 Close out of the door. Yeah, just give us an office of what you did. Sure. Yes. Thank you. This is the Armstrong local home park Vermont Community Volunteer Program grants and It requires a public hearing to close the grant out first I'd like to say is thank you to the time to slide forward first through supporting this and as with many of these projects it takes a long time To get through them and we appreciate that the support was Was consistent and throughout and to help us get over some of the bumps and hurdles So thank you very much for doing that working with us on that The project is complete. I Haven't been is interested the as built and the engineering specifications for the final Underground wastewater and water systems that were redone on the property. There was also some rehab of Electrical pedestals and and and the buildings on the site The project is now complete except for the closeout of the grants and some final paperwork So we're excited to have that done and to be more in the operational mode this provides housing for 18 families in town and and 16 local home lots the great majority of which are our Home owner occupied. So it's one of the least expensive ways to own a home And you know, that's available to people We've also been able as a result of this to work with folks on energy efficiency of their homes and Turning over some of the homes that were in the worst shape and to try to find their options for them So we're happy to be able to carry on this tradition But the answer and family of course started many decades ago And to sort of keep this available as a housing source If anyone has any questions about the specifics, I'd be happy to try to answer them But that's the project in the nutshell And Everything's seated and graded and seated We had a sort of a quirky year is either too wet or too dry So we're gonna be having to do some more work some more Work in the fall, but probably the spring and we've Got an estimates from our Landscaping folks to help us beef that up in the next season It was a rough year Very nice Ask the board to consider making a slight change to the agenda what is Bringing up from old business the art and culture committee briefing which should not take very long to perform and Then at the request of work one of our committee members and the other is Board would like to add Kasella transfer station repairs to new business Our representative from Kasella agreed to attend today's meeting to provide information on what they propose To change at the transfer station That's good Okay, I'm gonna make a motion to approve agenda with the changes Calendar regular meeting minutes current tax warrant It was one change that I'd like to point out shared the information with board through email, but there was an update to the Warren sheet that was shared with you through email warrants in a pocket. We had used the previous Form and it had different names This is the updated I Know most of you on pomegranate members of the arts and culture committee that was appointed by Approved by the select board in July and first of all, I just want to thank the select board and An adult for the time measure below for for seeing the wisdom of putting this art and culture committee together I think it's going to be a real Solid contribution to making Randolph a magnet for arts and culture Sonny whole Susanna Colby Ravel and I are the first three appointed members of the committee and since July we've been actively soliciting people who are interested in Serving on the committee reflecting as was directed by the select board as broad as possible a spectrum of all you arts artists and arts organizations in the community today through those effort we've identified eleven other individuals with expressing interest in serving and We've already held one informational meeting with those folks just to kind of get acquainted and talk a little bit about the mission of the commission of the committee Adolfo advised us about the public process that was involved in officially making people committee members and we're hopeful that as the process requires those Committee opening to be warned and publicly advertised in the next Few weeks so that we can have a new fully named committee In the wake of the October select board meeting and check in the minutes of the July meeting Checking in with Adolfo on those minutes. We noted that The initial recommendation of the select board had been to have a committee of nine people representing has brought a Possible cross-section of the arts community as possible in Randolph Obviously our Initial outreach has resulted in a significant amount of interest Across the spectrum of artists in the community and so we're hopeful that the we'd like to request that the select board consider capping the committee in size at 13 rather than nine We anticipate this is going to be a committee that's going to require a significant amount of volunteer commitment and In the interest of having a broad spectrum of people on the committee and lots of worker bees moving forward We feel that moving the committee up in size to 13 rather than nine Would be appropriate particularly given the sizable number of people that have already stepped And also wanted to let you know that we have already established a regular meeting day and time and location We're going to hopefully moving forward meet the first Tuesday of each month from 5 30 to 6 30 and In lieu of having to always try and book rooms here We've reached out to Chandler and they're willing to post that meeting Tuesday of each month Chandler as seems appropriate given it's an arts and culture committee. So the only request that we have of you this evening Other than moving forward with warning the openings as required by the process is to Consider a capping the committee at 13 as opposed to nine any questions beyond that Happy to answer them. We've got a number of exciting Potential projects that people have already brought to us Including the creation of a sculpture trail, which is something that has been talked about Particularly in the wake of the Randolph region re-energized Sessions this past year and with the reappearance of the whales tails exit four and there are One or two other proposals that are already sort of on the table for us to jump on and Explore once the committee is fully So Tom are the 13 people there that you're looking at are those all different areas of the arts Yes, they are overlap like three of them are you know sculptors and two of them are musicians and that's exactly correct We have we have two sculptures an instrument maker a pair of musicians a folk dance instructor a Poet a novelist a fine woodworker And I'm sure I'm forgetting some others, but they really run the gamut of Of the creative community that we have here. We really made an effort in that regard and reaching out to people that we Identified in the community so that a whole range of perspectives Having read the paper today to Having read the paper today article about reishi Farrell I don't know that reishi was approached one of the issues with reishi is that she's out of town have you know They spend they spend a good chunk of the year down south Yeah, yeah certainly it merits approaching her warrior and John and just Seeing if they might be Interested in putting their names forward Do any other committees that have as many people So refresh my memory we talked about like terms One year two year three year rotating I don't think we got deep into it. Did we no not that I'm aware of Suzana was here at that July meeting Actually set how many would be one year two year for year The only committee I'm Yeah, it has terms, right Just conservation committee terms to decide what they want the makeup of those committees to do too, to some extent. If you said you're on until you decide to jump off. Well, for the communities that don't have any formal structure, we just reappoint annually as we did. That seems to be the point, somebody. If there's a problem or something. I don't know. Conflict. But you want to give them that opportunity. So are these one-year terms in? So it's like one year and you read out to them automatically and just want to be clear about what we're doing here. I'm not putting somebody on to life here. What are you smiling for? I don't know. I'm just throwing it out there. It's like, you know, maybe there needs to be a change sometimes. So I'm kind of just wondering, are we going to reappoint or are we going to give them terms or what are we going to do? That's kind of where I'm at. Are all the committees reappointed at town meeting day? I mean, essentially that's when the terms run. Organizational meeting after town? Right, right. Yeah, exactly. I recognize that 13 is a sizable number for a committee, but I would just again reiterate we've got this core group of members. We've got this core group of very diverse people who are interested. I don't doubt we would have any issue. If more people come in, we're already at 14 with the three of us who are already on the committee. So it could well be. And I would say there are one or two people that are sort of, I think, vacillating in their potential commitment whether they would withdraw their names before next month or not. But we really do envision this as being a working strong working committee particularly on a project-by-project basis. But nothing prevents more people from coming in. You could have set 900 million and have 20 people that are working. That's true. I guess my concern going to 13 is there's excitement of it now and all that. Two years down the road, are we going to be struggling to find people that you don't have a core number? You don't have to probably vote on much anyway? Yeah, that's a good point. You've got to get quite a few there to have. You can have alternates. That's a good point. If the board would like, we could add the item to the agenda for the next meeting and potentially have the board's interest in having more in-depth conversation about the structure of the number of candidates on the day of appointing members of the committee. I think we should at least know who these people are, the resumes, that kind of thing. So I think that would be appropriate to make that decision a little further down the road once we have some information. Maybe that roof wants to talk about it. Maybe it's some of the ones that aren't ready to make our commitment to be there. We're more interested in being at the table and helping and not being named a committee member. We have their video alternates because it seems like there's often committees where there's more people who would like to be on it than there are space. We can say as much as we like committees don't vote very much. Membership being an official member isn't really that important. What's really important is showing up and being part of the conversation. But unless people are actually official members, it seems like they tend not to engage. So maybe having people being officially appointed as alternate members can give them that official status even though they don't get to vote and you don't have to expand the size of the committee with those associated problems. On the other hand, they're free to attend every meeting as is anybody in the public. And if we don't have a quorum, then the alternates kick in and give us one. So that's an interesting approach. Is it the board's pleasure that we have each individual submit a that we've already identified submit a separate application? I've already provided, we've already provided the roster of interested people to Adolfo with just a one-line description of who they are. Maybe you have a paragraph, background, bio, something. I can work with them to put that together and just put it all in one so I know rather than put the onus on them to do it individually. Sounds great. I'd kind of like to see that. I think it's a great thing. I think if you get that much enthusiasm, it's awesome. I just want to structure that if you guys do get in a voting situation, my concern is you got too many people. It's a little hard to make decisions. There's some other things around town that work that way and I'm thinking we need to not pick the number two high but openness I think could be a good solution. Excellent. Any other questions? What time are you coming back with dinner? I'm curious. My guest might have something to say about sharing their portions with me. I'm the chief cook tonight so thank you for moving it up on the agenda. We'll see you. Thank you Tom for all your efforts. I'm happy to do it. Take care. We're going to go to new business item B since our guest owner hasn't showed up. I guess this increase in school tax rate is for you. That's where it all came from. You just voted for it, right? We put something in the paper of the complaining of your school budget. We stayed under a penny increase in the municipal tax rate this year. How cool is that? In the police district for out 17.8 cents. You said they voted for it. They put something in the paper. It wasn't us. It wasn't us. The voters voted for this. Our local agreement went up a little bit because we had some added veterans that we need to take care of. We went from 24 to 28. That was the only difference really. The rest of it was too close. So it's like we're getting the mood on it but we don't really have any choice. We're not voting to approve the school tax rate increase. So all the numbers should be a little better next year because the state is going to give us a little more money for that $20 million plan on the Hill. I don't know if I can program some. Then we have these new projects coming in works. Food. Possibly a hotel. So that should burden some. Seems like it just makes a good forward progress. Yeah. Does anybody know why I'm looking at the last page with the make comparisons? I'm looking at the two school rates the homestead and the non-residential tax rates. From 19 to 20 the school rate has gone up a lot. That's something we're just talking about. But the non-residential rate has not gone up very much. Why would that be? I thought they would go up in tandem together. They still paid for them. Does that make sense to anybody? Why don't they be sedatives? The homestead rate is based on your per pupil costs and the common level. So the per pupil cost had to go up significantly in order for the students. The town-wide non-residential education rate is not based on the per pupil cost. It's more of a set number. That's interesting. I didn't know they were treated so differently. It's getting to the point where you almost want to be a non-resident. Almost. Six Mondays in part. I'll take care of that. Look at those. The homestead rates grow a lot faster than the non-residential rate. Non-residential rates increase since the year. You want to know why people are moving out, right? That's a state-wide problem. It really is. Most towns are like us. Most of us are adopted. All those in favor? Toast, stained, anything floating under protest? Nope, that is what it is. Right, Ed? All in your life. Thanks. How wonderful it is here versus LA. I'm looking at videos from the tomb and I'm like trees, no trees. No, trees. That comes at a price. Before Ed leaves, if I could just remind the board that Ed is going to be retiring very soon. I didn't see anybody accept that. I figured if we didn't acknowledge it, it wouldn't happen. He has an outside influence here. Happy life. Is that true? I'm leaning now. Our household wants to be the opposite. Thank you, Ed. Thank you very much. If I may ask the board to consider postponing or tabling this issue from future meeting, I would like to point out that we have obtained some general information to share with you now. Nothing to really focus on until the next time the board brings up this issue. One is that over the last two years repair costs for the two trucks that we were hoping to repair are in excess of $40,000. There are some additional repairs that have not been added to the calculation that we have for cost repairs. So repair costs are considerably high for one of the reasons we're looking to replace the two trucks, but also a part of the information to share with the select boards that we can review the information as a whole as opposed to just the bit that I'm sharing with you now. The river sludge disposal payment dispute. So we have here today, we have representatives from Wind River. We also have representatives from the town. All parties that are here have been part of an ongoing conversation that goes back several months. I would like to share some information with the select board. Who'd like to hear it? I'm sorry. Good evening, my name is Mark Carroll. I'm your colleague Jay. Jay runs the Dimmick wastewater treatment which has been driven by the town. Just to give you a little background on this situation right now, the Dimmick's been in town for about 20 years. Treatment for the community in surrounding areas. We take that in and treat it and then appropriately dispose of the liquid in the solids. In the last 12 months we've been going through a lot of effort to grow that facility, increase our permit, and have people with more trucks in it providing employment locally. One of the streams we manage there is the solids. Once we take the septic end, we separate the solids and send the filtrate of the clean water to the treatment plant. The solids, we have a couple of options on how to do that. We can treat it ourselves in-house or we can send it out. At the beginning of the year, in November and December, with Suzanne and Brother Dimmick and the treatment facility, we looked at possibly finding a solution where the new modern technology that you have to treat upon is the centrifuge. It might be a better way to treat that solids and there might be some synergies with doing that. So we looked at the cost and as treating ourselves. So the group met, looked through all the costs, calculated what they thought the cost would be to take that waste treatment house and then developed a price that they presented to us. We evaluated that. Just over a penny cheaper than we could treat it ourselves. So we thought that was a reasonable approach and we started sending our solids to the treatment plant to be processed through this centrifuge. A few months later, as the plant was carefully monitoring it, they told me that the costs were higher than what was originally calculated and as soon as they did that, they notified us. We realized that is who they called us and we started adjusting our approach. So we started redirecting the majority of that back in-house and we could treat it for a much lower cost than the price that we had been proposed. Ah, let's just see. So the point that we're using here tonight is just talking about time from when we came to a agreement on the price and we started directing our solids to the treatment plant until it was notified that the costs were higher. So we had a price that was agreed, we were pursuing it, we were directing our waste material all into the town's treatment facility and once we notified we changed that part of that approach. There's a question now about back charging and we don't believe that's appropriate. We can't go back to the community and say, hey guys, we're going to pass more because our costs went up going forwards. Of course, that's understood but retroactive is what we don't think is appropriate. Just wanted to share with you. Was there an actual contract? No. But everybody agreed the price was $0.85? $0.85. $0.85. So we directed a large amount of waste through our plant to send to the town just because the agreement we had made and the price point seemed to work. So we were directing it from a larger footprint of the state into our facility to process it that way, which we wouldn't have normally done without that arrangement. As part of the town we have Cliff and the finance director and we also have Chris Chambers, the waste water superintendent who have been working with Jay, Markon, discussing the issue and essentially trying to find a mutually agreeable solution so you guys want to share your perspectives? Chris came to me at the end of May and the event that really causes to sit up and take notice was the direction of the additional sludge and of course we're behind the timeline because we don't realize that until we get the bills from the sell-off for the disposal of the sludge after it's been processed and so Chris came to me and we started examining this process and discovered of course that our costs were much higher than what was originally discussed and our understanding was that it was a preliminary rate that could be adjusted and so we got in touch with Mark and let him know that our costs were higher and we generated the bills based on those higher costs making, we used the calculation that was based on the 9% solids rate that their operator and chair of the Chris that they were obtaining. It came out later that there was some testing done along the way that indicated the sludge density is about 6.2% rather than 9%. When we found that out we didn't have anything to dispute that and so we adjusted the back billings that we had presented for that amount to reflect that lower cost of lower density. It was clearly a set rate and it was running discussion and it wasn't a very go try it out. We had a surcommission met on it a number of times and even with Robert and Suzanne they recommended to increase the lower to the 8.5% it was a beginning for it to be lower than that it was definitely no try and see how it goes because 8.5% and if you find something different then you can adjust it from that moment on which we find that. One other comment just added that the solids percentage of the reference every single month we report that to the town. We publish the issue that as an episode so that wasn't sort of a red and after the fact thing we've been doing that every month. I can share with the board that communication has been ongoing. Wood River has been very open with speaking with our team. Our team has been equally as open sharing information. Our calculations are formulas that we are using to base costs we share them with Wood River. They review them. We've also spoken with then consulted for Wood River to share our information so that they could also review our facts and confirm that we are accurate with our disseminating of information. Although we're still at an impasse there have been credits issued based on changing of the formulas based on changing of facts as they come out with the 9% sludge rate C%. So it's not that this is a it has not been contentious. It's been a point of disagreement but we're still working well. Absolutely. There's no contention here. We work very very closely. We go across and try and help out if we can share information. Very much probably one of your biggest customers into the treaty plan. So this is not contentious. And to give you an idea of how we approach it we've got these bills we didn't agree with them. We didn't stop for a second. We paid them immediately and came up and met with you guys a week later saying hey let's just work this out. So it's not contentious. It's a collaborative effort and it's just we're saying from the moment they shared with us this is a change to completely find it. But I can't go back to my customers for three months and say I need to up your bills because my costs were up. So retroactive is what I'm an issue with but going forward it's absolutely fine. So the algorithm that was used to establish this that was shared with you guys right from the beginning or was that post facto after the error was noticed? No the calculations how it was possibly determined were shared but that's often the fact. The original estimates we've done on a different calculation. Did you guys see those estimates in those calculations? Because the water it's in. Well it was originally proposed by NewTek consultants for Wind River. They proposed the rate the rate that we kind of looked at. They were actually higher than what we were looking at initially but we weren't sure and so we were kind of relying on NewTek as well because it was a big gray area for us. We didn't know what we were. So NewTek was hired by Wind River? They were hired. NewTek was hired. Your numbers were lower than that 8.5 My original numbers that I came up with but I also went I was looking at them and I don't know how to establish a rail. That's why I was kind of like I don't know. I was no one. The numbers kind of made sense. I think one of the estimates was 6 or 7 8.5 made sense because we know we can do it for 10 but it's not with less sophisticated equipment and other things like that. So 8.5 to us sounded like a very appropriate price. Plus there would be a benefit to the town as well in both parties thought that by using the thicker material in the center of views they would get drier material. It just seemed like a mutual win for both parties. So when you go to another facility somewhere to do the same thing, what are their rates? We do it in-house. Did you check with other systems? No, we just brought it back in-house. We have it at the press in our facility that we do the same thing. The town just had a technology that wasn't being utilized to the best sensibility and we had material and we just thought that if we put it together it would get down to the point they needed to be and it would work for both of us. We saw synergies. The centrifuge wants to run continuously and not front head thin enough and then combining the waste we thought we would get a drier waste better out of control. So it looked like a synergy of win-win and the pricing seemed like reasonable. So we're still planning to use it just not for the bulk of the treatment. We'll do the bulk ourselves and use it when we need to. So how did the 75-25 amount that was out of the committee? Do you know what the ration was by percentage? There was no specific rationale. The way I can imagine it is if we could treat it for 10 cents that would kind of be the 25% of the difference. So one logic would be if we could do for 10 with any of the 8.5 that difference would be kind of equivalent to the 25%. That's how I imagine it. So it's not hurting you in the end. If you could have done it for 10 cents you're still capped at that 10 cents cost in the end. You just didn't get the 20.5 savings that you... Not completely because like David said we brought material in from a further field considering that the lower price here. So if we didn't have the lower price we would have been much more taken into material or somebody else. So since we have had to change we have still brought material at the higher price. We still will but if you need to that's been a much smaller number I think last month might have been 16,000 gallons as opposed to before we brought over on the 60,000 gallons at the end of the slide. We're capturing it from all over the state of Vermont instead of processing it and just bringing it all here to push through that. Looking to Montpelier, what would they turn to? I don't know. Montpelier was previously was at 6 cents a gallon and had done some upgrades. Can someone clarify the relationships between the consultant that was originally used to help you determine the price and the various organizations? Like I'm not so quick yet with that idea. New... Was the prior owner of the business but he sold it to Wind River? Prior to Robert Dimmock. Dimmock except it was owned by was technically New Tech. That entity sold to Wind River. Okay. And it was New Tech that came up with the original? Well New Tech was involved in the negotiations of Robin. It sounds like New Tech was they were the people who had the expertise you thought to come up with a price for that. Yeah, I mean they proposed I admitted that I didn't know how to separate. I kind of did a half spreadsheet that I wasn't comfortable with and then they proposed the 8.5 cents a gallon after we realized the costs were way up. I went to Cliff and I said I don't know how to do this and he kind of guided me to get the information together and that's when we realized it was way off. Now I would point out that the biggest reason for it being so much more expensive for us to process their higher percent solids as it turned out is the older control that is enforced on us by Cassella for disposing of the solids because it has to meet their sniffer test. However that's done up there. Yeah. That has been an expense trying to find a chemical to help us visualize that that was one of the tricks and that's what really skyrocketed theirs up was because they had so much more solids that they were bringing in and I have to treat every bit of it to get the elder under control. Which isn't a factor that you know outside would have foreseen when the original calculations were possible. When a new tech came in with an 8.5 calculation they had and the Montpelier rate 7 they probably were right in the ballpark of what was seen as reasonable at the time too. Montpelier's rate is based, Montpelier has one advantage that we don't have. They have what they call primary clarifier. Everything comes in and all the sludge and stuff that settles out before it even gets treated through the rest of the system. They also have an aerobic digester that produces methane that they use for heat in their facility, electricity that type of stuff. We don't have that capability. So that's kind of where another big difference turned out to Montpelier. Unfortunately we're not comparing apples to apples in Montpelier. Your point Trini, the information that was presented to the town was in an attempt to mislead the town and it was just an attempt to use standard information that is available facilities that most municipalities have to treat these types of waste. Hours just happens to be different. We just happen to have a very different type of system. We don't know why, but I think it was just the model that was engineered a few years ago, but it's very different from what we have since learned different from the standard. In all fairness, there wasn't the knowledge really to operate it to where it needed to be. So I think that's a big difference. I think that's a big difference to what we're doing here, which also kind of threw the process off. What is the original evidence for this idea of working together comes from? The collaboration between one of our operators and one of their operators that started talking about it, and we both thought it was a good idea. They helped us when it was needed. So it's a very collaborative thing. And even in that discussion at the beginning and I know there was we kept there. The sewer committee was involved. Everybody was doing their best ability to estimate the cost. And as I say, it was even proposed to put a little higher than the estimate because we thought it might be too low. I guess that's where I'm challenged with the 75-25 rate, just like you not being able to go back and charge sewer districts to have to take this cost on the folks that didn't have any sort of involvement in this. And if it really was the best effort kind of thing by both parties, I don't know where the 75-25 comes from. Yeah, I think that was just sort of a compromise that was kind of made. Similarly, if we'd gone the other way if we'd said eight and a half and it turned out in five and a half, we wouldn't be here talking about a green bay. If it was a sort of, let's try this absolutely, the rate. That was the agreement. We've made the last year the rate. And just the price. And is it the town made money on it? No, I don't know. I would, as a business. As a business, you would. Of course, but that's the bottom. Yeah. So we're just looking for a reasonable solution to this going forward. We solved all the calculations for the last few months, but we were going to get one way with one understanding. And now there's this request for a draft plan. We're at a point where, if I could remind the board, because this is a part of an agreement and it's part of an evolving agreement, the board can have a deliberative session during the executive session to speak about it. Again, it is based on an agreement, so it is appropriate to have that conversation. We're unwritten at this point, right? That's one of the things we should be doing. Exactly. And then any decision made? The positive both sides agree to what the agreement was. Otherwise it might be a mess. No decision could be made during the executive session. After the talk, but the board may have the opportunity to discuss this. But the water wastewater committee made the recommendation to go with a 2575 split. It was a two to one. Sounds like there's like three there. There's four members on the committee. I propose the 5050 split. My idea did not come to that. Okay. We have a committee that made a recommendation. Recommendation will form based on an agreement. That's what we're talking about. I couldn't really speak to the sort of the rationale behind the 2575 that John Lantz said. I couldn't speak to him. Eva Mark, you were saying that was based on a 15, one and a half senate. I wasn't at the committee at that meeting. I was traveling that day, but I interpreted it to be that. I don't know what the volume is at that time. It's not too far from that. I don't think that was the intention. It was more of just kind of told him that. My thinking during the meeting was that everybody went into it trying to do the right thing, didn't work out, and didn't seem like anybody was really anybody's particular responsibility. Everybody was all in it together and I thought the town would could be half of it and in fact their total cost if they don't in-house at 10 cents they still got that opinion in half with the original number. So at the end of the day we were looking at $18,000 bill to winner the and if we split it minus winner of the savings the cost to the town was actually still higher when I think it was that 50-50 our biggest concern was 50-50 we weren't operating under regular conditions they brought in so much volume made it so really higher than it would have been if it had just been a normal operation and it kind of went the way it did and we went 50-50 that's one thing but we purposely drew in so much more than we would have if not for that if not for that agreement. What was the intent when you brought it in to save money on the disposal costs or to get the volume in that was seen as being we were trying to expand the content as I said earlier we just increased the permit to $20,000 a day and paid for that so we were really trying to grow that business bringing material in bringing the volumes up with all part of that strategy. And with the sludge cost is also the effluent we still pay for that to go to the plant as well so it's two costs really. You had to pay a higher cost on that side too More volume makes it higher but the scent volume is still the same. The bill from the town with the figure was higher. Am I missing something or was the agreement with 8.5 cents if the town agreed to do it for 8.5 cents then the town agreed to do it for 8.5 cents we shouldn't even be talking about an additional bill I'm missing where we really have a like to stand on an additional bill While we say that the agreement was agreed upon it doesn't sound like it was one thought it was a try and adjust but it was firm fixed Great That being said the adjustment didn't come to us until June We didn't have a problem with them noticing there was a different rate in adjusting it but once they adjusted it it went backwards from that point to when we first started So then it seems like your agreement would have been for actual cost process versus Cost plus versus firm fixed right Timing too versus firm fixed Just putting myself in the business side I don't know if I would move forward with it if I had the impression I could be back 20,000 That's it What's this word again Yeah I agree I want to take it on if they thought Everybody took on all of this right and you had how many meetings did you have to set the rate To set the rate it was a proposed rate by new tech and then we went into a water short meeting and everybody seemed to think it was a good idea but nobody really knew what we were going to do but it was also somewhat based on certain machine parameters that we didn't realize we were going to have to change as well which had the effect of things This one I understand was this is the price it was never we'll determine the price later I'm looking at the documentation that I even believe there was a later with the price exchange We kind of ended up at all for my talk about it and it was a Trump move the maintenance side of that so we ended up saying no we're not going to go with this but there was two parts to the price for the treatment and then there was the maintenance part even though we didn't go forward with the maintenance part everybody knew that the eight and a half cents was in and it didn't say eight and a half plus whether it turns out to be just eight and a half cents but at least from my interpretation I understand using that ladder and it actually fell back before it was eight and a half cents My memory is fuzzy the only thing I can say is that it was my failure for not having the agreement and memorializing right would have cleared up some of the issues that are occurred now and bring it to later I think it was from the river that put the rate in that recorded the rate I'd have to see if there's any other race to rate sewer rate established a rate I have to look at the ladder I haven't seen it in a while we also should probably look at the minutes this seems like this really is a partnership between two organizations they both went into it trying to each benefit the other and it didn't work out and it just seems like each side should share the fact that it didn't work out why should the rate players have to come up with all the money because this plan which is largely created by was there an allocation fee paid to and that's really good I think it was I think it was it was done over time it was over time it made the agreement to do it over time and then we sort of and you increased the the other charge because they brought in the additional volume and our intention is to keep the volume up that we caught up in the volume to the treatment plan so that increased bills to the counter for the regular for the water treatment with the expansion we made we brought in the charges and invested in the plan so it's going to be a step-changing contribution to the town I'm just trying to figure out I'm just trying to get to the bottom line how it came up with the 2575 split and that's the part that I'm like the YSR committee made a recommendation was there a search for a recommendation but did you guys agree to it did you agree to the 2575 2575 your guys were okay with it the water sewer committee made a recommendation so in my mind I'm not thinking I'm going to second-guess the water sewer committee here so I would probably at this point say no I think we make the move to take their recommendation and that's it and then move forward with the process I don't agree but you don't agree so I know two things one is I don't know what values there customers over our tax payers there's nothing written with two perspectives on how the rates were achieved when we write contracts and we have services like this use fees are applied and if we our use fees are more we go back we charge our customers more for those use fees if there's not then we credit the customers back with their delta I don't know I understand the business model I get it and I understand the only thing that I'm waffling on you guys made a decision to bring more in and if our bills were monthly or notice monthly we caught earlier and that impact would have been seen and their methods changed typically when something new like this you try it out and make sure it works it's all economically abandoned the economic advantage is really there in the 60,000 gallons or whatever but if we need bills for four months well we did get bills every month and we paid the bills every month and then this whatever issue was happening with the process and the cost wasn't caught until about five six months into it correct I paid all the bills as they came monthly I was billed the ramp up of the amount going in didn't hit until later in April we didn't see the effects until late in May early June January February March January February March the amount of sludge being brought to the treatment plant was not as high as significantly lower than it was in April and May so we didn't see a rising cost in those months so how can we go back and fill in for if we didn't have a rising cost we didn't see the rising cost in those months that became apparent when the volume increased we ran into one of the what happens is so percent solids that comes into the centrifuge our wastewater facility generally puts in between 0.5 and 1% up to 1.3% solids but usually we're not on the higher end we're right around 1.8 that's our average what happened was when they started initially bringing their sludge over it didn't bring our percent solids to a point where the machine was overloaded and then all of a sudden about mid to late April we started having process issues throughout the entire facility so we were chasing those and then we processed elimination and we came back to the centrifuge and we found that what they call centrate which is the byproduct water that comes back to the facility looked just like the sludge going in because the machine was being overloaded because the percent solids were too high the machine was rated from XYZ percentage which is what threw everything into a whole mix and us not having from start up the engineers were fired up and go and it was all preset and little tweaks but nothing to account for a lot higher solid floating which is what really threw things into a pickle for us then obviously the increased disposals stuff like that you started bringing more you increased your volumes in January we started bringing it in January and so when that volume increased you saw no change in the plan it wasn't enough to see on our end to see we saw a little bit of I think we had one more dumpster go out but the cost of it was it's a hard thing to gain and also when we ordered polymer polymer comes with four barrels of lac and they last several months it wasn't until then that it started getting used up a lot faster but actually it's funny we actually saved on it because we had to use it more freely but that's the time my understanding when we had the community was that everybody agrees that everybody was acting in good faith and everybody agrees that no one was doing anything that legit everybody was doing the best that they could do and just this was the result which is kind of something that blindsided everybody involved and I can't believe that but it's sounding like some of the time when they were first ramping up in January that there wasn't an additional cost to process it that the plan was handling it everything was going along good and then as they continued to ramp up at some point that cost became issued but not maybe in January well it's one of those things that different percentage one of the things that we caught was before embarking on our cost per gallon was actually very high for centrifuge one of the hopes was that overall they would bring it down and it didn't necessarily bring our cost per gallon down because of the way we were handling our stuff it was after the fact that we learned what was going on we've actually been able to drop our cost per gallon now because we were running now we're thickening it ourselves in our era we got a digestor to try and get it up to that one one and a half all the time that there's just coming in and bringing it up to almost two so that we can optimize the machine because apparently if you don't optimize it it doesn't work right nobody ever bothered to tell us that until after this was a problem but you had a brand new toy you had to figure out how to use it right but in January we actually used the same amount of polymer which is kind of one of the other big expenses overall in it and we used the same amount of polymer through the month of January, February, March that we normally did because they didn't bring it up there so actually the cost to treat per gallon for their stuff was even higher because it wasn't until after the fact when all of a sudden it thickened and we started seeing the higher disposal costs and the calculation that Cliff and I came up with takes that into a fact but we didn't see it at that time just because it was more of a physical in front of you think that we didn't see at that moment we have some time to digest this let's see the minutes I think from any little information I begin to see the letter that's being talked about in the minutes from the water sewer committee and anything that came out of them so important I can compile that information bring it to the point thanks we won't have a solution tonight sorry maybe next one stay tuned to be continued the best part of the film both for every year thank you can I ask a question oh we got these people right here what is the name for the future at this option do we need to charge more I'm sorry what does this mean for the future if we decide to do it do we need to charge more yeah we're all understanding they said the rate is 21 cents it's actually changed from the 21.6 it's been re-evaluated I believe it's 0.1815 it is 0.1815 to that point the group knows a rolling calculation I don't think there's a solution coming in here it's slowly coming in so I think we have a quick handle on that but they would give real-time information to make good decisions and provide the testing as well so everybody will have all the information we'll be able to go forward to your point, from the moment we were notified we have no problem we'll pay the rate it's just up until July and June maybe we'll be notified from that moment on as soon as we're made aware of it we're fine coming forward so the rate is not in dispute today perhaps with a group of the rate today just a few months before we were told that it's changed thank you guys thank you thank you thank you thank you oh yeah we're good see you very soon thank you so do you get all this stuff in the area maybe from water responsibility minutes maybe from the water sort of meeting so this was discussed with Robbie and everybody maybe just a very very brief discussion about this sure what we were talking about not doing this I think for this particular case they're playing in the background it's all yours this time you don't have anybody's so when I came to you before back in May I talked about what we had for a private audit the weaknesses and internal control and the transactions that have not been recorded and I strongly suggested that we make some changes that would fix that so I kind of like to talk about some of the progress my department's made on July 1st actually July 5th July 2nd I just won't have petition I renumbered the entire chart of accounts for our accounting system so that it makes more sense it's easier to use there's consistency across all of our funds so that if you've got telecommunications in one department and one fund the same numbering system is used in another fund so it all fits together and if somebody wants to know what we're spending on that particular line item I can tell you we'll push it a button so that was a massive undertaking I renumbered I deleted probably about 2,000 accounts that were no longer being used I renumbered the remaining 1600 made some mistakes along the way we got to fix a few things but it is working quite well and I think the department has really liked it and I certainly have the budget committee is going to love that they're working with it okay to your point there Perry we're resuming the budget committee meetings this month I've kind of put them off for a little while until I could get an answer to that and get some kinds of numbers that's great so all of this stuff that was called out in the audit report I've addressed about 99% of it I've still got a few things that are going on some of it is related to just how municipal, how he works with the 60-day bill which means that you have to wait until 60 days after you're ready to figure out what your tax revenue is for the prior year because anything that's not collected within the first 60 days is not considered as currently available for the prior year I don't know what else the pension information doesn't become available until November so that's not recorded but it will be before the audit gets here there's also unbilled waste and water and wastewater revenue because we build on a quarterly basis for each of the routes some of it the July billing two months is done and billed as of June 30th so we have to address for that that's been done as we speak there was a number of prior year deficits related to grant funding that's been addressed and fixed and most of it was related to the town share of money related to a grant that wasn't properly transferred into those funds so we have moved that to a place where they will actually right now for fiscal 19 you will be happy to know that I am projecting surpluses in all of the funds except the landfill fund I'm sorry the landfill fund is also a surplus I discovered that when I was thinking how did that deficit happen so it was one more adjustment that I hadn't done yet so for the future I'd like to see an audit committee and I'm going to suggest that that would be someone, a committee of probably three members or them being on the board somebody with a financial background and they know what they're looking at and they will oversee the audit rather than my office getting the reports and then holding on to what I don't think that's the proper way to go about things not very independent no is there a reason why the budget committee can't do that is there a reason why only that and I'm still blue to the process so I'm not sure how much input they have into the next year's budget and that process and so it may be a case of them that they're only one which would be problematic you know I see it as an independent there are different functions too one is just setting a budget and seeing how you track the other one actually needs to help respond when there's efficiency in your budget but in internal controls and how things are being managed those type of things it's a more of an audit committee than it is and a budget committee is putting together the numbers and recommending them to the select board having some of those discussions on how we're doing it what should we take money from to balance this and where should we be doing different things where as an audit committee is more on your financial credibility between the maps your accounting functions does that make sense one's numbers, one's more functions it might be able to be the same people it may over send about five years you know making sure that I'm doing what I'm supposed to be doing with all those doing what I'm supposed to be doing and if we're running the audit I'm being responsible for it it's kind of like a fox watch in the house so I could also add just one thing the budget committee is elected at town meeting or members elected at town meeting and the audit process is really to to make sure that the board the employer of all the town employees make sure that we're all doing our job so another benefit of having a committee of the audit appointed by the select committees because they would essentially be your arm overseeing us during our work so it would be your preference that the committee members as opposed to a general election that may not see appropriate people elected to the office so is this a committee that would form and be around just for a few weeks and be unheard until the final year generally they wouldn't have that long of a period of time if there's a problem such as what we've had with in terms of material weaknesses they would have to get involved in and that was going to be a good trust the hope would be that they only once a year but in this case they would have a life for about four years to help straighten out how grant funds were being tracked and activities that type of stuff it seems like we could find a few people for that I'm sorry I think we could probably find a few people that could be qualified for that maybe a task if they were to I'll have to deal with a few things over the course of the year a couple free weeks here and there committee would have to be advertised similar to the arts and culture committee we'd have to advertise in positions the board would then have to interview candidates during a meeting but to Perry's point we have had professionals in the town that have financial backgrounds and expertise in finances that have served in previous committees at the very end they do feel that we have the population in town to fill this committee with professionals who do this work to that end we're making changes and processes upstairs to address some of these issues with internal controls to make sure there's proper separation proper review of things before they get into accounting records and hopefully we'll be more efficient and more effective about it and getting the classifications of the expenditures right the first time instead of going back and fixing them change all the numbers it's just going to take a little time right it does take time it takes a little time to learn what the new codes are but because there's so much consistency across the funds maybe it's easier because our with the numbering scheme are very clear and easy to follow and it makes it so much easier that when you're trying to code something you look at it and say okay that was this and this one, it's this and this one I'm anxious to see it keep working and doing that really helps us use our software tools that we've got upstairs and to become more efficient more effective to be able to give better timely information to help the decision making process it's very difficult to make decisions when you don't know how much money to have you probably notice that our works are now on a bi-weekly schedule every other week we have a new warrant coming out we've tried to coordinate that with the payrolls so that we're doing all of that information at one time and we're not having multiple warrants for similar types of things we are currently working on the still working on the April storms for the damage for female reimbursements that is actually going fairly well building Morgan the highway superintendent did a great job capturing the data and I'm helping to assemble that in a manner that female wants and we've been to a number of training events for the finance department and we'll continue to do that as we learn as we go I'm pretty happy with what's going on upstairs I've had one employee retire as we know it after 33 years with the town and I continue to hope that we're going to be able to do it toward that position I'm not sure with that yet but I see some light at the end of the tunnel I can share with the board that Cliff has been just a magnificent addition to the team he's really taken the position and not to be critical of the spread association but he's really modernized the role he's brought and he's said skills that the town at this point now needs he's made it's been a heavy lift with some of the challenges that he gets to the town and he's made do with staff and we've increased her capacity for work and the culture and atmosphere and the finance department and just the town hall is just more positive so it's really been a great addition thank you questions, comments keep up the good work looking forward to the next audit sometimes you don't hear very well our current auditors I put them on notice that they are going to deliver the reports to this body and they will brief you on what they found upstairs I think that is appropriate that's the right way to go and we currently have an RFP for audit services for fiscal 21 fiscal 20 sorry we'll see where that goes I have a related question Northfield savings bank and they're handling other funds are we going to hear back from them landfill funds I thought they were going to look at what we sent them and come back with any suggestions they had they provided a proposal we're discussing the Northfield handling the town's investments yeah we had it asked if we planned to invite them to come back to address this board what they're proposing we'll define this so far we had met with them Adolfo Joyce and I met with them in July and explained to them what our visions were for how those funds should be taken care of and invested and they are making adjustments now to adopt that what we talked about was income based limited exposure to risk and also to have some equity in there as well and they are working on that we've seen the effects of that in the August statements but we're working on reconciling that thank you very much this is fire department youth training program there's someone here that board members may know chief Michael Hildebrand to talk about some of the work that he and his team have been pulling together to potentially establish a new training program within the fire station we have shared this information with the public and city's accounts and the information that is in front of you has again been vetted and shared again with the chief for his comments thank you Michael Hildebrand ran up to the fire department we are interested in starting a junior program we went down to school a couple years ago and met with a couple of classes and mentioned that we were doing it and what five or six cans flew up like hey we want to do this I'm sorry you probably graduate by the time we get it done but there was a lot of interest under 18 year olds so over the last few months we've been looking into and I had an awful contact with PLCT I talked to Jim Caring with PLCT as well he sent me 15 different documents about it so did Wayne Missouri and also I reached out to the Vermont State Firefighters Association and several of their board members sent me information about their departments and other departments in Vermont and I even got something from one of them sent me something, a model from Michigan so we put together a lot of information and we're at the point where we're ready to form a committee and talk to the other departments in town but I didn't want to go down the road if the board was like now this is a really bad idea we don't want to do it I didn't want to put in all the work and put together a 60 page document for no reason so really I'm just looking for a blessing to move forward with it it's not an approval of the final document obviously that will come back it's not more of a blessing to do the work that you're open to the suggestion and for us to put in more what ages are you looking at? 16 and 17 there are certain OSHA and VLC requirements OSHA under 18 year old can't work on a roof VLCT says they can't drive a truck so there's very narrow things that they can do but it gets involved in the fire service it's a declining enrollment across the country and we think this is a way to get people interested in doing it they can drag and roll hoses right? they can fight exactly so they can wear an air pack but they can't go in a building they can go up the ladder but they can't work on the roof and they can fight fire from an exterior standpoint which as assistant chief Ford can attest to we had a lot of people outside of the building over here we had 8 guys in the building and we had 20 guys outside the building fighting that fire so there's a lot of need for non-hazardous situations plus they can drive to the station they all got to pick them up the parents don't have to drop them off like instead of going to soccer we just go hey we're going to a fire and they can't do the part of the test right Bethel has a program they have some restraints for kids leaving school and things like that you're not looking to get out of school because the toll went off but everything else is on the table I think you got to do it because I think you need to engage these young folks and stuff like this yeah because everybody's trying to delay your mic engagement you're on my mind it's I see it so yeah you can get them involved I think there's a lot of young kids in the community that probably even the opportunity would probably jump at that I think it's good to keep kids in the community yeah exactly a lot of kids need something to be involved in that gives them a purpose yep technical school we used to have something that would tie them in with us right that doesn't have that anymore and PTC just graduated their last fire their last fire I think they're moving they're I think they may be moving the fire power power is done all the more reason to engage them can't imagine what the dance had to do thanks for taking the time 60 pages huh yeah it's about over actually many of the ones I've looked at are less than that I'm sure you can find something what's that it's going to be 60 you can find somebody to pick it up just double stick I think it's great so I guess it all kind of can gentle the bylaws and stuff I think we put this as an opportunity in the bylaws right I think we listed that as the things that we heard in the back well it's a much broader issue now because of what we just the other conversation we discovered about uh even though we have all the dear firefighter departments state law technically well not technically classifies all of your firefighters as municipal employees so now there's the issue of if state law says municipal employees are we allowed to have independent department bylaws that are separating this group from this broader, bigger conversation to have as opposed to what we had before which was just finalized for each department and having a conversation of creating a master bylaws with individual appendices for each department so they can make their own decisions but now it's entangling the issue of really municipal employees volunteer fire department that is that pops up a question participating in this or just the village I'm going to invite them to be on the committee with us to develop them probably do three from the village and one from each of the other departments unless they push for more participation but I don't think it's needed to have more than the five but they could certainly adopt it as well and utilize it okay just think of just geographically you know I'm just on the program the one program that everybody participated in the training part of it the pilot program the first year it's been it's been spring I guess in our high school we got kids from over the mountain back so I think I'm sorry about I think what I would like to do is as Adolfo mentioned about the bi-law concerns and things like that with the other departments as far as town ownership association stuff I'd like our program not to be held up for that so if we end up being in the pilot program and then sort all the other stuff out and then have another sign on but I think we can get ours done I don't think you need the bi-laws no I'm just using that as an example of our bi-laws got approved a year ago by us then we gave it to you about 20 years we don't have bi-laws officially yet that have been voted on by this board because we're the only town in the department essentially so if we do this program and then I have to wait another year I'd like to find a way to avoid doing that I'd like to see you guys moving forward as quickly as you could so not to hold it up because I feel like I haven't drafted to you of this document before your next meeting to your point do you feel that there's standing to make this independent of the bi-law process and this is two separate programs for two separate issues I want to go back to being in school I do a lot of these and you're blessed as long as the proficiency based grading is part of the evaluation battle tracker we're more simple it's faster so the next is assessment and scope of fire operations this is the topic of looking at what Randolph needs for fire services versus what we have now and how we meet those needs it's been a little challenging to get it to this point I would say but but I think we're here the back of the handout has kind of this is the draft for the committee this has been sent to the chiefs for comment basically some of the comments I got back were not germane to the topic so we're good to go what we don't have is the actual make up of the committee yet I've got the fireman's name from Randolph's center this is a committee that I think we need to put a timeline on I think we could spend years talking about this topic if we don't the scope is fairly specific here as far as we're headed and it's basically just looking at what we have and what we need and how we get there the proposal is to take members of the fire departments and some members at large looking for folks that have some background in firefighting in a rural area we do have some members of other departments that have been through similar exercises that I spoke to that are willing to come they don't want to be on the committee but they're willing to come in and talk about what they looked at, what their results were what they give us some lessons learned and ways to look at it I think it's going to require us to coordinate with Josh some he's doing the inventory of businesses to look at what the risks are where they're located Josh tonight just looking at whether we want to move forward with this under follow-up should that be really committee members or is that staff I think it's both it's going to take some work from the town staff it's going to take some work from the committee members this is probably not a committee somebody gets on just to get out of the house on a Tuesday night because there's going to be some effort put into it we're going to have to be looking at everything and I think we've got some buildings and we've got some materials in those buildings right now that we may not be the best shape to address them our building materials today are different than they were 40-50 years ago as we keep building these large structures it becomes an issue in the town but ones on the front line are the ones that are at risk if you don't give them what they need so from the fire chief's perspective, Tim, Kevin and I have had a few discussions about it and we were concerned about what would be in the study not so much the charge of the committee because at first we thought the committee was going to put together the scope force to go out to an arcade or somebody else to do the study and so there's been some confusion on our end about what the committee is actually going to do and so from us, initially the information that we had sent to Adolfo and I think it made it to the board at some point really focused on distance to an appropriate water supply and things like that so that way we could evaluate the fire services because I don't know if all of you have read the 99 Scoping Study but it's very inadequate it doesn't address the actual service or the capabilities or the fire department it was an inventory list you should train three or more times a year you should do this and that those are all things that the departments and it wasn't to my purpose useful at all period except for now I know that a couple of trucks are out of date which I probably already knew but going forward and really examining the capabilities and the needs of the community there were things like distance to an appropriate more dry hydrant two of the seven dry hydrants and these trains are no longer usable because the rivers changed or things like that have happened do we want the community to be isolated and to what degree we've got to be a certain distance with an 1800 gallon per minute pumper in order to achieve the highest iso rating how many pumpers in the town are 1800 gallons rated two of them can do it but they're not rated for it it's going into that higher gear and looking at things like that if we give the community money if we don't need three departments but we need 60 firefighters that's one way to look at it but it's not the objective and numbers way to look at it to say we still need a department here and here because this is the closest to this water supply they can get there in seven minutes but this one would take 14 minutes to get there and when you talk about building materials it's half to a third of the time from 40 years ago that you have to get out to be 20 minutes approximately to get out of your house when a fire started because you use real wood you use those things and now you're using synthetic materials that burn hotter quicker that provide more noxious smoke than just wood smoke and you have I think it's 8 to 10 minutes to get out of your house now flash over in 12 minutes and so those things are all important to consider plus you have industrial activities that we really don't have the time to go in and evaluate the MSDS for these places we do training every couple of years we do things like that, we do pre-plants but some of the materials that are being used in industrial applications now we don't want to add water to them, they get worse or you push it around, you make more smoke, you do these other things and so from our perspective I really would like that included in the study and I don't know if the committee any committee that we put together can provide that or are they just putting together the scope to go out to RFP for somebody else to provide that service to the town yeah so and I think I've read this before but I think one of my suggestions was that we politicize the goals here or the committee does one of the first meetings whoever that is it says these are the things that we're going to look at maybe that's when the fire chiefs can invite it in or something so they look these are all things that can be considered flow rates, right none of those how much water we have at the hydrant at the end of June versus how much is at the fire station and so that makes me nominate two different people to do those, you know somebody who's more technically capable versus somebody who's more aware of the service but not technically capable so if you could give us a little insight onto what is the charge of the committee then I think we can help it move it forward and you get more of a recognition of the people I understand this wasn't to generate an RFP correct this was all, it was decided to do this all in town with this committee just like with or similar to what the police community was of charge but again I think this is way more science than the police community more science than there is in the police district for sure whether it goes to an RFP and needing an consultant type service to help with it or it doesn't I think you have to have that steering committee that's going to look at these are what we got to do here's what we need to do to deliver that I think that's the level we're at right now so we need to get that first group together to flush out this is what we're trying to do how do we approach that best what do we have for resources that we can do at the town level versus what type of help do we need and then you might have subcommittees other things that oversee this type of effort you know do we need that consultant to help us with these pieces of it but not everything I don't know what the answer is I think we've got to do it and I think we've got to do it right I don't think this is something that we just go at half way because we're the one in the end we're not doing any service to anybody if we're not prepared and we don't think we share with the board we'd like to instill a sense of urgency and establish shame either steering committee or commencing a process because we do have an aged fleet and we do have several of our fire chiefs that have mentioned that they want upgrades to their vehicles but from my perspective I wouldn't be able to recommend that this life board to purchase opening vehicles if we haven't yet performed a study that can tell us whether we have sufficient equipment or not high enough with it so the longer the process takes to start the longer it is that we could tell our fire chiefs yes you need more or no you don't need more for what you need, how to move it around because what they're looking at today may not be what is really needed we may need to move the truck from one station to another type of vehicle in the fleet of it's just I don't think we know the answer right because in residential homes even the materials in residential homes burns scary you know we're building homes that are they have no wood in them and the plastic nobles quick and black it's just I think we're in a whole different world anyway that's for sure we've got 1800 houses and we've got brand new stuff it's all on the board can we get that one start a fire and the other I think this is the place to start the committee decides that you need to go to a more professional level to do an assessment do a scope and get a cost estimate for it and bring it back to the slope for the same thing I don't have any dollars to hire somebody to give us this data I can't sit in my computer and write up everything how it's going to go I've been in the firefighting world from the support side for 32 years now but I get to wash the clothes that come off the floor and some of them are pretty bad I'm all for getting started I think we need to get out so how many more people need to be nominated how many do you have that fit the gaps there's one there's one fire I think you have two but I think the request is not to be chiefs my concern is that you're setting up a committee to look at what is going on out there but not definitely need the input of the chiefs but when you form a report from the committee making recommendations to the town having the chiefs and a couple select board members sit down and give a list to the town of stuff they have to buy it really doesn't go over well I understand I just wanted to make sure I was clear on the part two and I think the chiefs will probably be there and I'm probably the other people there too I think it's definitely a topic that's got at least 60 people's attention but you know and you need it you need all that input somehow you got a harness into the working group that's going to be able to give us something better than what we got the last time do you think this timeline is reasonable six months well we can get back in six months I think it is I think if you get started going into winter it seems like you know probably just going to get a lot done kind of roll around spring like you have there's some sense of what direction we need to go in next I think that's a pretty reasonable timeline get the ball rolling we have for select board members a month play I think right there except for the center doesn't want too many village people well you're not the village look I'm not a cop you're not the village he's not the village he's rural I know I know but he's rural I'm just saying he's rural where in the member I have one in mind I'll check it out I'm going to get back to you soon I can reach out to a brain tree select board member or select board chair and ask her to make a recommendation as quick as possible so the goal is to be able to appoint this committee by the next meeting if we could at least approve the committee and then we'll get the names out there if we can get the names out ahead of time we'll soon not be the email if we start getting people together again how many of you are thinking about this I'm going to get one member for me two select board members I'm definitely wanting to do it but I have an interest I don't want to sway I don't want to have a process that's when we typically impart but not always is that a human being or something I know and then we'll get the other members make a motion to adopt the committee second it what was in favor can you say approve the randolph fire services committee it's pretty fun I guarantee in 60 pages though just for the record should be a hundred though have a good evening so Delphi you were on the police committee you want to be on this committee I'll start by the committee you're not listed here I think it's probably best if I attend the committee maybe not I don't have expertise in fire I can serve in sharing expertise with research for processes and I can be the staff for that committee there's going to be a lot of data as we look at the inventory and we'll be up and in coordinate with other folks that have been through it a few recently that have come through formal decision matrix you see what you're missing oh boy alright land use of regulations amendment the county planning commission has made a change or made an amendment that it recommends to the select board to amend the land use regulations there were several amendments that were proposed one was to change the use and use type for the Randolph village district it would be for commercial group services and also for industrial light and then also made two changes to one for a definition for the independent living facility as listed in land use regulations and then also one a change to the description of assisted living and independent living facilities in the land use regulations if the select board has any comments to make or if it would like to continue with the process the idea would be to or the process would be to set a public hearing 16 days as of today at least I know greater than 120 days to continue with the process the process was started to amend the land use regulations due to an existing non-conforming use-building Randolph that is potentially in the process of being purchased to establish a new business in the town it's under P&S right now P&S and it's getting this changed is one of the conditions of the sale if we were to select would we agree to hold the hearing before within 16 days of the day would certainly fall within the purchase and sale requirement and I believe the purchase and sale date is October the first week of October the regulations were changed so that the business could then move into the building itself so as soon as we could do the hearing it would be up on the weekend 30th of September is this the actual wording of the amendments yes the early issue is the actual wording that was given to us by I can't do the 30th of June and then on the capture on those that I may be able to get that but yeah yeah I think I understand what you think it's amazing maybe a until the end of October everything's happening everybody's doing something actually what I mean, if you're just going to hold the hearing, then you couldn't do it with anybody. I mean, I can call in too. I think the person I will be is on the 27th, September, Friday. Somebody must have mentioned that, but I missed it. That puts us pretty close. We've got to get the ad in the paper. He's thumbed on, right? We have to put it in the paper. I could send it to the Herald tomorrow for printing on the 19th. But as long as we can move that on the bulletin points in one month, it's going to be posted. So it's giving you that every day, which is why I said Monday. Monday the 30th? Yeah, we're giving that. We have a few people who'll be able to be the first. Is the first work to work for you again? October 1st. October 2nd. I'm also happy in advertising the proposed changes for a considerable amount of time now because of the planning commission's hearing. We did put the proposed changes into the Herald. We have had the language regulation draft at the clerk's office for full inspection by anyone. So, yes, we've advertised it. We had no one come in to express comments during the public. The PC's hearing, so. This amendment requires only one hearing from our government. At least one hearing. Just one hearing. If we change it, if we make a material change to it, then we have to advertise it. But later you do is better for me. I could also suggest that if this board is holding the hearing on that day, that you could also hold a special meeting following the hearing. If there aren't any changes requested, there aren't any comments, the board can then accept the changes proposed by the commission. The 21-day period starts at that day. There's a 21-day wait period that's necessary after the board amends all of these recommendations. It feels moving. But the P&S, the Purchase and Sale Agreement doesn't speak to that point. It just requires the count to take steps to change all of these recommendations. Hearing of the call late at night. Yeah, I can call in. That's fine. You can do it every time you want to. Yes. And then also are we meeting afterward or just the hearing? Yep. Okay. You get us all of you? So that's that part? So some of the typos that we've fixed. Yes, we'll make changes. Yes, then you can go. Selling. Are you here for Kasella? I am here for Kasella. My voice don't work? In all fairness, I did tell John that he would be at the end, so... If I need to go later, that's fine. No, no, no, no. I'd ask him if he didn't want to hear the whole thing, to not arrive at 5.30. And thank you for having me tonight. It's good to see you all having some fun here in the late hour. Thank you for being the last. Why do you think we're having fun? Oh, yeah? You're going to have it where you can, right? It definitely does. Anyone else need one? I like your pants, by the way. I have the same pants, I think. Okay. I'm John, skating some with Kasella. Good to see you all again. I think I was here probably about a year ago. And I came here today to talk about the Randolph Transfer Station and our intention to propose an upgrade to the facility, to the decking and the compactor area specifically. Nothing with the building. It's all on the area where the trash happens, so to speak. In talking with adult forward, Mr. Bailon, for the last couple of months about our plans, we would like to, we'd like to receive a couple of benefits here. One for us, which is very nice because it's going to ultimately pay for this upgrade, and there's not going to be a cost that we're offering here to ask you for to help out with this project. Another benefit as well would be that there's a safety component to this as well. If you've been to the facility, you know that we run a truck down there and we park it over to the left of the entrance to collect all the trash, whether it's residents or it's local haulers. That's kind of an older, archaic method that ultimately comes with an increased risk. At my division at Kasella, which I operate in the northeastern quadrant of Vermont, we have about 30 trucks a day running around. We pay over $100,000 a year in the workers' comp. The risk to our employees and ultimately the public is a very big deal for us and there's lots of business interest in making that safety cost come down. It's good for everybody to go home with all their parts and pieces as well. The transportation itself, there's been an opportunity that we noticed a couple of years ago to try to get that truck that goes down there three days a week, retired. That's ultimately where the cost, not seeing that truck and turning it into a compactor, an extra compactor for the trash to keep on the site would be what we're coming to propose. There's, as you know, I'll kind of get into these diagrams too because I think they help illuminate what I'm talking about. There's a recycling compactor on the right, as you know. There's a cardboard compactor that's 90 degrees off. We'd like to turn that one the same as the recycle to send it the same direction and then if you move to the next slot, so to speak, there would be a trash compactor of a larger size with a ramp next to it that would be about 50, 60 inches high so that small haulers could, away from residents, be able to back up that side and dump their trash directly into that compactor's hopper. We'd have a gate so that residents wouldn't be able to throw their stuff in while that's happening. Kind of the same process. You can't do both at one time and now anyways. But for that safety piece as well, we'd like to have that interlock there for people. On the residents side, we'd like to have all the parking happen on the front end for basic trash and recycling. There'd be a ramp on the right, which is six feet wide for people to walk up and the deck height would be just like it is now and that would approach the hopper of those three compactors so you could still do the recycling you could still do the cardboard and then you could go over and do the trash on the side here and the ramp would be kind of centralized per that top diagram. So that top diagram is our proposed changes to the site. The second page is a diagram of the overall site just to kind of jog your memory about where everything is and where it is in relation to everything. And then the follow on pages are the site today and I thought I'd just walk you through the pages real quick in case you had any questions about where things would lay out. And there's two more little points I wanted to hit up on as we go through those. So if you go to the first picture page from the back side of the facility, you see the back ramp walk up. So that walk up is starting to bow. The wood there is decaying, it's rotting. You can, I don't want to say it's dangerous now because it's not what it is, but looking ahead, I'm thinking about the snow loads on it. I'm thinking about the safety of that roof in the future and proposing that that goes away. That roof is nice to have. It helps cover the area and ultimately help people help us prevent slips on that ramp, but the ramp itself needs work. The roof itself either needs reinforcing or replacing. We looked at purchasing a roof to go over this project, but the cost of that was going to be a lot higher. So we are proposing that instead we're looking to minimize the walking areas so that we can help make sure it maintained in the winter especially with plowing and salting to make sure that stays safe for our attendance and for residents. That's that picture. The second picture here is we have the contractor markup on the current walkway where the new walkway would be. So as you can see there, as you look into that cardboard compactor, that's where the walkway would go a little bit further over to the trash, but right where the walkway is today. So there's not a huge change in actual location of where people would go. And then the third picture is the parking area where residents would go. And what I wanted to point out was where that staircase is over there, which we're going to get rid of staircase, because that's just one more thing to slip and fall on and really injure yourself on is that's going to be a person that's going to move toward the camera in that picture to come down probably in front of that somewhere between the camera point of view and the power panels. So it would be centralized. When you walk up, it would be centralized to those compactors. Easy to access one of the right doors of the left from the middle. And then also on this side of that ramp would be a shack, a tenant shack where our tenants could be more present in the front to be ready to take money to answer questions or to help people to make sure the material gets up the ramp as efficiently as possible. I don't really like their presence always in the garage where it is today. I feel like I'd like to have our tenants in most of their stations. Most of their transfer stations where we have backdrop offs, our attendants are much more front and center, so they're easy to access, easy to ask questions, and less of like, is anybody here? I haven't heard that concern, but generally speaking, I think it's better business to be easy to spot where help is. So that is by and large the change that we're looking to do. That includes a concrete, if you go back to the front sheet, it includes a nice large rectangular concrete pad. On that pad is built that red decking. That's all the wood in the project. Is that red decking? And then on the pad would be two new slots for the two new compactors. Is the new ramp going to be covered? Which way do we walk up the deck? No, it's not designed to be covered at this time. So you're focused on the shovel that you've assaulted? Yes, and I think by making there only one way up right now, there's the staircase in the front, which I don't like for safety reasons, and then there's the ramp in the back. But making it one way to walk up gives our people and the attendants no excuse. That one way needs to be perfectly maintained. Our guy actually did fall last year beyond that ramp, the long ramp on the parking line area. Just having to throw salt over such a large square footage. People are parking in the front and they're parking in the back, which they do now and they have been. You've got to salt and plow. I mean, we can plow, that's not a problem, but you've got to salt and shovel all that. If you miss a little spot of it, that's more risk. So our guy did fall last year. And that's one of those workers' cases that we don't want to have to deal with. We don't want him to have to deal with. It's just not good for anybody. Currently there's no way for anyone who is physically unable to climb steps to get to the trash that pulls away, or the recycling area at the very least, recycle in the wood area because the ramp that exists presently leads to two steps that have to be climbed up. And then the only other access point is four steps that have to be climbed up. So that has been an issue that has been reported to us over and over again. Somebody is disabled and they get help? Anyone that needs help is encouraged to ask for help. And also someone brought up a good idea today that we don't really employ anywhere, but I could see this being a good situation to try it out to see if it's something that works for the town and our attendance is just some carts, like a couple of trash carts or two, a recycled cart or two at the bottom of the ramp so that if we do have someone that's disabled or just really has a tough time going up the ramp or if our people are just too busy to be efficient and helping everyone in a timely manner, there's a couple ways they can just dump it into the carts and then when we get free moments in the day or at the end of the day we can wheel those up, dump them right in because we'll be at that height where you can just dump it in. Yeah, the question is currently in the truck, I assume on Saturdays or whatever day it's there, it takes the trash away. This compact, how long does the trash stay in the site? Oh, if it were in this compact that they're proposing. Based off the tonnage, it looks like it would go probably every seven to ten days. So it's a larger compactor. I mean we want to minimize the number of runs we do, but that would be by the time. And it closes up, it's in an enclosed compactor. The door is ratchet tight. And then the slug of the compactor, the actual piece that pushes the trash into the receiver box could be closed such that there's no animals that can get into or out of that package and it helps contain the message, the smell. We have these at several other towns if you'd like to consult with them and talk about it. This is all being proposed at no cost to the town. So yeah, in full disclosure, to do the construction we'd have to take out the two of the compactors. One of the compactors that's there now and we'd probably continue to run the trucks in the meantime and then put some open top boxes for recycling. That would be an option. But there would be a traffic issue during that construction process that we'd want to work through. The contractor is very adamant that they can get in there late in this month. I'm thinking that October may be finished up. I'd like that to be the case, although I'm not in the business of predicting many things and construction completion dates is definitely one of those things. The goal was to get it done before winter. Exactly. Coming here is for your approval to put the project in its concept. We would take care of the state permit. The contractor would engage you about the local permits. I think that would cover most of anything we'd need to do. Any updates you'd like. I'm not only getting ahead of myself, but I'm very excited about it. So if you have any other questions or anything, please. Go for it. I'm having a hard time reconciling. You're looking at the detail of this one. This is what we're proposing. This was a week and a half ago where we were. It's a little bit different. That decking was reduced. We really tried to get rid of the high decking, such that it was less to maintain. It's not really necessary to have it go up to the end of that truck ramp. So that's the part that we have. One of the parts that we have. Right now, if someone comes with a significant amount of garbage, just a homeowner, they can just take it out of their car and very easily shove it into the truck that's there. With this plan, we're looking at walking it up a 30-foot ramp for each bag we have to bring. It's going to be a much more cumbersome process to get trash in the hopper here and the garbage truck we have now. So if I could just preface what you will say in that it's a bit of a Wild West next to the truck. People typically park next to the truck. I'm not saying it's ideal. This is going to be a lot more time consuming for people to drop off multiple bags of trash. Well, there's two accesses. There's the walk-up ramp, which is in red, where people with one or two bags can go up that or have help with our attendance. Or if they do have a pickup truck full of stuff they want to... We can give access... It's not just specifically for any local holler. That could be anybody who's going to use it. If anyone thinks it would be easier with the load they have to go up that drive-up ramp and there'll be a curb that'll be 8-6 inches, so that worst case, their back tires will hit it and then they can't go into the actual compact or hop or something. I think it's the way to get rid of your junk car. Full smash in the trash and just dump the load. It's not going to be changed though. Treatment truck that has people gone. Okay. Thank you. That was really good. I like it. We were thinking the same thing. All right. I have one more turn. I'm unconvinced that a covered ramp is safer than a covered ramp. In the wintertime? Yeah. It sounds like more of a work. To maintain it? So the problem is we don't maintain it and we're not responsible for the insurance or the accident surf or all that. So we'll have the staff and... But we don't want our taxpayers to get hurt again. I think they'll have the staff to keep it clean. I was just throwing that out. It's hard for me to believe that. Well, it sounds like some of the decking is going away though. Do you know if the total square footage reduction increases? I'll get rid of the ramp that's there. The large ramp that's there would go away entirely. As with the land that's... We wouldn't have anyone that would need to go on the land behind it. So that's really been a large... It's like this room. It's not to maintain. If anyone's parking here, there, there, there, this all has to be... And it's a square footage. Yes, the actual decking itself is about the same as today. But the approach, being one approach, gives us complete control over making sure that we keep up with the weather. If it's still coming down on us or it's melting and freezing again. There's no excuse why we couldn't have that one ramp maintained to where there's no... There's a little minimized risk. As far as being covered, the roof's really ad-hub quick and in cost. And I originally wanted a roof over the project. But we were talking like another $30,000. And frankly, I can throw a lot of labor at the problem for $30,000. It's like about 300 square feet. Exactly. That's how you can take care of it. Versus taking care of two areas. Because when the garbage truck was there, you got to take care of that space around that truck. That's true. So it's like... I'm not seeing a big difference. Ready? I'll make a motion to approve Kasella's request for redeveloping the transportation. Thank you. For the blame. That's a favor. Bye. Bye. Thank you for your time. Really appreciate it. Thank you for being on the agenda. Appreciate it. And if you have any questions, send them to my wife, please. And I'll let you know as the contractor wants us to know what their dates are. You'll be the one to deliver it to the board. Okay. Thank you, John. Thank you. Have a great night. Good night, sir. I'm asking for the DRP's. Thank you. I got it. We'll do it. Thank you. Did you act on this? I just wanted to have a double check for the permitting portion of the funds. It may be permitting to the funds... Maybe a little... Maybe a little bit. I'll have to take a look at the requirements. I'll work with the permitting process. I just want to make sure that doesn't fall down. So this will be the new one. Oh, what is that? I've got a flashlight. Well, by God, I don't have to fix that right now. Can you fix it so it's on my computer? Hold on. I don't even know why it does that. You probably have to understand. All right. Brands, the library long career brand. $390 bucks. This is one of my favorites. Thank you, John. Thanks. This year, I knew you were going to be excited. You know what I'm going to do is stop, you know, make the recommendations as governor's office and consolidate all these little things. So try that. I only did it for an hour. You're just not spending a lot of time unless people want to discuss this. All those in favor? You don't want to talk about it? No. Fire protection task force brand. This request had been made by chief Taylor. We were not able to receive any additional information from themselves. You could ask just a post phone. It's for a future meeting. It's a relationship to try hydrogen that they're hoping to have installed at some point. That's right. That's right. Yeah. Don't look, some of the dry hydrants are dry. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Some of you repaired. Yeah. I don't know. Well, yeah, I mean, just how far are you going to dig to find more of the dry hydrants? I think there's a couple of them. Because of my reading. Northern borders grant. This is a ratification from an attachment the board had taken earlier this month. To accept the $400 and $100,000 grant. $50,000 grant. This is part of the reservoir. Oh, yes. Water service projects related to the reservoir and new wells to improve water quality. Do you need a motion with that? We do. Motion to ratify. Second. Those in favor? Aye. Aye. Post. Stained. Henry's. Forex grant. We finally received the Forex grant agreement issued by the agency of natural resources. The agreement memorializes the grant that had been awarded to the town for the work that would be performed to create new trails, new maps, free maps, essentially to continue to advertise outdoor cycling and recreation through Rasta our partner. The grant amount is for $65,000. A&R has been a good partner to the town in terms of working out crafting the agreement that is before you. There were some initial proposals to install some long-term timeframes as well as financial penalties to property owners that are going to be hosting some of the trails that are going to be built. A&R listened to the town, listened to our partner Rasta and agreed that they would eliminate those penalties and also the long-term requirements. What's in front of you for review has been crafted over the last several months and includes considerable input from Rasta and from the town. That's part of our grant agreement. Thank you. All those in favor? Aye. Aye. Opposed? Stay in it. I'll carry this. Other business? No other business for me. I'll keep it brief. Let's just say that. I'll keep it brief. Get a new piece of paper out there and take it away, right? Yeah, a small one. It says it's a automobile. Keep it brief? I'll keep it brief. All right. I have had on my to do list for quite some time to have a conversation with VTC about their EMC program and how it could potentially work to help Northfield rescue if we are to enter into a long-term agreement with them. I have a call scheduled with VTC next week so we could have a conversation about their EMC program and how it could help to augment services offered through Northfield Rescue if, again, the town is to establish an ambulance service with one field. So I'll have more to share with the board after I have that conversation. We are continuing to push direct deposit requirements to town employees, and in this case, the fire departments. We're going to be working with the chiefs to provide notification that they are classified as municipal employees and to fall into the direct deposit category. So we're having those conversations with personnel. What's the savings? Dollar amount, what's the savings, doll? What does that save to town? Because, yeah, can you even? I don't have that answer, but I can. Yeah, it'd be interesting to know. What's the real savings is for paying once a year, twice a year, that way? I think it's more about just remaining consistent with everyone in the town as opposed to individual savings for one group, but I'll give you an answer. Absolutely. East Valley days in East Randolph was held this past weekend, it was very successful. Everyone who participated, Friday was a great event. I attended, brought a friend from out of town, and they loved just seeing the community out there. The flea market as well was active in a different section, and also saw a lot of people stop by and make purchases. The planning commission is hoping to have ongoing conversations about updating the land use regulations to make sure that our land use regulations are up to date, that they are as friendly as can be, as well as land sensitive as they can be. So we're gonna continue to have those conversations. Our PC chair also asked that I share with the board that in addition to the land use regulation review, the PC is hoping to also review the sign ordinance so that our sign ordinance is also up to date and not as old as it is now. We are still in the process of searching for a zoning administrator. Working on the duties as best I can. We haven't had any issues with permits yet. I don't see us having any issues. We're actually entering a slower time for permits. We've kept up with them as best we could. Everything seems to be operating smoothly, but the search will continue. We're also exploring ways to potentially keep the zoning administrator's duties to exist in staff members so we could reassign duties and we could have the zoning administrator be full-time rather than higher. Part-time zoning administrator will only be here 20 hours a week. The zoning administrator duties could fall to someone in town who's here full-time to deal with those requests for help and potentially hire someone who can do administrative tasks to help that person. So this way you could also have a way to share that one administrative person. The zoning department as well as finance, as well as everywhere else in town halls. So it's another way to try to mainstream the way we do things in town halls while it's making sure that the zoning administrator is in town hall. But Duffin, just one thing I'd like you to keep in mind when you're talking about this is the relationship that Marty had with the place broader committee. She was really instrumental in providing technical feedback and keeping things organized and her knowledge of the system and the town was, would be hard to overstate the helpfulness of having her at those meetings. So just to keep in mind like how changing that position will affect that community. When Marty felt too position, she was actually a town engineer and a three, right. So she's town engineer and zoning administrator. I think that was the town engineer position that helped her committee. That's where she was helpful for that kind of stuff. That's what she oversaw the construction of the wastewater and highway projects and stuff was as town engineer. Unless she was a tree warden. We are hoping to have her there. Signed on. Any 911 coordinator as well? I think she's a tree warden. No, that's currently Robert Wilson. But we are exploring options or discussing ways of contracting out the town engineer duties. We have spoken to local engineering firms to ask them what typically they would charge to have like a master of human in place so we could send to them forms to review, check formulas. But if the firm... My support like Larry's talking about. Yeah, if the firm is local, we could potentially find a way to have them provide support at the meeting or through telephones. But it really depends on, you know, crafting the actual RFP that goes on the type of duties that we would like for them to perform. I have a feeling that we have budgeted throughout the multiple departments, $8,000 in total for engineering costs. I have a feeling that $8,000 will go very quickly if we were to contract out services. Plus it ensures conflict of interests that's serious for them too. So if they're the town engineer, they may not be able to bid on those jobs. Yeah, that's all right, yeah. But whatever the issue is for, whatever the path moving forward, we'll certainly look at all the committees that Marty's staff, EC, DRB, Waterways Water Committee, and if we are to hire an administrative person to do the work, they would have to be as knowledgeable with the committee structures as the person doing the job. So they could potentially serve as support staff for the committees. She also did 9-1-1-1. 9-1-1-1, that's right there. Which has been fun. You could do that in a special meeting. Pick an old hat. Stagecoach in the town have had ongoing conversations about installing, potentially installing a new stagecoach plus stop signs throughout the town. They're looking to expand service along School Street and a few other locations where they have noticed that there is an increase for their service. So we're working with them to make sure that we can put stagecoach stop signs throughout the town and not violate our existing ordinance. We reached out to e-trans to ask them if they have any guidance on installing stagecoach signs or waterways. They responded to me and said that they don't. So, unless there are any objections internally with our ordinance, we can work with them and say, okay, you can install stagecoach stop signs. Who from the town is responsible for evaluating and validating the need for the stops? Not for the stops. They don't have that function to evaluate the need for the stops. That would come from stagecoach, because they're independent and they could determine if... It's kind of a self-licking ice cream cone, though, right? Because the more stops they create, the more money they get from the grade, more funding they get. The slower the route is to let people take it too. So they want to make more stops than they have to be, but they want to make the right number. It's always a balancing act with transit on where you stop because you lose time, which stop you make. So you want the prime spots. The challenge, though, I think. Let's see if you can see the opportunity to buy a new bus and hire another person and charge more money. We watch whether they run around empty or not. Well, that's what I was asking you then. And then they got performance numbers they have to meet and if they don't meet them, then they go into a one year probation and have to evaluate and make changes to try to get that ridership. Who's looked at that? But the problem is that most towns have to approve stops that are on public streets, which the majority of them are because you don't want them right in the middle of downtown stopping in the road and those type of things. So didn't we hear they wanted to change the parking out in front of across from Du Bois and came there in the rainbow house? We did work with them. They came in and did a presentation like why that parking wasn't needed and how they wouldn't conflict with traffic and stuff. But I don't know that we want to get into it through everything that there's off. Somebody out from the highway, I'll look at it to make sure what they're putting up is an maintenance issue. Yep. The goal of sharing the information with the board today was to, if there are any comments or suggestions or objections that we could go back to them and say, you know. I was just curious how it's modern, how it did. I can tell them moving forward that they would have to work with, again, they even forwarded us that they wanted to do this, we could connect them with them for the highway department and say, if it's a problem, the four highway then, you know, we'd have to come back to the board or if there's a problem with the sheriff's department with stopping traffic in certain areas then they would have to come back to the board. But otherwise, we'll work with them. And the last thing that I have for now is that we've continued the conversation of an appointed Lister and Clerk as opposed to elected Lister, I'm sorry, not appointed Lister, but an appointed Assessor position as opposed to having the Lister's office and the appointed Treasurer Clerk. What I would like to do is in the October meeting is to select for bring more information for you to consider, more information for you to ask questions about the process. And if the board at that point would decide to continue with moving from elected Lister's and Treasurer Clerk to appointed positions, then we could potentially have three public meetings between now and the time the warrant for town meetings built in January. One could be held at the end of October, another public meeting in November and the last public meeting in December, just before the warrant is crafted. So people could have input, we could have the OCT attend, we could present different types of scenarios. But don't we wanna delay the Clerk Treasurer till? We could stagger it. Joyce did share with me that there is state statute and I don't have the statute with me, but the statute is that if the voters at town meeting authorized a change for appointed treasurer, I believe it's just a treasurer, not the clerk or it could be a combination of the two. It's a clerk. The clerk, but then 45 days, the select would have to appoint a clerk to fill the position. There could be something on the ballot that says that if we do, if the select were chooses to do both at the same time, they could say that the position is changing from elected to appointed. The position will remain Joyce Mazzucco's position until she chooses to retire next year. So that's why it's done that one time as opposed to staggered every year. There is that option. What about Samarka saying that she would be appointed to be clerk until she chose to retire? Which would be, now it is up in the air. I know she mentioned that she's trying to decide whether it would be in 2021 or sooner. Not going anywhere. Not going here. Okay. I tried, but she said no. So we could certainly do it one year, the assessor list for the second year. It could be a trigger clerk, but if we're going through the process, maybe we're doing it close to the same time. It's up to the board. I'll have more information to share with you next month. What's your plan with the Lister's office after October 1st? It was hard enough to have a second Lister step up to be appointed in Dennis. You know, we are losing it. The idea is to try to find a replacement if one is needed. Dennis says he's looking to stay as a Lister until we need him, but not long term, at least another year. And it seems like his timeline would tie in well for transitioning from an elected Lister's position to an appointed assessor position or in some capacity. A change, whether it be we appoint an assessor or he'd contract with an assessment firm. He's willing to stay with us until we make that transition. In terms of finding somebody else to fill Ed's position, it'll be a little harder to do. It was very difficult to find Dennis. Is there anything stopping us from hiring an assessor now? Budget-wise, but we do have Ed's salary as soon as he retires to use for paying an assessor. So we could do that. We could hire an assessor now, and then the problem is that in March, people say they don't want to get rid of the Lister's. They want to keep them as elected. Now, I think people understand the struggle because nobody seems to be stopping at the plate to be elected, so I can't believe the voters would hope to continue the process when it's not working. I just have to explain that clearly. If we hadn't found Dennis, he wouldn't have been able to report to the state. It took a little longer to explain. Yeah, it sounds like what this doesn't mean. Yep, and that's all I have for, it was brief, see? Well, he was pretty close. This is as long as you believe it has to be early.