 If you're having a, are you having a final meeting? This is myself. Okay. Those are the best ones. Thanks, honey. Like they say when you get on the airplane, those of you who don't want to, are not flighted, you go to New Orleans tonight and get off the plane. Oh, there we go. There we go. I bet some more than the first thing I think of. But anyway, so we're gonna do much good work. So those of you who are getting in the lot right now at any meetings or whatever, just, you can stay, don't sweat, but we're gonna be doing some talking. And those of you who are new, watch your work, anybody new, who's new, who's new. So we'll just explain it really quickly because we've been doing this for how many years, girl? For like nine years? Like nine years, right? And there's still always a little bit of confusion. So, but this is fine. Just, oh, so before I forget, to quote, let's see, I'll quote two well-known Americans. I'll quote Iverson, do your thing so that I may know you, and I'll quote Taylor Swift, both of the Democrats. Throw some quotes out there, you know? And, yeah, we'll never, never, never get back together. Yeah, so, yeah, we'll never tell you. But for those of you who are confused, because this is what you're working, here I am, this is about your work. So what we're going to do is be talking about your work and your creative process, or in other words, not mine, not my work and not my creative process. So if anybody has a question today about their work and their creative process, I'll happily talk about your work and your creative process. Okay, we've got Audrey here helping us organize the whole thing with the eight people behind the camera. We've live streamed on HowlRound. So there are people who have been tweeting in and asking questions that we will answer in real time. And what we'll do, yeah, is we'll work for 20 minutes in all number one. And then we will stop working and we'll start talking about your creative process. So, is that everything you're going to ask me? And if you could come up. Yeah, we actually have a, you can watch our Facebook live on the publicator's Facebook page and also HowlRound's Facebook page. We're going to do that now, that we're going to do that. I hope so, I hope so. But you can comment to stay on who's put on the public page or on HowlRound's page or tweet at us and we are monitoring all of them. And we'll get you to question. Great, okay, it's okay. So, what else do we have to do? We've spent a long time. Last time we were doing this, early this year, it was almost the summer or it was the summer. And we're like, yeah, we're going to work through the summer and we work through the summer but we didn't show up here. And, you know, is anybody having any, you know, questions, problems, answers before we start? I don't know, forgetting my, okay. So, we'll begin. What can happen when you just sit down and like, face it, you know? So, now here comes the, oh, what is this? So, watch our work, it's actually a play. I forgot to tell you, it's been so long. So, it's a play. So, we did the action and the dialogue. So, we just did the action and now we're doing the dialogue which is like, we do it together. So, if anybody has any questions, you get it. You understand. Yeah, right. Change it. If anybody has any questions about your work, your creative process, there it is. Here we are. Yeah, man. What's your name? Carmelo. Carmelo, yes. Okay. Hey, sure, did you get, what do you change? Well, it's an avail. Right. And they were writing about Invisible Man. Oh, great. Until anyway, I wanted to go home and not do anything. Right. And then I heard about this and I came here and meeting their responses. It was just the perfect combination. Oh, I'm so pleased. Of, you know, so thank you. Well, thanks for coming. Yeah. I mean, sometimes, yeah. I mean, that's what it's for, basically. That's why I sit here. I've been doing this for Carol knows because she's been coming over for like nine years or over nine years. I basically sit in the lobby and invite people to hang out and work also. And then, but the second part, this part right now is allowing people to talk about their creative process and we can hopefully help them find a way to keep going. But so you're, you're writing paper. So that's kind of like, you just go down and like saying, good. Yeah. Right. Right. And help them like develop their critical, we'll come back sometime when you, you know, have time to work on your own work too, because we welcome that. Okay. Well, thank you. Thanks for that. Anybody else? I mean, well, yeah, I have more, more about maybe, I mean, if you want to, but also, mostly if people are having some, like, are in a tricky place with their creative process. Like, for example, a question we get a lot is, I have a lot of different projects. How do I choose which one I should be working on like that? And we talk about that. The reason why I don't ask people so much to share with me is because then it gets to be sort of like the writing Olympics. And basically it gets a little competitive. You know, like, oh, see, I wrote something brilliant. And did you? And the person goes, well, no, I just wrote, you know, that kind of thing. So, so that's why we don't go there, but you're feeling a strong urge to. Respect. I, I, I don't understand what you're saying. I'm totally by chance. I'm a whim. And so I would be inspired by the 20 minutes to, I mean, something was written I'm not really sure, but not, not to engage. It's not incompetent. Right, right. But it's one of my products in that period of time. I'm not an inspiration. Do you have a writing practice at home? Or outside of this? Oh, I've been writing. Yeah. Yeah. And as far as the process is concerned, say just, like anything, let the hard guy, show on this, the motivation, and the intent, the sound, and solid, and then whatever, if you read a pumpkin chair on a flat surface, just to afford yourself out of the space inside. Right. Just to, to write, and then just let it go, or you gotta try to get in the way. Right, right. Just the clear path, and, and remove obstructions. Right. Like not over-complicate base, hold it back to the heart. You know, simple and plain, basic, kind of, just kind of where if I'm struggling. Right. Right. That's great. I love when you say about making time for the practice, you know, and getting out of the way. What's your name? My name is Jed. Jed, J-E-D. J-E-D. J-E-D. So Jed is talking about making time for the process and getting out of the way, which are two really, really super important things. A lot of us, a lot of other things come before our process, our work process, our creative process. We've come a lot of things before that. So a lot of us like, we got kids, we got day jobs, or whatever we got, shit we do. And a lot of stuff comes before that. So it's really important to have your process and to work on getting out of the way. Yeah, what inspired? I don't, I'd say ten minutes a day of like visual, formula, or formatics. Right. I give thanks every day. Right. I draw inspiration from the natural world. Right. Or even from toxic therapy headlines or because ultimately, as far as the heart, even in the apparent complications and distractions, like lessons in life, you take a break and get them. Right. So as for inspiration, you'd be amazed where it can come from, where it can come from. So when inspired, it shouldn't be a task or a burden. It should be, for me, it's a great joy. It's a great relief. And so I just give thanks for that stuff. That's really great. Yeah. That's really great. That's awesome. You have many. What's your name? Cherie? Yes. Okay, Cherie. How you doing? So I've been working. What I've been writing, I've had it in my head for a couple of years. Right. And it's been hard. Like, I would sit down and couldn't ever get it out. And I think I was reading with my friend to see a play. And we had all this time. So I started and just came to me. It was kind of like the voices of the characters were flowing through me. And I had, I could just easily write it down. And I know this has happened only once before in my life. And the question is, at some point last time, I stopped hearing that. And that's, and I was told that's where the work begins. Like, you know, that's the real work. Like, you know, keep it going. Right. So I guess the question is, tools to keep going after that, I don't know if it's an inspiration or the, you know, when the characters stop talking. Right, right, right. Everybody here should read when the characters stop talking. So he's had moments in his writing time, a career where he sits down and the words come and they flow. And it's all cool and good, you know. And then they're talking those words stop. And he was told that's where the work begins. And so we want to talk about what kind of tools might be helpful to keeping going. Even when the voices aren't just flowing, even when it's not flowing. How do you go when there's no flow? Right, right, right. Which is like, it's great because it rhymes. I love that these rhymes, but I tell myself that they actually are medieval. So how do you go when there is no flow? That's when you become a pro. That's what being a professional is. Right? So we write when there is flow and we write when there is no flow. Right? And so you, maybe when you're writing when there's flow you have great confidence. Right? I am fabulous. This is all going nicely. And when there's no flow maybe you have less confidence. Oh no! Oh no! So what do you do? You take little steps. Right? You sit down at your writing space and Jen you have your practice where okay, maybe you work around you don't sit down at a certain time. For me personally sit down. Turn on that timer. And because in my experience the news is kind of like, you know what I mean? It's a relationship you're having with your higher power. Right? And your higher power will meet you halfway. Your higher power you can do all over in my experience. Right? So you've got to show your higher power I'm showing up. It's like dating. You know you're going to tech if you're not going to return those you know if you're not going to show up right? Your date is going to get starting at the feelings that you don't really care for them. Right? The higher power will just go to someone else showing up more regularly. Right? And be there for them. So the higher power is giving you a gift with the flow and then you reciprocate the gift by doing a little work on your own. Show up every day maybe use a timer. Not your phone. I just use my phone today because I forgot my regular timer. A kitchen timer is better. Oh, you have like sand in the hourglass. That's so old school, yo. That's like, okay, so you sand in the hourglass. That works. That works great. So is it a big water? Like the wicked wind chair of the little one. How? It's 20 minutes? That's so cool. What color is the sand? It's yellow. It's yellow. Like yellow? Like a coat? Like big bird yellow. And what color are the... It's all black. It's all black. How nice. Okay, so you have one of these. Right? You sit down and sit with your work. Right. Exactly. Exactly. Or like you can look at it every second. Like I do sometimes. And then the beautiful thing is when it is done. Now I did my bit today. So that's what you could do. Start by showing up every day for 20 minutes when the flow isn't happening. And just write anything. When you're going to be a professional. That's what a pro... I mean, really, do you watch any sports or... Well, I mean, that's a pro. Or actors, right? Actors, you know what? You're not feeling it tonight. I'm not going to go on. I'm not feeling it, yo. You go. You go on. I know. We play, you know, right? Sometimes you don't... We don't like it. We got to do it. We show up anyway. And that's what it means to be... to be serious about your vowels. You've taken a vowel to your crack. Right? Take a step. There you go. Right? It's okay to fail. Right. Just keep showing up. It is... It's difficult. It's difficult. It's okay. Because we all do. Fail. Are we still showing up? That's right. You give it your best effort. You know? Then you give yourself a chance to win big. Anybody else? That's right. Vanessa? Yeah. Okay. Okay. But after... I finished a couple of laps. I just didn't know what to do with it. So I don't have to put it away for a while. Okay. But now I just don't... I don't know what to do with it. Like having no... So you put it away for a while? Yeah. And then... Then you don't know what to do with it? Like, where is it? It's here. Don't worry. Okay. Good. No, you'd be surprised. No. So it's on your laptop. It's on Google Docs. It's everywhere. It's on Google Docs. It's good. It's on the cloud. It's on the... Yeah. Great. Okay. No. It's great. It's in the cloud. She's in the cloud. At least you saved it somewhere in the cloud. Okay. Do you have a printer? Yeah. Okay. Have you printed it out? You printed it out. But I haven't. Okay. So that you... For myself. You haven't printed it out. Great. Okay. So you want to get grounded basically. Okay. So when you have a chance, you go to your printer and you print it out. And there come the pages. And I would suggest printing it out. You know. Sorry for the trade. The only way to do this once, you print it out single-sided. Only because you're going to get... You need some space. Okay. I'm not suggesting all the time. I rarely print out things. But when I do a rewrite, I want it to be printed out single-sided. Because I want lots of space to scribble and do rewriting. Rewriting. Don't you love rewriting? Yes, you do. Who loves rewriting? Does anybody love West? Ta-da! Ta-da! Ta-da! Ta-da! You love rewriting. Yeah. You love rewriting. Right? You just do. Because rewriting is where you get to... Right? You get to show that you're serious. Rewriting. Have any of you ever been in a relationship? Right? Okay. That's like rewriting. It's not just like, Oh! Talk about this shit. We're going to talk about what is it working? Right? Maybe I don't like what you're wearing today. We're going to have a conversation about that. It's a relationship. So you're going to have a relationship with your work. So you need to rewrite. So you're going to print it out single-sided. And then you're going to... Have you ever read it aloud? You have a voice. So... And you can read it. Yes. I'm sure. So you're going to maybe read your work aloud. Okay? In one go. Aloud. In your... Do you have like a room or a place you've come from? Great. So you're going to read it aloud in one go. And you're going to preferably stay out of it. Because then you're in your body. And they're characters, right? Yeah, I know. It sounds... It's exhausting already, right? But did anybody run the marathon yesterday? No. So it's kind of like that. But there are no people cheering you along. Every go, go! And the spirit. And you guys are working together. Okay? So this is rewriting. So you're reading it along. Right? And you reach a part that is like, I don't understand what's going on here. Shut up. Keep going. And you're reading all the way through. You've got all kinds of works on when you're done. And that's a roadmap to rewriting. Okay? Okay? And that's the first step. It's so important to learn to rewrite your work on your own. Okay? That's not to discount the help that brilliant editors and dramaturgs and you know, can give you, right? But you really want to learn to rewrite your work by yourself. You don't want to have to wait until the road is filled with brilliant actors. You don't want to have to write your play. I can't hear but some of my students are like, I can't hear my play. Unless I hire these fabulous actors to read it. I want to get you to hear me play first on your own. It's like a composer. She hears her work, right? She can hear her work in her head. That's what we want to develop. And then when you hand it off to actors, you will be employing amazing amplifiers. Who amplify? And there's brilliant things with your work. But you want to have done a couple of rewrites before hand off to actors. Right? Okay. It's going to be fun. Rewriting is fun. The hard work you've done, the hardest part of it is writing is harder. Okay? Okay? And come back, come back because we can keep talking. It will be like those people at the marathon. Go! Everybody give your name because I see you around town. Jim? Yes. Jim. There are biographies or backstories for your characters. Right. Pretty much everything you know about them is in the play. Is it in the play? Or does that change from project to project? It depends. It depends. It depends. Sometimes we write something and you really, you as a writer, need to know what happened when the kid was seven years old. You know? Or an actor might say, what happened when the kid was seven years old? And you might provide that, Jim, right? I mean you might provide it to the actor outside of the text or maybe the telling of it is very important to the dramatic unfolding of your play. Okay? So, I usually only include what's going to be dramatically relevant. Now, it gets us into an area about exposition, right? Where one character is just saying, back in the day when I was... And I know these are like, it's like torture, right? It's torture unless it's attached to dramatic necessity. You know what I'm saying? So, a character starts talking and relating some information about herself because she wants something. Not because she wants the audience to know. That's kind of lame exposition. But she wants something from the other characters. And that's why she's telling this information. You see? So, it's very active. It's not just the playwright wants the audience to know something about these characters. Does that make sense? So, I would say, sure, if you want to write some back stories, if that's going to help you hear the characters, if that's going to help you write them more vividly, sure, write some back story. Only include in the play what's going to be dramatically relevant. Right? Yeah. Like we know, like in Medea. Medea might talk about where she cut this from because she's trying to maybe tell Queon. This is my back story. This is what I want. So, she's using it as fuel. She's not just telling the audience her stuff. Tatiana? Yeah. Cool. I had a question. I'm working on a play for a class. I'm a graduate student in playwriting at Columbia. Oh, great. Okay. We have this prompt, and I've been working with this through line, and I've gotten lost writing different themes kind of out of order. Right. And I'm wondering if you had any advice about how to find your way back to your through line. Okay. Okay, so do you like the prompt? I do, yeah. Good. Good. Okay. So, how do you find your way back to your through line? Okay. Great. What you haven't mentioned is any character. Are there characters in your play? Yes, there are characters. I know. You laugh. It's funny, right? Are there any characters? I know. There are characters. So, what are they? I mean, do they have names? Yes. So, one of them, I have it split up into kind of two parts. One is like a play within a play. Okay. And the other side of it is the rehearsal. Okay. So, we see the actors. Okay. So, Rivka and Leo are my two characters that I'm working with. Great. Okay. So, what do they want? They want to perform this play while also understanding the backstory of where their characters are coming from. Okay. The play that they're performing is like a bat mitzvah. Okay. Okay. And so, they're like 23-year-olds playing 13-year-olds and they're trying to get into that headspace. And they're also in a relationship. Okay. And what is, what's in their way? What's their obstacle? A hard time getting, because they're so clouded with everything going on in the world as it is now for... Right. At age 23-ish. Right. So, they're in trouble relating to a character that would be in the headspace of a 13-year-old. Okay. So, what are they going to do to overcome their obstacle? So far, I just have them talking it out with each other. Okay. Different ways that they can get deeper with their characters. And maybe some interaction with the audience, but I'm not sure. Okay. So, you notice everything I'm asking you is about your characters and what they're doing. And I'm not really asking you about, you know, the plot. Because they're connected. They're so connected. But a lot of times we lose our way when we're just thinking about one of those things. Right? We're just thinking about the characters or we're just thinking about the plot. And what's clear to me is that you're spending more time on the characters. So, what will they need to... It's a play about a bat mitzvah or a bar mitzvah. It's a play about a bat mitzvah. And do you know what that play is? I'm still trying to figure that out. Okay. Okay. Okay. So, I would suggest that you just spend a lot of time talking to your characters. That would help. Figure out that play that they're performing. Okay. Get specific. Because I think you're kind of specific about the big picture things. But when it comes to what the characters are actually doing, like this... Like, for example, if I wanted to remember what it was like to be 13, what would I do? I don't know. Could you go online and maybe buy something off of eBay that might have been a toy or something that you had when you were 13? You know, I don't know what toys people have when they're 13. But do you see what I'm saying? Yeah. Get a sensory object. Get something. Instead of just doing this, talking, I encourage people to get their characters to start to be active all through their body. And not just from the neck up. There are a lot of plays where people are just talking. Wah, wah, wah. They're not really doing anything. Except talking. And yes, talking is an action. But, you know. Okay. So, if they're doing something, right? They're actually doing something. For example, you should go, do you know the play, Hamlet? Hamlet by that guy. So, the play opens. How does the play open? It's been a while since I've read Hamlet. Okay. Is it like, is it their birthday party? No. Is there, are they outside? Yeah. They're outside. They're outside, right? Yeah, yeah. So, they're outside. And they're like, who goes there? Whatever the person. I don't know that, right? And they're outside and they're on watch, right? Some miscellaneous dudes are on watch because there's been a ghost sighted and they're wondering what the fuck, right? And so, they're standing up. They're not just talking, blah, blah, blah. They're on the parapet. It's foggy. They're going, oh, shit. Oh, there's a ghost. I don't know. Right? It's very active. You see, Shakespeare set this, these two guys asking these important questions. Who am I and what am I doing here? He put them in an exciting place and it revealed so much about the questions of the play. You see what I'm saying? They weren't just talking, okay? So, think about what your characters might be doing, actively doing, to take them back to the time when they were 13 years old, okay? Are there any articles of clothing that they still wear or they might take out of a trunk or a closet? Are there TV shows that they might watch or they might remember together? Okay? Okay? Active, active, active. Keep it active. Because it's a play. You forget. Thanks, though. Thank you. Thank you. Good question. Anybody else? I have some of the things that I need to talk to someone about is structure. Right. Okay. When you have a piece that you're working on that has lots of different bits and pieces and lots of different ancient stories, it's a family dynamic. Right, right. It's dysfunction. Okay. But if it's all in the name of one particular kind of goal. Right. And each one of these things could easily be like a vignette. Right. If you wanted to. But I don't want it to be that. Right, right. I want it to be maybe a musical. Maybe you play a lot of music in it. And I understand that each piece of action has to end the song, you know, that you write. Has to continue moving the action forward. Right. You know, so that you remain invested in the character. Right. Otherwise it's just like you don't care about the thing. But one of the things is how do you hang... I'm trying to figure out how to hang, you know, this one particular idea that is like the culmination of everything. Right. And how to bring that forward in a clinic so that we know what this might be about. Right. You know. Right. I see what you mean. That's really tricky. Yeah, yeah. There's many ways to do it. Right. Right. But I'm not sure what the strongest way to do it. Or to keep it as a surprise and then it's... You see what I mean? But even if it's a surprise, there should still be a little hint or something. True. True. True. That's structure. That is structure. Yeah, there's also character involvement. It's all the same thing. I mean, I think it's most helpful for me if we see all the things as interconnected. Right. Okay? So we can take out for the moment the fact that people say that songs, you know, have to move this very forward. But if we just take out those for a sec and just look at those... The story. The story. The characters. What they want. What they want more than anything. Right? So if we were to say, just to take this conversation, very much so, Mark will want you to successfully write her play slash musical. And in the end, she successfully writes her play slash musical. It's okay to know what the characters want at the beginning. Right. You think of all the musicals and not all the musicals. But like, I don't know, what's musicals that you like? That's musicals. Oliver. Oh, there's a great one. What does he want? He wants more. He wants more. And people go, ah! You know, I'm treating him like shit for wanting more. But he gets more. He gets a lot more. But it's okay to know what he wants at the beginning. It's often called in musical theater language. Theater language. I know, but we hate it, but it's comfortable. The I want song. It's called the I want song. And it usually happens like the second song in, and they sing about what they want. Right. Right, like that. And that's okay, because then everybody knows that's what the characters want. Right. And then we see how they get it. So we're watching how they get it. So we think of, I don't know, the rakes of rap, although it's not a musical, but they want a better life. And we see how they get it. So the it doesn't need to be kept mysterious. It's the how. It's the word for it. Does that make sense? It's okay to say out, try and experiment, say right in the front what they all want. Have all your characters stand there and go, I want this. I want this. I want this. And then watch what they're going to do I know I have that. Okay, okay. I have that already. Okay, okay, cool. And, you know, when we, maybe I need to think, one of the things that I want to do, is there's a thing that the main character is not aware of. Okay. So say, you know, the main character wants to see the entertainment. Right. Right. You know, it's an ignorant, always wanted to see the entertainment. Okay. So that's what, that's what this came in. Right. However, when she goes back to the dynamic, what she discovers is something, or pressing, you know, and she tries to, you know, extend it to something that is in denial about things. You know, it's true to stand there and stare at me right in the face. Right. But, you know, the character is the only one who can really see this. Seriousness. Right. And the other one is, ah, that doesn't go up. Ah, you're exaggerating. Ah, I don't even know what you're talking about. Right. That's the one that's really pressing to the future of whatever. Right. So I'm trying to figure out how to make that, the connection to why she needs this. We'll see at the table. Right. You know, so you need to go through and ask every character, how is your story connected to the same story? Right. You could ask them that. Because some characters go, ah, I'm only interested in, you know, buying a pair of shoes, you know, whatever. But how is your story connected to the same story? Right. You know, because each, each and yet, as you call it, should be connected to the bigger story. And when they're all together, as well, because it's, I think, well, sure. But it's all connected. It can grow up. It can grow up. It can grow up. Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. That's all right. Also, index cards, a motion board. Yeah. You know, it's helpful. It's a lot of that. Yeah. You know, but it's really helpful. So try to get it, you know, off your lap, off the desk, and, like, on the wall. Yeah. You can just play with it. You know. Thank you. So, I'll get you next. Okay. Go on. Go on. Go on. Go on. Okay. You can start with the clothes. Right on. You got to see the next one. Right. There you go. Go on. Okay. Go on. Awright. Right. Oh, great. All right. That's fine. So, then, number of songs I've worked at, one of the ones that I like, Oh, great. Oh, great. Oh great. Go on. Thanks, guys. Oh, good. Oh, good. And that person's... who was that? Oh, great. Oh, great. Oh, great. a lot of books, so now she's been getting into songwriting, so now we're, she's, yeah, so you've got to, you've got to transcribe. I registered the copy. Okay, cool. It's very timely. Oh, cool. I'm going to take my baby away. Oh, okay. I'm dealing with another supporter. Okay, okay. So, like, what do I do next? I don't know what to do next. What? What do you mean? I'm going to get it out. Oh, I know. Are you recording a song? Well, if you recorded a song, if you bring a song, you copyrighted it, you recorded it, you have to record it in pain. You can put it on SoundCloud. SoundCloud. Well, you've got to know. No, you just, no. In two minutes. You've got to go online and forget that. I mean, really, just do it. Go online, SoundCloud, yeah, and it doesn't really have anyone to, yes, exactly. Yes, exactly. It's not that difficult. It's just, you just can upload your songs to SoundCloud. Getting your work out there is very important. You want to just upload your songs to SoundCloud. That's good. I mean, or you can, you know, brush off your musical chops and perform it yourself. You can do it. Yeah. You can do both. But it's, it's, um... It's been a wonderful experience. Well, that's good fun. Congratulations. That's what you get there. Run, run, run. So where will we be back? I know. November 26th. November 26th. We'll be back on November 26th at 5 p.m. And, uh, anything else you need to say? I know. Well, you know, it's working. Congratulations. I sure will. Okay, thanks for coming in. Thank you. Thank you.