 Big hustle, big shit, big shit, big shit, big shit, huh It's a unique hustle, nigga, big shit, big shit, big shit, big shit, huh Name another podcast like this Check it, check it, check it, this is a unique hustle This is your boy, E.C.O. And I'm here with the lovely, amazing official Mr. Michael, what's going on? Nah, nah, nah, you know my dad, what's going on? Man, we got a special guest in there, man This guy right here in Los Angeles, we in the building, man I got my boy Big Huchy in there, now, man You about to go down, man How you doin'? What's up? You out of Dallas, originally, but your roots here now Well, yeah, I mean that's what they say, I've been here long enough to get money You know, the sequels will say something like, that'd be like the earth is my turf No, because I still love Dallas, like for real, yeah But I've been in the music industry and I've done it so long So it's kind of like my second home, so I could say Forza Music Industry is concerned and then, you know Growing up here as well, but I grew up both places, back and forth Wow I would go there summers, I know a lot about Dallas, you know Growing up, so I still have my roots, yeah Yeah, so you know how to get off a half-thirty or twenty And get over to another street over on a six-thirty-five? I know how to get around, if I need to I won't get lost like that So, man, you know, we just wanna, you know We slight learn and curve, but I'll get there You know, people don't go by directions or whatever, they fall on anyway Wherever they're going, oh, let me put it, cause it's just more convenient, right? That's right Man, check it, man, so just you being out here, man I wanna go back into the back story when you moved out here, right? Okay From West Dallas, you came out here, just how was it when you first came out here and being such a young age? And why? Well, I came out here, you know, originally My family is in the music business, my uncle's Willie Hutch, my father's Richard Hutch They were both writers at Motown and composers Willie Hutch did the Mac, you know, they wrote for the Jacksons, the Miracles Commodores, so on and so on, you know So that's how we landed in California, because my father and my uncle was in the music business Yeah So we came out and then from there, I stayed out here and then I ended up When I was a teenager, I ended up meeting EZE and Dr. Dre and Leyla Yeah And at the time, they were starting Rufla's Records And so I joined forces with them and then we just took off from there, you know what I'm saying Rufla's Records, NWA, EZE, Above the Law, so on and so on, Cocaine The DLC, you know, I came from when they first developed Rufla's Records Yeah, but You know, and all that Yeah, y'all slid on it, because you came from West Dallas, y'all You come down there, you took the DLC from us, which you needed to go I remember, man, I hate to go to work Dr. Rock and all that Feel the Fresh Crew, yeah That's kind of how you guys end up linking with him, right? That's right, yeah, it was at a mall, they performed the Feel the Fresh Crew Performed at a mall and they liked Docs Yeah, Big Doc took him Yeah, but the boy still held on to the Dallas Cowboy Jersey Oh yeah, you know, we don't do that anyway Yeah, but yeah, I'm from the original Rufla's Records family So when you guys, you got out here, when we getting on into the music deal Just like you being one that when that first took off, you know You didn't see that depicted in the movie, actually No But we know that the movie can be swayed a little bit They can't put everything in the movie Of course What would you like to see in the movie? I'd go there, I wouldn't even go there, I'd see a few years of it But no, I mean really, really what I would have liked to see in the movie Is kind of like, I think Easy didn't get as much as he should have gotten You know, because without Easy-E, Rest in Peace Easy-E, Rest in Peace Camp G Without Easy-E, doing what he did I don't think any one of us could be where we are today You know, because his decision making for us Actually having something really, really huge, that was his vision All that was Easy's vision, I mean the other guys The other guys end up benefiting from it You know, which, you know, I love Dre, Dre's my brother I love Cube, Cubes are my mother So are you telling me they twisted the plight? Not really Because you just said it was Easy's vision But in the movie, it made it look like it was more Dre That pretty much wanted to make that happen Yeah, we couldn't have done it without Dre Of course And it's all you Yeah, but I think Easy-E kind of got looked at as the rapper who died from AIDS And he was just a brilliant dude You know, he was brilliant You know, Easy-E, without Easy-E, you don't even look at the music industry The way you looked at it back then Like for instance, if you look at the East Coast The East Coast was more doing like, just rapping against each other He's the one who decided to get behind really back in the reality rap He put his own money up, his own street money up, you know And then he kind of got overshadowed because the way he passed, you know But he put all of us in the game There's no DLC there, there's no above the law There's no any of these great things There's no Death Row Death Row don't happen without him putting the money up Because at the time, Dre wasn't really huge Dre was a really creative person But he wasn't really huge Like I said, you are definitely hitting it on the nail when you say Because Easy, for me, you know, when those songs came out being an older cat I really rock with Easy way before, you know Dre was around, don't get me wrong But people don't realize how long N.W.A. was rocking Before that whole movement happened They kind of bypassed it when you're an old nigga like me You came past by, I still remember those albums And I still remember those moments When an Easy E-Track would come out It was projects coming out of Ruthless Man And that's another part, like you brought up Like after the fact of them breaking up We still had big success We had cocaine, above the law, bone thugs and harmony Those records were huge in the Easy E stuff After Dre left was big too You know, so that's the thing that wasn't in the movement That's what answered the question But that's God You say, what is he talking about? That's because they couldn't touch that Because there's probably going to be a point where Maybe a little easier or something Or you or somebody put together a project That really really shows love to Easy And I'm going to be honest with you If you do it, there's still If a budget gets behind something like that That's a move that's really going to depict things You know, another thing that didn't get showed in there Was the fact that like J.J. Fad J.J. Fad actually, they're the reason why The label even happens Because Super Sonic, the sales of Super Sonic Made it to where we were able to actually Establish ourselves as a real serious label Yeah, you know And Jerry Heller, I mean I won't say anything about Jerry Heller Bad, rest in peace, you know God rest it dead But without Jerry Heller I don't think we could have made the success that we have Either, you know what I mean Because at that time, you tell my 1988 We couldn't walk up in the record companies And get distribution like what Jerry Heller Had to offer You know, and a lot of those companies Wouldn't listen to reality rap Because it hadn't hit yet, you know Now people kind of look back at it Now think like, oh, these dudes talking street They talk street records, you know Make street records and they like Oh, it always was like that No, it wasn't like that It was at a time where labels didn't even want us We sold platinum records Golden platinum records With no radio Yeah So that was an incredible thing That they didn't really give easy that shine And straight out of the company, I believe Again, that's the reason It was a great movie, it was necessary Because I think NWA is the greatest group Of our time, you know For when it comes to like impact Because it changed the whole course Of how hip-hop was done at the time But how hard is it, man It's getting easier and easier This guy down in, shout out to my boy C. James Got a magnificent movie called What is it, nice guy's finished last But took this and made this movie On his own budget with just a black magic camera Oh, that's dope So all I'm saying And it looked better than most productions I'm saying the talent is out there To create a film, he writes There are so many different writers I know You can do so much on your own I think people are so caught up in their mindset For back in the day that they don't realize The power they have right now To do whatever And to pretty much put it in their face In a way to where you don't have to put it out But you say, hey, look what we got And next thing you know, it makes a big You know, some impact Where somebody buy that off of you Yeah, you can straight stream, too That's right You don't even have to go to the studios anymore Like with straight out of the company You know, it was a lot of red tape With the studios Correct For that movie to even come out You know, that's why it took so long to come out But you're right now Moving past what we was going through To the pandemic and technology And how it is now Come on now All these streaming networks Oh, you could just put a film together Dave Dash just won an award For a film without a script Really? Yeah, I forget what the name is He's just won an award for it Man, that's my boy right there That's my boy right there I like Dave Dave makes me feel like I'm the main runner I've seen that nigga Man, I've seen that nigga Have Andy He'll pick him so hard At a show one time He do not play about us, bruh That's one thing He ain't playing It don't matter where he at He gonna shine for his people, man I gotta give it up today, man He have that soul Like Eric had that soul You know, Eric always stood for all of us And that's why I think We've all went so far in our careers Because of without him risking His own street money To do it It was hustle money And him getting behind Everything that we did We wouldn't have made it Where we at You don't get You don't get artists in a rock and roll hall of fame Without what Eric done So, you know When the movie came out It talked about And I'm not gonna stay on this movie too long No, you good It talked about When It had one scene where Shug looked in the room at He looked in the room at DOC And he had the thing on him And he was telling Dre You know You don't want this to happen to you Or whatever Is that kinda stuff added Or do you think that was real? Well I mean, you gotta put a little Hollywood to it I know what I'm saying Is there Hollywood Or is that really You know, him That the way he was moving Or, you know I mean, Shug Shug I I will say this about Shug Shug And this is Shug gets a bad rap A lot Well, Shug was the first person who stood up For all of us You know, when things were wrong At Rufla's record Shug was the one who stood up He said, look The paperwork is wrong You know It's not the fact that It was wrong when you signed it Because we were kids Coming out of the hood The projects Or whatever, you know So every contract Was a good contract But after you established something He felt like, okay You guys are selling records now We need to renegotiate This is not fair He exposed that So it wasn't anything wrong with that I think later in his In his game You know, in a game In his career He started really pressing Really hard on the wrong kind of people Right And that was his demise I think at first he was You know, he had a pure soul You know, for us He was like, look Okay, these are homies And you doing them over Because he had good knowledge And he, you know He was laced up by some good people You know, to know what was going on For his business concern So he told us He was like, look This is not fair Some of us went in and renegotiated Him and Dre decided to leave the label They decided to leave Ruflas And start Death Row Which was dope for them You know, we all were going to The crazy thing that people don't know That it was so bad at Ruflas Records at this time As far as the way the paperwork was And it's not that no one was getting Fucked It's just the fact that it wasn't fair That everybody had to go and renegotiate Everything and then Eric's biggest thing with What should and Dre was He wanted to deal with Dre direct Because he had a great relationship with him He felt disrespected because He bought a whole other entity And then the same thing with Doc Was the same way He just felt like that So we just decided to let him flow Let him go You know, with us We had to stay above the long cocaine We end up staying Because we had a new contract But we all were going to go with Dre Because Dre is who was Kind of like, if you say The head coach of the team So me, as a young producer Who studied under Dr. Dre I wanted to go with him Because she would ask me Would me and him want to do a partnership Going into business with him So I was like, okay I was a staff producer at the time So I was like, okay I can get higher up on the The ladder going with them I can get more out of the company But unfortunately I end up EZE Ended up offering me the liaison job At Roofless And then they went on And started their throw him, Doc And Michelle A But you make it sound real Smooth transition But Dre Day only makes easy pay day Well, yeah But you know why that happened But you know what happened Because you sound like a pristine Right here But I know That something went on To make that song come It was something in there What happened? Okay, so Okay, like We entered an agreement Well, as Roofless We entered an agreement to Where you had Dre Doing everything Like, we were at Epic Dre was named doing everything I was doing some stuff You know what I mean Like, I would produce Above the Lord cocaine He would produce NWA We would assist each other like that What happened was They all, you know The bigger label found out So when they all broke up All the paperwork Went crazy So Should And Eric Get into it Yeah, yeah He forces Not by He just forced Like, oh, I'm threatening you To sign this paperwork Eric signs, right? But it's under duress So when you're under duress It's not Exactly It's so Right, it's not binding So When they went back To negotiate Eric negotiated 25% Of whatever Dre did At Defro That's why he says that And now, so that was real That's real, yeah How long was it for? It was just For those For a limited time It was some years I don't know how many years it was But it was some years It wasn't just for the chronic It was for whatever His name was on Basically, he'd get 25% of it Yeah So when he said Dre Day only made Easy pay day That was a real statement That's the truth Yeah, he was A true business man like that How was he Dilling with Snoop Dogg During this time During that time How was that Because when he came With Dre It seemed like He came through us Snoop and Warren G came through Above the law Really? They were going to be signed What happened to Nate Dogg? That was 213 At that time they were 213 Yeah They came to our camp Okay They came When really Warren was pushing Snoop All the time Because Warren used to Understudied with us You know Above the law In cocaine And When he ended up coming He just used to be around me Learning how to produce At that time Snoop comes And then they come And they're like Okay, we want to do this thing All right, I was like Cool But that's when we all broke up As a group As a whole clique We all broke up So they just went to The death row side Yeah And then Dre came back to me And was like Hey, you know I want to sign a kid I know you was developing him Is that cool Because me and Dre are still Friends, you know We're broke So I was like Yeah, he's incredible You should do it You know, we got to stay And I'm saying it to you Because it wasn't no funk It wasn't no funk like that It wasn't no funk like that The only people who had funk Was Eric and Dre Because they were so tight And he felt like he was betrayed Because real talk, y'all On y'all network And what I tell everybody Yeah Is Eric was so deceived By Jerry Heller He didn't understand Like, he was too young He was a young entrepreneur And he didn't understand Like, okay Y'all just trying to Press me, like Jerry is cool If it wasn't for Jerry We wouldn't have XYZ So he kind of sided with Jerry So And that's what they showed in the movie Yeah, so Dre felt betrayed You know, but at the same time Eric told me He was like Me and Eric had a real argument About this I said, man, listen You letting the homie go We family You know, we built this together You know what I mean He's like, man You know, why you fuck Dre And I said it just like that Because we brothers He's like, I didn't fuck him And he showed me all the paperwork Showed me all the He actually showed me the checks He said, but my problem is this He want to put sugar in my face And I don't know sugar for no business If he want a piece A more of a company He can have it But he got to ask me We started together That's right And they were like When I met them They'll tell you that they were brothers I met them at the same time Laylaw bought me to him Laylaw from NWA bought me to him Me and my brother, DJ Chaos My brother, Go-Mac And my brother, Reston Pease, KMG He bought me to them three And so that's all I saw when I was at Roofless It was them together So when me and him got into it He was like, man, you know That's kind of disrespectful He said, I had a meeting with them two Dre never looked He hit his head in the book The whole time And she was talking to me So that's disrespectful We supposed to be brothers So he said, they hurt him So both of them was kind of like You know, at odds Because of the personal part of it None of it ever sounded like business It just sounded like He ain't treating me fair I'ma go over here with you, Shug Fuck him But all of us was like torn Because we cooed with Eric And we cooed with Dre and Shug And Doc and Michelle A That's why I say it wasn't no beef So when Snoop and Warren and Nate Wanted to go work at Death Row We were fine with that You know, that was cool We was like, okay everybody We can't do anything Because we were kind of in turmoil Then Eric passed So then it even went more haywire, you know Tell me, what's going on with the new Death Row? It's owned by Snoop It didn't do anything about it I love it It's great because Snoop owns it now Okay, I just had to ask you that That's a new thing That everybody Somebody that's a survivor owns it So that's great And it's Snoop You know, I think he's one of the one Person that deserves it Like one of the people that deserve it I mean, Dre, he has so much money He's out of the stratosphere So it's great for Snoop to be able To still control the legacy So I want to know Back in the past when you were just starting up Okay In the beginning of your career I know there's a lot of ups and downs In this business Tell me about a time where Depression Because we all go through that You know, all the notes that you heard You were up here and then you came down here You know what I mean How did you deal with depression And what kind of depression did you face And what caused it? The hardest thing I think for me Because like I tell you I came up in the streets And I came up hustling That's how I met all of them But when I came to Roofless I made a great relationship with Easy When Easy passed That was a bad time in my career Because Eric always held us Like in high regard Like whatever we wanted to do So that was kind of a dark time for me Because we didn't know where we were going to go One, two We done everything according to Like someone letting us do what we wanted to do And then we started dealing with other labels And it was really And you used the word depression Because now you in big board meetings When you could just call your home And be like, I want to put this record out You know what I mean Now you're in big board meetings And more people are saying no than yes It's taken you a year to do an album When the shit usually only took you Like three months to do an album now Because you've got to meet with so many people You're trying to raise a family You're trying to maintain that And then another time was when my brother passed And he was my partner He's my partner Making music together He rapped with me And we've been knowing each other Since the sandbox date So that's another thing But people want you to go with what you're saying People still want you to make them records People still want you to It's like a selfish thing But they say put it all in the music Because that is therapy within itself But again, you do this music Put it all in music But yet it don't get the response that you want Yeah, but I think with music The good thing that I've learned with music Is you can't please everybody Because that doesn't really depress me That doesn't really give me the dark space I can just do it again But I think it's harder It's harder on you When you go through personal things in life And you have to be able to try to navigate Through putting it through the music It's really hard Even when you look at You might have family struggles It's hard to put it in the music And actually deliver something that people want to buy Just because you're going through something Don't mean that it's interesting for people to buy So that's another struggle But I think how if I tell young artists I tell young artists just do what you feel Because you don't have control over What's going to happen And that's how I got it through the dark times Just different things And how we came up was we came up Like say you guys grew up together And then all of a sudden y'all hit big And you guys are world known You're doing world tours now It's going to be a shift in How y'all feel about life And you're going to grow apart a little bit Like a lot of people are going to grow apart And that's what happened with us Like when it was basic When it was just simple Doing it, making it It was easy But when money came It started tearing people apart Let me ask you something Let me ask you about the architect of the G-Funk What's going on with that man Bring me up to the game The architect of the G-Funk is Me and cocaine We did a group together Funk Soul Hip Hop Band We've been working on it We say we've been working on it for 30 years Because I discovered him I put him in a game I brought him to Roofless Records But it's a 14 song collection That me and him put together I produced the whole album He did the vocals Me and him wrote and composed the whole album It drops on September 18th The singles out right now The Boogie Man The Boogie Man And we've been working on it We started working on the album Like right before the pandemic The pandemic stopped us Because we actually The cool thing about this album We actually went to the studio together and done it Oh yeah? We didn't dial files in You know, emailing files So yeah So you could vibe off of each other Absolutely Yeah, because we always did All the records together Me and him produced together All the records that we Because we wrote for NWA Wrote for EZE We wrote, composed for Above the Law We worked with Tupac Snoop, this goes on A long list of stuff we've done Like with different artists But together we've never actually Done the album together Me and him So that's dope, man Hey, hey, hey Did we go get that funk back? Oh, that is, yes And it's all G-Funk You know, I'm the originator of G-Funk I created it You know, I'm a young producer That created it Everyone else kind of like Was influenced by me The chronic is highly influenced by My theory G-Funk out Yeah, yeah G-Funk era Went hard Went real like, boy, that was hard Yeah, so, yeah That sound is a sub-genre And hip-hop's on very proud of that You know, to be able to be the producer That actually gave the industry that theory That time period was a time Where it was like People don't realize That you had the chronic album You had the G-Funk period That era we were going G, it had a wave That was serious It was a serious wave Right It seemed like it had its body in there Like you can't talk about hip-hop And not understand that G-Funk era happened You know, that whole wave, I mean And it's funny, we just done it to be different In NWA We wanted to be a funky You know, we wanted to just do We wanted to rap the funk music So I slowed the beat down And we started singing on top of it And KMG and cocaine And we just started harmonizing on top of it And then it birthed from there And then Warren is birthed out of us Out of a bubble of law So that's how the G-Funk era Ended up being highly influenced Like that How hard was it after Easy Dive For you to really like your publishing And all the stuff with his wife? His wife, pretty much I was on the outside looking in You know, if I'm in Texas I'm just looking from the outside But it seemed to be an agitative situation Very For busy bone him as well Very It seemed like It seemed like You see, I got one word for it It seemed like I was catching hail You know what I'm saying? Very So it was a real thing Yeah, but see Shout out to Bone Thug and Homie too Yeah It was Because you got to realize One thing that people don't realize is that None of us knew Tamika At all She just came out of the blue Like, who the fuck are you? Wow And then she was handling the business You know, she came to my studio Like late one night Oh, I'm handling everything now Who the fuck are you? You're some bitch that Easy was fucking Yeah What the fuck are you? And that's how I felt But then it started becoming like After they The courts went through their thing Started being harder and harder and harder I would We would have stayed with Ruthless But like my man said How difficult was it? Very very difficult You know Like that's why it's no Ruthless records anymore Because she's very difficult You know Who's that? I heard somebody say that That they bought the rights to That's what we thought Somebody Maybe they were just saying That somebody said that They bought the rights to Yeah They do And they gave it to Easy Easy Yeah, it's the rights It's the rights to do all the Ruthless Apparel Apparel And all of that Yeah But not the music side Yeah Man But you know Here's the saddest thing about that Those kids should inherit that label Yeah You know I think all the kids Should inherit that label She still has the label Yeah, she's a wife So yeah, she got everything The mother didn't even get it Because they got married on a death bed Wow Yeah, y'all know about that right? Yeah, I see They got married on a death bed So And it just pretty much took over the Man Yeah, I mean Easy The bad thing I mean the great thing I could say about With us with Easy Above and Long Cocaine Our contracts were up when he died Wow So we were able to But doubling back And getting royalties and everything Was very, very hard Wow You know, she's hard to deal with I don't even know how they dealt with her For the movie Really? Because she'll sit in the meeting Be like, I own it I own that WA I own EasyE And like, okay And what does that mean, bitch? Like we built the label What are you talking about? No one here Is even working at the label anymore The people that came through the door at EasyE And you'd like bragging about you owning something Like What's the point? You're not doing anything with the shit I own that WA But you ain't letting nobody You license the music You don't do nothing Wow Man, I hope we did him justice Anything we leave out You gave a lot of info Yeah, you gave it up Yeah So when you come back to now How can people get a hold of you If they're trying to reach out to you If you want to reach out to me You can reach me On Instagram and Massimoosa Royal You also can meet Reach me on Facebook And Massimoosa And on The Real Code 187 On Twitter Top three artists of all time did our live Top three artists of all time did our live Any genre Any genre Number one Oh, man Prince Number two Michael Jackson Number three Oh, wow Let me see Well, that's a good one It's gotta be a rapper to me Tupac Okay That's everybody's thing What do you say to Chris Brown They say Chris Brown better than Michael Jackson Please, don't do that Don't do that to yourself I'm just telling you what they're saying, man Don't do that to yourself I'm just telling you what they're going to do That's a rhetorical question You said a trick word on TV Rhetorical, man Man, it's been an honor and a pleasure, man Whenever you back in Dallas Can I say this one thing? Also, you guys can You can get the album We have returned On September 18th You can get it on our website And that's Buddy Boy Buddy Boy Music B-U-D-E-B-O-I-Music.com Man So, amen Thank you for coming on the show, man Thanks for having me, y'all Say, man, you family now When you come to Dallas You gotta come by Me and cocaine go come out there We do have a run We do have a run coming up So, okay And we gonna call DOC here in a minute Oh, you got to I'll hit him up and say Say, hey, you need to do boss talk You gotta do boss talk, man Say, he gonna say, hey, maybe a home team, man Boss talk, one on one Boss talk, one on one What a boss is talk Because you from the I'm from the land You from the land That's what they say out here Who's from the city, man The city, yeah Check it, man Shout out Dallas, man Shout out West Dallas West Dallas, man West Side where you reside Man, check it, man It's been another great segment Of boss talk, one on one What a boss is talk And we out