 Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Lowy Institute. It is my great pleasure to introduce his excellency, Mr. Petro Poroshenko, the president of Ukraine, to speak about the challenges facing his nation. This is the president's second visit to Australia. He was very impressed the first time he came, and I believe in talking to him, he's really enjoyed this second visit as well. Just to give you a little bit of background on the president, he has extensive experience in politics, banking, and economics. He was the minister of foreign affairs for a period and also the minister for economic development and trade. Significantly, he was head of the National Bank Council for five years in the not so distant past. He was elected president of Ukraine on the 25th of May of this year. I think, as you all know, 2014 has been a most demanding year and a most difficult year for the president and the people of Ukraine. Probably the most difficult in its 23 years of independence since the Cold War. There's been extensive political turmoil at the beginning of the year. You can still see the scars of that in Kiev, certainly when I was there. There was the annexation of Crimea by Russia in March and continuing destabilization and intervention in the east of the nation of Ukraine. That is manifested in a very bloody conventional war in the provinces of Luhansk and Donetsk. And then, very sadly, in July, we had the shooting down of MH17 and the subsequent recovery operation and a number of initiatives to get the investigation going to determine who was responsible for this outrage. Of course, since then, there's been a tentative ceasefire and, of course, associated with all of this, very challenging economic circumstances for the president and his government. Now, through all of this, the president has shown a very strong and inspirational leadership to his people. He's won great respect around the world, particularly in Europe. And I think we're very fortunate to have him here today to speak to all of us. So, president, a very warm welcome to the Lowy Institute and I invite you to address the audience. Thank you. Thank you very much. Thank you very much indeed for the warm welcome. Dear Mr. Michael Fulilov, thank you for the invitation and to have a possibility to communicate with such a distinguished audience, not only in this hall. As far as I understand, we have a live on the ABC channel. And let me start with thanking all of you here in this audience and outside of it for your interest. This is crucially important for Ukraine to have an interest in the world, to the events and to the situation which happened in Ukraine. We live in the world which cannot be measured only in terms of the geographic distance. Yes, that's true. The Australia is thousands and thousands kilometers far away from Ukraine. But the world is actually very small indeed with the many factor bringing different nation much closer to each other. Economy, education, culture, common rules, common values. All these factors are present in the relation between Ukraine and Australia. Actually being here for more than 48 hours, I feel myself among the friends. This is very important to have such a feeling. We share the common values and we demonstrate the unique unity and unique solidarity. And I wanna thank all of you for the solidarity of Ukraine. Australian people, Australian government, prime minister, leader of the nation. This is vitally important for us to have this solidarity. However, there is some more aspect that come to forefront right now. Solidarity, compassion, and the universal drive for freedom. Ukraine now is under attack. Ukraine being punishing for choosing freedom, democracy. And actually what we have now in Ukraine, this is not just the war for our independence, not the war for our sovereignty, not just the war for our territorial integrity. Thank you. This is the war for freedom. Global freedom. This is the war for democracy. Global democracy. And this is the war for security, global security. The world is not anymore existing in a condition of cold war or post-cold war. This is completely different situation. And I think that the tragic events which happened in July in Ukrainian sky, the terroristic attack against MH17, demonstrating how close and how small is the world. And among the nation who suffered the most from this terroristic attack was Australia. And 38 innocent Australian people, innocent victim who suffered in this attack. And demonstrating that this, from the first glance, regional conflict touched every people on the earth. From the very first second of this terroristic attack, we, Ukrainian people, and me as the Ukrainian president, was together with Australia. Tony Abbott, as a prime minister, was among the first to whom I call and propose open independent investigation. And any assistant we can present to the Australian military, to the Australian police, to the Australian investigator. And I wanna thank the Angus Houston for the great job who do for making investigation as much transparent and as much effective as possible. Together with 100 Australian military and police being in a very next hours and days in Ukraine with a very high level of risk for their lives, try to be on the crash site under the fire of the terrorists trying to bring the truth about this terroristic attack and tragedy to the whole world. Thank you, Angus for that. But beforehand was the revolution. Revolution of dignity. Exactly one year ago, more than one million people were on the street of Kiev. I never ever in my life see such a well self-organized people. When the previous authority take off from the street, the police, pretending that it would be a clashes, send the provocateur, but one million people, don't break one window. Don't touch one car. Don't break one flower. They go on the street of Ukraine, demanding freedom, demanding democracy, demanding European democratic values. That was just after the previous government make a decision not to go and not to sign the association agreement with the European Union. The position which was supported by more than 70% of the Ukrainians. And Ukrainian people simply do not accept this choice. They appeared on the street with the form of the peaceful process. The most peaceful process, again I ever seen in my life. And within 11 days, the special riot police make a first attempt to storm peaceful people on the street of Kiev. And Ukraine maybe pay the highest price in their history. More than 100 people, the heavenly hundred gives their lives to change the country. And Ukrainian people win. We have a new country and we have a new people. And within the 23 years of our history, Ukrainian people who fighting for democracy and fighting for freedom, now have a unique chance for the transformation to build up the new society. Yes, the year 2014 make Ukraine life changing moment. It was loaded with a passion, pain and dream of the human spirit. It started with a shock of the shooting at the Maidan. And in its last throb, the corrupt government of Yanukovych tried to use violence to scare the people. But scared it got, the more Ukrainians came to the Maidan. I remember the night of the 11th of December 2013, when we have a 5,000 people on the Maidan when storm will start. That was started when we have in Kiev the high representative of European Union, Catherine Ashton for the foreign policy and deputy sector of state, Victoria Nuland from the United States. And when storm has began, it was an appeal to the people, please come and defend the revolution of dignity. There is no public transport by the authorities they were switched off. It's not possible to use the taxi because 12 kilometers they were stopped by the police. It was minus 20 temperature. And during the night, by walk, people of all ages come to Maidan. And at 5 a.m., when I saw more than 40,000 people on the Maidan, understanding that there is no more important thing in their life, like to come and defend democracy, I start to believe that in any circumstances we will have a victory with these people, very responsible, very pro-democratic, very European. And I'm proud of my people and I'm proud of my country. And of course we, for these 23 years, the Ukraine-Australian relationship was not so close. But immediately after, our revolution of dignity and our common pain during the tragedy of the MH17 make our nation, who are divided by their, it seems to me, 13,000 kilometers. Much closer and we become a nation who share the common values. And again, I wanna thanks all Australia for the unity and for the solidarity you demonstrate immediately after. And then we have another test, very important test, which Ukrainian state should pass, the aggression of Russia. First, it was annexing of Crimea. They say that it was a quiet aggression or quiet annexing. It was a so-called polite, green man. From the very beginning this was rejected that this is not a Russian regular troops. Then it was recognized. And they say that nobody was killed during this aggression. This is not true. There was a, for example, Crimean Tatar Rishat Akhmetov, who went on the one-man rally, went missing. And after 12 days was found tortured and dead from the God-short wound, right in his eye. There is an internationally acclaimed Ukrainian filmmaker, Olexin Sov, who was arrested and remained in custody in Moscow under made-up charges. And there were 19 Crimean Tatars, mostly young activists, who either went missing or were killed of the last couple of months. There are many, many other Ukrainian activists getting terrorized on the daily basis in Crimea. And let me remind you, 20 years ago, Ukraine, who have the third biggest nuclear arsenal in the world. And exactly 20 years ago, in December 1994, voluntarily give up this third nuclear arsenal launching the non-preferential movement. Having the guarantee from the five biggest nuclear states, United States, United Kingdom, France, China, and Russia. Guarantee for their security, guarantee for their independence, guarantee for their territorial integrity. And now one of the country guarantee is an aggressor against us. And 20 years afterward, Russia broke the pact and attacked us without any explanation. Once things were sorted out in Crimea, they moved further to Donbass. Ukraine has always been a tolerant nation and a friendly place to all the religions and denomination. The most shocking is the terror on Ukraine's religion minority instilled on the occupied territory by the terrorists. Let me give you a couple of example. In early June, group of the terrorists was waiting in front of one of the prayer houses in the occupied Slaviansk. They waited till their faithful came out. They detained four of them, took them in jail, severely tortured and killed. Five days later, these four young men got buried in the collective grave. There is no place, that was an explanation, there is no place of American sects on the Russian land, said the terrorist while convoying the victim out of the church. Greek Catholic revended, Tihon Kulibyaka was detained on July the 4th and had spent two months in captivity. His torment tried to make him convert to Moscow Orthodoxy to no avail. Unthinkable but true, in the middle of the 21st century in Europe, people get terrorized, tortured and killed simply for being different and being patriot. It's not just a rejection of the value today's Europe is based upon. It's attempt to build alternative, Europe based on alternative value. And Ukraine can be just a start. The terrorists justify their action by the glory pictures of civilian casualties from Donbass city. Propaganda describe them as a punitive action on Ukraine's part as a desire to kill them all. I have only one thing to say, shame on you. Each civilian death is a tragedy for Ukraine, not only because it's another Ukrainian life. It's the same way how to treat the lives of the all innocent victim of the age 17. It was absolutely unacceptable how the victim body were treated immediately. After the catastrophe. This is the way how describe what is the terrorist are. Ukraine would be last one interested on this. Ukraine be last one given such order. And what happened to civilian and Donetsk and Lugansk is yet another part of the unthinkable tragedy brought upon Ukraine by the polite murderers operated by Russians. Once the violence stop, Ukraine would be open, engaged and interested through the investigation of each particular case. Strangely, all the decision that would make possible and had based international control over the territory and borders blocked by Russia on international borders like UN and OEC. And it is vitally important for us to have a support of the whole world. And that was a great moment when 100 world nation vote in support of Ukraine on UN General Assembly. And immediately after the catastrophe of the age 17, that was very important for us to have a security council of United Nations decision supporting Ukraine and give us an opportunity to demonstrate the world unity and world solidarity of Ukraine. I have a meeting on the Munich and the beginning of year 2014. At that time, no European nation can imagine that we can demonstrate such a unity of the European Union for the sanction against Russia and supporting Ukraine. After three months after the aggression, after five months after age 17, Europe start to learn to speak one single voice. G7 countries, including Canada, including Japan, starting to speak single voice. Cannot mention, cannot not mention the Brisbane G20 where the whole world voice also was very loud in supporting Ukraine in their fighting for the global security and global democracy. Sending troops to the neighboring countries and taking away their territory is absolutely not the idea living in harmony. Sadly, many in Russia prefer to justify their aggression with the scary tales about the fascist Ukraine. I understand that the living in this delusion is more comfortable than simply facing the truth, especially when the truth is so horrible. The truth that Russian citizen killing my Ukrainian citizen just for nothing without any explanation. Because most of the people fighting and defending Ukrainian sovereignty is Russian speaking. And they don't have any... Russians don't have any reason to be there. The truth is that Russia make a mistake of a historic proportion. Ladies and gentlemen, Ukraine, Russia and the whole world pay a price that is too high fighting a war that is absolutely unnatural. So let's stop it. Let's get Russian troops out of Ukraine. Let's close Russian-Ukrainian border. And yesterday I told it in Melbourne. Within two, three weeks, if we have... get out Russian troops and close the border, it would be law, order, stability in Ukraine. We don't have internal conflict at all. We have a humanitarian catastrophe where people in Donetsk and Lugansk not receiving any money, not having any social benefits or pension, have significant difficulties to reach the food and medicine should survive under this condition. And we should stop this humanitarian catastrophe. And I think that the... restoring all law and order and restore the Ukrainian international-recognized border is a very important part of the job. What is the basis? My peace plan. Immediately when I become a president, I propose to the world a peace plan. And based on that, we signed up on the 5th of September the Minsk Plan and Minsk memorandum. By the way, it was signed by Russia. Very simple steps. Point number one, ceasefire. Point number two, withdrawal all the foreign troops outside of my territory. Point number three, immediate release all the hostages. Now more than 600 hostages, they keep them in the absolutely disastrous condition. Point number four, political dialogue. The election, local election, which should be done under Ukrainian legislation, internationally recognized with the international observers. And we are ready to have any form of communication with the leaders who would be elected by the people of Donbass and Donetsk and Lugansk. But that would be a complete disaster for this terrorist. They know that. They understand that. And that's why they do not accept even the Minsk Plan, Minsk Protocol and Minsk memorandum, which was already signed by them. Ladies and gentlemen, Australia is blossoming. Wonderful place. And I have another reason to be sure. Looking at the world from here, one doesn't get a feeling that something goes wrong. But it does. And the international relations are in turmoil and in Ukraine. We have a very big conflict. Ukraine is burning. And Europe is dangerously close to slipping back to the Cold War reality. This crisis, artificial as it is, won't just go away. It needs to be tackled. And it will put a burden on every nation who take freedom seriously. From all of my heart, I want to thank Australia for the support. I thank you, all of you, for feeling our pain. Please, be with us further on. Together, the whole world can bring peace and stability, not only in Ukraine. This is not a question of Ukrainian original security. This is a question of global security. Because this aggression demonstrates the uneffectiveness of the post-war security system based on the Security Council of the United Nations. We should propose to the world another idea who keeps the world stable. I think together, we can develop and propose it to the world. Thank you. And to my Ukrainian colleague, Slava Ukraine. Ladies and gentlemen, I'm Michael Fully Love I'm the Executive Director of the Lowy Institute. I want to start by thanking President Poroshenko for doing us the honour of visiting and supply street and making such interesting and important remarks. And I also want to take the opportunity to thank Air Chief Marshal Angus Houston, who in addition to being the Prime Minister's point man on most difficult Australian foreign policy topics, is a member of the Lowy Institute Board and we're very proud to have him and he was a very appropriate person to welcome and to introduce the President. Ladies and gentlemen, we have about 20 or 25 minutes now. I'm going to start by asking the President a number of questions and then I'm going to go to the audience for a few questions. So please think of questions you'd like to ask the President. Make sure they're questions, please, not statements. Let me begin, Mr President, where you finished. You said this is not just about Ukraine, this is a war for global security. And as many in this audience know, a couple of weeks ago, Chancellor Merkel of Germany gave the annual Lowy Lecture at the Lowy Institute and she made some very forward-leaning remarks on Mr Putin and Russia. She said that Moscow is displaying old thinking in terms of spheres of influence in which international law is trampled upon and she said this must not be allowed to prevail and those comments were reported across the globe in Spiegel and the Journal and the New York Times and the Economist and elsewhere. Can I draw you out on Chancellor Merkel's comments and can I ask you, does it signify in your mind a shift in the tone of the way the international community is considering this conflict? Thank you very much indeed. First of all, I want to thank the Chancellor Merkel for such a statement and for her very important role in providing the European unity with Ukraine. I think that the... I can sign by every word of Chancellor Merkel and I think that the level of danger, if you do not stop this very dangerous development of situation for the Europe because conflict is in the heart of Europe in the 21st century, the situation would be completely unpredictable. I have an opportunity because of the invitation of the all European leaders to have a floor on the European Union Council meeting with all 28 European leaders. Two times. That was right before the very important decision of the European Union Council for introducing the sanction. Now we see the evidence, the sanction is working and I have one positive news, by the way. Today is the first 24 hours for seven months when we don't have... when we have a real ceasefire in Ukraine. You simply can imagine how important it for me. This is the first night when I don't have neither lost nor wounded Ukrainian soldier when we don't have any lost or wounded civilian. Today in Canberra, I was in your war memorial with more than 100,000 Australian giving their lives for their freedom and democracy. Can you imagine that only in this conflict we lost more than 1,200 soldiers only for the last half a year, 1,000 civilian and soldiers missed and about 2,000 civilian were killed. I hate the idea that Ukraine continued to pay this price and that's why because of our coordinated action the whole world is coordinated. Cross my fingers if we are in a position to stop the war and have a real ceasefire that is a real great step for peace and stability in Ukraine. This is only 24 hours. Everything is so fragile but I pray that we should continue this process and if we will be united we will win, no doubt. Not win by military means but we will launch the political dialogue, peace brings stability to my nation, to the continent and to the whole world. Can I ask you, Mr President, last week President Putin in his speech to the Federal Assembly compared Crimea to Russia's Jerusalem and he said it's as sacred to Russia as the Temple Mount or Haramal Sharif is to Jews and Muslims. Can I draw you out on that claim and can I ask you do you believe that Crimea will one day return to Ukraine? I have no doubt on that. Crimea is Ukrainian and how we can win our battle for Crimea? To win the battle, we should win the battle for the Crimean brands. If people start to understand that better to be Ukrainian because Ukraine is a democratic country because we have a freedom in Ukraine. Ukraine has a perspective to be the member of the European Union that every single person is proud to be free and living in a democratic society. If we transform the country and we have zero tolerance to corruption, if we have a rule of law, it would be absolute, I'm absolutely sure that we win a battle for the Crimea. People in Crimea has a real big problem. There is no tourists, no jobs, difficulties with food and products, prices are double and people understand that there is no benefits. What now are feeding the Crimean? The conflict on the east of Ukraine, the conflict in Donetsk, because they say if we do not occupy you, you will have the same situation like in Donetsk but immediately when we have peace and stability in Donetsk like it's happened when we release the occupied territory because while I'm the president we decrease by two-thirds the square kilometers of the occupied territory and immediately on the released territory we have a pension, school, kindergarten, hospital, normal life is returned and people start to understand what for. What these military people are doing on my street, why they are killing the people, why they are simply bandit and terrorist and it is a significant transformation which happened in Donetsk and Lugansk and I don't have any doubts that it happened in Crimea. It is not interesting actually for me how anybody tried to explain the aggression or annexing. This is a brutal violation of the international law and it should be responsibility for this violation. That's it. Ladies and gentlemen, I'm going to give some in the audience an opportunity to ask questions. I first saw this gentleman and that lady. A microphone will come to you. Can I ask you to first of all state any affiliation you might have and then can I ask you to ask your question quite briefly so that we can get as many questions in. Thank you, sir. Thanks, Matt Siegel from the Reuters news agency. Mr. President, you said that it's vitally important to have the support of the whole world for Ukraine but India has been very forthright and blocking sanctions, standing against sanctions. And yesterday Sergei Aksyanov, the self-described Prime Minister of Crimea was with President Putin in India. Will this have an impact on Ukraine's relations with India? This is not an easy job to keep the world together. Santa, if you want, this is the difference between money and values. And this is very simple to understand. The closer you to the civilization nation, the values is much more important for you than money. Or you can be bought by money, contract and everything. But I'm an optimist. And the reason for this optimist is the decision of the United Nations, General Assembly, our coordination in the multinational institution, starting from the OEC, and the Indian position doesn't help and doesn't save Mr. Aksyanov. He is a criminal, very simple. He has a criminal background and no doubt he has a criminal future. This lady was next. Yes, the lady is standing up. Hi, I believe, I'm sorry, Philippa Nicole Barr. I'm with Korea Dela Sera in Italy. I believe that energy has been on the agenda in your talks with Tony Abbott and in particular the importation of coal and uranium. In the wake of MH17 and even the Chernobyl accident many years ago, can you ensure or guarantee the security of any imported uranium and how can you ensure that it will not become a target in any further aggression? Thank you for the question. Look, first of all, we have our own uranium. And we have a state of art technology to keep it safe. This is just a diversification of the supply of the energy sources. Because of the shortage of the Russian gas and Russian coal, the part of the nuclear electric energy in our balance is more than 60% now. And the level of the security on the nuclear station is the highest, which is confirmed by Magater. And this is not just... We are not a nuclear nation and we wanted to be a nuclear nation. This is not true. We are the nation who can produce all the equipment for the nuclear station and who provide there for the years and years the highest level of nuclear security, especially improved after the Soviet Union when the catastrophe of Chernobyl takes place. And we're talking about the diversification of the energy supply, just to make it lower dependence on Russia, which is very easy understandable in this situation. No matter if you're talking about the uranium or coal. And this is just the beginning of negotiation. There is no any contract, but we want to be very pleased to the Australian government to give us this opportunity and to help us. We are one of the top player on the energy market. And having him together with us is extremely important for us, just to have this opportunity as a other source of the energy. So please don't worry about nuclear security. We are a very responsible nation. Please don't worry about the qualification of our personnel and security on nuclear station. We are the top priority. And I'm absolutely sure that the current level of the bilateral economic relation between Ukraine and Australia is absolutely not sufficient to the level of the political relation between our countries. And that's why we find out the opportunity how to expand our agricultural cooperation, logistical cooperation, energy cooperation, and make it further political cooperation because on the 11th of January the new appointed Australian ambassador come to Kiev. And I want to thank the Australian government to open the Australian embassy. This is a very symbolic step. And we agreed that in the first quarter of the year 2015 the visit of the Australian Prime Minister take place in Ukraine. That would be also very symbolic. And we try to work hard and to prepare a package of documents to be signed during this visit. Thank you. Alexander, I saw this journalist here standing up. Yes. Aksana Kriss, Ukrainian Channel 1 Plus 1. Mr. President, could you please comment on the cases which were lodged by Ukraine in the International Court of Justice and the European Court of Human Rights? Those cases are regarding the situation in Crimea, in Eastern Ukraine, and about kids which were stolen, just kidnapped from Ukrainian orphanages. And the second thing, could you please comment also on the situation, on the relations between Russia and Ukraine regarding gas, what it is going there now? Thank you. Thank you. For the first question, Ukraine will use any opportunity to defend their interests, including possibility to defend it in the International Courts Institution, including the International Court of Justice, including the other International Institution after the situation in Crimea and after the situation in Donetsk and Lugansk. No doubt. And the new government, because look, I want to just attract your attention how responsible is Ukrainian. Immediately after the Revolution of Dignity, we not just have a presidential election, which was worldwide recognized as the most free and fair in our history. Immediately, when I was elected to the president, I declare the new parliamentary election, which was not an easy decision, by the way, because during the war, to have a parliamentary election is a dangerous thing. But democracy is the top priority. And Ukraine demonstrates a unique responsibility. Eighty percent of the political parties and members of parliament are strongly for the European integration of Ukraine. And first time in our modern 100 parliamentary history, we don't have the communists in our parliament. And we are ready to be adequate to all the challenges we have in front of our country. This is not just the reform, because reform is widely used in the world. We need to demonstrate the transformation of my country. Huge transformation, first time in our history. And I am absolutely sure that our new government, where we have a unique experience, we invite in the government our Ukrainians from abroad. Ukrainians who was born in Chicago and now work as a minister of finance in our government. Lithuania, who lived 10 years in Ukraine, but before in Sweden, I give them the citizenship, who will work as a minister of economic development and trade. Who will... Who are the author of the Georgian medical reform and have an opportunity now to implement his knowledge in Ukraine? Why don't you invite some Ukrainian Australian? You are welcome. Well, there are some Ukrainian Australians here today, so perhaps they can apply with you later, Mr. President. Next question here, please. I'll just wait for the microphone, if you would. Paige Megle, AFUO. Mr. President. Sorry about that. About the gas dispute and gas deal. You probably know that I was one of the leaders who support the gas deal between Russia and Ukraine, which was signed in Brussels and which regulate and give it the opportunity to buy up the gas from Russia during this winter. Why we do that? Because we are a responsible nation and we promise to provide energy security for Europe. And this gas deal give us this opportunity. But I am absolutely sure that the question for the energy diversification with a coal issue, it is the same important in a gas issue. And that's why we work hard today with our European partners to buy more European gas and to make energy security situation in Ukraine and in Europe much more security, being a member of the Energy Community Treaty and to transform the gas factor from the only political stick for some nation to the normal economic market situation. I think that would be positive for Ukraine. That would be positive for Europe. And at the end of the day, I have no doubt that would be positive for Russia. Yes, sir. Mr. President, earlier today in the United States, the Senate passed a resolution which provides a legislative framework for the provision of military and other forms of support for Ukraine. Could you comment on the passage of that resolution in specific and in general on Ukraine's position with regard to the provision of military support, be it lethal or non-lethal? First of all, we welcome this resolution on the resolution of Senate. They will register the project of resolution during my presence in Washington. That we welcome the status for a major non-NATO ally. And just for your information, we do not talk and immediately demand the lethal weapons from any country in the world. Ukraine has a state of our technology allow us to produce our own lethal weapons. We need the military technical for cooperation to defend ourselves, not to make an offensive operation. Yes, we need the state of our technology in the communication, into counter-battery, in the reconnaissance and intelligence, but just to make more effective our defense system. And I think that this way of the cooperation with the United States, European countries, Canada, Australia, that would be effective. That would be a synergy to keep world more secure. Mr. President, I'm going to ask you the last question. I know you have to leave for another event. I'm going to ask you about Mr. Putin. You've been very polite about Mr. Putin so far. You haven't risen to any of the baits that I've offered to you. President Bush famously said that he looked into President Putin's eyes and saw into his soul. Senator McCain said I looked into his eyes and saw three letters K, G and B. Prime Minister Abbott was more focused on his shirt front. I think it's fair to say than on his face. You've dealt with Mr. Putin a lot. You speak with him. You've been active in Ukrainian politics for very long. What sort of a person do you find him? Do you detect any goodwill from him in terms of ending this awful conflict between Ukraine and Russia? Thank you for giving me this opportunity to be polite. If I say that I support all the position starting from Chancellor Merkel and finishing with the Prime Minister Tony Abbott, I just share their views. This is point number one. Point number two. I have my personal feeling, if you allow me, to be just a normal person, not the responsible president. I think that the Russian president has changed significantly from those he was 10 years ago. Third, I think that the Ukrainian matter for him is very emotional. And fourth, I'm absolutely sure that we will bring peace. We will have a territorial integrity. I avoid the term we will win war, but I can use the term we will win peace, no doubt. Ladies and gentlemen, the president has a career in diplomacy in front of him if he ever leaves politics. Ladies and gentlemen, I think it's fair to say, as the president said, that a year ago the relationship between Australia and Ukraine was pretty thin, but international politics changes very quickly and the despicable act, the downing of MH17, which of course carried 38 of our fellow countrymen and countrywomen on it, along with many other civilians, has had one silver lining and that is it has brought our countries together and it's created the kind of solidarity that the president spoke of. Today we've heard another important speech by a world leader to the Lowy Institute. It's becoming a bit of a habit. We thank you President Poroshenko very warmly for visiting us at Blyth Street and for giving such a serious important speech and also for taking our questions. Please join me in thanking the president. Thank you. And I want to use this opportunity to make many thanks to the Lowy Institute for this opportunity to have an open and easy communication with the such a distinguished audience. I want to thank to Michael Fulilov, I think for the excellent moderation of the audience and I want to thank all of you because again this is a unique feeling to be among the friends and I think that when all the Australians will have the same feeling visiting Ukraine that would be very important for us. What is my role? I wanted to remove all the barrier between the Australian and Ukraine. I invite you to visit Ukraine no matter with the business purposes, as a tourist or as a politician. We are very close nation and I promise you you will fall in love with Ukraine. Thank you. Thank you very much. Just one second. Ladies and gentlemen let me also thank you for visiting us at Blyth Street today. This is the last event in the Lowy Institute's event series for the year. Please join us early in the new year when we kick off with a panel discussion on events the coming year of 2015 and hopefully that year will bring peace and justice to your part of the world Mr. President rather than more conflict. Ladies and gentlemen thank you again. Thank you.