 So, being somebody who's in that side of the system, how do you view the other side, right? The more independent side when we talk about the artist being, you know, independent and not getting signed by labels and that whole perspective against that and even a lot of executive types that aren't at a label, right? They're still like the young business professionals in music, but they're kind of finding their own different ways and navigating. How do you view that side and what makes you choose the side that you've chosen? Yeah, I mean, as far as the artist, I always say, you know, at the end of the day, you still need a team. So whether you have a label or not, you still need a team in order to successfully promote your music, et cetera, et cetera. But the Indie Lane is not for everyone, you know what I'm saying? Because at the end of the day, I feel like, to me, honestly, I think the Indie Lane is best for artists who've already built a following and are already like, you know, able to make money on their own without a label itself. You know, if you're a veteran, like if you're a rapper, like they came out in the 90s or whatever the case may be and you had your success, well, you should be signed to a label in 2020, you know what I'm saying? You have your catalog, you can go do your shows, can't do them now. But once it's over, you go back to doing your shows, selling your merch, et cetera. You don't need a label because you already built a brand up to be what it is. For Indie artists, you know, it's kind of like you're playing, I feel like nowadays with a lot of Indie artists, you're playing a game of look. Like, you know, artists that kind of pop off now, like Lil Nas X is like once in a lifetime. That's the look. You know what I'm saying? Pure look. Great record, don't get it wrong, it's a great record. It's pure look, you know what I'm saying? And everyone can't do what Lil Nas X did, you know what I'm saying? It's rare that our artists will pop off with one and sometimes, you know, and he eventually signed to a label, you know, after he had already popped, you know what I'm saying? So you have some artists who are able to do them by themselves and be able to have that success and maintain that success. Did you have some artists who want to take it to the next level? You know what, you know, with Lil Nas X signed to Columbia Records, it took it to the next level. You know, I put Billy Ray Cyrus on it, he went diamond, he won the Grammys, like he did all of that due to the label's help, you know what I'm saying? So I feel like if the Indie game works, and it all depends on what are artists want out of their career. You know, you have some artists who don't care about winning awards, don't care about, you know, all the video press and going on Jimmy Fowlin and all of that stuff, all the things that a label provides, because basically a label has the relationships, you know, the relationships with Spotify and Apple and all of the new news press variety and everything like that, where Indie artists may not have that. So if you're an artist, say like, I don't know, they might, you know, who never really cared about having the labels pushed, right? I just want to make my music, I want to tour, make money. That's totally fine. The big problem from the next question about executives, I often think it depends on the person and where they're coming from. If I was a person, if I grew up in Atlanta, if I grew up in Los Angeles, if I grew up in New York in a major city where things were popping up, then you of course know why not do the Indie role, right? Because you are in a big enough market to where you can do that. I'm from Arkansas. So, you know, and I'm down there. So it wasn't, I didn't really have the resources to pretty much do the Indie role as an executive, you know, because I grew up, you know, I'm a young kid, I'm from the projects, didn't come for money. So at that point in time, I'm just trying to make enough to feed myself, you know, so for me, I felt like the best route for me was to go corporate route until I'm able to, you know, barn up the brand, build the relationships, have the success. And if I choose to, then I can go the Indie route, you know. So I think it not really depends on the person itself, but as I chose the more corporate structure, mainly because I felt like just being where I was from and having the disadvantage of getting in a corporate system, building relationships, you know, it would allow me to have the choice to do the Indie route or stay corporate if I choose it. Right. But that's pretty much what. All right, it makes sense that you always have to understand where you are. I mean, what position is going to get you to where you need to be. So that makes sense. That makes sense. Being a label, like you said, the relationships just naturally happens versus you having to hustle one by one. Now you're just around it at all times. And we all know it's a very, it's a cliche, but it's a very, very small industry. Everyone really knows everyone. You know what I'm saying? You go to an event, you see the same people. And it's always, you know, I hear people always say, like, people always try to network up. Now I need to know who the CNVP is. The MVP, like, no, really it's networking across. Like group chats full of assistants and coordinators. We all know each other. We are our relationships. We all hang out. You know what I'm saying? Me and the interns are cool. Me and the next guy who's coming up behind me, cool. You know, always say, like, to me, it's always best to kind of just not just network up, but network across and build those relationships. Because in five years, 10 years, you all are going to be the new CNVPs. You all are going to be the new EVPs. And then you have pool. You know, because in the day, everyone wants to have some type of power in decision making, you know what I'm saying? And so if I see an artist that I really, really like, I'm in a position where I can sign this artist, then I can do so. You know what I'm saying? And the same, like, I have a homie that might want to be in the business and I can make a phone call to give them an internship or give them an assistant role. I might be able to do that because I put relationships coming up, you know? So, yeah. Got you. Got you. It's a long game. Long game. Is it? And I've got to ask it while you're here because we kind of talked about both sides. But again, there's this whole idea of you don't need labels or labels are evil. You know, artists have all this reasoning for not getting signed, right? What do you say to that being somebody who's in that side of things? I mean, I would say this. You do not need a label, right? Nowadays with the internet, you have the option to put your music out. You have the option to promote your music. Everything that a label was so valuable for, you know, everyone has access to do it themselves. Right. However, I would say this. A lot of people who downplay a label, well, it depends on where they come from. A day of someone that's trying to get noticed and they're downplaying a label, it's mainly because no one signed. That's pretty much, that's one reason. Another reason why if you are an artist and you're downplaying a label, especially just an indicator that you get bad business, you know, you sign a contract that you didn't get looked over, you didn't read, you didn't have a lawyer look over, you didn't even have a lawyer. Like, you basically get bad business at the end of the day, right? Because, I mean, at the end of the day, a label's job is to, it's a business. You know, in business, your goal is to make money. You know what I'm saying? And as an artist, you have to figure out and negotiate a way that you can kind of come in like a mutual partnership with the company versus being someone that's in debt with the company because you got your advance and you blew it on foreign cars and you didn't think about saving it or investing it into other things. One of the biggest misconceptions that you hear a lot on labels and it's something that I've learned over time. You know, artists are always like, you know, I'm on my master's. Like, you know, you hear people talk about, yo, you got to own your master's, own your master's, right? Here's the thing, right? If a label is going to spend one to two million dollars upfront for you to record an album, put the album out, pay team, et cetera, et cetera, they have to have something, they're paying for something, right? The master recording, you know, is an asset over time, right? It's your catalog, right? And especially now when streaming is at an all-time high, the catalog really kind of makes more money than the music that comes out, you know? So that's why you always hear about Beatles' catalog or Stone's catalog or Michael Jackson's catalog, no pun intended. Just all the catalogs that are super, super valuable and they're worth millions of dollars now, right? So you want all your master's if you can, but at the same time, you got to realize the label didn't put millions of dollars into recording this project. The project belongs to the label, you know what I'm saying? Now, if you were to put your own money up and put a distribution deal, which a lot of people do, and it's a different conversation you're going to have, right? You know, like every day, the infamous Cash Money deal, I think it was 85-15 split, you know what I'm saying? Birdman negotiated that. You ain't never heard Birdman downplan to like, Birdman got money, money. Yeah. You ain't never heard Birdman downplan to like, because he got what he wanted. Yeah. So it's all about how you negotiate, man, at the end of the day, one of the things I would say, and this is just me just overseeing things over time, right? A lot of the kids that get signed, you know, a lot of artists come from like, poverty-stricken environments, but they don't know nothing. They don't know much, right? And you're a new artist, someone's waving around a million dollar check, like, yo, you signed this right now, you walk out here with a million dollars, you don't technically walk out with a million, it covers everything else. But it's like, yo, I'm gonna get a million dollar check, you coming from the projects, you know what I'm saying? You go back to the, like, in your mind, you're like, yo, often to sign this piece of paper, it's just me and not a check, and gone about my life. You're not thinking about the long game, right? Labels do take advantage of that, right? That's why I think it's very important for people like me, you, other people coming into the music business, to be in those positions where we can look out for the younger artists that's coming up, because at the end of the day, a lot of the artists don't know any better. And it's not until over time, when the money dried up, when you're not hot no more, that's the reality. All the young artists that's popping right now, ain't gonna be hot after a while, right? Ow!