 Welcome back to the breakfast here on Plus TV Africa. Our first major conversation takes us to Emo state where there seems to be a little bit of controversy after the Emo or six Emo lawmakers have removed their speaker and his name Mr. Emiziem, yeah, that's his name. And of course, this is also common. Just a few weeks after the same speaker had removed the deputy speaker for unparliamentary activities And we're speaking this morning. Yes, the speaker's name is Paul Emiziem. I beg your pardon We're speaking this morning with Festos or Google, a constitutional lawyer. Good morning and thanks for joining us All right, it's not the first time that we're hearing of situations like this and not very long ago I think also in Plateau State there was something similar going on Can you share with us, you know, what what your take is on You know bits of crisis that happens in Nigerian State House of Assemblies that you have six sometimes seven eight ten lawmakers impeaching the speaker and you know replacing him with you know a new speaker the next day How does this always happen? Mr. Ogun, can you hear us? All right, we seem to have lost Festos Ogun there We will try to reconnect with him and of course bring him to share his thoughts on this It's Paul Emiziem who of course is a speaker that has been removed He has been replaced by a new speaker Kennedy eBay our guest earlier Of course Chris one who had spoken a little bit about it What Kennedy eBay currently is the speaker of the Emo State House of Assembly in reaction to it Paul Emiziem has said that he is still the speaker and that the deputy speaker Amara why who was removed and of course who led other lawmakers to impeach him and put in Kennedy eBay as a new speaker Cannot do that legally because his impeachment still stands. And so, you know, these are the legal You know directions and you know controversies that they would have to continue to battle on to you There's some clarity as to what is going on in the Emo State House of Assembly Chris one who also mentioned earlier that this is all just politics being played out here and there We hope that there is some clarity and we'll be able to understand better as we try to reconnect with Festos Ogun this morning And I was saying earlier that it's not the first time that we've seen things like this And every now and then there is one state controversy or the other, you know, and you know It leads to impeachments Sometimes it even leads to the mace being stolen or being taken away from the house You know so that the house citizens can hold in reaction Fred Polynesium also made sick man saying that they weren't even meant to be having a parliamentary sitting on the day that you know He is supposed impeachment to place And so it cannot stand They obviously would be going to the courts, I believe, you know to try to make sense out of all of this and of course I'm not sure where this leads It's just a similar situation that happened in clear Tuesday. Just recently looking at the impeachment as well I'm sure that there's a procedure because with everything you have laws and rules guiding every organization every institution And so I'm hoping that we're able to connect with Festos this morning. So we find out exactly What the law requires. I mean what it takes if you were to impeach a speaker You know, what is the expectation of the law? How is it supposed to go, right? And so what are the procedures to be taken before a speaker has been impeached? I'm sure that the constitution actually states that also That also is also a major concern because if you're not supposed to have plenary It was supposed to be a committee meeting and then why do you have that? How many persons sat and decided that we have a country report saying that about 19 members signed that resolution out of 27 members So find out, you know, the legality of all of this Well, it costs for a lot of concern because I mean, these are lawmakers and we Aspect that there should understand the law Before you become a lawmaker, you should understand the law understand what the losses and that you are abiding by the law It is really really sad because over time we've actually seen some radical behavior in State houses of assembly and usually when that maze is taken because that's the element of legality Without that it doesn't it means that your gathering is noil and void. However, you know Polynesium is also saying that he is still the speaker and that his removal is childish noil and void Yeah, you know, like you said, you know, we've seen this in a couple of times more times than we're comfortable with Can six lawmakers they remove a speaker You know who needs to step in here to ensure that there is peace or there's you know Some some some sanity in the emu state house of assembly does the governor also need to step in here And of course the allegations against the deputy speaker You know who was also removed in the 8th of July, I believe by Polynesium That's also going to come into into the conversation here because they're gonna have to wonder Exactly what he is accused of it says on parliamentary activity And that's the reason he was taken out as deputy speaker Before then leading the six lawmakers and others to impeach Polynesium now We have a first also boom. Welcome back. Mr. Oh, boom Yes, we can hear you can hear us clearly All right, welcome back go ahead if you heard my question earlier Time of God knows Don't know the format of Yeah, but it's not my dream that it was really by the Emu state out of assembly But then when we look at it from from the aspect of law You see that section 92 Possession to see of the nineteen ninety-nine Lead down the procedure with which He speak out deputy speaker can be fished the law says that at least Majority of the members of the house most have booted and must have passed the resolution Before Speaker or deputy speaker and is there to have been fished The question is is that the is that the case? in this correct We have about Lawmaker that you know booted for isn't fished So from the aspect of law At least from the face of me I think it is valid But we really need to ask if indeed the only Constitutional by me the house of the bill that's not in Nigeria if it is present on pension The question is are they really committed to their constitutional mandate to make law For the peace order of Nigeria Are they really committed to making law Yet to work the progress Advancement of them This is a real question that concerns the common man on the street What I think they will be able of impeachment On the daily basis It may not necessarily matter to the common man. That is their policy What is important to the common man? Is the divinity of democracy? That can be resulted a result of conscious and deliberate love big Love making jet towards the development of the society, but is that what appears to be mostly While I am not Substitution of the leadership of the house I think it is important for Nigeria not to be distracted by the by the distractions that will be on the daily basis I'm really taking time to address a decision questions affecting the people of the most days That is the question, but that would have been mostly for the ticket Mind you Where do we look at the serenity or the gentleness or? or whether the Impeachment was malicious the difference to the entire but from the same value of the law to turn majority has been made and the impeachment appears at least in Consonance with the provisions of the Constitution But what you don't have out of that the law because we have Not because It is advanced because it is a gross violation of the Constitution We mentioned that it won't happen in place of the if we have less than two thought majority of the members coming together to if this Speaker We should call it a charade That cannot be called an impeachment But in this case of people say at least from the fact that in public disposal, I think it is constitutional However, I do want Nigerians to really be aware on You know distractions coming in form of legislative Speaking, I really would make Nigerians to go to a lot of issues issues of God legislative capacity I didn't really believe really expected goods It's a question begging for answer What would you don't have a situation? Where the a key speaker? I've been suspended from performing his other legislative views. Then I do not have an issue But when we have a situation Where he's not just But he's also suspended that there will be a serious challenge Because the position of the law remains that a member of the House of Assembly or even a member of the National Assembly cannot be suspended But to be finished or removed, a speaker or a deputy speaker or a principal office in the House from his office I think that that is a must have the position. What should not be done? is to suspend or remove a lawmaker from representing his people But once the deputy speaker can still perform his legislative views on behalf of his people, it's a right way to go But from the fact that public disposal There is no constitutional refraction But the reaction is well called on issues They should be accountable to the people that elected them just enough to engage in legislative politics that we see on a daily basis. It does not profit you from a man on the street What is important to the good people of the most need is democracy's governance So what you're saying So what you're saying is that all this drama that is you know currently you know being played out in a emo state Is really very irrelevant You know with regards the reason these persons have been elected in the state house of assembly in the first place This is really personal politicking and not actual governance What i'm asking is that you're saying that whatever is playing out in emo state currently Is personal politics and it's it's not actual do the actual reasons that these persons have been elected to represent the persons of emo state in info is that looking at what the law says section 92 or section 2c of the constitution the impeachment Given that we have about So So the impeachment of the speaker Is constitutional At least it meets the constitutional requirement. The constitutional government any additional Requirement the question list is okay We must have at least one Majority of the others of course the impeachment. So from that angle It is constitutional. At least it meets the requirement of the constitution. For my own position it means that We should not go too well On the politicking Of you know, let that of the house of assembly In emo state These those who got this traction The period you've been you know, removing impeachment, suppression, and the rest Can be used to do post democracy Because when you look at the provision of section 4 Of the constitution To discover That the house of assembly Has a constitutional mandate Make law for the good or there are peace process in the emo state Are they really doing that? The question that will be asked Okay So Can you also tell us if there are other factors to be considered before an impeachment process is taken? You know, the truth of the matter Is that impeachment Is More of the political questions that are in question Well, I I absolutely agree that the constitution is equally not just A legal document alone It is a political document As it stands The constitution only provides For the for the requirement The constitution has never provided for grounds Why a member a speaker Or deputy speaker Should be impeached or should be removed The constitution never gets ground Because the constitution of that is usually a political question What the constitution only requires Is that it was supported By the total majority of the members of the of the house of assembly And in the emo state Question At least in the first in public to me, we have Without The requirements of the constitution, which is the total majority From my mathematical Knowledge, I think nice in out of uh, 27 Big requirements of total majority So what happens to the fact that you know, uh, he's also mentioned the impeached speaker is saying that The they are not supposed to have a plenary. It was supposed to be a committee meeting So it's a question of time as well the time and the purpose of the gathering Well, I would not I would not want to join issues With uh, the pronouncement of The impeached speaker What I rely on if I speak to you After public to me what I read in the news I do not have an inside perspective on the foundation but What is important is that If the business of the legislature Performs on the floor of the house Not if you tell or not elsewhere on the floor of the house I think Might be might be like from the position of the law once it is on the floor of the house Then it might be like Because what the knowledge is because I didn't play That's more of a political question than a legal question What is not to be seen is that It's most Dissupported by some legalism of the house. That does not necessarily mean that It can be done outside the floor of the house We have a popular case of If you're an Adiliki Uh, where an incident was carried out Not to tell you the bathroom No, no, that's not it. That's not the contribution of not It's not the carried out in the floor of the house All right, let's talk about them Because at the end of the day What's the ingenuity of that time And that is why they suffice Is that The old legislative point which Is all about the appearance of the logic that is all about the appearance Of The political elite How does it concern the common man? That is the question Mr. Ogun Price will use it to handle Mr. Ogun, I think we would have to take a pause here And of course, I think you've mentioned, you know that the the most important thing is, you know How this affects the people of imo state and the electorate, you know, they are on personal politics and personal squabbles Should not, you know, be the most important thing At any point But we would have to of course do this Conversations some other time where we of course out of time with it. Thank you very much Professor Ogun for your time And for joining us this morning And we'll move away from imo state now But still in the southeast our conversation moves to anambra state Where we do a follow-up on the Elections in anambra, of course, it starts at 10 a.m. This morning supplementary elections from 10 a.m. To 4 p.m. I mean ihala local government area We're going to be talking about the extra details surrounding this when we come back