 Welcome you to the select board meeting for September 11th. I would ask that you rise and do the Pledge of Allegiance with us. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible with liberty and justice for all. Yes. If you could remain standing, I would like to ask for a moment of silence on this anniversary of 9-11. Thank you very much. Patrick, do you have some changes for us? A couple of additions. First of all, there's an Act 250 permit that's been issued. This is the subdivision in the RPDI where the select board had submitted a letter about the 2-1 versus 1-1 process to agricultural soil. Act 250 came down and issued a 1-1 mitigation fee, so good news for the town. The decision is right here. That's for a consent agenda. Second thing for a consent agenda. The select board had issued a letter of support for some UVM students to do a trail mapping project in town. The project was selected by those students, so that'll be happening. This is just an email from Darren Shibbler, but UVM NR 206 project being accepted. I'm also just for a consent agenda. We have corrections to minutes from select mid-runner. No, these are actually old minutes. I'm going to be referencing them in a discussion that's part of the business items. Which item? It'll be item 5D. A couple items to remove from the agenda. The Fort Water Tower Grant. The estimate came in from Negli and Chase. It's much more expensive than was expected, and more money than the town has to contribute at this point. That one can be pulled. That's item 5C. And item 5I, which was to acknowledge a new street name for Somerville Lane. The fire chief still has some outstanding questions about that one, so that one's not quite ready for your review yet. And also we have Captain Gary here from the police department. He was interested in the regional dispatch charter and funding documents that discussion, so rather than make him sit through the entire meeting, I'd ask that the board consider moving that up to just after item 5D. Which would take a motion? Yes, of course. Are those all the changes, Greg? Yes, they are. Okay. Do I have a motion on the agenda? I would move that we move 5L underneath 5B, and that we remove 5C and 5I to tonight's agenda. And include the consent agenda items. Would you like me to answer that? Do you want it after D? Okay. We'll put it after D. As well as accepting all the additions to the consent agenda and the item 5D. Do I have a second? I will second. Thank you. Moved by Irene, seconded by Sue. All those in favor of amending the agenda, please signify by saying aye. Aye. Opposed? Motion passes, Sim 4-0. Before we get into the public to be heard, I would ask that anybody who has an electronic device with them move it to silent or vibrate at the very least so that we are not interrupted. Item number 4, public to be heard. Is there anyone who has anything that they would like to share with the select board that is not on the agenda for this evening? Hearing none, we will move to... Mike, I have something. I beg your pardon. I have something. I'm sorry. That's okay. I wanted to give the public a chance, but I just wanted to provide a real quick update, and Mike could do this as well, the Public Works Evaluation Committee. We've wrapped up our sessions where we were meeting. We came up with an outline for our report, which is going to include recommendations, and actually the first draft was just provided to our team today for us to make edits. So just wanted to give that update that we're progressing there, and we're on track to meet the deliverable date. Anybody else from the select board? Okay. Then we will get down to the business at hand. Item 5A, we have interviews this evening with Ms. Janssen and Ms. Brown. So Ms. Janssen, if you would come and join us, please. Yes, thank you. Ms. Brown, if you wouldn't mind stepping into the lobby while Ms. Janssen is on. I apologize, and I thank you. We will come and get you. So Ms. Janssen, you are interested in a position on the Cemetery Commission, so we're looking forward to hearing from you about why you want to undertake that endeavor, and we thank you in advance for coming forward and for volunteering. Always intrigued me, and so I visited them all over the country. So not only when I became interested in genealogy to just see if I could find my ancestors, but to look, I mean, if you go to Virginia City, Nevada, it's totally different than, you know, going to say Rockingham, Vermont. I've even had friends take me to the cemeteries in Scotland because they knew I was interested. I guess one of the things that, as I've looked at the cemeteries as I've gone up to Johnson and down to Western Mass yesterday, for example, or to my vet in Virginia is the older cemeteries and the stones that are even broken or not clean anymore. And that is kind of upsetting. It should, the cemetery should be a place where, this is my perspective, you go to see where your family is buried, right, or your ancestors. Years ago, probably around 1984, my son was stationed in a Syracuse. He had just moved up here, my younger son and I. I looked up, you know, my ancestors, and sure enough, they were there in Syracuse. So I found out what graveyards they were in, and we went to one on this trip. And I found a great, great, great grandfather who died in 1810. And so I thought, oh, next time I come, I'll carve, rub that stone. And I've taken classes that belong to the association for gravestone studies, the Vermont Old Sect Cemetery Association. So I know the paper to use and what to use to rub them and how careful you have to be. When we went back and I had this stuff, his gravestone was smashed, right? It's really awful. If you look on Ancestry, for example, and people have taken photographs and find a grave, you know, sometimes you can't see the dates, right? I've talked to the lady that's in charge of the Vermont historic sites, you know, about grants. And I've spoken to the people at VOCA and was hoping to do something on the 23rd, but it's just a grave. It's a small, private graveyard, so it's only eight stones. So there's plenty of people for that. So graveyards are really important to me. I told my son one time, my younger son, you know, because when we went to one graveyard, this lady who lived next door said, I come here to look up the names, you know, if I'm having a baby. And I later said to my son, you know, I'd really like to live next to a graveyard. Mom, you do. Because he's buried all my dogs. I have about 40 dogs buried just outside my fence, but that's not the kind of graveyard, you know, really. So that's my reason. I really want to be involved. And if there's, you know, there's something I can do. I've been to the legislature all these years. I know a lot of people. I belong to those two associations. I went and watched Matt Peake who cleans Hope Cemetery stones for Rock of Ages clean the stone. Does the board have any questions for Mr. Jensen? I'm curious what the Nevada gravestones look like since you mentioned it. You know, there would. Oh, that's fascinating. They're just wood. You know, there are some, you know, like marble. But I picked Virginia City because I lived in Reno and I had friends that lived in Virginia City. And even when, you know, what was that, Bonanza, we were up there when they first started that program. And so we saw Haas and Little Joe, you know, right. So any old town and my father was big on visiting ghost towns. And so, you know, I've been to a lot of cemeteries, but each one is different and special, you know, to their people. And it needs to be, it needs to be well cared for. That's a good question. I think I know the answer to this question, but so last meeting we appointed you to the library. Right, right. And I know that you're taking classes and you're involved in a lot of things. Is there a point where you're spread too thin or do you feel like you have more to give for this? I work one or two, it depends. The tests mostly are in the summer and in the fall. In the winter it's slow and there's only about five of us and we all work part-time. So I work maybe two days a week, half a day, right. Then I take two classes a semester. And next semester I hope to take a historic preservation class at UVM. I take two classes here. And so no. Yeah, right, right. I said I knew the answer, but I just wanted to ask. I live by myself with three dogs and three geese and three chickens. So my family helps me. I don't have to help my family anymore except over the telephone giving advice. Oh, maybe they don't want. Yeah, right. So I don't think, and I'm not sure. I was told, and I'm not sure about this, that they only meet once a year, the Cemetery Committee. Does anybody know? That could be about right. Yeah, right. So gee, you know. I think you're going to be able to make that okay. I'm going to be able to make that wonderful. Does anybody else have questions for miss Jansen? If you get a chance, you should go down. You've all I'm sure been to see Hope Cemetery, right? Right. Yes, there. Yes, yes. And it was really amazing to watch him clean the stones, although it wouldn't work. You know, they're because their gran wouldn't work for Slade or marble. Yes. All right. Thank you. So we will decide later on tonight and somebody from the manager staff will be in touch with you tomorrow. Okay. But thank you again very much for stepping up. Yes. Miss Brown, please come join us. Good evening. Thank you. Thank you very much for stepping up. So we understand that you're interested in the position that became available on the Cemetery Commission. So we were wondering if you could tell us a little bit about yourself and why you would like to serve on that commission. Well, I live in Essex Center out in the center. I've lived there for about 28 years or so. And I haven't really been too involved in the community to be quite honest. I was working and I didn't. I did work at the library in their gardening project for a couple of years and all. And I've also been very involved in my family genealogy and have seen a lot of cemeteries. Found them really, actually before that, when we, I have two children, when we traveled we would, Massachusetts has the best cemeteries. And we would often stop and trace them or whatever. And so I've always found them really fascinating historically, but also because they're kind of a, people kind of, they're a resting place for the community. You know, stand there and look and there's the neighbors next to each other who probably couldn't, you know, but there they are for the rest of their days. So, but, you know, as far as being involved in the historical society here or the, or, you know, other things, I haven't. And I felt, I like Essex. I feel connected to it. I think Indian Brook is a wonderful place. I feel proud of Essex. And I guess that was kind of what led me to apply for this. I don't have a lot of qualifications and I think I naively kind of called thinking of it more in the historical context. However, I did go online and I realize a huge, oh, sorry, a huge, that there's an whole nother dimension to this, which is the rules, the regulations, the running of a cemetery. Right. Is, you know, I would say is, you know, quite a big responsibility and, and takes some good, some hard work from, from a committee. So, okay, the first, the thing that really led me to this in addition to all of this background is about a year ago and Irene, you, I was on, you and I were on the same tour. I took a tour through the common burial ground up in the center. And it was with Tim German and I think Lori Johnson and it was, it was fascinating. But it was also very sad to me because there's so it's, it's, it's a huge ground takes a lot to keep up. And it's, I don't, you know, everybody, I mean, all towns, I think, probably old towns struggle with how to keep your cemeteries a strong and respectable and landscaped and all of that. So it's, the cemetery has been sort of on my mind since then. And when I saw this opening come up, I thought, well, I'll just, I'll just take the leap and see if, you know, what you think. Okay. Fair enough. We thank you for doing that. Do any of the questions? Yep. Do any of the board members have questions for Ms. Brown? I don't know. Okay. Then I think we're good. We will deliberate later on after the meeting and we will, we'll come to a decision and someone from the manager's office will be calling you tomorrow to let you know what the results of our deliberations were. But we thank you again for stepping up and we really appreciate you coming in. Well, thank you. And it was very nice to meet with you all. Thank you very much. Thanks for all your hard work. So, 5B, I think, I think we're going to, we'll do that when we're in executive session for the other two. Do you think, Patrick? I do. It probably is a fairly easy right decision. Do we need to go into executive session? We'll probably do it right now if you were so inclined. Yep. Since the individual was already on the last one. What's the board's pleasure? So, can I ask a question? Sure. So, is the situation that an additional position has become available? Correct. There was Sue-Anne Kirk, I believe, resigned. So, she'd opened up shortly after you had the shift. I actually knew that I just wanted to settle out in the meeting. Sorry. The sheet that was in our consent agenda was dated August 1. Which was long before. We didn't see it until after. Not to highlight an issue, but I just, you know, that would have saved us the situation. Thank you. So, was it the pleasure of the board to take this appointment up now? Please. Okay. Then I would, I'd entertain a motion. I would move approval of the appointment. I would move that we appoint Iris Banks to the Essex Free Library Board of Trustees. I will second. Okay. Moved by Irene, seconded by Sue. Any discussion? Oh, yeah. Yep. I should reveal that my wife is on the Board of Trustees. But I think I can be impartial on my decision. So, I'm going to. Very well. Participate in the vote. Okay. Thank you. Any other discussion? Then all those in favor of appointing Miss Banks to the Library Board of Trustees signify by saying aye. Aye. Opposed? Motion passes Sam 4-0. The Water Tower Grant has been eliminated. So, we are now here to hear President George Tyler talk to us about the management recruitment update. George? As you know, your illustrious chair is in Texas with the Red Cross. So, I was asked to step in just in case you had any questions about the process so far. I don't really have a presentation. We tried to figure out all the documents, all the relevant documents that you needed to see. As I was, just before I came over here tonight, I remembered one more which is just a list of all the places that's going to be, the job will be advertised. I don't know if you need this, if you want to see that. I can just read it to you, but I can hand it out to you too if you want. But I've got that with me. Okay. So, I guess maybe what I'll do is let me just quickly go through this. I'll try not to take much time. And this is, as you know, to go back over the, as our last joint meeting you, the two boards authorized the two chairs to initiate and execute the contract. And that really was going to mean, and I think it's going to mean over the next few months, a lot of email and phone conversations with Don Juden in New Hampshire. And so our first one, we kicked off shortly after we had the joint meeting and the agenda, the big issue was coming up with the contract. We had, Don had presented us, as you recall, with a rough outline of the contract. We had that. It was a draft that he had used with other communities. And we also had a survey. And the survey would be to board members for the select board and the trustees asking us, what are we looking for in a manager? How do we see things? What is the current state of Essex and Essex Junction? And so I think you have gotten, I think you have, you should have hard copies of that and you had the links for that. And it's pretty, it's pretty weighty. It's got, it's not a multiple choice kind of a thing. It's got a lot of questions there. So Max and I thought it really got, it really got to the heart of everything and it unturned. And if I would say if anyone thinks that we left something out of that survey, let us know and we can, we can probably tack it on. If you can think of something we should have asked and didn't ask, but it's there. And I think there will be time for that sort of thing again for some more revisions. So that was, that was with a conference call. And we then did business over with email Max, with Travis sort of hovering in the background to take care of any of our administrative needs if we needed paper or someone to sort of pass, you know, move things along. So that's it. We did, we finished off the survey. We finished off the contract. You should have copies of both. Dawn then asked Max and I to give just a, off the top of our head, you know, stream of consciousness thought about what we, where we thought the state of the S6 junction and S6 town were, what we thought we'd be looking for in a new manager. Max was sort of in the process of gearing up to head off to Texas. I sat down and wrote something. Max said, hey, that's great. But I'm not sure that Max will probably, he may when he gets back want to write his own, but he, I'd let him look at mine before I sent mine off to make sure I didn't say anything completely ridiculous, even though it's mine and it's, but I think you have that narrative. So you, again, and I just tried to basically summarize how I saw things and what at least I think kind of the kind of political environment that the new manager would be coming into. What I think, what I think were the biggest issues, I kind of said that I thought that to summarize for the audience. I don't see us, we don't have any catastrophic knock on wood economic issues. We don't have any, we're not being hit hopefully by a hurricane. We don't have any devastating stuff going on. I think that the biggest challenge for the new manager is probably going to be jumping into the middle of the consolidation effort. That's going to be sort of an outside the box sort of experience for someone who's into the normal routine of municipal management because consolidating two communities is not something we do all the time. So I kind of said that that's the sort of thing that I think that that is going to be the biggest opportunity and the biggest challenge for the new manager coming in, getting to know the ten of us and working in that environment. And so that's pretty much it. Now, I think just to go back, I can summarize where we are in terms of the process. The idea is after we get the surveys done, he is going to generate, he'll use that to generate a profile that will help him screen candidates. The advertisement for the position should have already gone out and should already be being advertised in these venues. And I'll read them off in a little while. But I think he kind of discussed this during our interview where he was going to be. And ICMA was the big one. The other interesting piece is that we decided we'd probably do three focus groups. One was staff and then one with members of the public. And we weren't really sure how we would get folks from the community involved in a focus group. We didn't know, we can't say, and I don't think we can say now, if we advertised that whether we would get enough people involved in wanting to participate in focus groups, would we get so many that would have to screen them? If we wouldn't get enough, then would we have to reach out and appoint them? So that's, we're still not really clear on how we're going to get the focus group piece, the public input for the focus group piece. I think that should be on the agenda for our next joint meeting, which is going to be in two weeks. We can go over that and talk about how we want to do that. But the idea is that he's also going to have a focus group for staff. And if we wanted to put, and maybe not the entire staff, but people that we think should be. And then I think you, if you have all the, I don't want to have to go over the entire detail of the contract, but I think most of the schedule and the process is laid out in there. And so I can answer any questions that you have. Let me do one last thing here, though, and say where it's being advertised. It's being advertised, interesting to me, I didn't realize this, that every state in New England has something that's the equivalent of the Vermont League of Cities and Towns. So we are advertising on each one of their websites with each one of those, including the VLCT. We are also advertising with ICMA International. It helped me with this, Pat. The International City and County Management Association. The big organization that all managers know and trust, and they'll be looking at that. And then we debated somewhat advertising in the Boston Globe, but he said he's for New England, for Greater New England, he's had a lot of success with the Boston Globe. So he put it, we said fine, put it in the Boston Globe. And that's it. He's putting it on the MRI website, obviously. One of the other issues that came up that we discussed was are we going to, we being Essex Town and Essex Junction, are we going to be advertising this position? Are we going to be putting it in the newspaper? Max and I said no, we're not. We are assuming that MRI has been hired to do this job, and they are going to be handling all of that. We are not going to be trying to, you know, ask for resumes ourselves. We don't want to go there. We don't want to get involved in it. We wanted the entire thing to be handled by MRI. So that was probably a bit of an executive decision, but I think we both sort of assumed that we kind of understood what you guys were thinking. So that's what we decided. And I'll stop there in case you have any questions, or we're good. Any questions for George? So the ICMA, is that on the web, or is that some other way that that's advertised? It's on the way, they have a web presence, a big web presence. Pat, you have a? Yes, they put out a bi-weekly newsletter of all vacancies throughout the, for all their members. So that's an email. Yeah, it's an email. It's something that every manager who's looking to perhaps move or who wants to check their salary against communities that are advertising for a new manager in the same population group, and many other reasons why people don't want to check up on their friends and what's going on with their job. So it is seen by a lot of eyes. So besides the email, is it also posted on a website? Oh, I think it's, I think if you, my understanding of how it works, Sue, is that you go to ICMA and then it's jobs. There's probably a link on there and you click on it and it's all the jobs that are. Right, or like if you did a search on your search, it would come up. Okay, got it. Thanks. You can do the same thing by contacting your consultant. They also keep a list of their jobs that they're doing and the status of the job. So people who are interested, who know MRI in New England, will look at them, look at what they have posted, and see whether or not they'd like to apply. It's a pretty comprehensive list. Yeah, I thought it was comprehensive, yeah. I'm struck by the fact that, unbeknownst to me at least maybe other board members knew this, I wasn't aware that just a brain dump from the chairs would be asked for. I think that it was, I think if you wanted to do the same thing, I think it'd be welcome. He just wanted to start the ball rolling. I think if you wanted to write an essay similar to that, I think you'd welcome that input, Irene. So do you have this contact information for us then? I do. Great. I don't have it right here. Yeah, I can email it to you. Sure. Thanks. Yeah. But the survey, I don't know if you've heard through the survey. I think if you look at the survey, you'll see it's asking the same sort, it's pretty much asking the same question. It's anonymous though, so maybe that's, yeah. Well ours isn't anonymous. I'm certainly, no, and I think, I'm not sure that ours are, that the surveys are going to be anonymous. But you identify whether you are trustee or something. That's true. Yeah, that's true. I don't think he'd be, he's welcoming anything we send him and say to him. So I don't think he's trying to be selective. But he said, you know, this was our very first conference call. And he said before you go, I'd like to ask you both of you guys to do this. And I went right home and did it. And because that's the kind of stuff I do. Max was a little more, you know, wise and reluctant about it. So, but I just shot it off. So in, but I don't think he'd have a problem with it. But I think if you look at the survey, he's asking pretty much the same questions. You go through the survey. I just got a different sense of the president of the village trustees is speaking for. Oh, no, I don't know the town that he doesn't know. I mean, that just that just weirded me out. And that's why I presented these old minutes where Irish banks comments that in future deliberations over the two halves of the town, she would like to be represented by someone who lives in it, not outside of it, particularly when the chair of the select board and the trustees meet without the entire select board being present. So, so to see your name on a letter and seeing that Max seconded your letter left me feeling like half of my constituents didn't have a voice in presenting their side to Mr. Jutton. Oh, I think they'll I I would assume that they'll first of all they'll they'll help they should have an opportunity to present their voice. But I think I I think this I tried to make it clear that this was really this was from me. He wasn't asking me to speak on behalf of the trustees or the village government or anything. He was just saying from George from your perspective. What do you see? What do you think is the big thing going on here? And I think if he if he got a similar communication from Irene or from Sue, he'd be fine with that too. But we were there. He asked us. I responded. No, I just I just wish in the future when those things come up with you and our executive search firm that both chairs would forward to their boards. This is what I'm doing. This is why but feel free to weigh in yourself like maybe more communication than waiting till after you've submitted something and then it becomes just something on our agenda because I think there needs to be more interaction at this stage with point because I think that some of these things I mean the hope not just that but also with the survey some of the survey questions. It the the issue at that point was well what what when we're talking about executing the contract is this come under the broad definition of executing the contract or not. And if we had said well look at there are some you know we're not sure we want to advertise in the Boston Globe and we're not sure about some of the survey questions. So let's not answer these now. Let's wait two weeks until we have our you know then we're then we're we could really be slowing the process down. So I guess that's the thing. It's it's sort of we took a bit of a gamble there. And that's what I'm saying is that we we try to accelerate it. But I have a feeling that that looking at the survey looking at what what the process he's got laid out. I don't see that there anyone's going to feel that they've been left out at all. I hope so. I just I just was taken a little bit back to see so much work having been done. And I personally hadn't heard from you or Max maybe other people did. But I feel like this like board had been left out of the loop as to what had been going on for the last several weeks. Well we could probably we could probably send all of the emails. I mean there was this huge flurry. Right. And then and then it's sort of because we wanted to get the the advertising out and we wanted to get him to get started on the survey. One of the things that we could do it's certainly possible is we could CC everybody on the emails. But you have to be you have to swear that you're not going to respond and get into a conversation with us because then we're having online meetings and we don't want to be doing that. So we we sort of said well let's let's let's instead of you know tempting ourselves and going there and and encouraging potentially an online conversation. Let's just save up all the stuff that we have and then and then we'll read it all at a meeting. But you know why don't we why don't we discuss this at our next joint meeting if you you know there's we're just still pretty early in the process. So if you think that you folks want to be more engaged and have up have this flurry of emails coming into you we can probably arrange to have that happen. So but let's let's talk about it at our next meeting and see and see because I'm going to be making the same presentation with the trustees tomorrow night and they may have some some comments or reservations to questions. Just a comment. I think spell check is changing sudden a jutting to sudden in a couple of places. Is that me? I don't know. I looked up to make sure that I remembered it was with a J and then a couple of places and not in the contract. I mean the contract doesn't include is also as long as you got the contract right. Yeah. Yeah. Let me see. Yeah. I don't know why that would have happened. Yeah. It is jotting. So I don't know. No trouble. Yeah. Any other questions? Okay. Nope. Okay. All good. I'm good. Thank you. Thank you for having me. Thank you very much for coming in George. Appreciate it. Our next agenda item is the discussion about the regional dispatch charter and funding documents. Captain. I'm going to be speaking to this. Okay. I have the follow on discussion that's what you're going to hear. Very well. But basically at your, the meeting on August 21st, your presentation from Charlie Baker from the regional planning commission about the Joint Survey Committee's draft charter and their draft MOU on cost sharing for member communities. The Joint Survey Committee was requesting feedback on those documents from all the legislative bodies who are involved with their regional dispatch at this point. So, the select board made some comments that were given to Charlie at that meeting. I believe he took that back to the JSC, but I just put that into list form and figured if they were new, or opened up an invite to the board if they had any additional comments to reach out, let me know. The select writer did give me an email with some comments on there, and those are attached as well. So I just recommended that you review the list of comments made on the 21st and Irene's comments. So, that's on the committee on behalf of the entire board. Andy? Bullet number four starts with page 10, section 19. It says Mr. Watts recommended there be a 15% requirement for the reserve fund. I believe I said the 15% maximum for the reserve funds. I'd like to correct that from requirement to maximum. If we could, please. Any other questions for Greg? Comments? Patrick? I suppose the bear is repeating that this is the second through the last process where your comments will be gathered, put into a document, and then the last step is it comes back to you for a final vote. And I think we remember Charlie at one point, one of the earlier meetings, or somebody said that not all of the comments may be included by the joint study committee. So I think it behooves you to hang on to the documents here or remember what you said and determine how important you thought things were for that last meeting. Good advice. Okay. I believe this requires action on the part of the select board if I'm not mistaken. And authorize the town manager's office and final comments. Sue? Yes. Make a motion that the select board authorize the town manager's office to send our final comments on behalf of the select board to the joint survey committee for the Chittenden County Public Safety Authority. With the, I'm sorry, with the modification that Andy made. Okay. I'll second that. Thank you, Sue and Irene. Is there any discussion? Any additional questions? None. All those in favor of the motion as stated, signified by saying aye. Aye. Opposed? Motion passes Sam, 4-0. Thank you, Greg. Okay. We're down to 5-e, the 2020 census and local update of census address operations. Greg? Almost 10 years already since the last census. I'm to prepare again. But the US Census Bureau reached out to the town. They're getting ready to do their Luca process. It's called the local update of census addresses, which is when they basically verify all the addresses they have on record so they can get in touch with people when the census happens in a few years. Our GIS coordinator would sort of be overseeing this, but she'd be parceling the work out to the Regional Planning Commission, which is offering to do it for the towns or kind of have more expertise than us on this so they can do it more efficiently. But basically by participating in the Luca process, it just makes the census go more smoothly for the town, for the government, the US government when it goes through. The census is helpful in terms of providing grants, federal funding, it's helpful from a planning standpoint, our local standpoint just in terms of tracking population demographics, all those types of information that come in handy when doing government work. So there's a form on here and just recommending that the select board authorize the chair to sign that form to let the town of Essex participate in the Luca process. Any questions for Greg? Irene? I see that Max is signing one, but in the recommendation it mentions the village president, so is it the town outside the village Max is signing off for? I'm confused why the town wouldn't be the entire town and why the village would be. The village had their own as well, so it's the memo is addressed to the select board and the trustees, so I believe the trustees will be seeing a similar thing and recommend just modifying the motion that authorizing the select board chair to sign off for their respective community. As to what territory the Census Bureau is looking at when they look at the town of Essex, it sounds like the outside the village and nobody that I know looks at the outside the village portion of the town as a separate entity. It's curious to me. Yeah, I'd have to double check into it. Makes sense to me that signing off the town. Is that the village has been offered or request, had the same request from US Census? Any other questions for Greg? Okay, I believe this requires a motion as well. I can make that. Fire away. I make a motion that the select board chair sign off on the attached paperwork for Essex town outside the village. Okay. Thank you Irene and thank you Sue. Any discussion or additional questions? All those in favor then of the motion as stated, please signify by saying aye. Aye. Opposed? Motion passed Sam 4-0. And Greg, I think you're going to talk to us next about the winter lane circle maintenance agreement. So you might remember from a couple months back, there was a small 0.1 acre parcel on winter lane circle that the town owned and didn't want to maintain anymore because a resident offered to take it over and maintain it. Neighbor right there. Town when we did a research looks like we own it. The state told us we owned it. When the attorney for the clupas started looking into the transfer agreement and the deeds, they came to the conclusion or the opinion that the town does not actually own the land. The deed says that the land was relinquished from state control to the control of the town. So like I said, the state had emailed Shannon Lunderville in the GIS office saying no, town owns it. So we went forward with that and under Shannon's own research and the state's research. So it's still a little bit of an unclear issue, but the quickest and cleanest way at this point, based on opinion of the town attorney, recommendation from the town attorney is to grant a license agreement to the clupas to allow them to maintain the property. Mowing the lawn, trimming the trees, trees wouldn't be cut down unless the tree warden authorizes it, signs off on it. The agreement would be just to the clupas not to anyone going forward because who knows if future landowners would want to continue maintaining it. But just in the interest of trying to tie this up and let the clupas maintain the land that they want to maintain, recommendation is to let the select board authorize the town manager to execute that license agreement. So moved. Most haste. Any questions for Greg? Sue? Sorry. Yeah, I was going to ask if staff had, if the board had any questions of staff before Irene jumped into the breach there. I just feel like we spent hours on this and it's just, we have more important things to do. I mean, this is important. Don't get me wrong, but we have gone around in circles on this. I want to get it done if we can get it done. But I don't want to do that at the expense of anybody having legitimate questions. Let's give Sue the opportunity to ask her question. Absolutely. So the stipulation about, you know, not cutting down trees or whatever without having the tree warden review and approve, how does that get complied with? I guess how do you ensure that that happens? A little bit of trust in the clupas. If there was a violation, I suppose we'd have to deal with it then with the zoning administrator. That would actually require them to replant a tree at the cost of wherever the tree might be. And then my other question was about when the clupas move. But I think you answered that, that this. This would just be for the clupas. Yep. Thank you. Okay. Andy? Yes, for taking questions. The, it's the centers around if the clupas sell the property at some point in the future. And we've all forgotten about this agreement. And new owners of the clupas property continue to maintain the property without a license. Is there any concern on the town's part? I suppose if the town wanted to. I mean, is there any. Eventually wanted to come down. We could come back and say, Nope, we still own this land. You don't have a license to maintain it. Please stop. The question is whether there's a liability there to not making it somehow clear that that's town property and not the land. I just, it'll be in the land record. So, so anyone who's doing title search at a sale is going to raise this and point it out. So it's somehow the, the 26 and the, whatever the other property is 30. There would somehow be a cross reference between those two or whenever the clupas property sold, it would trigger some sort of cross reference that said this other piece of property is somehow entangled here. Sorry to drag this out. No, that's what you need to, obviously. Yeah. So this license agreement will run with 30 winter lane circle and it talks about license to maintain point one acre and that 26 winter lane circle. And it is recorded as such. And so if the clupas want to sell the property, title search would be done by somebody interested in buying it but know about this and it would not be a clot on the title. It would either run with the, with the title or be renegotiated. Okay. So there's some sort of cross linkage that would flag the fact that there's a secondary agreement that may need to come and be discussed. Okay. All right. It's a binder clip, isn't it? I mean, it's pretty. It's a paper record, right? Yeah. So. Okay. All right. Thank you. I want to make sure I don't miss. I mean, it's a unique scenario. I think those are good questions. Yeah. Any other questions for staff? Okay. Irene, would you mind just restating the motion please for the record? Yes. I would recommend that the select board authorize the town manager to execute a license agreement between the town of Essex and Michael and Emily and allowing the clupas to maintain property at 26 winter lane circle. Second. Thank you, Andy. Thank you, Irene. Any other discussion? All those in favor of the motion, please signify by saying aye. Aye. Opposed? Motion passes, Sam. 4-0. And next item on the agenda is 5G, the Vermont League of Cities and Town 2018 Municipal Policy. Great. So, Sluck and Watts was delegated as your delegate to the VLCT annual business meeting happening in a few weeks, October 4th. At that meeting, VLCT is going to look to approve its municipal policy for 2018. And last meeting we had talked about giving Andy some feedback and comments about that policy that he can take back to VLCT. Do you have any comments? Now is the time to share them. Did there be any comments for Mr. Watts? Not at this time. My only comment, Andy, was the one that I think you made, which is to go back to a form where they flag what is changing from policy to policy. Because, you know, I did read through the whole thing, but I probably didn't need to because most of it was probably existing and not changed. I do have a question. Go ahead, Andy. On the front page, the nine items that are listed, number eight says state collection of funds assessed to implement statewide goals. But then on section 1.01 on page two, item number four says maintaining billing and collection of state education property tax at the local level. I'm just questioning whether staff has any concern. Those two seem to contradict each other. One says that if it's for a statewide goal, it should be collected by the state. And then the other one says that property school taxes should be collected locally. Is there a preference on our part? I don't know how. I would say the differentiation would be one's attacks and one is an ad hoc funding source for a goal that the state wishes to undertake. It might be temporary and may be yes. But it doesn't seem to be warring with each other, in my opinion, because of that, but that's my interpretation. Okay. Okay. I have a question. On page nine, the bullet number five under law enforcement issues, maintaining the independent status and function of the E911 and Vermont communications boards. VLT supports that. I'm wondering what impact, if any, there is with this regional dispatch. And does that, if we decide to participate in that, does that have anything to do or any impact positive or negative on this? There was, if I may, I'm sorry. Please, no. There was some comments made before the Joint Study Committee was formally adopted that one of the driving forces for the regional dispatch was the likelihood or the possibility that the state, aka the state police would, or the state E911 would get out of the E911 business. But that didn't materialize and I wasn't sure whether that was a direct quote from someone in Montpelier or that was an assumption made from my colleagues. The other point is that, if I understand the question right, Vermont communication boards throughout the state have a certain jurisdiction that they would be responsible for in some policy making ability or authority. And I, we would only worry about one and that's the one in the Chittenden County area. So I don't know if knowing that it would take what, seven or eight, nine different things to occur simultaneously on these communication boards that would present a problem. Maybe something that our delegate can flesh out a little bit for us. But the annual meeting, just to be sure that there isn't something hidden in here that would have an adverse impact on us. I mean, I can't see it, but I'll probably. This is the first I've ever heard of a Vermont communications boards. I've never, and that's not. The state 911 board has been around for quite a while. In fact, one of the members of our joint study committee is the fire chief in Burlington, and he sits on that board. That one I don't have the question about. It's the one at the end of that sentence. Right, I have no idea what that is. And that's why I ask the question. The state police, for example, and the town of Essex and maybe a few other communities use an emergency communication. And they do have a board in the state. I'm not sure if the state police run it or some other entity runs it, but it's the, help me with the, not my famous, gosh, what's the name of the, our system that we run? Spillman. Spillman, thank you. It's the Spillman system, and it's used by the state police. It's used by Essex, it's used by others. The Spillman, that has a board. And so that may be one of the Vermont communications boards that is being referenced here. Is there any others throughout the state, Mike? I don't know about. Okay. Any of you could just ask a question or two about that. Yeah, I will. Just curiosity's sake. I'd appreciate it. Thank you. The other part of your question is, was that answered? Yes. I'm good with the rest of it, and I thank you. Any other questions for Greg or for points that you want to make to Andy? Okay. I don't believe this is a, an action item that requires a motion. I think we just fulfilled our, our marching orders. Thank you for representing us. Yep. No problem. Item 5H, Acknowledge new street name of Smoke Bush Lane. Greg. So there's a new development going through the permitting process, seven unit development off of Chapin Road. It's maybe quarter mile, half mile north of the intersection of Towers Road. It's going to be just a private drive, but needs a new street name. The developer is looking for, or Smoke Bush Lane. The E-9 and 1 coordinator and the fire chief have both approved that name. And so looking for acknowledgement from the select board. Any questions for Greg? Do I hear a motion? I'll make a motion. I'll make a motion that the select board acknowledge that the E-9-1-1 coordinator has approved the street names Smoke Bush Lane for a project located at 50 Chapin Road. I'm straining to hear a second. I'll second that. Thank you, Andy. Any further discussion? All those in favor, please signify by saying, I. I. I. Opposed? Thank you. Motion passes 4-0 Sarah Michelle. Okay. Item 5J. Conflict of interest policy update. And again, I turn the microphone to Greg. So getting, getting around to updating some of the policies that the select board has. This one is the conflict of interest policy. And made a few changes to it. Largely it's based off of the latest model from Mont League of Cities and Towns and their updated conflict of interest policy. So what that did was added a little bit to the definitions that are listed in there. Kind of better laid out some steps as to when considering a conflict of interest may or may not exist and how board members on the select board or other boards commissions in town can decide whether or not to recuse themselves in the steps that should be taken when making that determination. Those are kind of the big changes. It just fleshes it out a little bit. Stuff. Gender specific pronouns as much as possible. That is, that's pretty much it. So happy to answer questions if there are any. Any questions for Greg? Andy? Yeah, article eight or was remembered to eight. There's a comment in there that says after taking the actions listed in article six and seven public officers whether appointed or elected shall declare whether they will recuse themselves and explain the basis for that decision. While the next very next paragraph says otherwise public officers shall recuse themselves for the matter under consideration a public officer that recuses oneself may explain the basis for that decision but is not required to do so. I think it seems to me those two statements are directly conflicting. So I guess I would suggest taking the second one out. I think it would be very good practice to have people explain why they're recusing themselves in public meeting. One that begins with otherwise and ends with so. Yeah, I'm wondering what the value of the sentence that starts with otherwise is but or is it a sentence? I guess it is. I mean it follows a sentence that says public officers can decide if whether or not they can act impartially and I take that otherwise to mean if they cannot act fairly objectively in the public interest. Right, right, right. But I think you're ready to strike the sentence. That last sentence, right, should. Okay, any other questions for Greg? Andy? Oh, sorry. Okay, all right, so then the article eight section B says failure of an appointed officer to recuse oneself in spite of a conflict of interest, maybe grounds for discipline or removal from office. My question is how is it determined whether or who decides whether there's been a conflict of interest and with lack of recusal. I think there's a couple of ways that come to mind. One is if other members on that board and appointed board approach the select board and say action on it. For instance, the planning commission recently updated their communications policy to include a little piece about social media and I believe that it says if a violation of that social media policy, the planning commission may recommend that the select board remove that member from the planning commission or something of that effect. In which case it would still go up to select board and you could go through the steps and review that and determine if it's grounds for dismissal or not. I think another option would be if you as a select board paying attention to the other boards where members you've appointed two other boards if you start to see something that's an issue then you can take steps to address that. And then there's article 11 in the draft policy here. It lays out some potential steps about the chair of a board meeting with an officer to discuss possible conflict of interest. Then going on from there in terms of discussing it at a meeting in executive session or outside of executive session if the offending officer or allegedly offending officer wants to have it in public that can happen. And then taking steps from there in terms of the public censure, recommendation, whether elected or appointed, whether it's a recommendation that an elected official resign or if it's an appointed member of a board the select board can choose to remove that person. I guess I have concerns about reacting to hearsay or rumor or I guess it would have to be very careful not to or to actually get the facts somehow. And I recognize that this doesn't apply to elected officials necessarily because there's no way to remove any of us unless I know the policy from VLTC includes a couple of footnotes that mention Tom Manager may have different you got to have due process and I get concerned about reacting to hearsay as I said or I worry about the process of making that decision but I guess it could be a case by case basis if I have concerns about how issue was raised I can certainly raise that question during the discussion and say I have concerns about where this information came from or so forth but a little uncomfortable how that process might flow I mean I'm happy to take it back and try to tweak it and put in something to the effect of the select board shall meet with the alleged defender and do an investigation into whether or not conflict of interests breach occurred, violation occurred something to that effect and I'd be surprised if this board or any other future board just acted without doing a little bit of investigation and taking hearsay at its word without actually meeting with the alleged defender trying to do some research and figure out what the potential offense is but we can try to clarify that I don't know maybe it's not necessary I don't know what others think I think your comment about us maybe just even more basic like you know do diligence be taken in this process or something like that I think you said do diligence I think that that is there are great nations involved here although they're not stated but they're implied that there's the conflict of interest but then there's the perceived conflict of interest and that in and of itself would generate a discussion because some actions which may in and of themselves not be a direct conflict of interest should certainly give the appearance of such and that would be something that would be a teaching moment more than a disciplined moment of some sorts and that would at least give the notion that everybody's paying attention as best they can in these matters most of the board members if I might Mr. Chair most of the board members would be able to truly appreciate themselves in the area of conflict of interest to go out of the way to not give the impression or to be involved in anything that would cause them to have to face that challenge and we've had people here that have been involved in all aspects of work developers have said they're state state officials and most department heads and the town manager they all have a code of ethics based upon their profession which is really kind of vicious on those points I mean there's self-flagellation in the managers I mean they beat each other up on these matters so we pay pretty close attention to it and then pass that on to the organization so it is still good to have a policy to point to I have one question if the board will indulge me new 11 Greg number four upon majority vote in an open meeting the board may request that the offending public officer resign from the board and then later under B enforcement against appointed officers about midpoint it starts with in addition to or in lieu of any of these steps the select board may choose to remove an appointed officer from office subject to state law so unless I'm missing something someplace those seem to contradict there seem to be two different steps going on elected officers is A so as elected officials you cannot force one of your colleagues to resign from the board 11 B is appointed officers so you can point you can take it the way you want it thank you sorry thank you also under 11 A1 the chair shall meet informally in private with the public officer to discuss the possible conflict of interest violation what if it's the chair that has the conflict of interest violation vice chair would do it would you like to stipulate that that's a good catch never should have a single point of true article 10 the last phrase says or remain physically present in the room this is a discussion with when someone recuses themselves shall not sit on the board deliberate with the board to participate in the proceeding as a board member in any capacity or remain physically present in the room this applies to elected and appointed officials according to this I believe I'm a little concerned with telling people that they have to leave a public meeting I recognize that it's good practice to leave the room but question I have is do we want to require it silent communication body language everything else can be seen very clearly in the room while the board is deliberating to be out of it removes even that from a critical point after the decision has been made this language isn't used in the model one from the VLCT I think they say that it's leaving the room as optional so that's part of why I'm asking the question and the other it's always been our practice but I just want to make sure that the board agrees that it should be our policy because I know of cases planning commission where something involves a commissioner's neighborhood commissioner recuses themselves and sits in the audience and participates as an interested party because it's happening in their neighborhood you may not have this document in front of them either that or it's bad leadership you got to protect the community you got to protect your decision making process and sometimes you got to be a little harsh harsh is the wrong word sometimes you have to be a little firm on the content of the business so once we approve this we are going to make this available to anybody that we've appointed everywhere so that they will be aware of that I just want to make sure we're all comfortable with that I always leave the room when I review I see you even when you don't have to anything else Irene just a couple of word things on that same article 10 public officer who has recused oneself we've been using them can we just say themself or is oneself more correct for some reason in that case I did get all grammatical public officers singular oneself I could change it to public officers who have recused themselves for example we're saying public officers reason to believe that they okay I see what you've done the whole gender the whole gender do we want to say nor rather than or at the end of the A if we're being grammatically correct the end of A nor remain physically present the thing that Andy was talking about anything else for Greg I'm going to ask a dumb question go ahead Indy what the word admonish means it's not defined in here so that's why I'm asking the question is you know we have definitions so we can have it does it need to be clear what that means I guess I mean is it you can have a public announcement you can have a private one you're still just using the word admonish again you know it needs to be respectful needs to be do we need to have those kind of words there somewhere is that in our other policy of rules and regulations for orderly conduct of business we treat each other with respect alright good I'm okay with that that's a good question anything else for Greg okay I would entertain a motion I will make a motion sorry what is maybe I wait till after the motion but what are we doing here can we present a policy in this meeting and vote on it in this meeting or do we need to vote on it in the next meeting we should have put the rules and regulations before this one where we talk about that this one I think there's enough changes there's substantive enough that you should prove it I'll take it go back I've heard tonight and presented to you the next meeting for signature for adoption the recommendation would accept the amendments to the conflict of interest policy so it will come back according to this sorry that's okay so do we need a motion here go ahead I think the motion is that the select board accepts the amendments to the conflict of interest policy do we also need to note the additional modifications I would say as as further amended or as further discussed I make a motion that the select board accept the amendments and the additional modifications to the conflict of interest policy second moved and seconded any discussion hearing none all those in favor of the motion as stated please signify by saying I I proposed motion passes 4-0 thank you 5K rules and regulations for orderly conduct of business update so another update on the rules and regulations for orderly conduct of business finally get back to the discussion that was held back in April about some of your comments on this and tried to incorporate them really no huge changes to this one it's a lot of the getting rid of the gender specific pronouns and switching over those to gender neutral the real one kind of substantive change is an addition under conduct of meetings of number 9 members and all other participants shall welcome a variety of opinions when disagreements occur discussions shall remain civil and all viewpoints shall be treated with respect on that it's mostly just some grammatical stuff cleanup on under motions and votes on the last page number 10 specifying as we move towards tablets in the near future town issued devices are exempt from the recommendation of using cell phones and then number 11 what Andy just brought up policy amendments that are not substantial may be acted upon at the same meeting in which they are introduced but other policies should be introduced to a select board meeting and acted upon at the next meeting happy to answer any questions on 10 while we're on the back of this document on the use of cell phones and other devices the planning commission for example and other committees have had laptops of their own they're not town issued but they've used their own technology for years here in this room so I think it's appropriate that we make sure that it's an inclusive statement and not an exclusive statement given that the practice differs from the way I read this so something like with the exception of town issued devices or other devices accepted by individual boards I can take it back play with it basically acknowledging that yeah it doesn't have to be a town issued device it could be any device that you bring that helps you be productive here and just because the select board made up in my opinion ridiculous rules several years ago for political reasons does it mean that something like rule 10 has to stand forever other committees have used laptop computers for a very long time in this room so the select board should get on board with that and not have such exclusive language in my opinion on this document I would take that one step further and just say it needs to be the same policy across the board so we either change it to include them or we take it out and we don't do them but to have committees making up their own rules on what they're going to be able to bring to meetings and stuff I don't think is the best policy in my view I mean the gist of the policy is to keep people from fiddling on their cell phones and not paying attention to the meetings so I can all take it back and try to what was that? I don't know let me check I think maybe that's what we need to say is that if you are using a electronic device it should be for the purpose of the meeting right and the second sentence is fine as it stands I think that was the original rule corrupted in my opinion by adding the first sentence because we've always said that people's phones should be if I use a calculator during the budget session off of my phone because that's the most convenient way who are you or anybody else to tell me not to you I mean that doesn't make any sense they have to be sensible rules yeah and I would during the public works meeting I did bring my laptop because I could we didn't have everything hard copy right and it was a more productive way of handling it it wasn't a distraction yeah try to uncorrupt it I'm okay with taking that first sentence out it's alright first sentence out completely and just having the policy be that phones or devices should either be turned off or placed on a setting that does not utilize an audible ring oh yeah I guess you got the alright I could be face booking with my kids here you could be alright go ahead a couple very minor things or I think they're minor at the last paragraph of the first page I guess I gotta read the paragraph it is the intent of the select board to exercise the authority and trust vested in us as a representative body to conduct the affairs of the public as it deems on the merit of the information before it is in the best interest of the town of Essex and the majority of its residents I kind of don't understand why we need the majority of I think we're just representing its residents and I think if if a smaller subset of residents have a very valid issue or point we should be representing it that probably goes to the notion of the greatest good for the greatest number or representative of democracy or majority rule rather than trying to isolate whether one neighborhood has a real problem that the rest of the community does and it doesn't exclude you from diving into that issue and solving their problem I don't think that was the intent here what purpose does the majority of serve there everybody may benefit by what's done for a smaller group I mean I didn't write it I take no authorship priority or purpose here but I'm more comfortable with the best interest of the town of Essex and its residents so that would be my recommendation to scratch the majority of but open for discussion anybody I'm fine with it being changed you good? one more sorry under second page under five the members should notify the chair and manager as soon as it is practical by telephone does it need to be by telephone and why so you might have other avenues that are more expedient at this point in time just put a period after practicable and call it good and then this is just a curiosity there's a word pecuniary last under motions and votes number five conflict of interest shall be limited to possible pecuniary or other benefit should we say that should we say financial because I know I had to look up that's not a word it's a peculiar word peculiar word what's that yeah so financial hey he just used the device he did the purposes of the meeting that's right that's all I had thank you okay so this shouldn't this should go without saying but we ran into lots of issues with this last year I'd like to say somewhere preferably under conduct of meetings around number three that the chair must act in an impartial manner if any select board member objects to the chair's conduct the gavel is to be turned over to the vice chair for the remainder of that agenda because if we can't be impartial as chairs then we shouldn't be chairs and that's from a former chair and I don't see it anywhere else in this document so I think it's one of these things we understood until we see it breached and then we don't have a rule against it because we assume that people are going to behave and if they don't we throw it out there was some reference to impartial right I did see that somewhere electronic we can search it to focus in a little bit on the wording it's very difficult to be impartial when you're encouraging a variety of comments at a meeting and you're the chair and you have to get all these various comments you also have the right as 20% of the board to have an opinion and to differ from any one or more of those comments as well I think that part of the concern was from my standpoint at some of the meetings and please correct me if I'm wrong because I sit on this side but I think going back to how we interact with each other as members of the board conducting the people's business we may do it in an informal setting such as a room like this there's no marvel steps leading up to it you don't put our hands on the not a good book but the the appropriateness of what we do and how we do it what we say and how we say it but it's also in other places conduct for all of us in all of our town discussions so impartiality might be hard we value differences I don't think once you've chosen a chair that you can tell the chair to give the gavel over to somebody else I mean that's a board it's a board decision but you know an impartial chair might gavel themself out of order theoretically if they made a full follow or something or apologize for it because we all have done our dialogue over these many years we are passionate people about what we do and what we believe in and sometimes that passion shows in the volume I have a problem with pointing my pen I started doing it again I'm sorry so I would just ask for maybe a different word than trying to live up to impartial and who would be the judge of that that's why I said if someone objects and says I'm not being impartial and that came up over and over and over again at last year's sessions people were saying excuse me as the chair you cannot be speaking about this issue in this manner and that was ignored and people felt it was ignored and people felt there wasn't impartiality and it happened repeatedly and because that was not just a one-time oops or something that just one person noticed but rooms full of people were noticing I think it gives us to think really hard about how we codify that rather than cure it so feel free to work on this more if you want to fiddle with that language because I'm fine with fiddling with it it wasn't really I think that when it was coming up it was bias unbiased versus bias it was having a predetermined bias kind of thing Andy? Just as if we're going to consider the possibility of asking the chair to turn the gavel over to somebody else during a meeting what happens if the vice chair then exhibits similar behavior what do you give it to and at what point do you run out of people that run the gavel I have concerns about starting a process that could have multiple knock-on effects I don't know what you're going to come back and propose but you are all 20% of a body we all have our own opinions I think as humans forget your role as select board members as humans how would you handle the situation if it was a neighborhood meeting or any discussion about it and point out what the offense is and why it was felt that way and what would be appropriate for future discussions and check and adjust as our chair likes to say but sees the opportunity for the teaching moment to occur at the time it's going on it has the greatest impact six months later, four months later, two weeks later maybe not so much because so much has happened in the interim so we tried to at the time and we came up empty so therefore I waited until now a year later to codify this because it was such a huge and egregious and repetitive problem said certain people in the audience and therefore I'm trying to do it at the appropriate time and whether we the word unbiased or impartial I'm impartial as to what the language is just so that the meaning is clarified and yes if it has to go to the speaker of the house next and then I don't care where the gavel goes the point is it can be passed all around in many towns people take turns being chair for just that reason to give people a chance to be impartial as well as to be biased about certain topics it's highly appropriate to do that we don't tend to do that in Essex that's not our tradition but perhaps we could try something new Andy I am reminded of one of the footnotes that was actually in the other policy the model policy from VLTC the conflict of interest one word says that elected officials are only beholden to the voters and that other select board members and this is the reason why you can't the select board can't remove part of the reason why the select board can't remove one of their members is they're elected directly by the people and so I don't think that I think I start to develop concerns if we start saying that members of the board can comment or be restrict what other members of the select board say Sue first then Irene I actually I can agree with some of the comments that Irene is making if I think we are clear that it's not like just an opinion and jump on it where there is due diligence that someone has been spouting in a very biased way and there has been input from the public in the conversation from the public and from the board saying we are hearing a bias and you should not be doing that and it's ignored so I think in the instance where there is the attempt to correct and there isn't that I think that there should be some sort of in our conduct of meetings that there should be some reference to in the instance you know this is you are not conducting yourself in an appropriate way Irene I'll second that so I think we have the just of return don't envy you Greg I'm going to be interested to see what the language comes back so no motion needed here I don't think you can the same motion okay go ahead I'll make the motion that the select board accept the amendments and the additional modifications we just made to the rules and regulations for orderly conduct of business I don't agree to accepting the additional modifications it's not clear to me what those additional modifications are and I don't agree with taking the gavel away from the chair during a meeting correct me if I'm wrong but I don't think we agreed as a body that we voted that someone is going to be giving being forced to give up the gavel I think it was made as a suggestion but I don't believe it was voted on or accepted to use the words and the additional amendments and it's not clear to me what those are unless we can specifically say what they are I think we should do what we did with the previous agenda item and leave it leave the language broad to include the amendments that Greg presented to us tonight plus and make some reference to the suggestions that were made tonight for additional amendments I think we've heard exactly what the issue is how you enforce it is a little bit separate than what we're going to come back to you with the issue is bias and objectivity and impartiality when you're leaving the discussion as the role of the chair is what happens if you don't like that it's certainly up to you and you can figure out anything you want but what we'll come back with we'll give you the point to have the discussion and say look, we've all agreed upon this this is part of our conduct how we run an orderly meeting underscore the word orderly and that also means being able to look out in the audience when people are getting a little unruly and interrupting the speaker in the audience as it says some place that the chair also has to do alienates the chair from the audience and you and staff and everybody but as long as the chair understands that's the job and how to do it correctly appropriately and on the high road is what you are asking and that's a fair point and we'll come back with language and maybe even look around at what we already have elsewhere and reconfide here as well it's a good point because we're still in the discussion part of this against this as well but I'm going to suggest that another motion be made with different language that allows for the suggestion that I made or if somebody can come up with something better by all means do it but I'd like the final my own personal view is I would like the final motion to say that we are going to take this up again after staff comes back to us with the amendments that they made plus the ones that we suggested so you want me to take another shot at it? you can withdraw if you want to withdraw your original motion and the seconder agrees then yes we could do it that way I do have a question though because this is exactly the same motion that we just made on the other on the conduct business I'm sorry conduct conflict of interest and in that instance we also made additional suggestions for modifications that we it's going to be handled the same way I guess is what I was trying to say so why would we do this one differently? I thought the language in this one was different than the first one is it the same or is it different? Sam do you have what the motion was before? Are you talking about just the discussion but the discussion is far more complicated and I think it's the deeper underlying consequences to the language changing that it's proposing for the rules and regulations versus the conflict of interest that's what I'm hearing I wouldn't disagree with that I just thought the language in the motion was a little bit different than the first time through I had no problems with the first one Now it's to accept the amendments and additional modifications to the conflict of interest policy and the same here accept amendments and additional modifications to the rules and regulations for the concept of business and from what I'm hearing is the accepting might be the word that you're making you feel a little uncomfortable for this accepting accepting is good I'm just going from what Andy was saying I suppose that if we view whatever comes back the next time we see this as substantial changes from what's in this today we could choose not to approve it anyway because of the fact that we've agreed that we're not going to do it and a big change is without having a second meeting on it so please understand you can have a whole series of other discussions how you enforce your whole separate issue what it is that you're looking to enforce so I don't think you need to redo it I think we can handle the motion so it's been moved and seconded is there any other discussion on the motion hearing none I'll call the question all those in favor of approving the motion as stated please signify by saying aye opposed motion passes Sarah Michelle thank you 5M approved minutes of August 21st 2017 and the minutes from the joint meeting on August 24th 2017 do I have a motion approval of the minutes of August 1st 2017 the select board member corrections see that again please I'm sorry what date I would move approval of the select board minutes of August 21st 2017 with select board member corrections second all those in favor we have to go through yes thank you page 1 page 2 page 3 Andy I was anticipating go ahead line 153 this is the same correction I asked for before where it says 15% requirement please have it say 15% maximum thank you anything else on 4 Irene the wrong glasses also to boot let's see at 160 please after the period this was a long discussion it was completely eliminated so I'd like to sum up and say Mr. Baker said the idea is for towns to join when ready and then we'll change the heat of Mr. Lebe because now we're switching speakers again and then at 161 after that period Mr. Baker obviously agreed the citizens could petition but he was wrong so I'd like you to insert Mrs. Reiner pointed to the whereas at the bottom of page 1 as well as section 22a which made it mandatory for boards to warn a vote and remove the right of residents to do so with the petition Max called that a showstopper I think that's it for that page page 5 Sue at the very bottom of page 5 24205 my comment was so confirmed for Miss Cook that the new components are expected to have an increased life expectancy period it wasn't about the security cameras it was that the component was a better component than what was that's all, thank you anything else on page 5 Irene the sentence that begins at the end of 167 Mr. Baker explained it was a three stage process to get to the 9-1-1 train level he didn't say that so let's take that out please what did he say he said he didn't know he said he would pass that on he said a lot of other stuff about training but he didn't say that according to what's on the video now we've had video issues in the past but we're watching the video okay anything else on page 5 page 6 I have just oh no, never mind, sorry I made a note and then I cancelled it out Irene, I'm good page 7 page 8, Sue op 288 the section header says notice of real estate conveyance the LCT annual business meeting should be notice of delegate appointment unless you want to convey some real estate while you're there anything else on page 8 page 9 page 10 all those in favor of approving the minutes of August 21st as amended signify by saying aye aye motion passes Sarah Michelle I will move approval of the minutes of August 24th 2017 with select board member fractions second page 1, page 2 page 3 page 4 page 5 page 6 page 7 page 8 page 9 page 7 please, if we get after the first the the words first line of the so that it says Ms. Renner also suggests the word competition be removed from the first line of the resolution anything else on page 11 page 12 and page 13 all those in favor of accepting the minutes of the special joint meeting of August 24th 2017 please signify by saying aye opposed motion passes I will move approval of the consent agenda with select board member comments thank you Irene second thank you Andy anything on check warrants from the 25th September 1st and September 8th and rather than go through all of these individually is there anything else in the consent agenda Andrew I may have answered my own question it says effective September 14th I was going to ask when Carmichael Street is going to close it says effective September 24th right on there got to learn to read again thank you anything else in the consent agenda Sue? just two quick ones one the police facility bond refunding just a big thumbs up that was a smiley face happy news and then on the upcoming meetings for October 2nd I had a note that there were some energy committee potential energy committee members that were going to be coming in for an interview but maybe that has fallen through I think you're right I can't remember if it's the 2nd or the 16th but you're probably right with the 2nd okay I have one and that was the stand-by the municipal budgeting workshop being held by the VLCT I can't recall if any of us have ever attended that and I don't know that we've ever done one person to represent the board in its entirety but I'm thinking that I might like to go with that I will talk to the staff offline Travis can be your content sure very good anything else in the consent agenda Irene? I'm delighted to see that our police facility bond got refunded and we're going to save some money that was what I was smiley facing Hallelujah thank you thanks you're calling me a bookend well, a very ornate one but never mind anything else in the consent agenda folks? okay we have a motion we already have a motion so all those in favor of approving the consent items at least signified by saying aye opposed motion passes Sarah Michelle thank you now I think we have an executive session yep you ready I'm ready I make them I move that the select board make the specific finding that premature general public knowledge of the select board's position concerning the proposed public official appointments would place the town at a substantial disadvantage second all those in favor I opposed motion passes and part 2 I move that the select board enter into executive session to discuss the proposed public official appointments pursuant to one BSA 313 a3 to include the manager and the deputy town manager thank you soon Irene all those in favor hi I opposed motion passes so I have just one question Dr. Shepard did you have anything or were you just here because you didn't get a better offer very well good to see you again