 Yeah, yeah. All right, everyone. My name is Romeo von Herman and welcome to the ward eight. NPA meeting for April the 27th 2023. And I'm going to be today's facilitator for this meeting. I do have Keith with me as well here, Hannah. And myself and Sam in the room. We're going to go through the introduction announcement process right now. So I'm going to start that with myself and then we'll probably just go in a clockwise. My name is Romney. I work for Green Mountain transit. I was the station's customer service supervisor. I am also a member of the steering committee for ward eight NPA. And I'm glad to be here and ready to discuss the business of the day. And expert. I'm Keith. I live on university terrace. And I'm a member of the ward eight steering committee. Hi, everyone. I'm Hannah King. I live on college street and I'm the ward eight city counselor. I'll jump in. I'm Bill. I'm on the steering committee, but I'm out of COVID. Rehabilitation. So Keith and running the money. I'll be. I'm sure I'll jump in. I live on Bradley street. I am Dick grab. I live on hunger for. Taurus. And I'm a resident. I'm Linda. And I also live on hunger for terrorists and. Just attending the meeting. Thanks to everyone for organizing. Gary. Gary golden on the. East district school commissioner. Towards one and eight. And you can go ahead. Hi, my name's Emma. I'm just here and Tim is on vacation. So he can't make it. All right. And that concludes the introduction part of the meeting. I don't have any personal announcement to make, but anybody who has an announcement to make can go ahead now. If you haven't any announcement. Okay. We will move forward. And as always, we will go with ward eight residents to have their say. And. Before I say anything, I'm extending the floor to any ward eight to. Speak this time. And get the first opportunity to speak in the meeting. Anybody wants to take the opportunity to speak from ward eight. Linda, were you saying something? Okay. I'll just go ahead. Sorry. Thanks. Oh, no, that's okay. Oh, that's all right. Thank you, Linda. I saw an article regarding the pods. This week, and I thought it was worth mentioning in this meeting. Where the residents were having concern regarding. Safety issues as well as the neighbors were. Having concern with all the noises and all the. Folks that actually don't live on the pods that show up, although in the middle of the night. And are creating very unsafe situation for the folks that are living in there that are trying to get some help. And members of the neighbors spoke to the folks that live in there. Try to find out what is going on. And the folks that do live in there said that, you know, it's not them necessarily. It's just folks that are coming in, trying to either sell something or trying to connect with somebody who lives there. Who end up overstaying their time around the pods. So all in all, hopefully we'll have maybe someday somebody just kind of give us update on that. But, but that's something that I thought it's worth mentioning. Yeah, that's for me for now. I guess I feel like I should say something. I just came from watching channel three news and the announcement that the university medical center has opened up. Housing units in South Burlington for staff. For their staff. And that's, that's a great idea. But I think it's a real lost opportunity for our, for our district to not house those people. They make great neighbors and hopefully they will walk to work, but I suspect that they may not be able to all the time. And so we will have some more traffic from those people walk coming in from South Burlington. Again, I think it's a, for an issue for our district where we continue to allow the university to use our housing for to house its students, yet staff at the hospital and at the university and the graduate students that are going to be coming in this summer are not going to be able to find available housing. Because it's because June 1st, it'll all be occupied by the new set of undergraduate students that will be moving in. This is Bill church with respect to housing. I had a brief conversation with Bruce Baker. Who is, I believe there's been a, he's got a plan to develop the old YMCA and he's asked to appear at the steering committee in ward eight next month. To present that plan. Apparently the, there was an issue of the homeless people had been, were able to break into it. And there were up to 20 or 30 people living in there. I think that they've, the police has been, have been involved in moving them out. We know that when you walk by there, it can be in pretty rough shape sometimes, but there is apparently a plan. Which is being promoted. And Bruce is going to try to come next meeting to talk about that. And that's basically what I know, all I know about that, but that would be a big help for ward eight. If that property could be rehabilitated somewhat. Thank you. Thank you, Bill. You want me to give updates? Yeah, we'll come to you. All right. So if nobody has any, anything for ward eight. We will move on to. Gary golden to give us any update he might have. Gary. Thanks Romeo. So a couple of things happening at the, at the schools. The. Search has concluded for the new BHS principle. So that person's name and bio will be released next week after the vote Tuesday night. Several really good candidates that we could have gone with any of them. So we were really there at the end. Sort of luck out on who stepped forward. Lots of experience, lots of. Good connections were made during the visits. The second set of candidates. The two of them showed up or were. At BHS on the 13th two weeks ago, toured met with students and staff. And both came away with good reviews. They both spoke that night. For broadcasted webcast. So we were able to do that. And answer the same set of questions. That all went well as, as well. So. That's happening. Going well. There are some. Staff changes that are happening. Throughout the district with a couple of. Administrators. Leaving their posts, but. Probably two will be moving within the district. I'll be coming best. Some of that's been notified to the school. Some hasn't. So. I'll be posting tomorrow, front page form. And I'll. Do links to the information when it's available. Through that source. Construction is moving on. And going well. We had a second vote for. Contracts last week. And we're. Going to move on. Just slightly over budget, but within the contingency funding. So we're doing well for that. We've probably seen notices that the. Our ability to move into the building has been delayed into. The fall and winter of 2025. Rather than summer of 2025. Mostly due to the. Lawsuits. We had to give Monsanto. We had to give Monsanto. We had to give Monsanto. We had to give Monsanto. Their own experts to come in. And do. To assess. What has happened. If you're. Do you have access to WCAX? They're running a series about. How the high school. Situation happened. I think tonight was Dr. Levine. Basically have. I haven't watched it yet. Having to defend. The. State Board of Health. I think we've seen. A lot of things happening around and timing. Around getting the school district notice about the change of. Standards that we've gotten it earlier. We might have. Changed some of the. Some of what we did, but for the most part, a lot of the building was. Beyond use. Especially the tech center part. It was not going to be remediated. Really. Extravagant cost. And it was due for remake. It was due for. 21st century skills, not 20th century skills. So. I think it was time to be able to. Redo that. And. Really make some plans for. Upgrading. What's offered. Other than that. Also, though, there was a presentation about the new reading. Program. I'll be posting tomorrow. It's about page four. Read some of that. And then we're going to do. The new. The new phonics based reading program. We heard from. Three of the. Integrated art staff who use it regularly and. Talk about the advantages that this new program has. Too early to get. Too much data, but. Everything looks good so far. Several schools have showed really good progress with it. You really need a couple of years to. You know, You can get this actually it's students included. Getting them trained on how to use the program to their benefit as well. And to get a comfort with it. So that's what's happening right now. Be willing to ask her. You know, address any questions you have. Bill, let me start first. I attended the homeless. Alliance meeting. Earlier in the month and. We were there. We were there presenting and. We'll be looking at some partnerships. Kind of. Look at what's needed and share resources in the future. It's going to be a. Progression of. Planning that's going to happen because, you know, budgets have passed. We'll just have to figure out what existing resources we can bring to bear. So, you know, We've had a lot of coordination. In our case, when I worked in the district. 20 or 15 years ago. What I saw in the North end was a sort of a progression. Not progression. As people. Lost housing in one area. Like the old North and they moved to Milton. Or they would. You know, You know, You know, You know, Other areas had had cheaper housing. So it really was. Kind of a transient community within a. Stable community. So we really should be working with those other districts to try to. Figure out how to. Assist, you know, these families who find themselves in these really dire situation. So I'll keep you posted. The next homeless alliance meeting. I think it's going to take place next Thursday at nine o'clock and talking. Bring back. I'd like to attend. So now a question. Anything I can address. Yeah, Gary. This is Bill. Thanks for the update on that. I. I would like to talk with you more about that offline and I will try to. Attend next Thursday. With respect. With respect to the principal. Generally. Without getting into details of the each of any candidate. I think it's going to be. A set of criteria. Which the school board. Is looking for. Individual, right? It could be, they want an advanced degree. They want. Areas of specialty or something. Can you share. What the. The objective for the hiring was at the school board level. You know, it never is easy. It's just the best candidate. There's, there's an objective they're trying to fill, right? Yeah, it's a, I mean, Keith can speak to this too as a former school board member. In this case, it's. They're, they're having to deal with a, you know, The downtown campus is just, you know, kids will be able to brag to their kids and grandkids. I attended, you know, high school in a mall. So their kids may not know what malls are at that point. Who knows. So that. It self presents a certain. A set of issues. So you're looking for somebody with flexibility. Somebody who can think on their feet. Somebody can deal with. Just the situations that that's not built. To do school in. So that's one piece. The, we are looking for somebody with. Good experience. We were very fortunate. The last three candidates standing. They're all either. Former principals. One's a superintendent. And in the area. And one's an assistant principal down the Hanover high school, which is a dual state. School. So they have Vermont students from Norwich. So that's helpful. They're all three familiar with Vermont. Regulations. With how Vermont does business, which is really. You know, something that's been the downfall of. The, the, the, the. The, the, the, the recent. Administrators. So. And parts. And then also, you know, we have them. Probably the most unique school. And Vermont. With our large, global majority population. Really talking about. Something that. Very few other schools. Are dealing with. who can come to that issue with some knowledge, some empathy and sensitivity, because there's a whole different set of issues for many in that population. Many are coming from very traumatic settings, coming in some cases straight from camps in either Africa or stop-off stops in Europe or other places as they're waiting for sponsors. So many of them have ongoing trauma that needs to be addressed. Your administrators need to be knowledgeable about how to deal with that. And then it's really our passion for deep learning. That's one of those strategic goals that the board has set up and that Flanagan is in total agreement with and speaks to quite often. So you're not just looking for getting by on test, you're not just looking for passing, you're really looking for engagement for your students to become lifelong learners. And that's a whole different process than the stand-in-the-liver teaching that's happened for 100 years in the US. So those are some of the things that we're looking for. In this case, we're very fortunate the superintendent had been of, that was a candidate had been of the principal down Harwood for seven years and was there during that horrific car crash that took five students. So, you know, she brings a wealth of knowledge. Deb Oprey from Hanover is assistant principal there, has served schools in Vermont. She brings an awareness of the black and students of color issues feels very comfortable with that. Marlon from Spalding principal there this last year and has experienced in the S. Westford district. So they're all pretty connected to us. They all bring, you know, the necessary credentials, experience. It really was a wealth of great candidates that I think Tom and the advisory council committees have done a good job of weaning through references and interviews. And it'll be, I think, a great presentation Tuesday night as we learn more about the candidate that Tom has and the council has come up with. So if you want to, I think that'll be early in the agenda Tuesday night if you want to zoom in for that. Any discussion of where they think they're going to live in Burlington? Do they have to live in Burlington? Well, though, I think our former superintendent has made that an ongoing, this is what you need to do. In the past, there's inflexibility like when Jeannie Collins or other administrators have come on, there's an exception that they already lived in the area. So Jeannie lived in Shelburne, made sense for her to be able to just be wavered because of that. But certainly if you're moving into area, the expectation is you're going to move into Burlington and your kids are going to go to Burlington schools. And I haven't heard that said explicitly, but like in Amy Rex's case from Milton, there may be an exception on not sure where she lives, but she may probably already lives in the county because she works there. But if the other two or one of them is the final candidate, I think the expectation would be they live in Burlington, be a taxpayer in Burlington, be a consumer in Burlington with children that they have children attending the schools. Good question. Thank you. Anybody else? Gary, do we have any clarification as to whether we're going to receive some money from the state for the rebuilding of our high school? Do we know how much that money might be? Yeah, 15 million is still on the table through Martine Gulick's efforts. I think if you read her latest front porch four and you'll get as the news that I have, I think the state money is going to be tied up with, you know, if they give us the money we're requesting almost drains what's in the fund currently. So it's going to have to be new legislation. If they give us the funding, they're establishing a standard for everybody else's request can be and what will be honored. I mean, I have thoughts that I'm trying to be relating to Martine about, I think it should be based on severity. I think it should be based on per capita. I mean, we have over 900 students that are affected by this construction, this cost, you know, and you're not even getting into that a lot of that cost and sort of caused by the states dragging their feet to get new regs put out. That's just not going to come into play. The legislature is not going to take that into consideration but we have to go back to some form of state provided school construction money. Problem is, where's that money come from? There are no pools of money sitting up there waiting to be tapped. So something else is going to suffer and that's where the legislature has their problem. They just don't know, I think it's a federal response and I think that's who we're going to miss Senator Leahy because he could tap that kind of money. Senator Sanders is next up, you know, with seniority. I think we have to start looking at money from there. Monsanto, I think has a couple of outs. I'm not sure how that's going to go but that will play itself out over years. They're not going to, they will not go silently into the night. They're going to fight this new through the nail because everyone's affected by this problem. And what I've seen is they will say that this is more because of our department of health than it is their product. Should be interesting, it's going to be a fight. All right, Gary. Thank you very much for the update. We're going to move on to our city council. Thank you. You're welcome. We have Hanuking here in our presence. So Hanuk, go ahead. I'll keep it brief so we can stay on schedule but we had our first official meeting of the new council a couple of weeks ago, we had two work sessions. I just looked at community infrastructure projects funded by ARPA as well as the Moran plant. And then we got a livable wage report from the city. So pretty light meeting. We're going to be meeting on Monday and big things are there's a resolution in support of dedicating the airport to Senator Leahy as well as a presentation on the neighborhood code. So looking at zoning changes and there is a board of finance meeting before it that will look at adding a new position to the police department. And so that will just be a discussion and that's kind of everything. Thank you, Hannah, for the update. We're a little bit ahead of time but I'm going to just go ahead and move on to Linda. Go ahead, please. Just a quick question for Hannah. Hannah, do you know what committees you'll be on yet? Yeah, so I serve on CDNR, HR and TUC. And so CDNR met for the first time tonight and we looked at our big discussion was looking at changing the camping policy. That's kind of been a big thing that's been going on for the last couple of months looking at public camping. This was just trying to build a resolution that essentially will send the policy back to CEDO so that way they can do more research on it. So no big changes there. Oh, sorry. So HRs look like you work with city employees and they're meeting tomorrow and we're just looking at policies about city employees and that will be the first time we're meeting. TUC is Transportation Energy and Utilities. We're meeting in May. We don't have the agenda for that yet. And then CDNR is Community Development and Neighborhood Revitalization. Thank you, Hannah. Anybody else that have a question for Hannah, please go ahead. All right, seeing none. I'm gonna go ahead with an update that I wanted to provide the ward 8 NPA. Are we talking, sorry, are we talking, are we gonna do the YMCA? Oh no, we're not gonna do the YMCA or the library. Can I do an update then about the Y? So I've had quite a few folks reach out to me that live in the Y's neighborhood about the traffic and parking situation. And so I don't know, I don't think anyone on this call has reached out, but I know that there are Bradley Street folks and hunger for tourists folks that have and I'm working with the city and the Y to try to figure out a plan if we can somehow change what the parking requirements are and traffic there, which would hopefully lighten the load and stress on the neighborhood. Kyle Dotson who runs the Y has agreed to do a listening session with neighbors if you're interested in that. And so him and I could do that together at an NPA if we think that would be helpful to kind of brainstorm ideas and figure out ways to improve that. But that's the Y update that I had. Thank you, Hannah. I just have to report that Mary Danco did respond to our request to me tonight. And unfortunately at the last minute she had to go out of town, but she is really excited about being asked back next month. So she will talk to us about the library next month if we want to have that. Thank you Keith as well. All right. And if there's any additional questions or statements regarding the YMCA of library we're happy to take any from anybody as well. All right. Seeing none, we'll move on to the next item of the agenda which is the update from the police commission for this month of April that we're still in. I attended one of them. I haven't had a chance to attend the other one but I looked at the agenda that was on file on their website, the police commission and it more or less encompassed what they've discussed the prior meeting in this month of April which pretty much covered the department directives for fair and partial policing reviewed. The Burlington police department adopted cultural sensitivity training as well as additional language for the police public communication section. The Maya Scholls president of NA NA NA NAACP for Rutland rather spoke to the training materials that the police department here in Burlington uses and the need for the police to be held accountable statewide. Jeffrey, former African-American Vermont state police officer shared his experience during this meeting that the department and how PDP Brown to police department needs to seize the moment as well as any changes in the recommendation under the policy section such as gender, gender identity, sexual orientation, those definitions within department training policies. Public forum was extended which I spoke to the need for the Burlington police department to expedite the hiring of public engagement and community officer and why that is important to the department to have that so they have somebody who's from the community that can help rebuild the trust between the department and department unions as well as the community and the current acting chief. The acting chief chief Murat, John Murat rather spoke to or rather shared the chief's report regarding the Brown to police department and the current state of the city, safety plans, trends, the police's response and training and that of course can be found on the website at berlington.gov slash chiefs and hyphen reports. Input on civilian oversight ordinance has been discussed as well and timeline as well as process of members of the chatter and ordinance committee are also working on changing the oversight authority of the police commission. Discussion was also included regarding the mayor's memo that was directed to the commission as well as the acting chief to exchange information such as the use of force and other police actions against civilians. They've also spoke to the police review for reporting corruption and as well as misconduct included a better response to police officers who want to respond to any corruption as well as misconduct within the department. They've also discussed any additional recommendations that was on file and I think that more or less encompasses what the meeting was all about. If you have any questions feel free to ask and also it can be checked on the TV as well on YouTube. Can I make two comments? Yes please. I met with the acting chief for a couple of hours on Tuesday and just a few notes on Romeo's presentation. The department's training that was part of mandatory training that happened over the course of two days and so they split up the department so that way they could do that and they watched a Netflix series that looked at different types of policing as well as how different marginalized communities are impacted by communities and then the chief puts out a report every month and so that's what the chief's report is and that's where they outline all of the data of if you're interested with how many car thefts have happened in Burlington which I found to be a really alarming number. I think we're at like 103 for the year compared to the normal which is like 15 so you can find all of that data in there but that's kind of those were just my two comments. Thank you, Hannah. Any additional comments regarding the police commission's report? Can I ask you a question regarding that? Sure. So I work with the disabled community, people with intellectual disabilities, they tend to speak up. I work with people with intellectual disabilities but they are adults and a concern that my coworkers and I tend to have revolve around policing because we're not always with them. When you talk about police reform I often think about people of color but I know people I work with have had run-ins with police because they act a little different. Is any of the police reform? Because I know it's not the majority of what happens but I know that there are times that if someone doesn't act the status quo they're gonna be questioned by the police for not. Has there been any of that within? I know I'm just curious if that's inedible. Yeah, so from what I was told from the acting chief in that training it looked at how the police interact with different groups in general. Okay, perfect. Like historically like LGBTQ folks like situations like that I can ask though if like what their policy is because I feel like we hear a lot about how the police interact with folks that are having a mental health crisis or whatever it may be but that's a community that I'm not sure we focused on and so I think we're just curious. Thank you. No, it's a really good question. This is Bill, can I ask a question about that? Hannah, it sounds like there are other communities that may need to be brought into the discussion with the police. I think it's hard to put all the onus on the police department to understand all the different segments that really they affect but by inviting these groups into talk to the police then they can hear directly. So that's a different approach. I worry that there's so many people who maybe don't feel comfortable coming to the police but how do we identify groups such as the intellectually disabled who can now come in and have a conversation with the police at some level or even at maybe an NPA meeting where their point of view can be heard and understood. Yeah, I think that's part of a lot of the work that the CSOs are doing just because they're unarmed and unsworn and so there I think four communities that don't feel comfortable around sworn officers they can be more approachable but I think that there have been avenues to try to get different types of communities into the same room to talk with the police but also with the understanding that like as you mentioned there are so many groups of people that don't even wanna be in the same room as a police officer because they just don't feel comfortable based on their own experience or other folks. And so I think that different offices in the city such as REIB are looking at ways to have those discussions without and doing it in a format that is comfortable for everyone. Thank you, Hannah. Anybody that has questions or anything? All right, fantastic. Again, like I said, we're a little bit ahead of schedule by two minutes on our next item of the agenda which is basically the next meeting agenda. One topic that I wanted to bring up that I've discussed previously with Keith and I believe Bill and Linda our steering committee members was the what we can do with our NPA budget or the funds that we have and if there's any discussion can be put forth right here on the floor any idea suggestions would be welcomed. So the floor is open to anybody that have ideas on what we can do with the existing funds that we have right now. I would say we need to get creative about how we are advertising the NPA. I feel like we've had a relatively steep decline in engagement over the last couple of months. I think people are probably just tired of going to meetings but I think as a group we should think about, do we flyer in the neighborhoods? So paying for printing, like ordering more lawn signs kind of what that looks like paying for Facebook ads to reach a larger audience but I would say that would be my number one suggestion. So all those things have been talked about do we need a proposal, a natural proposal Romeo to just vote on these things or do we need to present estimates from vendors or I mean, we've been talking about these things for many months. What's the next step to take action on this? You have to put together a budget. I think what I was looking at was having at least maybe four or five up to six ideas that can be put to vote for the next meeting or the meeting after that we can decide on that we can do. I think Sam has information on the process. Yeah, so the process for your budget is really simple. We are, CEDO is very like lenient with whatever you want to do. So you don't have to like put together a budget. Honestly, if you just find something they want to do for advertising you send me an invoice and I can send you a couple more forms that you fill out and then we can kind of get the ball rolling that way. One thing I will say is that our finance team is trying to have all of our purchase orders in which is what you'd be kind of basically setting up in by June, I think June 1st. So you have a month to kind of work on it but I believe you guys have your entire budget but yeah, there's no like process you have to do for voting. If you want to do that in the NPA, that's great but if you want to just start getting things done the steering committee members can just start sending me invoices or receipts and stuff like that and then we can kind of get the ball rolling on that. So what we've done in the past is we the steering committee would put together a list of like five ideas or whatever it was and then at the next meeting which normally was the main meeting presented to the group and then we would have a vote with the group is everyone okay with this after discussion and then that's how it was decided but you can change it obviously. Thank you, Hannah. So about this, so there's two things. First of all, the way the steering committee does it in some of the other wards is we basically keep our eyes open for things that we'd like to fund. Now, if other people just come off the street or just come to us and say we have a proposal then we obviously take that into consideration and give that a heavy emphasis but generally what happens is that almost all the ideas are generated by steering committee members. So you see something you wanna fund like some of the like some examples are some of the festivals that happen in the summer or people who are doing like like there's a food giveaway program in Pomeroy Park there's a repair cafe on North Street that helps people repair this. So we find things that we think are a good fit for that money and we propose those. So again, if someone comes from the public we don't get very many of those. So almost all the money that we spend comes from the steering committee. We talk about it ourselves and then we bring it up at a neighborhood planning assembly meeting to give the public an opportunity to talk about it and then we just approve it. Now you guys are behind the, you guys are in trouble because this money's running out real fast. So if you've got something that you can decide right this minute like say there's something I can't think of anything but if there was a festival or something that happens in Ward 8 that you wanna fund you could do that probably tonight and you could just say but you haven't contacted anybody so it's impossible to do but I'm just saying that that's how it works. So you guys figure out what you wanna do and take it from there. That's how most of the wards do it. So the steering committee comes up with the ideas and sometimes we'll approach groups and say would you accept funding? Can you think of a good way to spend the NPA money that promotes the NPAs? So basically it's up to you guys to go out there and aggressively spend your money your time is getting really thin here. And see we allocated our money back in like October and so they've had all this time to spend their money and so we know if they're spending it or not and how much we have left over. So we're way ahead of the game and you guys are way behind the game. So I just thought I'd mention that. Thank you. Thank you Charlie for your support. I think we have, we know. I think we know the people here know what we should be spending it on. For example, we need to support front porch form because they support us. We need to support Tom meeting. We need to give some donations to them. Facebook, definitely. I think we already know. And then we do need to do signs and Vantage has given us a quote. We're ready to go. It's just that our steering committee has to take the bull by the horns or whatever you wanna call it and just do it. And I think Charlie has given us that told us, yeah, first of all, we didn't really know that we had $2,500 until a couple of months ago. So we're still learning, I guess. Perfect, perfect. Will it be $2,500 next year? Do we know? Yeah, we're getting into budget season. Okay. It would be nice if we were told that maybe in the summer, whenever we, or September, what our budget was. So that we would, yeah. All right, perfect. Anything from Rob, Bill, Gary, Linda? I'm sorry, I was talking to Ann. You were asking about ideas or are we gonna move on? Yeah. Yeah, go ahead, Bill. So Keith, you were on this weekend. We'll go down and buy damn lawn signs from Vanguard. Okay, good. I'm around, yes. And basically all we need to do is take the one we had that had one and eight on it and take the one out and we have one. Because they want to design and that's another expense that they have to have. So they'll do- We don't care about that anymore. We got the YMCA, we want to have a party with them and we'll throw in some money with the YMCA. Okay. We'll get a big banner to hang in front of the library on nights of committee meetings. We can spend the money. Perfect, perfect. Okay. All right. Any additional comments on that in the meeting at all? No. Okay. I wanted to bring up which that I was hoping that I could put as part of the next item agenda is considering that Ward 8 has a heavy student presence to have hopefully way to reach out to students. I would say it's a little bit tricky for like undergrads just because they will not be here. Okay. But there's probably other ways to engage the student government. I'm happy to connect you or just connect with the contacts that I have. Okay. And then other ideas for next meeting, obviously the why that doesn't have to happen right away, obviously. If you want a presentation from the acting chief, he said he'd give it. I think it could be cool to have the CSOs come in, CSLs talk about their experience in the Ward 8 neighborhoods. Gail from Oscar, Office of Student and Community Relations at UVM. She can talk about like the work that they've been doing. Could we have the, ideally the CSOs as well as the acting chief that be possible? Let's just get CSOs that are available. Yeah, I can ask. That's just gonna be long. That will probably be the meeting because he talks and then with the CSOs too, just like keeping. I wouldn't like to have, I don't know if we ever had him here. What? The acting chief. Oh, yeah, we have. Actually, we've had him twice. Oh, okay. He's very, he's very... If he's open to it. Flexible. Yeah. We're happy to have the CSOs. Yeah, so if that's something you decide you want, just tell me and then I'll reach out. We had a resident of Ward 8 in the newspaper seven days today had a comment. So it seems like it's on Ward 8 people's minds. So we probably should have him back. And I like the fact that you've got some, more than just the chief. Yeah. We don't need to hurry reaching. I'm hesitant. I know we're not. Sam, you're gonna have to shut me off cause we're not supposed to debate. No, no, go ahead. I'm hesitant to, the police chief, I hope is a really busy guy. And to have him to a third meeting of five people in Ward 8, I'm not sure that's really effective anymore. And just from his standpoint, everybody wants to talk to him, but nobody wants to come to the meeting to talk to him. So I'm just hesitant to inconvenience him to talk to me one more time. Or if anybody feels that way or differently, we can do it that way. But that's kind of my take on it. I think it would be our responsibility to do some really good outreach to make sure people come to the meeting. True, true. But I hear you. Yeah. Right. We'll have a discussion at the steering committee meeting, right, Bill? Absolutely, Keith. Best place to go. Thank you, Bill. All right. So any additional suggestions for the next meeting item agenda? If you want to library, if you want the librarian to come and say a few words. Yeah. I think we have a long list of ideas that Hannah's given us. Okay. If we're going to keep it in the hour that we're... Yeah. All right. Fantastic. Yeah. Okay. And if there's nothing else on any ideas or any suggestions, I think our meeting adjourns much earlier than normal time. Thank you for everybody being here and we're signing off. Thank you all. Thank you. Thank you, everyone. We're in this area. Thank you, Linda. I live... Thank you, Romeo. Hannah. Thank you. Bye.