 I'm Joshua Cooper and welcome to Cooper Union. What's happening with human rights around our world on Think Tech Live broadcasting from our downtown studio in Honolulu, Hawaii, and Moana, Nuiakea. Today we're looking at freedom of peaceful assembly and association of West Papua actualizing UDHR Article 20 in the Asia Pacific. Today we're fortunate enough to be joined by an amazing activist who is very much dedicated to the important issue of freedom of assembly and association. Rudy, thank you so much for joining us. Thank you, Joseph, for the time. Can you share with me why is this issue of peaceful assembly and association so important in international human rights law, especially where you live? Yeah, thank you very much for the time. And currently in West Papua the freedom of assembly is being, I think, that is often denied by these states. It is important to fulfill and protect because from that bottom we can understand what the people need. I mean, if you let the people assemble it and if you let the people express what they want, then you can solve the problem. I think that is the basic right of human rights where the citizens can participate in the in the policymaking and in the development progress of a state. So we cannot deny that right. So I think it's very important, as mostly with West Indigenous people, so we need more interaction. No, you really covered it so well. It's a freedom of assembly and it's paramount that if we don't have freedom of assembly, then the people can't come together, can't have conversations, can't discuss, but also can't coordinate in a way campaigns to then actualize these 30 articles of the universal declaration of human rights. And I thought the point you made that was so crucial is also how every human right is interconnected, that there's freedom of thought, conscience, and religion, which of course you could share with us a bit about unique aspects as Indigenous peoples that West Papuans are. That's important, but then freedom of speech to be able to share those ideas together, but then of course most importantly that element of self-determination and to actually assemble together and coordinate. Can you share with me what first inspired you to care about this issue so much and some of the first campaigns you've been involved with around freedom of assembly? Yeah, so what inspired me is the story of my parents is the story of my mothers that they tell me how it's difficult for West Papuan people to gather and to express what they think, what they feel, or what they have been through in their life. So that is what inspired me to promote what the people need. So that is why as we know maybe there are a lot of human rights audiences in West Papua and when the time we are trying to express it, it gets bent by the state, it gets oppressed by the force. So I think it's just something that we need to take more voice. So up according to the stories of my parents, up according to their past experience, that is the things that inspired me the most. And for my first enforcement to promote human rights violation is when I you know, conducting a rally to make a campaign in social media about human rights violations that is going on in West Papua for the example, like the case of Mukile or that they may remember Mukile forced in East Papuan that has happened several years ago. So that is my first where I will assemble the people to protest. And finally the perpetrators are brought to court for life sentence. And yeah, I think it's very important in Kursil to assembly and to express our opinion. Thank you. And you're really bringing up something that's so vital. It's something that most people almost think is part of everyone's life to be able to assemble. Can you maybe share also a little bit more though about West Papua culture, about the history and how we got to where we are today. But more importantly also what people in West Papua are doing on a daily basis to actualize Article 20. Yes, so for the for the history of West Papua itself, we are for the first in 18th we are colonized by the Dats by the Dats and then it's and then it's give to Indonesia through a free choice for 1969 where mostly West Papuan people think that it was that it was full of violence, full of fraud. So that is why it was for one people are still fighting for their right to self determination. And we're in West Papua, we are still living a culture of in a in a culture of indigenous people like we use the land we we are described the land as a mother with the source of our life. And that is totally opposite with what the government will commit today. They just destroyed the forest and didn't have much conversation or relation with indigenous people with West Papuan people. So it is sometimes it is sometimes fair to be sometimes so far from what West Papua indigenous people people need. And that is the things that become the problems today in West Papua. And mostly West Papua you you would purpose like me, we are trying to build such a movement like we are promoting a peaceful demonstration and peaceful peaceful approach to the to the conflict to be solved by the government by addressing the the core the core thing is human rights where we are all have the the rights to be free or and the rights to be the rights to to determine what we would be in the in the in the future. So there are a lot of things we we have done. Like we make a we make a lot of organizations such as Papuan speak on the on the Instagram and some there are so many different society of indigenous Papua that created by the young Papuan. So yeah I think we are we have started to uh yeah yes that's it. Thank you so much. When we look at that you're talking about self-determination but then you're also raising the important point of free prior and informed consent. It seems that there's many actions by the government that don't obtain the free prior from consent and also inhibit the right of self-determination. Can you share some of those aspects where the government has made decisions that then have a adverse impact on the people at West Papua? Yeah so let me just sample. Okay for for the example it's it's like the new provinces in West Papua. So now there are six new provinces in West Papua and it is without adequate participation and not enough participation from the indigenous people. That is why there are a lot of mass protesting all over the West Papua and maybe we can go over the internet we can see that that the West Papuan people oppose that that that kind of politeness because they see they see that as a threat to the indigenous people's life because there will be a lot of transigration there there where it will be a lot of development that is that is you know separating people from lands, separating people from their culture and for another example it's like spatial autonomy and spatial autonomy since 2001 has been updated in 2020 2021 years ago it is without proper participation from the indigenous people there are a lot of people protesting and the government responded by sending more crops to the region so that is the you know that is the real example of how the West Papuan people strikes of self-determination to choose how they supposed to live and how they choose their lives in the future is so controlled by the government. So we read the point because the universal declaration of human rights provides the power of ideas to initiate change in the world and the UDHR outlines opportunities for a new direction rooted in inherent dignity and able rights for dynamic sustainable development in social democracy and article 20 focus on the porn right to freedom of peaceful assembly and association to impact the public policy and practice of one's government for good and when we look at it though it seems like there's a couple factors there's rising militarism there's also corporatism of corporations coming in without allowing peaceful assembly and then also even that aspect of religion you of course shared that aspect of unique relationship with mother earth can you maybe expand on those three examples of how the lack of being able to come together and being able to practice article 20 are impacted by those three aspects of corporatism militarism and then of course that aspect of not respecting indigenous religion as well and spirituality. I think how it currently gives each other it is can be seen by by the the creation of numbers of populations of indigenous people when when these three aspects came into force with prior consent it affects the the populations I mean when the when the props came and when the when the props came and make people fear they cannot assembly and because the the absent of the rights of the assembly the people cannot express what they feel what they think and what they want and then lead to any other rights that is being filed so I think these three aspects need to you know need to go together need to apply together as one body we cannot have been back to the little people that's what I get from your questions maybe if it is no it's a great a great explanation of the solidarity and also the necessity of sustainability that we have to of course focus on mother earth first but then also you know to make sure that when people do the most basic aspect of standing up for what they believe in and assembling that then the military or incorporations do not come in and they've directly impact people for just you know exercising the most basic right can you share with us some NGOs that are champions to create a culture of human rights in West Papua you are sharing some aspects on Instagram and some other ways that people utilizing social media but in West Papua maybe what are some of the most powerful positive examples of exercising article 20 and then more probably international NGOs that you feel are standing up in solidarity with West Papua for the for the NGO I think for the for the NGO I think they move in very diverse sectors they just come from the independent sectors and then human rights sectors and indigenous people so it is like there is a live uh was a carbon dollar like yet and others is like apple it based in UK and human rights monitor based in Germany so and there are a lot of Indonesian national NGO that is moving in the sector of development and I think it's somehow helped it helped the voiceless people to rise their their voice up and there are as well post thing in social media campaign like what I've mentioned earlier like the pop on specs and pop on stick on the Instagram and like to be in Swarapapua either in cities are local local news that that is run by in several your pop on news where they are trying to give a deep dive dive first narrative from the instant media so I think maybe we can take that out it's like to be calm and Swarapua calm it is run by maybe uh free to remember it's a well-known journalist that maybe we can allow for empowering how you use the media to the people so I think that's many maybe there are a lot of a lot of examples but I think there I think that is what I can no explain here those are great examples and it's good to see the depth and how people around the world understand that their voice that they have when they have living in a democracy must be united to stand up with people who aren't able to exercise those basic fundamental freedoms so the examples you're sharing about Germany about all over the world plus also your response about Indonesia is important because then that shows that even in the belly of the beast of the colonizer that people there know what's happening is wrong that reminds me very much of really some of the most recent events we shared in dilly in Timor-Leste where we were able to be there on the 24th anniversary of the referendum can you share what it was like to be in dilly and how inspiring it is to meet with the people of Timor-Leste in their sense of solidarity with the people of West Papua and how you felt in that program in the evening programs as well as the larger one yeah I just feel so emotional you know like I just cannot I just cannot express what I feel I just I just take quiet and I think how beautiful these when people know not all the legal violence they've been they've been in dangerous like they don't have to be afraid of their land being taken they couldn't been taken so I think when they show me the solidarity it's an unrighteous spirit for for me to share to my family who's back in West Papua and I think that even at that time was very memorable and fantastic and it just somehow become blessed for me to memorable and fantastic and it just somehow become blessed for me to to keep on to keep on have a voice officially for the better world and you know for so our human rights can be protected promoted and fulfilled by by the that the barriers state so I think what they what they have what they have shown in daily pursue amazing when people when we can see even though even though they have no like they have no like enough welfare that resources but they live in a in a society where the human yeah Timor-Leste and yeah that's that's it I think what I think about it rather just no I agree it's it's it's so special to be there on that holiday when in the face of extreme violence the people of Timor-Leste they voted overwhelmingly for independence for being able to take control of their future after centuries of colonization from various forms and even as you brought up losing 200,000 people out of 800,000 in just 24 years that's quite an experience so it wasn't easy but more importantly as you said knowing that they were also under Indonesia that they were able to become free how does that inspire you to then assemble and then take action to realize what's possible yeah I think and take action to realize what's possible yeah I think the one thing that they have told me is solidarity and I think that it's the court of power when when we have solidarity we can protest peacefully we can use the peaceful way to promote peace I mean but that is through solidarity for all over the world as a human being we came together with with the same problems it is human repilations and they are denied of human repression and I think when we have solidarity it would be a weapon to to finally to erase all the worldwide abuses in the world so I think that is what inspired me and I finally understand how solidarity is the key so we have to build solidarity with Hawaii and with people in Indonesia or themselves we're trying to build solidarity at the moment solidarity it's true solidarity and it's not a theory right it's a transformative totally can see it directly applied and you can see it in the eyes of of the people of Timor-Leste that really one of us cannot have pure freedom and still everyone has freedom and when you see the way that they take action to set up a western Sahara and an embassy look at issues anywhere in the world that if anyone's human rights are denied anywhere on earth then all of our rights can never fully be realized so I think that's what's so powerful and article 20 says it's really essential to engage the people to participate in governance and promote human rights for all and you can see that the universal declaration of human rights calls for a coalition of conscience centered around trust and transformation while honoring values voice and vision and on the 75th anniversary it's important to reflect on the role of human rights in our daily lives and world affairs and you can actually experience it and feel that in Timor-Leste maybe at a more visceral and beautiful level than most people feel because it it's still only 24 years and it was rising out of the ashes of some of the most brutal situations anyone's faced in the history of humanity yeah and give it how they how they are in the end finally and celebrate democracy and what they're enjoying beautiful beautiful moments that is fantastic it is can you maybe share for people who don't know some of the major heroes of the human rights movement in West Papua historically and currently who have had such a huge impact to really bring to life article 20 yeah impact to really bring to life article 20 yeah for the first is what I what I want let let you know guys it's Phinit Karma Phinit Karma Phinit Karma he was he was a peaceful leader in West Papua where in 1998 he was you know make a demonstration in in Biak and and it's apocalyptic peaceful demonstration there is no weapons it is just just voice and microphone and all the posters they hold and there is no weapons but and then suddenly the the military came and you know just like shooting and disturbingly and it is what we know that in today's as a Biak massacre so it's like Biak massacre and so so historical historical moment historical day when the people are killed just because protesting just because you know assembly peacefully to protest what they so yeah in West Papua we know how Phinit Karma is in there is a war as well promoting peaceful peaceful movement peaceful assembly to to freedom and and for the protection of human rights that's the major human rights defenders in West Papua any others that you you would like to mention that people could learn more about exercising that article 20 yeah what I mentioned before is like Victor Yemo Victor Yemo is now in jail like even though the court already Victor Yemo is now in jail even though the court already already said that he must set free but the police didn't get him out of the jail to remove Jeffrey Wenda or yeah there are a lot of people but the leaders they are the leaders that that is us you know make make people assembly peacefully to demonstrate what they were Jeffrey Wenda actually want to want to join this this interview but uh you know what he has some business and he'll he'll enjoy he'll have been through infighting the next time just sounds good can you share with us just taking a moment and reflecting on the time and team more or less they but also the idea of what's possible in West Papua can you share your vision for the future of the right of article 20 in West Papua yeah for uh you know it's kind of difficult to to have a court vision especially when we know today the government posts are the same approach when it's just like will it throat in any other today the government posts are the same approach when it's just like will it throat in any other but uh i believe in i mean i still believe in that the thing when we get what we can fight and we keep you know peacefully declare what we were what we need or our better future and i think there will be still uh there will be still future for movement right especially when the year when the year will take motion yeah so there if if there are more more and people come to express uh like that if i can i give some your vision that maybe i i mean i cannot give a vision that it's impossible how i'm just trying to say why this written the reality didn't show we fully understand and we your vision is very clear because it points out what is so important in that why these freedoms these rights that are expressed in the universal declaration of human rights over 75 years ago are so valuable in the daily lives and why people value them so much so it's it's truly there and what you describe though is also reminds me of what president Joseph almost worked to said where he said no empire lasts forever so that then in a way nurtures that seed of hope that you were describing that one day soon this can change and more importantly that people can then live and practice these basic human rights and the u d h r article 20 is one way people exercise their engagement for equality and guarantee good governance in every nation and global democracy for our collective planet and the people desire dignity and to be part of this global family for freedom we can hear that in your voice how you yearn for these basic rights and how we have really a sense of solidarity but also a duty to one another to make sure that human rights are recognized in West Papua and around the world thank you so much for joining us today and really appreciate you not only all of your energy at the university of new southwest diplomacy training program but also your commitment to social change and a better future for West Papua and everyone on earth i mean thank you very much you soon as well for the time into it got this