 If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go Mind pump with your hosts Salda Stefano Adam Schaefer and Justin Andrews In this episode of mine pump for 15 minutes me and my beloved co-hosts have a fun discussion We talk about we're beloved Justin's chicken run. Yeah, yeah, it's cardio The chickens we talk about household rocky shores and how does Sal or Adam do any? I'm the only one that does him now Have you ever got your hands dirty and then of course we talk about keeping peace in the home Hopefully in this episode airs. We still have it Then we get a listen. Oh, and we also mention our sponsor organifi. We talk about their green juice Which is actually delicious. Can you use it for intro workouts to build hella muscle? The inception workout probably not but it's still delicious. Anyhow, if you go to organifi shop Dot-com enter the code mind pump. You'll get I think it's 20% off It is pretty much anything you want to get then we get into the questions The first question was how do we enjoy the holidays without compromising our health and fitness? I just get really drunk. Yeah, what do we do so that we don't leave the holiday looking like Santa? Next question was what are our thoughts on intro workout foods and drinks if you think I made up that word intro workout I didn't the supplement industry did the next question was what is your guys? What is our method for retaining information? So if we read something and we want to remember it so we can recite it on the show Do we just look it up on our Google phones marijuana does not help this I have a chip in my head No, there are techniques though that will help you Finally what advice do we give a new gym manager with regards to training? Trainers should they just teach them all new exercise programming or should they give them total freedom and have anarchy in the gym? find out in this episode also Are you an athlete? Do you want to be a sexy athlete? Are you neither? But you want to be both? We offer the sexy athlete bundle this includes Maps aesthetic and maps performance melded together. So it's basically two Separate fitness programs that we've designed one of them is called maps aesthetic. It's designed to train You know stage presentation athletes like bodybuilders physique competitors people are really concerned with, you know Getting symmetry to their physiques. Then we also have mass performance, which is a program for athletic performance So it's different in how their program but what we've done is we've taken both programs which seem On two sides of the spectrum and we've combined them and melded them So that we've created the sexy athlete bundle the aesthetics With the performance. So you look good, but Can you move good exactly up and it's discounted massively Because we've bundled them together if you're interested in this program or you want to look at some of our other ones Go to mind pump media.com Can you tell us about the process of the chicken run that you would call a chicken prison? In your in your history. Yeah, you built it all out. I did I I took I took it. It took me like maybe three weekends. Did you do that solo or did someone help you? No, I stood by myself. He did that Han Solo, bro. Oh Han Solo pretty legit So what yeah, what's what's going down with that like first of all? Well done the construction. It's to keep him a shit up. Stop shitting on his deck. I think yeah, man I mean that's honestly it's that and it was because I saw Courtney was Trying to figure it out and she was like kind of looking online and And and looking at posts. She was gonna set posts and all this kind of stuff and I was just like No, let me do it. She was gonna build it. Yeah, I think she's really figured out how to I already know what she does is the same thing Katrina does like she Totally gets like halfway there and like almost starts ordering it and all I'm like, whoa, whoa, whoa What are you doing? Katrina does the same when when there's something around the house that she wants done Yeah, and like she keeps reminding me like hey, could you fix the light fixture this and that? Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, she has to do start doing it. Yeah, then she'll start she'll start doing it Then I just know I feel like so you got to do it. I can't be a man and sit down and watch your woman change I'm like, you're building something and you're not involving me Not gonna happen. You got to do what I used to do. It's because you guys are your egos Of course I don't ever build a chicken run like I give two shits do what I used to do salad powers them. Yeah great job Oh, yeah, honey. Thanks. I mean the beach is sweat rack. Can you turn it down though? Like don't do the drill so much I can't watch tv Take it from me the guy that's divorced Solid advice my methods are effective Indeed Oh, you're really getting a lot of back sweat there Ticking up. I'm bro. I'll be the first to admit. I'm worse around the house, man I'm terrible with that stuff. I really am I just and I don't know what it I don't know what it is because it's a kid. We had to do we had all these chores Dude, I'd fucking chores up the ass all the time man. It was crazy. Yeah All right, my parents were smart. They they had us to treat us like slaves They had my sister and I cook in and clean it We need some more dishes and vacuuming and mowing like, you know That was like this strategy was like let's just have all these kids terrible strategy. It was a now expensive children Yeah, you could hire someone for way less. I think that's what they weren't thinking. They didn't child. They didn't think it all the way through That's what I'm saying. They didn't think sometimes I look at my kids. I'm like damn Yeah, you're expensive. Yeah, oh my paycheck dad dad wants his new car My kids started doing they started doing their their chores now. My son will wash the dishes Oh, nice. Yeah, and they make their bed every morning. Just pretty good way more than I ever did when I was at home Yeah, I get them doing as like as much as I can think of you know, do you guys sweep this wash my car So you did chores when you were a lot and Justin, did you do chores when you were a kid all the time? Yeah, you did. Yeah, but I was always going after the ones that were outside So it was chopping wood loading wood stacking stuff building things, you know I was like always trying to get out of the house because I did I did go to work on my dad and stuff But in the house I did Nothing so we yet understand is this this this is a culture. It's an old school Southern Italian culture where if especially if you're a boy Your mom does And especially if it has to do with in the house your mom does everything for you Like I didn't even know how to open a bank account when I was 18 years old Like everything ruins you they do and it did it ruined the fuck out of me Like I would I wouldn't make my bed. I want to clean my nothing What I won't clean my mom would want to like fight all my fights, you know It's like my teachers and everybody like come in like a bulldog just I'm like no I would like selectively not tell her what happened, you know some things at school because I Yes, you come in with like guns blazing. Yes. I purposely wouldn't tell my mom because she would throw down Yeah, so I had to be careful. Yeah, I had to be very careful Now when you when you got married did that change at all or because you married into an Italian woman She followed suit probably just like your mother did I assume for yeah It took me a while to really understand and learn like to do I was like clueless dude like literally clueless. Now. Is this something that you like I didn't know how to wash a dish It's like so cute. Yeah, it's not It's just terrible It's terrible You know what I used to do though This is what I used to do when my mom would wash dishes I still do to this day if I eat over my mom's house When she after dinner she'll get up and she'll start like washing the dishes and then Maybe my sisters will help put stuff away now I help and put things away and try and wash and of course she swats me away So then while she's washing dishes, I just kiss her and hug her while she does it She giggles Oh I squeeze the shit out of my mom. So does this does this work with Jessica or have you had to change? Oh, no, no, no, no, no, I do I do I do a lot more now. It's just not I live there too. It's just a strange It comes from the old world where People had the role so it wasn't like my dad didn't do anything My dad handled all the stuff that had to do with outside Or the cars or the stereotypical like manly, you know man stuff, right? So they definitely both did a lot. It wasn't like, you know, one was lazy and one, you know, did all the stuff Right, they both did it was like an agreement. Yeah, it's they both did the roles So that's where it kind of kind of comes from but Today like, you know, like I don't do my yard work I mean when I had my when I you know when I was married I had a house and I was like I just hired someone to do my lawn and do that kind of stuff if I need the car fix They go pay someone so It was just it was it was strange and I I mean now I take pride in it The funny thing is and this is really really strange. I really enjoy doing shit around the house I actually enjoy it. Really? Actually. Yeah, I do actually enjoy doing laundry And dishes and and stuff like that. I almost find it to be Meditative and therapeutic. So like while I'm doing it. I'm thinking or I don't know. It's very strange. It's interesting Very very interesting. But when I was a kid. Yeah, no No, nothing now was that something that it was just an easy transition for you There was no there was no growing pains that you went through from being a kid who Didn't have to got all his shit done then you got into Marriage or got into now a relationship where you growing pains. What do you think? I mean, that's what I'm fishing for Part of that. I mean, it was a big struggle It was a big struggle It was towards the end of my marriage that I really started to when did you take ownership and realize it was partially your own fault, right? that that was partially my own fault when Later on much much later on much later on but there were you know, I had my own resentment So it was tough to see, you know, I'm saying because you see what the other person Isn't doing or whatever if they're being a dick or whatever But no, I mean now it's like I take I take pride in doing it Which is it's very interesting because again, I was brought up in that type of environment where my brother lived at home for so long And it was funny because we would be at family functions, you know And my brother's like, you know, he'd be god how old was even he moved out? He was in his 20s for sure. He's making plenty of money And people would be like, hey, when are you gonna get your own house, dude? And he's like, why? He's like, I eat restaurant quality like better than restaurant quality food He's like, I don't have to clean anything Free rent and my mom will be right there and she'd be smiling like, yeah, he could stay as long as he want First she was like, she'd be so happy She would be so happy if he lived there until he got married like 45 year old dude. She'd be so happy if he was there Oh man That's so funny. Is it a hilarious that is funny I'm afraid for my mom and my brother just moved back in with my mom I'm afraid for the same thing because he's in his 20s right now He came back from colorado. My mom brought him in and my mom's getting ready. She's engaged and she has a marriage next year coming So I was like, you're crazy. What are you doing letting my 20-something year old brother move back in with you guys right now? Damn And they moved in with a girlfriend too. Oh, yeah. Yeah, I'm like, oh man, you're crazy. Yes, they're crazy I send like a text message over to my my mom's, you know fiance now, right and check up on him like every two weeks Hey, bro, how you doing? How you doing my crazy ass family over there? Oh, I'm good So what do you guys do around the house now? Do you guys do anything around the house? What are your bad habits so that like what do you not do that? You know, you should probably do I think let's talk about the positive first Let's talk about how good we are. Let's talk about the stuff we do do Yeah, I mean, I'm I'm the first to get on the roof and fix stuff in the house Yeah, oh in the house. So yeah, like plumbing stuff and like electrical Why are you gonna be so like manly all the time? I build because I like to build stuff because I feel like I'm doing something Uh substantial, you know, it's the little stuff that I'm I have a hard time with like all the it's the consistency Did you change? I'm very inconsistent. Did you do a lot of diaper changes? Oh, yeah Yeah, and that's what's so funny like because my dad and like his generation and all that used to give me all the shit about that, you know, like I never had to touch, you know diaper change and I was like, well, you're fucking lazy You know, like it's nothing to be proud of, you know, like I I don't know man It's a different mentality like when I was a kid. Uh, who was it? Was it my sister? It might have been my sister She was a baby and my mom went somewhere And my dad she pooped and my dad freaked out. I was like, oh, what do I do? So he's trying to change your diaper couldn't figure it out and Using using duct tape To tape the sides of the diaper and my old my my sister my other sister who's older because I have I have three younger siblings Right over everything. I have three younger siblings Some of the sister that's closest to me in age She sees what my dad's doing and she and she's a baby still she's not a baby She's still just a child, right? So she must be I'm trying to think how far in age She might have been seven or eight And my you know, my youngest sister was obviously a baby And she goes over and she goes, but by you're doing it wrong and she like pushes my dad aside and she changed your sister's diaper She did the whole thing. Yeah, my mom comes home And now when I was a baby one time my mom tells the story that I was she came home And I was just walking around naked house because my dad's like It's a game, man. Yeah, it's gonna happen. It's gonna happen. I put these papers on the floor These papers let them run around like a little puppy. Yeah, so so what do you do adam? Man, he's all trying to change the subject Katrina is so I have I have a superwife at home. So she she pretty much handles everything everything and anything There's not much that Katrina does not handle But Being in fairness to myself, right? I'm sure she would defend me and be like, that's not true. You help out blah, blah I I think that she truly handles almost everything. She's out of the two of us She's the most organized on the most scatterbrain But what I what I what I think I am good at and what I do do is I'm very Very aware and I pay pay close attention to her mood and her day and I know I know her schedule So I know if she's had a long day I know if she had a big meeting or she had something a lot on her plate or You know what she's doing for mp and stuff if she's got a bunch going on like If I recognize these things that she does then I try and pick up the slack where I know that she She will clean the house. She'll take care of the dishes. She cooks. She cleans. She does laundry She handles all that stuff. I mean we have House cleaners that come every 10 days. So, you know, it's not like there's made it's not like she's doing huge deep cleaning But you know, she'll she pretty much handles most everything even to the extent of if cars need to be fixed She's the one who sets the appointment. I typically go pick it up or take it there or pay for it or whatever But she handles booking it and setting the the calendar up for me But what I what I do do is I'll pay attention To you know, what's going on in her life and I'll relieve her of the things that she normally would do because I see She's got she's she's carrying a lot, you know, that's all um, yeah, I'm always thinking like that because You just can see opportunities to kind of help and I think that's That's the biggest thing if like she's like frazzled from having the kids and they're in a certain kind of a mood You know, I just take everybody and I leave and give her peace and in harmony for a couple hours Or like, yeah, I mean I I definitely have gotten better. I've been bad about You know dishes and um Vacuuming and stuff like that, but um, I've I've really made an effort a concerted effort to Right after everything's done just attack it and not even think about it Just I'm talking and I'm doing stuff and that's really helped and I've been a lot more consistent with it And it totally changes the atmosphere of the entire house Yeah, I try and do my best to be proactive. Of course. There are some times where Um, and you know, I could probably count on one or two hands and all the all the time We've been together where you know, I could tell she was irritated with me because maybe I wasn't helping out enough around the place So it doesn't take it doesn't take that much for me to notice when you know She's not her normal chipper self or she's got a lot on her plate or she's stressed and you know The only time it's really tough is if we both happen to be going through at the same time And this is those are those times if there's ever a time where she's just like god damn Could you fucking help me? Yeah, it kind of gives me that shit It's because I've got a ton of stress in my life a bunch of shit on my plate and then she does too So it's like or else I would be on top. Yeah, and that's and there's been a handful of times that You know, that's happened But in our relationship, you know, if she doesn't complain she doesn't bitch She doesn't ever do things like that So if she does then I know it's she's overwhelmed and that's a lot because it takes a lot to push her to that point Where she feels the need to ask me like hey, dude, could you fucking help me out here with this stuff? I'm fucking buried in laundry. I've got this going on. I gotta do this for you Yeah, that and then it's like my bad. That's why I know exactly it's it's almost the same thing It's all about like trying to get her to hang out with her friends and and go do things that she enjoys You know outside, so it's not like it's this identity of like I'm just mom and I'm stuck here and you know And I'm just doing all this shit and it's like no no get out. Enjoy yourself do something I'll just like take over and I know for the other thing too that I know that's really important in keeping a healthy home and healthy relationship for us is Just I and it's I've never trained myself like this until her to Be proactive about just little things that going out for a walk after dinner and doing she like I didn't do Shit like that before that wasn't a part of a relate anything in a relationship that I had before where I was like, you know We can really easily get caught in the hustle and bustle of keeping the house the bills going the business going all the stuff going on with Both of us that You know and I know that stuff really goes a long way with her and I think just women in general's quality time and Making the time to do something that is just kind of like whatever for a guy like go for a walk Like this this doesn't this is not very much fun or very cool or very challenging But just getting it out of the house walking down the road with her, you know in a nice night or with that I mean last night we did it with her mom That's I know those those things To her like me doing that is so much more important than me You know folding the the most recent laundry that just got done. She listens to the show, right? Yeah every episode You're attached afterwards. Actually Now that you're bringing it up. Why don't you do the laundry too? Oh, she definitely she holds it down Man, no no doubt. She's she's I've said on the show before she's the rock for sure My wife doesn't listen, so I'm good Bring the chicken Today's quaz being brought to you by chimera coffee It's the only coffee that is infused with all natural Neutropics for a cleaner calmer and more focused buzz without the crash Put the chimera link at mind pump media.com and input the discount code Mind pump a check out for 10% off. It's the motherfucking The eagle has landed quick First question is from keep up with m way How do each of you enjoy the holidays without compromising your health and fitness goals? How do you tweak your diet and fitness routines leading up to the holidays? And how do you sustain those routines through the holidays? Yeah, the the way I view holidays is uh First and foremost when you're talking about total wellness health fitness all these different things There are a lot of components that make up that make that up It's not just physical performance. Although that's in there It's not just, you know, body fat percentage and a lot of stuff, but that is in there. It's not just Um, you know physical health. There's also mental health and emotional health Uh, and some people would even say spiritual health and that You know all of that Is very very important. There isn't one piece that's more important the other and if one Falls down or if one is bad It will um take its toll on the others and sometimes the others have to kind of You know pick up the pieces or or support those other ones in supporting roles So the way I look at holidays is holidays for me is really to feed my Emotional health the the health I have with my connections with families and friends So that's the priority. So christmas comes once a year. Thanksgiving comes once a year When I'm at those events and and I'm with my family I'm not thinking to myself about my My fitness. I'm not thinking about my body fat percentage. I'm not thinking about any of that. What I'm thinking about is Connecting with the people around me now what you'll find when you go to your holidays with that mental with that That understanding or at least with that um that concept You may find because what I find when I would go to these holidays Understand this is about my family. I find myself eating less of The cookies and sugary stuff and the stuff that I know normally would bother me anyway Because you give yourself the approval to do that. That's it If I when I was it like super hardcore into fitness I would treat those holidays as like free for all And then it become it went over It would I just say I ended up the way through and I'd feel sick and I'd feel You know my stomach would hurt and I'd take a nap You know after dinner because I couldn't breathe or whatever Now when I go there and it's like it's about my family and friends I'll enjoy a few things here and there But it's not that big of a deal and I enjoy them because someone made them homemade I'm gonna taste them if it's not if it's store-bought cookies. Maybe maybe not not big deal, but I'm there to enjoy the people around me and when I I found that since I've treat since I treat the holidays that way It makes it A lot healthier physically as well Ironically very very different than what it used to be so I have A bunch of different things here because I've actually I I competed one year The day after Thanksgiving So I actually hopped on stage the day after I was driving down to the competition on Thanksgiving day So I didn't even have a Thanksgiving one year and I'll never do that again I did it because I thought it was a smart strategy and I was completely wrong I thought there's got to be nobody else if you're a pro already. I thought all All the top pros. Yeah, I thought all the top pros are at home. There's no way. Yeah, they're at home at Thanksgiving Oh, I'll fucking 25 of them showed up with All the all things now we avoid it a bunch of phonetics Yeah, so I was totally wrong by that. I thought that was a really smart strategy And I do you feel like oh, I missed that Thanksgiving with my family. Absolutely. I did You know, it was yeah, but you know, I learned a lot and there's there's certain things that I'll say that You know, this is how like you I agree sell like so at that time. I made it work I mean, fuck, could you imagine a more challenging time to compete at a competitive level than fucking Thanksgiving or the during the holidays? I mean that was very challenging and it was very doable And I I like to do things like that occasionally to stretch myself To prove to myself that I have the discipline to You know refrain from going overboard on foods and do things during the times when everybody makes the justification of Oh, I can it's the holidays and I'm just gonna fucking eat whatever So I enjoyed putting myself through that to prove that I have the mental discipline and so it taught me a lot about that But with like Sal said, you know, the holidays really are you know, it is it's it's a time for me to enjoy with my family And because because I don't compete anymore and I and I definitely remember Sacrificing some holidays for sure in birthdays Where I was in the middle of competition mode and I just didn't get to have anything really I had to be In my tupper eating in my tupperware And that uh, I didn't like that and I would never want to do that long term I don't give a shit about how important Competing is to to me or whatever at that time going forward. It would not be something that I would sacrifice Um, and but there are some things that I do do dude. I keep saying do do I said I said do do like two times today. I just got On the mind I'm noticing the same thing. I'm like, it'd be if I bring it up. It'll be so I know you did so I just caught it. I was like, why didn't it come out twice like that in one episode so I do do what I do do is I I will set up the day like okay, so I know Thanksgiving and most people I know for Thanksgiving Christmas all these holidays Normally the the big meal comes around between noon and four right somewhere in that range so I like to make sure that I either get a really good lift Or get out and do some fasted walking and cardio and burn off some and just refrain from food until the big feast is coming And then if I just enjoy myself and I'm mindful While I do it because I don't really think that people do as much damage as they think they do On the actual holiday holidays. No, it's fucking all the spiraling down afterwards It's the crazy about that. Yeah, it's not like you most people I'll tell you what especially if you do this if you fast till the big meal And then you just fucking gorged. I mean eight eat until they have to roll you out What are you gonna get five thousand six thousand calories down? Maybe not. Yeah, I don't know many people I can do that. Yeah, right So you're I mean and you're not so you're not gonna put on a pound or two pounds of fat from one holiday meal And calm down like really just shovel that shit in your mouth like just one sitting Like why don't you just eat like a reasonable person? Right? So I I think you could actually I think you can actually Really enjoy your holidays enjoy, you know, and you know, so I do little things right like I do the walking thing the fasting I eat in the order of what's best for me. So when I look at what vegetables Yeah vegetables and meats first before I start going to the gravy and mashed potatoes and the breads So I I try and fill up on the things that are giving me the most value But then I don't neglect my like if there is a dish that I just love that one of my my mom Makes the most of mate we have this recipe that's been in the family for a hundred years And it's stuffing and it's amazing and I just I'm not going without it It's like going in my plate for sure and I love her gravy So it but I make sure that I eat the other stuff first and then I enjoy that And it's like and then I get up the next morning And I don't start down the the path that everybody does and have You know Fucking the marshmallow yams for breakfast and then they wash it down with some fucking sugary drink Found that like, you know, some of your filter is gone with being nice about certain foods You know like somebody like brought some jello with a bunch of marshmallows on it and shit. I'm like Yeah, I'm not eating that Like I'm not you and it doesn't interest me. It's not even good. Yeah, my mom. It's not salad Yeah, so stop calling it salad We my mom celebrates Thanksgiving on a different on a different day because we have this blended family And she just finds it easier to I think I think so November 11th is our Thanksgiving with my family And Katrina texted my mom and said, you know, what would you like? Would you like me to bring a dish or this or that and my mom's still like, yeah, could you bring over a Um marshmallow salad or what's it called? It's called something like that, right? Jello jello jello jello marshmallow salad or whatever and Katrina's like, I don't even know what the fuck that is What is your mom want me to make? I'm like, she gave you jello marshmallow salad. We're not gonna eat that tell her no I'll tell her it's a sugary dessert that identifies as a salad. It's literally yes. It's literally It's a new pronoun For christmas. Yeah that one and the the sweet potato I'm just like man, that's just It's just candy. So yeah, I think those these are little things this year Katrina's family we we uh, we have a very very competitive basketball family game that we play So and that's after we eat so we'll eat and then do that So honestly, I can pretty much go to town on that day As long as I'm mindful The next days that follow I think that's where people really get caught up is and stay active Yeah, they have a slug. Yeah, enjoy enjoy the day. Enjoy your family, but then that's it that's it because If you go if you you know the the following days if you're just gorging yourself, it's no longer about the holiday It's no longer about the people around you and the family around you and the people that tend to have the worst Relationships with these holidays are the super strict Dieters year round. Yeah, and they treat this like this, you know, like a binge on the whole Yes, the whole cheat day mentality and that's why you know, you don't hear us talk about cheat days like ever on the show really Except in a negative kind of you know context because it's it is it's it's just this This mentality where now everything, you know, all gloves are off and I could just shove You know shovels of food down my face and you know, oh, wow weird I I I you know I gained 10 pounds this weekend I mean I sat around and just you know fell asleep and didn't do shit Thanksgiving holidays and Christmas holiday like the eating that goes on there. Isn't that different than how I actually eat year round Right, it's just I actually get to have these amazing Gourmet foods that my family make that are tradition because I still do the same thing like, you know, I will periodically Have a low calorie days that lead up to a big calorie day And I know I'll go enjoy a burger or something like that. That'll be like my You know, high calorie day where I'm enjoying these foods that I wanted and Thanksgiving is basically the same I'll treat so ramp up your metabolism so you can handle like, you know, some of this So I'm smart Leading up to that. I'm typically the days leading up to Thanksgiving I'm being very cautious of my calories and not over consuming leading into it You know fasting maybe that morning and moving around and being active and then fuck I'm having I'm enjoying the shit out of myself, man I'm not saying I'm not saying no to anything that I really want to enjoy with my family while I'm sitting there eating Yeah, and you know As far as fitness is concerned your workouts. I mean, there's really no reason to stop working out. Just keep working out It's funny that they that some people actually take that time off Yeah from their fitness as well And I think those are the same people that view their training as A job or as a punishment or you know, because I don't stop working out because I enjoy it You know, that's a really good point because that's that's the other piece that really gets everybody It's the combination of fucking off the diet and all said not lifting It's like the worst thing you could possibly do like if you actually just kept your training routine up And just was mindful that you might make use of those extra calories right sometimes We have a tradition every think every Thanksgiving where The day after Thanksgiving we have the post Thanksgiving We named this years ago post Thanksgiving Guido workout. Are you going to do that this year? Yeah, we'll do it next year down here. We might do it here or my garage. You should do it here But I would have to cut our tree No, so we me and my cousins my brother we all meet together There's anywhere between sometimes four sometimes many seven of us depending on who can make it And the day after we all meet together and we lift and we lift heavy. We talk a lot of shit It's a it's a bunch of ego lifting and joking and then we afterwards go and Eat a meal together and have a great time. So it's like a day. We get to hang out together And it's funny. We've done it now for this maybe the seventh or eighth year In a row coming up and everybody's wives and girlfriends are just like, yes, okay It's your guy time. You know what I mean? And it's cool. It's really really cool. I look forward to it I missed out last year. You did it. I wanted to come. I remember we had to go I think I had to get a tree or something at the same time But I want I want you to do it down here so we could come down. That'd be awesome Next question is from mark wools thoughts about intra workout foods and drinks You know that term intra workout? It's another made-up one. Yeah, that made-up word three workout intra workout post workout What's next now? We've sold you a supplement for before middle and after If we could only break up if we could only break up the workout into quadrants Second quadrant supplement third quadrant the thought of working out. I have to supplement There are athletes out there and there are types of training that may Benefit from intra workout supplementation intra workout Supplement is something you take During your workout who endurance athletes. That's it. I was gonna say that's it. Well, who the hell else? That's it and really it's only endurance athletes that are training You know that are doing really really long runs And that's why they have those goos and those easily digestible The only other place I could see this and I did this and I didn't do it the healthy way when I was a kid But I used to and I used to you know, if I'm being completely transparent here So I used to drink rock stars those sugar loaded ones in the middle of my workout In the middle of your work in the middle of my work out and the reason why well before my workout I'd have About about an hour or two before my workout I have a full meal Then I'd have a bar or a quick shake and then I would also eat the sugar drink in the middle of it And this was during my heydays of trying as hard as I could to gain weight And as a trainer and in my early 20s, I was burning five six thousand calories every day consistently And so I just had a hard time keeping up with calories So I tried to find anywhere I could get these liquid this liquid sugar or liquid calories And so instead of just drinking just pure water my whole workout I would go back and forth between sipping on a rock star to drinking water now I say that in complete transparency, but I'm not recommending that you do that But that's the only other place where I get where somebody would feel the need to do inch work out Is if you really struggle with Getting enough calories in your diet and I almost feel like that would that would take a I could see some sugar But like food, you know what I mean or calories in the oh, yeah, that would be tough to work out that would be tough Right, I mean I did it because drinking would be easy So here's the things some if you want to drink something that's got flavor like I mean you can do that But again, you know waters are probably your best option. I haven't done anything. I have the organized green juice is pretty good I could see maybe drinking that for a long long workout I've I've done that but not with the intention of trying to get something out of it, right? Like I actually enjoy the organized green juice like it's just a Refreshing it has that kind of minty flavor It's you know, I can put a lot of water in it and it really waters it down And I've done that before or I'll I'll do like literally, you know, 32 to 60 something ounces of water So you dilute it. Yeah, so it's diluted and it has kind of a minty flavor to it And I'm getting my stuff from my organifi, but I'm not like it's not because you're trying right I would not tell like a client who asked me like hey, well, I don't what do you think about intro And I'd be like oh take the organized green juice for your intro workout And it's going to maximize your muscle gain like I wouldn't it doesn't make a difference No, I like it. It's kind of a it's kind of a it's one of those categories of Supplements, it's kind of a myth aside from the endurance athletes You're not going to really benefit from taking anything During your workout and I know there are supplement companies. I'll tell you Drink branching amino acids prevents muscle breakdown during your workout Like here's the thing with individual amino acids When you take high doses of individual amino acids or just three like the branch chain ones You can throw Some things off in your body and there there is some evidence that high doses Of branching amino acids has a depressive effect on some people So and it might not be good So if you're drinking because I know some people that drink branch amino acids all day thinking It's gonna make them build muscle and then they feel down And they're wondering why they feel down it might be the bcaa's but Otherwise you're you're probably best drinking nothing maybe not even water You know, you're already hydrated go in your workout and just do your workout unless you're doing these super long grueling type workouts where you're gonna have to You know replenish glycogen While you're training those are like super long That's a long that's like you're running 15 miles or 20 miles It needs to be over an hour because you're not even getting you're not even threatening that high You could do high-intensity irrelevant almost an hour before you even by by the way, you know You get an in you get a growth hormone spike from Working out and if you raise insulin growth hormone drops. They're both inversely related So drinking some of that having a bunch of carbohydrates in the middle of your workout Unless again, you need the carbohydrates because you're doing the super long workout Like let's say you play like five basketball games in a row. That's different. But if you're lifting weights You want to kind of take advantage of that growth hormone spike. It burns body fat does build muscle Um drinking the sugary things in a blunt that quite a bit and you're gonna get you know an insulin spike Yeah, irony too is a lot of times the kids that are drinking are the same kids too that are pounding the pre-workout before too So you're like i'm trying to gain weight So i'm drinking this interest shake workout, but then i'm also doing a pre-workout that's overstimulating my body before i go You're gonna need Gatorade to refresh me Yeah, what a shit drink by the way I hate that they fucking the kids parents give that to the all the kids after soccer great marketing like oh, it's terrible But no, um, yeah, you got your stimulate before let's spike some cortisol Drink some sugar, you know in the middle of it. So now we're gonna spike up your insulin like what a great combination It's hilarious Next up is Jeff Sherman 22. What's your guy's method for retaining information? Oh, I forgot and punching myself in the head I used to have one. Well, let's I let's just say right out the gate. Sal's probably the best at this for sure Yeah, I definitely think what are your ways a wise one. There is I don't have Uh, I don't necessarily have a method. It's if i'm really into something So have you always did you notice where where at what point in your life as growing up? Did you put together that like you had this ability to Read something and then just remember it really well like when did someone finally tell you that or did you put it together like That it was abnormally good family members would be talking about a subject And I would know something about that subject and then everybody would look shocked And they'd be like, how did you know that and then my answer and everybody used to make they used to tease me about this Because I used to always say I don't know. I just know Because I just I just did I remember as a kid I would know these things and I didn't piece it together that something I read earlier as it got older than I started kind of thinking about this because people started pointing this out to me quite a bit And um, it's funny when I remember something actually remember what it looks like I can remember the page how I read it and where it is and I don't know if that's what helps me remember or if it's because You know because when I really get into something I get so focused on it that it it just you know, I just Retain it very well into your brain the but I will say this Um, I do know so maybe that's my default right? Maybe that's my my baseline. So my baseline may be higher Then let's say the average person for remembering things But I have found taken found techniques or things that I can do That brings it up even higher and nothing is as effective For retaining information for me than when I teach it If I learn something and teach it or talk about it, I have I will remember it And as a trainer I learned this very very quickly I would read a topic, uh, you know on a on a I'd read an article on carbohydrates or on gut health Or on hormone or something like that and because I was into that article I would talk about it to my clients and teach it to people and then that was it Well, not only that to take that a step further like refining that message even more to present to like a kid So like, you know, just just trying to explain, um, very natural things that That in the world and that they have this curiosity about it and they're asking you like a legit question about it And I'm like, oh my god, how do I explain this in a way that they're gonna understand it? And it just Then things click a little bit further for me Like I just to get it to refine down to that level has really helped, uh, like certain subjects and certain things Like I understand on a greater level that way. I have a couple things um Sal nailed one right on the head for me for sure that, um, I wasn't even thinking about till you said that and this Couldn't be more true to me and my personality and even to the point where I've actually been teased made fun of this It's even something that we make light of on the show all the time What I will do anytime I learn something especially if it like strikes a chord with me I was like, oh, fuck that's really good information. I will immediately Regurgitate it. I will definitely Say it and and a lot of times I say it and I fuck it up and it doesn't sound as good as the the first person who Gave it to me or the first time I read it right because it's the first time that I've practiced saying it It's like I just read something I learned it. I thought wow that was really good information right away I try and challenge myself to whether I share it with Katrina or family or friend or on the show or whatever it may be I'll share that information and sometimes like it flows right out I retained it really well and then sometimes I don't and sometimes it comes out and it's all kind of Messed up or I make up a word in there and it just doesn't flow right just doesn't get processed next up right And so what happens after that like people people would would tease or make fun of me or give me a hard time about And I don't let it bother me And I think that's where a lot of people they they learn or they read something or they hear something And they got the information But because they're not confident that they can they can give it the same way they received it or they read it That they just keep it in there. And I think this is a major issue with bad communicators I used to have really really intelligent people that work for me phd's masters Brilliant minds far smarter than I was And it would blow my mind how poor of trainers they were Because I thought like how does this guy who works for me who has a much higher education and experience than I do Can't do as well at this job as I can when he's got way more information because he couldn't get it off his tongue Yeah, well, I'm gonna be honest I mean I feel like I'm a little bit slow to the party as far as like having to communicate verbally like what I know And um, that's been a real Source of friction for me It's starting this podcast and like getting it like because I get on a one on one level I can coach and I can cue and that that's like my comfort zone And uh, like even going through the academic process though like I knew exactly what I had to do Study wise like look for on the test I would scan and I it was like I gamed the whole way that I would learn Because of what I expected to see and do well in excel Based off of what they were like quizzing me on and so like some of my methods for school were totally different than what I do now Like I mean for me to retain things, uh, I would study till uh, whatever I I Whatever I was like memorizing late at night I would I would just I would repeat it over and over and over and over and over and over And then first thing in the morning I'd look over at once and then boom I had it But I didn't retain it So, you know, it's you learn how to like you learn how to learn it just long enough to just long enough And a lot of people do that. I think what we're what we're really talking about right now Is that and I think this is generally true for most people Is that humans tend to learn well? Through discussion and this is probably because We evolved our ability to communicate verbally Way before we ever evolved the abstract idea of symbolism and writing of you know and writing of reading Which is extremely abstract people realize how abstract of a concept and what a mind-blowing concept that was for a human to You know, we drew pictures for a long time But to write a symbol and to assign it a sound so that you can combine different symbols together to create a word That is a that is a an extremely brilliant abstract way of thinking that obviously propelled mankind Forward but it came much further along before that it was all through Discussion and song song is the other thing one of the reasons why it's called mnemonic Learning yeah, I mean think about this like you can remember a fucking jingle or a song and know all the words to it Yeah Way easier than you can if you were just to read that list of words or whatever and without a tune behind it Dude, I use it all the time especially for organic chemistry Like I would have to literally like seeing a lot of the compounds like in my head So I could remember it because it was just like it Just so many different things from you just memorize like I was terrible at memorizing things But that totally helped it all goes back to evolution and we evolved Passing on information through song and through discussion Do you ever and so if you want to retain information and you want to use? Hacks like real hacks. These are real hacks. Like if you talk to memory experts, these are real things Is use song um and discussion and so when I mean I think when we're talking about how we learn it by teaching it Really, it's discussion, right? It's a discussion that's causing I've also I've had great success recently with the Ice that I took from Tom bill you and it every time I do it. It trips me out that Listening to uh audio books at a faster speed Actually helps me retain more. I would never think that a closer. It seems. Yeah, it seems like it would be totally opposite that Speeding the words up would make it annoying and hard to listen to and not be able to absorb it all But because it's so fast. I can't be distracted by other things I have to completely hone in and focus on what's coming in because it's coming in so fast But and so it forces me to hang on every word and repeat it in my head really quick And then I tend to retain so much of it where it now if I listen uh and a One speed and it's just like the speed of us talking right now I can trail off because I feel like I can think about other stuff Yeah, I can I can listen I can listen and think about other stuff Which I feel like because of that it takes away from the information that I'm listening to So that was a big hack for me that has helped me out But 100 the after you get information Sharing it right afterwards and and I think Yeah, it would be if you're in college like you can even literally read a chapter And then call your friend and or your girlfriend or your boyfriend and Share what you just learned. Yeah, just talk to him about what you just read Which won't take you very long 15 to 30 minutes, but it's it'll blow you away It'll blow you out how much more effective it is in the old way of you know Trying to write things down and take notes for sure. This is this is me all the way Like that's how I've had and then like I said, I just you're going to fuck it up sometimes And it's not going to come out like you just can't let that Make you feel insecure because oh it didn't sound perfect or I forgot this stat or like that It's like, you know, sometimes when you practice, you know sharing information after you've just learned it Sometimes you will you'll flesh it out. Yeah, and what I would do what I would do is every time I would do that Right because it's inevitable. That's going to happen. I'm gonna I'm going to read something That's kind of maybe it's a heavy topic and I'm going to miss some things Then that makes me want to go dive back into it, right? So I share it Mess a few things up make me go back relearn it again and then by that time it's like it's completely The other thing too I want to touch on before you move to the next question is When it comes to retaining information sometimes you have to make space For new information and I don't mean you need to forget something else Literally like, you know, I got a race, you know, my brain so I can But what I mean by making space is if your mind is preoccupied with you know Anxiety or stress and you're having repetitive thoughts about something or you're just stressed out about the day or whatever If you can't handle that it'll be very difficult for you to remember anything So sometimes sitting quietly meditating going for a walk doing things that kind of make space Will help you retain the information I wonder if we all have this individual ability in walking to really helps me That's actually that's a good idea. Yeah, moving. Yeah moving and doing stuff is actually huge Yeah, because what uh, I forgot some I was talking to somebody they were talking about how When you're moving your body you're preoccupying certain parts of your brain And it allows the other parts to be more open and free to remember And that's why it's a creativity tool tool To you ever notice how you come up with some of your best ideas while you're doing things or moving I was fascinated with I mean, I just read not that long ago in this uh, this new book that I'm reading subliminal About that 95 percent of the information that we download in the day is actually subconscious and we don't even realize it like So that's that's 95 do so most most the information our brain is downloading and processing We it's subconsciously happening. You're you are literally this freaks me out You are literally living in a tiny piece of what's really happening, right? I know That's so you're not even processing it like I bet you we don't even see like a fraction of what's in front of us No, no, not at all. I mean right now. There's a part of my eye. That's looking at something over the left right now It's downloaded that information and it's processed a guy in a clown suit like the whole time Well, it's it's it's pretty crazy. But yeah, shit's happening all around you and you're so unaware Well, this is my you're living in a dream This is my theory on why when you go places like Yosemite or you go to these like what they say Take your breath away type scenery places. It's just like overload. Well, it is it's it's How often are you in a space where from completely everywhere from the left to the right to the top to the bottom You're paying attention. You're paying attention and you're downloading beauty Like that's just rare when you think about it. That's what makes I think the take the breath away part because We're so used to like this the scene that we're sitting in right now. Okay, we got 600 something episodes deepness I've seen Doug over there a million times. I've seen you there there. I've seen all these things in here So it's not take your breath away. It's like I've already downloaded in process. I'm wearing something Might spice it up just right come on man. That's I think that's a challenge actually Next question is from get fit with Miranda What advice would you give to a new gym manager with regards to training trainers? Do I go in and change the way they train or do I introduce them to maps programming? And hope they take from it allowing them freedom So a new gym manager freedom. It's a tough question right here Very tough question because on one hand when you first walk into a gym, you need to set the tone immediately fire everybody No, you need to set the tone immediately because I used to say that when you first walk into a gym Or or a business or you know managing own culture And you're all of a sudden like this super nice And I'm going to be very hard to be an asshole after that very hard to get hard after that If you walk in and you're like, all right, here's the deal. This is what's happening There's a it afterwards it's it's you can be you can throw that out every once Why you can bring that up But the other side of it too is you want to develop a good connection with these people You want to earn their trust now with trainers Really if you want to spend a lot of time with them in in ways that are going to see that they're going to see A huge impact and how they train and and how they build their business You're going to focus a lot of time on how they communicate far more than how they train However, it is important. I used to notice this as a as a manager I would do for every I would do let's say I did 10 meetings a month with my trainers It would be You know, I don't know six would be on communicating better and organizing your business and all that stuff But four would be on better training and the reason why I would put those four Those four, you know meetings for better training was of course, I want to teach my trainers because they loved it That was the second one. They didn't necessarily get a huge amount out of it Like they would at least if they were good Like they did with the communication But I did it because trainers love those meetings traders are usually you have them come in and you're going to talk about communication They're like, I don't care. I just want to train people Um, so that's those are those are my pieces of advice. I'm going to I'm going to be a little bit different I'm going to tell you to fire everybody I'm fucking serious too. And I wish I remember what book I can give you. They're going to get fired. They're going to get themselves fired But Adam said to fire the whole staff. Let me let me tell you. I wish I remember the book to Have to do that sometimes I'll try to well most times As a matter of fact 90 of the time you will have to fire and here's the deal and I and that's so tough to tell somebody who's going into the position that you're going into right now because Of course that sounds scary as fuck to go in and handle a facility And then you're going to let go everybody and obviously you can't fire everybody on the same day right away But eventually more than likely if you're going to be very successful at what you're doing They'll all end up probably being your people down the road and think of it like this And I don't know if you're a parent or not I'm not but I can still give this analogy That coming into a gym and this is something I'm very familiar with in adopting a Somebody else's staff is like being a mom or a parent and taking on 15 17 year olds That are somebody else's kid. That's what you got. You just got you just inherited 15 15 year olds that were somebody else's kid and now you got to teach them life And imagine is it possible? Sure. There's some people that were cut out for that There are some people that could take somebody else's children A whole bunch of them with different personalities that you didn't raise and get them midway through their life And actually make an impact on them. I absolutely think that's possible But it is fucking rare and the likelihood of it is very small Most of them have they they are going to have What they have learned from the the manager before and potentially before that That has really shaped and formed them into the trainer. They currently are right now And that is really tough to do when you're coming in to lead a facility and you want to create your own culture So and for the first half of my career, I didn't do this the first half of my career I came in and I could outperform the guy or girl before me because I just had this ability to come in I had a lot of energy. I was really talented at the at my own job And I basically had this idea of I'm going to come into this club And I'm going to run so fast these trainers have never seen a boss before run at this level And the few there will be a few that will be inspired by it and they'll jump on board with me And then together the three or four or five of us would crush goal and we would have a successful business And then the rest of them would would eventually wean themselves or weed themselves out Or I would end up self-imploding because I'm just trying so hard to carry this On this entire thing on my back. It wasn't till later in my career And I can't remember what book it was that made the difference for me Where I in there suggested that you know, you if you're going to be successful They've got to be your people and your culture And it was one of the scariest things I ever did was to come into a facility and fire And I didn't do it on one day. I ended up letting go. I had 20 something trainers And I got rid of 15 within the first three months that I was there And I kept the for the major solid four or five that you know, definitely got scared when they saw people getting let go of And I had a rough month or two because I'm understaffed and but we didn't really take that much of a dip It was pretty surprising for how much I cut as far as staffing was we still maintained about the same revenue They were doing with without the 15 trainers and then once I got my people people that I hired that I trained Um, then it was so much easier to run the facility So I know that sounds harsh to come in and do that But the sooner you get your people and the sooner they're they're yours and you because imagine if you Well, we got to give them some advice on how to make that Manageable because you can imagine someone walking into a gym. It's owned by someone else Right. They can't maybe they can't fire everybody. That sucks. Yeah, so but What you can do usually is replace them and what I mean by that is bring some on board And then slowly bring others right actively. Yeah, you know, you're fine You're looking for the recruits which that should be right away I'm recruiting if I'm if I'm being handcuffed by upper management, which I've been in this situation to where You're kind of new and they're not going to let you come in. They think you're crazy. You're going to come in and fire everybody Uh, and they're saying no way you can do that. Then like sal said I'm I'm out looking for everybody's replacement right away I'm not and I think this is a mistake that Managers make when they come in as they come in they try and mold the staff that's currently there and change them and motivate Them and get them to run instead of running their programs now. They're running maps It's like all that you're going to get you're going to get people to hate you for that They're going to push back on you and trainers have major egos So trying to tell some smart trainer how he's going to program or how she's going to program You're looking for uh a lot of they'll get a lot of You know, what's going on based off of that like you're putting all this attention into these new trainers You're bringing in and you're you know, you're really taking your time to to develop a what kind of a culture you Want with this person and they'll see that and they'll watch it because like he said it's it's just not It's not something that uh people that are already there that have their own way of doing things It's such an ego driven Job for the most part that a lot of these guys are going to give like nothing but push back the entire time So just kind of build your little army and then you know, you never know You might actually get some of those like smart trainers that will see what you're doing and start contributing Well, do you do you remember do you remember that you went through this with me? So When I hired you a you and nick at hillsdale and I took nick you and coran Is that all and ronnie right? Yeah, nick you coran and ronnie ronnie came later. But yeah I came I took all four of you from hillsdale with me to sanatrisa And that was it I had four people that were mine that were all people that I hired trained and developed from the beginning And justin was part of this I then they then put me over in sanatrisa. So it's a brand new club. They had like 15 trainers I'm coming over with four of mine and a better at like 10 of their trainers And what did that what ended up the staff that was killer where any of them left? I don't think we had any none of We had like maybe one but yeah, and what we ended up doing was just I you know I came over so I already had four that kind of knew my philosophy that had my culture And and I would I then slowly started to Get rid of all that now that I think about it. I've definitely I definitely would fire at least Two or three that was probably the average two or three walking into a gym But you know, I I was a gm for a lot longer than I was an fm. So I'd have these You know these big staffs and I would place pressure on the fm sometimes to make some of those decisions Who's the fitness manager to to to get rid of the trainers? Because as a gm Um, I had to be careful sometimes with how you take away, you know Some people's powers and if you did have a good another good leader in your gym Like if I had you Shit and that would have been an amazing team because now you've got you've got you know Some powerful leaders in the gym. It wouldn't it wouldn't be a problem But you know one thing I used to do when I used to train the trainers For training or for exercise is it wasn't so much? Sometimes it'd be a seminar But but it would be something that I would teach that I knew that they'd never heard of But other times it would it was a discussion and we'd sit down and I'd have a trainer that I knew was really good at Whatever whether it be olympic lifting or correctional exercise and they would teach the class And then people would learn and listen and I mean and then you would see some you would see some excitement come out of that But if I could go back and be in the her shoes. I think it was a girl right in her shoes And my mind pump existed 100% This is what I would do totally do this because there's no way I'm going to be able to come into a staff of trainers and tell them how they're going to program their clients They would fucking throw a fit like talk about shaking their world upside down and getting a lot of enemies right away But if that's my desired outcome like if my true desired outcome is I do want all these trainers teaching maps because I do know It's superior and the clients will get more results. How do I go about that? Well, what I would do Especially since you're a listener Is when you come across episodes that really strike a chord or that really make a lot of sense to you And we we convey that message really well or potentially better than how you could potentially Convey it to your clients is I would assign it I was like I would assign listening to it and I would and then I would say hey you guys here's here's an episode I want you to a podcast episode We have a meeting next friday if everybody is sometime between now and then listen to the And we'll discuss it perfect right and then you have an open discussion about it Then it's you know, then they what you're doing is you're empowering them and you're also stimulating Growth right because now everybody's discussing fitness. They're talking about concepts. They're talking about, you know Different ways of training people and you're going to have some debate in amongst your trainers, right? And it's going to just it's going to get everybody just to kind of You know grow from there so learn from it and that strategy reminds me of one that I did probably eight years in or so into my career And we had what we used to call a fitness budget where I was allocated, you know $5,000 a month of revenue that I could spend on my trainers Which what we call floor hours where they would walk the floor and try and book people Well, you know the idea is that that $5,000 of floor hours would then convert into $10,000 of new business if I manage my staff correctly and So at this time I I was really focused on education in my in my facility Because I had just recently seen a stat in the company that for every national certification that a trainer got that they're they're uh Uh, what do you call that how long they stayed in the company for retention? Yeah, their retention in the company was you know, it would every national cert added one to three years And if they had three national certifications or more, which would consider them back then a master trainer They uh, their amount of revenue they produced the amount of hours they serve It was so mind-blowing to me. I was like, how did this information just now make its way to me I remember when you did that and uh, how powerful that was because Now what you're doing is you're emphasizing like how they can improve be better But also like one thing I did remember when you know, you're managing us was Uh, just always pointing out like holes of where you could be making money and monetizing off of that And that was one of those things like if you had uh, you know X amount of certifications Now you're at this level of pay grade and it's just like it was like a no-brainer You know like but a lot of these trainers. They just get into their own little Um, you know like like they create their own environment They don't like consider all these different ways to to to maximize what they're doing in there. So so we I'd literally Paid the trainers to study which was totally against the rules. I wasn't supposed to be able to do that But it was think about it though. Why not? I know right? Yeah, well, that's I mean the business mind of mine I'm the one like it makes total sense to do this because it's going to be worth it, you know So totally fireable Yeah, right for reals. No, absolutely. Yeah 100 percent. I mean, that's obviously I made your corporate kind of yeah Yeah, no in a corporate setting I could have easily been if that was anybody else. I'm sure they could have got fired for that same situation So I'm not telling you go do something get you fired the point of the story though Is what an impact it made and I my desired outcome was to get them all more educated Had I gone about it by saying get your national certifications, which I had been preaching that for years before Nobody did it So what I did was I provided a place every Friday and it was two hours And I would and I had two of my trainers that were already master trainers. They both had their degrees They all they all had they had three national certifications They taught the other trainers the first level of certification And then after they got the first level then they taught the second level And so it was them teaching each other and learning and getting paid to learn and get themselves paid more And it just after that staff it was we were unstoppable after that that was probably Yeah, it's team building right there huge. Absolutely Check it out. 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