 Hello and welcome to NewsClick. Today we have with us Sunila Abhishekara, a well-known human rights activist from Sri Lanka. Sunila, good to have you with us. I am very happy to be here. Sri Lanka has been what appears to be us for a long time in a mess. Do you think there is any resolution of the problems in the sense of some kind of reconciliation, devolution of powers today in Sri Lanka for the minority Tamil community? Well, actually, how shall I say it? As most people know that there was a very bitter and barbaric war in Sri Lanka through the last two decades and then in 2009 of May the government troops defeated the liberation Tigers of Tamil Nadu in a final grand offensive. Since then, well, because of the war, many people were displaced and there was a hope that the end of the so-called war in Sri Lanka would bring about a space, a new space for dialogue and discussion with the Tamils, but particularly with the political leaders of the Tamil people about what were the possible ways of guaranteeing minority rights in Sri Lanka, ensuring that Tamil people of Sri Lanka can live with dignity in the north and east of Sri Lanka, ensuring that those areas can be developed, that the infrastructure can be built and so forth. And there was a hope because, you know, at the end of a war there is always a possibility and many new openings and new opportunities and unfortunately that has not happened. When we as progressives and human rights activists in Sri Lanka try to describe what circumstances we are living under, we say it's post-war but it's not post-conflict and I think that perhaps is a way to explain the situation that we're in now because it's almost three years after the so-called end of the war and there still is no clarity about what the Sri Lankan government of President Mahindra Rajapaksa is going to offer to the Tamil National Alliance primarily because they are the majority of the elected members of parliament from the Tamil community. There's supposed to be talks happening any one of these days between the government and the Tamil National Alliance, the TNA, but there's no clarity about what is on offer and considering that the Tamil people of Sri Lanka have endured maybe 30 years of conflict and before that and throughout that entire period and now endure severe discrimination on the basis of their right to use their language, on their rights to live and travel freely throughout the island, on their rights to return to their places of origin, on their right to return to their livelihoods, you know most of these rights are still not enjoyed by the Tamil people of North India. That is one part of it but the other part of it is really in terms of what is happening in terms of democratic rights, basic human rights, the fact that people who are speaking against what is being done, there seem to be a lot of disappearances, journalists who have spoken have been killed. This government seems to be doing not only following a discriminatory practice which has been there in the past but also seems to be also coming out against any kind of normalization of the scenario. I think that's really a problem or it's going to be increasingly a problem. I think that in any country where you have a protracted war, you will see that there is a long-term suspension of the normal rule of law and of a range of processes and structures that are put in place to safeguard people's rights and Sri Lanka is no different. So we have a police for example that have operated under emergency regulations and under the Prevention of Terrorism Act for 30 years. So for them impunity for example is guaranteed. It's the same for the military. We now don't have any longer emergency regulations in place but we do have the Prevention of Terrorism Act which has been since its inception in 1979 criticized by human rights activists in Sri Lanka and outside as being in flagrant violation of international standards and principles with regard to emergency legislation that is about national security. So because of the climate of impunity that has prevailed in Sri Lanka since the 1980s, first in the in the regime primarily in recent memory in the regime of President Premadasa who was of the UNP up and down during the time of Chandrika Kumarathonga and then certainly under the Rajapaksa regime. The impunity, the climate of impunity has only got worse and worse. So disappearances are taking place, judicial killings and abductions, what we call white van abductions. The white van came into the common usage in Sri Lanka in the 1990s, the white vans that had no number plates and that would just stop suddenly and drag people in and disappear and the people were never seen again. The same of this unidentified gunman you know, the phenomenon of the unidentified gunman who suddenly turns up somewhere and just blasts bullets into a person and then disappears. In the heart of Colombo we have had Tamil members of parliament assassinated. We had Lassanta Vikramathonga the editor of the English language Sunday leader assassinated. In broad daylight you know there have been so many exjudicial killings in Colombo, in some areas which are designated as high security zones. So and there has never been anybody held accountable, taken into custody. The investigations just start off with a grand fan fire and then after a little bit you know it's gone. So the cycle of impunity is something that has persisted and grown over the 30 years of the boy in Sri Lanka and now that the boy is no longer there, the impunity continues to exist and the human rights violations continue to exist and I think that's something that's a matter of very great concern to us. The other thing is of course that there are a lot of internal displaced refugees within Sri Lanka who still even after three years seem to live in very difficult conditions. Do you think any change is going to take place on that is taking place? Well I think that part of the problem you know at the end of the military offensive in 2009 there were 300,000 plus Tamil civilians who were displaced in the Vanni alone and let's just talk about them. By the end of 2009 because there was such a huge international outcry about the conditions in the camps that the government had set up for these 300,000 people in Vavunia but also because the not only because of the conditions but because there were so many allegations of abuse and human rights violations taking place in the camps I think it became absolutely untenable for the government to have these people in the camps and they began accelerated process of resettlement. Now we refuse to use the term resettlement because these people have actually been sent back to their places of origin without any guarantees that they may be able to resume life as was before they were displaced. Many of them still continue to live in very unprotected areas in small shacks and hovels without a door that they can shut which makes women feel extremely vulnerable. They have not been able to restart their livelihoods for a range of reasons and I think that what is most shocking is that internationally there is enough experience in Sri Lanka we had the experience of the tsunami and of rebuilding and resettling people after tsunami so there is knowledge there is expertise there is information and in fact there is also money available for example the Indian government commitment to build 50,000 houses you know but up to date none of that has come together the knowledge the experience expertise money has not come together to produce tangible results for the Tamil people who were displaced by the last months of the conflict and so they continue to live in absolute deprivation. So lack of political will in that sense to really address the issues properly. There is a lack of political will the people the people of the Vanya also the ones who lack political voice and political clout in our society but there's also a way in which there are many overlapping bureaucracies which also prevent anything from moving forward in a smooth way right. So for example the situation with the 50,000 houses offered by the Indian government you know that process was constantly blocked by this and that and the other bureaucratic procedures to the point that again that's really lack of political will but coming back to this issue of for instance what happened after the war and there was this lessons learned and reconciliation commission so has that report produced something from which things can move. Well let me just go back one second to the reconstruction of the Vanni because I wanted to say that the lack of political will is clearly there but on the other hand you have the political will that was expressed by the creation of a presidential task force without which nothing can happen in the Vanni and presidential task force is headed by the president's son so there was a extreme expression of political will to reconstruction in the Vanni and then there is the reality of the political will that really blocks anything from happening. So you know I want to be sure I put that on the table. Now coming back to this issue of this lessons learned and reconciliation commission which was constituted after the war has anything happened really on that which makes or do you think that the report of that commission will make any change in the situation? The no that would be my short answer the lessons learned and reconciliation commission was established as a response to the Sri Lankan government to the report by a panel of experts that was commissioned by the Secretary General of the United Nations which stated clearly that there was enough evidence pointing to allegations of war crimes during the last months of the military offensive in 2009 and calling for an independent investigation. The panel of experts reports said there is basis to talk about the allegations right in response to that the Sri Lankan government embarked on a big campaign of denial and attack on the Secretary General on the members of the panel and then after a lot of pressure nationally and internationally announced the creation of the LLRC. The mandate of the LLRC was to look at the failure of the 2002 ceasefire agreement and by the way to investigate what has happened thereafter. So actually the war crimes were not foregrounded in the way that the mandate of the LLRC was set out. The people who were selected by the president for the LLRC were also all senior government servants, retired public servants, many who had no other experience of doing this kind of investigation. The mandate of the commission which is set up under the Presidential Commission of Inquiry Act means they can only listen, they have no power to order anything other than make recommendations to the president and now that is what they have done. They had hearings in Colombo, they had hearings in the North and East, they had an interim report in which for example they had asked for the government to release a list of all Tamils who had been taken into custody in the last weeks of the war up to date that has not materialized. The final report of the LLRC was made available to the public in English in November we are still waiting for the Tamil length single aversions to be made public. The report contains references to possible actions by the government of Sri Lanka and some of them and on face value may seem to be to lead somewhere positive. For example it makes a mention about the need to look more clearly at the devolution of power but the government for the last three years has not had a consistent conversation with the Tamil National Alliance about devolution of power. The LLRC report talks about the need for a freedom of information act but in fact there was a draft of a freedom of information act that came before the cabinet and was thrown out some months ago. The LLRC report talks about the need for an independent national police commission. The creation of independent national commissions was mandated by the 17th amendment to the constitution. The appointments were to be made by a constitutional council which would include members of the opposition. The 18th amendment to the constitution which precedes the 17th amendment says that the president may make appointments to the independent commission. So you see the text of the LLRC report seems to be good and positive but in fact what we were looking for as human rights activists in Sri Lanka which was some commitment to move a process of creating a lasting and sustainable peace with dignity for Tamil people in Sri Lanka that is nowhere on the agenda. Last question that if you want really long lasting peace and as you put it sustainable peace in Sri Lanka what would be the measures that the Sri Lankan government needs to take? The Sri Lankan government needs to engage in a process of dialogue with the Tamil National Alliance as well as with the Tamil people of the north and east of Sri Lanka. There are many different historical examples even in the last 10 years of what has taken place in Liberia or Rwanda or East Timor. What is taking place now you know in many parts of the world where there have been conflicts where if there is a political will for reconciliation, if there is a political will to recognize minority communities in Sri Lanka as equal to the majority community then there is simply an open field for dialogue and discussion and for us the great pity is that the Mahindra Rajapaksa government is actually a very strong government. They have one public opinion behind them and the president need have no fears about moving forward with this because he will not meet with any resistance from a southern constituency and that's why we say that it is indeed a pity that in spite of being a strong government in spite of having as they say a very stable economic position they still lack the vision and the courage to move forward into an arena where you know the future of Sri Lanka may be resolved. So this is a moment in which they can seize the opportunity but that's being let go. Exactly so that's the great disappointment and frustration for us. Thank you Sunila it's great talking to you and hope to see you again in Delhi. Thank you very much.