 Good morning everyone and welcome to the second half of the 2022 Fitch Colloquium. My name is Jorge Oteropailos. I'm professor and director of the Historic Preservation Program at Columbia University's Graduate School of Architecture Planning and Preservation. We are coming back from the longest break ever in a conference, a break of 11 hours. If you are in New York or in the United States, you went to sleep after our conference last night. But if you were in China, good evening to all of you. You had a very long day between the morning session and then tonight's evening session. The Fitch Colloquium honors the memory of our founder, the Columbia University Historic Preservation Program's James Marston Fitch, an incredible figure that traveled the world and thought broadly about preservation and was interested in all aspects of preservation from architectural design, to policy questions, to historical research, to materials research and technology, quite an extraordinary figure. And it's that legacy that we honor today. And in today's symposium is particularly relevant as well because it is in collaboration, it is organized in collaboration with the Museum of Modern Art. As I mentioned yesterday, but for those of you that were not here, this symposium really began in dialogue with Martino Sierli and Evangelos Cotzeris who have curated an exhibition in MoMA called Reuse, Renew, Recycle, Recent Architecture from China, which is on view through July 4th, about which Evangelos will talk a little bit more in a second. Before I turn to Evangelos, I just wanna do a little recap of yesterday's conference. We heard yesterday from Zonke, from Xu Tiantian and from Philip Yuan. Beautiful projects dealing with heritage and many different levels. And in some ways, we were looking to understand through those presentations, the forces underlying the turn in China to preservation, Chinese architecture to preservation. There has been a marked turn from an emphasis on new construction in symbolic buildings to preservation in China. And we wanted to take note of it and understand what are the forces underlying this turn? And we learned yesterday about many of those forces, what is activating this turn. And in particular, we heard a lot about the social issues that are driving this turn. Grappling with, in a sense, some of the outcomes of the incredible construction boom that happened in China in the last 40 years, but in particular with particular intensity in the last 20. We heard about the social issues being really, as a result of construction, things like displacement, social displacement, and we saw that kind of displacement both in cities and in rural areas. And we've seen attempts that really start at the government level with different policies being set up to address and repair these social problems. And architects responding, giving expression to these policies and trying to address them at various levels. We saw, for example, the upgrading of vernacular housing to contemporary living standards, both in cities and in rural areas. And in a particularly poignant example with Hutongs of Zongkei. We also saw new modes of cooperative businesses, the creation of these cooperatives to support family-owned craft businesses like tofu and sugar, to bring them up to contemporary health standards, but also to aggregate them so that, for example, packaging becomes easier, marketing becomes easier. And we saw some amazing projects by Xu Tiantian on that. And these projects are really trying to preserve not just architectural heritage, but they're also trying to preserve these intangible traditional practices and giving them new locations, new sites for them to practice. And then we saw a very interesting now rise of a new tourist economy, internal tourist economy to China, where urban travelers, urban tourists are going to rural sites to see how these traditional crafts are carried. Of course, another social issue is that there's been mass migrations from rural areas. So actually some of these crafts don't have enough people to be carried out. So the question of labor force becomes a real issue. And we saw the attempts to create new robotic tools to carry out these crafts, to assist the local craftsmen in a hybrid mode. So not to replace craftsmen, but to actually help them do the work in light of the fact that there's just fewer people to do it. And we saw Philip Yuan, for example, with his interest in woodworking, helping us understand how that can be a form of assistance to local crafts. Now, we're familiar with now motorized tools and pneumatic hammers and so on in construction sites in the United States. So in around the world, in fact, and those kinds of attempts to introduce robotics tools really go back to the 19th century in the United States. So this is, let's say, one more step along that way. And it was interesting to hear Philip Yuan talk about the sense that the future for him is a hybrid future between humans and robots kind of working together. We also saw a very interesting discussion about materials and both the combination of traditional and more contemporary materials. There was a beautiful project with Zhang Ke of introducing the most traditional and beautiful of Chinese materials, ink, which is at the heart of a whole tradition of painting and of writing and script. And introducing that ink in different ways into architecture through by mixing it with concrete and that was very interesting. We also saw the real kind of interest in traditional wood construction and adapting, reviving some of that wood construction in the work of Xu Tianxian, but also of reinventing it and rethinking it across all of the projects. I'm sure some of these issues, some of these ideas are going to come up today as well. And before I introduce the speakers, I'll be introducing them one by one today, but just to give you, I mean, just a telegraph, we're going to hear from Dong Gong, Wan Hui, Lu Wenyu and Pei Wei Yi, Chloe today. I'll be again, giving you a better introduction of each of them before they speak. Both the speakers yesterday and the speakers today are really superstars in world architectural and world preservation architecture. And we are just so honored and delighted that they have all agreed to participate and share their ideas and thoughts with us. After some of them have been included in the exhibition at MoMA, but not all of them. So I will now turn the virtual podium over to Evangelos to tell us a little bit about the exhibition at MoMA and which was the spark for this conference. Good morning, Jorge. And thank you for this introduction. Thank you also to everybody joining from around the world. So good evening to those in China and other parts of the world. I'm going to say a couple of words about the exhibition we use, Renew, Recycle, Recent Architecture from China, which is currently on view on the first floor of the Museum of Modern Art here in New York and was co-curated by Martín Osterly, the chief curator of architecture and design and me. This is a small exhibition that showcases eight projects from the last decade, more or less of architectural production in China that really share a number of common threads which are namely the idea of reusing existing buildings or renewing urban infrastructure or recycling materials. And even though it is really kind of focusing on them as a case study almost on Chinese architectural production, both of us believe that it's a remarkable kind of set of projects and practices and strategies that architects from many different parts of the world can learn from. I wanted to start by showing you just this introductory wall into the exhibition, which speaks also to the multiplicity of practices represented in the show. And to give you also kind of a glimpse or a peek into the actual side of the installation, you'll notice that there is not only the multiplicity of practices represented but also multiplicity of media that speak again to the tools and processes that many of these architects that we have been in conversation employ. So preservation is really one of the dimensions that runs through this exhibition. And what is perhaps commendable to note is that preservation or historic preservation of structures and buildings is not meant as a means to an end or it doesn't come as a mandate but is in most cases actually proposed by the architects themselves as a way of creating communities that are embedded in their context and create a kind of cultural continuity for them. I just wanted to point out also very briefly without giving away too much information, two of the architects that are part of this panel today and we'll hear more from them. The first one is vector architects and Donggong's work for the Alila Yangshuo Hotel in Guilin, which really speaks to the ways in which more humble structures like that of a sugar factory can become part of development for a region, in this case part of the hospitality industry in a very kind of interesting and sustainable manner or the work of Wang Xu and Lu Wenyu of Amateur Architecture Studio, whose work really I think has set the groundwork for many of the younger members of the current generation of Chinese practitioners working in this vein. Here, for instance, you see one of their material studies for the Jinghua Ceramic Pavilion on the left, which is an older project than the others in this show but really kind of speaks to this intense interest in materiality and craftsmanship and how those ideas of architectural practices can be brought to the present through translation and really on the right, the project, one of the two projects that they will be discussing today, the Wenchun Village and Yangshuo, which proposes a repertoire of interventions in a depopulating village. And I will not say much more than that. I also wanted to mention that Urbanus and the work of Wang Xu, who is one of the speakers, is not perhaps included in this installation that you see on your screens but is represented in MoMA's collection through the Tule Collective Housing Project from 2005-2008, which reinvents and reinterprets the communal dwelling type of the Tulu housing, which is unique to the Hakka people. And today they're gonna talk about a different project that is also extremely fascinating. And we also look forward to hearing, of course, from Pei Weiwei, Weiwei Chloe and her work on the Shujang Heritage Park in Beijing. On that note, I wanted to also thank the Historic Preservation Program at Columbia, G-SAP, Jorge Otero-Pilos and Sarah Grace Goodwin for giving us this opportunity to collaborate and unpack some of these dimensions that our exhibition hopefully has provided a starting point for. And I would also encourage everybody who has the possibility to visit the exhibition in New York to do so until July 2nd, when will be the closing date for this exhibition. And on that note, we very much look forward to today's presentations and discussions and I'm sure that will be as exciting and prolific as yesterday's. Thank you, Avangelos. It's a wonderful exhibition. I encourage everyone to go see it. I think one of the things that is an obvious thing but it bears repeating is that so much of American academia has been influenced by Chinese students and the influx of Chinese students in recent decades. They have been the bridge that has really educated us as faculty as to this amazing work and this incredible traditions of Chinese architecture and preservation. Of course, there has always been some kind of bridge, some kind of connection between the United States and China. There is a long history of Chinese immigration to America and that of course, we have a lot of Chinese American students in our program who also contribute to the understanding of the enormous contributions that the Chinese have made to the development of the United States of America. And I wanna thank Chris Kumarjaja who is a great activist of that but so many others in our program, Clara Yeap and others who constantly remind us of those contributions. But in particular, I think it is important in this conference to really acknowledge, and I did so yesterday, but I wanna do it again, acknowledge the role that our current Chinese students have played in organizing this conference. They're just a terrific force. They're incredibly smart. And they're the ones that really, we had discussions with them about, identifying the leading voices in China working on preservation and architecture. So I wanna thank them. Luxiyan, Shuyiyin, Ziming Wang, Duxing Shen, Xiyu Li, Yingye Tian, Hongye Wang, Wenji Xue, Zihao Zong, Shuya Zhao, Jianing Wei, and Ye Xu. I also wanna thank, of course, Sarah Grace, Godwin and the GSAP events team. Sarah Grace is a program manager for Stewart Preservation and the GSAP events team including Stefan, Bode Ker, Lucy, Chris Bach and the rest. And Chris, of course, who joins us today. So thank you all. Thank you, of course, again, to Martino and Evangelos for your collaboration in this. This has just, it's been a really amazing first day and we're about to then turn over to our second day with the first presentation by Dong Gong who is a founder of Vector Architects. He was elected as the foreign member of the French Academy of Architecture in 2019. He's been successively employed as design tutor at Tsinghua University and Central Academy of Arts, distinguished visiting professor at the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign, a visiting professor at the Polytechnic University of Turin, and indeed a really a world figure in his work, not only in China but in his pedagogical practice. He and Vector Architects have been invited to various major exhibitions showcasing their work including the first Chinese architecture exhibition at MoMA, the 2018 Free Space Venice Biennale as well. And many others, but we don't have time to get into them but Dong Gong's practice has earned international recognition by his representative works including the Seashore Library, Seashore Chapel, Alila Hotel in Yangshuo, and the renovation of the captain's house in Jiangjian Art Museum. The, everyone's CVs is a very, very lengthy and illustrious so we are just, this is just the tip of the iceberg and so without further ado, I turn the virtual podium over to Dong Gong and thank you. Thank you, thank you for introduction. And thank you for inviting me to be part of this symposium. I'm going to share the screen first. So can you see, can you see the screen? Yes, it's perfect, thank you. Great, okay. So, yeah, I noticed this keyword of this entire discussion of symposium is the preservation and I do think it's a very sensitive and meaningful issue, especially in China in the current moment because you might know that China has been undertaking this drastic urbanization process for the past 30 to 40 years. So literally this entire country is in the progress of transforming into some new state. So how we deal with this relationship between new and old become a very crucial issue for architecture people. So today my topic of the presentation will be the evolution of a place. It's basically about a story about a factory which is a factory, it's a sugar mill factory built about 60 or 70 years ago and generation by generation step by step transform into current cultural icon in China. So I basically will introduce the story and sharing some of my understanding about the preservation throughout the presentation process. This project is basically located in Guangxi which is in the southern part of China and closer to a tropical climate area and that the red spot is the location of the project. And there's a very powerful factor about the site because if you see the red line on the screen is the property line of the project and it's a red along a very famous river in China is the Lijiang River. And it's supposed to be a number one beautiful water scenery river in Chinese people's mind. And together with the river this is a typical karstic geographical district. So when you see this picture you can have a sense about how beautiful this mountain and water landscape is. And besides this beautiful scenery we do have another very important factor which is the sugar mill factory right over here. And this factory was built around 1960s and throughout the history it has different stages which I will elaborate later on. And this is almost like an iconic angle to see this factory together with this beautiful mountain around the factory. And eventually actually our design concept has a lot to do with how we deal with this factory as a center dominating role together with the surrounding beautiful mountainscape and also the river in front of it. So majorly two important relationships relationship with the factory and the relationship with the natural landscape. The factory was a very important industrial facility back to the time when it was built. This is a very interesting image. It was 1972 which actually is a year I was born the factory became the cover page of the National Military Magazine. So you can have a feeling that how important and the high class the factory was back to that time. But unfortunately all the way to the end of 1980s because of the national policy of this environmental protection the factory was shut off and it's becoming abundant structure in the suburb of Yangshuo County. And this series of pictures just give you the condition after the close off of the factory the condition of the entire architecture structure. In the early, actually in the early 20 in the early 2000 what our client they drove by along the Yangshuo County and very coincidentally they see the structure and they fell in love with the structure because of the beautiful atmosphere the architecture together with the mountains around that. So they invited a Shanghai architect. His name is Zhao Chongxin to give a very preliminary and basic repair of the entire structure. So I really appreciate his work back to almost like 15 years ago because he did a very slight and a very accurate touch to the original structure. He didn't do too much about this architectural expression as designer but he just simply reinforced the structure and also replaced some component of the eroded portion of the building. And starting in 2013 I was involved in the project which the client made up the decision they tried to transform the entire structure into a hotel. And I was fortunate in the beginning of my design progress when I went to Yangshuo I had this chance to have a lunch together with some elderly people who worked in this factory when they were young. And that they start talking about a lot of stories and the experience try to memorize the moment when they work in the factory. And for me it's a great learning process about this physical structure. It's not only architecture heritage of the local area but at the same time it's almost like an emotional link or emotional identification for some people living in the area. So this will also has a big impact in our later design process. And we started design progress with the hand sketches. This is my personal method to start learn from the site to discover the important things and build up this emotional interaction between architect and the place. So some of the design decision actually were made along right on the site instead of in the architect isolated in the office and that's typical way of our work method in vector architects. And this is almost represent the eventual layout of the entire compound. And no matter what we do because we have to we made up the decision that we keep the original factory and then we transform them into some public programs like libraries, like cafeteria, dining area and a bar and et cetera. And then we have to add new volumes into this compound to fulfill the functional requirement. But no matter what we do, we still keep the factory volumes original volumes in the center area. So the new volume become a flanking wings alongside the original structure. Yes, this is a very important relationship because we want to still keep the original structure as the dominating role of the entire compound. Of course, we went through a very thorough consideration about the different possibilities about the master plan. So from the elevation also you can see the central part, it's still the factory and the new volumes is alongside. And we tried to design some sequential space inside the new volumes, but we keep it simple. We keep the profile simple and clean, try to make a harmonic relationship between old and new. And that's the eventual master plan, a first floor plan of the entire compound. But this is the center part, which is the original factory and they are checking room and they are restaurant and so forth. And these are two new volumes alongside. And we made up this landscape reflecting pond in the front of the entire compound. And at the same time, it's a fire distinguished water pond. And then this is the corner of Li Jiang. We have an original trust connect the entire compound to the river. This is a picture showing you how beautiful this original factory, the facade, the material was. And one of our design task is try to build up something has relationship with the old between the new and old, but we have to make sure the new also represent the current technology and current aesthetic value. So we actually went through a design process, try to achieve that. And this is one of the early sketches about this war section. So eventually we made up this design decision. We use concrete blocks. It's also a masonry stacking detailing logic. It has a similar scale with the original break. And it has a similar logic about the construction detail because it's all always stacking. But because of the concrete could carry out a different kind of material quality, it can take more light and ventilation, the air into the surface. And to make the inside space has a better quality for living. So from this very early design model, the surface is made of this concrete block, but we try to make the surface light in terms of the sense of weight. And it allows more light and air to go through. And from this appearance, it shows a certain translucency of the materiality. And this is the model in the schematic phase. And then gradually the scale of model is getting bigger because we have to make sure we made the right design decision by making the large scale model. And this model is one-to-one mockup in our office. It's not in the construction site. And we try to use form to test this opacity and also the scale of the material. And then finally we went through this process of manufacture and we actually declined and us try to find a collaborator who is the professional manufacturer, but eventually we failed because of the limit of the budget and also the difficulty of the transportation later on. So at that moment, our client made a very bold but very smart decision that he tried to build up his own factory just right on the site to really make the block by the local people, by the local team. So this, I include several images showing you the process of how we did the study and the research and eventually fabricate this concrete block by the team on the site. They invent some machines, try to pull the block outside the form work. This is the picture showing that particular step. And this is the condition of that small factory and behind is our structure of the building. This is the construction site. This is a typical process. So we have a form work made by PVC and then they have to lay the rebar. It's very thin, but it's almost like a cast in place concrete. And eventually they pour the concrete inside this form work, the mold and then they grind the surface and then eventually to push out this concrete block by this small machine they invented by themselves. And this is the process of stacking. This is actually in the construction site. So there are some very particular thought of this detail. I won't go too much into detail, but you can see how they incorporate the rebar inside the masonry wall and all such effort. So it's a combination of architect together with the local worker, we collaborate together and try to find the solution. And during the process, we always have one architect to really live on the site and working together with the team of the construction. So it's really about a co-working process between the architect with the local workers. And that's the final outcome of the material. Even though it's made by this very heavy material, but because of the process, we try to control a sense of lightness in the eventual result. And that's at the twilight condition when the light comes from inside, it becomes almost like a lantern effect. I will show you a short clip to tell the story about this entire construction process. And this is actually back to 15 years ago when the client went to the site and they take the air balloon to fly to the sky and then look at the site from above. That's the site. So they start the foundation work. They're full of stones underneath the building. It's almost like the extension from the mountain aside. That's the pouring concrete. Install the formwork. We have this large piece of this wood formwork because we're trying to reduce the joint of the construction on the concrete surface. So sometimes the entire space is one formwork. And that's the machine I mentioned earlier, pushing the concrete block outside of the mold. That's actually how we test the strength on site of the concrete block. But of course we have a structure consultant. This is just double check. And that's the topping of the structure. And below at the bottom is the site. And then you can see how beautiful this car stick landscape. And that's the stacking process. And that's myself and our interior designer, Jubeen, on the site. That's the fence work around the compound. He actually knocked off some of the log because they made some mistake. That's the installation process of bamboo shelter inside the building. Jubeen and myself, designing the location of trees. That's actually the opening ceremony back to three years, twenty seven, five years manic firework. It's almost like a battlefield. But very next day, we encountered a big flood in the local area, the Yangshuo County. And the entire county was flooded. And I was told it's almost like the most serious flood during the recent 50 years. So you see this is the road in front of the hotel and it's becoming a river. The hotel actually closed off because the basement is flooded. So they repaired for another three months and after three or four months, they reopened the entire compound. And that's the moment they reopened in the October of the same year after four months of the flood. So no matter how noisy the entire process is, how complicated we go through, eventually it's becoming a peaceful place. I think that's probably the most rewarding moment for architect. I noticed that I probably already exceed the time limit, but please allow me to use another very short video clip to give you a sense about what's the current condition of the hotel compound. That's the reflecting pond in the center of the entire compound. And that's almost like a cathedral, it's the old factory. And that's a cut-in path inside the water pond. This is the hallway connected the front desk room to the typical guest room building walling. So it's an outdoor space covered by the concrete shelter. That's a sequential space inside the new volume. That's the bamboo installation in one of the open terrace inside the new volume. Actually the truss is also from the original structure and we transformed this place into a swimming pool in front of the Lijiang River and looking to the distance of the mountains. And that's the camera flying above the water and look back to the entire compound. So I'm done with this presentation. I think we can leave more time for the further discussion later on. Or I will give the floor back to you. Thank you, Dong-Hong. What an amazing project. What an inspiring presentation. So much to talk about. We will return to comments. I just wanna tell everyone in the audience, please there is a Q&A button. Write your questions and comments down there and we will address them in the discussion session afterwards. We now turn to Wang Hui, co-founder of Urbanis Architecture and Design. Wang Hui is one of the most visionary architectural designers in China working with historic buildings. He's really developed a whole practice around engaging with historic architecture and historic sites. He's a council member of the Architectural Society of China. Also teaches, he's a studio master at the School of Architecture at Tsinghua University and a visiting professor at the Center for Architectural Research and Design at the Chinese Academy of Sciences. As a design philosophy, he's gonna talk a little bit more about that, but he's really developed a whole methodology for balancing the urbanization of China with the new urbanization, with the old historic monuments that are, let's say, absorbed by this urbanization and to explore new spatial solutions to really reconcile these conflicts between the old and new and, in fact, the kinds of urban life that takes place between this new kind of development. Some of his recent projects focus on new ways of revitalizing ignored historic monuments and they've aroused very interesting debates in Chinese historic preservation circles. Some of those examples are the environmental upgrade of the Five Dragon Temple in the Holy Flame Plaza at the Shihu Du Relics. So without further ado, I'll turn the virtual podium over to Wang Hui and thank you for joining us. Yeah, thank you, Prokhev. Thank you for your invitation and your introduction and so let me share this screen. And good morning, everyone. So it's my great honor and pleasure to participate in this column queen. Can you see my screen? Yes. Yes, we can, but it's not the, we see the whole PowerPoint slide. Now, okay, perfect. Okay, okay, all right, yes. Okay, so my presentation is to concentrate on one small environmental design for a very tiny small, so dimension-wise, this heritage is only eight by 14 meters and it was constructed in the year 831, more than a thousand years ago. It was in the end of the Tang Dynasty, which is the highlight of the China civilization. So this tiny building actually, it doesn't seem that much great, but if you don't know Chinese architecture that much, but if I show you this timeline, it is actually occupied a very, very important position of all these kind of existing timber architectures. So it is the second oldest existing timber architecture in China today. And the oldest tallest temple in China. The building is located in Shanxi province, but also if we look at this timeline of the war architecture, it's also very interesting that this timeline actually is in the middle of some, is in between the decline of the Roman Empire and the revival of the city culture in the 11th century of the medieval age. So during this period in the Western world, it is called Dark Age War or whatever. So which means the civilization was almost not there, but in the Eastern world, we have this magnificent impulse. And so this is one of three existing, remaining architecture from the Tang Dynasty. So that's the importance of this, okay? And then what I have done is something like this, then I will raise as a criticism because this thing is too subjective. Well, then that's something I want to discuss this morning of the three words, one is the criticality and another one is heritage. And another one is the involvement. If I am a pure historical preserverist, then it's not a problem just to make something as it works. But since I'm hired as an architect, it seems like I have to do something to it. So this is what I call the involvement and the involvement is inevitable, something very, very subjective. And how can you judge? Your intervention is something right. So that's something of the criticality. So we go back to Kent, you know, in his terminology the criticality is not to criticize something, but it's actually a reflective examination of the validity and the limits of reasoning capacity. So back to this heritage, this heritage actually was not found until the late 1950s. When this temple was relocated to this area because of construction of a reservoir of which will flood the original temple and then this one is relocated in the same county. And then people found another old structure in this village not too far away from this place. So let's say, you know, like the authenticity of this temple, which can be found in this kind of photography is something like this. And in front of the temple, there's a pond or a spring. So then it explains why this temple is called the five dragon or the fifth dragon because dragon is in charge of water. And in the old days, actually this kind of temple of the dragon functions as a weather broadcasting institute. So it's a necessary part of the people's everyday life. And also, you know, the building itself is in the middle of the field is so close to religious daily life. And so this place, because it's very, very remote, and it's pretty hard to access. So even I was educated as an architectural student and in my knowledge of my college I never ever heard about this. And this building was spotted by another gentleman. He, Mr. Dean, he's a senior vice chairman of the big developer, Ban Ki. And he is also a lover of the Chinese architecture. And so he found this place quite interesting, but he told me, you know, like the building is in a bad shape and he invited me to do something good for that. So we met to see this one. And I was with that kind of expectation, such as, you know, like when we read the writings by Walter Benjamin, you know, he will mention the aura. And then, you know, like when you first encounter this building, well, this is the aura like that. So actually it's not something, you know, as you know, you will think this is where he is building, but indeed it's in the backyard. And when you go up to this level, there are two buildings in front of it is a theater stage. And this theater stage was contrasted like in Qing Dynasty, not very long, only like two to 300 years ago. And this stage is to perform plays to please the dragon king in the temple itself. And then you go to the level of the temple, the temple is in such kind of bad shape, okay? So that was not too long ago, is in the year 2013, nine years before, okay? Then after that, you know, we did a proposal how to improve the environment for the local government. And then we didn't hear anything from them. And we heard, you know, the temple itself is restored by the government, by the antique bureau. And then we went to see it again and we saw the new temple like this, although it looks new, but anyway, in terms of condition is much better. But when you go back to the front of the temple itself, it's still a junkyard. And this is something of the environment about them. So we really want to do something and there's an opportunity can, which is the Milan Espo in the year 2015. And the developer, they invited Daniel Liberskin to design a pavilion in the Espo. So after the Espo, this pavilion will be dismantled. And they think they should do something for, you know, to have a legacy of this kind of, of this pavilion and they decided to do a crowdfunding to sell the tiles of this pavilion and to collect the money and to use this money to do a non-project work in China. Because we have this proposal already and we propose to Chairman Ban Ki-wan Shi, Ms. Wan Shi and he blast it. And then, you know, we propose a long plan. Long in Chinese is also called long, which means a dragon. So long plan, we try to use this kind of crowdfunding money and bust, you know, the investment of the bankers company to do something to improve the environment for that period. Okay, so we did lots of things and also this is a good process. Later on I want to discuss in the Q&A session, you know, because probably actually we didn't collect much money but good things that, you know, like, you let lots of people know this building and also, you know, like, you raise people's interest in doing such kind of thing, reserve historical monuments. And then this is the proposal we have and, you know, as our architects, you know, like what we can do is about the space but it's not only about space but also about time. And the space is related time in terms of, you know, like if you provide a longer sequence of the space and then you can prolong the time because, you know, like when we first came to this place the panel is not constructed yet. So we have to, you know, like go across a mountain, so it is almost like a day to be there but when you go to this place, you see this singular building and you stay there for nobody feminist, you know, because you will totally lose your interest of seeing this and then you will leave. So it's not worth that to come. Plus, none of the things like because these are historical monuments and it is impossible for us to do something more and there's also a protection zone for this one. And so the only thing we can do is outside of the protection zone, we slightly increase the original wall for this and then make layers of walls and then create lots of spaces. And then, you know, when you enter this one and so this temple is not encircled by original red wall but it is actually, you know, like encircled by lots of spaces. And another thing is like after doing this, you know, like as right now, you know, it's in retrospect, this project, you know, I have to answer the question why our solution is correct. So I'm borrowing Kent's theory of synthesis to validate my reasoning in three steps, you know, as mentioned by Kent. The first step is synthesis of apprehension and intuition and the second step is synthesis of reproduction in imagination. And the first step is the synthesis of recognition in a concept. And the most important is the third step, which means, you know, like how can you prove what you're doing, your involvement is correct. Okay, so let's see the arrow view of this one. And I do believe, you know, over past a thousand years, you know, this one doesn't change that much, the religion and the temple. But if you lower your eye level, you see this one, it's totally changed. So this is something, you know, like if you have to, when we take the first glance of this one, you know, we have to make a judgment. So what's our intuitive feeling and the discovery of this one? Actually, it's quite simple, you know, as I mentioned, you know, like here, you know, the pond is gone because, you know, in water level and overuse of the underground level. And so the water is gone. Water is gone means, you know, the dragon king is gone. And the plus, you know, in today's material world, you know, we don't live in any kind of spiritual things. And the worst thing is actually, is the historical preservation because when this building is enlisted into the national monuments, and then they build up this wall, and this wall not, you know, actually, is not to fence, you know, some kind of dangerous factors, but actually it fences off the villages. Over the past thousand years, you know, the villagers co-living with this temple by now, they're gone. So then the villagers, you know, made this one, this lower dry pond area as their junkyard. So our solution turned out to be very, you know, clear and very, very intuitive. The sense that, you know, like, we provide this plaza to reinvite people come back and we provide this kind of routes to let people get into the space. Although we still have the fence, we still have the fence wall, but it's accessible. It's unlike before, it's not accessible, whatever. Okay, and so, you know, this kind of mark originally is the center, but then it turned out to be a margin, and then this center comes back. So this is the original picture, and this is later on. And originally, you know, you have to access from this route is not very comfortable. So we provide these kind of steps leading the people going up. And also this is a cave to raise cows or whatever. And then we really introduce this one and clean it up and make this one as a resting place for people together in the plaza. Okay, all right. So, and this picture shows, you know, this kind of program and we're going up over here. And when you go into the space, so we do not allow people to see the building first, actually go to a pre-functional home, something like, you know, space in front of a multifunctional home, whatever. So this is an educational space and it tells you, you know, history of this building and give you sufficient knowledge to let you go to the second phase. Appreciate the building. And then this second space is something like this. So this is a pre-functional space and you go to second space and then immediately you see the building. And this is actually the intuitive feeling when I first stood on the side, I saw this side at the vision of the building. And I think we should use one point perspective to concentrate on this. And then also, you know, on the floor, you create this kind of slightly going up ascending station. So this is my first intuitive sketch and the modeling and so this is the real picture. And this is actually, I'm standing, I was staying here to do the real sketch of this one. So they're quite similar. And then after this space, you have to go access to the MOA itself. How to make this one? At the very beginning, you know, I just put some stones over here because this is a very muddy ground and we put a very small stone to operate. But then, you know, in the construction, we change idea, you just make people step on the stone because this is a place where we're remoteed and not very much people, many people come here. So when you go to this place, it's almost like you are the only visitor. So I want people to listen to the voice of their steps and then you enter the space, you actually not enter a physical space, but it's more or less like you enter into a mental space. Some people also criticize us as, you know, like, so this is more like a Japanese or Korean, something because Japanese, they prefer a white stone. But in it, you know, like later on, this kind of wild flowers will grow and so it will be something like this. Then, you know, so this is the new scenario and this is old one. And we changed the color of the wall before it was in this kind of very sharp red. And but now we make a new material for this one and make, you know, the building very, very much coherent with the surrounding environment. And also we create another axis because in China's traditional architecture, normally there's no like a double axis. It's only like a one axis, but there's no another, you know, crossing axis. But, you know, so that's kind of invention by us also was also criticism for this. And as we mentioned, you know, like in the old days, this theater stage is for the play to please the God inside the temple. So it's not for people, but today, you know, like God is gone and so we do a much wider pavement over here but still leave the original one here, right? And so this is after, okay. And the vision before is only a singular wall and after putting layers of walls, you know, we create this kind of, you know, space after space and we try to use space to make people to stay here longer and to stay here to various different things. And then, you know, they will feel, you know, like lots of interest in staying in the courtyard. And also this kind of session, cross session showing the ascending route and at the very end before it was something like this, you know, you won't see anything outside of the courtyard. Now we provide this kind of observation after me here and then you stay here and actually there's another historical remain over here. So you can see the whole environment. So this is a basic, you know, intuition where we see the site and quickly have a solution. And so this is at the very first step of designing. But then another thing is like as I mentioned before, you know, we can come to this place really, really, you know, the reality is kind of boring. So the second step is actually what I mentioned at the synthesis of reproduction in imagination. And then one thing you can imagine, we came up with the idea of, okay. So since, you know, this building, you know, has such prestigious status in the history of China architecture, why not make it as an open Chinese timber architecture museum? So we infuse all these kinds of places with lots of contents and this contents actually is what we call now is augmented reality. And this augmented reality actually, you know, we can find lots of inspirations such as the tablets in Iran and you know, like people do this kind of one-to-one scale inscriptions for the construction of graphic architecture. So we use the same method to make a one-to-one scale section of the building and also tells all these kinds of gardens, similarities of the buildings. And actually it's done, you know, very hardly by this lady and manually it's not done by any kind of machine. And we also, we don't have any kind of, you know, like equipment to trace the profile of this one. So we just do it in a very stupid way, you know, like we printed in so many different sheets especially in the mountains, there's no a zero size sheet. And so we have to clash all this kind of small sheets together. And then in the end, when you go into the first pre-functional courtyard, not only you see this timeline of China's architecture, but also you have one-to-one scale understanding of the building over here. And so this is a very, very good educational contents about the history. And then secondly, we also have massive spaces and nearby there are so many historical heritage and so we want to make this one as a place, you know, like when you come here, you know, much, much more information about others and then maybe you can render by-store, you can go to somewhere else, you will see more. So we did a mock-up of this kind of exibit and then later on made this one. And to our surprise, you know, like we kind of thought, you know, like the only tourists will be interested in this but actually local people, they're very much engaged in reading all this kind of information, which means you know, actually help them to enrich the knowledge of their homeland. And the thirdly, we do a courtyard for Chinese doggone, this kind of bracket. And so it's elements in the China's theme architecture but when it was put on top of the column, you don't sense, you know, how big this one is but when this one is put on the ground, you know, you have another kind of, you know, this. So we, in this courtyard, we make like four brackets of the oldest Chinese architecture and although it's for educational journal purpose, but actually it's for data map or whatever. So this explains, you know, the augmented reality we did for this reality. And then the next step is to whether, you know, our this kind of involvement is great. You know, we're also very much dubious about this. But, you know, we have to do this kind of synthesis of recognition in a concept. For example, so what the concept is. So for us, I mean, we are doing something rich. So the concept is actually the special justice whether this one is coherent with the environment at the very beginning, we saw the local construction we think, we thought, you know, like the building, the new material should be something like this. But what this one is, you know, in the rendering it looks like the rain or construction. I believe when you do, she will deliver their practice. So those are the real one. But for us, in terms of timing, in terms of lots of things, it's impossible to do this. Then we work with the GRC manufacturer to develop this one. So they're using the form manually to create this kind of textures. But unfortunately, you know, like in the factory, it looks pretty good. But when you put in the real scale, you know, you will see all these kinds of repetitive patterns, which is not, it's too busy. So we have to invite their workers to come to the site. So this thing is done half-halfly by machine in the battery, but also half-halfly by this guy on site. The good thing for this one is actually, it's a paneling system. And actually it fulfills the requirement of historical resolution, which means we use this kind of retractable system. Later on, you know, if we're not doing something correct, so it can also be demolished to return the site back to the original authenticity. And also this is a system which can integrate other artworks in the display, okay? But we are also criticized by this. And I was not quite certain about this until one day during the construction, I went to Spain and I saw this building. To my surprise, at work beginning, I thought, you know, this is done. And then one minute ago, I went back to this building because I realized there's no drawings on the stone. So it's actually all painted. Then, you know, I was pleased because, you know, although we are also doing something like this, but I think, you know, what we're doing is correct. You know, it's not a matter of the force or real construction, it's a matter of something else. Okay. And we will have this kind of materiality in a good relationship with nature, with this environment. And also, you know, we have to re-invite back the bodies before, you know, like local people just do something like this. I mean, you won't, after you go into a temple, you won't feel any kind of respect to these gods. So we ask people to redo this and we have not only the dragon king, but also have four other diatics in charge of lightning, rain, wind, thunder. So it's all about this kind of rain or water stuff. And after we finish this one, we have the outer, we have, you know, like the five gods over here. And the local leader, he came and he was very, very pleased about this. And he gave a very good comments. He said, you know, like after this, you know, the building does not seem very small because actually the building is very small. And the gods do not seem, you know, do not look very, very big, which means, you know, the relationship in terms of proportion and the scale is correct. And of course, you know, the most important thing about the special justice is the co-leaving with the villagers. And so you can see like before, like people even don't have a place to sit. But now, you know, we've got so many places for sitting. And okay, so let me just show two pictures of before and after in terms of the community. So this was before the village does not have a cement road, but similar because, you know, like we sponsor the upgrading of the environment of the temple. And then this one turned out to be a very, very, you know, eye-catching stuff and the local government paid the money to rebuild the road, to pay for the road and also, you know, to paint the buildings, whatever. So before it was a junkyard, but now this is almost happening at the same place. So not only, you know, clean up the space, but also provide lots of public facilities for sporting. And also our long planting, you know, that every year we will revisit the place to check whether it's still in a good condition. And then we do lots of work, we pray to the gods once again, we plant new trees. And so this is like three consecutive years, you know, I meet with the same keepers of the temple. Very interesting. And whenever we come back, we will invite the local theater to come, you know, like to play of the local theater. And of course, you know, it attracts lots of tourists and also it's a place of kids to play now. So it's part of their everyday life. And the long plant also develop into something more, you know, like last year, Ms. Dean helped to establish non-profit foundation and this foundation sponsored something, such as for example, like during our first construction, so we put all this kind of tablets on the wall, but it's not protected by any kind of canopy. So last year, we did a small canopy over here to protect these tablets. So in summary, I have mentioned like three regional steps. It's kind of synthesis approach. And the most important link is the synthesis of recognition in a concept. So I want to compare three different approaches of the historical preservation. And the one, I'm not sure whether it's polite to call it is actually those people, you know, who against us, against our approach, I would call them is dream, fundamental list. What they want is, you know, as fund, you just don't change anything, you know, until the whole thing collapse, you know. So that's not your responsibility. If you add something from memory, something new, you know, then this is your original thing because you don't have a good will to treat the heritage. And the neutral ground is this kind of authoritative measurement in terms of, you know, like what they're doing is something called political correctness. So what they want to do is just simply, you know, like make building sound and make the heritage as it used to be. But as I mentioned, because I'm my role basically is the artist, you know, if I was, I am invited to do something that I have to be involved, then I will call our approach is something like a critical involvement. So we want something is not as it is what was being, but as a becoming thing, you know, because space is in the reciprocal cycling. So it has its past and in our hand is our present, but most importantly, it's the next step, what the future is. So we don't believe, you know, a heritage is in the dead or mummy status. So it's always in the, it's still in the status of a life. So based on this kind of understanding, we actually we have done so many of the historical building or heritage preservation and things, but in general sense, we almost are taking the same approaches. For example, like, so this is old is archeological site with such kind of, you know, like a plaza as a mark of the site, but, you know, it doesn't work for the environment and the way we use, but we cannot demolish this and we use a cable to cover it and to make the thing to dialogue with the nature and the tool allows people's interest to experience this kind of primitive space. So this is a temple in the demolition site and then we rescue this small pavilion over here. And actually, you know, we did not do something like repented or whatever, but we made this kind of permit to make people to sit here and see the environment, whatever. And so this is a warehouse group and we just finished a renovation and turn out to be something like this. But so general speaking, you know, that the all process and the logic behind is about the same. So we want the heritage has is in heritage. Okay, thanks. Thank you for this amazing presentation, this deep dive into the Five Dragons temple, which was just so eye-opening. I knew the project from before, but it just, you gave us a whole new look. So many themes are coming up that are resonating among the presentations. We'll turn to those later. Please a reminder to everyone to put your questions in the Q and A so that we can turn to them after the presentations. Thanks again, everyone. We're gonna turn now to Lu Wenyu, co-founder of Amateur Architecture Studio. Lu Wenyu is an architect and practices with Wang Xu in Amateur Architecture Studio. And together, they also founded the architecture, the department at China Academy of Art in 2003. They have both a practice as architects, but they are also very involved in education. Lu was a visiting professor at Harvard GSD, at MIT, at UCL. So really trying, she's been really trying to build these bridges to the United States and exchanging information about architecture and preservation across from the United States in China. She's completed a number of projects, including of course, but not limited to the Ningbo Historic Museum, the Xiangshan Campus of the Chinese Academy of Art. She's done the preservation and renovation of the Southern Song Imperial Street, the Fuyang Cultural Complex. She's also worked at the renovation of the Wekun Village and the Lian Historic Museum. It's a very long list that I will not get into because of course we've asked our speakers to focus on a small number one or two projects, but of course, their portfolio is very rich and quite deep. So I invite you all to look at that in your own time. I do want to lift up and call your attention to her recognition in the field. She was awarded the Shelling Architecture Prize in Germany and an Honorary Award at the Venice Biennial in 2010. She's been listed among the RIBA's 2015 fellowships. She was the recipient of the 2019 Gold Medal of Tao Sigma Delta and she's also very involved in service in preservation and recently as the juror for the UNESCO Asia Pacific Awards for Cultural Heritage Conservation. We're very pleased to have Lou when you with us and without further ado, I'll turn over the virtual podium to her. She's going to be speaking in Chinese and will be translated by one of her assistants who is next to her right there. We see half of them. So thank you both for joining us. I'll turn it over to you. How are you? How are you? How are you? How are you? How are you? How are you? How are you? How are you? How are you? Can you hear the, can you see the presentation? It looks great. Thank you. Thank you, Jess. I use Chinese to speak. Today, I would like to talk about two projects. We completed in parallel, one in the city and the other in the countryside. What can architects do for the future? How do we do it? And do we have a choice? What is the future of the city? What is the future of the countryside? Can I change anything? What's the future of the city? What's the future of the countryside? What can we change? These are also the questions we need to think about before we start the project. The Southern Song in Pearl Street, a main street built for the capital of the Southern Song dynasty, it has a history of 800 years. It was in a state of broken and disrepair. I will talk about the main strategy we used when we designed this project. During this project, we introduced some unusual concepts of historical street preservation. We believe that all of what formed from Southern Song dynasty until today belongs to the history and anything valuable should be protected. It was not suitable to choose a style from a certain time in history and to adopt it in the entire street. This is the common practice before we start this project, how the government treated all the other streets. We eventually influenced the local government's decision making. We should preserve everything as we could. We did a lot of research, investigation and planning. We suggest the government to only make new buildings instead of fake and teak. And design small buildings of the right scale in the right place. To re-establish new street forms to revive the whole neighborhood. We tried to reconnect the local culture in an innovative way. These photos show what we did in this project. In order to maintain the diversity, we invited 24 groups of architects from multiple architecture school and institutes to join the design. Our studio was responsible for designing the entire streets with buildings up to two-story including some small buildings, paths and water system. We introduced water into the street and increased the number of trees to change the small environment and the micro-climate of the street. In order to maintain the daily life of the locals, we proposed that the resident should not be forced to move and renovate the streets. In order to maintain the daily life of the locals, we proposed that the resident of the existing streets should not be forced to removed. So this project later influenced the government to develop a new policy instead of forcing the residents to move out. They encouraged those who are willing to move out and allow those unwilling to preserve their own land and their own land and their own land. And allow those unwilling to preserve their homes to follow their own wills. In fact, this strategy was very successful. However, it increased the difficulty of design and implementation. This is the actual situation at the time. You can see that residents and staff at the same time appeared on this street. However, it made the design and implementation more difficult than usual. So these photos show during the construction, the life still goes on. This project started in 2007, and completed in 2009. Fifteen years later, those design methods, renovation strategy, and concepts have further influenced decision-making of many government authorities. The design and implementation of the design and implementation of the design and implementation of the design and implementation of the design and government authorities and the architects across the country have influenced many policies of different government. The second project is about the renovation of Wenchuan Village. Wenchuan Village is a typical and inconspicuous little village away from the city within two hours' drive. This is before the renovation. Before, the old village was demolished and built this kind of new building was shown in the picture. How we design a new village after we participate in this project? How to design and build a new village? And how to protect and renovate the old village? And how we can sustain the culture? In terms of planning, we continue the foundation of the old village and the density. The strategy we adopted at the planning level to continue the old village fabric and the density. The old buildings are preserved while the awkward new buildings built by the villagers have been demolished and rebuilt. The new village on the other hand is a continuation of the form that grew up from the old village. Furthermore, cars could drive through and every household is equipped with one parking space provided a necessary condition for the new way of life. At the architectural level, we persuade the local government to change the land use policy and add an additional courtyard to each new-built house in the village. To avoid over conceptualization of the design, we developed 24 types of courtyard house variations corresponding to the rich and the diverse lifestyle. The building materials were all sourced locally and the local building techniques were used. So that the local craftsmen naturally joined the building process. The most interesting thing is that from the beginning of the construction, the neighboring village began to imitate our material and the building techniques. So during the process, we actually applied a new method through three steps. So step one, we use a professional urban construction team to implement the construction of new village at the fastest speed with high quality stands and quickly establish a tangible example for the villagers. This is the built new village. So step two, during the construction and the renovation, the professional construction team was responsible to organize and guide the local villagers to implement the construction in order to teach them how to build during this process. So this photo shows the status before the construction. So on the right side of this photo shows the step two. So the left side is the step three. So the step three is that the other villagers will use the construction drawings we designed to build their own house which will complete by them. So the step three is still in progress. So the result is still unknown. Thank you. We are looking forward to see the complete of step three. Thank you. Thank you so much, Lu Wenyu for that amazing presentation and for putting on the table the whole question of working with local government to change land use policy as you rethink the ways in which you deal with traditional architecture and vernacular architecture which is of course part of a major aspect of historic preservation how do you preserve that and move it forward. Super interesting, again tremendous amount of overlaps here between the previous presentations that we'll get over in our discussion session which is coming right up. But first we have our last presenter who is a Chinese Canadian born in Fuzhou who grew up in North America and traveled more than 50 countries and regions before starting our practice with her she has a tremendous international perspective which really informs her research into digital technologies for conservation interpretation and dissemination of cultural heritage she is the creative director of Tsinghua's Heritage Institute for Digitization she is the vice president of RE International Center for Digital Creativity and the founder of FX Cultural and Creative Studio and to be continued she has working experience in various public and private cultural institutes for international and national projects and in 2017 she returned to China to join the digital Yongming Yong project led by Professor Guo Daihing of Tsinghua University and that's when she began her affiliation with Tsinghua's Heritage Institute for Digitization of course the Yongming Yong is known to everyone around the world for being destroyed by French and British troops and known to everyone also is Victor Hugo's famous denunciation of that act by the French and the British against his own government which led him to have to go into exile in fact all of his criticism of his own government so that will be known to many people because of that and of course the work that she's done to restore that digitally has been really groundbreaking and gives us access to what that garden was before that destruction currently she's responsible for the full circle of experience design and content research and value assessment to artistic interpretation and technical implementation of these interpretive projects she's also in charge of international communications in exchange she is one of the core developers of the digital exhibition system for cultural heritage and has participated in designing developing and implementing more than a dozen national patents and original content in 2021 very recently she founded the FX cultural and creative studio which is dedicated to sustainability and the use of cultural heritage assets according to the current needs of people and places resources and knowledge so without further ado I'm going to turn the virtual podium over to Pei Wei Yi Chloe. Thank you Thank you so much Can you hear me? Yes we can hear you. So I I'm just going to quickly share the screen and well good evening and good morning everyone no matter where you are right now in the world and for those who stay up late with us and I will try to make this as interesting as possible so there was me a little bit more longer and again I want to express my gratitude once more for inviting me to this venture colloquial and to join this very inspiring part of the conversation and I think for the past all the panelists that we had previously we heard a lot of perspective from the architects from the creators and the interpreters of the space where the space and the building is acting as a medium and the moderator in the sense to bridge in between the past and the present and also the amplifier for the local characteristic and the heritage and coming from background as a curator and interpreter also as storyteller I want to shift the focus a little bit more towards someone who inhabit and operates in a heritage space and then how do we using content and experience driven methodologies to revitalizing that space and also to contributing to community building and then identity building and then just to forming the bomb between people and then also to encourage the conversation between people using heritage as a tool so but nevertheless that we should start with something in some place that's concrete so let's begin with this photographs I believe that if you followed just by a little bit about the past Winter Olympic which actually was very recently and then today is actually the opening of the Paralympics Winter Olympics so amazing event came across a photo shoot like this and then varied striking images of a slender figure of the athletes just flying very light air and then agile almost and wowed in the background is very rigid and then also varied robust concrete structure coming from the industrial you may first wonder as industrial site and then that's actually causing many people to wonder and foremost let me clear it out that this is not a nuclear plant but what you're looking at if we zoom out a little bit is one of the largest industrial heritage remains of one of the well the largest steel plant in China if it's not in the world and we can see it from this this aerial view that the big air shogal which is the structure that's built for this Winter Olympic is located at the downed lower left corner where it's basically adjacent to four cooling towers in front of it you will see a large pile that was used as a cooling facilities for the steel and iron making process and next to it on the other end of the pond you'll have the National Center for Winter Training which is turning also adapt and reuse project from the previous factory line and then you also got the Winter Olympic committee where they work at the north end of the park and then right now and then you also see it towards the horizon there is really like a green mountain and that's the Shenzhen mountain and also give the name to the district and then beside is also the river so the Yongding river that's basically embracing the entire site and so it's a very unique combination of nature and industrial heritage and what we've seen is actually only one fourth well a quarter of the site and the entire site is stretching over the land of 8.63 km2 and if we wanted to get some perspective it's about 2.5 times of the Central Park in New York so if we zoom out a little bit more putting the context of the city of Beijing what you can see right now is that Shogun Park is located out where on the map circling in red and that is on the west extension of Chang'an street and which is that big avenue that runs in front of the Tiananmen Square and what you can see at the center of course is the historical center of Beijing and then just spreading from the center you see and almost cross like which actually it's the axis that defining the city and you see the north and the axis that runs on the north and south direction and that's actually the historical central axis by the one that's in the progress of the destination of the UNESCO heritage site it's along this axis but then we also see one that's running west and east on that direction and on the on and this direction is where being designated as the economy and also the cultural axis of Beijing and where you can see that on the east far end and that's where the new administrative capital of Beijing where all the admins and the government sectors they're moving towards that new town and then on the west is where we see that the new landmarks of the capital of cultural revival which is the Shogang industrial heritage park and so basically under this entire new urban overall urban master plan of revitalizing the west end using culture as catalyst and we actually being invited to Shogang and then as one of the catalyst and what we've been given is basically one of the single space located at the very north and if you can see it from the legend down at the bottom left corner and where I put that golden pin there and that's where so basically it's just adjacent to the Winter Olympics where and then also very close to what we call the five ring and they have the the metros running around it and so this road of Silo is actually among the first built structures on the side of Shogang and then but the Silo itself right now is built in 1992 and then it's a pure concrete structure that's used to store raw materials before they going into the smelt linked process and so here it's a very interesting space where you can also see from the inside that the space has undergoes a little bit of renovation and also rehabilitation because of its adjacent to the Winter Olympic Winter Olympic venue that this entire road of Silo's are dedicated to the golden sponsors of Olympic Games so if you can see it that the first two are actually the 5G broadcasting studio of the Tenzing Sports and then next to it's a big data bank for the data restoration and then after that you see antasports and then also so this is actually very creative it's a so-called zone where all the golden sponsors of the Olympics are situated and they are working crates on the side as well but all of the side of other Silo's has been renovated and the interior has been changed to adapt the new functions as office space but only Silo 4 remains its original structure so you can also see from here that it's actually divided into if we can using the concept of floor then the first floor is actually the heritage space where it's kept its original concrete structure and then the second level and the third level it's all built on a cantilever structure which allows the bottom level to be basically structural free so that it's not supporting the floors above and the floors are hanging up from a very huge steel structures on the ceiling so those two floors are added to giving more useful space within the Silo's but it does have a striking interior atmosphere towards compared to all of the rest and this is actually the only Silo that's been kept in its part of it been kept off its original condition that's open to the public on the side of Chauvin Park at the moment and so when we first get into the space and then what we were envisioned is as an incubator and also as something that we will be able to use it as a studio but also running tests and because we've been really straight focused in the field of digitizations the integration between digital technology and cultural heritage and we know that some of the things that we do is quite new and in order to persuade the stakeholders to proceed on this particular direction there is more proof than we needed than just a PowerPoint or like a good story so prototype is very important to us and not only so but we are also particularly interested in the relationship between the audience and the contents and so basically using a 2C mindset to dealing with exhibition content and not using the narrations from upper above but trying to connect it with the audience and see what exactly are they looking for in an exhibition like this so we're basically trying to utilizing the space by three major parts I mean the functions functional wise by using it as a digital creative experience center where people can come in and then they can try new things but also as a community service where we were using it as a platform and a bridge to bridge in different disciplines and then to bridge in different fields so that they have a space where it's not that rigid but it actually encouraged creativity and open-mindedness and last but not least and this is one of the very important function where we're using it as R&D collaboration and also project incubations and then and because our close relationship with the audience we are actually able to run much frequent user evaluations and then to get direct feedbacks from the people that we encounter so so compared to many of other projects that we've done no matter is the library I mean the museum projects or the historical projects or adapt and reuse projects the things that we try in the silos are the center that we're talking about the international centers for digital creativity it's much more experimental if we can say it and we're trying to using a lot of things we're trying to actually experiments on installations and on different artistic representations we're trying to experiencing on working with irregular forms and then also you can see that this is how the interiors are for that the heritage space that it has a concrete comb at the bottom of the silo and then this is actually a really interesting thing because this is a storage barn as we know and then so the iron ore and the raw materials other raw materials they're actually been loading from the top so this entire silo is free of windows there's no windows except for a loading dock from at the top so there's an opening at the top and then they were throw the raw materials down so one of the reason being that for the iron melting process there's actually a very strict standards in terms of the size and mass of the raw materials but many of the raw materials during their transportation they are self-flammable so they have to be transferred on the open cartridge on the train which often causing the material to clot and then so they need the gravity to basically shatter those materials once again and then having this shape at the bottom of the silo actually helps the basically the material to fill the space better in terms of the mass and the volumes and you can also see that they are really like metal plates that's on those cones and just imagine that this water pouring down from the top of the and the water will basically deviate throughout and it's the same thing that goes with the raw materials and so you can see that we are trying to do a lot of artistic installations and then representations here and just two experiments on the way that we can do in terms of story in terms of narrating in terms of visual representation of the cultural heritage and this is the one that a text run that we did for one of the 40 scenes in the Yanmingyuan and this is Wulin Chunze basically directly deriving from the very famous poetry and full of peach blossoms so we've been working with lights and sounds and also a very calligraphy and almost like Chinese painting sort of representations instead of a very realistic rendering of the site and to see how to give how to represent the site can we give another layer of storytelling to help people to better conceive that ideas and then there's also a top level which it's almost on the other and so it's almost like divided from the bottom bottom space where we will be able to host many activities and having a close relationship with the audience so just to quickly show a little bit so that you can actually walk so you can see the exterior of the silos and people actually this isn't how we're getting to it so basically you're going from the outside and then the entire space is circular and this is basically the heritage space where you can see that we leave it as it is so this is completely untouched and then just from its original conditions and then so and also just to take advantage of that natural where they don't have light and we turn the exterior into an immersive space where we can the audience can appreciate the original texture and the spatial experience but also the extra information is the digital layer which lay on top of that really intricate space and then we're trying to generate something that's almost like creating a dialogue between the actual physical space and the content that's projecting on top of it and previously you can see that there is one thing where there are rocks falling down from it and that's why that's one of the programs that we're generating using digital to imitating the previous function of this silo but in a more creative way and just to help the people understand what the original function has been and so all the content that you've seen right now is some of the other exhibition that we did and transferring our previous research results into the experience that can be facing the public inside and we did the one with the viewing end and you can see that in the previous there is like a big water mill almost that's been casting on the cone and that's actually one of the things that we did for the water structure of the Yangnye and also the one that we did for the center axis of Beijing so we did a lot of experiments on that experimenting the idea about digital twins and also to stepping a little bit further into how do we implementing the digital content and how do we taking advantage and then of the space but also working with the limitation of the space to making the content versatile and then trying to figure out best practice for narrating and seeing how people responding with the different method that we're telling the stories and so while we've been invited into the park it has been over about two years now and then we actually bring many big culture IPs into the west end of the cities but again again we're coming back and thinking that it will be invaluable and it will also be necessary for us to explore exactly the value of the location itself because it is unique as it is and it also gives that gives that how did you put it, it's that the rights of being here the existence, the rights of this existence and then so that's why at the one year anniversary of the founding of our center we launched the project of having a special exhibition dedicated to the content of Shobong and then so the interesting thing is that we know that it is a huge, huge complex and then we know that it has a very, very long history but it's the more we know about it the more that we understand that it's so much more than just a still plan, it's so much so much more. I mean the complex it's starting out from a very, very little still planned and then actually it's iron plan at the time it doesn't have the capacity of making still back in 1919 so it just celebrated its centennial anniversary three years ago and so during that process it went through a war it went through social turbulence and it becomes one of the first manufacturers to back in work after the war and then start to making productions and then at first it couldn't but then there's also endeavors making technical advancements and so gradually it runs from a very small iron factory to one of the top in China that can easily produce 8 million tons of stills per year and also be one of the first to launch its own stock and also one of the first to have its own bank and to basically managing the entire entire company using the modern management system and also went through a lot of and it's also the testing ground for many of the really renewal reform in terms of business modeling and everything like that and so when people working in it, it's not just a factory it is a society where you can see that the service they have ranging from education so from kindergarten all the way to college that's like a technical specific college that trains workers that can go back to either the steel factory or metro system which has been extremely popular by then they have their own set of supplying system which means that they actually owns farms and they owns ochars they owns basically farm in the sea actually so they have their first hand resources of many of the products and they only serve to their own workers and then they also have realistics so the company develop realistic around its plant for their workers and they not only have realistic they also have retirement homes they have hospitals and grocery stores and everything basically and the entire different set of entertaining systems where it's just serving their own own workers so after learning all this and then it started realizing that this is this is a society this is a society that has influencing many people many people spend their lives in it and for a company as big as this it's inevitable that it's involving so tightly with the history of the country and especially that it's the steel production and it feeds its products feed into all the major construction that's happening in the capitals as well as around the entire country so the rise of the company is inevitable but also the the turning point is also very dramatic in the sense that it is Olympic believe it or not because when Beijing first owns the rights to host it the 2008 Olympics the entire issue of environmental environment friendly and then also about the clean air and everything being brought to the table and of course a big still plan like this it's a lot, it's a pollutant and then it's a source of pollution so then that leads to one of the largest migration of a singular factory and then that disburning to all over the country there are people that's moving out of the cities and there are thousands of families, their lives are changing and then but at the same time Shogang is also producing the at the same time they also producing the materials that goes into all the major structures for the Olympics back in 2008 so it's very moving it's a very moving history if you look into it and then how it was much wanted and then no longer wanted but then again become a new source of inspiration at this turn of the century where the Winter Olympics again chosen the site and then bring back all the lives and then give it another phase and then now it's basically one of the example of social urban renewal and also industrial renewal so when we look at this and we started realizing that our audience is going to be complex it's not just for people that's new but it is a contemporary heritage where much of the people who are involved in its entire history are still alive and there are various stages of their lives but there are also people who never know, don't know about it because it move out if you're born after that then you probably don't remember of seeing still mill in Beijing so when we're doing our audience basically the audience profile at the very beginning we are considered this as something that's long time no see but also nice to meet you it means that there are people who are going to find nostalgia for the concept but there are also people that come in to learn about the new things what we're trying to do is to create common memories for them to generating platforms where they can start the conversation so some of the strategy that we do and then it's quite interesting now to think about it it's one of the actually this is actually one of the very first promotion threat that we did and we basically releasing it on the May the 4th which is the youth day the celebrating of youth and we make a small comic if you're interested that I can post the link in the in the diagram and so that you can have a look at it so this is basically a small where we make an avatar we basically we are creating a character but we intertwining his life with the rise and fall of the company so he is also experienced as he grow older and it's also where he's feeling confident the company is rising where he feels lost and stressed there's also a parallel making between a human being and the fate of the company and this is a way that we're trying to bring people to feeling the warmth of the content and what is interesting of the result of this one is that we receive a very intensive response and then from people that's coming from all over the age and then this is when we're realizing that we've been thinking about the nostalgia part too easily because depending on when debate involving into get involved into the into the story they're actually having different mindset basically they can have very proud respondent to our story but they can also have a bit of sweetness of feelings so this is also that when we start to realize that we need to get something not as a statement but as a platform where people can come and as well as said basically they establish their common beliefs and the common knowledge of the content and then they can basically moving on and then having the space as an opportunity where they can generate conversations it's cross-generation conversation between the parents and the kids it can also be between the grandparents and their children's that they haven't been talking about so this is one of the strategy that we do for this particular project and over time I see you yeah so I'm actually just going to quickly wrap up then because the what we did is actually I'm just going to run through this what we did is actually a system where it consider a permanent part and the temporal part of the of the exhibition where the permanent part is the one that we said about setting up that baseline where everyone the basic idea whether they want to get the fundamental informations for them to generate the conversations so the one that we did is basically the history of the Shogun Park but also using the perspective of an iron ward so we want to take some time for presentation or discussion do you think you could wrap up and absolutely I'm just going to wrap up right now so for that basically for the for the entire journey so this is a way so that we're navigating through the entire entire complex and the other part is the temporal part which we changing monthly and each month we generating a new thing so that people can come in and then using the theme as a catalyst to connect different part of Shogun inside that same story so I'm just not going to talk about the rest because this is basically some of the temporal one that we did and then also the one we did during the Winter Olympics but just to show some statistic at the very very end about the approaching so we did and then some of the things that we may be able to do when we become so close with the audience is we can have the statistic to show us how effective is our strategies and one of the things that we are really feeling delight of is that it does attract people from a side of the city and then in fact that over 70% of the audience are coming from outside of the district which actually basically it's aligned with our strategy of revitalizing this part of the city and then attracting other people from other cities to come to here and then experiencing the different kind of vibes here and that's it and hopefully that everyone who's in Beijing I warmly welcome you to our site and so that I can give you a little bit more about the backgrounds. Thank you so much. Thank you Chloe, thank you very much. I'm going to invite everybody that all of our presenters to turn their screens back on so we can turn over to our conversation we now have about half an hour left. First of all just thank you all for these amazing presentations there's just so much there and to unpack I know it's late for you so I appreciate you staying up late into the night I think it's almost 1am in the morning so again thank you so many themes that are linking up over here in terms of your practices and I want to also return to some of these the larger context in which all this work is happening right like we have become accustomed to thinking about architecture preservation architecture in China as new construction but what you are showing us is the possibility that preservation is now at the heart of a new thinking about development about a new thinking about not only urban development but community development and a kind of development that is not reliant upon necessarily a tabula rasa clearing the ground and starting anew so I wanted to turn to Wang Hui very quickly because you laid out this idea of a critical involvement as becoming there is this sense of understanding heritage as a continuity I think this was something that came through in all of the projects that you as designers are deeply involved in the act of taking the past and making it relevant into the for the present and so in that there is a questioning of what is the present what does the present need and how are you trying to change the present there was something in your presentation that I think resonated with all of the presentations that really pointed to the fact that there is something missing in these historic sites many of them have lost their original function you showed us the temple of the five dragons had no long you know there wasn't a kind of religious practice that was organized around it anymore and so the water was missing and so you reactivated it so this question of reactivating through design and reconnecting to community to me is very important and I wanted to hear a little bit more from you and all of the panelists about the skill sets that you bring to the table to be able to make that connection because of course we always centered design but many of you talked about connecting to community and certainly in my education as an architect that was not part of my skill set you know to understand the methods of working with a community so how did you do that how did you learn that how did you know what are you you were talking about collaborating with other architects the notion of collaboration so I'll turn it over to one we first to talk about that how you how you connect with community and also tell us more about this notion of spatial justice as a way of you know of working that's a super interesting concept and we want to know how you're thinking about it and I'll be reading also please those that are in the audience put your questions in Q&A and I'll be reading them all okay thanks for a very very critical and a good question yeah so first I want to go back to spatial justice you know like because we're architects so we're doing something of spatial so spatial is our means of changing the world we have to use the space or you know something related to space to change the world and another thing is the justice justice is the concept you know maybe you know originally you can go back to Plato when Plato's you know the dialogue the republic the first thing is about justice justice in the old days is about something else but today justice is whether there's fair distribution of resources between you know different parties so this is this kind of fair distribution is more important today for example right so let's say you know China is under the urbanization and so this is the reallocation of the interest you know are fit between different parties so who is the powerful and who is palace you know so this is the first thing you know artists should be very much sensitive about so normally you know like for instance so it's a big topic so let's go back to the historical heritage such as the temple they work out actually we are continuing working on that so the temple has its original function meaning whatever but all these kinds of meanings are gone so we cannot go back to the old days but the temple also has its own function today so this function is not related to its original art so that's why I think we should use those kind of augmented reality reinterpret or to reclaim this kind of thing because today for example like the villagers they go to the city as a worker as a construction worker whatever so there are no more passes and after they came back to the village they only give their own house each house is quite big very wealthy but then the public space is a left over now you know like if we want to revitalize this temple so actually we play a role of reestablishing some kind of justice so the justice is to make a balance between the private and the public and this public space if we don't restore this public space and then there's no spiritual center in the village so when we do this kind of temple so we are not going back to the societies but actually we are going back to sort of you know as a spirit we want to bring people together so there are also lots of other means for example like I didn't mention you know like I persuade it is publisher in China to donate over thousands of books in the temple so the kids you know normally families are not poor but they don't spend money in buying books so then we have a small library there so we want to invite kids out of the school so they can gather in the temple so just like their ancestors you know like so they gather in the temple but they were gathering in the temple to pray for the rainwater but now the kids you know like maybe they encounter some great books and later on they will not stay in the village they will you know like in their future so maybe they will tell okay so something you know I know actually I knew and actually originated from this temple from that book so the place the location time whatever they are all you know like merged together as something you know like with a certain kind of power but this power cannot happen in public space I will definitely you know this power is a public space so to restore the heritage is not to go back to its original authentic aura but to create something make an augmented reality or augmented aura so my last word is you know according to Ben you know like some kind of heritage that either has its racial value or its display of value I think this both are important and most importantly you know we should really establish such kind of values according to our time to bring to our contemporary needs I'll turn it over to Lu Wenyu who did a lot of work with the community there's a question on the from Zee Hao Zhang that ties to this asking you know you mentioned that in the Southern Song Dynasty Royal Street project you promoted local policies to encourage aboriginal people to stay well aboriginal people I think he means local residents to stay at the place instead of kicking them out and he's asking did you think the strategy before you started the project or did this come through the work itself as you as you did the project this idea so this project is very complicated so I almost close our studio after this project after the government accepts our suggestion that the locals could stay or move by their own wills then we accept this project but we find it's we made a very big difficulty for our self and so this suggestion before is actually before the start of this project so we discussed the government a lot about the strategies to encourage people stay or how can we move how those who are willing to move out how this strategy could work and so we could for example we will offer a larger house for the people who are willing to move out then the house will move out and then the house will move out and then the house will move out and then the house will move then the house will empty out for some local commercials which is related to the street life but the old house actually live many families are lived in the old house we want to give the government a lot of ideas to tell them what to do some of them are willing to stay and some of them are willing to move out so we will give the local government some suggestions how to deal with this situation for example, some families who are willing to stay will move to the neighboring house which have some empty place so the government knows that the street will be more valuable after the renovation so they are waiting to offer the people more than usual so as a result almost half of the local residents are willing to move out and moving into the new place some of them stayed but after the renovation some of them are regretting leaving the neighborhood after the renovation some of them are regretting leaving the neighborhood after the renovation after the renovation some of the people moved out actually regret he wants to talk about other things that's it one of the follow-up questions that I have for all of you but especially Lu and you and also Donggong maybe I'll turn it over to you the projects you all showed were amazing and they are really seemed like the tip of the iceberg and I wanted to ask you to what degree are these projects in your mind the exception or the rule of what is happening in China today the rebuilding of rural villages for example in Lu Wenyu's examples or Donggong in your own work this project which is so unbelievable this industrial relic this historic building which is completely looks like from the images in the middle of nowhere and is being reimagined for this what looks like a pretty high-end hotel tourist destination is this the exception in terms of when you take when you go look broadly what's happening in China today is this the exception or do you see a pattern here that this is your part of a larger movement to rediscover these heritage sites and to create a new kind of tourist industry within China Lu, you go first or I can go ahead Donggong you haven't spoken yet and then we can turn it well based on my personal observation I do have to say that the situation is undertaking a very dramatic change here in China because if you go back to for example 15 years when you ask the government or the real estate developer or some private owner about how they value their trees from their old time for example this building heritage I think it's not quite a satisfied period of time because under the tremendous pressure from this drastic urbanization seems like people are more interested in this quantity and speed but this is a situation back to for me it's before the Olympic it's about before the 2008 but between 2008 almost like 2015 my personal experience of dealing with these clients and also the authorities has been I can sense the change because I guess there are two reasons first of all the speed of the development in China is slowing down a little bit so we have a little bit free space to rethink about what we have done in this urban including suburban or rural area are we doing things fits the real comfort and the quality of the regular life I think that's not only about the architects discussion it's the entire social concern from 2008 to 2015 and within the seven or eight years I think there are some very exemplary projects coming out even though it's a small number but it's very influential so in the recent 2004 years I feel when we communicate or negotiate with the government or client it's less and less barrier in terms of how we see the old stuff so I see a good change but it's not perfect yet I have to say each project depends on different situation architect is still in a role of this pressure and kind of passive so what amazed me today from especially from Lu Wenyu's presentation I think their effort is trying to get deep into this the mechanism of the revitalization of a place it's not the traditional role of designing space and form and I can imagine how tremendous effort and endeavor architects have to pay but I really appreciate that and this is something I feel very difficult as my personal practice 2008 of course was also the financial crisis and how much of that impacted in your mind the turn towards preservation I think that's the reason why the entire economic in China it's slowing down a little bit and that might be a good thing in terms of how people value a place of time and building with time to the preservation issue so sometimes it's always good and bad together I appreciate you focusing on Lu Wenyu's work and I'm going to ask that of everyone on the panel what did you find was a discovery or a valuable discovery in each other's work and I know you're very familiar with each other's work but I'm sure today going deep into one of these projects maybe there was something that stood out to you so I want to make sure to hear that from you should I start first? of course anybody so other than I've known from many venues but actually today I was pretty much surprised by seeing how to make the concrete block outside so that's part I'm pretty much amazed and for Lu Wenyu she mentioned when she took the project and she asked the local leader this is great historically can trace back to the Song dynasty but she asked them to give her the right not to do anything historically but everything should be in a contemporary way and for the last one because also Lu Wenyu has already diluted my memory of this but I was very much impressed because when she when she doing that kind of video and stuff digitally it's not that kind of pretty much concrete image but I remember vividly about that flower like a water or whatever so that kind of new things about history so that's something as an audience I would expect Lu Wenyu I think today because I've seen Wang Hui and Donggong and this is called Bei they are all original and Wang Hui is a historical heritage and a also a industrial heritage in Beijing because I've been doing the heritage in the Asia-Pacific region and the new design and protection I think we are all discussing some of the issues I saw many projects related to the industrial heritage also the cultural heritage from Donggong's project Chloe's project and also Wang Hui's project I'm actually the jury member of the UNESCO Preservation Awards in the recent two years so we are I'm looking very closely to this kind of project how to make new architecture in the industrial region I think we have been discussing these years so the topic of industrial and relates the new designs into the heritage site is a very hot topic in the recent two years I personally think good heritage should be based on good innovation only innovation can be passed on so I think the good way to pass on the culture is only by innovation and creativity the simple imitation is only a dead end so I'm very happy to see all the three architects using their own method to participate into the heritage also using new materials in a very different way so I think we should consider the materials in a very different way like concrete blocks also GRC panels so I think good design including the protection of heritage should still be in the details so I think the good design should take into the last details of materiality also construction thank you I turn it over to Chloe to reflect on the other panelists oh yes I absolutely second Professor Lu's comment on there has to be innovations in making the longevity of the heritage and I also particularly fond of the last statement about three classification of the three attitude towards heritage structures and then I absolutely found that interesting in a way that I think there is a difference because I myself I also have an architectural background but I'm a conservation architect so I was trained a little bit differently in the sense that somehow in this particular field I felt that people are pulling back a little bit and then it's a more conservative approach and if you put it nicely they like to say it's a humble approach where it's less about the personal and it's more about the heritage but I think that it's not really whether or not it's a personal statement or not but whether or not you will be able to taking the responsibility of making a critical assessment of that heritage structure and then making taking the effort of guarantee its longevity for the future generations and that means change and that is actually going to be a very critical change not just simply by altering it or just simply by inserting new materials and I think one of the questions that I saw in the Q&A session where it's addressing and asking about the future of digital preservation and I think that I also second that that it's changes needed it's not a mirror imitation of what is left digital is never meant to be an exact copy of the physical it is actually a process of thinking because it is us the human who make those things we make each single decisions it doesn't really matter if we build in the reality or we build in the digital realm but we are the one that making that choices and we are the ones that's processing all the informations and either the architecture whether or not it's a virtual ones or a physical one it is the manifestations of human genius in the sense that if we did not continue if we did not making that expression of our current era how can we be represented from the future point of view if we are so timid and sitting back so I think this is something that also in parallel to respond to that particular questions and it's just that also my greatest respect to all of the panelists the great masters for having that courage and having that taking the responsibility of stepping forward of making the attempts and then of making the active assessments and to to basically contribute in the continuity of the cultural relics and I think honor to be a part of this conversation thank you so much. You raised the question of responsibility and there's a question from professor Erika Avrami that dovetails well into that she asks following on the comments about how the past is instrumentalized by the present in what ways are architects accountable for transferring certain ideas and values of heritage and knowledge over others through form, material and process how do designers and design practice or reconcile the choices about what is deemed to be significant or not when not all publics not all members of the community might agree Donggong is that something that you would like to take up? I mean when there's conflict how do you take sides in those interpretations have you had experiences like that? Well I guess this might be relevant to the specific cases for me actually each place when you design architecture or there's an intervention of architecture it has a line of time already existing you can see this is the life of a place no matter it's a building heritage or it's topo it's nature it's all the conditions it's a kind of existing condition and for me there's not much the difference when I consider a tree or there's a building the new architecture has to take care of things on the site but there might be some special cases this is also my curiosity to Longquist project because when the significance of the building heritage it's above a certain level this might be more complicated factors will be involved if we make a comparison between my project my building I have to face is only with 60 or 70 years of history so it might not be that much classified by government and it's not protected by law so it's up to the architect's decision or the client's decision and sometimes it's very brutal I have to say but we do have some legal freedom to deal with that but the case of Wang Hui which is my personal curiosity I guess because that building as he just presented it's the second oldest building from the Tong dynasty throughout the national history so there must be regulations I guess because this is in terms of the history, the level of the importance it has to be some very complicated procedure that architect has to face if you want to do some innovation in this very sensitive site this might not be the answer directly responding to that question but this is definitely my curiosity I have known this project for a long time I read a lot of articles but still I'm very actually I appreciate the architects you know it's a very brave intervention and it must be a lot of fight I guess or battle between architects and all the whatever so question yeah of course okay actually you know like this is the biggest criticism because if this is just ordinary temple it's fine but this is such a prestigious historical heritage okay so my answer is actually very very simple why this building you know before you know it was less known even for me as an artist with certain kind of knowledge I never ever read this building in my test book but now simply because if I say in this way it was not so trouble for me because of my intervention then this building turned out to be known by many many people and actually over a hundred thousand people visitors have been to this place after reconstruction of this environment so this will go back to you know like the question of the spatial justice number one I said what we have done is something retractable I mean because we are using this kind of framing system so it's almost like a set design if because we do not damage the foundation that much and also before we started our construction we do some kind of archaeological attack whether there is something important on the ground and then we have foundation because it's a framing system so it's just a set design and then I will definitely believe in my generation what I have done honestly is something we introduced this heritage to work because before our intervention it was less known but I definitely hope after maybe not only 50 years but even 5 years 15 years whatever if there is something smarter or more appropriate or after this stage people may not necessarily want to see this kind of dramatic augmented reality that I create so this is just like a set of play in my hand and then later on this thing can be removed and then something will come back and my biggest expectation is actually totally demolished the wall because this wall you know even go back to the photos in the late 50s because you know this is not original wall this is a wall after this building was enlisted as historical monument and then you have to make a wall to define the certain area which is defensive or protective but it's not authentic environment the authentic environment is to totally get rid of all of this and then make this building as part of the architectural field and the who is in charge of agriculture in charge of water he will go back to his original culture instead of this kind of history of architecture because architecture is not the end it doesn't mean so my understanding of our intervention is an empire it's not forever thank you did you want to respond to that no no I appreciate that okay there's just so much here for us to explore and unfortunately we've run out of time and unless we want to keep going to a third day of the conference I'm afraid we're going to have to wrap up and this hopefully will be the beginning of many more conversations about the Pacific Ocean and many more ideas cross-pollinating you've put so much on the table we are just so impressed by your work so thankful for your generosity to share it with us and to unpack all the issues in it we've learned so much from you and we look forward to your questions between us thank you to everyone that attended the conference over the the long stretch of time over the too many time zones we appreciate your participation I'm sorry we couldn't get to everyone's questions on the Q&A there's been a lot of Q&A questions hopefully those can be answered later by some of the panelists once again just deep gratitude to MoMA to Martino to Evangelos for this collaboration please everyone go to see the show at MoMA and I hope that this will just be again the beginning of much more cross-collaboration between our thinking about preservation about creativity in heritage both in the United States and in China so thank you so much I'm going to invite the panelists to stay on the Zoom for a second so we can say a proper goodbye but I'll let everyone else go in the audience so have a great weekend everyone thanks so much goodbye thank you goodbye