 into the heart of man, the things which the Lord has prepared for those who love him. Welcome to Hope Today. I am Angela Madden and I am here today with Tom Hollis. That's right. I love how you started that because, you know, when we're looking for peace and joy, you know, we focus a lot on doing. Maybe we need to pray more. Maybe we need to, you know, there's a lot going on in our lives right now with the holidays. Maybe we need to read the Bible more or do something. But what if the answer really isn't found in doing? What if the answer is as close as a simple question, Jesus, how do you see this? Pastor Allen writes, going to be with us. He's going to share how we can see as Jesus sees and get a new perspective that can awaken joy in our lives. Angela, I love this subject. Yes. I mean, changing our perspective literally changes our world. I think King Solomon said something about that, Tom, as a man thinks in his heart, so is he. I believe that today this story, this, this author is going to bring to us some light that is going to shift us to see Jesus all around us. Well, I always think of that, the verse that says we see through a glass darkly now, you know, and then we shall see face to face. Well, we're not going to be then yet, but we are going to be able to get a perspective, a better perspective on what Christ has for us in our lives, seeing it the way he sees it, seeing it from that heavenly perspective means so much to us. So I know it's going to be a great conversation. And there's a story about this girl Joy that is amazing. We should get to that, but amazing story of what God does in her life. But I also want to let you know about Testament Tuesday. It's a new thing. We're starting here. Every Tuesday we'll either have a testimony from somebody or a scripture that we just feel like God wants us to testify about. We're going to do that today. I love it. And you know, scripture tells us all the time that we're made overcomers by the blood of the lamb and the word of our testimony. And this Testament Tuesday is going to be a focus on that. And we're going to see some victory in our own lives, Tom. Absolutely. I love that. Well, when we view the world and life circumstances through our perspective, that's what we do all the time, right? Well, we can see the flaws, the struggles and the other negative things that come to mind. But what if we could see the world and our lives through a different perspective through the eyes of the one who came to save us? Pastor Allen Wright is our next guest and in his book, Seeing as Jesus Sees. What a great title. Huh? Seeing as Jesus Sees. He shares how one simple prayer can change how you think, feel and act. Pastor Allen, it's great to have you back with us on Hope Today. Oh, Tom is so good to be with you and Angela is so good to be with you. Merry Christmas to you both. Thanks for having me. Yeah. Merry Christmas to you too. So let me ask you about the, we're going to ask about that simple prayer in just a second. But I love a story you start with, even right in the introduction from Stephen Covey, the famous guy from Seven Havets of Highly Effective People. Tell me what he said and what that experience was that changed things for him. Well, you just imagined him. He's a busy, busy man. He has a busy day. This business man, he gets on the subway. And you know, he just wants to relax, wants to unfurl his newspaper and relax. And then another man gets on, he has a couple of boys. And the boys are just rambunctious. They are, they're bouncing into people, grabbing at newspapers and they're just, they're just bothering everybody. And, and you can imagine is this business man sits there and he's thinking about, you know, the problem with the world today. I don't know all the thoughts in his mind, but you know how our mind start going, that's the problem. Disciplines are kids anymore and, you know, it can lead to another thought like, boy, if I were the parent, I would do this and such. And you know, we get in our minds, we think we know what's going on. And more he stews over it, there's something that's bothering him more than the boys themselves and that's this inattentive dad. So finally he, he, he stews long enough that he just has to say something. So sir, sir, he said, can't you see that your, your kids are bothering people and don't, don't you think you ought to do something about it? And he said, as if out of a fog, the man, as if waking up said, uh, yes, yes, uh, the father said, I, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, boys, calm down, calm down. He said, I'm sorry, sir. He said, I, I'm not thinking straight. Uh, they're, they're, we just left the hospital. They're, their mother died two hours ago and I'm not thinking straight and neither are they boys, calm down, calm down. Well, as you can imagine in, in, in, in a blink of, of the eye, just like that, this businessman, Stephen Covey said, you know, everything in him changed, right? Because now he's saying, no, no, no, they're not bothering me. Don't, don't worry about it. How can I help you? I'm so sorry. And the thing is that he meant it. He meant, he meant it from the depths of his heart because that's, that's how fast frustration can turn into compassion. That's how fast, uh, um, just wanting to, to, to, to fuss at somebody turns into being kind to them. And, and I just think about that so much and how, if, if in some that just in a worldly sense like that, our whole perspective can change how we think, how we feel and how much more so spiritual sight. Because I really think, as you were saying in our intro, Tom, it's not, it's not by us trying harder to be more patient, that we become more patient, uh, if it were that easy, we could all just do it. There's something else and part of the way the fruit of the spirit and part of the way that spiritual maturity happens in our lives is God gives us the gift of fresh vision to see accurately. And when we do, it changes everything. And that's what I'm just so interested in helping people with and for my own life is growing by the power of the gospel, by the power of God. And, and, and this little prayer, Jesus, how do you see this? It's, it's a tool. It's a spiritual practice that, that has changed a lot for me. And I just want others to, to practice it also. So Pastor Allen, are we spiritually blind then? I mean, are we like stumbling around in the dark? I mean, I guess we are a lot, but, uh, and does that prayer just saying that prayer has, has, has God met you when you've prayed that prayer and opened your eyes so, so many times. And, you know, any of our viewers could identify with this, the times where you thought you saw something accurately and then realized you didn't. And sometimes it's, it's the difference in judging somebody versus loving them. And sometimes it is just in our own attitude. And what I've been finding is I've been praying this prayer for a better part of four years now is that as soon as I say, Jesus, how do you see this? It gives me a pause, a mini Sabbath, a mindful moment, a moment in the busyness of life to say, reorient Jesus, you know, really. I want to see this through your eyes. So there's, there's in the first place, if nothing else, it causes you to pause and let your heart connect with Christ. So there's a pause and there's a connection. And then there's just simply looking again, how, how, maybe I've been seeing it wrong. Let me, let me look again and whether it be in a frustrating moment or whether it be in a moment of confusion or whether it be in a moment where I feel like I've just lost my sense of wonder. I found that through that simple prayer, just brief enough for a single breath, but really found it to be deep enough to, to transform so, so much. And when I pray with people, I say, Jesus, how do you see this person? When I start feeling frustrated when I'm reading the newspaper, I say, Jesus, how do you see this world? When I, when I am in a difficult situation in a relationship and I can feel myself getting that sense of frustration or Jesus, how do you see this person? And it's just been a beautiful new spiritual practice. It's changed a lot for me. So, you know, you, you, you shared generally there and I love what you shared. Is there like a specific moment in your own life where you, you can let us in on how God kind of changed that, that, that view for you? Well, I divided the book into parts where we talk about how we became spiritually blind. And then how, how do we see ourselves through Jesus's eyes? How do we see others and how do we see the world? And I guess the first thing I would share, Tom, is that my, my world got rocked and broken. And then I was in fourth grade and my dad left home. I didn't think there was anything wrong with our family. I thought we had a perfect family. But my dad, who was beloved in our community as a TV newsman, and I loved him, I coached my football team. He told me spy stories at night and, and suddenly he was gone. And, and throughout most of my growing up, he struggled with alcohol addiction. And I didn't know how any of that was affecting the way I saw myself when I saw the world, but it does. And so I didn't know it, but I was seeing through a lens of shame. Is there something wrong with me? Is there, is there a way that if I were to perform better, dad would come back home is the way that you're loved and accepted in this world by making sure that everyone likes you and that you perform well enough. All of these things that go along with this sense of not measuring up. And I didn't even know I was seeing the world that way. I lived my life. I went to seminary. I even started in my first pastorate. I had no idea. I didn't know why I was driven. I didn't know why I felt like I was becoming a workaholic. I didn't know why it was felt too devastating when someone was, was critical of me or disappointed in me. I didn't know why I was having some of the struggles I was having in the way that Ann and I, my wife and I were relating. I didn't even know it because the lenses that you look through are just the lenses you look through and you think that's the way it is. Nobody believes a lie on purpose. We believe it because we think it's true. And so when I began to learn about the healing of shame and about the power of the gospel, I knew that some things were beginning to change for me. But what I didn't realize was that I needed a whole new set of glasses in the way that I see myself. And so I began praying, Jesus, how do you see me? And I still have to pray that Tom sometimes because we're so quick to condemn ourselves, we're so quick to think that we're not measuring up. We're so quick to think that a past failure is still besetting us. We're so quick. And so that for me, and that's just kind of the big one, but a whole new set of lenses where Jesus sees me through his finished work and through his love, and it replaces this whole lie that says, if you want to be loved and accepted, you've got to do more. And instead, I see myself not all the time, but so much more through the lens that says, I'm perfectly loved through the gift of Jesus Christ. I can't do anything to add to it or take away from it. Well, when I see through those lenses, when I see like that, it just changes everything in my life. And that would be the biggest. But I would say that even though once you get healing or you begin to see more, it's something we need to keep asking him. And I just think the Lord loves to do this. He came so that we wouldn't stumble about in the darkness. We were we were in the beginning through Adam's sin. We were blinded spiritually and Jesus came to open the eyes of the blind. So he's God, he doesn't show us everything, but he doesn't want us believing lies. He doesn't want us living under illusions and deceptions. He wants us to see he's the light of the world. So that's a big one in my life, Tom. But there's also that every single day asking him and and and him showing you, I see you more this way. I see this person more this way. And and you can literally, I think, see with his eyes. Wow, I mean, that what a gift to begin to see things from that heavenly perspective. Now, you weave throughout the book the story of a beautiful young teenage girl named Joy, Christian girl, love Jesus and but kind of a devastating and incredible story that happens here. Could you just share that? I know it says we our time is brief, but if you could just share that from that story with our viewers. Well, it is it is one of the most powerful and beautiful miracle stories I've ever experienced firsthand. And I as family came in our church, I love them so much. And this teenage, this 13 year old, she loved the Lord with all her heart. She really did. And in fact, they were growing so much spiritually that she got invited into a prayer experience that she wasn't ready for. That was, I think, her family and everyone would say was looking back as ill advised in which there was a friend of the family who died. And a cousin of that friend said, let's pray the Lord will raise him from the dead, which they invited her to go in to the morgue and pray. And while she was there, Tom, she was unaware of what was happening, but she said she felt a darkness as if she couldn't see clearly. And later, when I began to minister along with the lady in our church with her, we realized that she had been demonically attacked. It was somehow a vulnerable moment, an open time in her life. And it began a time of oppression in which she had direct demonic attack that took the form of all of these horrible night terrors. And I got word that she was had become depressed and non responsive and hospitalized. I was out of town. I came back in town and I went to the hospital. I couldn't believe the scene. There was a feeding tube. She quit eating. She had not spoken to anyone, family or medical professional for a week. She had a security guard in the room. They had no idea what to do. They were just keeping her alive through tubes. And her eyes were fixed and dilated. And I just I just it was one of those moments where I knew this was a spiritual attack. And and as one of those moments where Jesus, how do you see this? And I I felt the presence and the power of God. And I just said, you know, I'm I'm going to bless this girl. And I had faith. That's one of the things that happens when you know, Jesus had faith. And so when he sees you see through his eyes, he had faith. And I just began to bless her and said, Joy, I come in the name of the living God and I come to bless you and to begin speaking the scriptures over her and begin speaking Ephesians one and you're blessed with every spiritual blessing. And I began to speak the love of God over. And then for the first time in a week, she turned and she looked at me. She said, in the name of the living God. And I said, yes. And while I tell the whole story in the book, but she something began to happen to her in the spirit, she became somewhat agitated. The she began to talk for the first time. The medical personnel came in, they removed the feeding tube. It was it was a scene of the of a New Testament power and glory. Well, it began a process of years. And what we realized was that the lie that came into her life through this horrible spiritual trauma of dark oppression was that you're not saved, you're not loved, you're not good enough. She was a young Christian girl who wanted to be perfect for God. And so it began a process from that point on of her liberation being day by day, seeing as Jesus sees, because most days she said, I don't see clearly. She literally things seem dark and she had a hard time looking at people. She thought that if other people got near her, that the same spiritual horrible trauma would happen to them. All of these lies and I tell the story through the book in which there are moments of breakthrough in our life. But several that are particularly beautiful in which she has a vision of Christ and a vision of her own life. And and it leads to her complete healing. I'll leave the rest of the story. Hopefully people read the book and come to the conclusion of Joy's story, which it's beautiful. It's it's it's amazing to see her now as a woman of God. But I am that's how much it is at stake, Tom. That's how much is at stake. The difference between seeing and not seeing it really is life and death. I mean, there is a beautiful vision that she has of Jesus that that just sets her free towards the end of your book. But let's just ask this Pastor Alan, as we wrap up here, what is it that a person can do right now who are maybe going through that struggle? Maybe they're watching the program and they're hopeful of coming out of a of a time of questioning or a time of not seeing God. What's what should they do? What steps they can take? The thing that I love about this new spiritual practice is that it is so simple that you can start right now. And the first thing I would say is just try it. Just even this morning, Jesus, how do you see this? Whatever it is that you're facing, if there's a challenge in a relationship just before you begin interacting, Jesus, how do you see this person? And allow yourself to orient a tune and attach to Christ. This is spiritual and mystical language, but it's what we do. He wants he's close to us and envision yourself now turned shoulder to shoulder with the Savior as if you're looking with him. The second thing that you can do after you begin just to put this into practice is read the scriptures sometimes with Jesus's eyes and mind. It's wonderful to read the Bible and say, what does this teach me about Jesus? It's wonderful to read and say, how is Jesus showing me new principles for life here? But what if you were to read the Bible, read the stories and narratives and try to stand next to him and look, how's he looking at it? How's he see a woman caught in adultery? How does he see a storm on the Sea of Gallery? Look through his eyes. All of that can help train you to see as Jesus sees. Well, Pastor Allen, thank you so much. Thank you for writing this book. Thank you for sharing the story. The book is Seeing as Jesus Sees How a New Perspective Can Awaken the Dark. Awaken, Defeat the Darkness and Awaken Joy. Thank you so much for sharing with us today. Thank you so much for having me. God bless you guys. Well, it's a powerful story. I recommend the book highly. Right now we're going to have Testament Tuesday. Today's scripture comes to you from Ephesians one, 18 through 19, having the eyes of your hearts enlightened that you may know what is the hope to which he has called you. What are the riches of his glorious inheritance in the saints and what is the immeasurable greatness of his power towards us who believe? You know, Tom, I believe that even as we were just listening to Pastor Allen and hearing a little bit of joy story today, it would benefit us greatly if we remember we wrestle not against flesh and blood. But here in Ephesians, we get the key to having victory in the spirit realm. It says that we may know what is the hope to which we've been called. Remember keeping your eyes fixed on Jesus, remembering that hope which Jesus has provided and the riches of his glorious inheritance. Do you know that no matter what the lack is around you, he is the abundant one that everything is according to his riches and glory. And this last part, what is the immeasurable greatness of his power towards us to believe? This is King Jesus, Tom, the one who defeated death. There is nothing that you cannot overcome. Everything by God through God and in Christ Jesus. As you keep your mind focused and seated, as scripture says, in heavenly places, you will be reminded of your proper position, which is power, which is authority and which is overcoming anything that opposes you. I mean, this verse has so much in it. But it says that, first of all, that our eyes, the eyes of our heart have been. What door does our heart have eyes? Well, yeah, it does because we see a certain way. We see physical with physical sight. But when we get our heart in tune with the spirit of God and we begin to see from the God's perspective exactly what Alan was talking about. And and we need that. We need it so bad. You know, in ministry, you need it because you're like, Lord, what are you doing here? You know, what what do you want to do in this service today? And this time I have with someone in this program that we're broadcasting, what do you want to do here, Holy Spirit? So we're trying to get that perspective every day. We feel that way here on Hope Today, but it's more than that. It's your situation, the situation that you're in day by day. And I love what Angela just said. The what is the immeasurable greatness? I'll just think about that phrase for a second, Angela, the immeasurable greatness. So you take the biggest container you can measure, you know, and and God's start pouring God's greatness into that, you know, and and then it just overflows because it's immeasurable. There's no container big enough to hold his greatness and the greatness towards us who believe. You're one of those, those people who believe. So think about that perspective that there's an immeasurable greatness that God wants. We are so too easily pleased. I think C.S. Lewis said this, we're too easily pleased with stuff. God has incredible things. And we mess around with, you know, sins and things and other worldly pursuits when the this incredible kingdom is offered to us. That's it. You said the immeasurable greatness. I mean, this right here, I has not seen ear has not heard. Neither has it entered into the heart of man. The things which the Lord has prepared for you. If he was willing to take the king of glory and squish him down and put him into a little baby so that he could walk with us. How much more does he want to walk with you today in any space of darkness in any difficulty he has the power to bring you through? He can do anything, Tom. And we find ourselves often. The reason why I think that we find ourselves often just shrinking down and not believing is because we forget exactly what Ephesians is reminding us of. And it is to keep our hearts, keep them enlightened in the truth of the word. Keep your heart meditating day and night on the goodness of who God is and his power. The buck doesn't stop with you. It stops with him. I love where it says, what are the riches of his glorious inheritance in the saints? See, you just can't, you know, you're having trouble paying the bills. And all of a sudden you find out that a year ago, a rich uncle, you didn't even know died all of a sudden you're a millionaire. It's like that. It's like that all of a sudden we receive this inheritance. We receive all these things. So this is what God is investing in you. This is what Christ came for, that you would be this person that would enter into this inheritance that would enter into this time. So I just have to ask you, what are you doing with that inheritance today? What are you doing with God's immeasurable greatness today? It's for you. Let you know what? Let's tie these things together. Let God open your eyes that you might see. Angela, God wants to set people free to see who they are in him today. Yes, he does. And let me just pray for you before we close out today. Father, we ask that each person who is watching, that their eyes would be open, that they would see you, Jesus, in every part of their story and their circumstance, that their best days are truly ahead and that even now their heart would be stirred by the light of Christ, lighting their path forward and bringing them new strength and new hope in Jesus name. God has greatness for you. No matter what you are facing, he is Emmanuel. He is God with you. You are made an overcomer because he was willing to die and conquer all for your sake today. We implore you to surrender everything to Jesus, to take that darkness that you're feeling. Take it to the one who is light and allow him to illuminate your eyes, your heart and your understanding that you may walk in the truth of who he is. Feel his peace and know that truly today you have hope. God bless you. Welcome and thank you for being a part of Hope Today. On tomorrow's Hope Today, pursuing God's magnificent love and beauty in a fallen world, author Amy Bake Lee offers encouragement on how to live more fully in the kingdom of God now, even as we look with hope to the world to come. That's tomorrow on Hope Today. Cornerstone Television wishes to thank all our faithful viewers, whose consistent prayers and financial support have made this program possible.