 Yeah, that's it. Bring him in. See if you, I mean, what's your original way to resign. Yep, should we get started? You want to wait for Eddie or? Go on text. It's Dariel coming. See who's Eddie. He's sitting down there, Alan. He's in the CM's office. All right, we'll give him one more minute. Sorry. I don't think it's going to be nice. But yeah, you give him a year. Okay. I know how you do it. We dropped Shagel's resigns. I think we'll keep the core together if they keep them. All right, let's go ahead and call the order. It's like 25 seconds. It's another minute, 25 seconds. Well, you know, once Rafael closed the door, that was the sign. Time to get moving. Let's go ahead and call the roll if you would. Council Member Eddie Alvarez is absent. Council Member Jeff McCrekey. Here. Chair Chris Rogers. Here. We have two present and one absent. Do we have any announcements? Thank you. Thank you, Chair Rogers. Good morning. Just a really quick reminder, we actually made this announcement at the full council meeting on December 12th. We have recently had some staffing changes within the department. Raya Sadellarosa has left the city of Santa Rosa. And to fill those shoes, we have moved Jill Scott, who is our real properties manager, over to the team. And Jill will be covering an acting role as a deputy director of economic development. Under this role, really, Jill's core responsibility will be to move forward with the strap plan to really start forming up more of a business attraction retention component to the team, understanding also the need for small business support. But really the important piece is getting into the implementation strategies and that strap plan, which will be the core conversation for today's meeting. So with that, I'll hand it back to the chair. Congratulations. Let's see if there's any public comment on the announcement. What was the official title you have now? Deputy Director of Economic Development. There you go. Deputy Director. I will move to approval of the minutes. Did you have any amendments to the November 14th minutes? Nope. Let's see if there's any public comment on them. Seeing none. Let's show those adopted without objection. Good. And then let's go to public comment. Yes, sir. I'm here. I'll come up there on the front so you can see me better. I don't like to talk behind people's backs. That's not good. Hello. My name is Dwayne DeWitt. I'm from Roseland. I wanted to thank you all. I hope you had a good holiday and I hope you'll have a good new year. I brought a couple of flyers here that are important. I'm going to talk about the city. The city has a program now to help with down payment assistance for housing within Santa Rosa. You also have a forum coming up in two days about housing. I was hoping that you folks could actually prioritize it to be housing in the downtown specific plan area. And closer to the smart station type approach. I know that this is city-wide so anyone who's trying to buy a house is going to go for whatever they can get. But by the same token if the city gave an incentive and said listen if you'll come in closer we'll even help you get more benefits I think are the terms for it, right? And that's not something I'm trying personally to do so I'm not here to advocate just for me. This is for young families and this is for the city to have economic vitality. Having people live here in this core footprint area is what's going to get us going. With that in mind I don't know if those of you who are here remember that the transaction that involved the former AT&T building that then went to Futrell Development was premised on the idea that housing would go into that building and that hasn't occurred yet. So I believe that you should talk to these people such as Mr. Futrell and others and see if you can get this type of a program going for condominiums in these buildings down here and do something like that town home approach something that helps us here locally with the economic development within our core area. And then last but not least in your documents that I was looking at today what's up brother this is my man from another neighborhood right Rosalind's in the house so you know I get to talk about Rosalind now because a portion of Rosalind is in your downtown specific plan going out on Sebastopol Road there's an area called Roberts Avenue that is primed in a way to be developed in the future for housing some people come in and talk with you and say they've got ideas about what should go and how that should go I'm not here to tell you that I'm here to say you folks should reach out to the United States Environmental Protection Agency for grant funding for what's called community-wide planning and assessment of an area such as that and then also reach out to other entities such as the US Department of Economic Development that's what you're about they got a federal department and I heard until they have billions of dollars this is the year to get it because if the last president comes back in as the next guy we don't get a chance for seven months to try to get that funding so please reach out to those folks and okay you got this wired it's inherent now in me I think you know it's like instinctual any other comments yep welcome thank you sir we'll move on then to item 5.1 that's our draft economic development strategic plan Crystal are you putting the mic there is it on here the file folder should be open for you with the presentation and can you also note in the records that council member Alvarez is present appreciate it thank you and his presence was here before he was here he's ever present he's ever present ever present that's why they call you a gift they're always present that's right must be must be present to present present present totally changes to the www on your website stop all the way to the music that's all we're still there talking about it you gotta look you gotta look that's good you do your job all right we're on business now that's exactly what we're talking about okay good morning everyone how are you good so today I wanted to start going over the actual implementation piece to the strategic plan so I know you've all been through multiple meetings many meetings and city council meetings on the full strategic plan. But for the last several weeks, we've been working on paring down and focusing on the actual implementation. And so we've put together kind of a draft of how we see the first few years of the implementation going. And we'd love to get comments from you on if that we're going in the right direction, if this is what you were thinking. So I'm gonna start with kind of the key areas of implementation. So the key areas that we see, and again, focusing down on the plan for these areas and also thinking about the staff that we have in economic development, which is two people and has always been. And the amount of work that needs to be done as I go through this to prepare us to start for these, to get ready for these attraction plans. So the first one is investment Santa Rosa attraction program. And this is the large business would be a large business attraction. Entrepreneurship and small business support, expansion of economic vibrancy. That's in that plan for the first portion of it, the implementation. We're talking about the downtown asset strategy, which is the surplus pieces that we're already having process and expanding on that program, as well as the reimagination of any vacant sites or dead zones that we have first in the downtown and then moving out to parks and looking at those. Oops, sorry about that. Okay, who's going to use this? Okay, so the next one and then the online platform, community investment programs we're going to continue with obviously, we already have those in place with all the ARPA support programs. And then the childcare support program, of course, keeping that going and in line. And then the online platform implementations, which we need to do quite a bit of work on. And I'll go through those a little bit. So first of all, online platforms, as we see it, we need to create one business friendly city brand over the years, over many, many, many years, 20 plus years. There have been different forms of city brands for a business attraction. I think I've found five or six so far over a long period of time. And so we feel the need to work on with the community as well and with the council on one specific brand that's city focused for the city of Santa Rosa on business attraction. That's kind of our starting platform. Then we need to create an online information services and toolkit center. So the one stop shop, we've talked about this for so many years in council. We would love to have a physical one stop shop where everybody can come in, they can get all of their needs met in one area and not have to go from room to room or different places. Unfortunately in the building that we're in right now, we've looked at many times creating a one stop shop and we haven't been able to do that in our current existing facility. So I see that as a little bit of a longer term goal as we look at a new building for city hall potentially in our future, which I'll talk about a little bit more in the coming slides. But for now, we think the way to go is to create a really, really fabulous virtual one stop shop. So everybody can go there, they can get all the information they need, what they need to do, create videos to do that, make it very user friendly. And that's gonna take some time. So this is all preparation for all of that attraction that we wanna do, that business attraction. We need a few software programs which Gabe and I are already down the road with looking at two specific ones. We need something for demographics. It's consistent demographics. We need something for land availability, which we have some, but we are looking at specific programs for that. You'll hear me talk about preparation of land for business attraction a lot. And then we need some tracking software. And so we've identified some software that we're looking at now and having IT review. And then we need to implement some online dashboards for tracking and performance. So we need to be able to report out to the community and to the council and just to our exact team what's happening. So like those ARPA fund dollars. I'm sure you all wanna be able to just go somewhere and see, hey, this is who got the money. This is where it is. This is how much we've expended so far. So we're gonna try and create some of those dashboards to make it really easy for you to see the metrics of where your dollars are going and where you've chosen to program the dollars. And then we're trying to put metrics to each section. So clear metrics so we can look at the programs as we're going through this over the next five years. And after the first year, after the second year, after the third year, really look at it and see what have we done good, look at our metrics. What have we not done good? What are our percentages for business licenses for whatever these metrics are and adjust the program as needed and be able to report out to the community and to council how we are, what we've done and how well we're doing. The big one for this is the investment as our attraction strategy. This is large business attraction, which we all know that the city, fiscal responsibility and fiscal improvement is a very high priority for the city. And this is a big thing for bringing in that fiscal and economic growth that the city desperately needs. So we need to build a whole program around business attraction. Again, going back to, we need to do all the homework to have to be prepared to attract those businesses. So we can't just go out and start using our playbook to bring business in when we're not prepared yet completely. So this is all the internal preparation until we get our playbook in order and start engaging it. And so there's a timeline and metrics that we've prepared for that process. I'm not gonna go through every single one of these. I'm happy to answer questions on it, but the big one I did wanna address is land development. We are not prepared as a city yet for land development in my opinion for not city owned land but privately owned land. So Gabe and I have been working on the whole team really on trying to identify land development. We're working with Ashley and with Jessica as the planning team to make sure that we can be nimble in our general plan because that's our biggest plan up here, right? And our specific plan, make sure we have what we need in there to be able to be nimble to change some of the uses on the land to be able to bring those businesses in because if we can't do the land use easily, that's a hurdle for bringing business in and what they're looking at. So there's quite a bit of background work that needs to be done on that. We need to identify key expansion areas. I like to do a business and we can do that in house of business gap analysis to see where we are. We need to look at if we already have clusters, if we already have the romerations formed and can we build on those? What do we have now? What are our top ones? How are those businesses doing? We need to know what the major operating expenses for those businesses are. So we've already started to make appointments to work with the businesses to find out what are their operating expenses? How can we help with that? How can we make that better or put an attraction plan together to make that better so that we're trying to inquire new businesses to come forward? We're prepared with all that information. And then here's some of the targets that we're trying to look at. The first year is mostly just assessments of the playbook. So we'd like to get that information compiled, share it with council, make sure we're going in the subcommittee, make sure we're going in the right direction, identify those target businesses, know where we already have those clusters, those automations, where we need to build, where our holes are, what do we need? And then start and hopefully begin the outreach in the first year. It's an aggressive plan, but we're hoping that we could get to that point. In year three of AL, it's a little closer to the metric. So do we have the increase in land readiness in year three? How much progress have we made in our outreach to businesses? And are the negotiations with business in process? Have we reached those points? Are we making headway? And then year five, which is the end of this plan is really stringent. So what's the percentage of our business licenses? Have we increased our business licenses? What's the increase in job creation? Expected tax increase and a full evaluation of the program and if it's working and where we need to go. And then if we're doing well and the areas we're doing well, we need to believe we need to work on implementation of to sustain the long-term growth, not just short-term. And so then we're on to entrepreneurship and small business support. This is really growing and helping out, supporting the ecosystem of small business in Santa Rosa and that's all over Santa Rosa. So building connections, creating partnerships, also looking for places where we can build workforce development in the small business or we can get students in for mentoring or students in for working to learn one build a workforce and one teach them how to build their own business. We're a plan to connect with the state, EDB is building a huge website right now that Raphael and I have been looking at that really has a lot of support for small business that's helped with building a business plan, helps with everything that they need, connecting the correct people and getting that information out with websites to know what they're doing and then social media support from the city, help with funding sources from the state and the county for their capital stock to be able to start a business and then really looking at immigrants, BIPOC and women, our premier is what are the hurdles? How can we help close that gap with the hurdles? And then again, the evaluation metrics. This one, because we do have a little bit more in place versus all this support year three, I'm really looking at the percent change in business licenses, the percent change in startups, a little higher metrics. How are we doing? Because we do have a little bit of a program in place now. And then economic expansion of economic vibrancy. This is, you guys have heard a lot about it at council. Again, this doesn't touch on everything in the economic development plan. We're hoping that we can start with these basics, build on these and then start adding in the things that we really wanna do as time is going on and as we're successful with our basic approaches. So continuation of the downtown asset strategy. So we need to complete the development agreements with the two developers that we have on the two surplus parcels that we've started, identify grant more grant funding, expand programs to address additional underutilized city property if there is some and what are those active uses, those alternative uses, start with the downtown and then move to the outer areas. Reimagining empty or dead spaces. It's kind of a big one. We hope in the years to come, as we're more fiscally able to, that we can set up a economic development or real estate fund to be able to look at those dead zones and do feasibilities in certain areas that we all agree need to be done. And then the last one, which has kind of been our long-term goal I wanna keep on there is to continue to assess city hall complex opportunities and where we can go, thinking about that one stop shop and thinking about a potential future redevelopment of a city hall site. And then again, measurements for each of those. Where are we with the DDAs in year one? Where are we with any potential identification of potential business opportunities to reimagine all those spaces that we have especially in business parks and some in downtown to really boost the vibrancy and get people in and around our town. Year three is hopefully thinking about a feasibility fund to look at those dead spaces and how we can program that fund for certain areas. We're hoping pre-construction will be started on our two surplus sites by that time. And then looking at the percent of empty storefront. So we do have to come up with that percentage which the software package that I was talking about earlier that Gabe and I have been working on will help us with those numbers now to get a starting point and then to know what our ending point is. And then again, community investment programs. We're gonna continue all of the ARPA funded programs. We're in the process of just giving out grant expanding the grants for the first, I think, seven, five, seven facade, facade improvement grants, the park grants and the placemaking grants. The child support program is still continuing and in place. We'll put some metrics in place for both of those and dashboards in place, facade, parkland, placemaking. So you can see where your money is being spent, how it's being spent and what have we gotten from this? What has the community gotten from this? And then identify outside funding sources to try and continue some of these programs. So we know, basically, we had the ARPA money which was fabulous. We don't really have the ARPA money and once it's expended, is there an outside funding source or grant to help continue with some of these programs? And then again, as I said, build on those dashboards so that everyone can see where we are and what we've done. And that's really it for what we're thinking about for the beginning stages of putting together the program. And as I said, Raphael and I and Gabe and our whole team have a heavy lift to prepare all of this information and get those implementation packages ready, get the, you know, all of our online networking ready and then looking for support from the whole city to actually do the implementation of the attraction program. So we'd love to hear what your thoughts are if we're missing something that's really important to start with. That's it. All right, you wanna start? Thank you, sir. For myself, I think it's more common to anything that I wanna make on this topic. One of the things that I've heard is create an environment where the entrepreneur with overhead costs and how they approach overhead costs. You know, and we're seeing and we're hearing about in the paper that we're seeing all these businesses leave our malls and from business aspect of it, it's not so much what the overhead costs are, but it's more of the potential of revenue. After all, if you're charging me a thousand dollars but I'm making a million, a thousand doesn't sound that big, right? But if I'm only making 800, you're charging me a thousand, that seems to be your problem. So for me, it's more of what are we, and I'm speaking from the business owner's perspective that I'm offering here, what are we as a city of Santa Rosa doing to attract customers to our downtown corridor? As we all understand that downtown corridor is the jugular of all shopping centers of Santa Rosa. So I really hope that that maintains to be the focus. And it sounds like it is. And one thing that I believe I had a conversation with Gabe on in city chambers is what are we doing to approach the business owners themselves? And I believe that's, and it was a great response from you, Gabe, that that is definitely being implemented into the strategy moving forward. And I hope that it continues to be the strategy moving forward. So I'm grateful the high level stuff. I mean, I just have some more minor things. In terms of when we're, and I don't know if you can do this or not, but I'm just gonna throw it out there. In terms of assessing the future of the complex, the city hall complex, I'd prefer a prioritization of redevelopment over relocation, just because I don't wanna get to another point in 15 years where we are now, where we move to another place and then there's deferred maintenance and we're going like that. I think if we, I'd like to look at redevelopment, I don't know if that's getting some sort of windfall or an exclusion negotiating agreement or whatever it is, but I'd prefer that just to be able to start a new and then delaying where we are by another 10 to 15 years and putting preferably not us as elected in that position again, but some other future elected in that position. One thing I did wanna see and it just kind of came into mind was is downtown connectivity find maybe it's sort of a bridge. Cause I know, I know most of us are like, look at the mall and like, hey, if there's some way we can redevelop the mall and maybe open it up, get a pathway between. So it may not be a long-term goal, but more of a bridge from now until whenever that may or may not happen, but find a way to make connectivity between railroad square and courthouse square a lot easier and a lot more attractive. I've heard ideas thrown out there from everything from Chris and I's favorite electric car, remote electric car that we saw to trollies to whatever, right? Horse drawn carriages, I don't know but something that can get people from here to there easier than having to go under an underpass or throw parking for the official record. It was an autonomous electric vehicle that acted as almost like a street car in San Francisco, but would go around your downtown and pick people up and drop people off. And for the record, our city manager said it was not feasible. Yeah. No matter how cool it was, but I'd like to see something like that just as a bridge for right now. I think both, I hate the bifurcation of railroad square and courthouse square, but I think if we have to say it, both sides would be happy with something like that, moving patrons from one side to the other with ease. And yeah. No, that's, so one of the things that I really appreciate in the plan was the activation of, you called it, I think dead space, but I'm even thinking owned space that has future plans potentially slated for it, but isn't there yet? Like so for example, along our square, there's some spaces there that might be able to host a pop-up park that could bring parents and kids down to downtown to Eddie's point, help drive additional revenue or generation for our businesses. So I really liked that. I'd like to see that sort of explored a little bit more what opportunities that there are there and understanding as I'm looking at the attorney, yes, liability, I get it, and we can come up with a program or a plan. Talk to me a little bit about how we're going to approach emerging markets or emerging opportunities. Are you envisioning bringing consultants to help us with that? Are you thinking that we'll do that internally? How do you see that playing out? You like, oh, I'll go first and then feel free to add, Jill. I think that that's an excellent point when we have a very small but mighty economic development team it becomes an issue of the amount of hours in the day. I think when we get into our smaller community and creating those relationships, it's really important to not have a consultant involved in that. Those businesses need to understand that I'm there and Jill are there to handle those issues. The small businesses need to know the same. I think where it gets a little more challenging is when you're trying to find emerging businesses in other areas where you're canvassing those opportunities and understanding, are they going to work in Santa Rosa or not? And that's where you actually do benefit from a consultant-driven exercise because they have their finger more on the pulse of really what's happening regionally. So we're gonna have to figure out the balance of that but I think it's really important for the team to put the face on it and go out to where people are and get on a bus or plane, go talk to businesses about Santa Rosa. Do they understand what we're doing? We've put a lot of housing units into the market here and what comes next from those housing units? Is it more of a movement of goods? Is it more of the business falls behind that? We have to understand what those trends look like and that needs to be the core group. And then that supplemented by I think special studies to understand more of those regional things that are happening throughout the nation at the state. So later today we're gonna start discussing next year's budget. Is this something that we need to flag in that discussion because by June, by budget adoption, will we feel like we're in a place with this plan where we can start to fund different aspects of the plan that we wanna see roll out in year one? So I think where we are at this point, we have some initial funding for the plan and the implementation strategies on the plan. And right now in year one, it's more or less going to be a focus on building the infrastructure and the foundation of that. We'll pull together the pieces, we'll have a better understanding as we get through year one on what the actual internal resource needs are and what the external resource needs are. So I think as we go through it, we'll know a little more as we get into this fiscal year discussion, but they're happening rapidly. We'll more likely be looking in a next fiscal year sort of conversation to truly understand what sort of resources we need because we do have budget that we're working in in that beginning stage. And I think the importance of having Jill and I and the rest of the core team understanding, it is a two-person team, but it has a village behind it. And when we've been talking about a one-stop shop, we start talking about other resources in the city. It becomes sort of a coordination effort. And as we understand what that coordination looks like, then we can start identifying the resource needs in the various areas, but it is going to take a little time to uncover all of that. Okay, and then I know a couple of years ago, EDB did a analysis for one of the things that they said was a huge opportunity for Sonoma County in large was investment in women-owned and BIPOC businesses that that was seen as the biggest opportunity for growth economically. It also dovetails very well with our equity goals in the city. How do you envision that playing out in this plan and how do we craft some of this specifically to help women and minority-owned businesses? Yeah, we've got to reach out and we've got to do some surveying and we've got to get some connections in place. We need to find out what the hurdles are. I mentioned it earlier, and then we need to start addressing with the county and the state how we can meet those hurdles. So we can't do it alone as a city. We don't have all the funding that we need to do it, but we can with our partners. And so that's a huge priority on our part of moving forward. Yeah, I think one of the things that I hear over and over again from business owners, especially small business owners, is they're so focused on their business that sometimes it's hard for them to be involved in these discussions or to even go and really figure out what resources are available to them. And so making sure that we're crafting this in a way where we're also being really proactive in reaching out to talk to folks about what's available, but then also being flexible enough to say, what do you as an individual need with your business? Yeah, and there's a lot of resources available. I think that a lot of people are not aware of. There's some newer ones too, especially. So we've been trying to gather that together. And not only, I spoke to the library yesterday about getting some help from them on this. I think a lot of our outside partners can help us to reach out to those people and to get them the information that they need and the help they need, especially on business plans. That seems to be what I keep hearing even in my real estate job, what I'm hearing over and over again is the business plan issue. And there is help for that. So really just connecting, connecting the dots is gonna be really important for us. Yeah. Yeah. Interim Deputy Director of Economic Development. All right. Acting. Acting. Okay, sorry. They're legal implications. Yes. Okay, so that leads me to dovetail kind of off of Chris's question about resources. And as we start the plan, the budget planning process, this is the altogether fourth meeting. I think this has come before either the subcommittee or council. And the last thing I want is for this to be put on a shelf and gathered dust because we don't have the internal resources. So for me, and this may be an assisted city manager and a CFO question is, I think going into the budget process about how we implement this, knowing what the economic development department looks like is gonna help me understand budgetarily what kind of resources we're gonna put towards it. I love our team. I love the small but mighty attitude. I prefer not to be small but mighty. I prefer to be a little bit more robust than that. If we're gonna take on something at this level in terms of how complicated it is as well as how important it is to our community. And I mean, the first discussion we had was economic development touches everything from childcare to housing, right? So this is a hugely important document and plan that we're putting together. So if we're gonna put resources towards it financially, I need to know what kind of resources we're gonna put towards it in terms of person power. Yeah, and I know we haven't been quiet about, I know we've got a structural deficit with the city but we also have one-time funds that are still sitting there. That we see this, I see this as a council member as an investment that should grow the whole pot. And I'm perfectly comfortable if we need to use some of those one-time funds that are sitting there above our reserve policy to focus on economic development. I think it'll pay dividends for us long-term. Thank you, yeah. Have we seen for being repetitive as what I'm about to speak is both what I've heard from my fellow colleagues as well as from staff. And it has to do with the one-stop shop and how important that is and how vital that is, especially if we're talking about woman-owned or a BIPOC community-owned. It's a level of education understanding from those that might not know how to fill out that form. And for Rafael, you've seen it in Roseland prior to the annexation of Roseland and South Park, how important our bottle. You were to really the growth of Roseland specifically. So for me, it's really not who's in the room but who definitely needs that assistance moving forward. And taking account that it is an opportunity zone, again being repetitive, the efforts that we're putting forward to providing those resources information to that same community and how important it is for us to be able to be effective in those efforts as well. I also heard my colleagues support an autonomous trolley system. Absolutely. Why can't it go just a little bit more Southwest and then come right back? Or just electric overall. All right, let's go to a public comment then on this item if there's nothing else from staff. Yep. Going away from Roseland. You gotta move faster, you can, you got next. Emoryville has a thing called the Emory Go Round, okay? And it's been operating very successfully for decades. So there's things that you can do like that, specifically regarding the downtown area. Almost 14, 15 years ago, maybe longer someone proposed Sunday streets where you closed off 4th Street as you do during the Thursday or Wednesday market and that you do that on Sundays and allow people to have walking streets. Decades ago, there was a downtown task force. I think it's about 30 years ago almost and they put a report together. I started coming here and I listened to downtown business people put the kibosh on these types of things that you're now talking about. So I would ask for you to lead the business people in a way to the promised land. Let them see that these economic development measures that Rafael and others are talking about in Roseland are actually going to be helpful in the greater picture. Then there's a woman by the name, I forget, I don't want to misquote her name. La Texanita is the name of the restaurant on Sebastopol Road owned by a nice woman. Alamindis. All right, Alamindis. So the thing of it is is she and another young woman who's on the Roseland School Board could be the leaders of this Roseland economic development effort, whatever you decide to name it. And then they have already been talking with me for a decade at least. And you have Mr. Navarro at the sazon restaurant out of Peru. There's a lot of people from a lot of different countries over in Roseland. And they're working together. What we need to show them is that the city is going to be supportive of the efforts they'd like to take and that it's not a top-down type thing. So perhaps you could have a forum that wouldn't cost money. This happened in the past with Mr. Alvarez bringing some of those business owners when they had El Marcalito that was happening before it was destroyed. These are the dilemmas we face because we get an initiative going and then it breaks down. So if you could now start this initiative with your strong crew, Rafael, Ms. Scott and Ed to go out there and entice these women-owned businesses to let them put together a woman-led economic development business group out there. And then there's a lot of people from Somalia, Eritrea and long from Southeast Asia and Vietnamese. We can get those folks involved when they see that you're welcoming to them. They're already doing things but they put their money into their own ethnic groups financing programs which they have. So if we can show them to come to the city and work together with you folks on what you wanna do and I'll be putting the good word into the Roseland review that Mr. Alvarez and Mr. Rivera are reaching out to the Hispanic community and seeking volunteers. And I'll make sure everybody knows there's no money involved. There never has been money for Roseland. It will be, but we can make it happen with what's that called, social capitalism. Okay, thank you. I'm a gig hideout resident, homeowner of a record's neighborhood. I own two businesses and also part-time city staff. I'm not working today. So I wanted to address the issues of evaluation and the criterias that you have throughout there. I've been a professional evaluator and questionnaire designer and all that. I'm not pitching myself right now but I noticed some of the, I looked through the whole thing and it's everywhere, which is perfect. And some of them are pretty specific, which is good. And most of them are very generic and not defined yet, which is because you're not there yet. But what I wanted to say was that in order for any kind of evaluation indicator to be useful after all is said and done, it has to be very specific. And that takes a lot of really thinking. And most of the time people say, okay, we'll get that at the end and see how many you've done this. But at the end, sometimes you don't really have the detailed kind of question that, well, this way or that way. So you have to get those indicators in there before you start the implementation. And that takes a lot of thought and it often takes somebody outside, a consultant or someone who's not already into your mindset to say, well, how do you know that they're actually doing that? So anyway, my point is just that don't just put off the evaluation and the definition of the indicators towards the end and think, okay, we'll just add everything up and see how we did. It's gotta be designed in the beginning because sometimes you need to get that data when the customer comes in or when you make the contact or whatever it is. And that might only be one question or two questions, did you do this, did you do that? Okay, boom, we got that in there. And now you've got data that you can use at that evaluation at the end. So I just know that most people think, oh, I'll ask a few questions, we'll find out what's happening and it'll all be good. It's not that easy. And it really takes thought of breaking it down into like, well, how would we know that we got new businesses, but did we get the kind we were looking for? Are they really creating economic development or are they losing? And should we count that? So you can get deeper and deeper into it. And the problem is if you try to collect too much data, then nobody wants to answer any questions and it becomes a problem. So how to focus it into one or two questions that only takes 30 seconds to get that data and then later on down the line, you present a report that's not just interesting, but gives you a strategy for, okay, how do we build on what we did well and change what we didn't do so well? So that's my pitch. Thanks, gang. All right, I'll bring it back. Anything additional from staff? I think I have a comment, I think. So there is a pilot, I'm in the steering committee for a pilot trolley project and it's in partnership with the DAO. And the plan is to bring a trolley that we're so called around Breville Square and downtown sometime between July and October. The DAO has identified some funding to fund this trolley. They're also going to apply for a community promotions grant. But we're getting to the stage where we're going to find out what the lease cost is and bring the trolley up here eventually with the help of the DAO. So that's what we call responsive staff. There we go. It's okay. And one quick comment too regarding the entrepreneurs such in addition to business planning, they're also very interested in learning more about marketing planning and definitely access to capital, low interest rates. As I said, capital would be an ideal organization that it's out there to help a lot of these entrepreneurs but many others like Cressair would be ideal as well. Well, one good thing he left but I was going to give Dwayne some credit for Jada by mind on something that I've seen before and not to get too specific but when it comes to entrepreneurship and BIPOC communities, immigrant communities, one thing I've seen in Los Angeles and San Diego is basically the pooling of resources. So instead of someone from East Africa saying I would open a restaurant by my own and trying to fund it and everything, they open, this is just an example and you can do it for multiple reasons they basically to get a cafeteria and so it's like a retail space and they put five different restaurants in there. So you walk in and there's chairs and tables everywhere and you can go over here, East African food over here, food from Michel Kahn over here, Indian food. I think that's something that we as the city could help entrepreneurs kind of get to because I don't think a lot of entrepreneurs especially among immigrant communities or marginalized communities know that those kind of opportunities exist or it could be mutually beneficial. Yeah. And if I could add to that, I know that that effort was definitely made with the Mitote or Atiange which will be a word in an old language to say of a market and it was definitely beneficial. We actually saw some of the business owners move on and occupy other spaces within the city of San Jose. So it's definitely the incubator program that we see being very effective. I was just talking to San Diego and San Jose about this week actually and they have some great examples. Yeah. Responsive staff indeed. I know. All right, any final words on it? All right, with that word adjourned then thank you everybody. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.