 Hello and welcome to the Runlet and Baldachi Report. We sure hope you enjoyed our part one show on Gianni Rousseau, a truly interesting man. And tonight we have somebody just as interesting who knows just as many famous people. I got to tell you, the introduction I was going to come up with was actually said by Jack Nicholson, and that introduction goes like this. You've heard about the six degrees of separation of Kevin Bacon. Well, our guest today has just one or two degrees to a huge bunch of superstars in pop culture. This woman has written two books. She has seen it, done it, and been there. If you name just about anybody you know in pop culture from Mick Jagger to Hugh Hefner to Steve Tyler to Liv Tyler, this woman is at least one or two degrees separation from these people. Rob, tell us how lucky we are to have our guest today. Well, we're very lucky. And Bibi, welcome back to Maine. It's so great to have you here. So great to have you here. Bibi and I were neighbors in Portland, and just, what, about 15, 20 years ago. I lived in summer place from 2001 to 2008. Yes. So seven years. Yeah, that's right. And since then, she's moved to New York and now most recently Nashville, Tennessee. And we'd like to talk a little bit about that. But over the last several years, Bibi has published a bestselling book and has come up with a new book, which we have here, New York Times Bestseller and her new book, Rebel Soul. But I'd like to take you back, Bibi, back to when you were just a little girl and sitting in front of the TV, watching the Ed Sullivan show and watching the Beatles. And what did that do? You guys watched the Ed Sullivan show. Absolutely. And I remember it vividly. Well, I mean, were you there when the Beatles? Yes. OK. I'm a year older than you, so. Well, yeah, but you were still, if I was 10, you were 11. That's right. I think seeing first the Beatles on the Ed Sullivan show and then seeing the Rolling Stones. That was really what sealed my fate. Right. My DNA was altered at that moment. I resonated. I connected with the spirit that the Rolling Stones were emanating. And I connected with the whole British invasion. And I became, I don't want to use the word obsessed. I became saturated with reading all the magazines, 16, Tiger Beat, because they were covering the British invasion. So you got to read about bands like The Stones and the Beatles and the Dave Clark Five, Hermit's Hermits, Gary and the Pacemakers. And you know, I loved Paul Revere and the Raiders. It was just, they weren't, they were American. But I just, the whole pop culture movement that was coming out of the UK, out of England, is what really I resonated. The women, Marianne Faithful and Jane Asher and Patty Boyd and Mary Quant, it just, I somehow knew that that was my tribe. Right. So when I was 10, I told my mother that those were my friends and that I was going to hang out with them and that I already knew them. And you did. I basically, but I basically meant what I said. I felt like, oh my God, I found my tribe, my people. What was it about them? I don't know. Just something cosmic. I don't know what connects souls. Our souls are connected. It's very mysterious. I mean, you can believe in past lifetimes. You can, you know, I have very metaphysical beliefs, as you know. So I just think that my destiny was something that I knew about very young. I mean, I was in Catholic boarding school for sixth, seventh and eighth grade. And that was when things really exploded, like the monkeys on TV. And my mother got me a tambourine so I could play tambourine in the rock mass. I was Catholic. I went to Catholic boarding school. So we had this thing called a rock mass. Rock mass. We would have our mass and there would be two girls that played guitar. And then I was the one that did all the singing. I was the only contra alto in my entire school and everybody else was either an alto or soprano. But I was what's called a contra alto, which is very rare for a child. So I got all the solos and I was always asked to sing at the choir and the Christmas show, you know, that kind of stuff. So I was very, very used to being the center of attention, even in boarding school. Right. And when I was naughty, the nuns would chase me around with a ruler, but I would outrun them and I would always go hide. And you know, I was a mischief. You were a little rebel. Yeah, but I also had their love for some weird reason. Kids did some stuff that wasn't so bad and they would get expelled. But Mother Sarah, she never expelled me. She always gave me that confidence that I was going to do something in my life. She used to always say, I don't know what you're going to do, but it's going to be great. And after she would spank me and take me around with the ruler and wear my butt out good. And but she never stopped loving me. And I remember when I left school, when I graduated from Villa Maria, when I was eight, she hugged and kissed me and didn't do that with any of the other children. And I kept in touch with her and I kept tracking her down throughout my life. And even after I did Playboy and she knew. So she knew you were in Playboy magazine and she didn't. And I called her up and I said, what did you think of that mother? Because I called her mother. Her name was Mother Sarah and she had moved from Villa Maria to Villa Maria in Greenbott Briar. And eventually she passed away. But I kept in touch with her. She always took my calls. And one of my favorite nuns is now on the Jersey Shore. And I sort of want to make a journey to go see her sister Dolores, sister Michael and Dolores. And I don't know how to explain my life. But when I told Mother Sarah from that, I wanted to play a tambourine in the rock of Mass and she said, why tambourine? And I said, because Mick Jagger plays tambourine. And she said, OK. And, baby, I'm jumping in here because what's amazing to me is that you had this dream and I had a dream of being friends with Bobby Rydell and Brenda Lee. And that dream came true. But I looked at the pictures of your book. There's pictures with you. And of course, one of the people that you spent time with was Mick Jagger. And there's a picture of you and Keith Richards. So your dream come true. What year did you actually meet Mick Jagger? I met Mick Jagger on the eve of my 21st birthday. I was with Todd. He had been invited to... Todd Rundgren. Yeah, Todd Rundgren was invited to come up on stage with Eric Clapton at Madison Square Garden to play guitar on the last song. So we showed up and, of course, Mick was there. And I met Mick that night. And I turned 21 the next day. Baptism by fire, you know? So, what was that like, though, to meet somebody that you looked like? Well, the thing is, I've never been starstruck. I've never... I don't look at people that have good jobs or are artistic as being different than me. I always just felt like that's my equal. That's my friend. That's my tribe. Meeting him, how did it feel? It felt like I already knew this was going to happen. It's hard for me to explain. But Mick, of course, took a shine to me immediately, and then we got invited over to this apartment afterwards where everybody was smoking weed and drinking wine. And Eric and his backup singer at the time. I wish I could remember her name. She had long black hair. She went on to become a pretty famous singer, too. And they were all... everybody was lulling around. And I remember when I got up to go to the kitchen to get some water. Mick followed me. And that's when Todd put his foot down. Todd sort of came in and said, we're going home now. It's time to go home. He saw the forest and the trees. No, it's just... Well, Todd and I were not married, you know? We were very young. He was five years older than me. We were... I was 21, and he... The eve of 21. I think I turned 21 in that room with Mick Jagger. How funny is that? And we had a very strange relationship. In those days, it was very Bob, Ted, Carol, and Alice. Everybody hung out with each other. Rock and Roll was very incestuous. We didn't want to go outside of our circle. There was never any stragglers. And that's why Patty Boyd, first she was with George, and then she married Eric. There was only a few of us girls. Things are very different. Things changed in the 80s. These rock stars, they only wanted the Kremdella Krem. They wanted women that could enhance their persona. Their personas, and they could teach them things. I mean, Mary Ann taught the stones about fashion. I needed to taught them about danger. And she taught them how to have poise around the royal family. Well, you were an inspiration, too, with a lot of these girls. The thing is, I think I got as far as I got in certain circles because of my background, because my mother taught me impeccable manners. Talk about your mother just briefly. Well, my mother is the founder of the Protocol School of Washington. And even at that point in my life... Protocol School? What's that? It's basically a school for teaching people protocol. Etiquette and protocol. Etiquette and protocol. Manners, how to conduct yourself. What a fish fork is. We're how to set a table. You know, and I knew all that. And so, for instance, when Mick took me to dinner in London one night, he picked me up and he said, we're going to dinner with Princess Margaret. Get out of here. And so I said, oh, you're bringing me? And he said, well, you're the only one I know that knows how to use a fork. And so it was just, well, he was kidding, of course. Mick is a prankster, an imp. Oh, is he really? Very funny sense of humor, very funny boy. And I'm sure Mary and Faithful knew how to use a fork. But I'm just saying that for this particular date, he wanted to bring somebody with him that could hold their own in a situation like that. And well, to go from watching the Beatles and the Stones on TV to actually being with these people. But like I told you, there was no. You were a model low first. There was no lull for me. Yeah, no, you never worked a nine to five. I went from being 10 to being 18 in Eileen Ford's office being signed to a modeling contract all in 10 minutes. Amazing. Just from a photograph that she saw me that my mother sent. My mother again, her intuition. Sure. I have dyslexia and I was a little ADHD. They didn't know what any of that stuff was back then. That's right, they just thought you were nuts. So my mother knew I wasn't going to go to college. But she said, BB, you have to have a good job. You have to work. Work ethic is very important in my family. And so she thought modeling would be a good. But see, to me, I didn't tell her this, but secretly, for me, modeling was my gateway to get to New York so I could meet Andy Warhol and so I could meet my tribe. I resonated when I would look at my mother's Vogue magazine if I saw a picture of Andy Warhol or a picture of Joe DeLisandro or Edie Sedgwick. I wanted to know those people. Did you go to Studio 54? Did you go there? I did go there, yes, but not a lot. Not a lot. It wasn't my scene. I'm not a big cocaine person, you know? And that was like the big cocaine place. That was a huge, Mac Davis. I had a conversation with Mac Davis, the singer. He was with Priscilla Presley, and he told me that one of the things that he was happy about was he never got into the cocaine. A lot of drinking, but never the cocaine. It doesn't, it's all a matter of taste. To me, it was like a dog chasing its tail. It's fun for a minute. And then you keep trying to do it. And it's never like the first part. And so I didn't like the way it made me feel. And made other people strange, actually. And that's another reason why I think I fit in so well with the hierarchy of our industry was because I wasn't some girl out looking for cocaine. Whereas a lot of women in that era, that's how they used the cocaine to get in with the guys and get backstage and to get in the door. I mean, I saw, there was a lot of drugs. It was a drug culture. It was very drug-y. So, Bibi, you or not, we've heard stories about the groupies, the women that made it their business to have relations with the rock styles, like some of them did with the, you or not the groupie, you were equal to these people. Sex was never my quest. You know, I make men work real hard to get in my pants. I mean, it's just, I like a little crawling, a little begging. I've always been like that. And somebody said to me the other day, how many one-night stands have you had? And I said, I've never known a man that didn't come back for seconds. So I've never had one. So, I've always had relationships that meant something. Even if they were short-lived, they were not brief. And lots of times, like with David Bowie, we were friends. We didn't date. And we hung out. I was his sidekick. We ran around together. We would go to the top of the Empire State Building, go to see the Rockettes at the Rockettes. I call them the Rockettes. Too much rock and roll. I was thinking of Brian Setser. You know, he wanted to see the Rockettes at Radio City, that kind of stuff. He wanted to see where Bruce Springsteen lived. So we took a limo to the Jersey Shore. And he turned me on to Bruce Springsteen. And I was lucky enough, in 1973, to be upstairs at Max's with him and two other people while Bruce did a set at the piano. Wow. He wasn't even standing. You didn't even get to see the standing boss. You saw the intimate boss. And that's when David turned to me. He goes, what's Asbury Park? And I said, well, go there. I'll show you the boardwalk. I'll show you Asbury Park. It was one of my, there was a venue there. The convention center at Asbury Park. And Todd would play there. And I'd been to a few shows there. And it was one of my favorite venues. So I knew Asbury Park. It was a sea short town. I related to it because it was a lot like my, where I grew up in Virginia Beach. Yeah, it was Virginia Beach. Yeah, it reminded me of that. So he wanted to see Asbury Park. And I remember he goes, that's it? Cause Asbury wasn't as built up as it is now. So I took him for that drive where he could see all the mansions and deal. Do you know Deal, New Jersey, anybody? One of the most beautiful places. Great houses, beautiful, beautiful, beautiful. Red Bank, he wanted to see all of that. So that was my relationship with David Bowie. And when we did finally try to take the step to maybe being a little more than friends, we just ended up, we burst out laughing and we fell on the floor laughing. I mean, it was just too funny. Cause once you become good friends with certain people, you can't take that step. You know what I mean? Whereas sometimes relationships blossom from friendships to love. So he goes like this, he goes, ah, screw it. Let's just play with makeup, you know? And so we, that's what we did. We sat there and we did experiments with makeup and doing crazy things with our eyes. Which we know, cause David Bowie was, what do they call him, a drudge? What people don't realize about Bowie was that he was a genius mime. Oh yeah. And he really was talented at mime. I mean, it wasn't like he was just okay. Off the chart. He was good. I mean, he could do all that stuff. I mean, it was unbelievable. So, you know, of course everybody was getting high and he would just do little shows for us right there in the hotel room. Did you maintain a friendly relationship with him through the course of his life? Yeah, throughout my life. And he even came to my daughter's wedding. I mean, it was just, David, I never lost my friendship with him ever. And you're also still friends with Steve Tyler. You two are still pretty close. My daughter's father, yes. He even moved to Nashville for a couple of years. So, I had been there about a year and a half and he shows up in town. Okay, cowboy, what should do when in Nashville? Rock and roll cowboy. I've got to tell you this story. I was in Nashville about four years ago with Brenda Lee. We went to the country music fest. And the first thing she says at the venue, I want to meet Steve Tyler. And they go, okay, we'll go ask him. They go ask him. Was he there? Yes, he was, yeah. Well, he loves Brenda Lee. Well, that's it. They said, come with us. And she said, Derry, come on. They go, no, no, just Brenda. So, she met him. They became pals right off the bat. And then a hundred people deep were waiting to get an autograph and a picture of Steve Tyler. How did that work out for him, that country music thing that he tried to do? Well, I mean, the record did not do great. I mean, he didn't make a country record. He made a, I call it like sort of a pop record with a twinge. I mean, personally, if I had been advising him during this period, I would have encouraged him to go country outlaw, to have done what Johnny Cash did. I got you. Remember when Johnny Cash did a cover of the nine inch nail song Hurt? Yes, yes. Did you ever hear Johnny Cash's version of Hurt? Amazing. It blew away the original. I just wish Stephen had locked himself in a room with Dave Cobb or Rick Rubin or even T-Bone Burnett who produced Robert Plant analysis. I think if he had gone that direction, we could have gotten a stronger record. I just felt that the record was fluffier than his heart. We needed to know about the pain. We needed to, that's why the Johnny Cash thing resonated with me. But he signed to a very commercial label, did the typical Nashville thing, the round table, 14 writers. I mean, you look at a song written in Nashville and it got 20 writers, you know, I'm exaggerating, but you know, lots of writers. Sure, sure. But I'm not saying I don't like the record. I listened to it like everybody else. But I just think there's, he's got another record in him. This isn't it. Yeah, okay. He's got another solo record in him. And this time I hope he digs deep in there and brings out his guts. Stephen, if you hear this, listen to me. Yeah, Stephen, this is advice for you. Is he still in Nashville by the way? No, he hasn't been in Nashville now for. Several years. For us, he was there from, I'd say, 2014 till about 17, so he was there about three years. And back and forth in 18, because he brought me up on stage with him to do train, kept a rolling in front of 30,000 people. And that's, you can watch that. It was in Nashville. At Fontanelle. Oh, surely, yes. I mean, it was amazing. I'm standing on the side of the stage and I see him going like this and I went, uh-oh, and my husband goes, it's on. And it was Mother's Day, so I knew he had something up his sleeve. He goes, it's just BB Buell in the house. And I'm like, oh! When I got my strut, I was dressed right. I had a rock and roll outfit and I just, I marched out there. So cool. And I have to be honest, I kicked his butt. He ended up giving me the microphone. No kidding. Well, if you haven't seen BB Buell perform. But anyway, you can watch this on YouTube. That's right. It's only a blip, but you get to see the magic. It's on YouTube. Oh, sure. We want to play it. I can send it to you too. It's just an iPhone video, but you get the gist of what our relationship is. I would like to see that. Go ahead, bro. We're best friends. We understand each other. We've only known each other for like, what is it now? 52 years? 52 years. So we knew each other when we were babies, when we were puppies. When I first met him, I was more famous than he was. And then suddenly he became a very big rock star very fast. But, and he ended up becoming the father of my child to top it off, thank God. And I mean, we made some good DNA swirl. I mean, we were like a good ice cream. Speaking of DNA swirl, he was at your grandson's high school graduation. Yes, he was. Very recently. Oh, really? Yeah, we, you know, yeah, that those are beautiful. I mean, listen, if you guys want to pull any pictures from my Instagram for this, you can. Well, we will. And there's one of those pictures from that, that was on on July, June 3rd. June 3rd was the last time I saw him. So just a month ago, a couple months, yeah. And I, you know, I will always love this man. He is a handful. He's a wild Bronco. He is really? And, oh please, you know, it's funny. Some people just have that energy. You know, he is just a born Bronco. I told him, you're not a man, you're a horse. You know, I, I, I always get, you know, I get upset too. And when he gets a young girlfriend and I'm like, he's a racehorse. Do you know how to walk water, clean the shoe, saddle, brush, do the main? I mean, it's like some of these guys are so complex that it is like raising secretariat or something. It's, it takes a lot of skill. He's a thoroughbred, isn't he? Yeah, thoroughbred. That was a good word. Italian, Italian stallion. But with Steven, he's got a very big heart. And I think that that's what balances it all. And he's, nobody's fool. He's smart. Nobody's fool. Very smart. Just like Mick, did you know Mick Jagger was an economics major? No. The London School of Economics. I mean, the guy, they wonder, how did the Stones know how to work with their money? How were they so smart to know how to hire these brilliant businessmen? Duh. Still stay together after all these years. Mick knew what he was doing. To me, Mick Jagger is the greatest living entertainer, front person. Well, Tom Jones is a close second. You like that one? I like Tom, too. He's one of the greatest performers I've ever seen. I agree. I've seen him a few times. Oh my God. And then my other favorite, my other favorite is Bert Backrock and Tony Bennett. Oh my God. So sad about Tony passing. Yeah, Tony, well look, he had a long life. If I can make it to 96, still being as- And still singing. And still singing and making records with Lady Gaga, whom I adore and- Have you met her, by the way? Of course, yeah. I met her when she was Stephanie. Really? Oh, she's- She's always been a genius. I saw her in a little club, at a piano. Tears were streaming down my face. I mean, she's just one of those, she and Pink, they have that ability when they're singing to just- Who are some of your favorite female rock- Well, Patti Smith, Debbie Harry, Joan Jett. I'm old school, baby. Well, we all are. I love Liza Minnelli. Liza Minnelli, I've seen her to a wonderful person. But a wonderful performer. Yes, oh yes. I like a good showman. I like somebody that is not afraid to really- I got a little angry when everybody started dressing icky and not caring. I like my rock stars to dress up and I like them to care about giving the best to the audience. That's important to me. And when I see an entertainer do that- And Mick does, every time, every time he gets on stage, he gives him 100%. Elton John, I mean, Mick only needs to wear a pair of black jeans, a T-shirt and a shirt, which always ends up on the ground. But that's all you need. And he is so rock and roll that it just oozes out of his pussles, core pussles. When did you decide, shit, I can do this. I can be up on that. I always knew I could do it. I know that. I was in front of a mirror with my hairbrush at 10. Okay, so what made you take the step? As soon as I saw him and the way he worked the mic and the way he moved. And Brian Jones in the harmonica. I mean, people don't realize I'm a harmonica player. You are? And yes, I finally, once I got to Nashville, my producer encouraged me, you play harmonica, show people that you can- I wish you brought one with you. I would have not. I should have. I'm sorry. I love harmonica stuff. Well, you know what? When I play here next, I promise you, I will whip that thing out and blow all those minds. But I've had lessons, Stephen gave me lessons. I didn't get lessons from a teacher. Well, maybe- He gave you harmonica lessons? I had a producer, John Tiven, that taught me tricks. It really is all in the tongue. You don't even have to know music, to know highs and lows. It's a scale. Sure. And your tongue is pretty much what your finger would be on the piano if you were gonna pick a note. So when you're blowing and honking, or whatever they call it, the tongue, that's why you don't see the action internally as much. But I know this is gonna sound kind of funny and metaphoric, but it's a process of, it's how you blow and how you use your tongue. You know, it's like a- I haven't heard anybody explain it to me that way. That's unbelievable. It's a rhythmic thing. Sure. Yeah. So how you move your mouth, it takes practice. I mean, it doesn't come overnight. It's not like some easy thing. But it's like anything, the more you do it, the more confident you get. But what I find with me in the harmonica, even though I practice every day, I play an hour a day. Well, I don't skimp, I get out all my harmonicas. Stephen gave me- Yeah, to explore the tele-audience. The long ones. All the keys. All the keys. All the keys and- Oh, tiny ones that you used to see on- I have little ones. I have a necklace that's made out of all harmonicas and I can even play it. Okay, that's cool. I can play it. That's cool. And I call that my dog harmonica. I play that one for my dogs. And they go, oh! But yeah, so I learned how to play harmonica, but it was the way he presented the whole thing. And so I started getting in front of the mirror. When I was a kid. And I would use the hairbrush. And I would start to try to emanate this and move. And, you know, I was, I wanted to be him. I wanted to be him, not date him. Yeah. And so, and it was just- What was your first gig? Yeah. The Downtown Lounge in Portland, Maine. All right, let's talk about Portland. Now, this is a Maine show. Halloween 1980. Okay. Halloween 1980. I always used local Maine musicians. I took both of my bands to New York and they played world-class stages. And the B-sides, we, by the time we broke up in 85, we were headlining big rooms in New York City. The B-sides were pretty big. We got, we got far. And the gargoyles. Huh? The gargoyles. And then I formed the gargoyles. I met, and I'll never forget, Stephen King came to one of our first shows because our name was The Gargoyles. Sure. And I'll never forget being on stage and looking over and seeing Stephen King. I was like, what is, another time I was on stage at the Tree Cafe and I looked to the left and there was Stephen King. And I looked to the right and there was Bonnie Rait. Well, she was in town doing a show and after the show they came down and to the Downtown Lounge, which was on Danforth Street, y'all. Right, right. And you could walk from the Civic Center. Yeah. And she was hanging out because that was the hot club then, you know. But my first show was at a dump called the Downtown Lounge but it was a cool dump. And it was awesome. And that was when people danced. Right. And so I had, from this first opening note, the place was bonkers. And my aunt Mossie was there, my mama, my whole family, you know. It was, and everybody had a ball. That was my first gig. That was 1980. Yep. And then my second gig was Halloween. I mean, Halloween was my first. And then on Thanksgiving, I did Beebe's pajama party and I did another one at the Downtown Lounge. So those were my first two gigs. And then my producer, one of my producers, Rick Derringer, who played with Johnny Winter and Edgar Winter. He also, a lot of people don't realize, Rick Derringer produced, did you know he produced the famous song Frankenstein by Edgar Winter? No, no. Rick Derringer was Edgar Winter's producer, not only his sideman. But to make a long story short, my producer called me up and said I'm getting ready to do a show with the Rids. It was gonna just be a Rick Derringer solo show for his All American Boy record. And he asked me if I wanted to open the show. I had only played two live shows in my life. So here was my third show on stage at the Rids in New York City to a sold out house opening for Rick Derringer with every news outlet you could imagine, including the British press. And then I got a rave review in a magazine called Sounds out of England. And they called it the BB Factory. I'll never forget the review. And it changed my life. After that, I had agents calling, everybody wanted to book the B-sides. Everybody wanted to book the band. So we had no trouble getting gigs. But we still considered ourself a local band. Even though I was who I was and had my New York international connections, I still lived in Portland. I loved Portland. I loved my friends. I loved my band. You're very loyal to Portland, aren't you? She really is. And you said earlier at lunch that you are pretty much the reason why Portland is a rock and roll scene. Well, I think- Tell us about that. Talk about that. You know, I don't wanna sound like I'm tuning my horn or anything, but the B-sides, when we came out, there were a couple of really cool bands in town, like The Stains and Zero Mentality, but it was a punk movement that was trying to squeeze through Portland. And then you later had your traditional artist, you know, like, who's the guy that I opened for up at Bowdoin College? Bill Chinook. Oh, sure. You had your Bill Chinooks, you know, and you had your staples. But the rock scene had not really exploded here yet. We didn't have a real rock and roll scene. And so when I came to town, I thought, you know what? Where is cool is Seattle? Where is cool is this? Why can't we have a cool rock scene? So that was the mission of the B-sides, to help and inspire other people to start bands. And then before you knew it, we had more bands than you could shake a stick at. And then you had the moguls, the brood. Remember the brood, the all-girl band? They were great. These bands were incredible. And so Genos became like the CBGBs of Portland. Sure, remember Genos, Derry? Yes. CBGBs was where Hilly Crystal gave all the new bands a platform to get good. Well, that's what Geno did here. Genos was on Brown Street. It's now on Congress. Genos long gone and his son took it over after he passed, but now Genes out of the business too and somebody else is running it, but it's still a very good place. Good place to cut your teeth, learn your craft. So I mean, we used to play there all the time. And whenever an out-of-town band would come, we'd take them to Genos. When the rock stars would finish, they're set over at the Civic Center. They would come over to Genos, sometimes jump up on stage. I mean, I saw everybody in Genos from Jimmy Page to Sting. I mean, everybody's been in Genos. Sting was in Genos? Of course. I mean, probably more than once. I mean, I don't know, but the thing about Genos is that they felt like they could go in there. There was nobody trying to take pictures. We didn't have iPhones then. Portland has never had paparazzi. And Mainers are just too cool to react. Well said. They're just too cool. Oh, things here. All right, great. Jeesum crowbar. Yeah. Bibi, all these rock and roll things in your performances, were these before or after you posed for Playboy? Oh, well, Playboy was just one of the billions of things I've done. It was just a moment in my life. People don't understand. I never became part of the Playboy empire. I never hung out with Pev for the man. I didn't could stay at the mansion a couple of times. You did stay there? Oh yeah, twice. I stayed there once for two weeks. You knew Hugh Hefner? I did, and I never saw any of the horror. You know, there's a lot of stories going around. And I'm gonna show my empathy for the women right now, because just because that did not happen to me does not mean it did not happen to them. Sometimes predators are selective. Yes. I don't think that Hef would have been stupid enough to come after me, because I had a famous boyfriend and I was a pop culture icon. So I don't think He would have pulled that malarkey on me. Right, and what year would that have been, if I can ask you? That was early 80s, when I stayed at the mansion. There was a period when I was dating Jack Nicholson that I thought about maybe moving to LA and bringing Liv to LA. I thought it would be a good place for her. So the comment that Jack Nicholson made that I came up by myself, you were dating him. Well, Jack's, he's the one that dubbed me the mother of rock and roll. Right, he did. Because he thought I was too motherly all the time. I'm always trying to get people to drink water and to eat right and to do this and to do that. Don't take those drugs, put those drugs away. Just smoke weed. Don't bother with all this other horrible stuff. Just, you know. But, and one time Jack was being a little, I thought drinking a little too hard and I put my arms around him. I said, sweetie, enough. And he goes, what are you, babe? The mother of rock and roll. That's great, baby. And it's just, it's stuck. It went from friend to the stars. Everybody tried to call me everything but the G word, which I don't even like to utter because it's so sexist. I think the sexism is one of the things. I fight it. I'm a fighter of sexism. I'm an ism squasher. I call myself. How did you feel when the movie Almost Famous came out? I felt honored to be even a speck of inspiration for that film. Because of course it's not, everybody thinks it's totally me. It's not. I mean, it is Cameron Crowe's story. The movie was, the working title of Almost Famous was the journalist. Because as you know, the movie's about him starting as a 16 year old journalist. And he was the first journalist I met when he came on the road with Todd to do the story for Rolling Stone on Todd. And Cameron and I are born one day apart. I'm July 14th. He's either the 13th or the 15th. I can't remember. But we're, he's maybe a couple years younger than me. But we were the babies. We were the youngsters on that tour. So we bonded, when they were off doing shop talk, Cameron and I would go and sit and talk. And he would be so frustrated because he couldn't nail everybody down for interviews just like in the movie. But you have to remember, the movie is fiction based on truth and nonfiction. So the Penny Lane character who sort of stole the movie. Right, I had that for a question, yes. When it really is his story, that's why I get frustrated with people because they're like, you're a Penny Lane. No, she's a smorgasbord of a couple of women that Cameron knew. And you're one of them. She's a combination of, so Penny Lane is Penny Trumble and me. I mean, so it's basically, and then there's other girls that say, I'm Penny Lane. And this is what I say. It doesn't matter. It's Cameron's story, Cameron's life, Cameron's creative artistic license. And if I'm even one speck of that, I'm honored. Yeah, absolutely. And I love what he said about me in my book. What is it, that last line? Well, it says, if using the F word, B.B. Bewell loves it and remembers twirling around, I walk away happy. So the point is, is that at the time it hadn't done a great box office. Now it's a classic film. It's the gone with the wind of rock and roll. And at the time, though, it hadn't done a great, and he was nominated for an Oscar. So the question that the magazine said, how do you feel about that? And for him to say, as long as I liked it, that's all that mattered to him. Right, and that's what it says. And by the way, the F word is used as an adjective. Yes, no, not a descriptive adjective. No, you're right. Thanks for the clarification, dude. And I also, you see the coat that Penny, here, let me show you something else. And I also want to show this picture. Show me of you on the cover of Portland Magazine. Cover of Portland Magazine. This is almost famous again, and there you are. But yeah, but this is my favorite. When I met, the day I met Cameron, I had on the Penny Lane coat. Oh, that's it, yeah. Oh, wow, yeah. This was a photo booth picture that was taken. I was with Cameron when these photographs. But those photos were taken? This was the day I met him. And he remembered this coat, and it ended up in the movie. And if you remember, oh, do you want to prop it up again? Yeah, so people can see it. It's a fantastic book. I mean, Penny Lane's opening line in the movie is, somebody said something about groupies or something, and you see that, I go, we are not groupies. We are band-aids. We inspire the, it was like, he took that essence of me. Whereas other girls embrace the groupie word, love it, and proudly wear it. I don't judge, but. Well, you're definitely, I mean, the whole point of this book and the whole point about having you on the show is that you are a force to be reckoned with, and one of the things that, because we're running out of time, this has gone by so fast. One of the things that you say, and this is a very important part of the interview for me, is that the greatest accomplishment you ever had from the rock and roll and knowing all these big people, the greatest accomplishment you ever had is Liv Tyler. And she has become. Well, she wasn't Liv Tyler. She was Liv Rungren. Initially. Yes, but she is so highly respected, and I now understand why she is so well loved and so humble. Well, I can't take all the credit. Well, you take a lot of credit. Because my mother and my cousin, who is like my sister, raised as my sister Annie, we did this as a trilogy. We call ourselves the Triangle. For Liv Tyler. It was three of us. My mother, if it weren't for my mother and for Annie, I couldn't have kept having a career. I couldn't have toured. The fact that I had the sense and the forthright to bring my baby up here, so she could feel the grass under her toes. She went to school here in Portland. She went to breakwater. She went to Wayne Fleet. She even did kindergarten at Reiki. Yes. And she's a Portland girl. She was not born here. She was born in New York City. If she went to school in those places. But she was in Portland until she was 12. And then the record companies started courting the gargoyles. And Joey Ramon from the Ramones said, you gotta move back to New York. I can't get you a record deal up there in lobster country, he used to call it. So I'm like, well, why not? It's only a six hour drive, Joey. And he's like, no, you need to live here again. So I packed up my apartment on High Street. My family took Liv until I got settled. And I wanted to get settled before I brought her into the chaos. I wanted to get an apartment and so she could have her own room. And I went back and forth still, even though Joey asked me not to. I still did anyway. Where's the band stayed in New York? But 89, you know, I went back and we started to take off really fast. But then her paternity became public. And that sort of put a, that sort of put a cabache. She had to change her name from Runburn to Tyler. She didn't have to. I mean, not have to, but she did. But it was just, it felt right for her. This was her choice. See, what everybody has to understand is that nobody forced Liv to do anything. She came to me when she was 15 and said, Mom, I don't want to do much modeling. I think it's nice and I'm flattered, but I want to be an actor. And she sure is. No, she literally landed a role within six months of saying those words to me. When she told me she wanted to be an actor, we were in the middle of the Amazon jungle. What? Literally on one of those boats that if you fell in the water, you would get eaten by piranhas. And she was shooting a campaign for bongo genes. And it was when we got back to camp and mosquitoes, as big as Chihuahuas were coming after us, that she said, Mom, when we get back to New York, I really want to be an actor. She didn't want to be a model. I want to act. Did she act on stage? Did you ever do it on stage? No, she didn't act on stage. She got it made off of the movies. You know what, some people, like I said, I believe in multiple lifetimes, some people are old souls. Some people just know who they are. And some people are just given a God-given gift and you cannot put it in a bottle. You can't explain it. You get your Meryl Streeps, who were trained heavily. She's still one of the greatest ever to ever live. And then you get your rawness. Your people like Liv, as you put a camera on him. And she's beautiful. Bam. Her first screen test brought me to tears. Really? Yes, she didn't get the movie. Natalie Portman did. She, the first. What movie was that? The Professional. Yes. It was between the two of them. Liv was too tall. There was a scene in the movie where Natalie Portman has to wrap herself around the guy's leg while he runs through and she was a small girl. But it was down to the two of them. Natalie got the part. But then she got up, her first movie was called Silent Fall with Richard Dreyfus. Yes. And then her second movie was a movie called Empire Records. Right, Empire Records. And then she made, no, it was Heavy Empire Records. But the movie that changed her life was Stealing Beauty. Absolutely. The Bernardo Bertolucci classic. Is that your favorite movie by her, by the way? You know, I can't put, I love Cookie's Fortune, the Robert Altman movie, myself, personally. The one where she cut her hair off two inches for the role to be two inches long. I think that's one of her strongest roles. She's done so many good roles. I love that thing you do. Tom Hanks' directorial debut. Yes. And he chose her for that. And you know what? Bibi, you managed her career as she did. I did. I managed her up through all that. Really through all the conceptions? I had to wear a whole new hat. I had to go from being... Yeah, talk about that a little bit. In a rock and roll band. Yeah. Being part of the rock and roll royalty circle. Right. To actually, I just wanted to be the best mother I could be. And I know how dangerous that industry is. And I know the predators are everywhere. Everywhere, predators. And the Harvey Weinsteins. I got myself a desk and a phone and a Rolodex. And I just went to town. Well, congratulations to you. I know, seriously. So I realized that I could do many things. You don't just have jack of all trades. You just chill of all trades. So, Bibi, what's your next chapter? Well, I'll be honest. I only enjoyed modeling. I mean, modeling. It's all IMS, musician, model, mother, manager, the M word. But I didn't like it. I was only good at it because it was her. Because I loved her. But if I had to manage some of these crazy people, I would lose my mind. So it was a labor of love. I'm not a momager. I don't want to be Chris Kardashian. I just wanted to set her up to be poised to go to the next level. And she did that herself. I took her to Lord of the Rings. And then it was all, I mean, live as live. If you don't have the talent, it doesn't matter who your parents are. It doesn't matter if your dad's famous, your mom's famous, your dog's famous. If you don't have the talent, she had the talent. And, Bibi, only because you mentioned her at lunch that you also were friends and fairly close to Lisa Marie Presley. Well, no, no, I was not close to Lisa Marie. I had the great privilege of meeting her and spending conversation time with her where I got to know her and got to see who she was. You liked her. I did. Beautiful person. Sweetheart. And I remember, it was around the time when she was getting ready to marry Nick Cage. People forget that she married Michael Jackson, but she also married Nick Cage. That's right, Nick Cage. I mean, Lisa Marie, and here's what bothers me the most is that nobody let her be the musician that she was. And Rob, you've seen her. I've seen her. She was unbelievable. She's unbelievable. Not only could she really sing, she had a great voice, played guitar too, and she could write songs. And imagine being the king's daughter. How hard that must have been. Yes, incredible. So I think if she had been allowed to really expand and spread her wings as a musician, that her identity wouldn't have suffered. And I think that we would have, she'd still be with us. Because it meant so much to her to look good, and she wanted to look pretty for the premiere of the, and basically it's what killed her, the way she was, she wasn't caring properly for herself. And that was the pressure of trying to live up to this legacy. Bibi, we only have a few more minutes left, and I wanted to at least give you some time to talk about the next chapter that you see in your life. You're a best-selling author, musician, performer. Yeah. Where, what's your next project? Well, I would like to spend, I just turned 70, everybody. You look fantastic. And I mean, considering that I remember turning 30 and having a party at the Coutree Cafe. I just wanna keep writing books. And I'm writing a book right now about animal reincarnation. Please don't cringe, you're gonna love it. Animal reincarnation. I believe in it. I believe in reincarnation, period. But I think that animals' souls are as relevant and as important as a human soul. It's just an evolving soul. And I've written a book about it because I have a dog that I am certain has been my dog at least three times in one life. So I wanna continue to write books, and that's why I'm thinking about moving back to Maine because I wanna have a desk in front of a window where I can look at it. Yeah, looking out the ocean, whatever. Or the trees, or the Casco Bay, wherever I find the house. We'd love to have you come back. I wanna keep writing books. I've been offered another book, besides my animal reincarnation. Somebody wants to do a coffee table photo book of my life, and I would just write the captions. But so I wanna write books. I wanna mentor, that's very important to me. I like mentoring. I know the technical word is creative consultant. But I like mentoring. I love helping young people not make mistakes because it's so easy to make mistakes. I mean kids now, you really have to worry. When we were young and experimenting with drugs, it was pure, the dosages were so much smaller. The pot now is like, ah! But fentanyl. I wanna take a moment. Go ahead. Cushion. Fentanyl is what's killing all our babies. It only takes one grain of fentanyl to kill five people. So they're cutting drugs with fentanyl. So what we did effortlessly, the experimentation, the crazy. I mean, when we were kids, Timothy Leary weighed all the acid. That's right. And he made the acid that went around to the whole country. It was personally made by Timothy Leary. I didn't know that. It was the very first batches. When late sixties into early seventies, he invented orange barrel sunshine. And it's just so scary. Cause now if a kid takes the wrong pill or snorts the wrong thing, we would learn our lesson, throw up, get sick. Oh, never wanna do that again, Debbie. Oh my God, that was. Now you're gonna wake up dead. So kids, you don't need it. It's just stay away from it. Drugs are not like they were when I, people like, oh, I want it to be the seventies. I want to live like it's the seventies. No, drugs are not as weak as they were in the seventies. Why is Keith Richards still alive? Because of that. I can't believe you say that because everybody says, how does Keith Richards manage to stay alive? How does he? Bottom line? You just said it because. Bottom line though, he's Welsh. You can't kill Welsh people. Oh my God. Like Tom Jones. Yeah, that's right. No, but see Keith is also a brilliant man with common sense. So when he finally fell out of the tree that time and really hurt himself, he stopped smoking. He stopped doing everything. And look, he's gonna be 80. Unbelievable. He looks 104, but he's 80. Mick turned 80 on July 26th. That's right. And Keith turns 80 in December. They're only a couple of months apart from me. Are you still in touch with either room like even today? Yeah, I mean, I do have, I mean, I'm not saying we call each other on the phone, but because of my daughter, who's friends with all their kids, and I mean, we all have children together. So you can get Mick on this show. I don't think so. No, I don't think so. Mick only stayed 45 minutes at his own party with Leonardo DiCaprio and people like that. So his own birthday party. I thought I'd thrown out there, Robbie, at least you had. You're not gonna get any. These people don't need to do shows anymore. No, of course not. They're at the point where we should all feel blessed that we can still see them. I'll see the Stones until they're not able to do it anymore. They're still the greatest rock and roll band that ever lived. And he works out, he works out every day. Unbelievable. And he's even got a stint. I didn't know that. Well, he almost had a heart attack a couple years ago. You don't remember? Oh my God, I remember that. I don't know if it was a heart attack or a blockage. Whatever was a blockage. But he survived it. But look at Keith now. He's so beautiful. He is such a beautiful human being and you can learn so much from him. I just remember sitting with him in Martha's Vineyard out at Montauk, not Martha's Vineyard, at Montauk, at Andy Warhol's Compound. Oh, OK. I was invited to come out there with Billy Preston and we took a little mix into private plane for us. And we had our own little cottages and everything. And it was so beautiful. And I just remember walking on the beach with Keith and there was horseshoe crabs everywhere. And he had a gun and he was so like, phew, phew. He was target practicing on the horseshoes. They were dead. They were already dead. Just their shell. Yeah, right. Thank you. We have them in Cumberland, too. Thank you for that. But the wisdom and the clarity and the brilliance and the beauty of this man, I'm just so glad he's still with us. And I'm glad that he gave up smoking and has a beautiful wife and beautiful daughters. And so his daughters know my daughter. And Stella McCartney and they're all McCartney. It's all the babies. They're all grown up. I know it. My daughter was 46. Whoever thought that day would come. Bibi, Kent, thank you enough. Yeah, we want to have you back like nobody's business. Well, I want to come back. Next time we come back, nobody's business. Yes, I would love it. Thank you, Bibi. OK, thank you for the Ronald and Baldachi Report. Thank you.