 Hi, it's me Neil Brennan. You're watching the blockspad Let's just leave it. I blew it. No, I know but I blew it and in front of one of my heroes Ladies gentlemen, I've talked about this guy every episode He's the pattern familiar for is that right? Is that the thing? He's all this is his he's the exec producer Not credited. You'll get no money. Oh, I had a bit where I was gonna hand you a envelope And I forgot to do it. Yeah, one of the best come on one of the best commit another puck I'm really in my head about this one of the best comedians doing it mansplaining. If you're not aware It's when a man tries to explain what you already know in a patronizing manner It's when a man Try to put clever clever thoughts into your pretty little brain And a great man easy for you to say well a great man in terms of been a friend like literally not only like gave me the idea but been a friend defended me and stood on with with me in various times and a true Resource in terms of just comedy and pitching and all that stuff. It's Jimmy Carr ladies and gentlemen. Yes. Yes It's such a pleasure to be here. I've loved the show. Yeah, I've absolutely loved it Like there are people that watch the show that always has notes basically every episode Well, we're talking about the carrot top episode for instance. I love it I think it just feels like it's a very interesting kind of space to come on and you know cuz blocks is such a it's a great Special yeah, and it feels like everyone In comedy could have written something like that could have been that open yeah about their mental health and their life and They aren't and maybe it leaks through a little bit. I think comics leak. Yeah, you watch an hour special with me It's just it's I'm a joke-to-joke comic and that's an insecurity that we'll get on to later I feel sure in this but the idea if you go I never feel like I'm enough. Yeah, I just need jokes I don't want to waste anyone's time. I'll just get to the next thing. They're not interested in me They need to laugh. They've come here for a reason. I'm providing a service and that's great But the idea with blocks that you kind of you open up and talk about what's really going with you And then you make it I mean it's hilarious. It's a hilarious special But that thing of like coming on and sharing that it's it's interesting, right? I think it's the most interesting. I'm worried that It's everything's pathologized now and everything is like my trauma and my And well, I mean the trauma bit in in the new one is yeah Phenomenal. Yes. Thank you. But now I'm worried not like I'm on the wrong side of it, but it's so It's like for instance, everyone said I'm Rick James bitch and you kind of feel like No, you were just too close to it. I think sometimes when you're too close to when you're in the zeitgeist You you can't see it. You know, I could see but I it just felt like it was being ruined by the wrong people So I feel like in a way trauma is being Overly used. I think no, no way. Let's let's overcorrect Let's overcorrect because no one was talking about it. There is a mental health crisis in the world And you know, you only have to look at you know, young people committing suicide. There's terrible things happening out there Yeah, people opening up and talking about what it's like to be a human being seems like a very very healthy thing to do Not a huge part of your childhood Not a big part of mine or indeed our adolescence and you know lives beyond This is all very healthy. Great. And I feel like I was there pretty early so I can stand on it but I do I have no I have made a point of talking about like post-traumatic growth as like no, you can grow you can grow from these things Yeah, and there is obviously a lot of upside to feeling like you're not enough One of the smartest things you ever said to me was there's not one type of therapy What therapists should have to tell you my law in the first session is there are other types of therapy available This isn't it because I don't really see the point in Going to Freudian analysis for 20 years to find out it was all your mother. Yeah, which you knew But what am I gonna do with that? Yeah, well, what do I do about it? How do I grow to me about it? I'll charge you. Yeah, let's get on to blocks I want to talk a little but I want to talk about a little bit about how Jimmy and I when we're in Montreal for the comedy festival, which is about six days we go on They're pretty romantic walks. I would say yeah I would say if you were remaking broke back in the modern age You would go on a very long walk and eat a nice vegan meal and discuss comedy and life. That's yeah That's all there is right. Yes, and it's philosophical and they're long walks. We burn the calories I put down the vegan sword and we get Dairy Queen We they're long. There's up a hill. There's down the it's the whole thing in the most beautiful city in the world I can't understand why more people don't go to Montreal for a holiday for a vacation I agree because you go. Well, what do you want from a vacation? You want fun? You want to have a laugh. You want maybe a few drinks and nice weather Well, you can see the best comedians in the world and you can meet them You can see that I mean now that they're there hanging around if you're super into comedy It's like it's the place because it's an invitational like the Edinburgh Festival is phenomenal in Scotland, but Some people are having a bad time Not everyone is winning and they may not be great at comedy, but everyone is winning in in Montreal It's invitation only I mean it might not be your thing I would say that thing with comedy if you watch a successful comedian and they're not doing well It's because it's not for you. Don't worry. Don't try not to sweat it They're doing something that's not for you You will three of the at least three if not eight of the best comedians in the world will be at Montreal over here Yeah, so have fun. It's it's pretty good. That's a good holiday tip for people. Yeah, I mean, let's this is a strong podcast Yeah, we're already doing yeoman's work and Yeah, it's like you do you do your you'll do roast you'll it's like people doing a bunch of things You I've seen the magic of Montreal is you do stuff. You would never do anyone else if someone else said to me Oh, do you want to go and roast someone at one in the morning? Yeah after you've already done two shows Are you go what no is it is a is there money changing hands? No, it's gonna be it's for it just for fun No, I'm gonna go home, but in Montreal. Yeah, of course. Where's the hang? Yeah, you know, everyone's gonna be there Oh, it's gonna be or Jeff Ross and David Taylor doing bumping mics or something you go Yeah, just hang in the audience. Yeah, of course. Yeah, it's a great time you we've also Well, I consider you like a resource of friendship meaning like you're you're very good counsel Oh, that's very nice. You just say yeah, and I feel like you feel that about me and you don't want to say it No, that's I was I was waiting, but it's that thing of yeah It is it feels like if I just fire the compliment back at you It's it's I love you too, but it is that yeah It is that thing where I do go to you for advice on things because you've got an incredible Ability with friendship very few people do it like you in terms of you go We do very little small talk everything seems to go straight into kind of quite emotional depth and there's a level of honesty That's incredibly unusual. I think it's one of the things that you go your more come on talking about this later Maybe but the your belief in fairness is it cuts through everything ruining my life, but yes, yeah Well, anything taken to a hundred percent becomes we just is taken to a hundred percent You know recipe for disaster four moves away from Stalin. It's you know, yes No, I I've come to that realization recently. I'm like this is you are dedicated to your own misery Okay, so let's talk more about Before we get into this you we're both very aware of how well our lives are going I just don't want people to think that you're like complaining. I think the I mean my thing is the Gratitude for me is the mother of all virtues gratitude allows everything else in so it's not just gratitude for kind of your life in them Oh, well, I'm glad I've got this show tonight with people coming you go Well, I'm glad to be a comedian. I'm glad to be living in this era I mean, I do think it's the golden age of comedy and as we're walking in we're talking about like the Beatles like being the first Band they got to do everything first. I feel like we're at that stage of stand-up comedy Yeah, it's a very new medium feels like it's an American medium Maybe you could stretch American Jewish medium really that the language of it and the idea that it's just coming up now And you have these incredible voices Carl and and prior Rock and Chappelle and Louis CK and Bill Barron. These kind of voices coming through that you go. Well, this is going to be It it's it feels like it's such a privilege to be in this world now Well, it also is a new it's like the Beatles were the first rock band, but music's been present for I don't know Like music, I mean written music, let's say fifteen fourteen hundred fifteen hundred whatever. I don't even know what it is, but Comedy is it's a new genre. I don't think it's a genre of something No, it's a whole like rock-roll was a genre of music. I wouldn't say spoken comedy That's it's from 1940 1950. Yeah, it's it's there's that great. What's he called Cliff? Huxton, no Cliff who's the guy that wrote the book the comedians? Oh Cliff Nessaroff. Yeah. Yeah, that's a fabulous book Yeah, I mean really and he's got a new one also outrage. Yeah. Yeah where it's like contextualizing Comedians getting in cancelled and in trouble. Well, is that thing where you go? I View this like in micro and macro I kind of think like the idea that cancel culture is a problem is sort of horseshit and You go but but in a in a golden age everything looks yellow So you you know America and comedy It's never been objectively better, but subjectively worse say more so the idea and I travel around America on this tour I go to different and this is the land of milk and honey It is so fantastic and to perform comedy. I mean the crowds are so up and Everyone seems to be having a great time It's the the great places to eat great places to live like 10 cities you could very happily live in that Yeah, great and yet subjectively Everything's terrible. I think there's a war going on. You know, well, okay, but compared to other places this yeah this is not a real civil war and and Tell you what was terrible the civil war and Then comedy like there's a lot of I think the downside with comedy is you're constantly looking at what everyone else is doing and So you're looking over. Oh, well what hang on. Maybe I should have a huge podcast. Well, that's you're fine Do do your thing. I'm trying to be more stoic. I'm trying to do less better Things are really nice Like don't accepting. Well, the thing that I want to I I got it from this. I got it from this this podcast I was listening to Pete Holmes on this to great episode. I mean such a lovely man Yeah, and he has this line he says the world ordered a stand-up comedian You got to honor that as the person like it said to you you're a stand-up comedian You were like great. Yeah, I'll try my absolute hardest to be great at it The other stuff is kind of a side hustle the other stuff that showbiz brings along The great thing about being comedian is we're in show business, but we're not in show business Yes, like like Harlan said to rock one time. I'm not in show business. I'm a comedian It's a great line. It sure is. Well, we're showbiz adjacent We get to go to the parties, but no one is is you know, you've ever been with real famous people You know people lose their minds around them. It's a security issue immediately. Yes. We're like we don't need security We can travel commercial. We're absolutely fine. And I'm you know, and listen I'm saying that here and I imagine most people listen to this listen in America And we'll go well, of course you can you're literally just a man. Yeah a big deal elsewhere. I'll have you know travel I'm a big deal Okay, let's get into blocks Stuff on here. I didn't know okay, which is great for a five-year relationship in Meshed in meshed very very close to my mother growing up and how come I think my Father was not and so if there's almost like you become a Substitute spouse you become very close. Yeah, emotionally with your parents. He was not around or he was emotionally not Emotionally not around you become very close to your I became very close to my mom And so that was a huge part of my childhood and adolescence and growing up I mean it really kind of follows you through she died when I was about maybe 26 and that that grief is a huge part of my sort of life and was a big turning point in terms of sort of pushing the fuck it button on I had a Separation anxiety in my life. My biggest fear was my mother Leaving there was an incident when I was I think it was three and my mother's twin died And so she had to leave to go to the funeral No one really sort of told us what was going on and we're kind of left with our father for a couple of days And I thought you know that thing with kids you you think it's forever Yeah, it's object permanence is what they call it that you can they might people play peek-a-boo. Yeah, they go I am here or I'm gone and then you go and then you go. I know I'm I never leave Yeah, I am always with you even when you can't see me I think the the sadness of that death which I wasn't aware of but you get the you feel it You feel you feel it and you don't know what you're feeling You don't know what's going on, but you go something's shifted something's changing this the sadness of that and then her being away I was kind of always very worried about that. And so when she died it was the worst thing. I mean it was just It's you know grief how did you okay? Well, let me ask this was it So maybe the boundaries weren't great meaning if she takes you on as a surrogate spouse Probably not the healthiest thing from I know far too much about everything Far too much middle-aged woman's bodies and selling everything everything. I know way too much about that So great always and they had great relationships with I think but she would you she probable love Oh and was so fucking funny had like Incredible charisma was incredibly depressed I always think the only question to ask a comic and really I think you should open with it every week on the show If I had one note, which of your parents were sick Every comic we know everyone you've ever had on the show, which of your parents were sick and you had to make it Okay. Yeah, I mean that said that really is like terrible atmosphere in the house Yeah, are you gonna learn how to change the atmosphere? How are you gonna learn? Yeah, the thermostat is very cold. You need to make things a bit warmer nicer I remember really clearly as a kid like my mother was cooking something for Christmas or whatever And I say I'm gonna go and watch this thing. Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, stay there and I went. I'm not doing anything Vibes, but you're there for vibes. You're making this all okay And that thing of like you you fulfill that role your mascot and then you slightly go Well, you know, you're drawn to doing that. Yeah in adult life, but she was incredibly funny No sense of kind of embarrassment and was a larger-than-life kind of Irish woman From memory Nora was her name. Great. Just a wonderful What you're a great company and then I thought it was just so normal. You always think your life is so normal Yeah, so you think getting home from school and your mother still being in the dressing gown and and hasn't got up and Hasn't got herself together and isn't taking care of herself physically Mm-hmm. You kind of you don't want to give anyone a hard time It's kindness in the moment where you let it go and you never question Like why are you not taking care of yourself physically? Why are you not? Are you aware that you're that a An adult is supposed to or you don't even know that that's what I think you I think you do when you you start to be more aware Of the outside world. Maybe it's from yeah, you go to friends house 7 to 14 You see their house you see how they are how they're living and it seems different, but also will seem less fun People always came to my house This thing of like so you don't have a thing where you were ashamed of bringing people No, I would have that thing of like I would get home to my house I remember like being at university and getting home and my friends sort of Giles and Phil and and Jared Those are not just random Actual friends and Hiroshi being in my house having Like having like I get home and they'd be at home having coffee with my mom And you go you didn't invite them. No, they would just let everyone just drop by each other's house or whatever But you go what but I'm well just chatting fine. You go an hour ago. Don't worry about it Do you feel proud of your mom in that? Yes, like to hold a role was like super super fun. You're super close She's a bit of you guys are probably the co-life of the party sounds like yeah I think we we had a great time. Let the the block on that is I didn't have any relationships Growing up at school and college Didn't have friends. You did not lots of friends lots of lots of girls I got on with never really had a girlfriend was it a what did you want to replace her and looking back on that? I think that was the I was slightly blocked from that because of a very close relationship With a kind of known was good enough and it was there was kind of a it was a slight It's a slightly weird thing being enmeshed. It slightly feels like Maybe a little bit too close there to to let someone else in so you know, that's that was that was an issue I think growing up That was it a thing that you were aware of in the time Are you yeah, I was I was kind of I was aware that there was kind of something Missing there something kind of I mean I also think I mean to be honest with you when you kind of look back at high school as well I think it was that thing of I grew up in an era where it was very What would you say? Unenlightened in terms of courting like so guys kind of had to we're kind of pushing it with girls a little bit Yeah, I was very very uncomfortable with that Dynamic always so you got a probably probably a good thing in some respects. Yeah, it was just it was pretty gross Yeah, and very drunken and very you know, yeah, I Was tiny and like at parties. I'd be like trying to Score what we used to call score with sure and it was like I remember girls like Physically overpowering me of like you're not No, you will not do that which is so fucking I'm so tiny I wonder with that as well with the you know growing up in that in that era the I mean You end up having lots of you know It's fun growing up and you don't feel quite comfortable in your own skin You don't really become yourself. I think it's like I don't think people talk about this enough Your mind isn't developed fully till you're about 25. Yeah, and I really felt that switch which we didn't know until like eight years ago Yeah, but it really makes sense to me really makes sense of like going There's such a hurry to get to someplace to make all your big decisions before you're 25 and it's a race And you go, well, no, you know yourself an education, you know, but but everyone is an auto-dictat, right? Everyone is no one is still using the education they got It just needs to give you a love of learning Even doctors like the best doctor, you know ask him how much he's using that he learned at medical school If it's anywhere more than 10% yeah, the guys are dummy go down a different dog. I mean, yeah We're always learning the last War, you know, like it's like the you fight the last war like you fight in Iraq You fight with the stuff you picked up in Vietnam, right? And so it's always like all these politicians are trying to fight the last election. You never get to fight that one again Yes, you always have to go with the your your ability to learn and and pattern recognition Which is what comics kind of our superpower. Yeah, is is what gets you there What's it like when you go to university with your mom pretty? Yeah, pretty pretty good. I mean close touch to or was a very close in the same house I was touched but like You know, she didn't take good care of herself. She died when I was 26 of pancreotitis Which was a a gallstone. I mean it's really silly No, gallstones not that serious But if you don't get it treated straight away and it was the wrong side of Christmas She wanted to wait till after Christmas and one burst and you get the you know, pancreotitis Which is a horrible way to go. It's like nine months of agony. It's it's cancer or it's no No, it's pancreotitis your pancreas just blows up and you can normally it's for clean it up So to speak normally our colleagues get it. So I imagine quite a lot of it in your family I'm just saying the guy does listen. Yeah And was she bedridden it like very bedridden at that point. Yes, she was in intensive care the whole time She we had like two three conversations for nine months. She was on a I mean actually the the staff at the hospital were fantastic because it's it's all about at that stage They say there's no such thing as euthanasia, but there is so they a form of it Well, they put them on on a level of so she would have found an epidural for the pain And then they just gradually sort of shifts up to where your lung function goes to nothing So there's a you know, they tell you sort of, you know, five hours in advance six hours in advance of the death Oh, it's gonna be today. It's gonna be this time. Yeah, you know the week before it's gonna be next week Yeah, and it's in there. It's what the mind I remember on the first week there. I'm at a young doctor and the doctor went Yeah, this is just they'll be there'll be ups and downs But this is this is it. This is it man. I love was very kind of him. I totally forgot the conversation I mean totally locked it out for that nine months. You and then oh, yeah, no that guy said Oh, yeah, and then it's a weird thing with grief when you know, it's coming You know, they're gonna die and then they die and you go, ah, okay So when she dies around the time she dies, did you feel a little liberated or total devastation? very liberated it was the And totally devastated but the liberation was more like oh the thing I feared since I was a baby had happened and It didn't matter nothing mattered Yeah, you've escaped from from jail in a way Well, but the ability to go out and do what you wanted to do and not care what anyone else thought So a lot of me going to Cambridge a lot of me like getting into the best university and doing well and Getting all my exams and things was to she used to refer to me in the biblical term of like she got religious when she got older Very Catholic and she would refer to me as my son in whom I am well pleased And kind of an ironic kind of fun way, but like she was really proud of that I really meant a lot to her like the bragging rights for parents your kid getting into Cambridge means so much more than for the kid For the kid is like I went to university in the 1950s Like everyone else was partying and doing ecstasy at university and I was having sherry at a drinks party We're going the fuck is all mark. Yeah, it was a weird place to go And everyone there is sort of having the same experience or everyone that I mean It's where I believe they invented imposter syndrome in Cambridge University because everyone gets there and goes But I was the smartest kid in my school right the fuck and then we'll come on to talking about my education naturally Flows from this of like I was pretty learning disabled as a kid put a pin in that What's the best way to learn a language? Immersion living where the language is spoken and using it every day But if that's not in the cards this year, you can still learn a language the second best way and that's with Babel Babel's tips and tools are approachable accessible rooted in real-life situations and delivered with conversation-based teaching So you're ready to practice what you've been learning in the real world studies from Yale Michigan State University and others continue to prove the babels better One study found that using Babel for 15 hours is equivalent to a full semester at college Babel has over 10 million subscriptions sold plus all of Babel's 14 language courses are back by their 20-day Money-back guarantee again I've been going to Spanish speaking countries a lot of which Spain go to Mexico fairly often Babel has helped me you use the app and then you're at a restaurant and you just like Dundas, Albania Like super things like where's the bathroom? Like it's just shit. You're gonna need it's easy to learn like how to order food As for directions speak to merchants. It's about Having a little bit of confidence I always say the sign of being able to speak a language is mumbling it and Babel can get you there You have to bring your own mumble, but I can teach you the mumble Here's a special deal for my listeners right now get 55% off your Babel subscription But only for our listeners at BabelBABEL.com slash BLO CKS get 55% off at Babel.com slash BLO CKS spelled BABEL.com slash BLO CKS rules and restrictions may apply I would think that you now are Your proclivities to get enmeshed with women I mean, you're married so yeah, I'm not right. Yeah, but the yeah, I don't know I mean, I think that thing of like I've got a pretty great relationship with mother half But you go I don't think it's particularly affected that going forward. I don't think I've to like carried it into Um I don't heard but it would be professional relationships if you're because you're you have a person It would be on the place the only other place you could do it would be at work, right? Or I guess just personal I think maybe friendship sort of I like to think that I'm I'm I suppose the the Everyday parlance will be ride or die if I'm your friend. I'm your friend. Yeah, and I've got you I've I've experienced it. Yes, and and that's and I view that and I kind of feel the same way Important part of life and and when people let me down then I really feel That it doesn't happen very often, but if you get let down or I feel betrayed It's just I'm not That's we got into a good habit early where if you did something That I was out of bounds Yeah, I can think of two times and you great immediately one of them I wasn't even done saying and you were like I know And it was very heartening for me And and we had one like last week about a joke. So and you were very like a joke was a point Yeah, it was a point. I don't do jokes. No, it was a really it was a really good point And I've forgotten that you said it it was fine and it was like, oh, yeah, that's fine But it is a very yeah that thing of like going we're good at that. I think the checking it and also I think respecting someone else is like the The fairness wouldn't be as important to me as it is to you But that thing of like I respect That's your sort of special skill. I think I get a lot out of this friendship because I know it's It's on these terms. I don't think it's more mine than I think it's shared. I would say what was the runoff what was the downstream effects of The enmeshment with your mother. I don't mean it's hard to it's hard to call. I think the right because we have so many inputs and but the but the uh You you don't realize, uh, it's a matriarch until They're gone. So the whole thing fractures And there's just boys left and you go, oh, two brothers Yeah, but boys don't really the birth birthdays forget it Christmas forget it All the nice things kind of went for a while, you know home isn't a place. It's a person So you're homeless for a while emotionally. Certainly. So that's that's a that's tough And then you find that again You sort of build that again and and and find something that's you kind of remake it You remake what you lost or and try and make it better, you know, which is, you know You know now I can I have did the relationship with your father change when your mother died Uh, I haven't seen him since really in any meaningful way great Not really but great in terms of just conversation in terms of in terms of this podcast, right? I mean, it's fucking right tremendous Yeah, it's uh, yeah, but that's like a whole other, you know, um a different episode. Well, it's not a different episode It's that thing. I mean, it's literally the line that we spoke about the narcissist line, which is your line, please The line is uh in terms of narcissism They have the disease you have the side effects Jimmy trying to sell that as his you can imagine. I mean, it's I I almost I I wrote it and I kind of think it's just because of the accent Yeah, um so So that's a bad that seems like a very bad relationship Yeah, that's a bad relationship But then I think it what it's not because you go I think uh the thing that I got from Uh alanon and reading a lot of the did you go to a lot? I didn't go a lot Did you go but yeah read a lot of the stuff and kind of really liked it But that thing of like detaching with love that the idea of going I don't want I don't there's no bitter list There's no sense of you want anything bad to happen. You just go well, that's not it's not good for me I don't want that person in my life. So I won't have that person in my life It's hard to get rid of that stuff. It just is I I I think I've not done it finally But like I've come to a new but then you know you stuff with your father I'm very aware of the is uh It's it's tough and then you're kind of looking for to fill that hole you're looking to kind of Replace that who are we trying to impress? Yeah, what are you trying to it seems like you were trying to impress your mother? Yes, much more so. Yes. Is it one of those things where you think if I still find myself now when I do things Going ah She would have thought this was cool like playing Carnegie Hall or something. Yeah, I've been going Oh, this would have been Well, that's funny. You thought she wanted you to go to Cambridge, but If she's funny, she would be real pleased with you being a High-level comedian. I think so. Yeah, I think it's uh, it's it's a sadness to think that you know, she won't see that But you can't but there's a bit of you that kind of you know kind of lives on Yeah, it's very it's maybe she feels it or you know or whatever. Okay, so let's get into The the learning disabled. Did you know you were learning disabled? Yeah, but obviously I wasn't the brightest so Not that aware I mean like I knew socially. I was pretty good with everyone else socially I was in school and I was at the regular school But I couldn't read or write. I mean, I just couldn't how old Maybe 11 when I could write with any level of um Acuity acuity, but I mean even then it was like very embarrassed by my handwriting Couldn't really read out in class could read words kind of um Phonetically explain dyslexia to people Well, I suppose it's that thing where I don't even recognize what it's meant to be like like I think normally people write And they just go I'm gonna write down this thing and just think it and write it I have to think about every single letter as I write it every letter of the word has to go down In so it just takes a lot longer. So my reading speed Is slower than my thinking speed So I'm much more on I'm on audible at times three the speed Because that's the speed I think at All right, so I like that I like I don't think it's disrespectful to the author Everyone sounds like Mickey Mouse to me. Everyone sounds like one of the chipmunks Yeah, like the greatest authors in the world sound like chipmunks to me because they're reading so fast So I listened to everything at very sort of high speed, but but the uh, I would like to show you pictures of chipmunks and ask you What author they represent Yeah But so it couldn't really write can't really write that well now I mean like, you know spell check is kind of everything to me Okay, so dyslexic I get the thing with spell check where I don't even know what you're shooting for Like spell check just goes like the one it comes up with the way they I mean, give us a clue use it in the sense. Give me more You were just like I didn't know what it starts with like If the words they suggest you're like, I don't know what that word is. Yeah, is that what you're saying? A little bit like like sometimes it will be just I've got absolute sort of blindness on it I can't see Because what happens is is the middle of the word tricky or the front back I know it's it's the whole thing. It's like I wouldn't know where to begin And there's certain things I've just got blindness with the names Susan and Suzanne are the same to me I cannot see how there's a difference. There's a weird kind of in this I think most people are in the same boat, but a weird like uh How could I tell the difference that kind of thing like it just don't know and then so But weirdly then so couldn't reading class Couldn't write was kind of a dummy and had to go to a special ed And then it became a massive source of what You were drawn towards that To go and well, I'll do that. I'll join the debate club. I'll I'll I'll show them And I don't know who was proving that to myself presumably, but You're you know, now what do I do for a living? Well, I do a couple of tv shows where I'm reading autocue, which is literally The nightmare scenario standing up in front of people reading things new years Eve can be a tough time for old people living alone So what I like to do every year is not think about them because it's depressing Do you memorize before? No, just does someone say it to you? No, but I have it like it's written in a really odd style I got this great tip early on in my career From Anne Robinson, the lady that used to do the weakest link. Oh, yeah. Yeah, you are the weakest link Goodbye I met her backstage and she went oh, yeah, okay Trouble the autocue what you want to do is this and you write it as it's Because spoken English is very different from written English So you put like way like thousands of commas in everything So when I write jokes now thousands of commas where the pauses are where the Gaps are like everything really As you would say it that's the phraseology. Yeah And like properly like I realized do you do you only do audiobooks? Pretty much no. Yeah, because I can't think of a better read person than you Like you're but you're not you're not reading you're listening. Yeah, just listening to stuff constantly Yeah, I'll do you know through for a week. I mean, I love it podcasts and audiobooks and I kind of think that thing of like You know, I may have said already but that education being something that like people seem to it's such a dumb system that we go And then it stops. Oh, I got out college when I was 25 never another book. Yeah, what? Yeah, didn't have to Yeah, I don't I'm not obligated to do it. So I'm not gonna do it. It's like there's a lot of good shit in books Or audio, you know, yeah, well, it doesn't matter. Yeah, but it does feel like cheating to me But everything feels a bit like cheating like the way that I got through my exam So obviously I had to do very well in my exams to get to the university I'm gonna go to so you can't really write that well But you have to get a grade essays and how is that done? And really that was the first kind of thing of pattern recognition in my life from my friend p maxman He's a wonderful guy and so bright and he was the best at history And my history teacher Crazy old dude great when just read his essays do that And so it was like because you'd read his essay and see how he'd structured it Okay, all right. Well, I can I can't steal the essay but I can steal the structure for the other back then You can steal go ahead. So the so the uh, but the but for the for that topic You could go, okay. Well for the new thing you can get that structure and you learn what it looked like And I think the same thing in jokes. I think when you start in comedy You're looking at your favorite jokes and kind of I was kind of looking at why is that so funny to me Yeah, when I was looking at I don't emo Phillips or Wanda Sykes or Stephen Wright and either kind of joke to joke I'm going why is that why is that so funny to me? Why is that line? Did they start with that and then reverse engineer and then and they're almost like crossword puzzles Like which I was found baffling trying to reverse them and then getting very into it like seeing the world in those And spending my time as crossword puzzles or just as crossword puzzles I think that's maybe the closest thing to it almost feels like with a great joke It feels like oh the joke was already there It was there and you just you cut away everything That wasn't a horse from the marble. Yeah, that old quote, you know, it was it was in there somewhere You could get to it. So you're very Studied and not It reminds me of the thing you were saying about therapy, which is you know, there are different kinds of therapy There are different ways to learn Some people learn from hearing someone tell them about it. Yeah other people have to read it There's a thing called called There's photographic memory. There's also phonographic memory. I think I may have phonographic memory I can remember like if I listen to this podcast pretty much name an episode I tell you where I was when I heard it Yes, like that thing of like I could tell you which airport I was in What I was doing when I heard that bit that I liked and I would argue that we're very good at quoting jokes Flawlessly, yes, because you hear a joke and you go, uh, okay. I can And then that's how some the the rhythm of that the the the pacing of it the yeah Yeah, you would be harder to get it wrong I I had to look up phonographic memory because I was like I'm good at remembering the and I was like, oh I can Yeah, I now I get it like if I could listen to an audio thing But that's not other people have it like in a in a different way as well because you know the singers I know that have let the lyrics just It's just in there somewhere. Yeah, and are you do you take any pride in that or is it just like survival what the uh You know, I was learning disabled I did I mentioned that you you said it right you you're one of the most well-read people I know okay now that I'll remember because I so embarrassed my lack of intelligence That I spend my life over compensating or compensating for it. So I read a lot and I Study a lot and I I think I got my work ethic from being a dummy So you go well, I feel like I didn't deserve to be at that university I feel like I I was a that place should have gone to someone else and I better make this work I better I better do my best here. I better and you weren't any sort of charity case. It wasn't like this guy is not They don't they charge Cambridge in the 90s did not do that. They this you had to be Uh, you had to be pretty good. I think it was a very I mean, it was a great course. It was really interesting Okay, but what I'm saying is are you happy? Do you take pride in the fact that it was over? I don't know age 11 to 17. You really dug deep and figured it out Yeah, I think I had a massive advantage in that when I was 16 I I changed schools and I don't think you ever get to beat your environment So I think the hugely important thing for me was going. Okay. I was 16 Doing well at school had my friends at that school Um who I loved But that was just funny and we're just fucking around and drinking and getting into trouble And we scraped through our exams and we're going to stay on to do the next bit the last two years of school And I left I went to another school And it was my mother went Oh, this is other school one of your friends goes to that we know from the village And it's a bus ride and a train ride and it's miles away. Do you want to go? Yeah, why did you want to go because I kind of had a sense of not wanting to be I knew what track I was going down and I didn't like where it was going I went, oh, okay. I'll go a different way. So I remember arriving there the first day There was one other new kid this kid Giles And we went, oh, let's I want to go to Cambridge And we both went, yeah, okay, and no one laughed. No one kind of went What are you talking about and it was really it really felt like oh, okay Well, maybe maybe with those kind of guys and there was a couple of great teachers that was a This guy called mr. Clay and mr. Fire. We liked that the and they were just fantastic They were just kind of believed in us and it was it was that That thing of like the real cliche of going well that turned on a sixpence because then you were sort of down that road And you had more You know, you have to give the world Irrefutable evidence you are who you say you are and it was that thing of like, okay Well, if I work hard at this it pays off later And that does that inform everything Everything in your life for that I think so yeah, I think it's the thing I've only kind of realized recently about that's the whole of religion is that The the whole of religion is prioritized later. God is an analogy for the future work hard now There's a great afterlife now. I don't believe in an afterlife, but I do believe in the next life And if you work hard now, oh next living life a next life like yeah There's a life that you've had like you don't recognize yourself from 15 years ago You're a different person now because you you put that work in and it's you know So the gifts you give yourself in the future the idea that anyone if you go and work out You're a great body when you're 60 if you save the money now, you'll have you'll be a rich man later Delay gratification is what the marshmallow test is what we're obsessed with. Yeah. Yeah that that whole thing is like Prioritized later is every self-help book you've ever read every religion you've ever heard about it's always Do the work now and it'll pay off later. You know, it's interesting I don't think I mentioned the marshmallow test on here the marshmallow test being they put a five-year-old in a room by themselves And they say I'm gonna put an adult says I'm gonna put a marshmallow on the table and I'm gonna go away for five minutes if I come back and you haven't eaten the marshmallow, I'll give you a second marshmallow And biggest single predictor of success in life. Yes is that not everyone's taking it but all of in the times they've done it the Longitudinally the kids who didn't eat the marshmallow In the five minute window have better life outcomes, which is just like well then there it is It's just can you delay gratification? Then you can can you save money? Can you do hard work? Can you with very little reward? It's stand up You suck and you get no money and then you just stick what you can take it The downside is you get into kind of a philosophical thing not the downside But the interesting thing I think is it's not the pursuit of happiness. It's the happiness of pursuit Having stuff isn't fun. Getting stuff is fun. That's kind of life. That's a great life lesson I think they're going you think you'll be happy when you won't you'll just need a new challenge I think we work very well with purpose So it's that thing. I was slightly lost in my you know post college Early 20s mid 20s like trying to find what I wanted to do pre comedy It's like quite a lost period of like, I don't know your mom died at 26. Yeah, 25 26 Yeah, and then you felt like comedy kind of they knew it was like a period on a the sentence of a life And you're like okay in your case of comma and you start you're like, okay now There's no observers. This is how I feel when I'm in asia Which is I like going to asia because no one No one's looking no one I it feels like you're hiding from america. They're all looking at you. Well, they're all looking Yeah, but but no one's there's no sex tourist So that rule I did it whenever I'm there I do I was like I'm a sex tourist pretty much everywhere I go If I go to Whole Foods, I'm like I'm still a sex tourist. I don't have to go to asia. Yeah, but Yeah, it's I like the idea of Of a duo or a start over the thing of like we are who we are when nobody's watching that lovely thing of going Well, if you're on your own, who are you really and finding someone you can be yourself with like properly yourself is very unusual I'm also very highly Sensitive to Perceived judgment like we're What happened when studio wasn't available? We got here or whatever we the times were fucked up We went and got coffee. We are in my car We're in my house and the whole i'm not doing like exactly like flinching But I just assumed the judgment Is in your head is like what kind of house is this? What kind of car is this but you know and So even you're not judging. I just assume you're judging. Yes, but it's that um, what's the quote? It's the in our 20s we think Worry about everyone thinking about us in our 30s We think I don't care what everyone thinks about us in our 40s We realize they weren't thinking about us the whole time and everyone is just doing their best Yeah, we are in a windshield flying past each other, but then it's a it's a it's a Something's got to motivate you right something's got to be the thing that and some with you It's the perceived slight is the is the thing with me. It's like, you know, okay Well, I thought I was a dummy Someone have to work hard and do this and then maybe a little bit of insecurity Is why I'm a joke-to-joke comic that really appeals to me of going I've just got to get to the next laugh quick It's the observation I had of like I come into every conversation five points down And I have to like okay, ah And I'll do gossip if I'm really bombing like Oh, here's me or here's a name drop or here's a because I don't think I'm doing well And I don't I don't think I'm enough so I have to come in and yeah I remember having that realization with Joan Rivers. Uh, we got to work with before Before she passed and She was doing we were taking her to dinner Like so that she was on our show in the uk and like a proper actual Legend, I mean one of the yeah And she was making notes one of the absolute great making notes in a hotel room before the dinner for the dinner like cue cards so she would have bits About topical stuff that she could throw in For a dinner with a bunch of what of course and why was she one of the greats? Well because of that the thing driving that that is with him with You know in our industry, you know, it's a we've said it before we'll say again comparison is the thief of joy It's you're always looking at what other people are doing. Everyone always wants what you've got They never want to do what you had to do to get it. Yeah And not just the hard work the emotional world the torture what you had to feel I just I'm editing my special the watching yourself over and over and over is a recipe for An abyss it's direct just go like Well, I mean the physical we can come on to that now if you want the the physical thing of going being on screen or whatever having a Just You look how you look no one cares no one's coming to see my show because of how I look Yeah, and yet it becomes obsessive the idea of taking care of yourself and being the right weight and being Uh, properly groomed at all times it becomes Just a compulsion. Hey if I asked you how many subscriptions you have to anything Would you be able to list all of them and how much you're paying for them cable phone gym memberships? Any of it could you name them if you would ask me this question before I started using rocket money I would have said yes, and then I would have tried and I would have been wrong I would have undercounted there was one app. I won't name it, but it was magazine Articles audio I was paying 10 bucks a month for that to hear magazine articles dating apps not neil not great You don't need them neil couple dating apps three it makes me sound thirsty, but please ladies, you know, you know where to reach me Another speech thing just I had a lot of garbage Yeah, and the other thing that it does is it takes like ones where you have to call And like call again to they take care of it for you like you do nothing They I did gym membership that was a nightmare rocket money is a personal finance app that finds and cancels your unwanted subscriptions Monitor your spending and helps lower your bills overall Rocket money has 5 million users and has helped save his members an average of 720 dollars a year with over 500 million dollars in Cancelled subscriptions stop wasting money on things you don't use cancel your unwanted subscriptions by going to rocket money Dot com slash ne al. That's ro c k e t m o n e y dot com slash ne al rocket money dot com slash ne al I've got a low-level eating thing where I'm very I think about I don't have an eating disorder that you would recognize as one of the serious ones I think about food you don't you said you don't I think about food a lot and I'm I'm I'm this weight because I'm hungry a lot of the time I could be bigger But I feel you were bigger. I feel happier this way because I go well actually I don't think about it a lot But I think it's partly my mother passing and not taking care of herself and being a little bit overweight And wanting to take care of myself and be a be a parent for longer and that kind of you know all mortality I I think kind of grief is cumulative. You don't just grieve your What you're grieving at the time It's cute every time it's all your grief. I'm assuming or is it you're taking on your mother's grief I think you you go well, so when your mother does you grieve as the first big loss that I had But when friends have died since even pets have died since sometimes just it will hit you in a way that you think well Is that commensurate is that emotionally Yeah, I know them well enough to get your friend Sean died comedian. Yeah, that's pretty bad. Yeah a gill died I mean, I was it was really bad But but some my my dog died about six weeks ago One of my dogs that I had for 14 years and was mackey was beautiful beautiful dog And he passed and it was you know, we did it really beautifully at home The vet came to us But all the grief from the past comes back and you think about your own mortality It's a cumulative thing and I think somehow the controlling You know anyone that goes to a doctor should be consulting a chef first It's that that thing of like what you're putting in there. It has consequences. Yeah How's consequences down the line? We don't say that a lot because we want to be kind to people in the moment to your mother for instance Yeah, you want to be kind in the moment whereas I sort of my Not theory, but I think kindness is incredibly important But it's got a temporal element to it. You want to be kind in the future So being a parent kind of teaches you you want to be kind to your kid But you don't want to buy them McDonald's every day. You're so kind that it is a disservice. Yes that you go Well, you could give into them all the time. They want to watch tv and eat junk food That's what they want. Yeah, and you go. Well, no, you're gonna You know, we're gonna pretend to be different people than we are for the next 15 years Pretend we love broccoli and reading books And that's the And that's how you that's parenting and then at one stage we'll go. Ah, yeah, we love McDonald's Yeah, that's that's uh, I have a hard time with that meaning I am Very quick to Go to judgment or go to like well if you really want to know If you you know, I have a friend who's having a drinking problem And I'm I'm saying Yeah, you can feel Sorry for yourself. You can talk about all the things that have been done to you Can you stop drinking? because it's Going to do a it's going to do huge damage to you if you don't stop And and I but at the same time like I think I've been empathetic in the past, but now it's a bit like hey If you want I also can't take on Uh somebody like can you kind of help me with this? I'm like if it's drinking I can't because I'll get too codependent and I'll get too forceful and I'll get too Worried and if you drink I'll get super disappointed and judgmental of you and so that is interesting of like where do you draw the line with kind where does where does where's what's the when does kindness become kind of Yeah toxic for a lack of better word. What's that what's that book the uh this uh There's something mind this naked mind. Okay. This naked mind is a really good book because if a doesn't work for you And for a lot of people it just sort of doesn't yeah, it's not their thing So they go well, I'll get california sober and just do yeah Yeah, this book's really good because it's it's the john sarno. You know the guy healing back pain or the mind body connection Really interesting books on like back pain and how most of it's emotional in our society the thing on his book Uh, dr. Sarno is you read half the people read the book and their back pain goes away. Well, here's this guy I've read the book. I was in lisbon Just listen to it walked around lisbon had back pain. He said in the book. Oh the back pain will transfer into your shoulder For for like a day and then it'll go like it might pass through some of the bit of you Woke up with a frozen shoulder. Uh-huh and then gone He's just oh, okay. I know what that was about great. What was it about? It was about my relationship with my father Yeah, but it was like it was just gone like, okay All right, you kind of acknowledge that and you it was so quick and so It was almost felt like I feel like Uh, uh, a hippie kind of saying of like you read this book. It's certainly worth doing before you get the back surgery Yeah, before you get your scoliosis treated Read the book because I brought it up on this podcast for how long did you wake up every morning at the same exact time? And go How how long did that last maybe seven years seven years used to work every morning four a.m Panic attack. Yeah, that's pretty bad. That's bad seven years Did you do were you doing anything to counter it that time? Not really? No, I think it's like it's Panic attacks are weird because you can I had one on stage in in Australia once and I was like in front of 4,000 people And the gig went great Then I had a panic attack and it's I didn't say you were having a panic attack. No, uh, I And did you listen back to the performance? We've got panic attack stories, right? The um, We do I should tell the story. No finish it and then Okay, so so the panic attack like if if you haven't had one Fabulous and I you never need to experience it. Yep. If you the first one is the scariest after that Okay, the first one is like I can't you have no idea what's happening. Yeah. I I can't stand up I can't sit down. I don't want to eat. I'm hungry. I want to sleep. I'm not tired. I like it's everything It's Incredibly uncomfortable But you can function through it. There's no sense of ah And I thought it's there's something about my Voice and the way that I present myself where if I say I'm very insecure and that's why I tell all these jokes and I I don't not very self-confident and I think I'm a dummy Some might my voice where you go You can hear it on one level and another bit of you's going. No Yeah, fine very successful British man. Don't worry about it Yeah, but you have to be aware of how the world perceives you and then mediate between the two It feels like you know, sometimes let me having a panic attack because I don't sound like I'm Having a panic attack. So, okay Did did it start? Mother half is often surprised if I go Feeling a bit down Yeah, you seem fine. Yeah, you're talking about you're like an emotional Are they called bobbies the guy who's standing in front of the the overton window of my emotion is is is that like You can get you know get given a netflix special. It's like you're filming it. It goes great It's a huge deal and I'm oh good and then you know something your friend died. Oh, okay It's like are you talking about that's what people's expectations are that's what you're that's how I present Yes, how I feel I feel overjoyed and I feel sorrow, but I think I present fairly Yeah steady. Yeah, you're like the guy who stands in front of Downing Street The soldiers who won't the fur hat my panic attack story involving jimmy was So it's fairly laborious in terms of how I started having them Had started having them two weeks before three mikes and then I went on zoloft after that they stopped And uh, and then I'd stopped taking zoloft again I'm in london with dave chapelle And jimmy's there Uh that came to the show it was dave show and I go on stage Here's what I have. Trevor Noah had told me that people in England just heckle Freely as like part of the show. So I I'm like fuck. It's the same theater. I think he did and I'm like Like and and sena dave's robin was like, hey, you got to go out now when I was like what and then I go on stage James and jamila are there and I do A minute and I can feel the I'm getting tunnel vision Can't breathe can't think And I was just like, yeah Hey jimmy Come come on out and I got jimmy car and again. They're very happy to see you and I go backstage Catch my it's once I it only takes about 40 seconds to clear my body, but I don't know time Yeah, and then you brought me back out and I did a good set. So yeah, but it was like It was kind of unfortunate, but I could tag team tag team wrestling. Yeah um So so I understand panic text now. I take a beta blocker and they I get none before I go on stage All right. Yeah. No, I uh, I I kind of don't like medicating. I kind of not Like I like to feel my feelings. I like to kind of go. Okay. Well, I'll I'll feel that and as long as it's not Really bad. Like I got beta blockers one time when I got cancelled. I got I got some beta blockers It was the the tax thing that I had like in 2012. He said two scandals taxes and and Many many scandals in between not all of them make it to the states got it. Okay. I get cancelled about About every two years. There's there's an incident great Normally a joke, which is fine, you know, because you got a right size. I told a joke. Some people didn't like it That's kind of okay But when it's a big thing the tax thing really felt like oh, this could be Not an existential crisis, but this could end your career could change it and I got beta blockers I remember taking one the first day. I think okay, everything feels all right And they just had them as a sort of a talisman. It's like okay. They're there if you need them Don't need them right, but you rather yeah, I use Downton Abbey I think it has the same effect as valium. It's a very chill show. Yeah, nothing shocking is going to happen I found it very calming What are you watching any of them hadn't watched any of them and then watch those like for like 10 nights in a row Watch the season. I just really found it very kind of grounding I don't know why but sometimes it's like that thing of like What are you going to go to when you're feeling like going while I use comedy for that? Yeah, I think a lot of people use comedy for that Okay, so what are the you wrote anxiety disorder counterfactuals? What does that mean? I spend my like when I wake up at four in the morning in a panic attack Partly it's the physical thing But but and that's gone now. I don't really get rid of it I think having kids had a had a huge effect on that There's something more important than you in the world and that changes your outlook on life Just in a very positive way for me. I mean I've really wanted kids. I was really Excited about the prospect and then it's you kept saying please get me pregnant. Yeah, and it's it was so hard on those walks I'm the the It's it's it's like I mean it really feels like it's that that thing where You're not the priority anymore and it's that last stage of Growth Oh, I'm not a big deal. Okay. Yeah, it's like you don't worry about it But you do there's a there's almost like the the uh, you know how the big bang you can still hear the sound From the big bang in space. They they there's a rumble from it There's a low level rumble of anxiety with having a kid that no one talks about and it's the counterfactuals Like i'm not worried about falling off a cliff. I'm worried about jumping. I'm not worried about let's see You spend your life thinking about things that haven't happened won't happen But you're constantly thinking about something bad could happen to the kid there something bad So every new is it all based on it happening to him? Everything with the kids is about something bad could happen to him. So every news story becomes a Well, what would you even do if that if if something happened? It's It's it is that thing of uh, I can't remember whose quote is the it's like having a medical procedure where your heart lives outside of your body That does feel what it's like Do you ever worry about? Dying and abandoning him Him stuff like that or you have two kids now, but mortality feels like it's a Become a much bigger. It just based on like I don't want to hurt him I like I die it's fine if you're if you die and you leave your partner you go Well, yeah, I'd want them to be upset for a reasonable amount of time But please 10 years go love again. I would say like anything over two weeks. I'd be thrilled like Honestly, I should find someone else. She's super. Oh, I don't want it to not find something Super funny super great. Give it a give it a couple years Warren's eve on keep me in your heart for a while. That song sums it up beautifully. Think of me occasionally great But the but now with kids you're oh my god, you've got to make it through for them. Yeah we just talked before about having a kid and What's been yeah, you're one of my many friends who's had a kid and loves it. Yeah Tell me more about loving it I think it's the it's tickets to the great show in the world because it's like And uh, uh the emotional experience of like that bandwidth that I have of like the joy to sadness the edit kids are So when you're with them, you're I'm not great at meditating But when you're with kids you're in that moment With them and there's nothing else and it's kind of phones away and you're just kind of you're playing with them And it's incredibly fun to see the world and talking about a show where you're invested in the lead character Yeah, pretty big Yes, like the investment that you feel for your kid is and getting to know them Like you have the baby and everyone's obviously thrilled with the birth and they are as a kid and it's great Healthy and lovely and then you get to know them And everyone with one kid is a nurture everyone with one kid will tell you well We used oat milk and this kind of special soother and these nappies and so obviously he walked at nine months Everyone when they have two kids goes. Oh, they come out with factory settings They they just they are who they are So we you know, it's they're different and they're yeah, they've got they've got their own sense of self And you sort of see glimmers of that even when they're sort of one and a half you see this person It's just it's based on their taste movement Blinking how they are with you how just how they how they interact not speaking even not speaking like pre Pre-language you can tell who they are as a person. It's great. I mean I couldn't recommend it Okay, so we I think we covered the eating disorder Yeah, we but we're both pretty I think we're on a similar tip on that. I'd say there's not Yeah, when I just I get mad all of the things I eat that that are over a certain amount are They just go to my stomach and love handles and it's so It makes me so aggravated So that's what a lot of my like controlled food stuff is it's like I know where you're going So I have to keep it around us weight past that weight. It's just like and it's it's wrong It's an injustice It really is just like this is wrong what you're doing on my body. So I just have to keep it within a certain You know, we won't get into the weight, but Yeah, but uh, but So mine is You know, we're talking earlier about, you know, there may be maybe too many people talking about mental health On podcasts, I don't know If there are I don't think men are really the male eating disorders are totally on We talk about it on here, but like for the most part, I never see people talking about it I think maybe it's holding a mirror up because we're on tv. We're on podcast work and we see ourselves I think increasingly everyone is seeing themselves. I mean remember that thing when we were kids we were told The people of native south america think if you take a photo it steals your salt and I remember at the time thinking That's some nonsense and now With instagram, I think yeah Yeah, it does. Yeah, it does. It's it's not one photo. It's two million photos It's every photo you've ever seen of yourself So you have this perception of who you are that isn't really you you never get to see What effect you have in a room when you come in and you're 3d and you affect it By the way, you don't get it when you're looking in a mirror It's a reversed image. It's you ever sometimes they'll have flip mirrors or whatever they're called and you see and go, oh That's different. Yeah, it is a weird it also is be everything's a beauty contest Because of instagram and or some kind of contest which is as a person that's already competitive enough. It's like I don't want to participate. Yeah over there. There's a great book by will will store called the status game You read that? Yeah, I bought it and haven't read it I've read a few other status books Like about that weird thing about like what that that force that's going on sort of through life of like You're sort of comparing yourself to other people and how am I doing and the work all is my find You work more than anyone. I know Yeah, yeah, maybe kevin hearts got you but like I think probably has but but the like this year was 300 shows Which is that's a lot and it's difficult to It's difficult to justify because you kind of go well, you don't Need anything but it's the enjoyment of doing it. It's partly that thing of like going This might not last forever Is there an iron man element of it? Like I can do I can do 300 shows and they're all good Yeah, there's a there's a bit of proving something to yourself There's a bit of kind of going well, look if you write the show That feels like the tough bit to me right in the show going and performing is a pleasure It's a joy to do and it's slightly different every night and you mess around a bit And yeah, it's always an enjoyable experience to do the show And the travel can be you know hard on you or whatever, but I I love doing it I mean it's that thing of going and I think I get to spend more time at home than most Parents how come because I work Nights right, but you like how long were you in Australia? But the kids came to Australia. Okay, so it's that thing like the big trips they come You never away more than sort of 12 or 15 days would be kind of the Absolute max you'd want to be away and then you'd be home for the same amount of time when I'm home I'm home. So when you're home, you're around so even if I have the UK so small if I'm geeking in Britain You could I could leave the house at 430 and make it a Manchester for a show at eight You've got great trains. We've got great transport system drive back afterwards be up with the kids in the morning Yeah, it's it's like you look if you if Caroline's fine with it. You're fine with it What's there's no problem, but I think there is that thing of going there's a there's two things going on. There's one is Safety Is there a bag and or attackers? Do we have a roof over our head? Do we have enough to eat and then one is scarcity And I think the scarcity thing is like do we have enough if it all finishes tomorrow? Do we have enough and I think the reason One day there will be a trillionaire is because for some people a hundred billion wouldn't be enough Because there's a scarcity thing. So I think they're they're a bit of my mind that goes Or you need to don't turn it down. Are you going to put in a new tour? Yeah, of course, we're going to play everywhere again. Of course, you're going to go to all those places, of course More more more and do you keep an eye on that? Well, no because I mean it's it's It's very joyful. It's like traveling the world as well. You go. I can't complain about it I mean, it's like I really can't complain. It's like a I chose it And be like the idea of going I did 50 countries on the last tour fifties. Uh, like that's you saw the world Yeah, it's amazing. Right and you had your whole day for it Hang on and then and and you get to meet interesting people and ask them interesting questions because you're doing a show that now And you kind of need to know Oh, you know, whatever bizarre thing is on that tour where are the sluts from you need to ask that's often the thing Or what's the local town? Where would you where do you think the inbred people? It's often the and they've always got an answer. There's always all these guys. Yeah I'm just there last night. They said you guys I like when there's four people and they're all pitching their own like well, they are those people are Super inbred. Yeah, the the I will say that I feel like you've changed in the time. I've known you You've kind of grown or your values have kind of The other good thing about the amount of free time we have is like we can think about it we can think about Like what am I doing? There's more there's more Self-reflection time. Yes, I think so. I think if you're if you know, if you're working two jobs and supporting a family or whatever There's not a lot of time to be, you know Being well read is a massively privileged thing. Yeah, and for that Yes, so the idea of going yeah, I think I have changed and grown but I think that's You know, my favorite question I would like if you sit next to someone at a dinner and you don't know them What was the last thing you changed your mind about always a great question always very interesting to kind of go Well, what's the Are you just rearranging your prejudices if you have the same views you had when you were 25? If I can ask you What you think about abortion and from that I know every other opinion you will have like it's kind of no I like it when people are like What do you want to fence about? Yeah. Yeah. Oh, what what do you but peter teal has this question? Which is what opinion do you hold that? Would be very unpopular. Yeah amongst your crowd. Yeah Yeah in the world, it's right. It's really interesting. Oh, okay, that's and when do you what's too crazy? Yeah, it's like I think we need to open Our minds about what to do about downtown. Do you know what I mean? Whatever that whatever the thing is that you go It's but that's why I think free speech is so important because if you take away free speech You don't know what people are thinking And that's more dangerous when it bubbles up If you don't talk about stuff openly and people don't feel like they have a voice Then it bubbles up in very strange ways. Yeah, and these unexpected, you know shocks to people happen You know people are shocked by I don't know whatever it brexit or trump or the level of anti-semitism in the world now is You know genuinely it's like it's a huge issue and it's always been there But it was people didn't talk about it. Yeah, they didn't engage with that Which is you know, it's dangerous free speech is I think massively important. Yeah Yes, but I have a longer explanation like With it I I believe in limits, whatever. It's the wrong podcast We'll go on rogan, right. Um, yeah, so I would like to say that I you're a great friend Uh, you're a fucking hilarious guy. You'll pitch jokes I feel I feel guilt right now For not being funny enough on this podcast like I always feel like it's a different side of yourself You're showing on these things, but I go It's not enough But you know what I mean? It's like you yeah, I'm used to doing it So and I also like trade in confession like that's sort of my three mics and blocks is more professional When you watch three mics and when you watch blocks it is Pretty joke-to-joke. I mean like there's maybe more joking than you think Yeah, I mean even blocks like the the end of blocks, which is Great, but like right up until the like it's right up until the last moment. You got a funny funny funny funny Okay Emotional clothes. Yeah, which you absolutely earned right, but it feels like But I earned it by jokes in a weird way. So it's like it is I I agree with you But there's I I would I like you to be a little more not even emotional But like what you said of no one would believe most of your true setups. Yes. No one would believe like I'm insecure They'd be like Like I know I'm I'm against you. I don't buy this premise I think again, that's a that's another big thing in the world at the moment where you go. I'm not self-authored I can't tell the world who I am They write we have to make an agreement. Yeah, it's it's a mediation everyone your sense of self is a mediation between you and what the world thinks and Think again the world orders stand-up comics get on there tell some jokes Do you think and then you know earning out like there's a couple of longer bits in the next special which you've seen And you know longer bits which are more confessional which are more kind of you know open And it'll go that way a little bit more as I as I go But still my love language is one-liners by the way I You send me the special and you you'd also directed it and I think I was a little stingy with the praise Yes, I'm directing agreed agreed Because I've directed Because I because I came I come from writing directing so if and I'm so so much more impressed with Being a comedian and having a persona and having a great career So you were like what about the director and I was like I don't care I was like you're a jimmy car. I don't care that you can direct But I know it's a new thing that you've done And I should have been more I shouldn't have dragged you into my point of view I wouldn't I mean the thing about the direction on it was I think sometimes stand-up specials can be A tough watch Because it's three shots on repeat and I saw I wanted every camera shot to be moving I wanted everything to feel like it had like a natural and also was moving at kind of 92 beats a minute I felt like it had the energy the same energy as as what I was delivering and was constantly You know moving. I just think it's that thing of like you're used to watching that in every other genre And stand-up is quite can be quite. Yeah. Okay. I'm wearing that. What was your great line about? It's bo bernum's line. So good your t-shirt Is basically the production design Like it's the lights and Dynamics and and curtains and he's like, it's your shirt. We're here most of the time. So it's just your shirt Yeah, um, but having a bit more movement in it. What about I think it's better. I think it's the best thing I've done I agree, but I'm just saying like I didn't I was aware in the like shortly after the moment And uh, and I that's why I think there's a tendency sometimes when you go To not say it because you think the person doesn't need to hear it because there You know, he knows he's a safe pair of hands. He knows he's has You know two hours of great jokes, but you go That thing of when we send each other the new stuff. It's always that thing of going Yeah, no, so I apologize for that and I now I give you the compliment now Um, the compliment would have meant nothing if we weren't recording it. By the way, I would have just been Well, no, it's you would have forgotten immediately. Yeah, of course. Um This is great. This is anything you wanted to talk about that we didn't talk about Yes, the blocks podcast and the I don't know how long this is going to run for but I hope it runs forever. I've So enjoyed it. Uh, it's it's great. Thank you. It really feels like and kind of every time I listen I go I should watch blocks again I love doing it. So and again, it's your idea. So you're enjoying I like the basking reflected glory. I've had to do absolutely nothing And I've got like it was basically an idea for a podcast I wanted to listen to and I've so enjoyed listening to it Especially I think some of the people I didn't know their comedy that well Yeah, so I listened and then went and watched two specials off the back of it Which I kind of think is the perfect way Because you're so much more invested post this show Going and watching clips of karat top and going oh, it's a fucking good joke Like whatever the thing is that you go. I wasn't aware of his work particularly But you listen to know who he is as a guy and then work. We may be going to las vegas together We'll go see him. That'd be great. So that's the new brand and promise the u2 karat top double We'll see if we can get them to open for them I mean, I I know they got to be open to it. They I believe they they should open for him He should do this fear. Yeah Explo I mean, please Um, all right, buddy. You're the you're such a great guy. You're such a important figure in my life And I uh, I I'm I love him and it's now it's on film. Okay. Well, I uh Uh, this is awkward, isn't it? No, I I love you right back. I love you. Fantastic. God bless. Jimmy