 And what a great way to spend a wintry wintry evening. I'm coming to you from Fargo and it looks like we've got people for joining from all around. So welcome to everyone. And I know this blizzard this evening is quite extensive. So what a good way to spend a blizzardy evening than talking about starting seeds. So anyway, again, welcome. I'm Don Kinsler, the NDSU Extension Agent for Horticulture in Cass County. And I'm coming to you this evening from our home in South Fargo on such a snowy night. I did not wanna get caught in my office all night. So I came home a little early and set up the technology here in our dining room. So we'll keep our fingers crossed that everything goes well. So again, welcome. And I'm excited to talk seed starting. This has just been a good hobby for me. Well, really since I was a little boy starting plants, my mom always grew her own tomato plants and flower plants. And my wife, Mary and I had a greenhouse garden center in South Fargo for over 20 years. And of course, so it was great growing all those plants from seed for sale there. And we still grow our own plants for our vegetable garden and flower beds, mostly growing them under fluorescent lights in our basement here in our house. And so it's fun, I really enjoy it. So that's what we're gonna talk about this evening is how to start your own flower and vegetable transplants from seed indoors. And some ideas for having the best success possible. And of course, it's just rewarding. It's not just about getting plants on the cheap but starting your own plants is just rewarding. It's a fun winter pastime to see these little seedlings sprout and then transplant them. And here in the photo that you see, I'm transplanting non-stop begonia seedlings. Now that's not this year, although I do have the little seedlings started already for begonias. And we're gonna talk about the proper time to start seeds but this was last year. And so here in the photo, I'm transplanting non-stop begonia seedlings and pretty soon in the summertime they turned into beautiful begonias. The nice thing about starting seeds is it's not overly difficult. Once you learn a few of the basic principles and have a little experience with it, it really isn't too difficult at all. And of course, watching seedling sprout in the winter under fluorescent lights or on your windowsill, it just makes springtime come. Even though right now it's snowy outside, I've got some seedlings started. And so it does. It actually does bring springtime alive. And it's fun to raise bedding plants as you see there, the petunias. It's fun to grow greenhouse quality bedding plants on your very own. These were some that we started, this was about two years ago that we grew those petunias. Now some types are easier to start than others. The begonias that I showed you aren't the easiest because they require such a long time. They need to be started in February and they grow really, really slowly. The seed is almost like powder. But other types are very easy, such as the pink zinnias you see here and tomato plants, popular for starting indoors. And they're fairly easy also. Other things like marigolds are very easy. And in the vegetable garden, besides tomatoes, cabbage, cauliflower, broccoli are really quite easy to start. So let's start going through some of the practical aspects that can make our process successful. Okay, one of the key elements is not to start too early. We get circling spring fever and one of the common mistakes is to start too early, such as tomatoes. In a second, well, there you can see on the screen the appropriate time to start tomatoes. But if we start them too early indoors, they just get too big before we know it. They're leggy and lanky and they just languish indoors from being indoors too long before it's time to set them out, to transplant them out in May. So a key component is to find out when each of the types of plants that you'd like to start, what the ideal time is. So there I've got a couple of examples for petunias about March 1st, marigolds, March 15th tomatoes, not until April 1st. The key is to get the tomato plants sprouting nicely sprouting quickly and grow a good husky plant that will be ready for transplanting out in the garden the last half of May. And zinnias grow really, really fast. So not until about April 15th for those. So here's a list of seeding dates. Now, it's gonna be hard to write down all those if you're looking at this slide. But the way that these seeding dates are determined is that each of these types of flowers or vegetables need a certain number of weeks indoors or in a greenhouse before they're ready to transplant out. A certain number of weeks are needed to develop a big enough plant that will transplant outdoors easily. And so that's how these are established. Now, for me, the 10 day key window for planting outdoors in our area, North Dakota, Minnesota, much of South Dakota, is the 10 day period from about May 15th to May 25th. The northern parts of North Dakota, more like May 25th to May 30th. So to me, that is the sweet spot for planting outdoors. Now, it doesn't mean that's gonna be frost free. So a person has to watch the weather. But to me, that 10 day period for a lot of our gardening is about May 15th to May 25th. So if we count backwards the number of weeks that are needed for these different types of plants, that's how we establish the planting date. Now, I gave a couple of key ones such as, you know, tomatoes, April 1st. And obviously you can't write all these down. But if you do some online search, if you search NDSU seed starting dates and then maybe even add my name behind it, Don Kinsler, you'll pull up this article. And so that will give a good kind of a calendar. So again, if you just search NDSU seed starting dates, Don Kinsler, I think it'll get you there. Now, gardening centers sell lots of materials that you can start seeds with. There's different containers, kind of little miniature greenhouses and different trays that are used, the different cell packs. So garden centers definitely sell all the products that you need, so that's a good source. And there's lots of options for seed starting trays. But take a look at the lower right hand there, rotisserie chicken. The container that the rotisserie chicken comes in. Look at what a nice little miniature greenhouse that is. Just picture seedlings growing in that. It's got a greenhouse type cover on and with some holes punched in the bottom, an ideal seed starting tray. So now bakery and deli containers also make great miniature greenhouses. In addition to the rotisserie chicken, search the bakery aisle. And in those donut holes that you see there, the donut balls, just an ideal. I've probably started more seedlings in donut hole trays than I have in anything else. And to the right, you see another type of bakery type tray in which seedlings are growing really, really nice. Now, of course, a key element is to punch with a nail or drill holes in the bottom so that the excess water can drain out, but just ideal little greenhouse type material. And sometimes you'll see on Pinterest or on the internet, you'll see kind of novel ideas, but such as these eggs, seedlings growing in eggs, but drainage is very difficult on something like that. Now, if you use the egg carton itself and poke holes in, that will work also. Now, many of us have a stockpile of these in our garage. And so there's all kinds of cell packs that we can keep from year to year, trays called greenhouse flats, many of those different types of pots. So many of us just recycle those, clean them up good. One way to sterilize the used trays or cell packs is to use a hylex dip. And to make that type of a sterilizing dip, we add about one part of a hylex bleach to nine parts of water. And then you can dip those packs in and that will sterilize it, leave them in for a while so that the hylex can do its work. But hylex residue can adversely affect the roots of plants. So it's important that after you give these, they're hylex dip, they're bleach dip to rinse them in clear water to eliminate any of the bleach residue that would be on. All right, so when you've chosen your tray that you're going to start the seedlings in, whether it's a kind of a greenhouse type tray or if you're recycling a tray of some sort, it's best to only plant one type of plant, either a flower or vegetable, just one type in each tray. The reason for that is that all the different types of plants come up at different rates. And once they do come up, we need to give those seedlings some special treatment that we'll talk about later. But if you have lots of different things in the same tray, they're going to come up at different rates and it will make the seed tray harder to work with. For example, in this one, we see someone did tomatoes, zinnias, marigold, they're going to come up at different rates. So much better to only put one type of plant in a smaller tray rather than using a big tray and putting multiple things in. It's fun to label with the name and the date. Of course, it's important to keep track of those names. For example, tomatoes, you want to know which are your early, which are your mid, which are your late so you can keep track. And also the flower types also. So you know if you want to plant that one again another year. And the date of seeding helps you know about how long those seedlings should take to come up. Now, why are we seeding? Here's a good question. Why are we seeding into a seed tray that we're going to have to transplant out of? Why don't we just seed directly into the final cell pack or pot? Well, there's some really, really good reasons for this. And the key reason is when seeds sprout in a cell pack or a pot, they come up fairly spindly. They do in the seed tray sometimes. We'll talk about how not to allow that to happen. But when they come up in a seed, in a cell pack like this, they tend to be spindly and weaker. The transplanting process imparts transplant vigor to the little seedling and they get stockier and have more strength. Now in the greenhouse, we rarely direct seeded anything. There were a few things, maybe moss roses because they come up kind of in little groupings, but 99.9% of everything we grew in the greenhouse for sale was all seeded into trays and then hand transplanted into cell packs. If direct seeding worked, the greenhouses would certainly be doing it. But as you can see here in this slide, the tomato plants are kind of weak when they are direct seeded. Notice the kind of lanky stem, they just have a weakness about them. Whereas by transplanting, we can set them down a little when we transplant out of the seed train into the cell pack. We can set them down a little deeper and they become sturdier and stockier. So with all the many plants that Mary and I start, we don't direct seed anything except melons, which I'll talk about in a minute. So anyway, the process of planting seeds in a seed tray and then transplanting them out into a cell pack or a pot is really the preferred way rather than trying to direct seed into these packs. Now look at these. These are some commercially produced seedlings. Look at how husky and healthy they are. What a beautiful stand. And they're ready then to transplant into cell packs or pots, kind of fun to see what the commercial growers are doing and how they produce. Now, as I mentioned, there are some things that are best direct seeded into little pots. Melons, cucumber squash, pumpkins are best direct seeded into a pot because their roots don't like transplanting. Those little seedlings of melons, cucumber squash do not like their roots to be monkey with. And that's why they're better direct seeded into a pot such as peat pots or you can use plastic pots too. And then when you transplant them to the garden you just have to be really, really careful. There is a caution though when we use some of the peat pellets. I mentioned direct seeding for squash, melons, cucumbers. And one way to do that is to put a seed or two in each of these little expandable pellets. A lot of research has been done with these though and roots don't always break through that netting that is around that peat pot. They don't always break through as well as they should. Also, peat pots, peat pots where the roots can grow through tend not to break down as rapidly as we would like. So I do direct seed our melons into peat pots but when I'm ready to transplant them out into the garden I always break apart that peat pot a little bit so that the roots can escape. So very important on those. And I should mention too, as you have any questions please do enter them in the Q and A. You'll see a Q and A if you put them in the chat that'll be fine too. And we'll address those questions at the end. So Q and A is probably the preferred if you spot that down at the bottom of your screen or at the top, whichever it is at and or the chat if you put those in. And again, welcome to those who joined a little later. We have 211 participants. That's wonderful for us. Snowy, snowy evening. So now the mix that we use for seed starting are one of the specially prepared mixes for seeds. And what makes a good seed starting mix is the fineness of the mix. You know how some of the potting mixes have kind of big chunks of bark or peat moss and bigger granules. Those would be difficult for little seedlings to push through. So a seed starting mix is milled and screened quite fine. But these, oh, I should mention, there's different brands. Miracle Grow has one, Burpee has one, the Jiffy mix. They're all good. I've used all of them and they all produce good seedlings. It is very important, though, with these to moisten them before you're using them. They're all very dry. And if you use them right out of the bag, fill up your seed tray and do the seeding. When you go to water, the seeds can just float around because those mixes are so dry. So very important to moisten the mix before using. It works quite well just to add water, to try to gauge about the right amount of water, mix it around with your hands, and then close up that bag the day before you're going to use it. And the next day, that seed mix is so nice and mellow. It absorbs some moisture. You're going to have to water after your seed, too. But this gets it off to a nice water-absorbing state. So very important to moisten before using, rather than trying to use the mixes dry. The next step is to fill up the tray, whether you're using a big tray like a greenhouse flat like this, or if you're using one of the smaller donut hole containers, fill the tray to the top. They're going to go all the way to the top. But they're going to settle when you water. But it's very important to have as high of a profile, as high of a soil mix profile as possible in those trays. The reason for that is gravity will help move water down. Every time you water the seed tray or the seedlings, gravity will help move the water through, and you'll get good drainage. If you only fill that tray halfway full, gravity isn't going to pull down through. You'll have more rotting, more damping off diseases. And so it makes a much healthier seedling, plus you have more root room. So always when you're filling up the trays, always fill them up right, flush with the top, brush it off with your hand. It'll settle enough when you water it. But make sure your trays are well filled. I've noticed that's kind of one little thing that you often don't see mentioned, but it's very, very important. Then you have a choice in your seed tray of planting either in rows, if you have a bigger tray, or you can just broadcast over the surface. Either one will work. Now, how deep do we plant these seeds? Well, when I'm seeding, what I do is, okay, I fill the tray up with the mix, and then if it's a large seed, well, such as if you're familiar with a cucumber seed or tomato seed, I lay those over the surface and then cover with a small amount of mix. But if it's tiny seed, and lots of flower seeds are tiny, like petunia seed, even elissum seed, if they're about the size of a poppy seed, you know, the poppy seed that are on top of a poppy seed bun, if they're that size, just sprinkle the seeds over the surface of the mix and don't cover them at all. And then water gently. The watering will carry that seed down in just enough. If it's a seed larger than a poppy seed, well, then cover with a little bit of mix. For example, marigold seed is fairly large. Zinia seed is fairly large. So just barely cover with some of the seeding mix and then water in. Now, some seeds do need light in order to sprout. You can do a little bit of checking to see whether you're supposed to have seeds in the light or in the dark. But generally, the rule of thumb that I use, it keeps it quite simple. If it's a tiny seed the size of a poppy seed, don't cover. If it's bigger than a poppy seed, so you can actually kind of seed the seeds, then seed them on the surface or in rows and then cover them with some of the mix. That seems to just be a really good rule of thumb. And then water gently. You could either use a mist bottle or a watering can if you use it very, very gently. Then in order to keep the moisture in and create kind of a greenhouse-like humidity over those seeds, we can cover the tray with plastic wrap or we can use a lid, clear plastic lid that came with the container. And that's why I like some of the deli containers or the bakery containers because they have a neat little hinged lid right with it and make a perfect little seed tray. So this is going to keep the moisture on quite nicely. In most cases, if you've watered well and then put the cover on or cover with plastic, you usually do not need to water that seed tray again until the seeds sprout and you've taken off the protective cover. All right, so we've seeded the seeds. We've covered them with plastic or put the clear lid back on. And now the next key component is to give it some bottom heat. Most seeds require a temperature of soil temperature of 70 to 75 degrees. And the soil temperature can run quite a bit cooler than the room temperature. So a very, very important key to success is giving this bottom heat and a good way to do that is with a seedling heat mat as you see pictured there. And of course, once you have one of those, they'll last for years and years. You can buy them at garden centers, you can order them online and really, really works well. There are different ways that people have used over the years, put the seed tray next to a radiator or on top of the refrigerator if there's a little heat, but all of those are kind of a little iffy. The bottom heat provided by a heat mat works really, really well. Now some of the heat mats have a thermostat such as the one on the lower right hand. Others don't have the type I use do not have a thermostat. They just automatically run at a nice warm temperature. Now take a look at the seedlings in the photo up at the top. Okay, they've spiraled really, really well, but there's a problem with those. They're really, really spindly. And that spindly comes from lack of light. Those seedlings came up really, really quick, but they didn't have access to enough light and so they stretched. I like to put the seed mat directly under lights. We're gonna talk about lights for plants, but I like to put the seed mat directly under fluorescent lights, then put the seed tray on top of the mat and then as soon as the seedlings start to sprout, they've got good light. And sort of stretching like that, there'll be good little compact sturdy plants. We could use a sunny window. Sunny windows, of course, tend to be one directional with the light. So that's a disadvantage of sunny windows. Sometimes the best seedlings are produced under lights. Now, as we see here, we're gonna talk in a minute about the closeness, how close lights should be to the plants. But here we see, excuse me, here we see different types of seed seeds being sowed in individual containers. They're put on a heat pad, so lots of good things going on there. So if they're receiving enough light as these seedlings sprout, they're gonna be nice and short and stocky. That's a good sign that they're getting enough light. So I mentioned putting seed trays in a sunny window, that can work. But if we're growing them under lights, the seed trays need to be fairly close to the light. If it's a fluorescent type light, such as my wife, Mary, and I use. In our basement, we have shop type fluorescent lights with two tubes and we keep those lights within about two inches, two to three inches of the seedlings. Now, in this photo here, these aren't my seedlings, but the light I think was raised up to get a photo, the photo of it. But light should usually be within just two to three inches. When we talk about the types of lights in a minute or so, it will depend on the type of light. If you've got a high intensity LED plant light, then the directions will tell you about how far away from the plants that the light fixture should be. But a common mistake that we make is to have the seedlings too far from the light source and then they get spindly. Here's an example of what can happen in a window, a sunny window. See, many windows don't receive sunlight all day. The sun starts over in one corner and then they maybe get sun midday and then the sun goes around. And so oftentimes, seedlings grown in a window can get spindly. And when they do, it's because they're stretching for light, just not getting quite enough. And so unless you have a really big wide window, which can work well, another good alternative is artificial lights. Here are some well-grown tomatoes under lights. Notice the stems are quite stocky and sturdy. So some nice well-grown tomatoes. If you take a look at the lower left hand, that's a good pack of tomatoes. The ones on the right have been stretching for sunlight. So if we talk a little bit about light fixtures and lights for plants for growing seedlings, there's a nice structure built there. That's a handmade out of wood, two by fours in different structures with shop-type fluorescent lights. This is similar to the arrangement we have in our basement. We don't have it on raised tiers like that. We just have it all on kind of a flat table, but same principle. And notice that the light fixtures are suspended on chains so that the light fixture can be raised up as the plants grow. Of course, there are also commercial types of plant stands made. So a person can buy the stands ready-made with the lights and everything all installed and ready to go. Now let's talk a little bit about the types of light sources. Now I mentioned that Mary and I grow our plants in the basement under fluorescent lights. They're lights that we've had probably in the basement for well, probably going on 20 years. They're shop-type fluorescent lights that are eight-foot long. Each of the fixtures has two tubes. We try for a warm white and a cool white fluorescent tube. Eventually I'd like to transition those to LEDs because they'd be even more energy efficient than fluorescence. But we have about five shop-type lights set kind of one next to each other. And they're about eight-foot long is the measurement. So fluorescence work very, very well. LED-type tubes work well. And I'm sure you've noticed the purplish-type plant lights. Now what's different with that purplish-type light than the white light given off by fluorescence? The purplish has a wider wavelength, the wider spectrum of colors in it. So plants grow very, very well under those. Most plants grow perfectly also under fluorescent types. But the purplish-type light does certainly have more wavelengths, more colors in that light. And so for some plants, they do grow better underneath the purplish-type light. If you've ever grown plants under the purplish-type light, and I've got some in my office actually, excuse me. And if you've grown plants under those, it's kind of a neat look. But when you're going to examine the plant to see if they're healthy green, it's kind of hard to tell. So sometimes you need to take that plant out from under the purplish-type light so you can assess in kind of more of a normal white light how they're doing. Some of the commercial growers that use the purplish-type light actually have a secondary white light source. So they can shut off the purplish light and have a white light just so they can kind of look how the crop is doing. Because sometimes we assess the health of plants by if they have a deep green color, which you can't really see under the purple. So anyway, two nice choices, the LED white lights or fluorescent white lights or the purplish-type work well. Now, if a person is choosing lights, the tube-type light are easier to grow seedlings under as opposed to the round-plant lights. The round-plant lights probably work very well for a house plant, but for starting seeds underneath, we've got all those trays, right? Can trays, you know, lined up in a line in a row? And so if your light source has that same length, length rather than just round, it's easier to congregate seed trays under a tube-long tube-type light if you follow me. So a tube-type source is probably better than the round-plant lights, which work fine for house plants. So if a light can't be adjusted with a chain, you can just put something under the seed tray. So if you take a look at the right-hand side, the light fixtures were not adjustable, but we can put a tray or something else, wood blocks, under the seedlings to raise them up as close to the light source. And then, of course, as the seedlings grow, then we can take the tray out and give some room for those plants to grow. Now here are some petunias from our own basement a year ago. So here are a little petunia seedlings ready to transplant. Now I mentioned that a lot of my plants, we seed in those little donut hole. If you look at the right-hand photo way up in the corner there, you can see some of those little trays. But last year, I grew lots and lots of petunias, so I seeded each type in a big tray. So these little petunia seedlings are just ready to transplant. And remember, transplanting gives a good sturdiness and a vigor to seedlings. If we seeded these directly into cell packs, they wouldn't create nearly as nice of a plant. So let's talk a little bit about transplanting. And here we see tomato seedlings that are just ready for transplanting. The key to know when to transplant little seedlings is when they start to produce what is called the first set of true leaves. Now notice on these tomato seedlings, those biggest leaves or what's called the seed leaves or cotyledon, those are the first leaves out of the seed and they don't look much like a tomato leaf. It's the little developing leaves towards the center that are going to actually look like tomato leaves. Well, anyway, when the first set of true leaves starts to be formed, then they're ready to transplant. Or just really, as soon as you can comfortably lift a little seedling with your fingers, they can be transplanted. So let's talk a little bit about how exactly we do transplanting. So here I'm transplanting tomato seedlings and I'm using a dibble. That's a greenhouse term for the little tool that we use for transplanting. The dibble is made out of a wooden dowel and just sharpened to a point on one end. We could use a pencil. When I was a horticulture student transplanting tomatoes in the greenhouse, we used a pencil. They were handy. The dowel has a little bigger diameter, so I like a dowel sharpened to a point. So I'm gently lifting the seedlings out of the seed tray. And then with the dibble, I'm making a hole into the cell pack. Next, I'm inserting the seedling down into the hole and gently kind of you can lower the roots and stem down in. Now for transplanting these seedlings, transplant them right up to their ears. And by their ears, I mean plant them down in so that the first set of leaves is really right down at about mix. If you don't transplant them deep enough, they tend to wiggle and wobble all around and be weaker. Also, tomato seedlings will root along that stem. And you'll get a stockier plant. So plant them down right up to their ears. And then you can firm the soil around the roots. That tomato that I seeded there, we were actually doing a photo shoot. And I wish I would have gotten it a little lower even so. And then firm a little soil around the roots. And then at that point, we'd be ready to water them in. Now here I am transplanting petunia seedlings. Now notice how I'm planting them nice and deep and firmly with the leaves, of course, up above the mix. And so after transplanting those, they'd be ready to water in and return under the fluorescent lights or to a really sunny window. And there, by May, you've got a really nice pack of petunia plants or tomatoes or whatever else you're growing. So after transplanting those seedlings, we return them under the fluorescent lights in the basement. But here's a method that we've used called a cold frame. I built these 4 foot by 8 foot sections with a clear covering that I got at one of the lumber outfitters. And they work very nice for finishing off the plants. So again, we're growing all those packs and trays of transplanted seedlings under fluorescence or other lights in the basement. But then for our own situation, around the middle or end of April when weather starts to moderate, we move them out to these frames just to finish them off. You wouldn't have to do that. Another way to do it would be to keep growing them indoors. And then maybe about May 1st, put them outside. You wouldn't even need these frames. But put them outside to get some sunlight and some air during the day, but then be prepared to move them in on chilly nights. So in that way, you can develop a really good called hardened off plant. So there we're ready for planting. If you notice the difference here, in April, they were in full sunlight. And what has happened here? I almost have the cold frames emptied down to the last couple of flats. So what's made the shade? Well, the trees that are surrounding them had leafed out by the end of May and so all of a sudden shade. So it's interesting how we can go with, you know, before the trees leaf out, I had sunshine, trees leafed out, then they were in shade, but that's OK. So it is so fun to have these homegrown plants. And here you can see, this is the home that Mary and I live in. We enjoy growing lots of annual flowers for flower beds. And our garden also is pictured there. We enjoy growing lots of cabbage, cauliflower, broccoli, squash, tomatoes. And it just makes a fun, fun pastime and a fun, fun hobby. Now, that covers just about all of the tips that I have. But I'm hoping we'll have some good questions. And so I'm going to check the Q&A box. So let's have time for questions. OK, we'll start at the top. Can you talk about the peat-free movement and what resources are available? There is a movement, peat-free. That's a good name for it. The peat-free movement is a movement to conserve peat moss. It takes many, many, many years. I don't know how long, 1,000 years, to turn vegetation into peat. And so, and of course, there's a limited supply. I think there's a really, really good supply. But, you know, that's probably a finite resource, although I think there's lots to go. But there's a movement afoot that maybe we should look at other resources. One of the best, I believe, and I've used it, is called CORE. I think I'm pronouncing that right. Coconut Core, C-O-I-R. And some of the potting mixes have that in. It's a very nice, well-drained. It's a byproduct of coconut. And of course, coconut is a renewable resource. And so, check for products called Coconut Core. A good substitute for peat moss. Thanks for asking. Are cow pots recommended over peat pots or transplanting from a plastic container? Peat pots, the roots will penetrate out of a peat pot. But if you have grown plants in them, the roots can kind of stay in that peat pot a little bit. They'll grow through, but maybe not penetrate. So that's why I suggested either breaking apart the peat pot. Now, cow pots. I've never used those, but they're an organic type pot. And I think that would be worth a try for melons and things that don't transplant well. Greenhouses do sell melon skewcomber squash in plastic pots. And if you gently slip the plant out and don't disturb the roots, that can work also. Cow pots, I've got to try those. That would be interesting. Resend the website you mentioned earlier about the starting seeds publication on NDSU web. I might not be able to get that looked up and typed in. I'll try kind of at the end. But I'm fairly certain if you, especially if you use, do my name Don Kinsler, K-N-Z-L-E-R, when to start seeds, I think it'll pop up. Good, I'll try to get you a maybe a better answer. A better to water from the top or the bottom on a seed tray? Well, we can do both. If we water too harshly at the top, it'll wash seeds. And so they can be watered from the bottom by setting the seed tray in a bigger tray, in which you've added water. And then when you see the top nice and moist with water, then you know it's soaked up. I water from the top because it's maybe a little handier. Sometimes I may be in a little bit of a hurry and don't have time to let it soak from the bottom. And so I water from the top. That brings up another good point. We mentioned the importance of heat for getting these seedlings to sprout. Instead of watering with cold water, it's very important to water with lukewarm water. So run it from the top until you get some not hot, but just in a warm, and that will help. If you water with cold water, it can take anywhere from four to eight hours for that soil temperature to warm back up again. So it can go a long way towards getting seedlings to sprout quicker if we use warm water. Okay, next, how do you know if they need light or not? How do they, you know, if they need light or not? The, well, two things. How do you know if a seedling that is sprouted needs more light? If they've started to stretch, then they need more light. But how do you know if a special, if a certain type of seed needs light or not? A good way to tell is very tiny seeds, the size of a, not sesame seed, poppy seed. If they're the size of a poppy seed or smaller, we just seed those right on top of the mix. And that will allow them to get some light. And so any seeds that do require light are tiny seeds. There aren't large seeds that require light. So large seeds generally get covered. Small seeds just because they are so tiny don't get covered. And the type that need light seem to be the smaller type. And so I hope that answers. So if you kind of keep the rule of thumb in mind, just if it's a tiny seed, just sow on the top and water in, I think you're gonna be good. And also, I'm a big proponent of putting all the seed trays under a light source, because oftentimes they'll come up during the middle of the night. And some of these come up so vigorously that they can be stretched by the time you get them to a light source. So I really like to have these seed trays under a light source. So even if they come up while you're working or sleeping, they'll immediately get the seed trays under a light source. They'll immediately have the light they need. Why does mold sometimes appear on top of soil mixtures when starting your growing seeds? Also tiny black bugs. Yeah, the tiny black bugs that flit around are fungus gnats and the eggs are oftentimes found in soil. That's why I really like to use the three, one of the three brands that I mentioned. Jiffy Mix, Miracle Grow, Seeding Mix, or the Burpee Seeding Mix. I've not had problems with the fungus gnat little flies out of those. I have had the problems out of some of the other soil type mixes. So again, if you start with one of those brands, it's less likely to have eggs of little bugs. Sometimes those little bugs will come from other plants that you have in your home though. When I do the houseplant webinar, there is a product called mosquito bits that also kills fungus gnats, mosquito bits, solar garden centers and hardware stores. So why does mold sometimes appear on top of soil mixtures when starting your growing seeds? Usually if mold appears, it's a sign that it's maybe staying too damp. Now I mentioned that the seed tray needs to stay damp or moist and that's why we cover it until they've sprouted. But as soon as the seed thing sprout, that cover should be taken off. The cover plastic film should be taken off and air should be gotten onto the seedlings. In fact, one way to decrease that mold or anything like that from growing is to put a small fan in the area in which you're growing the seeds and have a very small fan just gently blowing across these seed trays when the seedlings are up. And that helps to firm up and sturdy the little seedlings because that little bit of movement actually does strengthen the stem. And also that will tend to dry the soil surface which is a good thing after they sprouted and you'll have less chance of diseases and mold. So keep soil, keep the soil needs to be moist until the seedlings appear after the seedlings appear then the soil surface needs to start drying between waterings. How many hours should lights be on before or after this sprout? You guys have good questions. All right, easiest way to remember how many hours of light, how many hours of dark is give them the same amount of sleep that we're supposed to get, eight hours. Eight hours is the recommended, isn't it, for humans to sleep. So the recommended for plants is 16 hours of light and eight hours of dark or sleep. So 16 hours on, eight hours off. It doesn't matter what hours during the day the plants down under those can't really tell if it's what time of day it is under those lights if you follow. All right, then let's see. If someone will be gone for two to three weeks seems like these seedlings under lights would need lots of care. Yeah, seedlings do, the seedlings are like pets. They can't be left alone. So really seedlings do need almost daily care maybe not every day, but they do require daily care. I like to think of them as a pet that you would need to make sure they have food and water and care. And so seedlings do require daily care, but it's a fun care. Is there a minimum room temperature that is recommended for starting indoors with the heat mat and light? The nice thing about a heat mat is that it will keep bottom heat on. So regardless of what the room temperature is they'll still get the heat they need. Our basement is chilly. The air temperature is probably 60 degrees, but the heat pad keeps that soil and the little seedlings just at the right temperature. I should mention too that as soon as those seedlings sprout they should be taken off of the heat pad. Okay, still under lights of course, but off of the heat pad because once seedlings sprout then they can take a cool temperature. In fact, a cooler air temperature such as 60, 65, 70 is okay too but the cooler air temperature will make a huskier seedling. So again, on the heat mat until they sprout then as soon as you have visible little seedlings take off the heat pad and then grow them under lights and a cooler room temperature is better. So is there a minimum room temperature probably 60 degrees and on up? How many watts on the lights probably? How many watts? I don't have a wattage for you. Generally any fluorescence would be of a wattage that would work. Try for as many watts as possible so that they aren't too weak. But I don't have a good answer for you on how many watts. Plant lighting with the LEDs and the purplish lights, it's kind of new technology and the wattage and the strength of some of these is still kind of in an experimental stage. And it means too that we have to kind of do a little experimenting with our own lights set up to see what would work. Eventually I think there will be better recommendations as do with some of these different light fixtures. How many watts, you know, how many plants you can grow under a certain and the distance. Do you have a recommendation of how many lumens light bulbs should have for starting seedlings? I'm afraid I don't have the lumens. Again, as I mentioned that light lighting is kind of a little bit under a state of flux. And so I don't have the lumens on that that would be recommended. Someday when some of this gets sorted out I'm gonna do a kind of a special just on plant lights. Do you take heat away as soon as they've sprouted? Yes, as soon as these seedlings have sprouted then they go off of the heat pad and just onto the regular room temperature under the lights. When you transplant the seedlings you said to bury it almost up to the leaves is that the first set of true leaves like in the case of a tomato yeah, up to the first set of true leaves you can take off those little seed leaves but in order to get the plant down deep enough so it's not wiggly and wobbly those seed leaves can come off or just be protruding out a little bit. You know, when you're transplanting into packs like that if you set it down a little deeper you're only talking about maybe half an inch deeper so it's not like you're going deep deep and even if some of those seed leaves are down a little bit they're still as long as they're projecting out they're fine you shouldn't bury them without removing those. Yep, and gene indicates fans help if on low yep, they do blowing across the seedlings is a good idea. How tight do you pack the seed potting mix in the container? Ah, good question. All right, in the when you're putting the mix into a seed container that you're going to be seeding into what I like to do is fill it up with a moistened mix and not press it down with my hands but bounce it up and down on the tabletop a few times that will settle it good and then maybe just brush across with my hand to kind of firm it just slightly and to level it off but again, just a couple of bounces on the tabletop is about all it needs to settle. And also when you're filling up six packs or four packs, cell packs to transplant into make sure that you fill up those cell packs all the way don't leave too much space down in again we want as much root room for those as possible so fill them all the way up to the top and again, I kind of bounce them up and down on the tabletop that'll firm it down if it sinks down in, fill it up with a little more see when you water, it's going to settle it a little bit but if you start too far down in then you end up just not enough root soil these are really good questions how do you keep a garden organic? How to water when transplanted? How do you keep a garden organic? And of course organic means that we aren't using synthetic chemicals in it and of course to keep a garden organic there are organic insecticides that if we need to control some insects there's of course insecticidal soap and nemoil there's a great new insecticide called spinocet S-P-I-N-O-S-A-D spinocet that's a great product and as far as fungicides if we have diseases we could use nemoil again can be used there are copper type fungicides as well so there are definitely some good organic choices How to water when transplanted? Okay after you transplant a little seedling then water it thoroughly so that a little bit is maybe coming out the bottom of the cell pack then you know you've got it Best times to water and how much to water? On a seed tray we mentioned watering it well the first time right after you seed then putting a cover on and that will usually keep it moist until the seedlings come up then you take off the cover take them off the heat pad and then let the surface start to dry some of it is a little bit of experience a little bit of feel but when you see the top of the seeding mix start to get light in color and maybe feel it a little bit then when you do water water it so that it does thoroughly moisten that mix again and then let it dry out a little bit what that does is helps draw oxygen down into the seeding mix Do you fertilize seedlings? Some of the seed mixes excuse me some of the seed mixes will indicate on the label that they have a little bit of fertilizer in others if they don't indicate that they maybe don't there is enough natural nutrient in those materials to get the seedlings going but once they're up a little bit then we could start fertilizing with a water soluble type and usually it will indicate on the package such as Miracle Grow is probably the most commonly available and we'll usually tell on there what to use for seedlings if it doesn't say then we would usually use a houseplant rate divided in half for example if whatever would say to use on houseplants or potted plants take that at only about half so that we don't burn the seedlings or use a fertilizer that is for seedlings so very important to air on the light side so that we aren't burning our little seedlings it's more important to fertilize the seedlings after they've been transplanted into cell packs or pods I usually don't fertilize in the seed tray unless it's seedlings that are going to be in there a long time for example the non-stop begonias are seeded already in February and they won't be ready for transplanting quite a while so I'll usually give a little bit of light fertilizing in that seed tray but if it's a fast growing seed such as tomatoes usually there's enough natural fertility in that seed mix material to last until you transplant and then once they get into their cell packs or individual little pots then start fertilizing with a weak fertilizer probably every couple of weeks maybe have you ever created your own potting soil or used core C-O-I-R as a replacement yeah the core is a great product that can be used as an organic component in place of peat moss have you ever created your own potting soil we used to years ago in the greenhouse but what we found was that by the time you buy all the components that go into mixing your own it's almost as economical just to buy the ready made and so I don't we don't mix our own anymore well for one thing using actual dirt type soil isn't really recommended anymore it brings weed seeds in it can and I know you can sterilize it but sterilizing soil in the oven is kind of a stinky mess and carries more disease and plus the best garden soil outdoors seems to pack in pots or trays so the soil less mixes are really the way to go and by the time you buy the different products it's maybe as economical just to buy the ready made and so that's what we found we don't create our own potting mix anymore years ago when I was a student in the horticulture greenhouse summertime jobs were mixing up soil we'd use compost and manure and sand peat moss until the manure one year was tainted with an herbicide which passes through the cattle and a lot of our greenhouse plants died from herbicide entry so that put an end to that so even the greenhouses use ready mixed package type mixes and in the greenhouse that's what we went to also I don't know of many that are mixing their own anymore when seedling trays have holes in the bottom do they drip water out they do or do they need something under them to catch the water good point the seed seeding trays have holes in the bottom so they'll drip water out which is a good thing and but it does mean you need to put them in a bigger tray or plastic under something so that your floor or table doesn't doesn't get ruined should we fertilize or seedlings at any time before transplanting outside once that they get into cell packs individual cell packs then start the fertilizing do you direct so any plants okay when I say direct so remember I said direct seed that we don't direct seed that's for starting seeds indoors other than melons, cucumber, squash the other meaning for direct seed has to do with outdoors in the vegetable garden direct seeding or direct sowing outdoors means you're planting the seeds directly in place okay and things that are direct seeded in place traditionally are things like carrots, beets, beans, peas all of those are direct seeded rather than being started early indoors and lettuce, things such as that so those are customarily direct seeded out into the garden things that are traditionally started early indoors for the vegetable garden are plants that take a long time such as tomatoes of course instead of direct seeding them out in the garden they're started early tomatoes, cabbage, cauliflower, broccoli did I say peppers all of those are started early indoors they would just take too long direct seeded outside pumpkin squash, cucumbers, melons can be either they can be direct seeded out into the garden soil but to get a head start such as with melons we start them early indoors okay we'll be sending out your PowerPoint to the attendees not the PowerPoint but to those registered we hope to have a recording out at some point let's say I missed the first few minutes did you have any info on seed blocking? I'm not exact, I'm not familiar with the term maybe with seed blocking I wonder if you're maybe referring to creating little blocks of mix in which to direct seed possibly but anyway I'm sorry I'm not clear on the seed blocking term I see the sessions being recorded is there any way to view last week's session at some point to the registered people we'll be getting those out it might take a while but last week on house plant propagation at some point to the registered people on these sessions we'll put the links for recording can vermiculite from monards be used for soil mixture safely? Now vermiculite are the flakes of gold and vermiculite can be used as insulation but for gardening type planting in house plants as a soil amendment or seed starting it should be the horticultural grade so it should be packaged for gardening so I don't believe I'd use the insulation grade vermiculite such as sometimes it's poured up in attics I don't think I'd use that because I'm not sure if that's been totally cleaned of anything else but horticultural grade sold for growing plants vermiculite is a great product what temperature should the ground soil be before transplanting? Transplanting outdoors? I'm wondering probably what temperature should the ground soil be before transplanting so if we're mentioning transplanting outdoors into the garden depends on the crop some crops can take cool soil such as cabbage, cauliflower, broccoli they can go out really the end of April or first of May they'll take a little bit of light frost even but cover on a really severe freeze but those crops like cool temperatures but tomatoes, pepper, eggplant any of the melons must have warm soil if they're put in cold soil they really go downhill and may never recover so what is warm soil? The soil temperature has to be 55 degrees or above before a person should transplant them out so a person could check some of the soil temperature maps you can do a search for such as Fargo soil temperature and a soil map will come up and indicate what the temperature is on a certain date so that's what I always check I check the, it's called the endon N-D-A-W-N endon soil temperature that lists many different locations or you could use a soil thermometer as well to check your own so 55 degrees is the recommended are seedlings transplanted into seed-seeding mix or potting soil, great question okay for the seed trays of course you use the seed-seeding mix but once you transplant them into individual cell packs or pots then it's time to use a good quality, high quality potting mix so not the seeding mix but the potting mix the reason for that is that it's got better drainage little larger particles, better drainage so some brands would be of course the Miracle Grow Potting Mix that's probably the most common that's the one I use because it's available everywhere but garden centers will also have their brand recommended brand of mix it's probably the one they use in their own greenhouses for growing material and so Miracle Grow Potting Mix or an equivalent or one that your local garden center would recommend great question when to start geraniums if a person started geraniums from seed they take a long time so the earlier the better to get a good big stocky plant so really geraniums probably by January 1st should be started you can start them from cuttings if you have an established plant but seed grown geraniums should probably have about January 1st it's not too late now but they just won't be quite as big if you were going to start geraniums from seed I'd do it right now how many hours of sun should a seedling get if I set it in my window? okay in a window give it as many hours of direct sunshine and falling on those seedlings as you can in that window and again going from really sun up until sun down again the preferred is 16 hours of light and eight hours of dark sometimes that's a challenge on a winter window cell do you have experience with winter sowing in milk gallons versus under light? oh yeah have any of you seen that process where you can sow different products different things such as lettuce radishes in milk gallon jugs with winter sowing I haven't tried that but I'm going to so if any of you are wondering what are we talking about look up winter sowing in milk jugs and that'll tell you what that's all about but I'm going to try that sometime sounds like an interesting process do you leave the lights on 24 hours a day? you can most seedlings will grow fine if you just leave the lights on continually and or you could put a timer on and have 16 hours on, 16 off some plants don't like 24 hours of light and I've grown plants both ways tomatoes don't seem to like having lights on 24 hours a day I've noticed so the preferred is 16 hours on, eight hours off but if you don't have a timer it's okay to leave them on too and if you don't want to each day go turn them off and on how many hours should the lights be on? 16, 16 on, eight hours off now I should clarify a little bit on that the 16 hours on and eight hours off that's after the seeds have germinated see I may not have totally picked up on the question okay that would be after the plants are germinated and after they're growing when the seedlings are under a light I would leave it on 24 hours a day the reason for that is as I mentioned what if those seedlings come up in the middle of the night some of those grow fast they could stretch by morning so until they sprout until the seedlings sprout I leave them under lights 24 hours a day and after that you could switch to 16 on, eight off so good I maybe just now donned on me what some of the questions were so when a seed tray is just put under fluorescent light or other light source I'd leave it on 24 hours a day because I'm too concerned about the light the seedlings coming up in the dark during the eight hours of dark and then they stretch okay so I hope that clarifies that 24 hours a day while the seed tray is under once the seedlings are up then you could go to 16 on, eight off do you recommend letting water set for a while before using it so chemicals from tap water can settle that's a good idea to let it set for a day fluorine and chlorine it maybe won't all evaporate or settle out but it certainly helps and then again the importance of using room temperature lukewarm type water okay a few more questions about the light okay how often do you fertilize after you transplant the seedlings in the cell packs probably a light fertilizing every couple of weeks every two weeks and again when I say light fertilizing whatever they're recommending for houseplants but probably about half of that many of these little seedlings don't need a whole lot of fertilizer when do you start using fertilizer shortly after they're transplanted into the cell packs would I still need heat pad with a small indoor portable greenhouse heat pad would help unless the greenhouse temperature stays okay this is a small indoor portable greenhouse I gotcha unless it stays nice and warm in there such as about 75 degrees I would still use a heat pad to get the bottom heat what happens when you give the plant too much light if you give a plant too much light it would probably start burning a little around the tender leaves but usually it's a case of them not getting enough but yeah if it's a very intense light source then they'd start to burn a little around the edges of the leaves I'm new to starting seeds I'm limited in space I'm worried that I don't have a space to start my own seeds any ideas for small space seed starting set up or kitchen counters absolutely you can get very small remember when I mentioned kind of the tube type lights you can get kind of a tube type light setup that a tray would fit nicely under that are only probably about two feet long and so you could get a nice number of plants started under just a two foot long light source is it best to pre-moisten soil before planting seeds yep both the seeding mix and also the potting mix that you use best to pre-moisten and mix it up really good do you recommend that mycorrhiza added to seed starting mix or using a soil mix that hasn't added yep anytime you can find a soil mix with mycorrhiza which is the beneficial good a good soil type fungi that is beneficial to roots yep anytime you can find something with mycorrhiza added I don't add it to it there are products that will add that but I just don't get around to it but it's been shown that mycorrhiza will benefit seed starting and seedling growth wondering where I get my seeds well I like a couple of seed catalogs one is Johnny's selected seed from Maine another is Twilly T-W-I-L-L-E Twilly seed company Park seed I order a few things from Burpee seed and the company that I like for my squash and melons is Prairie Road Organic Seeds from Fullerton, North Dakota I like Baker Creek heirloom seeds that's got some interesting things as well okay I should have said soil blocking so again soil blocking does that refer to creating little blocks in which little soil blocks into which to plant? you know I've seen that I don't have first hand experience with soil blocking but I have kind of seen little equipment that will create little blocks of soil in which you can seed or transplant into GNAS rain or snow water yes both rain water is wonderful melted snow water is great for plants either house plants or seedlings and the snow water could be melted and then brought up to room temperature and that would be perfect for using on seeds I think I've gotten to the end of our questions is there anything else before we sign off? It looks like on a blizzardy night here here in Fargo I'm looking out I don't see the snow starting yet but the wind is up and I'm glad our technology looks like it held and so again I really appreciate you guys joining and if there's any last questions let me know I'm gonna put up my email address here feel free to email me sometimes I get behind in the email so be patient with me for a day or two and I'll get your questions answered so again feel free to jot down my email Donald.Kinsler at ndsu.edu Donald.Kinsler at ndsu.edu and thank you very much I appreciate it all of you joining me on a chilly chilly evening and stay safe and I hope everyone is where you need to be and can stay there through the duration of the storm so thank you again and thanks for joining ndsu extension Cascone Horticulture have a great evening thank you