 I think this is a really exciting and important session for the Global Landscapes Forum because we've been talking about climate and landscapes for the entire time, but I think this is the session in which we look a little bit at how the rubber hits the road on what climate smart development looks like and how climate smart territory approach can actually guide us toward a more comprehensive development strategy that is climate friendly in the places that we live and work. So I'm really excited about this session today and particularly the people who are working in it. The way we're going to structure this meeting is a first to have about a 12 minute or so overview by Dr. Jose Joaquin Campos who's the Director General of Catille and a very active partner in Eirka who has been working for many years on climate smart territories and also very many years on integrated landscape approaches throughout Latin America and now moving into Africa and Asia. So we're going to start with that overview presentation and then we're asking five very distinguished and very experienced people working in different parts of the world to talk about how this translates to implementation in the places that they are working at different scales from the national scale to the landscape scale to the farm scale. Then I'm going to do my best to take these very well spoken people who have so much to say and control them just a little bit so that we can have some opportunity for some time for hearing from you all and having some discussions about how this approach is being applied or could be applied in the places where you all work. So before we start I want to just ask two questions so I have a sense of the room. Who here actually feels that they understand kind of more or less what we're talking about with climate smart territories. Raise your hand please. That's pretty good. OK. JJ says he is a little bit OK. Please also raise your hand if you're actively involved in the implementation of climate smart landscapes on the ground. Fabulous. OK. This is great. So I think with no further ado I'd like to go ahead and ask Jota Jota to come and give us a start. OK. Good afternoon. I'll give you a minute for those who need a translation. I'm going to do it in Spanish. I'm sorry for the English speaking people in our region in Latin America. I should speak Spanish. Buenas tardes a todos. Es un placer estar aquí con ustedes y con este distinguido grupo de panelistas y Sara como moderadora. Es un tema fascinante que nos ha estado reuniendo acá en estos dos días que nos reunió el año pasado en Barsovia. También que hay mucha discusión mucho debate al respecto. Quién me está ayudando con Juan Carlos Peña. OK. Entonces Katia ha venido trabajando hace un tiempo con muchos socios. En realidad esto no es una construcción de Katia es una construcción de muchos socios con el tema de territorios climáticamente inteligentes. Hago un doy un mensaje. Nosotros hablamos de territorios porque creemos que los aspectos sociales son fundamentales en la construcción de un territorio y en español entonces se refleja mejor territorio que paisaje que tiene más una connotación ecoséntrica. Vamos a la siguiente tengo poco tiempo. Hay dos elementos que nosotros creemos que son piedras angulares de este enfoque y que son necesarios para para un cambio transformacional que son la acción colectiva local obviamente vinculada con diferentes escalas y para eso es necesario una gobernanza inclusiva con las políticas las instituciones necesarias que propicien que el máximo de actores en este territorio se involucre en las acciones necesarias y podamos ver esos cambios a nivel de de las fincas a nivel del territorio los vínculos con escalas superiores es una nueva forma como lo vemos una nueva forma de organizarse yo creo que hay un cambio importante de paradigma a pesar de que los elementos que conforman estos enfoques territoriales son conocidos por todos yo sí creo que hay un cambio de paradigma en como nosotros tenemos que actuar la integración es sencilla lo escuchamos esta mañana la inauguración en la inauguración es una forma de organizarse nosotros lo vemos enfocado en la gestión sostenible de los ecosistemas de los servicios ecosistémicos y algo fundamental es que lo que propicia es integrar los intereses de los diferentes actores y sectores con una visión compartida nada romántico de la visión compartida no es todo mundo a la mano requiere hay muchos conflictos para eso y entonces requiere de muchas capacidades de manejo de conflictos lo que algunos elementos de las ventajas de de un territorio climáticamente inteligente un TCI es más bien el propósito el propósito final de de este enfoque es maximizar la capacidad que tiene cada territorio de proveer bienes y servicios de los ecosistemas de una manera sostenible competitiva equitativa a través de estos dos elementos que con conversa anteriormente acción local colectiva para transformar y esta gobernanza inclusiva y que esas intervenciones y ahí viene lo en realidad la parte más difícil de desafío más grande que es de una manera armonizada e integrada siguiente hay seis aspectos seis grandes intervenciones que nosotros creemos que son fundamentales creo que hay más y los panelistas podríamos escuchar más pero de momento la primera de ellas y hablando de cuál es el foco de la acción de los TCI's que es la gestión de las tierras de los servicios ecosisténicos tiene que ver entonces con sistema de producción agrícolas agropecuarios agroforestales forestales y cadenas de valor que sean sostenibles entonces creo es es importante es un enfoque territorial pero no debemos de perdernos en la complejidad de las tantas intervenciones que requiere un territorio en este caso nosotros lo que planteamos es la gestión de los servicios ecosisténicos el manejo sostenible de las tierras algo fundamental es conciliar la posibilidad de producir y conservar al mismo tiempo creemos que es fundamental es necesario conservar suelos es un recurso fundamental si se pierde toma muchos años recuperarlo conservar el agua que están los suelos la biodiversidad etcétera y como propósito también parte de este proceso es fortalecer los diferentes capitales del territorio no es solamente el capital natural es fortalecer el capital humano el capital social el capital financiero como una forma como lo hemos estado haciendo y ahora ley dava comentar a través de nuestro proyecto mesoamérica agro ambiental mesoamericano las escuelas de campo como un mecanismo de de transferencia de de intercambio más bien de conocimiento del conocimiento local con el conocimiento científico y también vincuy mediante cadenas de valor para vincular a los productores con el mercado necesitamos que las acciones sean sostenibles otro elemento entonces el primero de los seis es sistema de producción y cadena de valor segundo es tenemos que intervenir para lograr objetivos de mitigación basada en ecosistemas pensando también que que es factible y tenemos que propiciar las energías entre la mitigación y la adaptación esto a través por ejemplo de prácticas agroecológicas que buscan aumentar la biomasa el carbono del suelo reducir emisiones en general en el mediante una agricultura más arbolada los sistemas agroforestales cremos que son parte de lo que se dice en inglés low-hanging fruit para lograr esto ahora en medio día tal vez algunos de ustedes participaron en el en el lanzamiento de una iniciativa muy ambiciosa que hemos llamado la iniciativa 20-20 donde que lidera por gobiernos de América Latina y el Caribe varios socios de inversionistas de impacto y varias organizaciones como WRI, CIAT, WCN y CATI y esperamos más por la meta de esta iniciativa restaurar 20 millones de hectáreas de tierras de gradación más o menos un 10 por ciento de las tierras que tenemos de gradación nuestra región al 2020 así es que invitamos a socios a unirse la red iberamericana de bosque modelo se ha comprometido con 1.6 millones de estas hectáreas CATI ha estado trabajando ahí con los 29 bosques modelo que suman todavía no me sabía decir una cifra exacta y no sé si se puede tener una cifra exacta pero me han dicho son más de 600 socios en estos 29 bosques modelo en 15 países también trabajamos a través del modelado ambiental de manera que podamos contribuir mediante escenarios de cambio cobertura y uso de la tierra para las estrategias red tenemos también estamos implementando el programa regional de cambio climático de usahid y en este programa tenemos como meta la restauración de 2 millones de hectáreas en centro america y dominica republica dominicana esto es un este componente le corresponde uno de los socios de este consorcio que es ucn y estamos impulsando iniciativas piloto subnacionales red y también hemos hemos estado apoyando políticas y estrategias nacionales de desarrollo bajas en emisiones por ejemplo una muy importante césar en el sector ganadero donde es posible reimpulsar una ganadería diferente a la convencional que permita reducir emisiones al mismo tiempo comentamos la producción de leche de carne como le hemos medido el tercer aspecto tema que trabajamos es el de la tación basada en ecosistemas adelante donde tenemos varias acciones con proyectos con muchos socios este me dice que voy más lento de lo que debería de no es una llamada es una no es una llamada atención para mí la adaptación es es fundamental nosotros creemos que la resiliencia es un pilar fundamental de los t6 resiliencia de los sistemas sociales de los sistemas ecológicos trabajando a través de territorios clave desarrollando capacidades de liderazgo en varios países y también en territorios secos por ejemplo en américa central vamos adelante equidad de género fundamental si vamos a hablar de de de gobernanza inclusiva en realidad la equidad general toca todos los niveles desde la familia la finca las cadenas de valor las las estructura de toma de decisiones donde se integran hombres mujeres jóvenes pueblos indígenas en esta toma de decisiones fundamental integrar el máximo potencial estos recursos esa inteligencia humana que hay en los territorios con una una género más una política de inclusión de género siguiente por favor gestión del conocimiento si estamos hablando de territorios climaticamente inteligentes tenemos que pensar que la toma decisiones tiene que basarse en el mejor conocimiento la mejor evidencia esto inclusive nos llama a a tener que hacer las cosas diferente lo que la ciencia que hacíamos antes ya tiene que cambiar la forma como educamos a nuestros profesionales tiene que ser diferente a como se hacía antes tenemos que romper silos y eso no es no es fácil integrar el conocimiento local con el conocimiento científico siguiente y el último elemento el sexto que lo mencioné anteriormente para mí es donde ok entonces no me fue tan mal es el de una gobernanza inclusiva yo creo que ahí radica una buena parte de la inteligencia del sistema porque en la gobernanza inclusiva es la que propicia que la la inteligencia colectiva del territorio tome lugar mediante la inclusión de diferentes actores en los procesos de toma decisiones a diferentes escalas existen mecanismos plataforma de toma decisiones de las que hemos venido aprendiendo en los directorios de los bosque modelo los comités de cogestión de cuencas en iniciativas que hemos desarrollado en centroamérica los comités de gestión de bosque modelo plataformas que ahora puede mencionar posiblemente leyda a través del programa agroambiental mesoamericano en un territorio como por ejemplo el el trifinio que son lo conforman tres países y aquí es fundamental yo creo que esta es una parte posiblemente de donde tenemos mayores desafíos y donde tenemos una mayor posibilidad de avanzar si logramos abrir esos espacios para que tengamos instituciones mejores incentivos para impulsar estos cambios en los sistemas de producción así es que para repetir si el TCI en realidad es una nueva forma de organizarnos socialmente para la gestión de las tierras y de los servicios ecosistémicos va a ser fundamental y no va a ser nada fácil en realidad bosque modelo nació de conflictos de tratar de integrar diferentes intereses de diferentes grupos sociales pero nace una propuesta para una gestión territorial y de esta manera el el avanzar hacia construir una visión compartida que no es fácil y que eso debe ser el elemento que guíe la construcción de los territorios climáticamente inteligentes no me sacó la roja muchisimas gracias thank you very much Jose Joaquina you might want to sit down there the this was a great overview of the the key components that they have found in the work at Katiai to be key for climate smart territories and I think it's very exciting that the new strategic plan of Katiai actually is focusing on these kind of climate smart territories as a core strategy of the next what five years I guess so what it would be so let us move from there then to to look at some of the specific examples and evidence that we've started to have and I'm going to ask the five panelists to come up here while I am introducing you so you can just come on up that's okay let me start with Leila Mercado who is the director of Katiai's mezzo-american environmental program up a rural development program that has a climate smart territories focus the second is Mr. Carlos Cuellar who's the director of the Corporación Autónoma Regional de Alto Magdalena in the Department of Willa in Colombia the first department that declares its intention to become a climate smart and green territory in Latin America and is putting its money where its mouth is they're actually launching their their plan 2050 to integrate climate change into their development strategies we then have dr. David Molden who is the director general of Isamod which is one of the most important research and development centers working in the Hindu Kush Himalayas of Asia he's also a member of the Erika group and he's worked on healthy landscapes he's worked on integrated watershed management as many years of experience throughout mountainous regions in in Asia our next where if where is dr. Jim may I do yes oh please come on up dr. I do we are privileged to please says or here is fine whichever is the exit you can sit here is the executive sector secretary of the permanent interstates committee for drought control in the Sahel in Africa which is called seals and he is also the former minister of agriculture and irrigation of Chad so he has both a technical hat and a policy hat from which to talk to us and a wealth of experience on agriculture in dry zones in Africa and finally we have dr. Andy Jarvis who's the principal climate change scientist of seat and sea calves which is the climate change and food security program those are both programs of the CGI our system and see it recently did a country profile stop study on climate smart agriculture for the World Bank he understands climate risks for lay and use in forests over the next 40 years and how well prepared the world is to face those risks so we have some really great speakers and I'd like to get right to it and ask my first question of each one of these panelists Andy you've been looking at seven countries to figure out how smart they are in terms of climate smart climate smart territory what policies do you see taking place that are going to support enable landscapes to become climate smart territories okay so so I mean there's right now across across Latin America there's there's all countries are now working on policies at national level in kind of response to the specific climate change issue right and so so you have for example Nicaragua now just passed into into Laura national climates climate change strategy and one of the things that they're promoting there is diversification so promoting diversification of livelihoods of farmers to especially in coffee regions essentially to kind of buffer for adaptation to look at means of diversifying the landscape as well in these in these regions which which have been identified as being vulnerable so so there's the strategies like that we have if you look at Columbia for example you can see there there's the multi sector sectoral strategies being developed and I think the challenge right now are really two things one is all of the new policies and strategies that are being developed in response to climate change need to be articulated very carefully with the excuse me saying it but the bigger development strategies and policies that are going on in the countries so how this fits into that much kind of stronger stream of policy work that's going on and the other one is then the trickle down effect down to those local levels and so that's probably where these the concept of climate smart strategy territories is very important how do these national level strategies get down to the local level and transfer into action because that's where the change actually happens thank you very much Andy let me let me turn then to Dr. Dr. Adum who's been working in a different part of the world in the Sahel and say what are you finding there that is promoting climate smart territories thank you very much and good afternoon ladies and gentlemen sills is made of 13 countries it's been in business for 40 years that's two regional centers one in Bamako an agreement the climateology research and gadget development is in Miami sills business is in natural resource management climate change food security water markets training and technology development with respect to what's going on on the ground there is a tremendous efforts basically because people have their back against the wall climate change is here it is here to stay people have realized we take any given example you look at leg chart went from 25,000 square kilometers to 2,500 square kilometers you look at the new countries that have joined sills like Burkina no codivo are Benin Togo and Guinea didn't used to be concerned about drought and its consequences have now joined sills so what are we really doing in Niger for example we helped through natural regeneration green up about five million hectares in Burkina fast for 300,000 hectares through you know the Zai technique through half moon through cordon pierre but the thing what is happening is that we need to from the village level up to the community level we need to have policies from the national level to go down and devolve authority and decision-making powers to the communities and we need to do the land tenure issues so that we'll be able to come and look at this we have a lot of knowledge already we scaled up and we should be able to do seriously very very interesting thing the one thing I want to add is that we must tied into economics we know it's easy to agree but what are they getting out of the forest if we look at the landscape film generated from terror Africa yesterday in Ethiopia we have a bunch of examples in Kenya and so on and Burkina fast with that matter the landscape approach and the climate smart is not that complicated technically but it faces serious policy challenges because I can do a cordon pierre and even if it rains 200 millimeters per season I can retain enough water and raise the water table and then immediately go into what they call in a country's sezon a second in a season basically after the rain season we can produce for that matter we've seen examples in charge in different places it rains about 200 millimeters we took that as in the extreme north 200 millimeters we established cordon pierre and these techniques and the size as soon as the rains stop we went into the second growing season and all of a sudden you see the re-greening once people go into the second growing season they're making money in that area we have the political wheel well si aquí tenemos un escenario en el caso particular en colombia nuestro departamento que es el departamento del vila hemos tenido la oportunidad de construir un proceso que venía aislado digamos así venía obviamente marcado en una política nacional ambiental que está gestionada del gobierno central pero desde nuestra institución desde la corporación autónoma en nuestro departamento que es el departamento del vila es un departamento que cuenta con aproximadamente 2 millones de hectáreas un millón de habitantes venimos y veníamos implementando una estrategia nacional en el marco de una política nacional ambiental pero lastimosamente había una cierta desarticulación en lo que tiene que ver con la identificación de acciones estratégicas para afrontar el cambio climático en particular en el caso nuestro el instituto de investigaciones meteorológicas en colombia ya nos venía diagnosticando y nos ha diagnosticado un escenario de un incremento de aproximadamente dos grados de temperatura para nuestro próximo horizonte de 30 años y también una reducción de la precipitación en aproximadamente el 30 por ciento eso nos llevó precisamente a generar una visión de construcción colectiva en la cual logramos precisamente con la articulación con la agencia norteamericana de cooperación con FCMC por supuesto con organismos importantes que producto estos cambios de temperatura de estos cambios de condiciones agroecológicas un desplazamiento estamos un país tropical además el desplazamiento se mueve hacia hacia una frontera más alta tenemos unas áreas en conservación que representan hoy cerca del 26 por ciento del territorio departamental y esas áreas también no seriamente amenazadas producto estos fenómenos de cambio climático nosotros entonces a partir de la estrategia conjunta construida con todos los actores porque un problema serio que teníamos en nuestra región y posible mente muchas regiones del mundo es que se le entrega la responsabilidad a cierto tipo de actores en el nivel digamos administrativo nacional en el caso nuestro se habla de que las corporaciones autónomas son las únicas encargadas de velar por la conservación ambiental esto este tema lo hemos logrado vaciar en un plan clima construido debidamente y que cuenta con los estrategios dentro de los cuales por supuesto el principal es el agua y a partir de él tenemos unas acciones que seguramente podemos dialogar más adelante muchísimas gracias y muy inspiracional creo que para nosotros bueno so let's go then to another part of the world we've talked about the Sahel we've talked about Colombia talked to us a little bit about how this climate smart territory maybe looks a little different in the high Himalayas okay thank you Sara nice to be here near the Andes or region basically is the mode works in what we call the Hindu Kush Himalayan region that covers eight countries that's Nepal Bhutan India China Pakistan Afghanistan Myanmar Bangladesh it's the mountain region and as well as the Tibetan Plateau I think what Jose you outlined was very pertinent to the same region I just want to add a few things to it the first one is it's a region that's it's undergoing change not just climate change but all kinds of socio and ecological transformation and migration for example you mentioned that is very very heavy especially of men moving out of the mount mountain areas so nothing is nothing is stable right it's just changing all the time that's a that's number one the second is this area you know population wise compared to the plains are less people higher rates of poverty in the mountains but more or less voting clout so you don't get the finances moving up into mountain areas but the mountains in that region are that really the the natural resource base for all of Asia about 1.3 billion people are living on the water resources you've got forest products tremendous biodiversity and agricultural biodiversity in the mountains so the beneficiaries of those goods and services are somewhere else they're typically downstream not just in the mountain so there's a relationship between upstream and downstream communities it's very strong and getting closer that we need to tap into when we're thinking about territories in in the mountain region you mentioned governance absolutely agree that's an essential term we work a lot on community governance that's true but then all kinds of other players come in if we're talking about value chains that probably means private sector if we're talking about tapping into these upstream and downstream relations getting money flowing back up to the mountains that's going to require governance at a broader scale so we in our programs actually we do engage governments a lot for many reasons and one is to outscale the different technologies the last thing that's probably similar but maybe different is those mountains where we're working are boundary areas between countries in a very contentious region so we intentionally do a set up landscapes and in river basins right on those boundaries and Rajin Kothru here for example works on Kailash sacred landscape crossing India and Nepal and China the biodiversity doesn't recognize those boundaries the people actually don't moving across boundaries quite a bit but there's a lot to learn when we're working across boundaries we actually getting people together is moving us forward in that direction so those are a few points just to add on to Jose thank you thank you very much David let me then move to Lady Lady you've been working in Mesoamerica on a number of these on the ground initiatives tell us tell us what you have learned there that you think might be relevant for climate smart territories in other places I'm going to speak in Spanish if I'm going to use as an example a program agro-environmental mesoamerican which I'm going to refer to as map this program operates in four countries in Central America in one in the Trifinion region where the area borders between Salvador Honduras and Guatemala and the other region where it operates is in the center of Nicaragua the same as the previous expository that's a zone where there's a lot of changes you feel a lot of impact on the climate in fact this year we had a very long drought where the production of the families has affected a lot there's a lot of migration the families are migrating it was very attacked this year also by the problem of the problem of the problem of coffee growing so it's a region where there's a lot of changes from what we've been doing so far and I see that there are three lessons learned that are very interesting in the objective of promoting climate smart territories in some conditions like the ones I mentioned is the importance of promoting that governance a governance at the level of the territory that is, as Jose Joaquin mentioned, participative and inclusive and that has mechanisms where the different actors in the territory can share common interests and problems and, above all, solve conflicts derived from the use of resources and the management of environmental goods and services another element that we've identified that is very important in that management of governance is that there are mechanisms that also allow us to deal with issues of land maintenance about 30% of the families we work with in Trifinio don't have land and they rent land to be able to produce they rent land year by year that's a great challenge if you want to think about improving the resilience of those families but it's also a great challenge if you want to think in terms of sustainable management of the territory, of the services and of the ecosystem another lesson that we've learned is the importance that there is a marco-habilitator to promote the territory climatically intelligent and as Andy said, what is done at the level of the territory has to be aligned with the national policies but we also think that national policies can be influenced by what happens at the local level by the lessons that are being derived at the local level and in that sense, as in your case we work with policy makers to ensure that there is a regeneration that many things are done at the level of the territory influence policies and that has been the case, for example in Trifinio a national food security policy was being discussed and since then, Trifinio has worked with the Trifinio Commission and has incorporated everything that is the rural schools as a mechanism to improve food security and nutrition and it has been very interesting because we call it rural schools and they call it ECAS and they call it ECOSAN rural schools for food security and nutrition Thank you very much Well, Brian, I'm going to ask you to watch the time a little bit for me I want to move to the audience but just let me know when we're around or just let me know So, you've heard some very rich introduction and a very comprehensive sense of what's involved in climate smart territories and you've heard the sort of national policy actually almost everybody talked about the policy issues as well as the interaction between what was going on within the landscapes so I'd like to open the floor now to you all to ask questions of our panelists or to add any factors you feel might have been left out or things you think are a little confusing just in the interest because we have such a large group and I'd really love to have as much participation as we can if you could just keep your comments and questions as brief as possible speak clearly for the translators and identify yourselves, tell us your name and what organization you're from and maybe your country So Cecilia, you'll be able to help us, right? Yes Excellent So raise your hands if you'd like to ask a question or say anything Go ahead Don't be shy Bastian I'm Bastian Loma from Cati There's actually a number of questions I would have but I think I just want to start with one and maybe that someone else will do the honor I hear a lot of, okay, governance and equitative governments and participation is necessary How do you achieve that? Because I mean if I think of some of the countries we're mentioning in Agua, it's not that easy I think to have equitative governance if there's a lot of groups different groups of different interests and there hasn't been really much governments in the last two years What I'm going to do is I'm going to collect three to four questions and then go back to the panelists and give them a round of an opportunity to select the ones they'd like to respond to One moment Good afternoon Thank you Very interesting presentation from all over the world My question is Your name? I'm a private consultant and I'm living in Peru now and I would like to know what are the implications of the CSC intelligence systems approach for knowledge management for example we heard about Africa we heard about Nepal many countries regional approach what is the approach for the regional concepts which one are the complex Thank you actually you can join us also on the panel Yes sir Thank you very much Rajan Kothru from Isimut from Nepal I think we can congratulate panelists they really touch most of the issues I have basically two issues based on our basic experience from the Trans-Monday Landscape of Kailash two things I think the institutions somehow I missed nobody talked to institutions as such definitely you talked about governance at the end of the day the governance has to be delivered by institutions which are customized to the problems and priorities of people on the ground that's very very important I missed that maybe they can throw some light on that second is the technologies which are adapted to local institutions and local communities I didn't hear a word about using the new technologies for improving the climate smart landscapes and improving those landscapes and third is really how do you really create an attention to these upstream or mountain related investments you know one of the key the key is that despite our discussion on upstream downstream linkages but we know that globally and also nationally there is much in the mountain world what is the reason for that I'll keep this well that's a very simple set of questions I think we'll stop there and we had the question profound question about governance and equity we had the question about about institutions we had the question about knowledge systems we had the questions about technology so what I'd like to do actually is ask each of you to pick one of those two briefly and we may not be comprehensive and we can come back if we need to but maybe I'll start with you Dr. Radun is there one of those that you'd particularly like to respond to thank you mine is the question on mountains all of them actually are pertinent to what we're doing but we're going to pick up on one the use of technologies technologies allow us to actually sort of shorten the way we transfer the knowledge tell what you mean communication technology I'm talking about communication technologies that is in in Niger for example we had a project satellite imagery ground-true thing it's on pastoralism so when we get it all together we actually pinpoint where there are water sources so when the herd moves across areas we'll tell them and actually locally with the producers together get together with the extension agents and that delves slightly into the institution support capacity building institution support so that the extension agents the producers the technician get together read them up and then inform the herd that actually we're running 100 kilometers you can go 40 kilometers off to the right and then you get it so it's really actually we're testing a lot of few things and it's extremely important and we cannot emphasize enough the use of this technology these gadgets are good and we welcome any thoughts or any other example that we're going to use to transfer technology and apply technology irrigation and the rest of the stuff thanks that's a great example Andy this is a tough one I can only pick one that's a tough one I'll take on the knowledge management because although the technology one maybe later so on knowledge management I mean I think if I think back about the most rewarding thing that's I've done in my professional career in the last five years was about South Exchange and this learning journey between countries and it was all about climate smart agriculture so there was an exchange between Colombia and Senegal where a bunch of Colombians went to Senegal to see essentially in a country you probably couldn't pick a country more different in terms of conditions you know in all aspects and the value of that exchange was just tremendous in terms of doing things and brought back to Colombia all sorts of now in action activities on in that case it was seasonal agroclimatic forecasting was what came out the reverse happened Senegalese went to Colombia and then out of that we had the Senegalese are now interested in things like silver pastoral systems so it's these kinds of engagement and knowledge exchange is absolutely crucial and I think we've got to look for ways of taking it over longer distances as well and it's absolutely crucial we need to get that right and learn from community to community and over longer and using things like I can answer now the technology is to bridge that gap Thank you very much Andy Later I'm going to speak in Spanish again Yes I'm going to address the issue of institutions I had it here but it's very difficult to address all these interesting topics in three minutes Yes then the institutions how should the institutions change? It's very important the issue within the field of institutions and I think one of the key elements of institutions is to change the way how they address the problems we are used to to do it in a way in a way in a way in a way in a way in a way in a way in a way in a way in a way in a way Thank you On the institutions and thanks for bringing that up let's recognize and it's related to governance too let's recognize some of the government institutions are weak and especially when dealing with mountain problems that's what we see but we recognize that there are a lot of informal institutions in these areas say the forest user groups and the water user groups at community level and somehow it's connecting trying to connect government institutions to better serve and kind of related to the knowledge and communication one thing we found quite useful is just to have community interaction but community to government interaction as well to just to get people out on a Yatra for example to see what's happening out on the field Interesting Carlos and I collect a little bit questions even in the fact that we should conclude with a strategic planning from the local territories we should build scenarios which is precisely where we are at the moment when I said and is building a strategic action plan for adaptation and mitigation in the different local environments that's very important because that you are aware that the biggest proportion of inclusion of local institutions and more recognition in the region through organizations leaders that can exist and take this to national or worldwide one review the world world building, planning of this type and there are not a lot of elements to review The important thing here is to generate knowledge, and surely, from all these well-planned strategies, everything else will arrive. Having planned, we have technology, having planned, surely we will have sufficient resources, because we have achieved the look of important actors that previously did not consider to be part of the problematic possibility that generates climate change and the situation of productive unsustainability. Thank you. Do you want to select one of these for practice? Yes, thank you. Yes, as you said, the topics are complex, and I do not think that we can give an answer to those, these are topics that we are going to have to continue to elaborate in the next years. On the issue of governance, I think that here people who have been for years linked to territorial focus, as a model, could comment on how they did it to form directories. What I do think is important is to think that even within the same territory there are different scales of the structure of decision-making. In a project that we promoted from a paradigm change, in what is the management of wells, we talked about the management of wells, and adaptive management. Committees of management of all the wells were established, but also committees of management of the sub- wells. So within the same territory there were different scales of decision-making to be the beginning of subsidiarity, to be closer to the decision-making that people care about. It is also important that the people of the central governments who are in the territory are compromised with the development processes. There are many interesting cases. I close. Nicoya's peninsula is a very interesting case, half a million hectares of which, in the last 35 years, 8% of forest coverage went to 54% of forest coverage, with social economic effects in the human development index, and anyone can say, well, that is already a climatically intelligent territory. However, what is missing? It turns out that they have a series of institutions at the level of the territory, but they do not yet have a mechanism of making decisions at the level of what, that is already a forest model, and then they are conforming the director and the forest model as a governance mechanism. Excellent. Well, I want to ask, then, if some of you have worked on this problem of inequity in the process of congestion. If we're going to look at this question of, is there someone here in the audience that would like to speak to that from their experience, approaches they've used to increase that? Ronny, identifiably. Ronny de Camino, de Cati, and President del Directorio de la Redo de la Americana de Bosque Modelo. En realidad, lo interesante en los bosques modelos no como bosques lindos, bellos, hermosos, sino como territorios ricos en bosque que tienen la intención de llegar a tener un desarrollo humano sostenible. Y que se generan a partir de un conflicto. Y entonces vemos como resolvemos ese conflicto y ese conflicto muchas veces es un aspecto muy práctico. Por ejemplo, el agua. Entonces hay que resolver un problema práctico. Esa es una de las primeras cosas que surgen. Y frente a la necesidad de resolver ese problema práctico todos los actores se juntan porque están todos afectados y después esa misma estructura se usa para otros problemas diferentes. Y frente a esto, y quiero tomar lo que decía aquí el colega, una de las cosas quizás más valiosas ha sido primero que es imposible que haya igualdad de poder pero por lo menos frente a ese problema se negocia una cierta equidad para resolver el tema. ¿Verdad? Eso es vital. Y la segunda cosa que es vital es este intercambio de conocimientos. El bosque modelo y Fernando lo me deja mentir que el gerente de la red se hicieron en los últimos 4 o 5 años alrededor de 50 intercambios entre bosque modelo frente a problemas conflictos. Yo resolví esto, tú no lo resolviste ven a ver lo que yo estoy haciendo y viceversa, gracias. Muchísimas gracias. ¿Hay otra serie de preguntas? Si ustedes tienen otras preguntas o comentarios, sí. Brian. Thank you, Sarah, Brian Finning and also from Cati8. One phrase that caught my attention very strongly in things I've read the last few years is perhaps obvious to everybody to, for forest ecosystems to continue providing a mitigation service i.e. sequestering and storing carbon there has to be adaptation. So to carry on mitigating there has to be adaptation as I read it in Spanish para mitigar y que adaptar. And I'd like to... I'm interested in hearing what the panel think about the territorial scale management and climate smartness is a territory in which management contributes to mitigation while at the same time adapting. So I'm very interested in hearing what the panel members think about this. Thank you. Does someone else have a comment? Here's the lady. Hi, my name is Laura Ragell and I'm a student at Swarthmore College in the United States and I was very excited to hear land tenure issues mentioned a few times to hear the emphasis on user groups and co-management as decision-making bodies at the local level that really matter as I'm wondering if when you're trying to address vague land tenure whether you're advocating for individual titling to single owners or for more collective community-based ownership structures. Thank you. Do we have one more? Anyone want to... That gives us enough to go on for a bit. So the question of... What does it mean to integrate adaptation and mitigation and what really have we learned about addressing land tenure conflicts within these landscapes? I'll let you pick whichever one you'd like to go with. Dr. Adum, I'll go this way again. Adum, Dr. Adum, how do you... One of the biggest headaches is land tenure. And, you know, I take advantage of this opportunity to say in Africa, Sub-Saharan Africa, we have population growth the highest in the world. Lousy land tenure systems and land has been degraded at a rate of maybe 300,000 hectares. For Adum, you look at any given countries. At the rate we are going in 2050 with population growth not actually dealt with population dividend, the most we can get is 3.2. That means we have to colonize about 125 million extra hectares to just break even in terms of eating. Consequently, the challenge is... And that's the one more thing I need to add and I'll let other people deal with the mitigation and management. That is, we have kids who come out of school with diplomas, bachelor's and master's degree on an average to 100,000 to 150,000 per country. And no country has been able to create at least 50,000 jobs. And you see the difference? What is left? What is left are on top of the moms and pops and the little kids that don't get the share of this common goods, provides tremendous opportunities for banditry and so on and so forth. So what is left for us is looking at this landscape. We're going to scale it up and out because by managing this and bringing economics into it, we should be able to mitigate as well as manage it. And we have the knowledge. We just need to select a few pilot tests and then go after them. And last thing, get governments to create line items in their budget. So after 10 years, they should not be still waiting for someone to come in and fund this because by that time, the system should have matured enough to self-sustained. Thank you. So mitigation adaptation is an employment generation strategy. Yeah, so a lot of my works on climate smart agriculture and the whole issue of trade-offs and synergies is very central to that. So the issue of the kind of outcomes of food security, adaptation, mitigation and being very cognizant that in some cases there are trade-offs and synergies in these. So for example, in the country profiles that we developed, we actually looked at a range of practices and technologies and we kind of valued, the value proposition of these of whether they're water smart, carbon smart, weather smart, nitrogen smart, energy smart, gender smart, all of these things. You know how smart they are. And what came out very clearly is that at the practice level, you have trade-offs. You have some practices which are fantastic in terms of productivity, for example, but have mitigation trade-offs. And so this was coming out clearly. I think what's key though is not saying that that's a bad thing but actually it's at the landscape that it all works. So a trade-off at a practice level on a farm is actually a synergy at a landscape level. And I think that's the utility of a kind of territorial landscape based a look at climate smart agriculture. And I think those two scales just talk to each other very nicely. So I think the trade-offs are there, but one man's trade-off is another man's synergy. Great. Leida. I want to give you an example of how we're trying to establish how these synergies, trade-offs between adaptation and mitigation in the BAP framework. Basically, adaptation, we're supporting the whole issue of food security, nutrition, work at the level of family gardens and on the farm. But basically what we're doing is introducing trees on the farm and on the family garden, especially fruit trees, so that we can make that synergy between mitigation and adaptation. On the one hand, we're improving the production of food and the availability of food so that families consume it. And on the other hand, we're introducing trees in both systems so that there's a mitigation effect. Thank you. Yeah. I think probably the red plus work, as I'm trying to understand the question, I mean the community is probably in our region see that more as an adaptation strategy with funds coming in, going to the different community members, but it's also a wonderful mitigation strategy. I think that's what you meant. So those two things definitely go together. The only thing I wanted to mention was there's a tremendous growth and demand for energy, right? So it's just finding those green technologies that both help people adapt and mitigate solar wind, biofuel, et cetera. Okay. Well, with regard to mitigation strategies, adapting, as you said, I think the best scenario is to interact with the mitigation issue, in our particular case, with the management of the risk. We have a very particular condition in our region and it has to do with the high slopes, the areas of agricultural production have slopes between 50% and 80%. And there we have achieved that with these mechanisms of identification of the problem around climate change, people adapt to strategies that not only carry the mitigation of the reduction of emissions, but the adaptation brand and this time in something fundamental for the populations and the management of the risk. So when this type of action is made, the house goes away, the crops are lost. So it's generating a whole strategy around what has to do with the agroforestry systems, in these areas, the inclusion of the forest component and, in the end, the issue of the property is very delicate in the case of Colombia. In our region the property has serious inconveniences to generate a whole new policy to be part of the government, in part, to formalize that property and to be able to access a mechanism of participation of these red plus scenarios or any other scenario that can exist. Very precisely, I think we are in a stage where we are questioning these paradigms. They have already dimensioned climate-intelligent agriculture. I think that this paradigm of a different agriculture will bring many opportunities or are demonstrating many opportunities of mitigation adapting to the best, right? I think that an element that we have not mentioned here that is fundamental is the management of the soils, not only the lands, but the soils as large as the biodiversity, the substrate to grow the vegetation that again becomes another large carbon reserve and habitat for biodiversity. So it is a tree agriculture that offers a series of options. There are many researches that have shown results of how it is possible to include trees and for example in Ganadería producing at the same time more milk or more meat that adapt more. You have to think about the management of the genetics of the animals so that they can also produce in warmer or lower conditions and make many opportunities with this approach of climate-intelligent agriculture that has brought the umbrella of climate-intelligent territories incorporating climate-intelligent agriculture. Thank you very much. Is there anyone who has a very urgent question My name is Mariana from Mexico del Centro Mar y Molina and my question is about all the topics that you talked about regarding equity, governance how long do you take in your experience to start running a project of this type at a territorial level? Good question. I want to see what you are working on Can you quickly comment on what has been your experience maybe Leyla and Carlos and David In our particular case it is a hard work to identify actors the role of actors is key It can be said that in our case to obtain the action plan for mitigation and adaptation of climate change for three years in that process we have been incorporating the majority of actors to obtain the greatest recognition and the greatest inclusion of all public and private of the region that allows a greater appropriation of the plan that is being built Leyla In the case of MAP we are in the second phase there was a first phase of four years and we are in the second phase we are practically in the fifth year and it has been a very interesting learning because there was a very big change from the first to the second phase the first phase was a program that had projects that acted independently and from there we learned lessons and we have an integrated focus where it is going to work our proposal is interdisciplinary and for example the campus schools we do not arrive with a school of cocoa or coffee but with a multi-term school that adapts to the needs of the family groups we work with the same when you work with the platforms of value chains or with the territories it is done with integrated focus so I would say that for us to get to this territorial focus we have been four years to have five or six years do you want to comment on that for just a second? I forgot to say that as soon as we did the planning phase we are implementing as soon as we start and one of the most critical conditions at this time is to guarantee the sustainability of that plan built and that is only achieved through very effective monitoring mechanisms under something that we have called we have generated a dynamic of some actors of greater relevance in scientific terms technical terms, academic terms that allow for traceability and dynamics of this plan you want to comment first and then David my name is Fernando Carrera I am the manager of the Iber-American forest model that has many of the ingredients of the climatically intelligent territories the first thing I want to say is that climatically intelligent territories forest model are not projects they are processes they are social processes they are multi-sector forums that can last many years with the name of forest model there are some that have Washington, how old is the forest model of the Iber-American forest model 14 years of creation I know others with the name but the process began 25 years ago we have the case of landslides in Puerto Rico, in Nojancha it has 30 years of experience and I can not say that it is consolidated but they are processes that are being built little by little and they are not projects that is the first thing you have to differentiate now how long does it take to be mature? this depends on each one not the time to start to really get collected that is a great question but also there are processes that start and fall case of landslides and there are processes that are slower the dynamic depends on each one of the sites but multi-sector forums what I do want to say that the participation of the municipalities is fundamental and that a forest model is not a jurisdiction authority that is very important there is no ownership of the land no there are protected areas there is private property there are national parks it is a mosaic of different uses of landslides that are planned in a coordinated way that is the concept perfect landscape process is a generational process not a project so that would be excellent we are a little bit running out of time see oh I'm sorry you can make it very quick I would like to it is a process but we have to start generating results, impacts and it is very important for sustainability for financing and also to keep the movement of the people if they don't see results the process dies thank you the process I like that word it is a process what is interesting is when we are working across boundaries between countries it takes two or three or four years to get countries to agree to work together then it takes a long time we are always too optimistic with time the point is you have to be there it is a long time to have this work but it is coming now more and more the big transformation in Ethiopia that has been documented took seven to 15 years but they quadrupled production got rid of food aid it was pretty major did either of you want to comment on this point yes please do it and I think well let me switch to Spanish we are in Lima I think we all need to make changes in the way we have been working the institutions need to make changes Sara remembered that in Cati we have taken climatically intelligent territories as a central element of the strategic plan in 2020 but we have done before fundamental changes and here giving a follow-up to what David said before Cati worked with many projects in many places and some of these were projects and initiatives that ended after a few years but to be able to accompany and really leave results we have changed the strategy and we adopt what we call key territories MAP is working on two key territories that are not part of a project they are part of the strategy in the long term that we have taken in the central region of Nicaragua that is a decision that we have taken institutionally to accompany territories because they are processes before a process is an aspiration that is implemented through a process that requires a long-term commitment of institutions like ours and many others including the cooperation perfect I wanted to have a last round of comments from the panel following up on one of the earlier questions about finance one of the themes of this session is thinking about climate smart territories as a development strategy that is comprehensive that has all the different elements in it but to make it happen particularly those components that do require this longer-term institutional investment and asset investment that may take from 3 to 15 years what has been your experience about if you were advising the national community your national countries if you were advising international donors private investors can you just sort of say what would be the one message you would want to pass to them or the one lesson you have learned about providing the financial resources for landscape investments if you could each just give a sentence or two on that and I think that will probably wrap us up do you want to start JJ? I remember a friend of mine whose son was going to study in the US he asked me the same question for the child I told him not to read so much so that he doesn't lose or that he doesn't get hungry I think that the development projects are the same a space with a lot of resources we can start to lose the development process and also we need fresh resources I think that the strategy should be I have seen a lot of positive results in GEF but also in small donations the ones that support the resources that are already in the territory I think that the main resources are already in the territory the resources on the outside that come fresh they have to come to plunge I think you as a model have a lot to offer Thank you another question Yes, precisely it is valuable what Mr. Joaquín says I consider the few resources that can exist from the environmental sector should be focused on what scientific development is and what it has to do with technical support specialized I think that the same territories should be generated from that dynamic the need and the real source of investment because they will be really affected in fact it is achieved with a good construction of the problem an adequate participation not only the government but the private sector that should be called to incorporate mechanisms that allow them to be more competitive under a global economic scheme I mean it's a strategy what our organization just does says we'll be there for a long time then we just make sure that we have not huge all the time resources but the other important part is to there are other resources there the private sector and the value chains bring in resources also it is working with governments you can actually leverage other sources of funding that are more important than whatever we bring in in the long term so as possible this is a very important and that is the basis of the decisions at the territory technical and research but it is important to think about the resources of the donor and also the results that are very important and also the beneficiaries que hay fuentes diferentes de sector privado y los gobiernos y en nuestro caso es muy importante también el cofinanciamiento incluso de las organizaciones de productores con las que trabajamos. Nosotros ponemos parte de los recursos y ellos ponen contraparte. Comgestión. Exacto. Comgestión. Yeah, so I mean just playing devil's advocate the difficulty that landscapes, territories always have is, you know, if you're an investor, a donor, policy maker, whatever, you're faced with the question. Okay, so who's accountable? Who do I need to talk to and work with who is going to be accountable for this change? And that's where institutions come in key and it's a range of institutions. So I think really the importance in this is massive. The challenge is making the strong case that this is a sustained winner. And that I think you need very solid examples. So you really need to show in the field, show is seeing is believing this working, you know, so I would say that would be the first thing to do. And then, you know, and then put it in numbers, these benefits, you know, real, real kind of hard evidence of why this is working and express that in all of the multiple benefits that you are gaining. You know, so I think that that would be the challenge. If I'm to be the devil's advocate and the investor, you know, show me the numbers and show me it working. That was good. Dr. Ardun. In terms of encouraging investors, currently the data indicate that countries that make up ECOWAS, YUMWA and SEALS, 17 of them, trade among them up to 12 or 15 percent. So if we want to say, why don't we not go up to, why can't we go to 30 percent? So with the opportunities that 30 percent will create, then we can go back and say, OK, you manage, actually you develop, you manage, you mitigate, you sustain, and then you don't even have to go far. You don't have to worry about the international market just within the region. There are plenty of opportunities. And so I'm conducting, I'm going to do a study that will help me understand the landscape, the regional landscape. And then I'll take that in a knowledge and bring it down to the community landscape. You will see here and there, this is what you can do to make life easier at the community and better for across the region. Thank you very much. I think that was a really thought-provoking and very helpful and concrete set of interventions you all in the panel. Before we close, I just wanted to give a little bit of a notice to an international coalition called the Landscapes for People, Food and Nature Initiative, in which Katye is playing a leading role. We have many of the other partners here who have been involved in trying to understand, have dialogue around landscapes, document, and synthesize the evidence from across the world about landscapes to answer the question that Andy was mentioning and Dr. Adoom, and also to provide support and knowledge sharing among landscapes as you were discussing. And one of the things I wanted to just highlight is that one of the things the Landscapes for People, Food and Nature Initiative has done is to implement a continental review in Africa, Latin America, and Asia on integrated landscape initiatives that have been around for at least a couple of years that integrate agricultural environment, often climate, and livelihoods. And we've got documentation now on 356 of these with very diverse institutional formats and a very rich source of information that we can start to learn from. And I think we're not at the beginning. There's actually a lot of information and experience out there as reflected in the panel today that we need to be tapping more systematically and sharing among ourselves and informing policymakers, decision makers, and investors in terms of doing it. And I think we're on our way there. So with that, I'd like to give a very warm thanks to the entire panel. Thank you all so much. Give them a round of applause. Thank you.