 Mobile is becoming a huge issue. There was one institution who spoke to me earlier that about 90% of their users are now accessing via mobile. But you know, on this panel, I'm sort of pushing for keeping the desktop and throwing the mobile away, in fact. Because if there's anything in this world that I could uninvent, it would be this. So way back when I was doing sort of just sales and consulting and that kind of thing, you know. I wasn't always being chased either by phone calls or emails and that kind of thing. You mean when you said phone calls? Yes, yes I know. I wasn't always there ready to answer a question by Skype or being asked to send some information in. And for students nowadays, they're getting the same kind of thing. They're getting these notifications from an app going, hey, you've got to quiz you. You've got an assignment due in 10 minutes. You haven't uploaded it yet. You haven't replied to that forum post yet. You're supposed to be in class five minutes ago. And it's this harrying thing. That's why when it comes to technology, I would just really like to uninvent it. Because I'd like my life back. I'd like my sleep back. I don't know how many people here actually figured out with these phones how to have a silent period at night. Yeah, I hadn't known that. I was just turning it off. So I really think that instead of throwing the desktop into the recycle bin, I think we should roll back 20 years and just get rid of mobile devices and mobile phones and reclaim our lives. But so the people here on the panel today are going to give their opinion on this general area and their experience from their different perspectives. So from the college, the university, and the corporate world, and also just from a development point of view. And I want to hear what your experience is. Because again, this is all about sharing. But that's where we're starting with. I think it's time to uninvent the mobile phone and get our life back. I feel a bit like Blofeldt and his chair here and Robin the cat. So from my perspective, I have two bits just to follow on from what you've said. And this is genuinely a true story. I'm saying I can't look that way because I'm blinded. So I'm going to stare over this way. About three weeks ago, I got accused based on the conversation that you just said about being always accessible and always doing it. I got accused, pulled aside within our faculty, by a professor and accused of workplace bullying. And I was accused, very serious, like there was abuse I was getting. But in the whole mind, it was because I had sent her emails after five o'clock. And I was sending emails at five o'clock and six o'clock and in fairness, the way I work, I was sending them at 11 o'clock. But it was the invasion that she claimed about the work email being on her phone and about her feeling obliged to answer it. So that's one angle. So I do accept your argument that there is that invasion and need to balance. But I also look at the potential. And maybe it's the energy in me. But I look at the potential as to what it can do, what the mobile phone can provide in an education context or small device if it's a tablet. Because the worst mistake, the thing that really gets on my wick when I hear teachers, educators, whatever level that they're at saying, everybody turn off their mobile phones during this class. Because you are turning off a world of knowledge, a world of opportunity. Like we run staff development sessions where we get our lecturers who aren't tech savvy, right, but their own confession. They wouldn't be tech savvy. And we would run a session on whatever it would be, whether it's Moodle or not. But we would have in-class polling. We would get them doing cahoots or get them doing z-things or whatever tool we chose with this device. And in seconds, the atmosphere and the class, the atmosphere in the room is incredible because we engage the people. We're not just lecturing to them all the time. So I would feel very, very strongly about the use of mobile phones and the potential that it has behind it. We have, in DCU, we have 16,000 students. We've, looking at our Google Analytics, we've 40% of our student visitors come from mobile. Now, we've recently got the Moodle app and we've customized the Moodle app thanks to one. Thank you and the team. And we're now looking at the stats from that about how many active users we've got. And that gives us metrics. That gives us justification to say to our lecturers, they need to engage with Moodle more because look, here's the facts and figures. And when you put it in their hands, when they're on the bus, they don't open up the laptop, but they'll open up the mobile device. Absolutely no bother. And I had a student, when I was teaching, before I'd given oral feedback on a particular assignment and I gave it as a trial test initiative and I asked the students for feedback on that process of audio feedback and one of them says, you're in my head on the bus. That was his feedback to me because he was listening to me on the way home on the bus. Now, he gave out to me about that, but that was only in a slagging way. But we brought the learning outside the four walls of the classroom and that's why that's important. So, I'm Peter from Leo. My experience is slightly different. It's in the corporate world. Now, I'm going to generalize slightly here, but in the corporate world, mobile delivery is now becoming king simply because people understand that everyone has a device. Smartphone penetration in the UK is over 90%. In developing markets like Brazil and South Africa, there are people there that have never used desktops but are active users of the internet, active people who are using tablets and phones and other things to access their content that they're producing. We're dealing with people who want to train their end, not just their end users, but their supply chain. So, it could be a garage. It could be a mechanic in a garage. Now, if you ever been to a garage and seen the computer they use, there's no way you're going to get a rich multimedia e-learning experience to run on a garage piece or a PC maybe in a hospital that simply runs medical studies or scans, that kind of thing. So, the change to those devices is simply because the user choice is there. 80% of multimedia content is consumed on mobile devices, on a tablet, on an app, not on a desktop nowadays. So, if people are going and spending 100,000, 200,000, 300,000, a million pounds on content, then they want to make sure that the experience the user feels is the easiest one they've got. It's not just because it's the device they want to use. It's simply because it's in their pocket already. They can target them wherever they are at whatever time they want to do. One of the main things they're going to do is return on investment as well. So, as soon as you get your users to pick it up, I mean, we'll talk about this more tomorrow, talk about analytics, but in the, I don't know about in the educational space, but certainly in the corporate space, we have to prove the value of these training programs. Now, if we're saying to them, well actually we'll use delivery method that everyone's got. It's in their pocket. They're going to have it on them. If we send them a notification, it's there right away. They don't have to send an email. They don't have to do comms. They don't have to send out any kind of face mail shot or something else like that. It's just there. And more importantly, they can do whatever they want. The choice is there that they could, there it could be, it's the employer, look, I need to do this on my desktop. I'm going to spend like half an hour. Or actually, as the guys were saying, they could be doing it on the bus. They could be doing it on the train. They could be doing it while they're sat watching these tenders, ideally not, because they're probably not paying attention, but there's that choice there. And that for me is the key thing with Mobile Directed. So Mobile Delivered Learning that as soon as you give a user choice, you empower them to do their own learning at their own time, in their own place. You kind of teach them as well that their mobile device is something they can get learning through. You direct them to kind of that self-directed learning whereby you can say, actually, there's loads of other content on here. It's not just our stuff. Go on Khan Academy. Go on Udemy, anything else. And look at that other content in there. And that's incredibly powerful. So, I mean, we've been developing content, Leo, for over 30 years now. And we are completely sold out for doing a mobile first delivery method. All of our tools, something like 95 or 6% of our content is mobile accessible by default, out the box. We don't even care if clients don't want it. We just do it, because in six months' time, they may well say, actually, we wanted that. And then we'll be like, yeah, we did it bad. We didn't do that. So we just give it to them. And I think, yeah, that's what I want to say is that as soon as you empower the user to direct their own learning, do it at their own pace, to choose, then they want to. They may not want to, but they realize it becomes easier. So therefore, that want or need or requirement to do it becomes easier upon them. Thank you. Hi, I'm Becky Banton from Cornwall College, which is actually in Devon and Cornwall, which is a bit weird. I just want to start with a line from a song. I'm not going to sing it. It's from the theme tune of Octopussy. And all I wanted was a sweet distraction for an hour or two. And I think we'll all agree that this is what this does. And my students in particular do wander around with the phones in their hand. Having said that, when I look at the stats, we have about five students a week accessing via a mobile device. Nearly all of our access via Moodle is desktop. I think that's partly because we're quite rural. So internet access isn't always great. Having said that, they're happily on Twitter and Facebook or Snapchat or whatever in the corridors. So we know it's not all of that. So we try to promote the app to get people to download it so they can do some things offline and that kind of thing. And the feedback we got from students was very negative. So we looked into it a little bit. And really, the reason is because the content doesn't work. It's not designed for mobile. So my kind of angle at this is really more about from the user perspective and not going old techy and hard. It's using the really easy stuff that's already there. So instead of dragging and dropping, I love drag and drop, but it's been terrible from a development perspective. And we should be using the books and the pages and all that kind of web pages and things because it will work on a mobile device. It will convert to whatever size screen you're on without having to do anything. You can still embed all your nice bits and pieces if you want to and things like H5P that we've all talked about quite a lot works very nicely. On the mobile app, by the way, because I tested it yesterday, and is web responsive. So it will again adapt to the screen size, whether you're using Apple or your normal device. So my kind of challenge really is getting stuff to use those tools so that it is mobile first. It's not about making fancy things for us. It's about using what we've already got, but making sure it is used as first and foremost and not just uploading a PowerPoint. I think that's probably all I've got to say for the minute. Let's hand over. Hello. Well, my name is Juan Bliva. I'm the mobile team leader at Moodle HQ. I'm going to talk from a developer perspective. I want to say that we gather statistics every month, since like three years ago, about the mobile app usage. Not usage in Moodle sites, because we don't have access to those sites. It's more about usage of our notifications infrastructure, downloads from the stores, well, this kind of statistics. We have noticed that, for example, when we are talking about push notifications, that are notifications that the Moodle installation sends to a user to a mobile device, we see exponential changes every month. Right now, we are sending 1 million push notifications per month, and that's a lot. And we are talking about only the Moodle site that are registered using our message server. And also, we have noticed that in the mobile forum, we receive a lot of functionality requests or questions from teachers. Two years ago, most of the questions were came from site administrators or partners that were testing the mobile app. But we have noticed that right now, we receive a lot of feedback from teachers that are using the mobile app in their courses. They are trying new things that they want to know which model works better in the mobile app. So we have been noticed lately this change that teachers know that they should engage students using the mobile app, so they have to develop their course materials, so they work nicely in the mobile app. We are working to make that happen easily to teachers, and we are working hard to make the mobile app very user friendly. For example, for the next version of the Moodle 3.3 and Moodle 3.3, we will be supporting new activity models, in this case, the lesson, the feedback one, and the database. Because they were widely requested in the last months, because there are a lot of teachers that use the lesson model, and other teachers use the feedback model or questionnaires similar. And we have also teachers using the database. So the only one missing model for Moodle will be the workshop, that it seems that nobody uses it. I know that there are people that are using it. But well, the good news is that we will be supporting everything in six months. This is our contributions to teachers, so they can create nice courses using all the Moodle features to engage students, to make them use all the potential of the mobile app. So thank you very much for your contributions there. I think it's a very interesting space at the moment. But so what's your experience? I'm afraid, Gavin, I've got to challenge your numbers. What was your percentage of mobile use you were quoting? There was one, which one? Well, you banded a number about earlier. OK, I thought there was one around that had 90% uses for this one particular. So because what I've got here is our data from our VLE at the OU. And I've got data going back to July 2014. At that point, it was about 65% desktop use and kind of 17%, 18% for each of mobile and tablet. And fast forward to the latest data that arrived yesterday from March 2017, desktop, 65%. Yeah, it's surprising. And the only thing that's really happened is that, strangely, mobile has crept up from about 18% to 25%. And bizarrely, tablet has gone down from where it started at 17% to like 10%. And that I really don't understand. So what's going on there? Because the argument you're presenting is hugely plausible, but we're not seeing it in our data. And if anyone's going to be studying on the bus, it's probably going to be an OU student. So it's really an enigma. Well, I'll sort of query that. So are your course materials and are your course activities designed to actually be mobile friendly? Do you promote the fact that they can use it on mobile? Do you have the Moodle mobile app enabled and promoted on the site with smart banners? We don't yet use the mobile app. Those people who came to our presentation this time last year will know we have a beautiful new responsive theme, and that's been live since September for some modules. And even before that, we did have mobile themes. But do you promote the usage? Because it is quite interesting. When people are used to using an interface with desktop and they see it in this large screen, unless they've actually said, hey, you can use it on mobile. So is it marketed to your students at all? I guess two things. First, I think we don't think it's our place to tell students which device they should be using. Our site should work on whatever they want to use. The other point is, when the iPad first came out and people were wondering, what is this thing? A thing that was commonly sent was that an iPad was a content consumption device. And it really wasn't so good for generating content, so posting to a forum. So maybe that's an aspect of it that maybe OU Study requires a bit of input. Don't know. OK. I think just to say something on that, actually, there's a key point there. It's the difference in having your content accessible on a mobile device and having your content built and designed to work on a mobile device. Walls of text, long form content, that you just won't read them on a mobile device. I can't read more than about 20 lines of text on my phone before my eyes go. Just on your tablet point as well, that's an interesting point around tablet sales have actually declined in the past few years, simply because nobody can really decide what to do with them. There's just no killer use case for it. They're too big to put in your pocket. They're not powerful enough to create with, as you say. So they're just dying out slightly. But also added to that is the mobiles have got bigger screens. So it's actually easier to read on that. I think, to consent back, we're seeing a very similar pattern with others, but I think what's important with the mobile stuff and a lot of it is the context in which the information we're putting out there. We're not using the Moodle mobile app. We have a brand new app at our university, but it's not delivering learning content. It's delivering the admin around it, the information that's about the learning to then get to do it. And I think that's an important thing of what we're trying to push to the students in terms of what they get on there. The mobile is suitable. Not everything is going to be work. None of our students want to write their essays on their mobile phone. So I think talking mobile first, it's really going to be everything first, and that's problematic for us in terms of creators of content. But like you say, I think it is about offering the choice to that, but making sure we're using the right context to deliver the right information to them at the right time. And that last bit, I think, is the really key thing with the mobile stuff. It's not just the right time. It's also the right place as well. And that really changes the way I think it's happening. And we're seeing spikes of more than 50% access to our VLE normally, around about changeover periods. So they're coming out with their lectures and we're an on-campus university primarily, and they're going on to the VLE on their mobile phones to see what's next, what they have to do next, not actually doing it next. And I think that's a pattern which we're seeing quite commonly. Thank you. I love the idea of the mobile app, and I think having a responsive site is fine, but it can still be a bit fiddly, depending on the theme. My consideration is the way the course is written and structured is that many courses will have been written for a traditional desktop use and to maybe then configure those so they are not full of text and more mobile friendly. So you almost want two versions, almost like a course light. So my worry is how do I, as someone who works as the head of online learning, but has to work with a curriculum team, turn around to them and say, so how are we going to reconstruct this course so people can engage with it fully on the mobile. To me, the mobile app is more of a complimentary tool to the desktop or full web version. But I wish it wasn't. I wish you could. I do think that if you look at what's different between the app and responsive, there's one fundamental thing, which you had mentioned, but actually notifications. You can't tell that student where they are next, automatically five minutes beforehand. So we've been all getting notifications for the different sessions here if you're using the MoodleMood app. So you know that such and such is starting next. So if your calendar in Moodle was telling you, hey, your class is next in 121 or Room 101, whatever it might be, that's something then that you actually are using an app for, which the website isn't going to give you. And you do have to look at that level of, and that is admin, coordination, communication, or messaging them, you know. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. A lot of the comments so far have been around if we build it, they will come as long as the content is right for mobile, then people will want to use it on mobile. Some feedback I've had from students in the past is that mobile devices are their personal devices and they use them to look up stuff they're interested in and talk to their friends. They don't necessarily want to be getting a push notification from their tutor telling them their assignments due on their personal device. Have you got any sort of insight into the student voice on this sort of issue? Is this something which students actually want to engage with in that way? Anyone? I think I'd agree with you. We just did some focus groups with our students and I've been eyeing the Moodle mobile app for a while, but it really wasn't something they were interested in because we also have an institutional mobile app and this is just one piece of it so they already have push notifications through that, timetables through that. It's not within Moodle. Moodle is one piece of the ecosystem in the institution and receiving other things than they want to is not necessarily the case. Just if I can answer that if you don't mind the app, one of the things that we're looking at is that I'm interested in learning analytics but one of the things that Juan pointed out to me actually with the app is you can look at not how many downloads, obviously that gives you a little bit of information but behind in the Google platform how many active users you have how many people have downloaded and then how many have uninstalled it will either back up or argue against your comment. I'll let you know in a few months time. It's also something we need to look at research. There's been a lot of research put into millennials and how millennials relate to learning but not to, I've forgotten what the next group is called but essentially if you look at the way tech is changing we're moving away from an app based ecosystem into the bots and the always on architectures whereby text message becomes king or real speech becomes king and these guys that you're teaching are growing up with that as their experience. We all grow up probably without the internet just coming, they're growing up with AI and how do we we are the wrong people to be saying how we respond to that unfortunately but I fear that nobody yet has done enough kind of research into how do we meet the needs of those people. And is there like a kind of a point of view from the focus when I'm on my phone and I'm just quickly checking on Twitter or Facebook it's just a snapshot and something quick when I'm going to learn something my mind isn't in the same kind of mode, I'm focused and I want to work through it and possibly because of my agents what I'm used to and being on a computer but when I'm sat in that kind of mode, whether it be on my tablet or my phone or whatever I work very differently to how I just quickly pick up my phone and look at things and I agree I think it was Dan and over here saying that they are different things and I think we need to enable people to choose which one they go into but I think it's making a one size fits all and you have to do it on one platform or the other probably isn't the right solution. So, sorry just to answer the question I actually did, I was part of a research project institution quite a large institution and it was interviewing the students and it was titled The Student Voice and I went round and physically asked them what they used technology for, like whilst they were studying. Mobile wasn't it was barely considered they would like it just to be able to check their classes were on or if they were cancelled but it was very much a laptop or going to the library and getting the materials even if they printed it off the data for that has been published and I can signpost that but it was quite a small cohort was that focused sorry just on learning provided by an organisation or a self-directed as well was that focused on just learning pushed by an organisation or an institute or on self-directed learning as well so learning they just do in their own time it was more the institute that was just the brief that we were working under but then that's the next phase of the project which unfortunately I'm not there anymore so I can't tell you how that's going but it was quite surprising the results that it was very much more they wanted the mobile just for the quick access is my class on maybe working appointments but for the actual learning it was still laptops even desktops going to the library well it is interesting that there has been a move very much towards nano content and because if you look at the percentages and I can't remember them off the top of my head are the times but the actual amount of time that a user will engage in one session with a phone it's around 15 minutes I think it's about 15 minutes for a tablet just under the hour for the sort of laptop desktop and so if you're going to want to have something in the pocket and a huge amount of corporate training now has moved towards this nano content because they want just in time learning and so that you want to have small videos, small quiz, small assessment within that time frame of the device that they're using now there was some statistics last year there was a share of total digital time spent July 2016 desktop 32% smartphone 50% sorry smartphone 57% but of that so 50 of the 57 was via apps and a lot of this is self directed learning it could be Duolingo or things like that so they do learn but unless you actually have really thought about making not just content but the course structure the assessment suitable how can they use it you're not going to read a three page PDF on something like this unless you literally have nothing else with you you know I must admit I'm boring and old fashioned I print out documents to read them take out a fashion editor just boring and old and we'll be fine you're mean I would prefer to read a long document on my phone and just scroll through it as I'm going through much more than I would on screen okay so I guess it is well it always will be a user preference next sorry over here so I think following on from that point Chris Whitham from the NHS Leadership Academy the program that we've seen the best engagement with was a program we did for 5000 nurses and midwives and right from the outset we decided that the program design would work around busy nurses lifestyles not around the devices that they would be accessing on so it was a mobile first platform but it worked on IE 8 there were takeaways everything was downloadable so you could consume offline or print it out but you could also digest everything from a phone or a tablet or a battered old hospital network PC in the middle of the night but we made a decision that no piece of content would require more than 10 minutes to login do it mark it as complete and get out so that it would fit around that lifestyle of you know short tea break in the middle of the night picking the kids up from school just having 5 minutes in the evening so I think yes we can design for mobile or not for mobile but as we've already said in 2 years, 5 years, 10 years those devices will have moved on we'll still want to be delivering content so let's think about lifestyles that we're designing for whether that's students or nurses or corporate people and then work out what that means for our program design just picking up from Rebecca's point really the reading a long piece on a phone for example and the difference between you might read it on a phone I'll read books on Kindle on my phone on the train for example but I wouldn't write one on it so it's the difference between the content creation consumption again and a sort of linked one that the entire title of the the panel, should we throw away the desktop or design first for mobile why why not use the desktop and design first for mobile again it's using the right tool for the right purpose you can design for your users whether they be nurses or whatever to use on a mobile or any other device we'll be doing that set quite happily at your laptop or your desktop it doesn't have to be one or the other next besides being very quiet by the way I will start picking on you I was going to say it's a further thing to what I've just said there it doesn't so much feel that the delivery mechanisms the problem is how do we get all of our content producers give them the tool chain the content production pipeline to get there I think we can see we see stereotypically the old professors not engaging with the technology doesn't want to change how can we put transform what they're doing into this new format without massive retraining without transformation I think there's a really interesting thing for where Moodle sits in terms of it's the content pipeline for many people now and what does that need to support to actually allow to bridge that generational divide of it like because I think the delivery mechanisms are there the techniques are all there in the mobile apps like you say it's the content to fit it and how do we bridge that gap between the two I guess it comes down to if you look at journalism in the past few years if you take someone like The Guardian for example they for a long time were printing broadsheet newspapers and they're journalists they simply didn't convert over to a modern app based ecosystem to a lot of those guys were gone and now when you look at how they produce content it's journalists creating copy that are then given to somebody with that expertise they're saying here is my source material go and make this work in that way I mean it's in the same way that you wouldn't necessarily expect a lecture I don't know to be able to lay out a desktop publishing lay out a book they'd go to an expert to do it it's a question of whether we as learning people need to change our skill set in actually becoming digital content creators and maybe taking that expertise and saying to our people give me the content and we will make it work for you it's maybe not something that everyone could ever be skilled at but I think that also goes back to what I kind of started with is actually realistically we're not able to do a lot of that we have to let our teachers make our own content and it is finding those really nice and easy things to do I think what we tend to see is some really fancy things when we see things online they're all whizzy and they're made by people who are experts and have had the time and the money to develop that but that's really out of the reach I think for many of us certainly in the FE sector and so it's about saying actually I know you like your PowerPoint because you're going to use it in your classroom situation but instead of thinking think about how your students are going to access it later and instead of using PowerPoint why not put it into a book or emails or whatever and present from that and then all of a sudden this becomes it's more available and it is more of a challenge but it's just those easy wins I think probably are going to be more achievable than saying we'd love and then just have all the nice fancy stuff made by experts for special occasions I think you've stolen my point a wee bit there I was laughing when one of your panellists said they should design for mobile because in my long experience most academics have been designing pretty crap content for decades and when we moved to ICT supported learning it got even crapper and I could just imagine what it was going to be like if you asked them to do it for mobile now that said I'm not too boring or too old fashioned but I think the quality will be awful Anyone else? One of the problems we've been facing with the app is that inside Moodle we have all these wonderful tools to create content like course formats and text filterings and helping the students to start at A and end up at Z giving context to different activities and then you open the app and you show it and it's just the list of activities again and you're able to make the transition from having a nicely formatted course nicely in parentheses and then going backwards to the app How do we deal with that? Well I don't know Juan maybe should answer this afterwards but I think that if you look at how people interact with apps and what they expect from how apps look and how they list content people who were designing really nice fancy pages or whatever in course layouts that isn't what people are looking for from an app they are looking at it basically I want to get in, find what I want do it, get out it is a complete immediacy need and I think that's different the interface methodology has to be different for mobile for that reason I do think that there's obviously space what the gentleman said about bad course materials working with lots of organizations I've seen people who refused to give up their private handwritten notes and they would lend it out to students beginning of class and then collect them back up again and not allow them to photocopy it it wasn't a digital copy of any of their notes for their course and that was a higher rate Not DCU, what do I do for the record so any of my clients here was none of them or ex-clients, it was none of them it was somebody else but that ranges from that to where I've seen the best impact is where there are experts so it is the learning technologist going up to a lecturer who has no clue they have no technical skills and doing it for them because one usually the learning technologist's salary is a lot lower than that professor the professor is going to do something a learning technologist does it twice as fast it's a multiple of times cheaper to achieve so why aren't we doing that why aren't we making it one of the things that we because we offer that service in my organization but there is a perceived threat that if their stuff goes online then they're not going to be needed anymore and I think that is for some, I don't know if that's an experience but for some people we offer this saying we'll do it all for you and they just don't want to engage whether it is for that reason or they just don't want to hand it over but we try that's our approach and we do get some and we're getting some good stuff but not nearly the amount that we need and I would be interested to know if everyone else has that same issue we've taken quite a radical approach occasionally we've just locked out the HTML editor all you get is heading 1, 2, 3, 4 bold underlining image because that's the only way you can reduce content that works on the mobile app if your lecturers are going to chuck a load of HTML it's not going to work, it's going to look rubbish no way they're going to do that they're just going to drag and drop their PowerPoint on they're not going to even attempt to look at the HTML editor am I right, I don't know if everyone has the same experience okay at the very back, Mary actually bounce it off somebody's head sort of like a skipping stone you don't agree with that maybe bottled water with this catch box isn't so good the first time I threw it I knocked over 4 bottles I was aiming for 6 I think I was there Gavin, that was last year wasn't it it was I'm Maggie Jensen from the University of Gloucestershire one of the things that I did after your presentation last year about the Moodle mobile app and the experience of using it at the conference last year was I went straight back we sort of promoted it but not really promoted it at the University the year before just made it available because students were wanting to develop an app of their own so we thought well there is one already so let's give you that but after the conference last year I went back to the University and I was sort of saying to staff you've got a fantastic potential interactive tool here that can support you in your actual session so in your lectures and in your seminars and I know that's going what I'm sort of hearing here is there's sort of a division between a new style of teaching and learning and then the traditional style of teaching and learning which is quite significant I think so the context for how we use the app is probably very important also in terms of the content creation but the main thing that I think the real power that I see in it at least where we're at at the moment is very much that sort of engagement, that interactivity that it can allow staff to have with students and also with forums for instance you can set up a forum you could start to have a plenary at the end of a session or a discussion at the start bring it up on the sorry I'm a bit nervous so I can't remember the word now but you can bring it up on the screen so that people can see it and they can engage with that and you've got your surveys as well and your feedback tools and your quizzes sort of interspersed a lecture or a seminar session with a little quiz half way through to check knowledge that's where I see one of the really great uses of the mobile app where we're at at the moment what you're doing there is that I would highly recommend it all the time and I think the messages came out from a few people just in different terms is you're leading with teaching not with the technology and that's the way to do it you're proper use of the teaching and integrate technology to support it whether it's desktop or mobile or tablet or whatever but that's a good example of leading with the teaching okay so we've just a few minutes left so is there anyone else who has any other experience that would like to sort of contribute to this has anyone here tried mobile and then just said no we're not going to go with it okay so any last final words hello sorry hi it's just me you're heading behind the lights I'm sorry I just thought I'll just give as we're coming towards the end and obviously there's no research behind this this is purely anecdotal I was head of teacher training at AFE college one of the biggest changes we saw over a five year period which supported the roller and Moodle was the changing in the in the course that we actually revalidated the course of the University of Essex and over the next five years what we're looking at is we said to we're looking at mirroring your classroom online as best we can and all our teacher training course was videoed and everything we had was online so they were experienced as students and then they rolled it out as teachers and we found that was one of the quickest ones in which they were learning the HTML they were learning all sorts of things and just give another bit of history I I think we need also remember when word processing came out I'm old enough to when I first started teaching have a secretary because I wasn't allowed to type four years later I was using word processing now take ourselves five years ahead I know we talk about tutors and teachers not having those skills but we are talking about very intelligent people that if they wish to learn it and have a need and can see it and have the time and the resources that I think it will happen in time and just to finish off sorry taking a lot of time I'm having the pleasure of working in a secretary school at the moment teaching stem subjects in a secondary school and I started using mobile phones with them and was shut down in the first week so we're still by by head teachers so there's also the cultural barrier that were hidden as well so we still got many of the things we had I believe five years ago okay thank you very much for me I sort of sum up by saying your answer your choice really depends on your audience and what works for you might not work for the college beside you or the industry beside you or whatever the case may be look at your audience look at your learners and design for them and I would say specifically designed for someone because if it don't design for someone you design for no one and in that respect that should steer the way you design your content sorry just wanted just wanted to say Kent we've actually implemented some of our own activity resources etc on the mobile app there's a bit of a steep learning curve but once you've done that the students then have access to all the content you've developed in a nice mobile friendly format I don't have the numbers here we do know that in previous years we probably had maybe a hundred users on the mobile app last year and we now have over a thousand users on the mobile app so people are using it whether it's a five year gap or a five month gap I think probably depends on the establishment I guess my only comment would be we've had the app store for nine years now yeah whatever we do we're nine years behind at the moment the Apple App Store launched nine years ago just think about that don't get left behind again I just want to say that the mobile team appreciates the feedback from teachers so if you want to give any positive or negative feedback please you have the Mural for mobile forum in Mural.org we always reply there we take care of teachers so we know they are our potential users so if you have anything to say or ask please go to the forum so we can learn well thank you very much to the panel and thank you very much for participating I'm hoping this evening that we will certainly have further discussions and maybe warm up some of those discussions about AI learning analytics for tomorrow as well so the MUA is having its meeting downstairs now and drinks are at seven I believe downstairs in the exhibition area as well before we will then be back here for dinner here hope to see you all thank you very much for coming