 Raise your right hand, please. Do you swear to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth? I do. Mr. Blankenhorn, what is the primary purpose of marriage in human groups? We're embodied as male and female. That's the basic division in the species. We we reproduce sexually. In fact, the famous anthropologist Claude Levi Strauss once described marriage as a social institution with a biological foundation. He was saying that across societies that the man and the woman whose sexual union makes the child that those same two individuals are also the social and legal parents of the child and there is only one institution in the world that performs the task of bringing together the three dimensions of parenthood the biological the social and the legal that institution is marriage Because we know how important this is for children very well. Mr. Boyce. You may cross-examine well Let me try to make this as simple as I can Have any of the any of the scholars that you've said you relied on said that permitting same-sex marriage will cause a Reduction in heterosexual marriages. That's yes. No, or I don't know I know the answer. I cannot answer you correctly if the only words I'm allowed to choose from is yes or no I can give you my answer in a very brief sentence if you know the answer. Why don't you share it with us? Well, I would be happy to but he's only permitting me to give yes and no I Cannot do that and be accurate He is giving you three choices. Yes. No, I don't know but I do know I do know the answer Then is it yes or is it no your honor? I can answer the question but I cannot give an accurate answer if the only two choices I have are yes and no I if you give me a sentence I can answer this one sentence is all I'm asking for All right, let's take a sentence one sentence. Can you ask me the question again, please? Yes Have any of the scholars who you say you relied on asserted that they believe permitting same-sex marriage will result in a Reduction in the heterosexual marriage rate answer is That I believe that some of the scholars I have cited have asserted that permitting same-sex marriage would contribute to the de-institutionalization of marriage One of the manifest manifestations of which would be a lower marriage rate among heterosexuals But I do not have sure knowledge that in the exact form of words you are asking me for They have made the direct assertion that permitting same-sex marriage would directly lower the marriage rate among heterosexuals Mr. Blankenhorn that wasn't that long Questions and answers if I were to take that as an I don't know would that be fair? Well with respect your honor, I would disagree with you I know Exactly my answer to this question and I have just stated it and I would be happy to restate it The record is clear on what you said and when you say Based on the scholars that have studied this that's because you're simply repeating the things that these scholars say you're just a Transmitter of the findings of these scholars. Is that correct now? You're putting words in my mouth. No, sir Yes, sir I was simply trying to report the view of some scholars that I was basing my arguments on I'm saying there are scholars respected scholars Who have made this argument based on ethnographic research and I've read them and that's the basis for my assertion your honor Could I ask this witness be instructed to listen to the question? Answer my question and not make a statement that is not responsive to the question even if he believes it's important I don't need such instruction. That's what that my intention is to do exactly that Mr. Blankenhorn One of the instructions that the court gives to the jury when an expert witness testifies is to consider the witness's background training and all the other evidence in the case and that other evidence includes the demeanor of the witness So I would urge you to pay close attention to mr. Boyce's questions and to answer them directly succinctly So bear that in mind. Yes, sir. I will I'm really just addressing whether I was putting words in your mouth If you look at page 300 lines 7 through 12 You said that you were basing your analysis on the work of highly regarded scholars and then you say okay Oh, I got you a moment. I used the word. I'm a transmitter of findings of eminent scholars. Got you Okay, I Said transmitter seven months ago in a deficit and what you meant there was that you weren't making these conclusions on your own You were simply repeating what these scholars had to say is that correct if I may say so well my own words Let me look at your own words. Let's look at your own words page 300. I am simply repeating things that they say I can assure you these are not my own conclusions. I am I'm I'm a transmitter here of findings of Findings of these eminent scholars. Did you give that testimony your deposition? That's what I said at the deposition Now you believe that gays and lesbians today are raising children, correct? Of course. Yes And in fact hundreds of thousands of children are being raised by gay and lesbian couples. Is that correct? I? Don't know how many you ever try to find out. I did And were you able to make an approximation? I Was yes, sir. I was And What was that approximation? I Can't recall can you recall approximately no, sir Okay And you recognize that in some cases gay and lesbians are raising a child It is the biological child of one of the parents and in some cases they are raising adopted children. That's correct Those would be too To you know, of course, they would be those would be examples of Those would be examples of children and gay and lesbian homes. Yes And you believe that permitting gay and lesbian couples to marry would significantly advantage the gays and the lesbians themselves and The children that they are raising is that correct sir? When you say advantage, do you mean improve the well-being of? yes, my answer to your question is that I believe that Adopting same-sex marriage would Be likely to Improve the well-being of gay and lesbian households and their children in fact The studies show that all things being equal to adoptive parents raising a child from birth Will do as well as to biological parents raising a child from birth correct No, sir, that's in well, sir. Oh may I say another word on that? I have an opportunity to redirect. Okay. Well It was a clarifying thing and it actually supports something you just said the studies show that adoptive parents Because of the rigorous screening process that they undertake before becoming adoptive parents Actually on some outcomes Outstrip the biological parents in terms of providing protective care for their children Yes, I was gonna come to that I appreciate you for getting there now in Binder number one. We have a copy of your book future of marriage and the last two sentences After all part of the reason why the principle is so revolutionary is that it can grow and deepen over time Groups that had long been considered effectively outside its moral reach African-Americans women people of certain colors or languages or religions Can over time and often as a result of great struggle enter into its protective sphere And then you get to two sentences. I want to particularly direct your attention to you say I Believe that today the principle of equal human dignity must apply to gay and lesbian persons You see that Yes, yes, sir. Yep, and the I There is you correct. That's correct and you say that In that sense in so far as we are a nation founded on this principle, we would be more Emphasize more American on the day we permitted same-sex marriage than we were on the day before And you wrote those words. Did you not sir? I wrote those words You believe them to be correct. Yes. Yes. I now believe them. That's correct your honor. I have no more questions