 Good evening everyone Yeah, so I have a few questions for you before I you know start the discussion with my panelists I want to start off with asking how many of you remember watching Television channels when they were less than five Raise your hands. Okay. If you're first Okay, if you're first, okay Do you remember the ads that played that at that point in time? I do Yeah, I do raise your hands show me your hands who all remember okay How many of you remember watching channels when they were about 20 or 20 to 30? Few okay. Yeah, obviously excluding us like okay 20 to 30 and how many of you are on social media now? Yeah Everybody raise hands. Who's not on social media? Okay, how many of you have? Posted ever a picture or video of yourself on social media all of us, right? How many of you still watch ads? Okay, lots encouraging Okay, and that's encouraging You know the point that I'm really making is this one point in time and you know when I said how many Let's remember watching channels when they were less than five gives a very age we all like In our 40s and the others who raise their hand a few there are the 30s and all the others in this room Youngsters I can see and I think brand marketing has made a huge shift since we Started you know And the shift really that has happened is there's one point where marketers would craft their stories and Would take a lot of pain in telling their stories in a very elegant manner from there to now What happens is often we discover brands on maybe a Instagram? We read reviews about it. Maybe on a marketplace like Amazon or Flipkart or maybe a trip advisor we'll go and maybe watch a YouTube video on it somewhere and Then very often we are also happy to give our own point of view on our experience with that brand right lots of us have sent Not so good tweets about brands and messages to them, etc But we do participate in how we feel about a brand as well And I think that poses a real complex problem for marketers, right? So, you know today brands are getting discovered through fellow consumers and they're sort of Perpetuating the buying process right it's been completely changed So in that context I want to start off with you Pallavi and ask you that as a brand how do you handle this? Complex system. What is the playbook that a brand should have to navigate this complex system? Hi, everyone Already introduced to you Pallavi. I work with HRX and thank you Rubina for that Solid opening. I mean, I think it just gets us thinking a lot more about as marketeers and brand creators Since I'm the first one and I'm doing the opening. I'm just taking a step back and getting into an Slightly academic discussion about brand creation, right and what is a brand? If you look at the process of brand creation as marketers, I would broadly Classify it into three stages, right? One is the creation of the brand Which is not just a logo creation But you have to create a bunch of raw material which you're going to shoot at your consumer and it's the perception They will start Generating as an outcome of what you shoot out to them. So brand essentially is an outcome, right? It's not just a logo or a device Second stage would be the amplification TV Instagram social media direct marketing whatever you sort of start using The vehicle or the other carrier of your message becomes the amplification media and At some point in time we get into the transformative exercise of the brand But I I think what makes a solid brand And which is the most important point in the playbook of brand creation Would be the underlying factor to all of these things, right? When we were in college we kind of discovered something called a brand personality I mean you try drawing a pen picture of who your consumer is going to be how your brand tone would look like how your brand will speak to this consumer I Again sort of drill it down to another Level of detailing saying not just personality, but what makes a brand brand And makes it resilient something that can withstand the times and the uncertainties of time and the Abrupt changes which happens is the character of the brand Character drilling down to the character of a brand is a pain staking exercise It doesn't happen in one go I'm a fitness brand and I often give this analogy saying if you look at a sports person or if you talk about Malcolm Gladwell's 10,000 hours rule Anything for it to become successful and solid takes that much amount of time So even a brand needs to be consistent with its character with the message Which is in sync with its character and keep hopping on it like a sports person or a fitness Enthusiast does the same drill every day to arrive at a level of expertise, which is so possible Sometimes when you become better at it you even break it down to a micro level Take the same analogy to brand building you have to work on the building blocks bit by bit on a daily basis So if I'm a fitness brand I keep talking to the same guy saying hey, I'm a fitness brand I don't I don't necessarily talk the language of a product saying buy me But I talk to him and I converse to him saying I'm a fitness brand. This is what I do for you This is what my character is. I'm honest. This is the change. I'm trying to bring about I'm trying to buddy up with you and this message remains consistent over a period of time So the character is what creates resilience in that brand and that resilience is something which will help you sustain even a pandemic Brands which were just a label which didn't have that resilience which didn't have that character Unfortunately, we all are familiar with such sad stories. They fizzled out Some withstood Again taking off from heyday examples If you look at a brand like Colgate Everyone in this room can associate Colgate with an imagery of white sparkling teeth, right? If you talk about Lux everyone can probably remember filmy sitaroka Sabun And how many times have you seen these commercials like how many times on different faces different media different channel? Well, they've been made to become resilient over a period of time and that's how they have survived To me the playbook the most important thing is identify the character of that brand and keep at it keep at it Till you reach a stage where it becomes synonymous to the reaction. You're expecting from your consumer Does that does that make sense? No, that's amazing Pallavi and what you said is so true and just building on what you said I want to go to you Puneet and ask you that, you know, well what Pallavi said is Is so important for any brand to build its character and be resilient and keep saying it over and over again till People understand the brand personality the brand character. It's very important But how do you do it in today's day and age because you don't have so much control like I said in my opening remarks You don't have as a marketer so much control about What a consumer is going to say about your brand. So we are in a stage I believe what I call, you know, we all started in this age of storytelling today It's more like story creating story living along with The consumer so how do you make your brand? Consistent resilient and so that people can still understand the character of the brand With all the noise that's happening around it I think today Consumers need feel the need to be connected with the brand for them to engage with the brand. There is this book by Jeffrey Samuels, which talks about how do you turn consumer passion points into marketing opportunities? And I also feel the the most memorable Interactions that consumers have with brand is when the subject is about their passion point, right? now for for for us This is when when there's a memorable interaction between the consumer and the brand that is when the consumer feels deeply connected with the product and service and Understands what the brand stands for which is the crux and the core of what marketers are looking for now at Mastercard We have identified nine passion points across geographies from travel to culinary from fashion to health from sports to music and These passion points obviously keep changing across different demographics and geography and This has become a pillar for us for every sponsorship or a priceless program But we call it internally framework right and we've not stopped at that We today have also started something called as multi-sensory marketing now for example We have a we have our mastercard sonic sound now Typically brands use a sonic identity to just slap it as a mogul on the end slate But what we're doing is that we have created a deep level of brand identity from a sonic level which enables us to Collaborate with musicians with composers around the world and in our ones at it to create popular music Hence the brand becomes part of popular culture. We have recently launched our flagship culinary experience We very soon are going to launch a premium line of perfume with an iconic brand In India for example last year in December We are sponsors of the biggest passion point in this country, which is cricket We've we've managed to pivot a campaign primarily to promote women in sports And how do you build gender equality on and off the ground and that was recently concluded With the fact of creating a sports clinic for aspiring women cricketers Where we have gotten legendary cricketers to mentor them and now this is an ongoing plan, which is Which we intend to continue now if you look at all the examples which have shown and all of them have given us a remarkable Response in terms of impact and engagement now each one of them have a strong purpose which is based on a passion point and It not only enables us to build Richard storytelling formats, but also enables consumers to reach out to us in different ways other than your typical traditional ways Which typically most brands do Thanks for sharing that and I think it's an interesting point what you brought forward What you're really trying to say is that you're trying to be part of the pop culture in many different segments Which is a little bit You know expanded from your just truly your business To be able to consistently to pull these point build stories still around them and encourage people to build stories around that area I think works beautifully and as you were speaking I was thinking of some of the things that Mastercard's done And yes, it did resonate with me as a consumer as well But moving to you next I want to ask you that like Puneet was saying that you know They're doing something for somebody who's perhaps a sports lover. They're doing something for another person who's a culinary You know has a culinary interest While they may be another person who's interested in travel and they are in music and you know They're engaging with them at another level How do you master this whole experience on digital and bring it out still in a unified way? That the brand still is center stage. How does one do that? Okay, interesting That's a loaded question, you know so I think One interesting thing in marketing which is happening because of the way people are connected digitally connected I would say that now the the feedback loop, you know or the kind of signals which you can pick from consumers have Increased multi-fold. Yeah, so back in the day you would say that listen I'm relying on certain signals if I was relying on probably some research or some insights I put out some panel data out there I I go to a research agency and I probably learn something about my customers out there So what has really shifted significantly is now that the the amount of intelligence which can come to you Okay, is can most times overwhelm you Okay You know so but the good part about it is that at least it is coming to you Yeah, so yes, it is complex But there are tools available out there which can simplify that complexity and make it manageable for you Yeah talking about you know Talking about, you know Rubina's point that there are people who are showing some interest points Yeah, and and I would like to say draw and a journey out here When there were platforms like Facebook which came into the market When search came in, you know search picked up signals which was around intent Facebook came in around interest Yeah, so you suddenly the marketer saw that okay fine my number of signals are increasing through these platforms Fast-track that to today and fast-track that as we are Going to go forward for the next two three years Another interesting signal is happening is that all of us in the room as consumers are Most times leaving breadcrumbs of our digital transaction habits at lots of different places Okay, so it's no more at a stage or at a point where That information or that understanding is centralized or probably Limited to a few platforms. Okay, so it's going to get more and more democratized. It's going to be out there out there Yeah, so so tomorrow you may say oh there is shopping happening So a platform like Amazon is capturing Interest and behavior or transacting behavior of customers were shopping into certain things You end up going to a financial loan marketplace. They are able to profile you at a deeper level So, you know what I'm you go to a D2C site You are buying a range of product categories and they're again that information is there across Across various behavior points. Yeah, so by and large There is going to be significant amount of intelligence out there And there are tools which are out there which help you make sense out of it Yeah, so I would not in this conversation I would not spend too much time on the tools but there are tools out there I think as as as a framework when you're looking to future-proof your your brand and and one of the frameworks Inside that narrative is that look I should be I should become more and more hungry so that I can get I can receive those signals Yeah, if I'm able to be at a place where I'm I'm constantly listening through these You know, I will sooner or later start making sense of how to apply Those signals to my marketing objectives or to the kind of personas which I want to target and they're One last point I would like to make here is that I don't think I think it's not about data It's not about technology. It's about people and processes Okay, so if your people and teams have that mindset, you know, you will be able to there are tools and technologies Which can simplify things. Yeah Thanks very nicely put and you know, you try to simplify it. Thank you for doing that Yeah, but I totally agree with you that you know, you have to start collecting the data Making sense of it and seeing that how you can build that whole, you know fine experience So that the brand voice is still not lost but luckily Coming to you and wanting to ask you Deepak said about people's and processes and so how do you work within the organization to one make sure that those people That minds people mindset is there the processes followed and secondly, you know, when it comes to technology Which I know is a genuine problem you get thrown with so many partners doing so many different things, right? How do you choose the right tools right partners? How do you evaluate it and how do you know make those decisions? I think first up. I think one of the key things for a brand is to actually Travel along with consumers, right? And I think beat in my earlier organization or even now one of the things I've realized is one needs to actually be very true to the entire life journey of a consumer and When I say life journey, you know, we are in the space of mobility You know today one might be owning a two-wheeler probably even a car But their personal evolution is is very steep the aspiration levels of of for the country today or every citizen is pretty pretty high and The moment the brand is able to kind of walk that particular journey I think it becomes easier for the brand to kind of relate to the consumer And yes at some point in time picking a partner or you know was more of a decision of commerce Right and at some point it was pure luck. You know in my earlier organization. I just discovered, you know a few years back that You know one of the top Advertisers of the country, you know the top creative head Working and writing about a particular brilliant campaign, you know hargarh kuch kaita hai was pure luck It was just a piece of scratch of paper and that was supposed to be rejected and it turned out to be the biggest hit ever So yeah, but but gone are those days, you know You can have a very structured approach to it and I kind of discovered more than a decade back when I kind of walked in You know as a true blue sales guy into marketing And I said Right but then but then the evolution happened and that was the stage of discovery and I think in partner you will find many You have people from research from advertising From the brand world what not but what the brand should clearly look forward to is a very powerful custodian and It takes time. It's not easy But those custodians have very very very I would say a very nice knack of working with you Right and what those custodians add to the brand is also very very significant In simple terms, you know, they have multiple zones Clearly one zone which says this is what the brand should do, you know, there are certain zones Okay, you can do it but there are clear cut zones which says that you know, this is not what the brand should do and You know when you work with consultants or anybody, you know more of a tactical game You're looking at the short-term game and everything is is is perfectly okay for you to work with But a custodian is very clear on the fact that what a brand should not do and I think that's the most important part For partners, I think beat any world beat advertising brand or any space Working with a custodian and identifying them is is super crucial for the success and I personally remember and Coincidentally it was in this very same room a decade back. You know, I didn't get the world of design and decor, you know, and Patiently, I remember the team that I worked with These custodians were very clear in kind of saying that we will not take a business brief from you Okay, we want a design brief and we will only work on a design brief from you And they made me run around the country for a month and a half and then it I was in a position to kind of give a True design brief with clear-cut inspiration and then we had a whole set of you know a range of things come up come alive so I think that's the world of custodians and They exist everywhere. I mean they exist in the world of advertising I mean you suddenly find custodians with even the world of production houses I mean you work with certain directors. They really get the brand right and and that's important for you And that's where you know the quintessential relationship comes into picture because you know And marketing has come and go into brands, but the custodians day Right and the custodians actually over decades carry that particular legacy And it's not just a function of brands which have legacy It's also about brands which which are just newborn right you can have a world of you know A different points of you come in different perspectives come in and I think that's the charm of building a brand because you know And today if even see it for that matter, right? See it was not built over the last two years, right? There are hundreds of people and the associations with each of these partners have lasted so long that There is a story or two that everyone is able to share and I think that's the that's the charm of building a future-proof brand because you know You have trust and you can definitely you know rely on those partners and For everyone out there every market here. Please find your custodian. That's the only thing I would kind of say So nicely put that is so beautifully put together. I'm a fan of this land I'm gonna use it Lakshmi and I just want to add to this I've been teaching to add to this It's an anecdote. I want to share we had a meeting a few days back and it was me and my team and Before I entered the room one round of introductions It already happened and then when I entered I started from the beginning and the client happened to turn it on and say hey Your version of your brand is very different from your team's version of your brand It was a Eureka moment to realize that a win a victory happens when Everyone from the CEO to the lowest denomination in the team can respond to the to a tweet in the same way in the same Language that is when you've created a brand that's when you have kind of achieved coherence and You know that you've been consistently doing the same thing in the right way, so I just wanted to top it up with my Thanks, Balavita to share that instant with such candor and Lakshmi It was truly insightful I think all of us will listen to every single word that you were saying you know it's so important we get lost sometimes In the commercials and just in we don't understand what brands are really looking for but yeah It's back to the basics look for custodians people you can trust because it's so rightfully said that you know people who think long-term for the brand and Tell you what is not Good as much as they tell you what you should be doing, you know, so it's so important But thanks for sharing that with us Shifting gears a little bit now to move with you Can't get away any panel these days without talking about Thring in words like data IOT voice We are you know, it's all disrupting us And everybody gets really excited when you talk about it in Panels, but they also throws a lot of Challenges Right both innovations and challenges to brands and it's not easy for brands to kind of Navigate through these upcoming consumer trends and create Interesting stories while leveraging these trends from your experience Can you share some interesting brands that have done some interesting work in that space absolutely Romina? I think Whatever Lakshmi and all of us spoke about it definitely gave a glimpse of what's happening in the ecosystem and Been in in movie for class for last nine years and then you know seeing the global market I've what I've noticed the challenges and the trends what we're seeing globally. They're almost same In movie, which is a programmatic platform it you know connects to millions of users out there When we work with our North American customers take example of Nike nobody can beat their brand communication story They're the best out there and they've been doing this for years now They work now for user acquisition strategies, right? And that's a paradigm shift because and and and the conversation which we are having with Nike, you know that kind of You know dwells towards you know user acquisition and how they can you know beat scan Which are you know very very technical stuffs which is happening out there and it just you know kind of gives you a glimpse of you know How brand marketers are kind of leveraging performance marketing on the other side and you know which is a in Mobis comes consumer platform Which is glance and so glance is kind of pervading almost 225 million devices in India and Indonesia at the moment We are present and almost all the Android phones out there, right? And we are partnering with all the largest OEMs out there So essentially what we are trying to simplify is the user's journey to find the content I think the previous section when sort of an issue we're talking about you know that we are in consumer economy content economy Users attention spans are very less. How do you simplify that content and you know kind of give it to users on one click? And that's the product philosophy of glance. You know what we have built in last three to three and a half years So when a user is picking up the device, they're able to see the content and you know when they're getting into the Indulge mode. They're able to do a lot of various things. You know, they're able to get news. They're able to Play games. They're able to find live content, right? And what essentially is happening out there is we are trying to give users authentic content, right? Because I've been hearing you know for last two sessions. There is so much of content out there But which also brings a lot of owners on every marketer every consumer every platform What kind of content users are getting it? Are they getting authentic content because we all know we live Day in day out. We see a lot of fake content out there, right? And this is what you know, we have been you know trying to experiment with glance Platform we call it super engagement platform right because there is so much of experiences and engagement which is happening out there Consumers are able to find the content out there, right? So that is the product hypothesis which we are building from consumers not coming to the brands, right? I'll take probably two examples how You know two greatest brand out there are working with us and they have probably worked with us One of them is Tata tea, right? And I think Tata tea is there in India for last 35 years. They're one of the iconic brands If I am if the numbers are correct one in every three Indian consumers drink Tata tea, right? And what campaigns they have been doing for last I think 12 to 13 years is a lot of campaigns which are related to social impact, right? Their property name is Jagore And they have kind of touched upon all the social causes campaigns, right social impact campaigns Last year they you know kind of worked with our creative team our brand solutions team For climate change campaign, right? They wanted to kind of reach to millions of users telling, you know, like when you get up every day You you're having a hot tea Do have that but don't make the planet hot, right? And they did that on the consumers lock screen because they were able to see the content and it kind of cut across Every age group, right? While you know, I'm sure everybody sitting out here. We are all the privileged group We're all having iPhones and all but Android is probably, you know, 90% of what consumers are having in the country, right? It did create that impact with the consumers and I will not get into the matrices because it was a phenomenal campaign for Tata tea They were able to bring that communication of Jagore from television to mobile, right? And that's the trend what marketers are now trying to pick it up. They are trying to pick it up The platform which they have never tried before, right? Jagore has been always been a television and then they all move to digital But they figured out India being the mobile first country. We need to reach consumers on their mobile That's one thing. Second brand which is Swiggy, right? Which is we all know they're doing a lot of very interesting campaigns and so far They have been doing a lot of user acquisition campaigns, right? But they figured it out game streaming is something which is picking up in the country, right? Lot of young population which are in the age group of 18 to 24 They are watching, you know, streamers play the game. It took me some time to understand what it is But then I understood this is what the new cake is, right? Kids these days love watching, you know Somebody playing the games and this is where Swiggy worked with us because we have a massive game streaming platform 75 million users are there and they did a lot of intro integrations on there, right? They were able to, you know, kind of, you know, a lot of features, content-related stuff and all of that So it just gives a very nice dichotomy of what's happening, right? Every brand is at a crossroad Nike being in US, they are best at the content creation communication. They're trying to do user acquisition TataD, which is known in the country for last 35 years, iconic brand, they're trying digital Swiggy, you know, which is a very digital-first brand, they're trying gaming and they're trying brand campaigns, right? And that's a very interesting thing. I think and this is how market was kind of experimenting in the latest, you know the marketing era Thanks for sharing that. I think it's great that marketers are taking those risks, they're experimenting, they're trying new things They're trying to stay relevant in the today's day and age and Deepak, I want to ask you this question that, you know, the panel today we are on is about future-proofing Your brand. So is it even required? I mean, do you need to adapt yourself to the changing environments or do you need to really future-proof yourself and if you do need to, what does it truly mean? Is there something called future-proofing? I don't think so. Okay, there is nothing called future-proofing at least in my belief. Yeah, I think which is why I said it's a very loaded theme, but I think, you know, from my perspective it gets down Rubina to that basic part that I think as a as a team, I just would, you know, we're talking about as a marketing function today I would say that, okay, you know what? I have to manage messaging. I have to manage multiple channels. Yeah, I have to manage multiple marketing technologies. Yeah, so there is I need to orchestrate a lot of these things Okay, and I need to possibly orchestrate all these things, you know, very quickly in a agile manner Then I need to also ensure that, you know, what I'm constantly having a team with me. Okay, which can evolve Yeah, so there is a need to adapt. There is a need to evolve and there is also a need to learn unlearn Okay, so so honestly speaking, I think we are all having fun in the marketing space right now It is a golden period Because it is fresh, you know, when we when we look at marketing Roles as, you know, whether I'm whether, you know, Lakshmi as a CMO Okay, you know, Pallavi as a brand head out there, Puneet there or any one of us out there in the room, right? You're basically orchestrating a lot of these things With the hope that you don't fail Yeah Yeah, so so there is no hope of a future, but there is some hope that you should not fail Like Pallavi was saying keep making money for your friends. Yeah, and you have to do it very You you'd also need to do it in a in a manner where Where where I think Scale management is testing all of us Okay, when I say scale management scale management of our own ideas scale management of our own expectations Okay, scale management of our own time not easy Okay, and simultaneously in in all of this, you know, you also I was talking to someone else Leading marketer and he said that listen, you know, I keep reminding myself that I should not fall into the FOMO trap Yeah, you know in all of this just because I hear a conversation which is happening today You know, it should not happen. I made a note and next day morning. Come on guys. We need to do this Yeah, so so so you're to manage manage that part. You do really just calmly look at your business You have to look at saying that okay, this is my marketing strength. This is what I am doing This is how I'm improving. Okay. I don't need to look at peer group. I can be inspired Yeah, but not Not like kind of feel anxious about it, you know, because I feel that the whole market opportunity for any brand And I just want to add a very interesting point. I'll take another minute out here What is very cool now from a consumer behavior perspective is if it's like just imagine that as a consumer today I have let thousands of brands enter my life So if you see the number of D2C brands out there, okay, or if you go and open your own wardrobe Right five years ago ten years ago. I would probably I'm maybe I'm not a good example Yeah, I would open my wardrobe and there are just three or four brands out there So my shirts are restricted only to two or three brands at best, you know And like I said, don't count me as the right example. Yeah But today when I open my wardrobe, I have 20 brands Okay, when I go to my kitchen, I open my fridge There are 50 brands out there, right? And we are all seeming to be at a place where we are hungry for more, you know So now you're suddenly saying that the consumer is embracing so many brands. Wow Yeah, so there is an appetite out there Okay, so overall the markets the consumers appetite to Bring brands into their life the frequency at which the brands they want to indulge with okay, all that is amplifying It it is growing at an infinite scale Now it's about when all of that is happening you as a brand custodian are thinking that you know what this is a ever increasing Market size and I want to capitalize on my market share. That's about it Yeah, so so it's a very interesting space from my view Actually, I mean what he said is so true and so real and building on that beneath I want to move to you and ask you that how do you Learn and learn every day at Mastercard and how do you make sure you're still in that choice of the consumer when the consumers While they expanding and opening their doors to many more brands at the same point becoming more discerning, right? So how do you still be part of their lives? So just adding to what the park said or will continue to be in the future as well Correct. So the I'm just adding to what the bug said so whatever we speak today on the panel may or may not be relevant In the next three or five years, right? But the point I'm trying to make is that two things which stands the test of time with regards to brand is brand purpose and brand identity Now if you look at everything which is available for marketers today For them to strengthen either brand purpose or brand identity There are certain tools and trends which every market year no matter which level in the organization He or she is in should definitely expose themselves to I think the first thing is data analytics and AI and ML The reason I bring this up is because if you look at what machines are able to predict in terms of human patterns and insights in fact to a point How a particular cohort or a consumer segment is going to what's going to be the next action is mind-boggling So for brands to invest in AI ML is is is almost a mandatory aspect To build and future-proof the brand. So we call it the second point which again I want to bring which again Deepak is an expert on this one is relevant and humanized Interventions in the entire consumer cycle journey Through marketing automations is important, but the key keyword here is relevant and humanized Okay The third part which I which I was just thinking about before I mean we were talking about this panel is which is Honestly the least spoken about subject is air The reason why I bring this up is because here is one technology which is ready to use We have the entire technology to use it across the sales pre sales sales the consumption cycle and after sales and More importantly, I think air is the first step that brands could take Followed by VR and whenever metaverse happens and becomes scalable and executable, right? Again from a Gen Z point of view data Security and data is an important aspect they would be Attracted and pulled towards brand who understand the the the sensitivity of data and hence blockchain Becomes an integral part in every brand going forward to make sure that Blockchain makes a brand transparent in every engagement be transaction be it conversation read engagement and Finally one thing which I'd like to put forward which I think again adds to the brand future purely from our consistency because it is something which Lakshmi and Pallavi spoke about is The project management tool in your organization which allows employees within the organization to talk to each other I think currently even irrespective of which level of brand today we work in in India specifically I think there isn't an open space for employees across functions to converse To collaborate to brainstorm which not only adds to innovation, but more importantly it you know There is an common aligned goal, which is which is possible through tech tools which are available today So I think some of these are the aspects put in together Possibly would future proof your brand Thanks for sharing that and you know I think what you're trying to say beneath again is like use analytics use data use machine learning algorithms, etc to understand the segments and perhaps a segment of one and You know drawing back to you Pallavi from where we started off and I want to ask you this question Is it important for brands to still be consistent or be coherent as he was talking about that I was thinking about that because you made that point on consistency and you know The other part is that as a brand how do you experiment with that flexibility because When I started working and when I work with marketers, you know, obviously brand is something which is very close to their chest So how do you allow for? Experiment and flexibility there, you know, okay to answer the latter part first I think a brand like let's just talk about this entity brand It becomes a feel-good factor only when the entire working team from top to bottom is sort of satiated With what it communicates what it does what it looks like so like most agencies It's a practice to involve all the stakeholders before we arrive at something before we arrive at a potential campaign like Harghar kuch kaita was an aberration like Lakshmi said but typically everybody involved in the chain is You know has something or the other to offer and that kind of contributes to a feel-good and a belief Conviction from everyone the entire team working on a brand front Coming to the coherence and the consistency part well I've spoken enough about the consistency part because I'm a strong believer in consistency and I think consistency does the magic because if you keep saying something Sales key language may pull us out. I mean who could be paid so if you keep calling something something else over and over again People will start believing it and they will buy into it right that is consistency after all Coherence now that's a tricky part Imagine we are a generation who are absolutely adaptable and malleable because we have in a way move from Icq to WhatsApp floppy to disk Landlines to mobile and I don't know what all and today's today's market here particularly at this Juncture in this era And I can speak for my brand because I sell fitness We speak to the silvers we speak to the millennials and we also speak to the Gen Z Adaptability comes naturally to us because we have understand we have undergone that transition You know step by step. We've seen the evolution But along with the evolution what Needs to be done is that responsiveness needs to be very agile I think Deepak was saying that or Drupal was saying that Because you need to work with momentum because it's a very fast changing world if you don't bring that momentum if you don't if that Momentum doesn't bring that energy then in all likelihood you're going to be redundant so I think as marketers what we are constantly doing today is repositioning ourselves some bit every day and also creating a market like earlier It was just one of the two tasks. I feel but right now It's become both and both of these have become a necessity because you have to keep growing that market for accommodating the new Gen Z and their needs and the way they look at things and You have to keep serving the silvers if to keep serving the Millennials and and each of these cohorts They understand your character the language evolves the personalities evolve But what is constant for me for us is consistency and that character So I guess that does the trick. I mean I can speak for my language of my brand again and Like fitness is not just a physical fitness That's the belief that we have been selling and that's the character of HR X saying Fitness cannot be just a physical phenomena. It has to be mental It has to be holistic and the moment you include everything you become the new age definition of fitness The physical aspect is going to the silvers maybe maybe to the Millennials, but Gen Z Today is interested in e-sport, which is a sport. I mean you have to cater to that There is no way I cannot speak that language and I cannot be a part of the e-sport phenomena Well NFT is gaining ground. I have to be there to how is to talk to communicate. There's no way I cannot be there We're talking about marathons gaining ground people are coming together in the act of community events. We are doing it People love walking. I mean if I come back to the The 40 demographics 40 to 50. Well, they are also doing high high intensity stuff, but let's look at the 60s They are still walking. So we have to cater to their needs. We have to supply to what they believe fitness is to them Underlying point being that I am a brand for the everyday athlete That is something that I don't change and an everyday athlete is somebody who's waking up and making an effort to get out of bed And get out of home and doing that little bit. So I'm not talking to the podium finisher I'm not talking to the person who's sort of trying to you know, improve their personal best or sprint their fastest or Hit their hardest, but we're talking to the guy who's waking up and making an effort that is consistent That is coherent in the messages which go out to people But the avenues have changed the personalities have changed the language has evolved. There is chat GPT Also, there's everything that needs to be there. I guess that's how we're balancing coherence and consistency today Sure, and I think it's a tough act. Nobody's got it, right? Palavate so and I also believe to manage this consistency and currency Brand again comes to center stage, right? You have to like you said you have to be true to your character And you've said it many times and I can't agree more with you and through boy I want to ask you this slightly Open and I hope your answer it in with full candor Given that conversation we've had and what brands are saying here today. Do you think brands are enough investing enough in branding per se? I'll be honest. Yes, I know so so I Think I'll just pick up from where Pallavi was talking about right and brands always need to do a lot of leg work right and that leg work is required because What's happening is at one side technologies kind of advancing at the same time consumers behaviors are changing, right? And what is kind of coming out is the consumers non-linear purchase behavior only channel presence, right? Now when brands need to do some branding, right? They need to take care of all of these things, right? Consumers are you know seeing products online going and buying on detailed stores vice versa, right? And all of these things will keep happening. So what brands need to ensure is how do they find a right balance out there, right? And that's a difficult thing for them to do couple of brands are really doing well out there Then I think we always hear think long-term right when you are building a brand legacy, right? But then also what's happening is CMOs are getting pressures from their their counterparts in the board meetings and all To get sales right and this is where you are you're doing a lot of campaigns Which are seasonal campaigns, right? Which doesn't leave impression like probably and this is what I think people was also talking about We have like so many brands out in our life, right? We see so many campaigns which comes during festive season, but we don't remember There's also dialbacks to Rubina your point what you're telling how many ads I remember from a childhood Because option was less and it sticks in my memory Now brands are in that that rat race, right? They're trying to reach the same consumer, right? And they're finding it very difficult, right to create that communication part So it's a good tough job Couple of brands like which I gave example previously. They are doing some good stuff out there So I think that's one thing second thing is I think that's also very important because we're just coming out of pandemic Purpose-based marketing is something which is going to stay for long We have seen some amazing campaigns which live was done start of 2022 Heart hotel or campaign it become viral, but it did deliver that message, right? One of the one of the campaign which was also very close to me. It's a government campaign Harghar. That's the which government of India debt for Vaccination, right? So these are purpose driven communications what brands are trying to do right and and this will stick stick to consumers, right? Yeah, I think answer is yes or no There are there are brands who are trying to do out there, but then there are a few brands, you know I think it's a it's a challenge which they need to figure it out. There are a lot of data There are a lot of stuffs, but at the end of the day you need to Do with a lot of gut feeling, right? Hey, this we are doing it for our brand legacy Okay, I know we are out of time, but I'm good. Huh a very diplomatic answer Yeah, I would not take that but we are out of time. So I'm not going to leave with the point But I'm going to ask you one glass question like me from a brand point of view What are the challenges that you have convincing internal stakeholders for brand budgets? I'm sure they're plenty right because partners always think that the same one doesn't want to spend on branding But I'd love to understand the other point of view as well I think that should be a last closing statement. So I think For market years it is a brand and for the rest of the organization. It's an organization I think the fundamental difference lies there and of course you want to invest on the brand There's no question whatsoever and of course you can you know on board people, you know with their currency Finance you talk of whatever a bit does or ROC or whatever you want to kind of work on It is not easy to kind of take stakeholders on board Enrolling them for example, you know, we spoke so much on digital, right? I mean it's very difficult for example for many of the marketing teams to onboard the legal teams, right? I mean, yeah, it's good to kind of have 24 hour leave a if you have to release an ad campaign, right? But if you have to respond to a meme Right, you can't do it with 24 hours. Yeah There's no shelf life available to you. So Getting all the stakeholders is not easy But but one thing that I've kind of seen and I speak to my friends as well in other firms Slowly the organizations have also evolved I think they understand the language of customer pain and I think that's a first starting point and The good part of it is market years have also started evolving a lot in their conversations with the rest of the organization That includes the board because you need a larger, you know, we spoke a lot of about band purpose You know the larger strategy of the brand as such you onboard as many people as possible And the more you have them on your side if they are able to speak the language of the brand I think you don't need to convince them it happens, but but trust me, it's not easy and You know, it's always a battle between You know, how much top line how much bottom line and For every investment, where is the attribution, right? An attribution is one word that, you know You know one gets chased to death with that single word. So so But yeah, at least I'm happy that Organizations across the board have evolved to kind of start understanding the value what brand brings on table Again another anecdote. I remember being told once that marketing will always be a cost head Remember this it will never be a revenue generating stream. So don't ask for too much money But I guess our market years have really evolved because I think Marketing has now become a combination of the right brain and the left brain It's become a combination of imagination and intelligence both with data coming in with analytics coming to the fore It's no more just an art It's pretty much science and I'm very very sure about the fact that it's become very scientific in its approach And so is the market years now. It's no more like irrational decisions anyway Thank you. Thank you. I know we're totally out of time. I would love to continue this conversation It was so interesting. Thank you. You were all very insightful very honest, and I really had fun I hope everybody had a good time enjoying this conversation. Thank you