 Good morning sir. Good morning ma'am. Please sit down. Thank you sir. Mr. Garg. Yes sir. After your law in 2019, have you been working anywhere or? Sir, I have been working as a research assistant for a book which two of my professors are writing. Okay, where? In Nalsar? Yes sir, in Nalsar. Okay. So, this is not on-spot training. I am doing it from home only in a remote fashion. And what is the book about? Sir, the book encapsulates all the supreme court judgments which have happened till date. Okay. Where we are evaluating all the judgments on 25 different parameters. For example, what high court the case can be. Okay. Now, with a law degree from a leading institute of the country, what made you decide to appear for the civil services? Sir, the dynamic opportunities which are provided in civil services as a career that attracted me towards civil services. And apart from that sir, the element of public spirit and public work which is enshrined in civil services, that was another motivating factor for me. Okay. So, is this your first attempt? Sir, this is my second attempt. I had appeared for the interview last year also. How many marks did you get? Sir, I got 184 marks. 184 out of? Out of 275 sir. That's a good score. Yes sir. You didn't do well in the written? Yes sir. I did not have very good scores in my law optional. So, I missed the cutoff by about 10 marks. Okay. Okay. Good. Didn't you get any of the class 1 services? No sir. I did not get any of the services. You have done law in 2019. So, what is the latest element which you have gone through of the supreme court? Sir, one recent order which was passed by the supreme court was regarding cancellation of bail which was given to one of the accused in the Lakhimpur violence case. Apart from that sir, there is also the hijab order which was challenged in the supreme court and the supreme court has refused to grant any stay. Now, in case of the bail granted to an accused in Lakhimpur, what are the observations of the supreme court? Sir, the main observation of the supreme court was that the victims in that particular case were not granted a chance to present their side of view when the bail petition was going on. On the basis of that, the supreme court cancelled the bail saying that the victims should also have been heard before the bail could be given to the accused. All right. Now, it is said that a bail is a rule and jail is an exception. Yes sir. What do you mean by that? Sir, it means that jail should only be given in extraordinary circumstances when the gravity of the offense is very high and when there are chances that the accused might flee away from investigation. What is the main purpose of not granting bail? What is the objective? Sir, there can be two main objectives of not granting the bail. The first can be that the accused can influence the witnesses or other evidence in that particular case. For example, we have many cases in which the witnesses turn hostile due to intimidation by the accused. So, that is one reason. And second is, sir, there are also some chances where the accused might flee away from the country so as to avoid prosecution. So, that can be another reason for that. Then, do you support that the merit of the case should also be discussed while granting bail? Sir, while ideally merit of the case should be discussed, however, that will mean that we are prolonging the litigation proceeding to a large extent. Since hearing on merit takes a lot of time, it would mean that the accused will be in jail for that particular period of time. And then logistically, it will become very difficult to grant bail purely on the merits of the case. What is public trust doctrine? Sir, the public trust doctrine is an environmental doctrine in which any natural resources or public property which has environmental significance. The government holds that property in trust for the public and the property should only be used for the welfare of the public and not departed for any private purposes. This was given by the Supreme Court in the Kamal Nath case of 1997, sir. What is Bicheri village case? Sir, Bicheri village case, if I am not mistaken, is the case on Indian Action on Environment Legal Forum in which certain chemicals were released by a hazardous factory in, I think, the state of Rajasthan. And the Supreme Court laid down the polluter-pace principle in this case, saying that it is the responsibility of the company to not only recompensate for the harm which has happened, but also restore the field or restore the area in its original pristine form. Which is the grand norm in the country? Sir, the constitution is the grand norm in the country. After China-India conflict in Galwan, some experts are surprised that the Indian government is not asking for a status quo just before the Galwan incident. Why is it so? Sir, while I am not entirely sure about it, my understanding is that the government first wants to reduce the number of friction points which are present. For example, China has been patrolling at a patrolling point 15 while earlier they were restricted to, I think, only 12 or 13 patrolling points. So, sir, my understanding is that they want to first reduce the friction points which are present and then go for a status quo. Have they succeeded in that? Sir, to some extent, for example, we saw that how China had controlled the elash heights, if I am not wrong, in the Pangangso area. Over there, the Indian troops have been able to remove the Chinese, but negotiations on patrolling points are still going on, sir. On the contrary, during this scuffle, India has occupied a very strategically important point at a height. India has given it up, but China has hardly... What was that point? Sir, I am not entirely sure, but I think it was the Kailash ranges or the Kailash heights. No, there was a specific name. I am sorry, sir, I will have to redo that. But we have given up something. Yes, sir. They have not given up anything, substantial. So, are they succeeding? Number one. Number two, India was a great parokar of China joining the UN Security Council. Remember, in the early days, there was... Today, when it came to doing something for India, George Bush was very particular. And Chinese opposed tooth and nail India joining NSG, National Supply. Yes, sir. Why it has been so? Sir, answering the first part of the question, the reason India... Spotted. Sir, I was answering the question regarding why India lost the point on which they had earlier acquired. So, that was in exchange, where Chinese troops also moved back at certain conflict points. And in turn, India removed its troops, which had controlled the strategic location near the Pangyong Seoul Lake. Regarding the second part of the question, sir, the reason India supported China's Wait for United Nations Security Council in the 1948 or 49, if I am not wrong, when the communist government came into power was because our political executive at that time believed that the new regime in China was the worthwhile or the correct regime, which had... They should reciprocate the suggestion. I am saying that. Whatever reason we had. Why is it not happening? I mean, our relations are always sharp. What does China wants vis-à-vis India? What is their ultimate objective? Sir, China has multiple objectives with respect to India. The first is territorial control over certain areas which they claim as their own. For example, Arunachal Pradesh or areas in the north of the country. Apart from that, China wants to establish its own hegemony in Asia and it sees India as a rival power. Apart from that, China feels threatened by India's rise, especially in the economic sphere and believes that it should be the dominant power and position and should lead Asia forward. What in India should not be in that position taking Asia forward? Coming by your observation, China already has a position in the Aksai chain. 38,000 square meter square kilometer area. Not for today, from the late 50s. So what more do they want? Now, for Galwan, Lathi also, they have accrued something there coming. So everywhere, Doklam also, they have come in. So how much more they want from India? Why? Because economically, four times their GDP is bigger than India. So India will never be a challenge to them financially, economically and trade wise. So hegemony, I can understand. But how much? What is your prognosis in Afghanistan? These are with India. So India has certain strategic and geopolitical interest in Afghanistan. For instance, our first main interest is regarding security of our borders from northwestern part of the country. We saw how in 1990s, after Soviet left the country, there was an increase of Mujahideen terrorists coming into India. So that is first. Second, India also has a... What is prognosis I am asking? I wouldn't say next 10 to 15 years. Sir, while India presently does not have any diplomatic engagement with Taliban as such, however, it is said that the Taliban regime is here to stay. So India will probably have to eventually start forming ties with Taliban in the long run and also protect its own geopolitical interest. For example, we have the Chhabahar port and our link to Central Asia goes through Afghanistan. So that is something which is strategically very important for us. Apart from that, we also need a surety that Afghanistan and the area around... When you go via Afghanistan, necessarily to the Central Asian states or most of it is through Iraq. Sir, presently... You can go to Afghanistan. That can be one access. Okay. That is one of our objective. Apart from that, sir, as India has repeatedly mentioned that we do not want the Afghanistan territory to be used for any terrorism activities or any activities which destabilize the security in the region. Sir, while if we go by the previous record of Taliban, it is difficult for it to happen. It will not happen. Then what else? And apart from that, sir, we also have an interest regarding humanitarian issues which are going in Afghanistan. India is always believed in an Afghan led and an Afghan driven process where all the people, including women and minorities, are taken into consideration for the rights. Thank you. Thank you, sir. You are a mixillologist. Ma'am, I have some interest in studying flags. What is the origin of this word? Ma'am, the origin goes back to the Roman period. Bexillum used to refer to a bowl on which a cloth would be hung. And this was a horizontal cloth, not a vertical cloth as you see in flags right now. So from there, Bexillum was taken as vexillology and consequently vexillologist's word was derived. Which is the oldest flag in the world? Ma'am, presently it is said that the flag of Denmark, which originated in the 12th century, is the oldest flag. And which is the only flag in the world that is non-quadrilateral? Ma'am, Nebo, Nepal, is the only flag which is not quadrilateral. How is it, it's in two? Yes ma'am, it is two triangles. Two triangles. Yes ma'am. Which in your view is the most beautiful flag in the world? Ma'am, my sympathies definitely lie towards the flag of our country. Of course. Because, yes ma'am. Impartial. Yes ma'am. And ma'am, apart from that, I feel the flag of erstwhile princely state of Hyderabad has a very interesting history. This was a flag which was yellow in colour and had a kulcha, a flat brick on the face of it. And the story is that when Asif, Yes ma'am. Yes ma'am. The story is that when Asif, I am forgetting the name of the first ruler of Hyderabad, he was going to Deccan to establish his rule. He met a Sufi saint who predicted that his seven generations will rule Hyderabad and he would give kulcha as a prasad. So, keeping that thing in mind, the flag was decided to be a yellow flag with a kulcha on the face of it. Correct. All right. You are also studying Supreme Court judgments. Yes ma'am. Which recent judgment fascinated you? Recent. Yes ma'am. Ma'am, one recent judgment is regarding, only two days ago, regarding the stay on demolition of illegal encroachments which was given by Supreme Court. Although not a judgment, it was an order which was passed by the Supreme Court. But that was an important intervention which the Supreme Court did. Apart from that ma'am, if we go a little back, the right to privacy judgment, I think was one of the most landmark judgments which the Supreme Court has given in this particular century. And consequent to that ma'am, the judgment which decriminalized section 377 of the IPC and section 498 of A of the IPC were also very significant. Thank you. You are from Nalsar. Nalsar I think recently announced something which is in tune with the, more what you call, when I look on LGBT issues. Yes ma'am. What was that which Nalsar announced? So there were two things which the college has done. One is to announce a draft policy to include LGBT and queer community into the college premises. This includes awareness, education, and also specialist courses. And apart from that was the infrastructural changes which the university has done. In the hostel. Yes ma'am. For example, we now have a separate hostel wing for students who identify themselves as LGBT and also gender neutral toilets. Very good. Now, what is a non-compete clause? Ma'am, can you just take five seconds to think about it? Yes, yes, yes. Thank you ma'am. Ma'am, non-compete clause refers to a clause in an agreement in which it is said that one particular party will not have a similar trade or a similar business while going in the future. This is generally done when a particular company is acquired by some other company so that the same brand name or the same product cannot be used. Apart from that ma'am, non-compete. Yes ma'am. It is about an employee, you know. If he leaves, it is an employee who leaves the company. Yes ma'am. He has to sign a clause in the contract that he will not work in that company for the certain period. Yes ma'am. Why did it come up recently very much in the news with relation to an Indian company? Ma'am, it came up recently with regards to, I think, enforces or DCS. Yes, correct. Why? Ma'am, because it is said that there is right now a lot of poaching going on in the IT sector because of increased investment coming to India. So a lot of employees are leaving at traditional companies like enforces, DCS for new startups where they are being given salary perks to up to 200 or 300 percent. So that is why it was said that enforces might start invoking the non-compete clause so that the employees do not go to other companies. Would it be legally tenable? Such a clause. Yes ma'am, because the Section 28 of the Indian Contracts Act specifically provides that while there should be freedom of trade in a rate, however, in certain circumstances reasonable restrictions can be imposed. For example, not the employee not going towards a same industry for some period of time or not opening a shop in a certain area for some specific period of time. So it should be legally tenable ma'am. Now on the Russia-Ukraine war the Prime Minister of UK was here recently at the conclusion of his official talks bilateral talk, what was said about this war? Because UK holds a particular position in conformity with a particular group. We hold another position. What did they say about it? Ma'am, Prime Minister Joris Ponson mentioned that although the Indian political executive has privately informed the Russian political executive regarding why the war should not be taken however, since India has old ties with Russia hence UK or for that matter any country cannot lecture India on what specifically should be done in this particular case and India has its own neutral and a separate stand based on its historical and future relationships. Thank you Ma'am. Lavish is how you are called? Yes sir. A colleague has talked to you asked you about this Ashish Mishra case and you admit the specific observation they made are you able to recollect what did they say actually? In the context of Supreme Kutsa? Yes, when the bail granted by the Allahabad High Court was rejected what were the specific legal language that they used there? Sir, while I cannot recall the specific language but the assent of the statement which Supreme Court made was that Yes sir. But you are a lost student so I was expecting something very specific. I am sorry sir, I cannot recall the exact language at the moment sir. He said unbridled participative rights from the investigation to the culmination of the case. This is the kind of word. Thank you for telling me. What is the current status of marital rape in the Indian context and how do you get a redressal to that? Sir, presently marital rape separately is not recorded under the NCRB data because it is not a criminal offense. No, it is a legal status. I am not looking at numbers. In any case. This is section 3. Legal position as it stands in terms of legal status. Sir, section 375 of the Indian Penal Code penalizes rape. However, exception 2 section 375 specifically mentions that any allegation of rape by a wife against the husband will not be tenable and that is an exception which has been given. However, the Supreme Court in a 2017 judgment has said that any marital rape which happens against a girl below the age of 18 years of age that will be considered as rape only and no exception under section 375 can be availed in that case. In case of the major? In the case of major, the marital rape is not illegal in the country. The only recourse which a woman can have. That is why I said redressal also. Sir, the only redressal which is available is to pray for cruelty under the marriage act and ask for a divorce on the basis of that. IPC provision? I am not aware, sir, about it. I will have to read on it. Any other IPC? This Abu Saleem's case again there were some remarks passed by the Honorable Supreme Court a couple of days back. Can you recall what happened? Sir, Abu Saleem was extradited from Portugal and one of the conditions which was given by the Union Government was that no capital punishment or punishment above the period of 25 years shall be given. Sir, the Supreme Court reprimanded the Union Government saying that the affidavit which has been filed by the Union Government was not correct and regarding the quantum of punishment which should be given that is something the courts should be deciding and the political executive should not have a say in it. The Executive, what was taken by the Executive over which they felt beaved? I am sorry, sir, I am not able to recall at the moment, sir. I did read on it. First, get the case heard and merit because the 25-year period is due somewhere in 2030. There is enough time for that. Thank you, sir. What is this Nawab Malik's case that they have again issued some orders? Sir, Nawab Malik has been detained by the enforcement directorate for certain allegations under the prevention of money laundering act. Supreme Court, no, the case, I know. Do not go through that. Okay, sir. Let us, what is it that they came up for? I cannot recall at the moment, sir. I am sorry. I will have to ask for an apology. He wanted a you know bail application. Right, sir. Okay. The case was against PMLA, no? Yes, sir. What is PMLA? PMLA is the prevention of money laundering act. It is an act created in 90... Right. So what is the specific issue of the PMLA which is, I guess, which is charged? I am sorry, sir. I will have to read on it, sir. I am sorry. And you were saying that you were working between your completion of the course and now you are working to look at some Supreme Court cases. I could not follow you. Can you say that again? Yes, sir. So in this study we are looking at all the Supreme Court judgments which have happened till date about 60,000 of them. And we are evaluating them on different parameters. For example, under what constitutional provision or statutory law the case came to the Supreme Court? What high court the case came from? And the aim of the objective of the study is to have better data so as to make a judicial... Who is doing this? Sir, this is being done by two of my professors in college. You are helping them on that? Yes, sir. I am working as a research assistant. So otherwise I am wondering if there are any AAR in SCC and all that. What is the use of more of a kind of classification kind of thing? Yes, sir. Thank you. Thank you, sir. Mr. Garg. Yes, sir. The dispute between Punjab and Haryana over two issues Chandigarh and SYL canal have been revived. By the resolution passed by the Punjab Assembly and by the Haryana Assembly. What can you tell me about the legal implications so far as the Chandigarh issue is concerned and the SYL canal very briefly. Sir, first regarding Chandigarh, under the 1966 reorganization act it was said that Haryana will get a new capital. However, that was subject on the condition that Hindi speaking areas from Punjab, specifically Fazelka and Abohar will be transferred to Haryana. Okay. Since that has not happened therefore transfer a new lateral transfer of Chandigarh to Punjab will be bad in law since it goes against the reorganization act. Regarding the Satyaloji Amra Ling canal On the issue of Chandigarh, has the matter ever gone to up to the Supreme Court? No, I don't think so. Sir, according to the best of my knowledge there has been no matter in the Supreme Court. SYL canal Sir, with context of the SYL canal, first in 2004 and then in 2016 the Supreme Court has specifically said that the act of Punjab to not create the canal is illegal in nature and it should be constructed at the first instance. Apart from that, since Haryana has already constructed its part of the canal and Punjab has almost completed 90% of it still due to various political reasons or since it's a emotive issue for the public over there, the canal has not been linked. Punjab has constructed how much? Sir, about 80% of the canal was already constructed by 1985 when the Rajiv Longowal Accord was signed between But then subsequently the Punjab Government had abrogated that agreement, isn't it? So how did it reach the Supreme Court? Sir, first in 2003 if I'm not wrong Punjab had passed a law in the State Assembly saying that all the agreements which Punjab has done previously, those are null and void the Supreme Court rejected this in 2004 and then Punjab Government again passed a new law saying that the land which was acquired for construction of the canal will be given back to the farmers and the Supreme Court also held this. Okay, now you heard of Kulbushan Jadav's case? Yes, sir. What is the issue which is now at why it is stuck the matter? Sir, the International Court of Justice had granted an interim stay on the execution orders and after that the court had also said that Mr. Kulbushan Jadav should be given to the Indian councillors under the Vienna Convention However, Indian diplomats in Pakistan have said that free and open access has not been given for Mr. Kulbushan Jadav. There is something about the trial also which is pending, isn't it? Sir, the International Court of Justice had said that although a military trial can happen, however, it should be subject to checks and balances apart from an appeal which can be filed. Right. In providing that, sir. In the Government of India has been insisting that for a free and fair trial an Indian lawyer should be permitted. Right, sir. And when Pakistan did not accept that also, they said, okay, someone who is already recognized internationally. So that is where the matter is pending. Okay, thank you, sir. Now tell me, on this NRC National Register of Citizens a lot of hue and cry started in 2019 when the Government said we are going to create this document. Now is the NRC to your knowledge already a part of the law in the country? Sir, the Citizenship Act as it was amended in 2003 is provided for making of an NRC so that any illegal immigrants, they can be... Correct, NRC by Section 14A of the Citizenship Amendment Act, right? Yes, sir. But how did the Supreme Court picture regarding NRC and Assam? Right, sir. Sir, under the 1976 Assam Accord... 85. Thank you for clarifying. 1985 Assam Accord. It was said that an NRC will be done for Assam so as to differentiate between three criteria... Not 85, 85 only said post-71 will be detected and deported. Yes, sir. NRC issue came up later on. In 2003, there was a tripartite agreement in which it was mentioned that the NRC of 1951 will be revised, will be updated. So how did the 1951 NRC take place? Any idea? Sir, if I'm not wrong, in 1951 an NRC was done for the entire country and specifically for Assam, in 2003 under the Accord it was decided that it will be updated. Right, okay. So we end your mock interview. Thank you, sir. I'll give you a feedback. Mr. Gurg, the fact that you are a lawyer you've done it from a very, very prestigious institute and the fact that you are currently engaged in, you know, coalition of Supreme Court judgments, etc. So this is an area on which you will be asked a number of questions so you should be prepared for that. You have a lot of time, your interviews on the 17th of May. So the first thing I would suggest is that you go through this CD which will be given to you. And see what are the various questions which are asked and where you sort of did not have complete information and try to fill up those gaps. Yes, sir. Then normally in the interview, questions can come from your DAF and also from current affairs. So in your DAF the fact that you are a law student and you have been helping you are collating the Supreme Court judgments, that is one area in which you must be very, very familiar. Then you know, of course, Vexology you've already mentioned, you've a fond of Bhangra, that also you can respond to questions. Table tennis is the only game which you have sort of shown and interested. So table tennis be absolutely clear on what are the international events, where do they take place, what are the national events, who are the national players, both men and women, international players, top players. On that you can be asked certain questions. Now the other area from where you could expect questions, generally current affairs. So that you would have to read. Nowadays the Supreme Court seems to be sort of very busy. Seems to be more busy than the executive. So you read these things carefully. Now my colleague asked you a question on Abu Salim. Abu Salim, it was the Tadakot which had said that their role is to apply the law. When Abu Salim raised the issue of the agreement between the sovereign agreement between the government of India and the Portugal government, the Tadakot said that is for the government to decide we will follow the law. And they gave him a life sentence. That is the crux of the issue. And the Supreme Court pulled up the MHA because the response given was sort of wishy-washy that after 230 we will see what are the various avenues available, something of that kind the wording was used. So what I am saying is that all these various matters are being reported very, very regularly. So suggestion would be that you read these very, very carefully. This is the current issues which are going on. Also you mentioned the Supreme Court decision on demolitions. But that was in relation to what happened in Delhi, in Jhangirpuri. But there are other, there are previous decisions of the Supreme Court relating demolitions. After all these two huge buildings in Noida are to be brought down by the Supreme Court. It is under the Supreme Court direction. So be very clear when you are asked a question and the other suggestion would be try to be brief and directly to the point you may have a lot of information but wait for the member to ask you. Supposing they ask you tell me something about this, about that then you answer it. Otherwise listen to the question, answer to the point. Because the time is limited in the UPSC interview and where you are not very sure of a question which is asked you do not know. Don't waste your time. You say sorry sir, I am not aware of this. So then the member would go to another issue. You are good. You have good knowledge and brush up on these things after a lot of time. One observation because all of us I think somewhat got carried away by the fact that you are a law and most of us have some background. Don't think that we will be limited to law. This is one thing I wanted to sort of because it was just of the cuff kind of interaction we are having. As our colleague has said you must be very well and thoroughly updated on current affairs and the happenings. The minute details of that and day-to-day reading the newspapers and going into depths of these issues. Thank you. I will take care of that. We wish you all the very best. Thank you. Thank you. Don't forget to like share and subscribe to our channel and press the bell icon to never miss an update.