 Good afternoon, and thank you for joining us for another episode of Condo and Cider. My name is Jane Sugimura, and I'm co-host with Richard Emery of this show. And what we do in our show is we talk about condominium living and how it affects the people who live, work, and play in this condominium community. And today I'm going to give you an update on the fire safety ordinance that was enacted as a result of the Marco Polo fire, that horrific fire that happened in July of 2017. And the purpose of the fire safety ordinance was to make sure that in the future that people who lived in high-rise buildings, that the buildings were safer for the residents and safer for the emergency first responders who had to respond to fires and other emergency situations in the condominiums. And you know, the fire safety ordinance was first enacted and it became effective in May of 2018. In fact, it was May 3, 2018, so we're coming up on a one-year anniversary soon. And that bill in a nutshell basically said that there were about 350 to 400 buildings in Honolulu high-rise buildings and a defined high-rise buildings. And it affects high-rise residential buildings, not high-rise business or commercial, just high-rise residential. Anyway, this ordinance required all high-rise buildings, residential buildings, to be retrofitted with fire sprinklers, except if they were 10 stories, less than 10 stories, or had open exterior corridors. And open exterior corridors means that when you walk out of your condominium unit and there's air, there's not a wall, it's not enclosed. The corridor between your unit and the rest of the building is open to the air. That is an open exterior corridor. So if you have those types, if your building has open exterior corridors and a lot of the high-rise buildings in Waikiki, like Yacht Harbor Towers and the Waipuna and I think the Wailana, they all have open exterior corridors and they're all over 20 stories tall. So they are exempt and those buildings that have open exterior corridors and the ones who are 10 stories or less are exempt from installing the fire sprinklers. Now for the rest of the high-rise buildings that are over 10 stories or higher, or they have interior enclosed corridors. They have a choice of installing a fire sprinkler system or passing something called a life safety evaluation. And so you say, well, what's the life safety evaluation? A life safety evaluation is a building inspection and it's done by licensed professionals who are certified to do fire inspections. And so these would be engineers or architects with a special certification. They have to be, and in Hawaii we don't have a certified fire safety engineer, but the people who do the fire safety evaluations need to know the fire code and the building code and basically be familiar with structural issues relating to high-rise buildings. And what these licensed professionals are supposed to do when they do a life safety evaluation is they go through the building and they look at certain components. And there's something that is part of the ordinance, it's called a matrix and it's a spreadsheet that was developed by the Honolulu Fire Department and it basically is a scoring sheet that the licensed professionals use to score these 17 elements. And the 17 elements include things like the height of the building, what kind of material is the building constructed of? Is it drywall? Is it a wooden building? Is it concrete? And it talks about, I mean, things that need to be checked is whether or not the fire alarm system is current or is it outdated? Are there standpipes in the buildings? And whether or not the doors have metal closures and whether or not they have louvers in the doors because that is not permitted by the building code. So if you have louvers in your doors, then you'd better change them out. And other things that they look at is the elevators and how they're connected to the smoke alarms and the fire alarm system, vertical openings. And these are openings, you don't see them because they usually occur inside the walls. And this is when a building is constructed and they have to put pipes. And so when they put the pipes into the building, they need to make holes in the floor so that the pipes can fit through the holes and go all the way up. And when they put in the pipes, they seal it, they caulk it. But after 30, 40 years, those seals deteriorate. And so those openings around the pipes allow air to rush through. And if there's a fire, it allows the fire to travel up. And so those are of a concern. And so those things are looked for in the life safety evaluation. Another item that they consider is how far is it from the middle of the building to the end, whether or not the buildings have an emergency evacuation plan. And these are all things that the licensed professional is going to be checking on when they come into the building. And if you get a passing score on the life safety evaluation, then the buildings who pass don't have to put in the fire sprinkler system. And so that's why it's really, really important for buildings who are over 10 stories and have interior corridors to become very familiar with this matrix. And as I said, there's only 17 items on it. It is on the fire department website. And so I urge everybody who is connected to an association, that is over 10 stories and has interior corridors and doesn't have a fire sprinkler system to look at that matrix on the fire department's website and become familiar with the 17 items that are listed there. And then to take that matrix and walk through their own building and see how they score. Because the scoring and the method of scoring is written into the spreadsheet. So you can kind of do it yourself and do a self-test to see how well you do. Or you can look at the matrix and figure, oh my goodness, we don't have doors with metal closures. And that's required. I mean, if you don't have them, they give you minus points. And so that would be an easy fix. That's cheaper than putting in the sprinklers. Changing out your doors, putting in metal closures. And the reason why the metal closures are so important is because when a fire starts, you want all the doors to be shut. That means the doors to the units, the doors to the end of the quarters. Because that way, the fire cannot travel. And in the Marco Polo situation, although most people have not read the whole report, what we've read in the newspapers, said that one of the reasons why that fire traveled so quickly is the fact that the doors were left open. Unit doors were left open. The door where the fire started was left open. The hallway door, the corridor door was left open. And we know that the Marco Polo had huge vertical openings. That's why the fire traveled upwards. And so the reason for the life safety evaluation is to educate building owners. And that means the board of directors and the people who live in the buildings, they need to be familiar with what is in their building that can make a fire situation more dangerous. And we're finding out in retrospect, unfortunately, that at the Marco Polo, the doors there had louvers in them, which are in violation of the building code. But anyway, they had louvers. So if you have louvers on your door, you've got to make sure you change them out. And in the Marco Polo situation, they had huge vertical openings. And the doors to the units and the corridors were not shut. And that means that there probably weren't metal closures. Metal closures on a door means that door will automatically shut. It won't stay open. And the licensed professionals will only be charging you for the time that they spend in your unit. And that's another reason why you want to become familiar with the matrix. Because the matrix tells you what they're going to be looking at. And if you know ahead of time, you can train your staff and have paperwork ready, including the building plans and any documentation regarding previous inspections of plumbing, any repairs that you did to the plumbing or to stand pipes or to your elevators. And in fact, most buildings have in their reserves elevator renovations. And they've been putting it off because it's a huge item for repairs. It's always several millions of dollars. But now, and most associations have this in their reserve anyway. And if you've been putting it off, now is the time to do the elevator renovations. Because when you do the elevator renovations, you have to upgrade your fire alarm system and your smoke detectors. And that will give you all plus points. Plus your standpipes have to be in working order. And so if you do that, which is on your budget and reserves schedule anyway, then it will go a long ways to help you get a passing score. And it's money that you have socked away anyway. So it's not like it's going to mean a special assessment for your owners. It's money that you've been setting aside. Now is the time to spend it. Because it will help you get a passing score in the life safety evaluation. And it may help you so that you don't have to install fire sprinklers, which is going to cost your association millions of dollars. Now when we come back, we're going to be taking a break in a few minutes. But when we come back, I will be talking about some changes to the original ordinance 18-14 that was adopted or passed on May 3, 2018. That bill is Bill 96. And it passed out of the city council at a hearing at a city council meeting held yesterday. And it was way into the evening. I think we finally passed. When they finally took the vote, it was 7.30 last night. And now it's going to go to the mayor. And when the mayor signs it, that ordinance will become law. And that means that we probably won't have any more changes or updates through the fire safety ordinance, at least for another six months. And so now we're going to take a break. And we will be back in one minute. And we will be talking about the amendments that came about because of Bill 96, which was passed by the city council last night. Aloha. I'm Warren Pair, a host here at Think Tech Hawaii, a digital media company serving the people of Hawaii. We provide a video platform for citizen journalists to raise public awareness in Hawaii. We are a Hawaii nonprofit that depends on the generosity of its supporters to keep on going. We'd be grateful if you'd go to thinktechhawaii.com and make a donation to support us now. Thanks so much. My name is Amy Ortega Anderson, inviting you to join us every Tuesday here on Pinoy Power, Hawaii. With Think Tech Hawaii, we come to your home at 12 noon every Tuesday. We invite you to listen, watch for our mission of empowerment. We aim to enrich, enlighten, educate, entertain, and we hope to empower. Again, maraming, salamat po, mabuhai, and aloha. OK, welcome back to Condon Cider. My name is Jane Sugimura. I'm your host today. And we're talking about updates to the fire safety ordinance. And specifically, we're going to talk about Bill 96, which was passed by the city council yesterday. And Bill 96 was an amendment to the fire safety ordinance that was passed in May 3, 2018. And let me just tell you, one of the biggest changes, and we went round and round. When the list first came out about the buildings that were subject to the ordinance, the city and the fire department, they had calls about people saying, why am I on the list? Or why aren't I on the list? Or how come I'm on the list? And you have me down for interior quarters. I don't have interior quarters. Or why are we on the list? Because we're under 75 feet. We should be in that category of under 10 stories. And so the city and the fire department went round and round. And during Bill 96, we had no less than four lists prepared by the fire department and the city department of planning and permitting. And the list went up and down. First, we had 350. It went up to almost 400. Then it came back down. So everybody is looking at the list. And we had people calling in and saying, why am I on the list? I have sprinklers. I shouldn't even be on the list. Or why am I on the list with interior quarters when I don't have interior quarters? So as of last night, and I was told by the fire department that they sent people. They sent their inspectors to actually look at buildings that were claiming that they should be in the lower category or that they have sprinklers installed. They shouldn't be on the list at all. And so this list of 377 buildings that is attached to Bill 96, which is on the city website, constitutes, as far as everybody is concerned, a pretty accurate list of buildings that the law applies to. And what this means is that the buildings that are listed, and they're listed according to how tall they are. So the buildings that are the first on the list are the tallest ones, the ones that are 40 stories and then 39. And it goes all the way down to, I think, eight stories. And then there are columns that say whether they have interior quarters or exterior quarters. It also says when the buildings were built. And so this is, and based on what we've seen and based on the concerns that we heard from people, we feel that this is a pretty good list. But because we know from past experience that the list is an ever-changing target, if the list is updated by adding or subtracting buildings or changing the information regarding the buildings, the current list is going to appear on the Fire Department website. So the list that appears on the Fire Department website is probably the most accurate. And so if you think that you should be subject to the law or you're wondering why you're on the list and you shouldn't be, you can find out by going to the Fire Department website and checking that website. And as of the, like I said, there's an updated list that's attached to Bill 96 that was passed last night. And it has 377 buildings. Of those 377 buildings, 159, so about half or less than half are required to either install a fire sprinkler system or get a passing score on the life safety evaluation. That means 159 buildings have interior corridors and they're 10 stories or above. And that means that they're the ones that are required to put in a fire sprinkler unless they get a passing score on the life safety evaluation. The one change that was made, and this is one that a lot of buildings ask for. They say, oh, rather than go through the hassle of going through a life safety evaluation because it's really scary. We don't know what it entails. It might cost us a million trillion dollars. We're just going to put in the sprinklers. We just don't want to fool around. We want to put in the sprinklers. We don't want to do the life safety evaluation. So Bill 96 allows you to do that. If a building says, OK, OK, we give up, we're going to put in the fire sprinkler system. We're going to spend the millions of dollars and put in the fire sprinkler system. They have to tell the fire department that that's what they're going to do. And they have to apply for a permit with the city and county of Honolulu within two years after telling the fire department that they're going to do that. And because it takes a while to get the plans and specs and find a contractor. And that's why two years is the limit. Two years, if they do that, they do not have to do all the life safety evaluation. And another thing that came out is because this list kept changing. And in some cases, some buildings didn't even know that they were subject to the law until the Bill 96 came about. And they heard rumors that there was this new list. And maybe they ought to look at it. And so the buildings that were put on the list for the first time, and this is a list that's attached to Bill 96, if they were on no other list prior to this applicability of the law, then they have a longer time. The people who are on the original list, the list that were attached to the ordinance that passed in 2018, the deadlines in that ordinance said that within three years of May 3, 2018, you had to have a life safety evaluation done. And most people, most buildings probably are not going to pass. So they have to do repairs. And then they have six years from May 3, 2018 to get a passing score on the life safety evaluation. So those are the two important deadlines in the ordinance, the three year to have a life safety evaluation done and the six years to actually get a passing score. But for the buildings who never were on any list and they all of a sudden end up on this list that's attached to Bill 96, it's not fair for them, because here we are, we're coming up against a one year anniversary on the ordinance. So their deadlines, their three and six year deadlines will start from the time the mayor signs Bill 96. And that's only fair because they only just recently found out that they are subject to this law. Another thing that this Bill 96 does, it allows the licensed professionals who do the life safety evaluation to use association staff to help them get the information. And that means counting smoke detectors. And this is something that the association staff can do and provide that information to the licensed professional so that you're not being charged a licensed professional's time to check the smoke detectors and the fire alarm system in the building and to check for metal closures on the unit doors and on the corridor doors. Another thing that an important change is on the matrix, and this is the scoring sheet, there's a factor called mobility. And we went round and round and round and round with the fire department because they wouldn't give a definitive answer. And then one of the people, one of the stakeholders basically said, did their research and said, the guidelines that you guys use, the fire department used to come up with a mobility factor, they got it from nursing homes, where people have mobility issues. The people who live in residential condominiums, they usually don't have mobility issues, this is being able to move around. And if you have mobility issues, you have somebody taking care of you. And so that means that you have assistance in getting in and out of the building. But anyway, because this was so controversial and it was like a moving target, the licensed professionals said, well, how are we gonna knock on every door and ask them, are you able to get out of the building or do you need help? And so this is the rule that we came up with. The mobility factor on a life safety evaluation, all high rise buildings who have to go through a life safety evaluation are going to be given a 1.5 point. If and only if and they have to have two things. They have to have a emergency evacuation plan. And that could be just a chart showing how you get out of the building. But they have to have a written plan and they have to give it to the licensed professional. And the second thing you have to do is you have to have a list of vulnerable people who live in your building and their unit numbers. That information is, that requirement is already required by the building code and associations are supposed to have this list of vulnerable people in the box for the fire, the first responders is the key for the first responders. And that list is supposed to be there. Now under the fire safety ordinance, that list of people who are vulnerable and may have issues or may need assistance to get out of the building, they gotta be on a list. And that list has to be given to the licensed professional when they come in to do the life safety evaluation. And that list has to be current. So what I suggest that people do is they, you put a date on the name of the list. And a lot of people, they feel shame. So they're not gonna tell you. If you say, the fire department's making it through this list of people who have trouble getting out of the, who need assistance getting out of the building. And so if you need assistance, then you need to let us know so that we can put your name on this list. And so some people feel shame. They're not gonna give you their name. And so you have to put out the word saying, hey, we need to do this. So if your neighbor needs assistance, give us the name and tell us the unit number so that we can put them on our list so that we can give it to the fire department. And we have to do this at the time of the life safety. And the best thing about the Bill 96 is for the first three years because this is a huge undertaking. This is a huge undertaking affecting over 300 buildings in the city and county of Honolulu and at least 160 high rise buildings. And so yes, on a going forward basis, we're gonna have glitches. So the city council has mandated that every six months the fire department has to come and report about the status of implementation and the number of appeals and what kind of issues are people grumbling about and the associations and the licensed professionals also have an opportunity to come to the city council and to share their experiences and to grumble. I mean, if there are issues that need to be addressed for the first three years, every six months there's going to be a review by the city. And this is to ensure that on a going forward basis that after three years we should probably have all the glitches addressed hopefully so that this system can then move forward to make our buildings safer not only for the residents who live there but for the first responders who have to come and help the residents in case of fire or tornado or any type of an emergency where they have to interact with the condo owners. So if anybody has any questions, I mean they could call the fire, they should call the fire department. The fire department has said that they are ready and willing to answer any questions. They are gonna have a website that has a list of the buildings. They're gonna have information material about life safety evaluation. They have the matrix to show you the 17 items that are gonna be scored. And so I urge everyone who has questions about the life safety evaluation or the fire safety ordinance to go to the Honolulu Fire Department website. And that is a huge, that's gonna be a huge resource to help you. And next week, what we're gonna have on condo insider, I hope you will join us next week is the Neighborhood Commission. The elections start on April 26th, the ballots go out. So the Neighborhood Commission is going to be talking about how you vote and how you can elect your Neighborhood Commission. So please join us next week for another episode of Condo Assider. Thank you and mahalo.