 Is where do you draw the line between podcasts, what you actually mean, and what is art? It's a podcast, and you plan on saying a bunch of fake stories. Don't call it a podcast, just call it a show. Because is David Cho gonna get Netflix's new hit series, Beef, entirely canceled? And why is Bling Empire getting canceled? I think they might be for two different reasons, but they kind of tie in together at the same time. Yeah man, sure seems like this week there's a lot of Asian cancellations. But it kind of goes to show you there's a lot of Asian things that exist in 2023 to get canceled. So I guess that's sort of the bright side. Yeah, we're going to go through the comment section. Everybody, we are going to talk about the David Cho situation. So if you are interested by this video, please hit that like button and check out other episodes of the Hop Hop Boys because you know from silly to serious, we're talking about it all. You know, originally I did not want to talk about the David Cho thing because it just seems like so old to me, but man, it's going viral within the Asian American community, Andrew. I'm talking about people. I know that I did not even know followed Asian American representation media things, sending me this article. All right, let me try to sum it up real quick. Back in 2014, David Cho, okay, he has this podcast with Asa Akira. They say a lot of edgy things on the podcast. He has this very disturbing and problematic story about sexually assaulting a masseuse, blah, blah, blah. They kind of laugh it off. He leans into the character or whatever. It's a very disturbing clip. Or the story, yeah. You guys can look it up. We're not going to play it. So anyways, anyways, at that time it is still controversial. So people ask him to take it down. Obviously he has to respond and say, hey, listen, that was a story is for artistic reasons. I was addicted to drugs. I had mental disorders at that time. I was at the peak of my craziness. So he is not accused. There's no allegations. There's no charges of him being an actual criminal because nobody came forward. So we don't know if it's real or not. So based off what he says, he says it's a fake story. Okay, yeah, some people on Twitter wrote about it. Of course that caused articles to be written about it. Now he's fighting back. Ali and Steven and the production company, they're sort of staying quiet. And this is creating like even more of a buzz. And I think to be honest, it's because beef is the most like hipster mainstream Asian American art probably ever made in history. And it is kind of interesting, David. Can David Cho get canceled twice? Let's take a look at it. All right, you guys, let's get into the comments section on David Cho. Somebody said, man, he was perfect to play a degenerate, too big criminal because clearly that's what his aura is like as a real person. But you know, that's just the morality side of it. For me, as a consumer just watching the show, I just thought it made for a great character because he really is a scumbag in real life. Yeah, I don't think anyone ever has ever said that, oh, Hollywood's not full of dirtbags and scumbags. Yeah, there's nothing wrong with people here. All right, so I'll be honest and it is an interesting situation because he did respond to that podcast clip back then years ago. And then now it's getting resurfaced. I mean, is it plausible that he just made an incredibly horrible, horrible joke like in a six-hour podcast on drugs? Yeah, yeah, I mean, I think because no one has stepped forward, so he hasn't been charged of any crime, that masseuse, that person has never came out and said, so we don't know if that's a real thing. But I still think regardless, it is fair for the people to cancel him now for those jokes. Like, I don't think he could be like, well, I already apologized for that back in the day, so stop coming for me for it because I'm like, those comments were so heinous and the story was so OD over the line and he's just stepped over the line that, yeah, I mean, everybody is responsible for what they say in the past, right? So of the severity, I don't think that this is bad enough, obviously, to get David Cho in jail, which he probably, you know, there's no reason for him to go to jail right now, but I do think he should probably not get his own show in the future. Yeah, yeah, I think that it's totally fair to bar him. He's going to be fine guys. He's worth $200 million from the whole Facebook stock thing. But do you think that Ali and Steven, his friends that brought him onto beef, need to answer? That's a tough one too, because are they responsible for his actions back in 2014? If maybe he seems like he's a stand-up guy now, I don't know him personally, so I can't say. Somebody said, yeah, and they also let Andrew Santino play the main white guy in the show and he has a podcast where he said a lot of racist things against Asians and he's still allowed to be on the show. Everybody that's in this show is trash. All right, so Andrew Santino, I do think he's a funny comedian, however, he does go pretty far with the joke with Bobby Lee on their podcast. So I think here's my question about podcasts is where do you draw the line between podcasts, what you actually mean, and what is art? Because now a lot of people are hiding behind the guys of a podcast or comedy when they say crazy things on a podcast. You know what I mean? So it's like very like, what is real guys? Like what do you want me to think is real? Somebody said, you know, David Cho might actually be a horrible human being on the inside or he's just one of those guys who tries really hard to get approved by the edgy vice crowd. But the truth is we can't retroactively cancel him because then we're gonna have to cancel all the rappers and then all the people they killed in their rhymes, especially if he said that this is his art. Listen guys, I don't like rap. I don't like David Cho, but I'm just saying we gotta put a lid on this cancellation culture that's super retroactive. Yeah, and I think that, I think the public can feel however they want about someone like David Cho. Like I'm not really a fan of his stuff. I never watched his podcast. I'm not a fan of necessarily his personality. However, obviously I can't say he belongs in jail because he hasn't been charged for anything. Guys, there's actually some other celebrities that probably should have been canceled a long time ago, like Chris Brown, but anyways, like, yeah, I think it's very hard in this day of media when everybody's putting out so much content and a lot of it sounds crazy. Yeah, somebody said in regards to the nepotism that got him on the show originally Netflix's beef, how can it be nepotistic if actors like Ali Wong and Steven Yoon are still being far from household names in America? They're the top of the Asian totem pole, which is a tiny totem pole compared to other racist totem poles. And if we start chopping this totem pole down because we don't like this little flaw with it or that flaw with it, none of us will have any totem pole. Right, so this guy's kind of saying, hey, we do need some Asians to get on and have good shows, even if they're imperfect people to an extent, but of course, like, who's really, like, what Asians are even really powerful at this point? And I saw that comment from a couple industry Asians actually on Instagram being like, hey, guys, let's not turn on the Hollywood Asians. We're all fighting for each other right now, and this is going to lead to our other point right now because I think a lot of people are starting to go, are you guys fighting for us? Or are you guys just being selfish and looking out for yourselves? Hollywood representations, you guys care so much about us, average folks, do ya? Somebody said, listen, cronyism, nepotism, whatever you want to call it, these upper middle class, cool, edgy, Hollywood Asian kids club is just all looking out for each other. They don't care about us, even though they say it in all their non-profit statements, they do not care. They're looking out for each other. Wow, yeah, this point. This guy's pointing at something very, very deep cut where a lot of Hollywood oftentimes is a lot of people, not all the time, but often from privileged backgrounds themselves. Yeah, and they wanted to be cool their whole lives, and sometimes you couldn't be cool, so you were pro-Asian, but now Asians are kinda opening up, you might be going with other crowds now. Somebody said, honestly, a lot of people just lie. Bobby Lee made up stories to be entertaining, Theo Vaughn lies all the time, even if they're not 100% lies, they're huge exaggerations. That is their job to give you interesting and entertaining things, because that is not the court of law. Nothing is legally there to say that what they're saying is true, and by the way, a lot of these entertainers do a lot of drugs. Yeah, I guess, David, what do you think about like, do you think some people kinda hide their racism and misogyny, and they're kind of like, I guess, negative beliefs behind the veil of comedy and art? Yes and no, yes and no. I think some of it is literally the inhibition from doing so many drugs, whereas they just see society moving this way, and they just wanna say a statement that darts that way, and that's what creates laughter in the mind due to the subversion of expectation. But yeah, possibly too, to be honest, I mean like, some of them, I think for the comedians, at least that I know, maybe they're not as racist, but there is a lack of respect or dismissiveness, especially of Asian concerns around Asian jokes. Yeah, how about this, guys? If it's a podcast, and you plan on saying a bunch of fake stories, don't call it a podcast, just call it a show, because I think when people like comedians go on stage and are presenting jokes, then you kinda know it's not always real what they're saying, but that's, we know that because we come to the show and we watch you on stage, but when you see the podcast, there's kind of this guise and this implication. Dude, people are thinking like, this American life with like ira glass when they see the podcast. Yeah, like people are supposed to feel like it's personal, but then you say some ridiculously fake stuff, and then people think it's personal, so then they judge you based off that, and then later you have to come on and say, oh, it was comedy and art, and I'm like, I don't know, just say it's a show, like it's nothing's real. And of course, there were still some anti-cancelor comments, somebody saying, yeah, these journalists in Twitterati are just trying to ruin everybody's life and career so they can feel power because they'll never be as successful as David Cho, Steven, or Ali, which there's actually some truth to that, but it's also like, that's a dismissive comment of legitimate concerns. If I find out those journalists were like former stand-up comedians that never made it, then yeah, definitely. Of course, listen guys, in journalism, whether you're exposing somebody or you're trying to highlight this, sometimes everybody has ulterior motives because humans have ulterior motives, but that doesn't fully negate the legitimacy of their claim either. David, I guess overall, takeaways before we get into how this ties in a bling empire because that's going to be an interesting segue, but I would oversaw, say like, America kind of loves dirtbags. As much as they say they don't, America love Joe Dirt. Just like that move with Joe Dirt. America likes a dirtbag that's like kind of sorry for being a dirtbag, but they just love it, man. Dude, just like Eddie Huang and David Cho are sort of like vice hipster dirtbags. And they're the only Asians that Joe Rogan has on his show because Joe Rogan obviously, to be honest, he does have a lot of dirtbags on his show though. Yeah, that's true. Somebody says, you know, I totally get it. I understand the journalistic side wanting to bring down the show. So basically it's sort of like people basically having this dissatisfaction with the same 15 to 30 Asians that seem like they keep circulating power in the Asian representation wave 1.0 since CRA, right? Since CRA, since everything everywhere all at once. It's been sort of like the same circle, Menari. And I'm not saying they're bad people. I'm friends with some of them. I've met a lot of them. I'm friends with a few of them. But like, aren't people kind of getting sick of it? Because they're just like, man, it's a lot of upper middle class Asians, to be fair, a lot of prep school backgrounds, a lot of private school kids. But now here they are depicting ultra-rich people, middle class people, and they're even depicting poor people. But it's like, man, why do we got to just cycle through the same like 30 to 15 people all the time nonstop? I think the average Asian, rightfully so, is sick of it. I've even got four toes in the game and I'm still sick of it. Well, you want to see some different faces. You want to see some different stories. And I think that you want to see some more people who represent the actual average Asian. And I think like, I want to see somebody who would care about me and the people I grew up with without having to do it. I feel like sometimes, and I'm not saying 100 out of 100, like I said, I know a lot of these people that are worth a lot of money. It's like some of them only care because it like helps their career to care. They don't actually care about the rest of the Asians. In my opinion, that's true. Yeah, I think Asians don't have an art form like rap or something that is more raw from the community, from the streets, people that are telling the real stories. Now you can, we can have arguments about rap content and whether you agree if it's positive or negative. But I'm just saying, a lot of it does come from some realness. I would say in the African American world in terms of different sides of like a die, you know what I mean, like different angles. They've got like street stories from people still in the streets to this day, right? That's hip hop. Then you've got athletes that are sometimes, you know, from the hood, but then they make it into these great sports corporations and empires. And then you've got also your bougie thespians, sort of like Denzel Washington's sponsoring Chadwick Boseman scholarship to learn acting. And then you've got your like your elite political figures like Obama. So they really got like, as far as representation goes, I'm not saying, you know, all the, everything's perfect, but they got a lot of the angles covered. Whereas Asians Andrew, it's almost like some of the metrics are okay in terms of the overall body, but in terms of representation, it's just 15 people cosplaying as everybody. Yeah. It's kind of like the top 5% representing everybody else. But anyways, overall takeaways, I don't think everybody should have a podcast and call it a podcast and you shouldn't take everything. I mean, people should just, if it's fake and they're telling fake stories, they should tell people that. Anyways, let's tie this into Bling Empire, David. Yeah, Bling Empire just got canceled. The original one, which was based, I believe in OC, like Southern California. And then the New York edition both got canceled. And this was sort of like your, what reality show real world version of CRA, crazy rich Asians. Yeah, it was essentially the Kardashians, except with rich Asian people. I think there's a lot of shows on TV about rich white people, right? Vanderbilt, Vanderbilt rules. Sort of, yeah, there's a lot of stuff going on. Somebody said, man, I love this show, man. Why did they take it away? I'll say, man, people really like Bling Empire. I guess somebody had to like it. Somebody said, this was such a wack, try hard show. It was Asians trying to recreate the drama that rich old money whites have, or their Kardashian new money whites have clownish. Somebody said, oh my gosh, this is why I hated it, but I watched every single episode and blah, blah, blah, blah. I'm not gonna lie, I never watched an episode. Somebody said, hey man, only Asians watch Bling Empire and America's only 6% Asian. Last time I checked, no wonder why I failed demographically. I think I got a lot of views from overseas too. And somebody said, where's all the outrage about this being canceled, people saying they're gonna leave Netflix? No, there isn't one because that show sucked and nobody cares about it. Do you think it's true? I mean, who cared about Bling Empire? I think Bling Empire ran its course. I think that it was, I wasn't the biggest fan of the show personally. I know some of the people who are especially in the New York one and very nice people that were in it. But I guess overall, I'm okay with the show going away and then leaving space for more Asian stories. I do think it did its job as in showing that for at least a couple of seasons, people did want to see some Asian faces. But ultimately, I think we can move on. I think there's better stories out there, better shows and better talent. And I think as long as people keep the thirst up, like when they cancel House of Ho and they cancel Bling Empire, we'll just get like the 2.0 version, which will be better, more accessible and just more interesting and less forced. I would argue that maybe we're on like, maybe 2.50 of Asian representation, but either way, regardless of the numbers or the version or the generation that we're on, I think everybody agrees that we are getting on right now and it's a lot of the similar faces and it's a lot of the similar storylines, a lot of the similar narratives of being rich and fancy and stuff like that. But we would love to see more from the average Asian, the regular Asian, the Asian that's like just down the block. Yeah. And we're not necessarily talking about ourselves like give us a show, you know what I mean? Still find some beautiful average people or something. It doesn't have to be the Fung Bros, but I'm open to hear any opportunities. I think ultimately both of these things, whether it's the attacks and you know, interestingly enough, some people are going to be like, oh, that was a reach. How can you tie the cancellation of David Cho in with the cancellation of Bling Empire? And I'm like, I can because I think the feelings behind both of these movements are the same. Like I'm tired of this. I'm just dissatisfied because a lot of the people launching the attacks against David Cho, they were outside of that circle and they were dissatisfied with everybody in that circle. They're using David Cho as a Trojan, not a Trojan horse, maybe a legitimate way to get in there and wedge their way in there and talk about all these other issues. But like people are fed up with it. I wouldn't necessarily conduct myself the way some of these other people have, but I understand their frustration. And like I said, it's almost like somebody's like, all right, hey guys, we're gonna move on to Marvel phase, like 2.0, it's 1.0 right now. Now it's 1.5, oh, we got 1.6 coming up, 1.7, 1.8, 1.9, 1.95, 1.98 version. And you're like, dude, I'm waiting for 2.0. And I'll do whatever it takes, even if it means overreaching and taking this whole thing down. And that's what people are feeling. Everybody, let us know in the comments down below how you feel about it. How do you feel about the current Asian representation because there is quite a lot of it. And we will honestly say- With the same 15 people, yes. It's getting better. It's getting better. But what do you think about it and what do you think about David Cho and Bling Empire as well? And yeah, I mean, let us know in the comments. Share your thoughts. Until next time, everybody, thank you so much for watching The Hop Hop Boys. We are out. Peace.