cholesterol, but now we have a medicine that can lower it for a hundred percent We can lower your cholesterol. So what was the message center around right? It was centered around that and it gave the perception that this is the most important thing that I should do And all these other things don't matter as much because all the information was directed that way And that's what ends up happening with our space because of things like supplements and Well, there's just so many things to cover and so at a certain point like you're going to get Different motivations from different platforms different people, you know representing certain things like there's so many avenues of health and Fitness to focus on and aren't we choose to focus on the biggest movers Specifically and yes, you know, you can make arguments for a lot of these supplements that Help in certain instances and situations and in certain types of people that would massively benefit But is that the majority? Yeah, I also try and put myself back in the shoes of what being a 17 to 21 year old kid who didn't really have The the expendable budget that I have today And I try and give advice from that perspective versus me today Because if you looked at sal supplement bag He probably walks around with a thousand dollars worth of supplements all the time But you also have the disposable income to play with those things if you were struggling and and gas prices going up And it was cutting into your weekly budgets and your paycheck to paycheck You wouldn't be taking all those supplements that that that money would be going to those things and so that matters too It's like when i'm talking to somebody it's like, okay, if you if you have Three to five hundred dollars a throwaway every month, then why not play with all these supplements? They're just have fun. They're not going to hurt you. They are beneficial and have fun with them add them to your routine But other if not i'm i'm going to first give you advice on the big rocks the big movers first It's also this like as a kid I remember getting advice from someone it was the right advice and he told me Lift full body three days a week eat a lot of chicken eat a lot of tuna fish eat a lot of rice Get good sleep and i'm like, ah, he's not telling me the real stuff like had he told me take this pill Yes, this cool supplement cost a hundred dollars a bottle. I would have been right on it Yeah, you know, so it's just it's just one of those things that we got to constantly battle Look if you like our information Head over to mind pump free.com and check out our guides We have free guides that can help you with building muscle burning body fat getting a better squat We even have guides for personal trainers. You can also find all of us on social media So justin is on instagram at mine pump justin adam is on instagram at mine pump adam And you can find me on twitter at mine pump sal How do I Incorporate cardio and not lose muscle seeing people do this before where they'll start to lose the sharpness of their muscles Or they'll start to lose the sculpt a little bit and that's disheartening But if you do it right then you minimize that muscle loss or that metabolism slow down In fact, if you do it right You can actually speed up your metabolism at the same time that you build stamina and endurance You just have to be able to kind of program it properly and the way to program it improperly It's just go do it as much cardio as you can for as long as you can right