 Felly ei fod yn ffordd i gael eu newydd ymlaen, a dyweddyn ni'n gwneud i'r ffordd i'r sredd yn ffwrdd y byddai, a fwrdd i'r ddweud ymwneud i'w ffwrdd ddaethau i'r ffwrdd i'r ddweud yn gweithio. Felly mae'n gweithio i'r stadion ffwrdd yn gwneud i'r byddai pan gael y newydd. Fyddwn yn gwneud i'r ddweud i'r Ffwrdd yn y drifiwr. Felly mae'n ffwrdd i'r ddweud yn ei ffwrdd i'r ddweud i'r ddweud. a'r dynion ar y llwydo bwysig a'r Llyfrgell Llyfrgell called Nigger. A rwy'n gallu bod eich llwyfrig honno. Felly, rwy'n gweithio eu cyfeirio'r ddau. Mae'n cyfeirio'r ddau o'r bobl sydd o'r blam. Rwyf i'n gweithio i chi. Rwy'n gweithio'n gweithio'n gweithio. Mae yw'r ddweud i'r i- yr ymddau yn gweithio. A rwyf i'n meddwl i'r ddweud. Rwyf i'n meddwl i'n meddwl i'r i'r i- ond ymlaen i'r ffordd. Fyddwn i'n 1-0 a fewn i'r ymlaen o'r amser. Felly rwy'n cael yw'r gwaith yma i'r ymlaen. Felly fy modd i'n holl gael, rydw i'n holl gael i'r rhan. Fi ddim yn ymlaen i'n rhan. Rwy'n cael ei fyddwch i'r rhan o'r ffordd. Felly rwy'n cael eu befli ac mae'r ymlaen o'r gwaith ac mae'n gweithio. Felly rwy'n cael eu gweithio i ddweud. Mae'r mwyaf i'r mwyaf. ond y trainingon. I feel well bad saying this, but losing my dad was the reason I won the British title because it gave me a reason to carry on doing it because it was the last thing I ever said to my dad that I promised him that I'd do it. Bwm be rhaen. Yn gweithgais, rwy'n cwrtus wedi tyfn. How are you brother? I'm good mate, yeah. Thanks for coming on today. My pleasure, it's been a long time in the making. Yeah, definitely. Great story mate. Premiership footballer, turn boxing, turn manager, you've had a up and down life basically in prisons, charges everywhere, but also a phenomenal career from a young kid 17. I think you're the youngest ever to captain, was it Sheffield United? It was, yeah. It's still a record that stands today. I've played for England under 21s, £1,000,000 signing on fees. It's a bit of a career man that retired in the early, so all over the place. Definitely, yeah. All over the place is probably the right word and I'm one of them. Even now I'm 41 now and I was thinking to myself sometimes, I wonder what I'm going to do when I get older. I've kind of got that personality, I'm always drifting from thing to thing, but sometimes it's hard sometimes having so much success at such a young age when you don't really know how to deal with it and that's what happened to me in football. Had I had my time again, I'd probably retired a lot earlier. I retired at 26, but I was probably done by a time I was 22. I didn't really know what else to do. The only other thing that I was all right at was fighting, so I thought instead of getting locked up all the time for it, might as well try and make a few quids. So I went into boxing, then quickly realised I'm not actually very good at fighting. So yeah. You said you had over 100 fights on the streets before you went in Tontpro, which is pretty mad considering the reputation you had on the football field and trying. People look at footballers and think they've kind of got to stay level-headed, but you were in papers and doing your thing. Yeah, and I think, listen, a lot of them were self-preservation, you know, my fights and say 100 fights, you know, makes me sound really hard, but I probably lost 95 of them. You know what I mean? I'm a five foot six now, so as a kid I was always well small and that's where I'm from, a little market town in Drifial. It's not very multicultural at all. Our next door neighbor had a black Labrador called Nigga, so that's the environment I was brought up in. So I was fighting all the time, like I said, for self-preservation more than anything. You know, I used to run on crying all the time and my dad used to say to me, listen, if you don't do anything about it, you're going to be running back here crying until you're a grown man, you know, get out there and defend yourself type of thing. So the first time I actually hit somebody back, it felt good, it felt quite liberating and what I realised at a young age is people don't actually like fighting, people don't like confrontation, so if you, you don't even need to be able to fight, just look like you can fight. You know, I always say to the kids that come to my boxing classes, if someone starts to fight you, get in your boxing stance and say to them, come on then, and that person thinks, oh shit, this kid knows what he's doing a little bit and 95, 97% of the people think I'll leave that one alone because people don't like the confrontation of it, so as soon as I started trying to defend myself and fighting back, people had stopped calling me the names, so I kind of took that into later life, you know, if anyone wanted to argue or have a fight with me, I was always willing to participate. At this time I'm a professional footballer, so whenever you're getting into trouble, it ends up in the newspapers and you know, I love the saying that the youth is wasted on the young and that's definitely the situation with me. I made so many stupid mistakes with a young boy that I wouldn't, as a 17-year-old kid, I wouldn't do the 41-year-old man, but we all do that, don't we? Yeah, but we all make mistakes, brother, we're all young at once and some just make more mistakes than others, some don't learn, some do learn. I always go back to the start of my guest cutters, where you grew up, and how it all began. Yeah, well, I'm from a market town, like I said, about half an hour from here called Drifield. So, my dad was born in 1956, so if you actually look at my dad's birth certificate, his name is Bernardo Stufig Woodhouse, so he was adopted by Bernardo's at birth. His birth mum came over here to England pregnant, had the kids over and then she disappeared back to Jamaica, so my dad was raised by my nana over in Bridlington and with my dad's twin brother, who's my uncle Carson. My nana's a remarkable woman, I could do the whole podcast about her, you know, she raised three black kids, my dad and his brother, my auntie Mandy, in an area where there's no black people for maybe 50 miles. You know, she's got pictures that I've seen that spray paint on her door, nigger lover and all things like that, brutal. People used to spit at her in the street and she was in a house of a real bad domestic violence, so she actually sent my dad and his brother back to Bernardo's for a few months until she got away from the relationship she was in and once she was out that relationship went back to go and get them, which I find remarkable, and raised my dad and my uncle Carson and my auntie Mandy and then later on they moved to Drifield. My dad then met my mum, my dad was out one night and there was a massive fight and someone punched my dad so this woman went over to my dad and says, are you okay love? And he said, Carson, I'm a stupid cow and that was my first thing my dad ever said to my mum and then my dad seen my mum the week after in the pub because at that time pubs were open every day, they were open Thursday, Saturday and Sunday I think in Drifield and the week after my dad was out with his mates and one of his mates said, hey it's that bird over there with the big tips and that ended up being my mum. So that's how my mum and dad met and then I came along, I'm a brother and sister and I was raised in Drifield here and I loved it you know when I talk about my childhood sometimes it sounds pretty brutal but I loved my childhood it was amazing. Like I said we had a next door neighbour but one who had a black Labrador called Nigga but we were all friends you know that was just a word that was used in them days and you either go home and cry about it or you deal with it there and them so we were always fighting amongst each other. My house was a scary place to be brought up in because my mum and dad had a fight a lot and a lot of my early problems came from dealing with that situation you know I remember still now so my earliest memories was sat up at the top of my stairs and we were born in a raising place called Northfield Cresham. My mum and dad would be fighting downstairs, windows would be going through everything would be smashing and I was petrified and as the eldest child I felt like my job is to look after my brother and sister and that feeling of pure frozen with fear is something that still now I've got to shiver down my spine when I talk back because I remember it like it was yesterday and not being able to defend my family I found really uncomfortable. It took me ages to kind of deal with it the process of talking about it and I hadn't spoke about this until probably a couple of years ago so it's something that I've bottled up for ages and it's difficult because my dad's no longer here you know and I didn't have a great relationship with my mum growing up we're brilliant now we get on great so it's all really a difficult process for me to come through but yeah there was a lot of domestic violence in my house growing up and that was hard and scary for it I think it affects men in uh in I don't listen I can't speak for for women I'm not a woman but I think it's quite um demasculating for a man I don't know if that's a word but it takes away that I'm an old school bloke you know I feel my job is to protect, provide you know that's my job as a man so as a young kid to not be able to help was was tough and that yeah a lot of my early memories are of that and that was tough so that was kind of what I was brought up in um my mum and dad split up when I was 14 years of age who was that for you yeah difficult I woke up one morning and um I'll never forget my dad said your your your mum's gone and I thought he meant he'd killed her I honestly did I thought my mum was dead and I said what do you mean this is a she's gone she moved away and she she'd um gone with my brother and sister so this was 1994 there's no mobile phones at this point so when someone leaves and goes to like another town an hour away or an hour and a half away whatever is I had no contact with my brother or sister on my mum so I didn't know where they were I didn't know what was happening and that was difficult my dad used to work away in London Monday to Friday's so on Sunday night he used to travel up so I'm in the house at 14 on my own 14 to probably 15 16 on my own Monday to Friday and my dad would come home on a weekend and he used to work on the doors on a weekend so I was kind of I raised myself for a couple of years I used to go around to my next door neighbour but one's at the time called Kevin Edgar who later died of a drug overdose and we just used to dust about stop going to school so I left school really at 14 and was just kind of living on my own so that was my upbringing you know and a lot of people say sport saved them but I was very very fortunate that throughout all of this one thing that was always constant in my life was football and I was always really good so that kind of got me away from the situation I moved over to Sheffield at 16 years of age and did an apprenticeship at Sheffield United where I was earning £42.50 a week so that was there that was amazing and from 16 to 18 were probably the best two years of my life looking back that when you felt alive for you chasing a dream you know I always say to everybody that the the journey is so much better than the destination you know all the stuff you're going through so there's a group of 30 lads there we all want to be footballers like so we're earning £42.50 a week it's about nothing but chasing that dream so them two years was so good and within that first year I'd made my debut for the first team which was amazing and I signed my first big contract and something that came into my life changed a lot of things which was money I'd never had money never experienced money didn't have a clue about it I don't know if you you guys have it up in Scotland but we used to put a pound coin in the back of the television and used to get four hours electricity so that's kind of what we used to do when I signed my first contract at Sheffield United I was having all this money come out of my bank account and didn't have a clue what was going on the first deal I signed at Sheffield United was on £1,800 a week and then I played and got in the team side playing regularly and my money went up to three grand I'm only 17 at the time so that was a bit mind blowing and and I remember ringing Kevin McCabe who's a chairman at the time like saying that someone's hacked my bank account I've got all this money like people taking money out my account I don't know I've got no idea where it's going so he rang the police and we had a meeting at Sheffield United and said bring your bank statements in your passport and all that so I took it in so the coppers are looking at it and they're looking at me like I'm an idiot and they're like we don't understand what you're saying so I've got look that £1,000 gone out there and they're like they direct debits and I'm like what's a direct I didn't have a clue what any of it was and it was really really difficult to deal with money talking about now is embarrassing but that's that was my reality did no diva take you aside and try and get money management skills are no for the to play in front of 30 40,000 people each week no have you just got to be learn how to deal with it especially with you talking about the trauma of the past as well it's obviously going to affect you because you would probably been used to your life full of chaos anger frustration to then being in a friendlier environment making some money legit yeah it's an extra pressure that you think fuck this I'm actually used to being in chaos yeah and I remember when I first signed my first contract I think I signed on for £100,000 spread over four years so 25 grand each year so all of a sudden I've gone for £42.50 a week and then I get a bank statement all of a sudden there's like thousands of pounds in there and there's there's none of like listen spend it on this spend it on that all I'm thinking straight away is clothes women fast cars you know all the stuff that you dream of as a as a young kid when you're from a council estate you've never had nothing I remember when I first went Sheffield tonight I didn't own a pair of trainers I had no trainers I turned up in a tracksuit and shoes so my first pay packet I bought a brand new pair of trainers and just little things like that I'd never had so then all of a sudden when you've got all this money it blew my mind a little bit and when I was 16 I got um I got put on um anxiety tablets by Sheffield United when I was 16 so the day see scenes of you being quite yeah all over the place yeah so I went to the the the club doctor who put me on like tablets but they were no good for me and at the time I always liked to drink anyway it was normal but they used to make me quite drowsy so people just thought I was pissed all the time when I wasn't I was just struggling a little bit but these it helped me sleep it helped me settle down sleeping's always been a massive massive issue for me because I panic in situations I've really bad nightmares still to this day do you think that's causing the domestic violence that was in the house yeah it is yeah because it's just not being able to settle because I used to sit up like praying thinking freaking hell what's going to happen tonight is everything going to be all right was your mum and dad drinkers yeah yeah so they both come in steaming yeah and then sometimes it'd be all right and I could sleep sometimes it'd be carnage you know I love my dad my dad's my hero he took me all over the country with my football and I'm a real daddy's boy but dad's also the scariest man I've ever been around in my life how was he when you're saying for Sheffield United yeah he was buzzing we went all over the country trials everywhere and trying to trying to make something of my life earlier whenever we had no money with big steel and borough for a tenor to get you know if we had 10 pound left that 10 pound would go in the car so we could get to a trial so my dad used to sacrifice everything to get me there that's you know my dad was without my dad I wouldn't have been successful in football because like I said he sacrificed everything I love my dad and you know like he said he's my hero he's also scary you know when my dad loses his temper he's a really really scary man so that was that was hard so yeah I struggled like mad with it and it was a long long process of trying to get over it still now I have real bad nightmares now 41 years of age so it's something I'm never gonna get over you just have to learn to live with it really but it shapes my whole life you know and it's so important like I do a lot of work with schools now and a lot of schools you know they have kids that are maybe not too naughty kids and I know it's not the kids it's what they're going back home to you know we have a massive responsibility as parents to do better what about when how long you're on the anxiety pulse for what were they valium or anything what were the kind of tablets I don't know what the exact word from were two years did you feel did it make a difference on the field as well were you tired more less energy they help you sleep and settle down yeah how was it when you said phage is a 16 18 was the best years of your life why is that because I was around loads of mates that were chasing the same dream and I'm out of burning mind from 14 to 16 I lived on my own I'm a kid you know I didn't even know I but dad used to live like chicken legs in the freezer I'm a deep frat friar so I used to bang a chicken leg into it like five minutes fry it stick some rice with it and that's what I did I'm a kid I didn't I didn't know what I was doing so from 16 to 18 I lived in digs with a lady called Rita and there's like seven or eight of us in there so I've got my own little family again you know I've got people I've got Rita who's cooking my meals for me she was my to a Turkish guy called Ersin who's a wicked cook he saw all like the Turkish food and everything so all of a sudden I've gone from absolute carnage they had a massive house as well and a real like posh part of Sheffield I'm like oh my god that was amazing I used to actually nick wheel trims from Millhouse's Lane um my really big cars up there so as soon as I moved into this house I'm like I'm like a kid in a sweet shop there's loads I can nick here so we used to go up Millhouse's Lane and steal wheel trims and when I got into the first team I'm nicking wheel trims you know so people are walking past them thinking is that Curtis Woodhouse looking wheel trim under his arm but that was just the environment we were in it was a buzz I loved it you know it wasn't about the the money it was about whether I could get that off that Jaguar or whatever it was so I loved them two years because it was before I'd made it as well as a footballer you know I was earning good dough but it's before no one knew I was I could go anywhere I'm in a big city it was amazing the best two years I felt like I was it like probably like how people feel like when they're in university or whatever were you drinking heavy at 16 17 18 no more than anybody else who was playing football at that age so we'd have like a Tuesday night used to be student night we always used to have Wednesday off so we were out Tuesday we out Saturday Sunday probably four four out the seven days Saturday Sunday Tuesday Wednesday and then on Thursdays I was one of them I could never I could I have to check everything to extremes so some of the lads would go out after the game on saturday which was normal but then I'd have to then go out Sunday you know Monday I'd be a bit ropey so then I'd be out all day Tuesday Wednesday we had the day off so sometimes I'd go out Wednesday and you never had to drink 48 hours before a game so Thursday was a no go so me being like a cleverest guy around I'm thinking well I'll go to Chesterfield on a Thursday it's like five miles away from Sheffield you know it's not this one going to the other end of the country so I've used to go out in Chesterfield a place called Zanzibars on a Thursday so book Friday place sat day so that was my routine from probably 17 to 25 do you ever look back and think if you'd fully dedicated yourself to your craft how far you would have went all the time but I've stopped playing that game now because I've kind of accepted that no matter what I'd have done as a young kid would have ended up the same because I just wasn't emotionally ready to deal with the pressures of being successful being successful you have to do a lot of things to do it you have to be dedicated you have to get into a good healthy routine you have to live a correct life I just know where I wasn't I wasn't mature enough to do that so no matter what I'd have done it'd have crashed and burned whether it'd be football whether it'd be working in a bank whether it'd be in this or that so I've stopped playing that game really but obviously sometimes I watched TV and think I wonder what I could have done and there's no worse feeling than that that's why I had to stop playing that game why just beat yourself up don't you what ease did you get a call up for England 21s well I played for England 16s under 18s under 21s so I went right through the age groups so I genuinely thought I had a chance to go to the world cup for Jamaica but genuinely thought I was going to play for England you know some of the players that I played with I was on level power with it went on to go and get loads of caps so people like Frank Lampard who was obviously a good player but wasn't stand out you know I mean Jamie Carragher Seth Johnson Paul Robinson who was from the area that I was from just loads of like really good player Joe Cole some amazing players so that was kind of my my era Stephen Gerrard all of the good ones really what was their dedication like seeing you were playing for under 21s and named were them were you still sneaking away and getting a drink or were they head down because they seemed focused Gerrard's characters they seemed football football football yeah well I think the era that I came into it so I came in at 96 so the it was the norm to go out and I've seen a few interviews with Stephen Gerrard where he talks about I think it was Gerrard Hullier came into the football club and stopped all of that whereas I never had anybody do that I never had that kind of positive influence on on my football clubs probably because they're at Liverpool I'm at Sheffield United that there's a difference you can't play for Liverpool and be doing what I'm doing whereas I know this sounds ridiculously arrogant whereas I could play for Sheffield United and get away with it being half cut because my ability had taken me through but you can't get away with that so I know they had a cut-off point like I said to you a minute ago I've never had a cut-off point my cut-off point had always as a young kid would be when I ran out of money when you're on three grand a week you're not running out of money anytime soon so you don't really have a cut-off point yeah was that ever drugs involved no I've never I've never been wanting to take drugs smoke weed and stuff like that actually smoke weed on a on a pre-season tour with Sheffield United four or five there's four or five of us sat on a beach in there about that big so that was there yeah that was interesting but no the drugs has never really been a thing for me when did you go to Birmingham 2001 and that was for a million quid yeah I was 21 at the time yeah still young big signing fee young very young very young what was it like leaving Sheffield United I was happy to leave why I was just in a terrible routine like I'm talking to you but there's sat me all day Sunday Monday sober up all day Tuesday I'm off Wednesday so probably all day Wednesday sneak off to Chesterfield on Thursday Friday sober up sat they play do it all over again so I need to get out of this horrendous routine that I'm in so I moved to Birmingham city which was just as bad ended up on more money in a bigger city so it's just like more you know more problems more money more problems yeah did you have a look to speak to anybody like to say I'm really battling here there's something not right as like I'm constantly waking up feeling down so that's a lot of depression anxiety yeah there's another time you know they spoke out at those times it's not like now where people's kind of speaks out all the time it's easy for people to speak out but did you not realise that okay I need someone to talk to or did you just try and hide that worth when I look back now I've probably suffered a lot more than what I realised there's an old man now looking old man I'm only 41 but looking back you see all the signs but I didn't know and football clubs maybe different now but football clubs don't care what happens if you're performing on a Saturday they're not really interested in what you do away from that there's no liaison officer or anything like that or no one kind of to speak to and even if it was I wouldn't have done it anyway because I was like say I'm old school I'm not I'm only recently ever felt comfortable to talk about how I feel you know the situation sometimes that I feel in you know sometimes I have three days where I just can't go to bed just can't do it but I just know how to deal with it now you know whereas before it was mad you know I'd be on I'd sometimes ring my dad right in tears and say what's up I say I just I just I don't know I just I don't want to be here dad I want to come home I don't want to play football anymore you know and I'm old school my dad's like even older older school so he'd be like fucking hell said I'm working on a building site here getting paid 300 quid a week you're fucking up in Birmingham on 15 grand a week grow up type of thing so that but that was it's not his fault he don't know any better and and I didn't know any better so I'm kind of thinking yeah he's right you know I mean okay let's go for a bit I feel better a few bits don't we so that's kind of the whole cycle and it just got worse and worse and worse what kind of age were you when you really started to take its toll when you get start getting not as fit as you were in the beers and the drink it starts really hitting its toll where the fitness starts to go about probably 22 like say if I had my time again I would probably jacked at 22 maybe even had a year away from football just to I don't know just to get out the the the whole the cycle of it all really but I was putting on loads of weight I drink lager so you know it put there's a lot of calories in it so and my game was getting around the pitch I was always quite quick I was strong I was fit I could run all day I tackle for you I was kind of an old school boxer box midfielder but what underpinned all that was my cardiovascular system I was fit I could run all day for you but once that starts becoming go from elite to bang average then my game takes a massive massive dip and that's what happened and I was no longer the player that I used to be so then that that kicks in them feelings of like disgust with yourself what the fuck has happened here you know and then before I know I'm dropping through the leagues you know and I'm I'm I don't want this to sound disrespectful but I know it does and I fucking ended up like playing in league two on a Tuesday night at Layton Orient where there's like 1500 people there I'm thinking what has happened how have I got to this and it took me a long time you know I blame everyone every manager I ever played for I hated and then after a bit you kind of realised that I was just unmanagable and uncoachable and that was a big issue that that I had and once I kind of got through all of that and moved on to a different sport in boxing it was easy to learn how to I learned how to handle that but I was I was unmanagable uncoachable but the best thing ever did was I've managed to bounce back from that how many players you know at a young age crash and burn and never ever come back from it and and I managed to find something else and fall in love with something else and find a way back to living a a healthy life and and being a positive impact on other people's lives which for a long time I never thought I would be so how did you end up getting over look 20 charges at different arrests and what was the one in the cup final you must but you end up smashing up the endings yeah we we played Liverpool in the carling cup final that was cup tags I played for chef's of the night before so I ended up going out all day ended up drunk and we ended up in a massive fight in in an Indian restaurant I got charged with a fray once I said to him when I was looking at 18 months so he said if you plead not guilty you're gonna get found guilty and says you'll get 18 months for this so I'd already been arrested so many times I've never been arrested sober in my life ever always when I'm pissed um and that was a I think I I think I'd just had my first son as well he's 18 next week he's big lad uh happy birthday he's called carol happy birthday carol yeah a little shitty I just let his dad down I actually spied him a couple of weeks ago he fucking dropped me with a body shot I can't believe it so whenever I tell him like go do the dishes he's like you go do the fucking dishes so he has a new sheriff in town now but yeah he's 18 um but yeah it was I nearly went to jail then very close and um when I when I went to court my solicitor told me listen take a take a wash bag a bag on what you're kind of gonna go to prison and I was like fucking hell but luckily the judge was lenient because he probably seen this kid's got could have a bright future ahead of him yeah we sent him to jail you know it might disrupt all of that so yeah I got I got another opportunity did that not give you the kick up they asked to see okay I need to knock her down here my life is slipping fast what age were you then 21 so story on kid was all this shit in the press all over the place oh yeah how was that extra pressure as well on your head hard because you kind of I've got a reputation now as a wrong you know because I'd always I'd always had loads of been in loads of trouble at chef United a lot of it was laughed off when you're 17 18 and just got into the team and then starting to become the best player in the team it's all like we spoke about before a camera now a lot of it's brushed under the carpet because you're a commodity we'll probably sell him on I said I agreed a deal with Glasgow Rangers for £4 million so no one's kind of like pulling you up on anything because you're a commodity that's the way they see you just a piece of meat really but then as you become less and less of a commodity the people start pulling you up and people start firing you people start wanting to sell you and get you out the football club when you're not a commodity anymore and at that time no longer a commodity at Birmingham City so when you're getting sad yeah when the dangers coming for you when I was 18 or 19 that's what they've been I think it was 1998 the Cadfocat who was a manager great manager yeah he was some players like Newman Van Broncos yeah get to souls and albert's I think had some team then great era and I went up I went up to I went up to Glasgow to meet the the chairman I was actually on the back of the Scottish Sun the headline was Kirk Court in the Act so Glasgow Rangers agree a £4 million fee for Sheffield United to Curtis Woodhouse so yeah that's one of them sliding doors moment isn't it you know of what what might have happened if I'd have gone to if I'd have gone to Glasgow Is that what it was £4 million? £4 million quid yeah in 1998 so you know when they first actually sent us strippers, birds, hotels it was classic Glasgow made it this thing well I went to the game I think a lot of people in England don't understand how big Glasgow Rangers is massive and Celtics they don't realise how big the clubs are and I was like I'm 18 year old kid big Gaza fan so the season Gaza had just left and obviously Gaza ripped the league apart so I've gone down there and I'm thinking like Sheffield United are a big club I've gone to Glasgow Rangers and I couldn't believe it it was the day that I think they beat hearts but they'd already won the they'd already won the league so they were parading the the trophy around the ground the place was round the atmosphere was like unbelievable so I've gone into like took me into the trophy cabinet in like the trophy room it's fucking bigger than my house there's just about a thousand trophies in there I mean Sheffield United have got like one trophy or something like that so I couldn't believe it so I went round and they were shaking my hand like welcome to Glasgow Rangers I just needed to sign the deal it was all agreed like a four-year deal and I'm really looking forward to it so after the game gone back to the hotel and I was down there with a couple of agents as well and Glasgow Rangers had sent like a couple of chaperones to take me around the city they took me to I went into the Versace shop I don't really know Glasgow but that world wide yeah yeah so they took me around there and said get whatever you want and I got like a black pair of trousers I didn't get anything else so anyway we went out on the on the night into Glasgow to kind of celebrate had a couple of beers before I know it like a couple of beers was turned into like drinking champagne I'm drinking shots and at this point like when I left the ground we went to there's a pub opposite the whole thing's blue and it's got massive paintings of all the old players in so it's like loads of Rangers fans in there so they're all like oh we can't wait to get you to Glasgow Rangers what you're doing after I said I'm going out in Glasgow we'll come with you so at this point I'm in Glasgow in this bar with about 50 Rangers fans and we're just going around from place to place and we end up I'm sure the place is called the piano bar is that a place a bar a planet piano bar it's like a real like swanky bar really like nice by this point it's like 10 o'clock I'm pissed so a guy's like playing the piano singing a little bit of a few love songs you know what I mean that of the Ben and Victoria's art the Clinton yeah piano bar yeah it's like amazing plays I'm bollocks at this point now I'm like give us give us another one so to get like I've got to grab the mic off him at this point like it shoved him out the way I'm on the piano singing fucking Mustang Sally with about 50 Glasgow Rangers fans behind me the place is absolute carnage we've gone from there to the strip club and I think it was like two o'clock everyone was leaving so we took all these women back to the back to the hotel there was more strippers in my hotel and there wasn't when there wasn't a strip bar and we had like a massive suite there and we just wrecked the place end up winning I think it was about six and a half grand barbell just at the hotel once a dick advocate I'm out I'm out with two Glasgow Rangers chaperones as well so they must be looking I'm thinking who is this maniac we've got here so I've gone back to Sheffield I've gone back to England on the Sunday gone in to see the chef I've got I've got I've got I've gone in like nine o'clock so I've got a message chairman wants to see you something so I've gone I've only gone in to say bye to the lads picking boots up and say oh lads all the deals done listen see you later type of thing chairman wants to see you something like obviously wants to say goodbye so I've walked into his room and you know when you see someone's face and you fucking know summer isn't right and he said to me he said what have you done I'm like what do you mean he said what have you done this weekend and I went to the game and then went out for a few beers after few fucking beers you've cost a foot four million pounds and all the deal had all fallen through I don't think it was just that I think there's other things agents and all things like that but yeah I think he's singing Mustang Sally in the piano bar on top of the piano I don't I don't think it helps I don't feel the strippers but it was an expensive weekend definitely but I always think like what might have happened it had probably been a bad move for me at that point because I'd have been on crazy amounts of money in a big city like Glasgow yeah yeah I was there one weekend and nearly wrecked the place so I don't think with your mindset back then no matter what team you don't work with no matter what manager even if a manager tried to help you you'd have probably told them to fuck off yeah I think you'd have just spiraled anyway but it's not until but again you're still here to tell the tale and you've had a phenomenal career anyone would any football would do anything to have half your career for what you've achieved so you went from Sheffield United Birmingham what was it after that? Well I got sacked from Birmingham City I went on a 44 day bender as you do which is impressive you know to wake up every day for 44 days and think fuck it I'm going again it was crazy really and Steve Bruce rang me up one time I was in Tenerife and he said where are you? I said I'm in Tenerife he was like you're fucking being on three weeks what he's going on when he's coming back and I was like I don't know my head had gone at this point absolutely gone you ever saw a say to them? No no never felt like that just my head had gone I just didn't want to be in that environment anymore so I ended up getting I got sacked from Birmingham City I said I had like two years left on my deal it just showed you because you're not a commodity they just want you off the wage bill but if I'd have been worth money to them they'd have somehow found a way to get me I'm not blaming Birmingham City you know totally my fault you can't go on a 44 day bender during a season so I totally get all that but I got sacked and then I ended up going to Peterbury United which changed my life because that's when I met Gary Derw who's a former British featherweight champion or super featherweight I'm not sure How old were you? 24 still young still fucking young it's as if you're at the end of your career at 35, 36 but you're only 24 I'm 24 bonkers and I was getting into trouble at Peterbury United that's how it all started I'd flare up during training and just want to argue with everyone we Bobby Gould was the assistant manager remember Bobby Gould who managed Wimbledon when they won the FA Cup you know been in the game for ages respectable fella I spoke to him like shit all the time so disrespectful looking back now it's one of the worst things that I feel more guilty about than anything it deserves so much more respect and I just I was a knight talk about unmanagable at that point Peterbury United I was probably the worst I've ever been I just caused fights every day in training just because I could because I wanted to and if anyone tried to stop me I'd just I'd kick off wreck the place just boot balls off the training ground when you look back like I said you know if I'd have been older more mature I can understand there that that kid's got an issue you're not captain there as well yeah I was captain yeah so that's not a very good leader the negativity impact so I wouldn't play with the year I wouldn't play the year fans play the year players play with the year I know it sounds arrogant I could do all that and still perform we're in league one at this point if I can league one I could play in league one now but maybe not now I'm struggling to get in the vet's team at the minute to be fair but I know that sounds arrogant but I could get away with it league one was like I couldn't easy for me play my eyes closed so I could get away with doing whatever I wanted and still be good enough to like I said be captain and I'm terrible captain awful leader at that point because I couldn't even control myself so then you're trying to inspire other people around you with all these frustrations going on and Barry Frye saved me really he ran at this point I'm I'm volatile I must be a nightmare to be around I'm a ticking time bomb so Barry Frye ran Gary Deruwp who had a boxing gym in Peterborough and said we got a player can you help us with him he's a fucking nightmare he said we can't do nothing with him won't listen to anybody he quite likes his boxing at the time I had Leon Mackenzie playing for us as well who ended up being a boxer so it kicked off in a game we were fine you know what I mean so Barry ran Gary Deruwp and guys said yeah bringing down to the gym one day and Gary was just what I needed you know tough bloke former British champion won't take any of my shit for starters and I looked up to Gary and he took me under his wing a little bit showed me a bit of care and attention understood me a little bit and we clicked so I started just doing little things on the pads bit of footwork just to knock a bit of steam off really to try and settle me down on me on the training on the training pitch and that's where my professional boxing career started that's when the the thing in my head thought I really like this and I've always liked fighting took me a long time to admit I like fighting I enjoy it but when he say it out loud it sounds a little bit brutal doesn't it I enjoy it love fighting was that taking you away from was that getting all your aggression frustration you can do that in a football pitch to a certain degree but you can't do it it's different in a boxing ring because it's not only fighting your fears it's the nerves it's everything going into your fight no matter listen we do sparring up in Glasgow and I still get scared getting into sparring no matter how long you do it you're fucking scared but after it you feel yeah you feel like a man you feel tough you feel like there's no pressure and for that few hours of that day you feel great yeah like because you're fighting I think it's fighting your fears I think it all boils down is we're all scared as human beings like you've been the angriest man in the rooms the weakest man I believe so you've been angry and frustrated and frightened if everyone shows me okay he's a bit vulnerable here why do you think you went why did you think every year you get angrier and angrier and angrier is that because you've seen your career slipping and the people you played football with under 21 level have kicked on and cemented themselves as players it took me a long time to realise why I was angry I was angry at myself I wasn't angry at anybody else I was angry that how has this become this how have I gone from there to here I'm angry at myself and like I said you see everybody else who you played with who you just as good as if not better at a younger age and they're doing this and you're doing this and just angry at myself yeah and like I said it wouldn't matter it could have been Alex Sir Alex Ferguson it wouldn't have mattered who my manager was and it wouldn't have mattered what I was doing at the time I was destined to crash and burn no matter what I'd been doing whether it had been football boxing fucking banker whatever it was yeah how do you feel when you were doing all that shit was part of you feeling it was normal because you were so used to the chaos in your younger years or did you realise what you were doing was wrong I knew what I was doing was wrong yeah deep down I knew what I was doing was wrong because when you hit 26 to the tire at 26 you haven't even hit your prime to say players like they're prime 27 28 29 30 even now with things changing the fitness levels there's players playing in their 30s late 30s look at Ibrahimovic look at who's a Geventus goalie 42 43 it's phenomenal that things are doing but for you to make that decision at 26 was that a relief for you to retire big time yeah why massive relief because I just need to get out of that pressure keg of football I just need to get out so it was a massive weight off my shoulders the last season I actually played was at Grimsby town and I played I think like 18 games for them with my old youth team manager Russell Slade who again was someone that when he went out of my life my life started to spiral out of control I was scared of Russ Russ was an old school youth team manager but now now in these days you can't do the things that Russ used to do to us it'd be classed as bullying or whatever but Russ was fucking brilliant you know what I mean Russ had made your run through brick walls for him because we all respected and feared him as well fucking crazy bastard Russ but I needed somebody like that to keep me in check so as soon as Russ left Sheffan United he was another one that all of a sudden I haven't got that fear factor fucking loads of things like Russ gets older and Russ would get older you as well you know what I mean he'd even join in training and smash you with elbows and he used to come training said listen fucking give him on today and training and all things that but he was proper old school loved him great bloke so he was a Grimsby town manager in fact I went from I'm missing out whole city so I went from Peterbury night to whole city my hometown club so that was for me the last roll of the dice of if I can't find that whatever it is back to my hometown club a lot of my mates used to go and watch them week in week out then I know I'm done it's over it took me a while to get into the team first like five six seven games over on the bench got into the team started playing okay went out one night end up having a fight with I didn't even I know listen I'm wondering if I've done something I'll be the first one yeah fucking on my fault but I've gone out this kid started on me in the bar I'd had literally one mouth of beer I stood at the bar I'm east pissed he's been out it was a Tuesday night actually we played we played Millwall on Sky Sports we beat them one nil and I got man of the match so I had no plans to go out and I thought and I like to say I've not been I've just got in the team so I thought yes I'm I'm I'm back in the game let's go out and celebrate I have a few beers so I've gone out in Beverly and this kid started on me and we went outside no I went outside to leave and him and his few of his mates ran outside and started and this guy fucking started throwing punches at me so I hit him with one of the best shots I've ever thrown in my life it made that noise and I knocked him out and he ended up breaking his jaw in six places so we had the Wednesday off I turned up to training Thursday as soon as I pulled in there's a fucking cop car there and he just no straight away don't you think it was for me so I've got my gear I'll slid out the back got into the training ground as I'm doing the warm-up police have come arresting me on the on the training ground I got charred when I get serious or so bad yeah I'm bearing in mind I've got the that phrase yeah so at this point I'm thinking I'm doing jail here 100% luckily for me there was a girl in the in the bar who I know and that's a special police officers of the called she's like a special PSO or something like that she's seen it all so she she actually said this for like a month after I've been arrested and charged so it goes to CPS doesn't it or something like that well she actually went in and gave a statement said because the guy had said that he was having a burger outside and I'd just gone out and hit him so I was like that didn't happen and they were like well that's what he said you broke his jaw you know he's in a bad way I was like fucking hell this didn't happen so the girl that was in there went in and gave a statement saying I was literally stood two meters from it all curts up the bar having a drink the guys come over attacked him because he put his beard on the left and then even his mates all ran out to try and to try and get him otherwise I'd have I'd have got a good few years yeah yeah so I'm so lucky that that lady was in there it's with that commander so defend so I got I didn't get charged anything all charges were dropped yeah because it attacked me for no reason I wasn't doing anything I'd literally had half a Budweiser so it wanted if I was drunk and disorderly and um was that all over the papers as well yeah yeah so they'd even said like oh you've been boozing all day I'm like well if you put sky sports on I was fucking on there from half seven to um half nine and this app this incident happened at like 10 past 10 so say I've had 40 minutes I've got to get a shower I've got to get from hall to bevely which is 20 minutes which leaves me 10 minutes to get pissed you know what I mean so it is what it is but luckily but at this point where in the mind I've already gone to whole city with a bad reputation anyway Peter Taylor's my old England under 21s manager so he's kind of thought well let's give him a let's give him a final chance type of thing and this took ages to come out with what actually happened by time it had come out the club had already thought we can't be dealing with this and they ended up paying me up and Russell Slade who was at Grinsbury town rang me and says will you come and play for us till the end of the season I said I'm done Russell I'm retiring he's like what do you mean you retire in 25 he said come and play till the end of season I said I'll come but I promise I'm going to retire I'm going to become a professional fighter so he was like what's he doing now so I ended up going to play for Grinsbury but I'd already made that decision that I was done so playing them last 18 game I played really well for Grinsbury yeah we got beating the play off final yeah how many people at Wembley it was that card if Wembley was getting redone at the time yeah how many people I'm not sure if he's Grimsbury versus Chelten not many I probably had a shower in front of my people but it was good to bow out me me me eldest son was at that game as well but yeah we lost but I played well because I knew it was over so I could just relax and just sing I'm just playing football for the last 18 games of my life I'm never going to play again that's sad to see that cut it's like 25 years old to think that especially where your son they are playing at one of the biggest stadiums on the planet my later years stadium to thinking this is me retiring feeling like it's a relief it's like people who are going to commit suicide have worked with a suicide centre in Scotland called Chrissy's house and the people who have tried to commit suicide but not the day it ends up falling through but the day they know they've got to commit suicide they feel happier that they've ever been that it's over and it's due at 25 to think that this is my last game and you feel even happier it's mad at to think that I understand that feeling that you just spoke about it was a massive it was a massive um relief I was so glad it was done that I'm not having to torch myself over like because you know every everything that went wrong in my career was my fault so I hadn't even got anyone to blame I can't like blame injury I had a couple of injuries but nothing like that affected my career massively I've had seven seven operations on my left knee but nothing that like I can say ah if my knee aren't gone this this and this so I had nothing to blame on apart from my own ill discipline and circumstances you know so that that's difficult to deal with having to having to look in the mirror and know that you're short coming to your own doing it's hard it happens though but what is the general old boy pass away so my dad died when he was 52 how old were you so I had a being 28 so after you retired but he's still good to see you fulfill your potential and love your dreams and do that so listen football's not everything do you know I must admit it must have been frustrating for my dad yeah to watch his son coming through the teenager talked about as a hot prospect to then be watching me but late and orient in front of one man and his dog so to see that that drop off and when I retired I felt guilty as well because my family gave a lot for me to get here and I've pissed it away my career I should have been able to retire and make the next three four generation of wood houses financially comfortable that's a reality of what I should have done but that's that's not what happened so that guilt of feeling like you've you've let people down that was that was hard yeah but hindsight's a wonderful thing as you say we can't always concentrate in the past but what happens is for your son who's turning 18 oh my dad can make plenty of Premiership he can be a a British champion your career's not that bad brother like that can eventually spur on your son's kids your grandkids to go he can do it so no matter what you've done in your life people can still take inspiration from it yes you were the bad boy of football we've probably had to live up to that reputation every team you went and then you've done fuck it but it takes a lot of balls to retire at 26 yeah knowing that you haven't even hit your prime yet so for you to make that transition to then quit football to then get into boxing what was people saying they think he's fucking lost his brain I was a laughing stock yeah I was a laughing stock um yeah it was like everyone was like ticking the piss but I've always been very bulleted the more people took the piss the more it kind of lit a fire underneath me and honestly I genuinely thought that um that I was good I didn't realise I was really bad until the bell went for my first ever fight and I was fighting a guy called Dean Mark Antonio and Dean Powell was my manager Dean's not with us anymore he actually committed suicide he was a great man boxing through and through and he was my first ever manager I was signed with Frank Warren and he says we founded your first fight um just like a week before the fight so I'm thinking I haven't got me anyone to fight yet so he rang me up got you someone cut brilliant I was like all right class who is it like it's called Dean Mark Antonio and I said fucking no chance I'm not I'm not that in that man he's like what do you mean I said I've never had a fight you can't chuck me in with a Mexican he'll fucking scold me and he said to me he said he's not a Mexican he's a fucking window cleaner from London he said he's the worst kid we can find he said he boxed one of our lads last week and I'll add shit and he made him look like sugar ale ended he said if you can't beat this guy he says there's fucking nothing we can do with you and I remember coming back after the first round of fighting the worst guy they can find thinking I think I've lost that round so it was a realisation of it's absolutely fine chining someone in a nightclub when you're ailed up but there's a big difference between that and boxing when you've got a sky camera in front of you and you're doing something against someone who's been doing it since they were 10 years of age and I've only ever had a fight when I'm drunk then all of a sudden I'll have to do it sober the nerves the pressure of it all and I realise I'm really bad at this I end up winning my I beat Dean Mark Antonio by I think it was one point and I knocked him down twice so I just scraped through and it's a real humbling experience and that's what boxing did me more than anything it humbled me really really quickly really quickly and that's a beauty of the sport and I love it and it it's such a tough sport you know there's no money in it people see like Anthony Joshua and and Tyson Fury that they're gonna split like 150 million you think we all get that fighting for peanuts much did you get for that fight so I got paid two and a half grand for that fight much were you getting that Grimsby a week about the same so you're getting that weekly but you got that for a 10 week training camp paying trainers playing managers probably walked away with fuck all yeah did you feel happier yeah I felt like I'd achieved something yeah because even though I beat Dean Mark Antonio and he was rubbish I was rubbish as well and that was on it early it was on it was on ITV yeah Kevin Mitchell in that fight yeah it was yeah yeah yeah yeah Kevin yeah yeah so if you had lost that fight you think you'd have kicked on or do you think you'd have quit I fucking don't know where the box after that he's ranked one eight nine one nine yeah where do we go from here yeah but um is that what he was ranked one eight nine and you were ranked one nine yeah so when the rank at the the British Boxing Board of Control rankings came out the week before so there's 100 no there's 187 fighters in my weight category and I was ranked 187th and he was ranked 186th so it's like the donkey derby and you know what pissed me off like when I beat him they kept me where I am and kept him where he was because he thought I'm not sure even if he won that so I beat him and still didn't move up a place so it was madness what was the press treat you like yeah the awful bad the all took the piss yeah I remember reading the headline the day after saying I wonder where the circus stops next because that was the first one obviously you had since then you've had ffreddy flint off come out and and box real further than and he was gonna but his ass fell off probably got hit on the nose so not sure about this obviously Leon Mackenzie box and and did well in a short space of time but Leon's from a family of boxers you know and so I was kind of the first one to come out so the press were like pretty brutal towards me but even in the build up to it I was like yeah it's all right you wait till I see me box they'll be like can all this kids brilliant and then like I said one round in I'm all over the place so they must be like oh this kid shit so they're all taking the piss out of me so that was difficult as well because no matter what happened in my football career people had always genuinely accept that I'm a good player so there's always only are there the only negative press I'd get was when I'd get in trouble you know normally the match reports yeah I normally play all right how was that for you again through racism as a young kid over a torment or other people to then try to do something with your life in the press right negative comments how does that affect you mentally it was difficult because I felt like they won't give me a fair crack of the whip give me at least give me a chance you know I mean don't you know these these kids have been doing it since they were 10 years of age I'm not put a pair of gloves on till I was 26 I thought that they'd been a little bit more sympathetic but it kind of felt like everyone wanted to stick the knife in as soon as they possibly could but with your characters that not a case of okay fuck you I'm going to show you yeah and you end up kicking on so you end up winning your first 10 fights is that correct first nine how are you feeling after that you're feeling I'm going to be a world champion yeah I'm big in that that's some feat in itself yeah for putting the gloves on at 26 and then no matter who you're fighting anybody can win a fight I believe anyway but to win your first nine fights we're then thinking okay I've got something here well if you go into Iceland now and mention my name I'm big over there because anyone that's around about 10 stone seven that's from Iceland I've dusted them off you know we've got we've got all the shit fighters and all of them from everywhere and and but yeah I was getting better you know I was getting better I wasn't matched hard you know there's no you know but I was learning on the job and then I fought a guy called Jay Morris who actually had the audacity to start punching me back I was like well what's going on here this is how it works um Jay was tough like a rugged journeyman had been around the game for a long time being in with some good fighters and he just outmanned me simple as that he was just too tough for me at that time it's amazing what happens to your body once you've been a pro for about five six seven years it becomes like that it's fucking hard rock solid your body's hard you conditioned I'd been a footballer for 10 years so my body was like jelly you know I mean it just wasn't that teat up you know fighters have got a yeah solid the different you know and and he was teat tough and I was still at the little footballers body really and he just shoved me about he beat me by one point close fight um I was devastated it was on it's on satanta as well live on satanta um that one hurt yeah it's like everything the first one's always the hardest to take isn't it and I did the usual I retired and that was it I'm done fucking judges fix blah blah blah then after I kind of got me it out my ass I thought it was actually Adam Booth that saved my career at that point he rang me up the next day and he was like how do you feel I'm like I'm gutted to say I'm done I'm retiring if I can't beat Jay Morris you know well I'm never going to be a British champion I'm like I'd come out and said I'd win the British title within two years me being a fucking idiot um so I'm like Jay Morris at that time had like won six lost 20 odd um if I can't beat Jay Morris like what am I going to do and I'll never forget Adam said to me he said have you heard of a fighter called Muhammad Ali I'm like yeah obviously he said you know he's lost five fights don't you I'm like yeah he says so Muhammad Ali can lose five but Curtis what else can't lose one he said like get your head out your ass you know get back in the gym there's loads you need to work on fucking get on with it type of thing I put the phone down I was like yeah he's right you know what I mean what am I going to be the guy that then runs away from football that then runs away from boxing that then runs away from this I didn't want to be that guy so I had to dig down dig down deep and swallow a bit of pride and fucking get on with it and I did do you think you can run away too easily throw the throw the toys out the pram about no I don't think I can I've like said it that's just a perception people have had I've never ran away from anything in my life but oh he's left football now he's leaving boxing I knew that that'd be the perception of what of what people would have of me and I didn't want to be that guy I didn't want to be that guy that walked down the street and put like that's Curtis what else and he lost his first fight fucking did a runner didn't want to be that guy when did you get the British title chance how many fights in eight years in so that's a long journey as well 35 fights in is that how many you've had 55 lost seven I came back then I had three more so I think I'm a 38 yeah it's fucking a lot of fights in only a short period of time any fights we have in a year three four as many as I can really because at the time I've got no income yeah what no source of income did you have any savings or anything other just one cut oh had some yeah but not what should have done yeah I mean doesn't last forever does it got wife and three children to to provide for big house fast car all the football stuff then all of a sudden I'm I'm fucking fighting tooth and nail for 1500 per fight or whatever so it doesn't go far see when you started getting fatter though 28 29 when you were doing the boxing did you ever feel like jumping back into football I played a bit of part-time football to provide a wage I could still play a decent and I played for Washington diamonds they were chucking like crazy money about at one point so I jumped on that gravy train and yeah that was uh that was fun but yeah I was done I just just seen it as just a source of income what about when you won the British title how was that feeling for you to prove everybody wrong that it could be done for the first guy you ever go from football to boxing to then one in a black states which has never been done again that's the thing it'll never ever be done again never impossible it's as close to impossible so you you you go and watch England under 21s you watch the next next game that they play and think one of them is going to become a British boxing champion it would just never happen I was immensely proud and not even because of the destination like we spoke about it's the journey I lost six fights on my way to go there six opportunities to retire to quit I got knocked out twice I got ridiculed the whole way through apart from maybe the last 18 months before I won the British title I think people started to think I mean I boxed Steffi Bull who'd had like 40 odd fights at the time being him some good kids I stopped him in nine rounds I then went and boxed Frankie Gavin who's like the UK's greatest ever amateur I lost on a split decision that was when people thought you know I was 100 to 1 to win that fight in a two horse race the disrespect is unbelievable you know what I mean I was 100 to 1 and I lost on a split decision but even after that it was all a Frankie Gavin didn't perform didn't train properly blah blah blah it was never like you know coach actually boxed well that night and then I went on and I beat Dave Ryan tough man for the English title so at this point that's a beauty of boxing when the bell rings the truth is always told there's no bullshit you can't you win or you lose and people see how you fight so it's not I'm beating and competing with good kids so whether they want to give me the respect or not they have to because I'm getting in with good quality fighters so I'm starting to get all these kids not bad and then obviously the opportunity to fight Darren Hamilton was a massive one for me and it was literally a stone's throw away from where my dad died so that was huge losing I feel well bad saying this but losing my dad was the reason I won the British title because it gave me a reason to carry on doing it because it was the last thing I ever said to my dad I promised him that I'd do it so having that burden to carry was hard because like I said my dad's my hero always will be like I said the scariest man I've ever ever met and and some things like I could tell you that it'd be you wouldn't believe it but they're all true but he's also like we all are a product of his own environment you know to be left on Bernardo's doorsteps at six weeks of age not know who his family are to be in a complete white area to get racially abused most of his life until he kind of starts fighting back so my dad had his issues as well so and he came through them all and became a respectable kind of guy so my dad's my hero so to I didn't want the last thing I ever said to my dad to not come true so to actually win the British title was again felt like the dairy title from professional football thank god for that because you know speaking about nightmares not being able to sleep I've then got that you know my hero and I've like the last thing I said to the light it's bullshit every time I lost that feeling it drags you down and it's really debilitated so to to get that moment where I'm the new it was thank god for that I'd hate to think what my life had been now without winning the British title it wouldn't be good yeah do you think you would still be here I don't know I've had dark moments you know I've been through some really really tough parts of my life that I've never really spoke about to anybody as soon as this is my last ever podcast that I'm ever gonna do um yeah it's been tough at times and yeah I'd hate to think whatever it had been just just struggling to deal with your past and having to accept what you've done loads of bad things that I've done um I'm not proud about never spoke about and and they're hard to to deal with at times and like I said on top of that if I hadn't have kept that that promise that had been tough yeah I know you've got kids I know you've got your messages in that but was it the boxing that kind of changed your life and it's a bit of a cliche to say boxing saved my life because it didn't yeah I saved my life of course man you know what I mean I take credit for it myself and it could have been anything if I had bumped into Steve Redgrave I might have ended up being a rower but I was fortunate that I met Gary Daryl you know and being I'm a big believer in you are the company you keep and all of a sudden once I started to step away from football I'm no longer in a drinking environment people don't booze in boxing fucking games too hard and serious you're not out three four days a week on the pace so all of a sudden I'm around different people I'm around inspiring people I'm looking at like fucking this guy superhero I want to be like him so I changed my life nobody else no nothing else no other sport I had the the gumption to do it myself that's the thing I'm really really proud about like I said I'm many loads of people four by the way so I'd never come back and I came back yeah you see the guys in the pubs and it's good though I could have been a contender I could have made something but you have played at an elite level yeah all departments in every sport you've jumped in you've got that mindset but it's that other mindset where the self-doubt and the thinking you're not good enough but that comes people need to understand that actually what you've came through the racial abuse the the hostile environment in a household where you're probably you says Ellie you can't sleep at night and that affects you the trauma affects you for eternity trying to break the connection so when you think about that pain the emotion isn't there as much but that comes with I don't know therapy I've never done therapy myself but maybe gonna try it myself also it's something that I really like to work on and go to deeper levels and work on in a child as well but for everything you went through you've still had a great career you proved all the doubters wrong but I believe that's when you perform better is when you're underdog when everybody doubts you because that's when you start making something of your life you start taking the foot off the gas because you're fucking accomplished that it always was Tyson Fury's prime example that he won all your belts most famous man on the planet undefeated hut the biggest depression in his life yeah because when he said that going achieved that it's done they're not it's done what is it that's not wait a minute I've still not feel fulfilled here I don't feel complete because when you get these things it is external stuff it's like I've said to you during this interview the journey's so much better than the nation it's to enjoy it though yeah and that's the fucking difficult part because we concentrate on a finishing line when we get the finishing line we create another one yeah and then four you know what time flashes that fast and then we're 50 we're 60 but you've still got memories to live your kids have seen you playing at football stadiums your mum's seen you won British titles so it's still a great thing like I do these podcasts and my mum enjoys them her friends that are working on watch James's podcast and she feels that good it's just that wee bit of goodness to try and help others around you to feel good because you're achieving something which is a great thing yeah absolutely and I think one thing that I've I've done so much better in later life is being able to communicate being able to talk about different things and and that's a massive massive help it like you said it is kind of a therapy but I think it takes a long time to deal with as men to deal with things and and and be able to get them out because you feel like God I hope people don't think I'm a pussy that's the kind of environment and background that I'm from so but yeah it's stuck with me a long long time to feel what's the right word I'm looking for comfortable within my own skin that's what I can talk about anything I can talk about anything now and I don't feel nervous I don't feel embarrassed I don't feel bad about talking about my past if I'm going to see the most violent situation happens out in the street my heart rate doesn't go up by like one beat and that's a terrible thing I think that's really bad have you ever done counselling or therapy have you ever spoke to anyone I'm similar to you though it's on it's on it's on the list yeah I think I've got a lot of things I still need to get better I've been trying to do it for two years I went once about three years ago and I don't fuck that I'm not going back yeah it's fucking scary now we can sit here and talk about the pain in the past but there's stuff that we'll not speak about in front of camera because there's still something there we need to speak to somebody who we can trust and I think the day we truly do that is the day we truly heal I believe I've got a couple of things that I've never ever spoke about and I'm not sure I ever would when I wrote my book your box-to-box yeah when I wrote that I was I just thought I'm just not ready to quite go there yet yeah you know but there will be a time when you feel ready maybe when I believe like the stuff that I won't speak about the stuff that I'll take to the grave also but like I always say I'm open in this and that but there's still something we hold back because we're worried how other people perceive them yeah do you know what and I actually spoke to my mate on the way down here shout out to Wardy, big fan of yours, I could tell you some stories about him by the way this would never be able to go live with you but what was I saying then yes I spoke to Wardy on the way down here about it's going to be my last ever podcast so speak about most things but I've got a life outside of this as well there's some things I don't want my kids to know future kids that I'm working with as well even though it might be good for them to hear me talk about certain situations and certain things that I've done which are terrible but I don't know like you said perception of how people are going to look in I work with a lot of schools a lot of naughty kids that are from bad background not difficult backgrounds all starts in the home you know all the all the problems kids have come from the home because you are the company you keep but yeah I'm not sure I'll ever be quite ready to put it out there because like I said people looking and judge and if I told you certain things people would say ease of fucking disgusting human being so I'm not quite ready to go there yeah but you've been judged your whole life so you know what it feels like the pressures of success it's not just about having a talent and being successful it's can you deal with the pressures the outside noise people's opinion especially with social media kicking off I think you probably came out and retired when social media was just kicking off so can you imagine at that time I refer in the papers you know what they say the papers have wrote much shit about being it's fucking being bullshit yeah but you just accept it so everybody's got an opinion somebody'll throw back in your face what you've done and it's an opinion that opinion then becomes fact yeah you see it that many times you read it that many times people assume that that is actually true and their social media is the devil isn't it you actually met a throw on live tv yeah what happened and nearly killed him I was gonna batter him so I put out a post it's actually the day after I lost my English title so I put out a post saying just doing the school run have a great day everyone and he put a post back out saying um you want to be careful where you drop your kids at school you never know I was watching that's what he put so I'm like there's a certain line isn't they I don't mind being called shit box or shit football online I don't mind all that's water for ducks back but once people start putting what I class as a threat to my family I thought I'm not having this so I put on Twitter I put a bounty on his head and so I'll give anyone a thousand pounds who tells me of this guy is I had his name address and everything within five minutes somebody that messaged me someone who messaged me um how can I put this add the deeds to his house so he sent me like where he lived everything um so I put it up on my social media and I sat in after his address and I was 47 minutes away so I said to him I'll see you in 47 minutes and I was just on my way there and Joey Barton retweeted it it's got like six and a half million followers and John Prescott you know the um the politician from whole is a guy who someone egged him didn't they and he's with a one two he tweeted saying this is how we deal with shit and so it was crazy then like Lorraine Kelly got old of it Lorraine Kelly I went on a good morning show the week after I got fucking paid more for going on that and I did for my English title fight so it was bonkers but I just went and tracked him down and um and yeah he gave a grovelin apology but people can't just say whatever they want to say can they that's not how life works and you know what when you know when I've been out in town or I'm in a bar or whatever no one ever said anything to you did it everyone just comes up and says hi mate I seen you put your title fight out there that everybody's nice yeah it's madness isn't it and then you go on social media like where are all these guys because I was doing a thing up in Glasgow I was doing like a reality show kingdom thing and when it just started there somebody was giving me proper shit and I thought nasty bastard because that was the first time I'd ever tasted any of that stuff yeah and I thought nasty like now you're saying talk about some nasty shit about my my kids and stuff and I says I'm gonna fucking batter you like I was wanting his number this and that I forgot all about it but I actually seen him we were up in there as a place called the fort in Glasgow and I'd never forgot it because I I couldn't sleep in that I'm thinking what if this is real yeah it's my first proper threat seeing him see what you're saying now that kid oh sorry big man just fucking slapped him yeah just slapped him put him in his place but you need to learn not to do that shit also because you know all these people are cowards and it is as you got older and the more you learn but you shouldn't have to accept that sort of pitch that talk shit get banged I believe that do you know what I mean so but fair play to that kid for coming on the telly with you well it depends on which got paid don't it did they get though for it as well so he's making money off giving people you know what I didn't even know he's going to be on the show so I was going on Lorraine Kelly to talk about trolls and all things like that so I've gone up to London the day before as most of the my stories start off we were in London I'm a northerner we don't get to London much so I decided to have a few beers so we were on the breakfast show at six in the morning they get you in so they picked us up I'm getting make up done Lorraine's coming she's pretty little financial so she is and she's smelled lovely um so Lorraine came in and says okay so I just want to let you know that we've got James on the show as well so apparently my name hung over I'm like what she said oh yeah he's on the show so I'm like right and she says and I love to get she says I just got to let you know that this isn't Jeremy Kyle that we haven't got any security so I'm like if he starts talking I'm going to I'm going to lay him out clean live on breakfast television so she's gone are you going to hit him I'm like depends on how he how he deals with it all so she's like panicking so she's turned around I sort of run back into his room and she's just come back in two minutes later she's going he just wants to say he's really really sorry so he doesn't want any like violence or confrontation at all so I'm like well we'll kind of see how it goes did you speak I didn't know what he looked like at this point so I'm thinking he's not a big lump and he walked out and I felt bad actually because he's like a young youngish kid and he's shitting himself he's a bag of nerves and he came out and just said sorry blah blah blah but just going back to what he said do you not think when these people are abusing you and it's easy to kind of fire back at them but you don't think that these probably have got a lot going on as well yeah no it's sort of like it's not in a good place no that's that's them projecting yeah do you know what I mean and a lot of them are mentally disturbed like I get crazy messages we get fucking 10 000 messages on all platforms each week so it's a lot of messages and you look at messages you go ah you're not writing a fucking head and and about 99% of the stuff you get is positive it's all love but it's that one but I concentrate on it one percent and I think you mug sticks with your head and you think two weeks later and then you pop into your head again and you want to see them but it can steal your your energy straight away can ruin your whole day and obviously I'm getting yard get you do get used to it you do get used to it and it get numb to it all the way and you kind of but but it makes you kind of recluse as well it makes you kind of it's a lonely journey try to be successful as well that all and then a few people you know why why is that because not many people are successful yeah there's not many people that are so people that are people looking and whether you're the same as them but you're doing good stuff and they don't fucking like it and that and that's why it's it's lonely on the top of the mountain isn't it that's the horrible thing like I'll support anybody and I genuinely mean that like but if you fuck me over I'm done but when you become successful you start seeing people turn against you the people who can't get to your heights become envious when you were doing your boxing stuff was it a lonely journey or did you well no it's most of it oh shit and we didn't keep seeing that though because you went in the fucking British title yeah I got there in the end and what happened after the British title did you lose it to was it Wally Lemon Wally Lemon yeah I know Wally is a good friend as well I spoke to him a couple of weeks ago yeah good guy man fucking bonkers he put can in his ass he should have beat can I think can get an 11 count or 12 count as well and then he's down a while won't he he's sparring with Ricky Burns as well another good sportsman what a long week that was yeah yeah so um yeah they rang me up he was fighting Michael Katzidus was Ricky Burns I come forward strong fighter so they rang me up and said um it was Billy Nelson rang me up and said would you come and spar with Ricky Burns Ricky Burns like a super featherweight at the time I'm a welter so I'm like a store and a half two store and Evian and Billy said we'll pay you a grand a week I'm like I'll fucking stay there a month if you're on bill so I said yeah come up and inspire them um so he said we want you to do eight rounds Monday eight rounds Tuesday Wednesday off eight rounds Thursday eight rounds Friday so I'm thinking Ricky Burns like super featherweight not really a puncher fucking easiest thousand pound I've ever earned in my life so they picked me up from I think it was Glasgow they picked me up from train station Ricky's like the nicest guy ever you know what I mean he picked me up in this like fucking Nova 1.2 he's massive he's like a borrower sir so I'm chatting away fucking brilliant I'm thinking wow easy money this um so we've got in Belwyn he's a vicious bastard is Ricky Burns when the bell went it was like trying to take me off I'm like where's that Ricky from a couple of minutes ago but you know what what that taught me is that elite mentality and bearing in mind I'm fighting six and eight rounds at the time so by when we sparred he'd get out he'd do a circuit and he'd go for a run and I'm thinking to myself like he's miles better than me which I can accept I knew that before I got up here there's no excuse for him out working me you know doing like the circuits and the running after and after spying I can't hardly move so when I went away from that that made me think I've got to work harder look at this guy he's getting the maximum out of himself because you look at Ricky Burns you're not looking at like a Floyd Mayweather Ricky's got the maximum out of the ability he's got and I love that in him you know I respect that so much in him and he's a real nice guy but yeah three-week world title yeah he beat the shit out of me I was meant to be up there for two weeks but he cut me under both eyes you know so me saying I lost a month I put you go after the week the first day I'm like me I'm letting put my head on the pillar and my head was like that but yeah Willy Lymond I lost I lost my title to Willy Lymond yeah how was that feeling I was done once I won the British title so you completed that you took the foot off the gas again I know disrespect to Willy because you know he's a good fighter and you know what I found in boxing because I didn't start till 26 what you can't give people is experience can you so the ones that had been doing it a long time I was always a little step behind them they just knew too much you know like I'm sure you doing these now you know miles more than what you knew when you first did them so I'm getting in there with Willy Lymond and he knows every trick in the book he's been in with Morales Khan his box since he's like 10 years of age so he was just always that little fraction ahead of me you know what I mean and there I like Willy I'd know you know you don't want to lose your British title ever but I didn't mind losing it yeah he's a good guy very funny bastard yeah on twitter like you're no holes bar that you don't hold back in people but you've got the the love hate relationship with the Celtic fans why is that why is you constantly got the spoon out of claspot rangers and they don't like it because I always see all here it goes like angels one step and then it's just you've got the spoon out you're mixing it in the everybody bites like Glasgow snowmarts Celtic Rangers if you're against one they fucking bite and it's not just one you'll get them all attacking well you know what I remember when I went up and we signed with Rangers they actually sat me down and said they spoke to me about obviously the religion they sat and they said there's certain things you cannot do up at you cannot say said if anyone asked you what religion you are they said you just say I'm the same as you just just say whatever they are fucking you I said don't get go down down that route and at that point I didn't really understand the the Protestant and the Catholic and and the hatred that the was bad for each of you so bad I got loads of fans at the Celtic fans so I've I've a good laugh with them and like I said I support Rangers because when I went up there it blew my mind and the people trept me like I was like the second coming of Jesus Christ and the whole city I just like fell in love with the place instantly and I'd love to go back in some capacity in in a football capacity that the whole city the whole football but it just blew my mind it was it was something else it's like I don't know when you first see something like that it was wow and yeah and ever since then I followed them not religiously but yeah they're my team and yeah the Celtic fans don't like me for it is what it is isn't it you can't please everyone you've obviously tried manager managers you've been a manager as well is it Gainsbury's your last yeah Gainsbury's my last club because that of you had Rico Franco yesterday spoke highly of you he's from that Neckarwood's he is I'm fucking got cut us on the podcast the next day Rico's that undefeated bernocle fighter great story great guy and he was speaking about you being the manager this is a fucking interview on him tomorrow well I said I said to our chairman we should fight me and Rico get it on at Gainsborough you know we should fight against each other and then when I went to go and see the chairman one day Rico was in there because the chairman was sponsoring him when I stood next to him I was like nah fuck right he's massive he's big one bini yeah he's a big boy yeah I didn't fancy that one tough guy yeah what's the hardest thing to do manager football boxing boxing is that tough what's it like before a fight after a fight compared to football before and after boxing mentally is difficult because you're bearing your soul to people to watch you fighting that's a personal thing fighting because I'm an alpha male so when I lose a fight I feel like I've been stripped of a bit of my manhood so the pressure leading into that having to make the way everything that goes with it emotionally it's draining so after a fight you think you won out celebrate and never you go out after fights ever you used to fight Saturday night I used to get a shower and be emotionally even if I won in one round two rounds three rounds I wasn't physically tired just emotionally drained and relieved I think as well because I knew I knew I was never that good and I won the British title but I got there by bloody mindedness I never out-boxed anyone in my life I never have honestly I haven't my fights I won by just being tough and getting through it and I had a few skills obviously to get to level I got to but every fight was difficult because I didn't have that skill set of a willy lemon you know a wiki burns or the good ones that've been doing it for a long time so boxing will always be no matter what I do my biggest achievement obviously there's some of the great things that happen with the football and but like I said because boxing was so hard and that's what makes it so great isn't it yeah going forward for future cutters what's your plans brother well I'm looking forward to seeing Majesty the Queen going down to see yeah congratulations thank you so a British Embassy medal so you got that Christmas I got that Christmas yeah I thought that was a blag as well when I got I got an email I managed to the Queen I'm thinking fucking I'm going jail here what's happening then when I read it I got number to ring so I rang up the lady answered the phone and was like I was like I've got an email you know what's your name so Curtis Woodhouse and she went like quiet on the phone for about 15 seconds so I'm thinking she's going down she must be going down the list or something she's like how are you spelling woodhouse I'm like w two oh yeah you're here congratulations yeah and I'm like oh my god so that was amazing that's an amazing feeling that to to be recognised for your hard work really like yeah my football careers people had miles better careers the same with boxing but I think the crossover is something that'll be never never done again so yeah I'm looking forward to going down and meeting the Royals us so she told you ahead hi for the transition that you've done to still kicking on in life even your dark days where you felt I can't go on anymore you've still pushed on so people can take inspiration from that take a wee all the bullshit from Twitter and social media from what you've actually achieved and actually what you've went through so I take my heart off to your brother because it's not easy I speak to people who battle some people don't go through it yeah people are it's too it's not going to say easy but people are taking their life too frequently for my liking and it's only getting worse so it takes a big bit of courage to push through those dark times no no matter if you were in the British title no matter if you're going fucking Manny's Liverpool you'll still battle yeah because we're human beings it's normal it's it is an emotions but it's not normal to live there every day yeah to have those battles and have that mindset of I don't live there anymore I still battle but the pain is not there waking up every day and think I wake up because I've got a bit of a purpose and I've got a bit of a passion now which is key as well and I'm exercising more frequently and that helps but I still have my moments and I think fuck all this shit I'm kidding myself on here and I still have that self-doubt do you know what I mean it's difficult but I know you now you're working with kids to now try and help them yeah the realisation for me is how much I've got to give back and that and because you've loved that yeah and giving back brilliant thing you know a set of the it starts Monday thing that we do now and it's basically for men that are you know looking to get in shape what we say is we're looking for a healthy mind body and soul because if everything's linked you know when you're training you're feeling good you're eating right you feel better don't you you know we've got loads of people on there that have struggled in the past and we're just giving them a bit of a community where we can talk and and have accountability as well you know so you've got to check in you you've got you've got to eat good you've got to do this you've got to do that and it's beautiful it's stretched all around the country we've got we've got 200 members up in Scotland it's brilliant we've got somebody over in Barbados got a few in Ireland it's crazy and all it is is a group of like-minded men that have maybe lost their way a little bit and need that community feel and it's amazing it's probably the best thing I've ever been involved in because it's so positive every day you go on and you see and read other people's stories and like you said we're there's too many men taking their lives and they're at such an early age there's got to be a reason for it um and hopefully if we can if we can help in that and kids as well you know there's the we're doing a charity walk you'll have to jump on with them we're doing a tech care walk-up in Edinburgh on June the 12th same me all the details we'll post on social media that'll be amazing and what we're doing it for Sam H charity which is a mental health charity up in Scotland that work closely with children as well because again you know we understand the tools to deal with it because we're adults kids imagine dealing with it as a kid and you don't you don't really know what's going on you don't know how to deal with these emotions you know and Sam H do loads of amazing work up in up in Scotland so yeah we're doing the we're finishing it is it the military mile that it's called it's leading to Edinburgh Castle yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah so we're doing a 10k walk and then we're finishing it yeah let us know man I'll be there brother yeah be great your book box to box how was it writing that was that 2016 yeah so that that that was difficult what emotion in that yeah a lot of emotion in that and that was probably the first time I'd ever spoke about my childhood um so that was tough but it was good to get it out I've actually never read it which is quite you tend to see that a lot of people write books don't read their books like I don't on the time I watch these pork answers is trying to get a trailer but I fucking don't like watching them yeah well I've seen the book in email form yeah so I had to kind of sign off on it on it first um but I've never read the book my kids have got it I don't think my kids have read it either yeah they're my only three sales I think but I've had like loads of people of of content and said we've read your book it's like it's amazing it's very honest because I'm in a position what I mean regarding myself is I can be honest it doesn't affect me either way I can be out there and speak about what I've been through and speak about my past because I'm comfortable within my own skin and like it's it's taken me a long time to get there but yeah yeah fair play you know who's the best player you've ever played with with or against against Stephen yeah easy yeah everyone asks me all the time the guy's like is if if you think you doesn't break sweat they can't mate it's fucking didn't against me what a play he's like if you could build the perfect player it's him I didn't realise how big he was have you ever seen him like in in fact yeah strong powerful he'd kick you score a goal he just had everything you know what I remember about him as well he smelled lovely he smelled lovely don't have to share he had on but he smelled lovely proper player great player and obviously he's not a bad manager either yeah he's done well man for amazing for looking back in your life just for what do you think of it so far you're still young back you're still only 41 but would you get tearing your story just now how do you feel for a long time a long long time just be one big disappointment how I looked at everything but now amazing my life's been amazing I'm so blessed to have had so many amazing things and so many dark things to come through to leave me in the position where I am now as a 41 year old I feel like I'm I've got I've got I've got it I've got control of this amazing thing we call life so yeah I look back with amazing pride at what I've done I quite often drive around where I'm from where I was brought up and the journey I've been on from there to where I've been all around the world doing what I'm doing fills me with immense pride so it took a long time to get to where I am but I look back at my life so far and I'm like wow you're killing it big laugh yeah good on you brother because if you didn't have it through all the dark times in your life that you wouldn't be able to help the people you are now and that's the key to your life and always say this shit but the gift in life is given yeah no matter what it is you're helping other people you also help yourself yeah and I wish I could help everybody in the fucking planet I wish I could reply to every message now but I can't but I do reply to most that I can when I've got the time but just giving that people that bit of inspiration but you've got to lead by the front and lead by example now you've lived through the dark times you've also lived through the glory times as well you've had a lot of success million pounds signing on fees British titles fighting against all the odds pushing through the races and pushing through the hostile environment in your household and still here to tell the tale now that tells you how much a character you are but fuck everybody else we're still going to battle we've got that character listen we can go and stay with monks for five years and come back and go on social media and still reply to people and call them lancers and cunts it's just ingrained in it is not a fucking not a quit and that's the beauty of life but Curtis for anybody it's watching maybe going through the struggle brother maybe it's battling my depression and not feeling good enough what advice would you give for them I think the advice that really hit home with me is to talk you know to really talk and and and don't be ashamed of what situations you are in and I know we're talking week we haven't dealt with therapy but I've definitely said reach out to professional people that can help they've got experience in that in that field because that's what they're there for and the worst thing you can do is bottle everything up because a small problem comes a big problem and then like I said there's so many people that feel there's no way out and they always is isn't they there's always another way apart from taking your own life yeah and that is obviously the the the mess it leaves behind as well is is devastating with so many families out there but I'd say talk and things are never as bad as how you feel are they things are never quite as bad as what you feel and tomorrow's always a new day but reach out 100% and and talk to people especially men and obviously women suffer as well but men it breaks my heart when I put social media on and see like the football of the other week you know that that that taking his own life it's uh it's really sad isn't it it's heartbreaking really so we need to as men we need to look out for each other we need to um we need to drop the the ego a little bit and not be scared to reach out yeah but the beauty of life people can change and make choices and you're out in control your life if you are feeling depressed or in a dark place if you are under eating over eating not fitting off battling with addictions and prison just now you can't make changes in your life one person that when I was having a really really bad time that I reached out to was Leon McKenzie I just sent him a message on um on twitter I was going through like a really really tough problem with the darkest points that I've been and I've not spoke to Leon for ages and I know he's he does quite a lot with it with mental health and I sent him a direct message on twitter just saying have you got a number I can contact you on mate and uh and I just reached out to him and said listen I'm in a bad way mate could you help me in any way so he sent me over loads of contacts to speak to the pfa were fantastic um gave me 12 I think it's 12 free um free sessions um with with somebody and uh and that was a big help and luckily some for some reason I don't know why I reached out to Leon I think I might have seen something on twitter this was a good few years back now but luckily he was there and I knew that if I did he would be able to help so sometimes even when people aren't contacting you and they're doing good things sometimes just dropping a message because he is that help out there yeah and sometimes everyone's like you know saying you know to to reach out sometimes you've got to reach in as well you understand sometimes you've got to reach in and ask people you know are you okay and Leon McKenzie was was brilliant for me and I played football with Leon but outside of that we're not we're not like buddies he's a friend but we haven't had like a deep relationship we just played football together really um but Leon was great for me and put me on the right path to um to dealing with a lot of issues yeah yeah took me a while but I'm I'm here and I got a smile on your face brother that's the main thing but I just shows you that that one message to even a complete stranger to reach out can change your whole upcoming life because it's just about getting help no matter how successful you are no matter how much money you've got no matter if you stop drinking still take stop taking whatever the fuck it is you can make changes and still battle it's just called life it's just pushing through it keep swimming against the tide and never fucking sink you never sink keep going but Curtis for coming on today and telling your story I've thoroughly enjoyed it I think you've had a phenomenal career thank you I look forward to what you see and I've retired now podcast done I'll let you come on for a part yeah I'll go out at the top listen fascinating guy mate and listen god bless you for the future check out more of my podcasts on the right and be sure to like share and comment your thoughts on this week's podcast thank you