 Okay, here we go. Oh my God! We're gonna give you MapStrong for- did I freak you guys out? Relax everybody, it's gonna be a great show today and we're gonna give away something for free because that's what we do all the time. Here's what you get for free. MapStrong, one of our most popular workout programs. Here's how you can win that program for free. Leave a comment below in the first 24 hours that we drop this episode. Tell us a fun story. Make a good comment. I don't care. Make it good. If we pick it, we'll notify you and then you'll win MapStrong for free. Isn't that awesome? You also need to subscribe to this channel and turn on your notifications. Also, before we start this podcast, we are running a brand new sale because it's August. Two programs on sale to great muscle building programs on sale. MapStrong, MapPowerlift, both 50% off. Check them out at mapsfitnessproducts.com. Just use the code AugustSpecial with no space for that discount. Alright, enjoy the show. Every once in a while, I'll go on our YouTube channel and read comments of people and what people are saying and stuff. Got a great comment that resonated so strongly with me. Once I read it, you guys will know why it resonated. I forgot which video this was on. I want to say it was the how to get build muscle on a budget. I think it was that last one right there. This guy says, I love you guys' content. I'm 14 and I used to get made fun of because I'm skinny and I started working out five months ago and the first three months I was lost until I found you guys. So thanks a lot. I went from 119 to 135 pounds and now people aren't saying I'm weak and skinny. You guys have changed my fitness experience. Hey, buddy. How great is that? Shout that kid's handle out. What is it? Give him some love. Yeah, let me pull it up again. On YouTube, it's Washi. You know, Washi? Yeah, W-A-S-H. We talked about one of the things that we've been most proud of as far as the business was when we designed Maps Prime and Prime Pro. I think we all agreed that was like one of the newest things I feel most proud of with this business was actually surviving YouTube. I'm serious. A lot of you are cunts. YouTube is full of fucking trolls, man. They are hard, man. Dude, when I first learned that. It's proving grounds. I forgot. I think it was one of our first workout videos that we did on there and by that time at that time I was in my late 30s. I'm pretty confident. I think I've dealt with my body image issues, right? And we posted that video and one of the comments, this is all it said, weak chest. I know. I've been leaning into that for since then. I know. I was like, wow, dude. Oh, it's tough. Yeah, no, YouTube's tough, man. So it's so cool to see the response that the show is getting because to your point, we started the exercise channel, right? So if you're watching the podcast and you haven't been over to Mind Pump TV, we have a channel that's got half a million subscribers over there that we do exercise demos and people were just brutal when we launched that and put that out there. And when we started to do the podcast, I thought, oh man, I was mentally preparing myself to not let the trolls get to me and fire back. I like reading stuff like this because obviously it's a teenage kid and teenage years are tough, right? That's when you're kind of finding who you are. That's the formative years. Yeah, you're feeling insecure. Everybody has, you know, issues, I guess, to one degree or another when they're teenagers. But I like this because, you know, this kid is like, oh, I was bullied or whatever. And he's now the part that's, you know, cool, but that's not super exciting. Okay. He worked out, changed his body. That's great. Here's what's exciting though, is he's learned a lesson that he can, he can make choices in his actions to change things or to prove things. And that's what exercise teaches you. So to read that, it's like, man, he's learning a valuable lesson, you know. Oh, yeah. And it resonates, you know, because I think we all kind of experienced that too, like being the skinny kid. And I remember, because my brother was two years older than me too. And, you know, there's a lot of his friends and that would come over and, you know, punk me. And that was just one of those things. It's to work out and get stronger and bigger made a massive difference. It just really kind of gave you that confidence that I never had before. I started lifting weights. So it's encouraging to see young boys, you know, still, you know, getting after it and, you know, getting that kind of gaining that confidence by doing something like working out. Well, talking about YouTube and comments and young guys and stuff like that. You know, something that Andrew taught me yesterday. So I was talking to him about not being able to read sarcasm. I was like, we should have like a sarcasm font because right. So like we were, you know, we jab each other quite a bit. So a lot of times, I don't know if someone's just playing on, on YouTube. I saw that comment where someone said something. Yeah. So I was talking shit about my outfit, right? Yeah. And you hit him back. Yeah. So I hit him back and then they came back and was like, I'm just being sarcastic. And I'm like, oh, well, fuck, I can't tell. You know what I'm saying? Like this one fires that memo fire back. But so he tells me there actually is a way that people type. And I don't know if this is like universal or what. Is this where they go upper lower case? Yes. So when someone does upper, lower, upper, lower, is that right, Andrew? Yeah. So that's, he says if they do upper, lower, upper, lower, that's supposed to be sarcastic. So if you're talking shit, just being funny, sarcastic, upper case, lower case, then I'll know. But otherwise I'm going to fire back at you. You talk some shit. I guess it too. It's like what you kind of see in terms of memes and whatnot. But I always saw that as like a way that there was, there was like a lot of insulting like memes and things towards, you know, the left that was using the, every time like, you know, one of them would, would, would talk or have like a video out. They would have like that text, you know, follow that. So I guess that's just in general, just making fun of people or a sarcastic voice, right? That's what you're doing. You're being sarcastic when you're, you're mimicking them by, by whatever quoting they state or quoting whatever they said, right? I guess that's the theory. How funny is that though, that memes have become the most powerful form of communication that exists? Oh yeah. By far. By far. You can convey so much immediately. And their, and their share of what's the political cartoons. I was just going to say, I was just going to ask you what the history was on political cartoons as far as like how much were they, you know, valued or used. Was it, obviously they've been in newspapers forever. Very instrumental. Extremely instrumental. Very powerful newspapers realized it very quickly because they'd post a cartoon either depicting a president as, God, let me think. Teddy Roosevelt, you know, like a walrus with mustache or whatever. Or they talk about like the fat cats, you know, whether with their big tuxedos getting, you know, fed a bunch of stuff, all people are starving. These are all old political cartoons and they circulated so quickly. And they people realized very, very fast that this is a very effective form of communication. Memes are like that. Nothing spreads fast. In fact. Well, and you would trace that all the way back to even further, right? If you were to see, because I've heard you say that that originated with like gestures, right? Oh yeah. That was how that started. Yeah. But this is this is about print, you know, something in print that you can share before print. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. But the there's like, for example, I'll see this, right? I'll get a meme and it's a fitness meme. And typically people will send me funny fitness memes. And then within a day or two, I'll get a hundred people sending me that saying, it's how fast. Like there's one where there's a dude, he's like sweating, kind of an overweight guy, and he's looking in the mirror and he's like, big old sweat down his shirt. And it says, all right, man, I just, I'm done taking the shit. Now I'm ready to start working on it. You guys see that one? I saw it the other day. The funny part about that is though the, the lifespan of them is so short. Like you try sending that to like your son or someone who's younger generation. And it's two days late. Yeah, I know. It's like, you can't even, it's not funny anymore. It's like, not only that, you gotta be one of the first to send it to people for it to have value. Otherwise people are like, oh, that's so Tuesday. Yeah, and they start with meme culture and all this stuff. It's like, they start referring back to old memes. So it's like, if you're not on the up and up, like, I don't know what all these like frogs and, you know, these crying guys and whatever, you know, dog images mean, unless you actually know like where it stemmed from because they do memes on memes. Yeah. You know, it's like, it turns into like, I'm memeing with the meme that mean this. Was it Reddit that blew it up first? Who, I mean, is that where the memes like really started to blow up? I don't know. I used to call it a Mimi. Yeah, I remember that thing. That was cute. Mimi. Six, seven years ago, it's the first time I've ever seen it. Reddit, I think is where you'll get like the newest ones. But I mean, back in the day, I didn't even know Reddit existed. I didn't even know if it existed back then, but I would go on other sites and pull them up. Bodybuilding.com used to share a lot of memes. Remember Bodybuilding.com forums? I don't remember memes been there. Oh, yeah. There were like sub categories. Hang in there that often. And you could go in and pick up it. This is back when you- Where is that company right now? Doug, can you do a little search on me to find out how they're doing? Are they- They used to be one of the most- They were battling Amazon, weren't they? They were like one of the most powerful companies in the fitness space. Yeah. Because of- Period. They used to be one of the most visited websites. Who was it that we talked to that one time that actually pulled up the analytics on the traffic that the website used to get? Doug did. No, was it you, Doug? Who did that? Yeah. Oh, it was you. Yeah. I thought we were talking to some- I think it was Alexa is a app that you can use to see what their traffic is. It was like- I mean, it was like a cliff. Yes. I mean, and it was- I don't know what. Seven, six, six years ago, six, seven years ago when it started. Yeah. And it's like just dramatically- Yeah, and well, Amazon crushed the supplement space. That's it, yeah. And then the second thing is that the forums that were really popular were forums that would talk about kind of taboo topics like steroids and how to take them or whatever. Yeah. And then Google, which is the number one search engine, started kind of censoring that kind of stuff a little bit. So it made it harder to search and go through there. And so- Well, originally they had this brilliant model, right? You offered all kinds of free content around exercise and nutrition and you had all these other, you know, famous fitness people that were providing free content for the platform. And all bodybuilding.com wanted was the traffic because they knew if they were, the millions of people were coming to their side every day that a percentage of those people would buy supplements. And then they sold other people, just like a supplement store, they sold other brands and supplements where they probably made 10 to 20% on that. And then they sold their own brand, which is what they had, their margins were probably 80, 90% of the money. Yeah, what killed them was not the prices, because they had decent prices. Amazons got great prices, of course. It was the shipping, because Amazon had Prime next day. How do you beat that? Yeah, next day and as good of a price or better. Or you pay no shipping, because of Prime, you know. And that just, remember they had, I don't even, does body space still exist? Do you guys remember that? Body space. So this was, I think it was a bodybuilding.com social media attempt. And they had something called, remember, okay, so it was obviously named after MySpace. So it was body space and you would post your picture and you'd have a profile and then people- Are you sure it was called body space? I think so. Maybe Doug can look it up. I think I know what you're talking about. It was right when I was competing. Is that when you're talking about what was going on? I believe so. So it was like a social media just for- It wasn't called body space, it was called something else. Was it? Yeah, if you actually- Let me see. If you Google, there's actually that still, there's posts, someone made a profile of me on that channel. Wait, wait, made a profile of you? Yeah, using my images and stuff. Oh, wow. Yeah, it's called- Is this the one where like in Kuwait, there's a huge post review? That's not what I'm thinking of. That is it. Is that what you're thinking of? Yes, that's bodybuilding.com. Oh, that's not what I'm thinking of. Yeah, it's a social fitness app. I guess it still exists. I wonder how popular it is. I don't know anybody that uses that. Yeah, interesting, right? It is. Yeah. Anyway, you guys want to hear some embarrassing stuff? Always, yes, please. So I'll give you the backstory. So I have every once in a great while, I'll get really bad vertigo. So you guys remember I think it was like three years ago when I got vertigo hella bad one day and then I came into work and I was just a mess from it? So again, this happened last night, right? So I turned too quickly in bed and so for people who don't know, certain types of vertigo can get affected. There's these crystals that float around in the inner ear. One of them can get dislodged and it can create this crazy sensation that you're literally spinning or moving. Yeah, it's awful. Oh, it's the worst feeling. You just, you want to throw up. I've had it so bad where it made me throw up several times in a row right away. Last night was bad. It wasn't that bad, but it was really bad. So I just laid steady, fell back asleep, woke up this morning. It was gross. So I did these epley maneuvers, which is this head positional technique that gets the crystal to move in the right position. I actually bought this hat, by the way. It's the dorkiest looking thing in the world. And it's got like this like floating little thing in it that allows you to move your head in the right position to do the epley maneuver. Oh, please. Yes, please share. It is literally the most, like I will never show this thing. No, you have to. That and your head gear. Yeah. So I had to do like three rounds of this epley. And when you do the first one, oh, your eyes do this. It's terrible, terrible feeling. So anyway, I was feeling pretty crappy this morning. Jessica gets up, she goes downstairs, makes herself some coffee, and she's having a nice quiet morning for herself, which this is me, my self-aware, non-egoic version of myself talking to her. She totally deserves. She never gets this time. The baby's always around her honor. She never gets this time. Anyway, I'm feeling crappy, right? So I get up and I'm like, oh, do my thing. I'm late. You know, I plan on coming in, doing a long leg workout. I only got to do about 45 minutes. So I'm like kind of rushing. And I go downstairs and I'm like, you know, hey, you want me to make you some breakfast? She's like, yeah. So I'm like making her some breakfast real quick. And I'm kind of feeling crappy. And so I give her some shit, you know? So I'm like, I kind of acted funny. She's like, what's wrong? I'm like, you know, I made you breakfast. Like you didn't even put my lunch in my bag for me or whatever. So, you know, and by the way, okay, I'm not speaking for every man, but most guys, when we feel crappy, we kind of become babies. Oh, I'm a pain in the ass. Yeah, like I want to feel nurtured or babyed a little bit. And if I'm not, then I'll start feeling stupid. So anyway, that's what came out, right? So she felt like, excuse me, like what's going on? I never get a chance that she finally got like a 30 minute workout. She's really hard for her to get in. So I made her feel real bad. And like, you know, five minutes later, I feel terrible. So I apologize. But she already feels bad, right? So just a lesson here. That's right. Put the sandwich in the bag, Jessica. No, that's not what it is. Put the sandwich in the bag. It's simple. That's not what it is. You know, that's your lesson. That's the lesson. Okay, if you're watching this, that's at the end of the day. Oh, man. Put the goddamn sandwich in the bag. Yeah, it's a simple, you know, loving thing to do. Yeah, you know what it is? It's and you said this a while ago when you guys first had Max, you kept saying how much you missed Katrina, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's because you just, they're just without a baby, there's so much time you can spend with each other. And then when there's a kid, it's never going to be like that. The irony of that is that you don't see that until you have the kid. Correct. Right. I think I've heard that said to me 100 times. It falls on deaf ears. Yeah. I mean, it's been told to me 100 times. And I, you know, I would just, no, I'm already so busy. And then all of a sudden you have a child and you realize like, oh, I understand what busy really is. Yeah, yeah. Now I know what free, free time used to be. So I don't think anybody realized it until you actually have the kid. So do you get like something in your ear, like water? Like how does this like occur with, you know, keep happening? No idea. It happens to me once every couple years, two to three years or so. Yeah. And how does somebody know they actually have that and they're not just kind of dizzy or like, what's, what? Okay. So do you get diagnosed with it? Like you go in and then. So I did years ago. So I used to train in ear, nose and throat specialists. Dr. Rufio, I think I forgot his name. Anyway, great. Maro was his first name. Great guy. And he, he's the one that diagnosed me. So he put me in a position just to see how my, what would happen. And my eyes did the, they do this thing where they, they'll go back and forth. Terrible feeling. And he's like, yeah, you've got, you know, benign, positional, something, it's a type of vertigo. But that's how you'll know. And you can test if it's your left ear or your right ear, where it's coming from. So that's pretty much it. And I guess people, some people are more susceptible, but there's, so there's car sickness. You ever been car sick? Yeah. Okay. So it's like that, except also the world is moving. Like if it's really bad, I literally can't stand. It's like everything is spinning. Terrible. Yeah, no thanks. It's like being drunk and car sick all at the same time. Yeah. Without the fun parts. Oh yeah. Exactly. Without the fun buzz or whatever. Right. Anyway, speaking of a fun buzz, I am loving the Ned hemp oil capsules. Oh, I tried them for the first time the other day. You know, the best part is you don't taste the stuff. No, exactly. You know, aftertaste either you don't burp it up like fish oil, you know, sometimes. So yeah, no, it's, I actually really enjoy the taste, you know, but yeah, it's game changer for Courtney, because then she can just take the pills and, and, you know, get the same experience. So I gave it to my mom because she can have some anxiety and stuff. And I had her just take one and she loved it. She's like, oh my God, I felt kind of calm and good. And she's like, is this. Isn't your dad using it right now too? My dad's using it for pain. So he wakes up stiff. He's got arthritis up and down his spine. And what he should be doing is mobility exercise and he should also eliminate certain foods from his diet, but. Baby steps. He's not going to do that. So I convinced him to take something instead. So he's doing that, but it is helping him. He says when he takes it, he wakes up and he can move better. Now the only problem with that, with my dad at least is when he starts to feel better, he starts to do stupid shit that makes him feel worse later. So he'll, he'll wake up, be like, I feel good, Sal. And he'll be like, you know what I did? I, you know, I went in the backyard and I tore up the whole lawn to do the thing. Or, you know, he'll wrestle with my brother. My brother's, you guys have seen my brother, he's massive. Yeah. And he'd be like, oh, I feel good. Let's see if you could take me down. I'm like, dad, you're like 65 and you've got arthritis everywhere and your son is, you know, 230 pounds a horse. Like, why would you try it? Yeah. I got to show him, I could still kick his ass. Which he can. Hey, Justin, I heard you found the show succession. I did. I just found on HBO Max. I'm enjoying it. It has like a, a billion's kind of vibe to it. But yeah, it's just interesting. Like the power dynamic of like, you know, who's trying to run the company and all. So it's, I didn't know that, you know, it's been out for as long as it has. I was going to present it to you like, hey dude, I found this awesome show. And of course, Adam's already on top of it. Well, Doug and I have been talking about that for a minute, right, Doug? You found that too. Yeah, I love the show. Yeah, we both. You know, I didn't know, and one of you guys brought it up, that McCollie Colkins brother. Yes. Is the one of the main characters. I didn't realize that. Well, he looks just like him. Oh, I know. Yeah. When you say, after you say, you're like, oh, God, that's totally him, right? Was he in anything else before that? Like, I didn't know he was. He's been in a few movies with his brother. Like, if you go back and look at like Home Alone, all these different things, like he's been there as far as I know. Didn't Rogan just recently, or in the last year, an interview with him? They did. Yeah, I listened to that one. I didn't listen to that. It was interesting. Now, what's he up to? Because I always feel like he's weird. Like, when you see pictures of him. Dude, I have no idea what he's up to. But he, he's actually like, I mean, he's fairly normal. Like, considering the fact that he was a child star and most child stars are like just off the rails. But he's, he's dealing with it pretty well. I think that he probably took some time off Hollywood and all that kind of stuff and has regained, you know, some sense of normalcy in his life. Left the cult or whatever. Speaking of that, I tagged you guys in the Britney Spears. Oh my God. Booby picked. Did you see that? Okay, so, so here's a, I have a theory. Yes. You didn't tell me that. Or a prediction. Thank you. I'll make a prediction. You know how she, apparently she escaped this thing where her dad was controlling her? Escaped. I think she won the court case. Yes. I say escaped. That's what everybody was talking about. So you think like societal pressure had an influence on all this? Well, I think we may learn why. Dad wasn't controlling everything. I kind of subscribed to that theory too. You think so? That would be crazy if all of a sudden like she just blows like millions of dollars. She doesn't look very stable to me, dude. She does not. Right away, right away, that happens. What does she do? Remember, she's a 39 year old mother. Okay. Let her breeze out. Right away. Boom. Right away. I won. Tits out. Yeah. Look at my move. You think that had something to do with the court case winning? I do. What? I think she's like hyped and she's like, now I can be crazy again. I feel like you would, if you were being held captive in a sense, right? I feel like she would be doing things like that more so. That is kind of the symbolic liberation move, right? I guess that's true. Yeah. No, it didn't. No, it wasn't. She should have let him all the way free if that was the case though. That's true. She did, but it was kind of censored the nipple. I'm sure there's a version online. I wonder if she's going to do an only, what is it? An only fans. Oh my God. She would make a billion dollars. Have you guys, remember I brought up on the show that only fans is moving away from like nudity and stuff? Anybody hurt anything else? Follow up on that? No, nobody else has? I don't know what you're talking about. Yeah, I just subscribed. Justin's very, I mean, Adam's very concerned about this apparently. It's affecting you. What the hell's going on? I'm just happy she's free now. Someone's shared that clip with Britney. Yeah, the Bill Cosby meme that works. Yeah, no, I think she's kind of crazy a little bit. I mean, okay, it is strange when you see a woman that age. Nothing wrong. By the way, I think she's very attractive and looks good. But that's typically an insecure young kid that'll do that on Instagram. Yes, it looks like a younger girl move. Yeah, you don't expect that from someone who has kids. Oh, I imagine you make millions of dollars before the age of 20. You kind of skip a lot of maturity that you would go through. Yeah, that's a good point. Yeah, I mean, I feel like that's your, she's probably in many ways, so in many ways she's probably very mature and had to deal with things that people at that age didn't have to. At the same time, I think she's probably frozen in time with a lot of things too that she didn't have to go through. Also, she got ridiculed unjustifiably crazy for just barely even kind of showing skin and doing sexy moves and provocative stuff like when she first started out. Because it was kind of crazy. Did you watch that documentary? Yeah, how aggressive everybody was towards her. And then, so this may just be sort of like a big F you. You know what, looking back, so during that period of time, there were like a few of these girls that were performers and they were like, okay, should I go all the way sluddy? Should I go all the way? You know, it was like that whole thing. Yeah, right. Christina Aguilera, she went full on. Remember, she was from that Mickey Mouse Club group and she went crazy nuts. Yeah, and I have a crazy way to open the door for that. She did. Now, some people at the time, I remember people saying Christina is going to ruin her career and other people saying, no, she's not going to ruin her career. Looking back, she might have. She might have. Remember, Christina Aguilera had incredible voice. She actually was super talented as a singer. And after she did that, did she do a whole lot more? Oh, I think so. I mean, she's on like the voice. Andrew, I know you're a big Christina Aguilera fan. Yeah, he was wearing her shirt the other day. So what is up with her? I mean, I think she still went on to do pretty. Did she? Yeah, I think so, bro. I think she did things. I think I had a good career. I don't follow pop and celebrities. I know I don't. I really don't. Except for Britney Spears. That was it. Britney Spears. Lily, Britney Spears was the only famous person that I followed or paid attention to when I was a kid. Other than that, I just I never was into People Magazine. I didn't watch. She was like the entertainment girl next door. And what's the other popular show that's like entertainment that everybody watches? Anything Ryan Seacrest is on. I'm changing the channel. What was that one on MTV? There was that one where they would show the top music videos and there was like that one dude. Oh, Carson Daly. There you go. TRL. Wow. Wow. Look on you with the MTV trivia. Come on, dude. That's like, you know what's funny? And I was actually watching another show on HBO Max that was like kind of covering the whole Woodstock, the one that happened like in the 90s. That was so funny, by the way. Oh, dude. They tried to recreate Woodstock. Yeah. And it was the opposite. It was the opposite. Well, look at the list of bands that they brought. It was so stupid. Like it, none of them were in there like, you know, peace, love and, you know, free loves. It was like all aggressive, like heavy metal and rap. Did you watch that documentary? I was going to watch it the other night. Yeah, so. Was it good? I couldn't, I didn't finish it all the way through because it made me kind of uncomfortable just because it's just you could, you could just sense this, this energy and vibe like of the people that were there, like how bad it was going to erupt in their face. There was violence that were like, you know, people getting sexually assaulted. It was so, so opposite. So why I bring that up is because the whole TRL thing. So you remember like Carson Daley and then there was like another guy, Dave, whatever his name is. The blood chubby white dude. Yeah. Yeah. And so like Carson Daley goes to like address this huge sea of people and just like, Hey, like, like doing this whole TRL thing. Everybody's booing, throwing shit out of, you know, like, he's like, oh, he's just getting pelted. Right. And apparently there was this whole, like everybody was upset because that was like MTV used to just show bands that were kind of on the up and coming and a lot of them were rock based or like, you know, arts alternative. And it was like a lot more, you know, in that kind of genre. And then they started incorporating these teeny bopper, like the Britney Spears, the Backstreet Boys. Like they just started kind of smashing that in there with all this like bubblegum pop shit. And so all these like angry dudes and people there are just like, you fucking brah. Like yelling at him that like they ruined their MTV and all this and like pelting him with like rocks. I was like, wow, dude. That was on HBO Max, right? Is that what that was on? Did you guys see the article I shared that, I didn't even realize that 18, I didn't know how silly, right? I didn't know AT&T owned HBO Max. I didn't realize. They do? Yeah, they do. I know that. Yeah, the article I shared was just that they crushed their last quarterly because they came in, their subscribers that, the increase of it on HBO Max is like 43 million subscribers. Do you know, I think. Meanwhile, Netflix lost. Did you see Netflix lost like half a million? That's what I was going to ask, I think. Maybe more. I thought they were, they were, they're approaching like a billion users or something crazy. Do you know what Netflix subscriber base is? It's, I know it's ridiculously high. I don't, but let me look it up. He's going to go and see. I know they lost 500,000. Well, I want to watch this. We've been talking about this since the beginning of all this stuff going on, right? So I really wanted to watch. The streaming wars. Yeah, see who comes out on top and as you start to see these other ones rise. You know what I'm starting to question too is my original breaking free of the cable was to save money, right? More choices for, but I'm starting to add up all the streaming services that I have. It's very equal. Yeah, I might be up to or maybe over what my cable was before. No, what's it at? Oh, 207. It's not that much higher. Wow. And they lost, I want to say 500,000 people and their shares dropped in price. Netflix lost quite a bit. Maybe you can look that up too. Now, did you read an article that they attributed it to something or is it just because the competition? Well, politically speaking, they're saying, oh, they, you know, all the low programming. Oh God, you must have been reading like a Babylon or some shit like that. I don't remember, but reality is the likelihood is that it's just competitive. It's a much more competitive. Netflix was the only show in town. Yeah, no. And honestly, I think that these other ones are doing a better job. I just, I find the quality of documentaries and shows that HBO puts out, although they can't hang with Netflix as far as the amount of content. But I think the content's better. I think they get better actors. I think they have better story plots. The stuff that the HBO Max says, I like better than most. But they don't have as much. Oh, not even close. I think Netflix crushes them. Yeah, so I was right. Almost half a million. And that was in the second quarter. Yeah, I'm excited for a course. I don't remember the title of this show coming up, but Apple has like put a ton of money into this like ultimate epic science fiction. What? Yes, series. Yeah, if you look it up, Doug, I don't remember the actual title of it, but like it's apparently a lot of inspiration for some of the biggest, you know, science fiction franchises out there came from this foundation. Foundation, yes. Oh, what is that about? So yeah, again, it's just this like really expansive universe that this author had created. And so yeah, they put a lot of money in like, so this is like their game of thrones kind of hedge. That they're going to be promoting soon. But yeah, because Apple's been somewhat, you know, hit or miss with me like they obviously they try really hard to make quality shows, which I appreciate. But they're like, so the one was that newsroom one. Love that morning show. Yeah, the morning show that they did really well with that, but they haven't really had like many hits since. So Doug has the trailer up. The imagery looks amazing for foundations. You know, okay, so here's what sci-fi. I'm so excited about it. Well, here's what sci-fi does. Sometimes what they do that fucks it, that they fuck things up is they spend, and I'm not saying this is what's happening here because this is a trailer. There's no way for us to know. Is that Matthew McConaughey? It looked like that wasn't him. No, I don't think so. I don't think they have big... So where sci-fi sometimes messes up is they focus so much on the imagery and how cool things look, and then they don't spend either time or energy. Just the avatar effect. On the story, right? And so the story sucks, but you've got all this cool imagery. I hate it when they do that. Yeah, agreed. No, apparently this is a really rich, deep story. Really? Yeah. Series or is it a movie? I think it's series. Expansive series. Now back to your comment about saving money, spending up spending more money. I've heard people say that like, oh, this was supposed to save us money, but now it's costing us more money. You're not comparing... People don't compare apples to apples. If you compare the choices that you had before, the quality that you had before, to what you could get for the same price now or less, it is much cheaper. The difference is we have so much more available that we end up just getting more stuff. So, I mean, if you go through all the channels... Yeah, no, I agree with that. I mean, I don't... I'm saying it more ironically, your tongue in cheek, right? I mean, it's like that was the main driver for me to switch over. I was like, man, I'm paying $2.50 a month for my cable bill. This is crazy. I only watch a handful of shows. So, it ends up happening and I cancel it. Then I start with just like Sling Studio and HBO, maybe like ESPN, maybe three or four, and I'm spending $60 or $70, but then like, oh, then Prime comes out and then, oh, nevermind. Before you know it, I've... They get you. Yeah, but also, you got to appreciate the fact that you can cancel out and like, it used to be such a pain because everything is bundled through cable. So at least like, if you want to be more... If you want to like make sure you're not spring to which you can. Do you know that Apple has an awesome feature? My brother-in-law, who always... My tech nerdy brother-in-law always saves me when I get in pickles like this. So, I brought up on the show like a long time ago, how Katrina, every like, I don't know, I'd say every quarter, every six months, she goes in my phone and my bills and she goes through and cancels things that I've been paying $7 or $30 a month for however long and not using the service. Anything that you've linked to your Apple Pay or your card to Apple and you use to do that, there is a place where you can go, it has all of my subscriptions. Easy, you can show me that. And you just turn it off. So much easier. Oh, that's great. Because you know what a pain in the ass sometimes that is? To cancel something that you've subscribed to and you can't figure out where is the unsubscribe button on their website or how do I stop this from... It's not that easy. Oh, wow. So there's actually a part in your iPhone that's like in the settings where you just go over and it shows all of your subscriptions that you're paying for. I think the future of streaming at some point, it's going to take a while to get here, but at some point is going to be you just buy shows. That's it. There's not going to be have to sign up for a network. Well, it's kind of like that already. So there's like, Apple's like that, Prime is like that. You know, you get all your free... I think it'll stay like that, where you have a bunch of free content which makes sense because that's going to bring everybody in. And then they... Yeah, but don't you have to subscribe still and pay a fee? Well, yeah, to like Prime or whatever. That's what I mean. Well, no, if you have Prime, you get all their movie stuff for free. Right. But what I mean is, I think you're not going to have to pay any subscription. I think you're going to be... You're just going to be able to shop and pay individual episodes. Well, it's kind of... Yeah, if that's the case too, you'd think that they'd allow the very first episode to be free and then everything else. So that way you get hooked. Eventually. So they do... So yeah, I've seen that. Epic does that. There's still... What you're saying is already happening. You're not paying for Prime movies. You're paying for Prime the service to mail to your house. That's what you're paying for. Yeah, I know that. And then they give you free access to a bunch of movies. And then if you want to buy other... Upgraded, you pay all the car. Yeah, no, I know that. And Prime is not a good example necessarily because Prime Amazon offers way... Lots of other things that have nothing to do with streaming, like you said, like the free shipping, which I think is super valuable. I'm saying just streaming period. I think the few... As it becomes more and more and more and more competitive, eventually the winning model is going to be... You don't pay nothing for any subscription. You just go on and pay 9.9 cents. Well, so I think what'll happen is as it gets more and more competitive, like we see is happening right now, is Netflix will probably have to move to a model that's... So they're also building their original content. It's like what supplement shops do, right? So they'll make their most money off of their content. So they'll get you in for free or for like a next to nothing type of price. Yeah, because there's no licensing fee, no nothing. Get you in, right, to come watch their streaming. And then they'll have all their originals, that they can 3.99, 4.99, and upsell you too. Like that's a... I think that's a... Interesting. Yeah, an interesting theory that might go that way. All right, you want to hear something really cool? Really interesting? Yeah, because I got some too. So two studies on resistance training came out. So one came out that compared resistance training, strength training, right? To cardio and then to nothing. And it's another study that shows that resistance training is superior for fat loss. It was a head-to-head competition. You burn more body fat with resistance training. They had obviously a positive effect on their metabolism and long-term it was just much more effective. We talk about this all the time. Then there was another study. This is an interesting one now. So there's a compound, and this is very complex to be quite honest with you. I don't remember the name of it, but there's a compound in muscle that prevents hypertrophy. In other words, it's kind of there. It's not myelostatin or anything like that, but it's in the muscle. And what it does is it prevents muscle from growing. When you lift weights, this compound, what they found in the study, leaves muscle. So now the muscle is free to grow because you've sent that muscle building signal. Guess where it goes? Fat cells. This compound goes to fat cells, and it makes the fat cells want to burn and release fat or prevent or slow down fat accumulation. This would promote our theory. When we talk about how building muscle doesn't speed up your metabolism as much where people try and argue that. Right, but there's other effects. Exactly. This was a New York Times article, and I don't remember what it was called, but it was an animal study, and this is the first time they observed this, and they said that resistance training, strength training, primes your body to burn body fat, literally by changing. Aside from the fact that muscle tissue is more expensive, needs more calories, that's only one component to it. It's also sending a compound over to fat cells, which encourage the fat cells to be utilized as energy. See, it's a compound. I mean, this is a chemical that you produce that kind of... I can't remember what they call it. Part of a hormone mechanism. No, I can't remember what they call it. I'm not sure if it's part of a gene. I think that... Like it gets expressed by... Vesicles is one of the terms that they use for how this thing travels through the body, but they found them accumulate in fat cells from the resistance training. Left the muscle, so it's like your muscle is signaling, or your body's using the muscle to signal to fat, and it says burn, which is remarkable. Well, you know what? Well, now you just think about all the scientists that are going to try and figure out how to artificially reproduce that. Correct. Well, I'm more interested in pointing out this was something that we've been touting for quite some time. That's right. The academia used to... I remember when I first said this on the show, like, I don't know, four years ago or what like that. Right. And I got just hammered by all... It's not 10 calories per pound or whatever. Yeah, exactly. And then everybody started arguing over semantics that it's not that. And the point that I was making was that it's... What it does for the body as far as speeding metabolism is much more than what I think that we know right now. And so this just proves that, that there's much more going on than just the tissue is more expensive and uses more calories. Speaking of which, predictions and whatever, we've been saying and I've been really making the case that we are entering soon, we're entering into a stage where resistance training and strength training finally didn't get the credit that it deserves. And it's coming from studies and the medical field. That's going to drive it. And we are now... That's exactly what's happening. We are now seeing medical journals and doctors and weight loss, quote unquote, experts start to say, oh, this is the best way to burn body fat. It's to lift weights. And this is just one more study that shows kind of what's happening. The metabolism is extremely complex. It's the second most complex thing that we've identified besides the human brain. And we know through experience that when you lift weights, there's this incredible fat burning effect that comes from it that you can't calculate from the calories burned while doing the exercise or even the per pound of muscle, how many calories that burns. There's other stuff that's going on. And this is one of the first studies to show that there's some, maybe some gene effects or again, I don't remember what the term was. More proof there. What did you have for us, Justin? So I was actually going to go in a paranormal kind of direction here. The fitting. Surprise. Yeah, so I guess there's been this weird phenomenon. Every now and then I check out that website next door because, well, Courtney gets obsessed with it because it's just kind of fun to watch, you know, what people are talking about and obsessing over and stuff. So apparently there's just been this trend lately that owners, dogs, have been acting very strange. And it started out with this one thread of this couple that was like, yeah, we were just sitting and watching TV and all of a sudden our dogs just all of a sudden out of nowhere just ran to the corner of the house and started barking. And, you know, like, and there's nothing there. And it freaked us out. And we were like trying to figure out. And then all of a sudden, all these other people started piling on. And they're like, yeah, all of a sudden, you know, just out of the blue, like a dog woke up out of its sleep, got up and started barking, you know, just randomly in the air. And so, you know, like some people are like, oh my God, we've got like ghosts. Like what's happening to this? And so then it became like, well, maybe, actually, if you go back to the 89 earthquake, there was like a lot of this kind of behavior beforehand with dogs because they could sense, you know, these vibrations or this movement of, you know, the plates and all that kind of stuff. That's weird because dogs never bark for no reason. You know what I mean? It's so uncommon. Yeah, exactly. I get that too. Like it could just be a random occurrence. No way. Their senses are crazy. But would it be a quick follow? It wasn't like regular behavior. So, you know, when your dogs just out like barking at some like critter outside or whatever, it's pretty like predictable. Or they like actually go to look, you know, but they're just like barking randomly at like a wall. Yeah, well, there was a case like that. I remember where it was where the dogs in this particular town were all freaking out all the time. They couldn't figure out what was going on. And apparently there was this factory across the river that was emitting this sound that normal people couldn't hear, obviously, because dogs have incredibly sensitive hearing. But the dogs could hear and it took them a while to figure it out and it could not figure out why the dogs were freaking out. So, yeah, yeah, that's totally something that's plausible. And also, too, like somebody theorized that, you know, some of those rat traps that are like electric sets dogs off because it's like they can hear that emitting like electrical sound and it like freaks them out. I've always been fascinated with the dog's senses, man. The ability for them like, I'll have somebody walk on the street and, you know, we have a good sized house. We could be on the complete opposite, hanging out, watching TV. Masi could be sleeping and all of a sudden his head pops up and you're like, what the hell? And then I go walk over the front door and you can see someone walking. It's another world. Dude, they live in another world. It's crazy. Do you guys remember that anti-pot commercial? Because in the 90s they had a lot of these. The drive-through with the dog that he talks to the dog. Yeah, or the dude. Yeah. It should just play it in you. Yeah, the dog. Exactly, dude. Hey, those commercials didn't work. If any of you made you want to try weed. Yeah, you're like, well, you can talk to dogs. This is amazing. Don't roll the joint tonight. Or the one where the girl, like, she's like, she turned into like, she's like melted into the couch. You know? And I remember watching that going, what does that feel like? I'm like, maybe I'll try this out. Your commercials did not work, dude. Terrible propaganda, yeah. Hey, real quick, I hope you're enjoying this show. Real quick, we have a sponsor called Ollipop. They make sodas, no joke, these are sodas, like the ones you enjoyed as a kid, that are extremely low calorie, that are also good for gut health. I'm not making this up. They contain prebiotic fibers. It's not artificially sweetened, although they do taste very sweet. And they're low calorie. It's like 30 calories or something like that per can. This stuff is amazing. I have gut issues. I drink this and I feel much better. Go check them out. And of course, because you listen to Mind Pump, you get an amazing discount. Head over to drinkollypop.com forward slash Mind Pump. Use the code Mind Pump for 15% off. All right, enjoy the rest of the show. First question is from Elfers215. Can heavy caffeine intake make it more difficult to drop body fat? And they put six to eight cups. Yeah, that's actually a pretty good question. I mean, look at me. Well, I mean, the whole cortisol thing, right? We talk about cortisol junkies. Yeah, well, the studies show that caffeine has a positive effect. In other words, it helps burn body fat, it could help suppress appetite, give people energy, burn more calories. In terms of kinesthetic movement. Yeah, but the problem with that is that there are, there's definitely a subset of the population that doesn't do well with caffeine. And if you abuse caffeine, it definitely induces this kind of stress state in the body, which can probably make you overeat or make you not move as much. I know if I have too much caffeine, I get this paradoxical effect where my energy is not higher. It's actually lower and I feel more. Well, isn't the, to Justin's point, isn't the research that supports the benefits of caffeine in regards to the movement? It's not necessarily like caffeine goes in your system and helps speed your metabolism up or burn body fat. It's that when you're on caffeine, for the most part should have more energy or activity. More activity increase. That's gotta be most of it. I mean, studies will show that it improves insulin sensitivity or at least coffee in particular. But here's the thing with caffeine. Does it improve your health or does it take away from your health? Because I've worked with lots of clients who had this kind of HPA access dysfunction. Back then they used to call it adrenal fatigue. Over-stressed, overworked, hormone imbalances, and caffeine was not good for them. In fact, taking caffeine away after they adjusted improved their ability to burn body fat and build muscle. So it's one of those things. It's gotta be the right dose and for the right person. Too much is bad. It'll make everything much worse. Yeah, I mean, if it's taken away from your recovery, if it's hindering the quality of your sleep, all these things you have to kind of factor out because those do contribute massively towards your goal of losing fat. There's gonna be a massive individual variance here. Huge. My personal, so when I start to feel, to your point, Sal, when there comes a point when I've been increasing my caffeine intake over time, that all of a sudden I get to this place where I'll have the fourth or fifth cup of coffee or a rock star or energy drink, and I actually get tired almost right afterwards. Like it gives me like an additional little bit of a spark and then 30 minutes later, I'm just like, grr, groggy. It's a sweet spot if you teeter over. Yeah, I have the same experience. And so I know that as I start to slowly, because I always go all the way back down to like my, like my baseline for me is one cup of coffee in the morning when I start my day. It's kind of like how I reset, right? So I'll go, I like that. Just like waking up to that. Once I start to scale up to beyond that, and I start to feel those adverse effects where either one, I get tired and I dip early in the day because almost I've had too much. Or if I start to see it start to affect my sleep, which both those start to, and for me, that starts to happen, which is whatever the amount of caffeine is in, a rock star and two cups of coffee is kind of my threshold. Once I peek over that. Probably around five or 600 milligrams. Well, I mean, the rock star is 220. Coffee is probably 180 each. So it depends how big the coffee is. It's just a normal cup of coffee. It's not like a Starbucks venti I'm talking about. See, I take caffeine in typically capsule form. So it's measured. And I know for me, it's about 300 to 400 max. And if I work it up, work up to that. The funny thing about caffeine is it's the most widely used, and I would say abused drug in the world. It's super acceptable, but it's a classic drug, classic. You build up a tolerance. It's got very bad withdrawal. Very addictive. Oh, very addictive. Go off, anybody who drinks coffee or has caffeine on a regular basis, stop cold turkey and then experience some of the worst withdrawal you'll have experienced in your life. I've gone off cannabis cold turkey and it wasn't as bad as going off of caffeine. So it's just one of those things, but it's the right dose. I know for me, the right amount of caffeine, for example, will give me a better workout. Too much makes my workout way worse. I think the point of this question is that is caffeine have a mechanism that directly affects fat storage, which I don't think that's true, but I do think that to our point, you can get to a place where you're having so much of it that it then begins to affect energy levels, which then can affect workout potentially, and or sleep. And if you start messing with sleep, then yes, that will affect recovery, building muscle and those things. There's a cause and effect. But there's not like a, oh, once you hit over 400 milligrams of caffeine, you now start to store more body fat or something like that. No, that's not how this works, but each person probably has a threshold to where you start to see some side effects that could negatively affect you in your pursuit of fat loss or building muscle. Yeah, because the thing is, it's a central nervous system stimulant, so theoretically it makes you burn more calories. But when you really look at the, you look at, just look around. Look how many people have caffeine and how many people are obese. It doesn't make up for extra calories. It doesn't make up for eating poorly or not exercising. And again, I'm gonna make this, I can't stress this enough. If caffeine is causing your health to decline, if it's reducing your ability to thrive, if it's causing stress effects in the body, then it's gonna hurt your ability to build muscle or burn body fat. Because when you're unhealthy, you're just, your hormones are off, you're not getting as good asleep, you don't feel as good. And in that state of being, you're not gonna be as effective. I just think it's a good habit for you, everybody. Even if you love caffeine and you don't think there's any negative effects from it, it's just a good habit to bring yourself down every once in a while. Every three or four months or six months, if you know you've been consistently having X amount and that X amount continues to grow, that it's probably smart. And I mean, for the least, it'll be cheaper for you. If you go, if you get into a place where like I said, where I rockstar, two coffees, you know, that's basically three, six, you know, $10 of caffeine that I'm taking in a day, completely going back all the way to the direction, then it only cost me the two, three dollars for a cup of coffee to get the same effect. So I mean, I think for financial reasons, it's smart to do it. And then also for the addictive properties that come with it. Next question is from Mo Strength Gains. You've ranked the big lifts a few times. What would you consider the top five accessory movements outside of a squat or deadlift variation, overhead press and bench press? I would have to put a row in there. I think a barbell row or a dumbbell row. I'll give you that. So there's one. Is a very, very important exercise. I'll do one more. And I'll leave this one. I think you guys will probably guess to split stance, squat variations. Well, I mean, that's a squat variation. Yeah. Right. I mean, that's a Bulgarian split squat is a squat variation. Would you see a lunge as a part of a squat variation? That's what I mean. Yeah, because I would go that direction too. I think we could put lunge because you have that back leg. It's stabilizing differently. I think it's a different exercise. Yeah. I would say that lunging or Bulgarian or back step lunge or something like that has got to be up there. So there's two right there. So what do you guys think for the other three? Yeah. I mean, I would think like a pull up. You don't see that on there. That's not bad. A pull up would definitely cover it. I'll give you that. Yeah, that's not a bad one. I like pull up for sure there. It's a foundation exercise. You know what's hard about this is that a lot of accessory movements are very similar as far as how I would value them. Right? You have like the big core lifts like that are that we talk about so much and we rank and we say are so valuable. And then I kind of feel like all the rest of them are like very debatable and like, well, would you put this one above that one or this one? Like it's hard for me to list what I think is the next. Preferably I would also throw in like a farmer carries just because of like the overall value of what that brings like in terms of like loading of weight but also like reinforcing good posture and like I could pretty much like plug and play that in a lot of different types of programs. I could see that. I would even put a dip, you know, using your body weight to press yourself up or push your body up just like a pull up to pull your body up. Very functional. I mean, I'll give a dip. I love dip because we already did two pulls, right? So we did the row and then the pull up. So I can get down with that. I love the dip for your push. Yeah. Because I was trying to think of other push exercises that's not a variation of the overhead press or the bench press. Yeah, I was seeing the farmer carry for the deadlift, you know, like in terms of just holding or just stabilization stabilizing. Yeah, overhead carries and maybe trying to think of something that would be. That's very valuable. Yeah, that's a valuable exercise. So we got the dip. We have the row. We have the pull up. We have. Farmer carry. Farmer carry and overhead carries. Overhead carries are pretty good. What about like chopping, like rotational stuff, you know, in terms of like like a med ball toss or something like it. I mean, it's again, this is an accessory that's it's not easily programmed. Well, why we're over here fumbling all over our shelf right now. I want to point out that this is the, that's the point, right? That those, those top ranked exercises themselves, somebody can get in the most amazing shape and never move outside of them. And the best thing you can do after you move outside of them is all the variations of those movements. Yeah, yeah. And then we can get into this debate of all these other secondary movements or accessory movements that are great. Those are, and I'm not saying these are all bad exercise. I'm just saying that when you compare them to the big five, there's so many variations within the big five. Well, that's like the common sub sect is what you do is you find like the, you know, the other versions of the squats, the other versions of the deadlifts, you know, like the, to implement in the programming as far as like your second tier while putting it together. After that, it's like, okay, so now what are we actually trying to do to adapt towards? I mean, would a chest fly be in here? You know what, I'll say this, let's imagine this is a step up. So imagine this is a routine, right? You're designing a workout plan for someone. Yeah. And we have to pick an exercise for the each major muscle group. We did, I mean, pull up, dip, row, you know, farmer carry. Like why not put something like a Turkish get up? Like that would round this whole thing out and include a very functional stabilization component, some core. Oh, I was thinking of, okay, what would I do if I was going to use the next best accessory movements and I want to attack the entire body? Like I want to hit a chest exercise shoulder, arms, back, legs, but I can't use the five big. Four big, right? Yeah, four or five in this case, they use five. What would I do? The dip, you can argue, is your chest, right? Right, chest, shoulders, triceps. Yeah, back, biceps. And rows, that goes there. Legs, we're going to say what you're going to say. I say step ups and lunges. Lunges, squats, we're already there, right? So lunges give you that other component. Okay. So let's see. We don't have like a functional stabilization type component. I mean, farmer carries are really good for that. You know what would be good? I mean, I think that the next one, the next one we can add is debatable, right? I would love to see the comments after this video because I know Andrew puts these videos together. I'd like to see in the comments what people think that next exercise should be. Yeah, there's really not a wrong answer here and I think I can argue almost any other accessory movement. Let's see what you guys think. Next question is from Brother Louis Louis Louis 87. Can I still build muscle and lose fat even if I walk 25,000 steps a day? I work out three or four times a week and do intermittent fasting every day. I am also at a caloric deficit every day. What is your advice to do body recomposition successfully given my situation? Let's forget all the information he gave us because then we'd have to design a routine and ask him more questions. Here's the real question. Can you lose fat and build muscle at the same time? Typically, it's very challenging, especially if you're intermediate or advanced. Like if you're really advanced, you've been working out for a while, we've been eating pretty good for a while, and then you decide to go on a cut and you're like, I'm going to build while I cut. Like good luck. Like this is a very challenging thing to do, probably not. We call that like the Goldilocks zone. If you're a beginner, this happens all the time. Every single new client I train gained muscle and burn body fat in the first few months. There is an exception to that. The advanced or intermediate person who's been off on a layoff, right? So if I've been off for a few weeks. Well, yeah, I would put that in the same category, the decondition. Well, yeah. So that's important though to note that because someone who's thinking that they've been training for a long time, they now think, oh, there's no chance of me doing this. This happens to me every time I go back to my training. And the way I do it is I actually don't focus on losing. I focus on building. I try and eat a maintenance caloric intake and I go back to building. You let the metabolism do the job. And I let the metabolism do the work. I figure, okay, this is my body needs, let's say, hypothetically maintenance is 3,000 calories. I'm back to training for strength and trying to build. I'm going to eat till I'm satisfied, say 3,000 calories. And inevitably what happens in those first couple of weeks is my body starts to remember that I had muscle. It starts to put the muscle back on. And then my metabolism starts to inevitably speed up, which ends up reducing my body fat percentage. So aside from the muscle memory effects, if you're consistent, consistent, consistent, you're advanced, your best bet is to preserve muscle. So now, how do you best preserve muscle? That's a good question. You try to build it. The goal is always to try to build muscle because if you're trying to build muscle and you're doing it right, you're more likely to preserve muscle than if you weren't. But in a calorie deficit, it's very difficult in a calorie deficit, especially if you're advanced to build and while losing body fat. Beginners, like I said, every client I trained as a beginner the first few months, that's exactly what we saw. You get those new be gains. Yeah, I would see them gain muscle and burn body fat and it happened all the time. I do think the advice to this person though is to get out of the deficit. So if your goal is to try and to build muscle and you want to lean out also, being in a caloric deficit and moving that much and training that much is not advantageous. It's going to be really tough for this person to build muscle right here. They're more likely to break down. That's true. Now are you guys familiar with, this is an old, it's a famous study done in the 19, I want to say the 1970s, maybe late 70s, with Casey Viatter and Arthur Jones called the Colorado Experiment. I might have brought this up a long time ago. We've talked about this before a long time ago. So Arthur Jones is the inventor of nautilus equipment. Casey Viatter, the youngest Mr. America, back then Mr. America was a big bodybuilding contest ever. I think he won, he was 18. This genetic phenom bodybuilder, really strong, long muscle bellies, the whole deal. He, Arthur Jones enlisted Casey Viatter in his experiment and the experiment was to test one set to failure training on nautilus equipment. Really what Arthur Jones was trying to do was trying to sell nautilus equipment. And there were people there witnessing this and there was an actual study. And you got to see this, maybe Doug can look this up. Look up the Colorado Experiment, Casey Viatter or just Colorado Experiment before and after. Casey Viatter goes in there and he does this like insane one set to failure for an exercise with forced reps and superset, like really, really crazy stuff. He ended up gaining like 30 pounds of muscle while losing 15 pounds of fat or something crazy like that in like 60 days or some insane like that. And it was documented and it was real. And people bring that up all the time and say, oh, it's totally, look at that. Now how long of a period of time was that before and after there, Doug? It was a very short period of time. 28 days, he did that. He gained how much muscle and lost how much fat? 63.21 pounds of muscle mass gain according to this. Now this was documented. Now here's what a lot of people don't know. Well, here's what happened. Casey Viatter is already a pro bodybuilder in that before picture. He had stopped training and probably it speculated went off anabolic. So he had muscle memory to use, plus he went on some whatever they used back in those days, you know, deep ball deck or whatever. Then he enrolls in this thing. So he's got like crazy muscle memory. Well, and this is the point I was trying to make, right? So he would be considered an advanced lifter who was taken off. And I noticed this when I just take a couple of weeks off. So you don't even have to be off for a very long time. I right away noticed when I've been off for a few weeks or a month or two of training consistently and or that, even just being inconsistent with my volume, my volume significantly low, I'm sporadically training and just getting back up to my normal volume of training and back to eating correctly and getting the enough protein and taking calories like I should. And you get that transplant? Yeah, I get that nice little build a little bit of muscle, burn a little bit of body fat. So it is possible for that. But what you're saying is so true is that if you're somebody who's asking this question and you haven't missed a workout in two years and you're training, you know, three to five days a week and you've scaled and progressively overloaded multiple different ways. Yeah, really hard for that person to continue to build muscle and burn body fat. Most, they've gotten most of those benefits already. Next question is from Tones Verone. What are ways to mentally deal with the forever moving goalposts of your fitness goals and journey? No, I like this. This is a good, by the way, this is a transitory period that you get into when you're stuck, when you do fitness consistently long enough, right? At first, you're very motivated by the building more burning more, stronger, improved performance. At some point, you can't possibly keep improving. At some point, you'll hit a limit, right? If there were no limits, I mean, by this point, I should be able to, you know, deadlift 8,000 pounds, right? There's always going to be limits. How do you keep yourself motivated when I'm not going to build that much more muscle? I'm not going to gain that much more strength. I'm not going to burn more body fat. You have to learn to enjoy the workout for the sake of the workout itself. You have to enjoy the process and being present. It's like the man who enjoys walking is going to walk much further than the man who's walking to get to a particular point. Like if you just enjoy walking, you'll never stop. It's the destination. Yes, at some point. The journey, I should say. At some point, you have to just love doing it, just for the sake of doing it, and that'll keep you consistent forever. I also think the answer or the strategy to this is to change the walk instead of all, change the goal. You know, I think we're always so caught up in the aesthetics, right? What do I look like, right? Or how strong am I? It's like, man, there's so many neat fitness goals, health goals that you can pursue. And I mean, this at least- You do this all the time. There's a whole multitude of them out there. This is what, I mean, I have, I found this early on and I love to do this. And I switch, in fact, if anything, I have a habit of like, a new goal and I do it for a while and I'm like, I'm already ready for a new goal and I change, change a lot instead of like probably sticking with something long enough. But that's also what keeps me interested is I might go on a kick, let's say, for three months and I want to get as good as Justin or as close as I can get as good as him at swinging a May spell. And that in itself, there's a lot that goes into that. It's not simply just watching him swing it and then going and doing it every single workout. There's a lot of work I have to put into to be able to get to that ability to do that. And that's a simple goal. Or I want to watch my Turkish Get Up go from 40 pounds to 100 pounds. Or I do, now I want to build all this muscle or I want to get faster or I want to build stamina. Like I just think that it's, and I think all of that is great. It's our all great pursuits. And so instead of always getting focused on how strong are you or what do you look like, try changing the journey, try changing the path, try instead of always moving the goalpost further away, try going for a whole different goal. I totally agree. That was the direction I was going to go. It's just like, dude, there's just so many different modalities out there. There's so many different types of skills that you can acquire along this journey. It's not just build muscle, burn fat. I know that's what draws people in and that's what's the most popular. And this is what I used to struggle with so much as a trainer because I'm trying to voice that there's so many other pursuits within this industry. That could benefit you on so many different levels, like just the overall quality and articulation of your joints, the joint health, mobility, learning, something like yoga in order to then provide peace and calm and meditation in your life that you're probably lacking by pursuing these goals so aggressively for so long, maybe doing completely the opposite of what you've been doing is going to benefit. So you're not going to know that until you really step into that realm. Oh, and what's awesome and at least what's happened for me is every time I pursue one of these new goals, I learned something new about myself or I learned something new about training that way that ends up caring and benefiting something somewhere else. For example, the pursuit of the deadlift thing for me, like getting really strong on the deadlift, was purely out of like competition with Sal. I was like, oh, we just started hanging out around that time. These guys were strong in the squatting deadlift. I never even once focused. That was never a goal of mine. Okay, I'm going to make it a goal. How strong could I get in the deadlift? While I did it, I had this crazy side effect that built the best back that I've ever had. That wasn't even the goal. The goal was just to catch Sal in the deadlift. Now along the way, I got this great side effect. Same thing happened when I won the mobility kick. I was so frustrated that I had this chronic low back pain and that I couldn't break 90 degrees without my heels coming off and I lacked the ankle mobility and the hip mobility. And I remember Dr. Brink breaking me down and I was like, man, I didn't realize how much I suck. And I was like, I want to get really good at this. What ended up happening is a side effect. I ended up getting this incredibly deep squat. I can now squat less weight and I have the same or better development in my legs than what I had when I was squatting significantly more than that. So when you start pursuing these different goals, a lot of times you start to learn some new things about your body or you see how much it ends up carrying over into another goal that you may want to pursue. You guys make great points because I think people... And by the way, what you'll notice that Justin and Adam just said were all kinds of different goals. I think sometimes people get stuck in the basic goals. Get leaner, build more, get stronger, get faster. Those are all goals, but you can really narrow down to very specifics. Like I just learned this new exercise, I want to get good at it or I want to work out with more stamina or I want to see if I can work out with lighter weight and get a better pump. Like you could create lots of small... And there's literally an infinite number of goals you can create for yourself. But I do... Again, I want to make the point like if you enjoy exercise for the sake of it, you'll never stop. For me, it's extremely meditative. So it doesn't matter if I'm strong. It doesn't matter if I'm weak. It doesn't matter if what's going on in my life. I've had terrible things happen. And then my workouts become a way to help myself process. It's... I've been through times when my body feels great and strong. Now I'm training completely differently. It's a tool and it'll benefit you and it can be molded to benefit you and improve your quality of life in a tremendous amounts of ways. And when you do that, it's like it's something... And I remember I learned this from some of my old members. Like they would come in and work out and remember, how did you stay so consistent? Like, well, it's just... It makes my life better and it really doesn't matter. I'm always going to do something. And I think that's a good place to be because at some point you get older and your performance is going to decline. You could be the absolute most fit person, most consistent person. But at some point you're going to end up losing strength no matter what you do. You're going to lose endurance no matter what you do. How the hell could you possibly stay motivated at that point? It's because it's something that improves the quality of life of your life regardless. You know, along those lines, if you've never... If you haven't gone through the webinar that Justin did for Prime, so mapsprimewebinar.com. It's free. Watch it. He takes you through the three tests. Sal talking about training to enjoy the process and being more meditative and feeling better. Like, when was the last time you ever built a routine around literally all the things that your body needs to feel better? Forget getting super strong or buff or ripped. Like, I used to love doing this where do go through an assessment right there, find all your imbalances on your body, and then the way you build the routine is around the fortification sessions. It's all around things that is going to improve your posture, improve your health, and make you feel better. So you walk out of the gym and it's not like those workouts where you feel taxed and you're broken and you're sweating and you're like, oh my God, I'll be so sore the next day. You walk out of the gym and you're like, whoa, I feel so good. Like, I've never felt that good before because I've switched my mentality of the way I'm training right now. So another great pursuit, if that's all you're looking for is to feel better. I agree. Look, if you like our information, you like our content, you gotta head over to mindpumpfree.com. We have so many guides, so many free resources that we've created for you listeners right here, mindpumpfree.com. You can also find all of us on Instagram, so you can find Justin at Mind Pump Justin, me at Mind Pump Salon, Adam at Mind Pump Adam.