 Hi everyone. We're waiting for our guests to join us. We're here live in in Bogota, Colombia. We've had a number of technical difficulties and some timing issues with a number of things here in the city today. So I appreciate you waiting for us. Our guest is Lilia Solano who is the vice minister of social dialogue and equality for the new government here in Colombia, the Gustavo Petro and Francia Marquez government. So just ask that you sit tight and give us a chance to get the technology part of this right again and get her online with us too. Hey everyone, hoping that you can stick with us just a few more minutes and let our guest join us. We've got a really great conversation coming up this evening. I'm very sorry for the technical issues we've had. But if you can sit tight for just a few minutes, we'll have Lilia back with us and re-engage in our conversation. So thanks for waiting. Hello. Hello. I can't, I cannot see you because I have my camera off. Here I am. Okay, so we're live right now. So let me go back to reintroducing the show. I've asked the audience to wait and they have on three channels. So I'm so thankful for all of you for hanging in there because we have such a great, such a great guest. So let me just remind you all we are broadcasting live from Bogota, Colombia. And let me go back and introduce the program, introduce our guest and start our conversation. So here we go. Welcome to what the F is going on in Latin America and the Caribbean, a popular resistance broadcast in partnership with Code Pink, common frontiers, council on hemispheric affairs, friends of Latin America, interreligious task force on Central America, Massachusetts peace action and task force on the Americas. We broadcast Thursdays at 4.30 p.m. Pacific, 7.30 p.m. Eastern on YouTube live, including the Convo couch, popular resistance org and Code Pink. You can also find us on Facebook live at popularresistance.org. Post broadcast recordings can be found at Apple podcast, Spotify, Telegram, Red Indie media, and under podcasts at popularresistance.org. Today's episode, bringing the people's voices into the government, the relationship between social movements and elected office. And so I've asked this evening for my good friend, Lilia Solano to join us. She's joining us from the ministry of the interior here in Bogota. And she is the vice minister of social dialogue and equality for the new government here in Colombia, the government of Gustavo Petro and Francia Marquez. We've had several episodes with all of you talking about those elections and then some of the significant things that have happened in the first 100 days of the administration. And so Lilia is with us this evening to talk about her new role with the government. But Lilia, can you start by telling, well, sharing with me too, actually, and the audience a little bit of your personal biography, what led you to working in social media and social social media, oh my god, social movements and and how all of that led to your to your current role? I just want to check if you can hear me well. We can, yes. Okay, all right. Well, I want to say thank you, because I'm really glad for this interview. My good friend, Terry, it's here in Colombia, in Bogota. He went today to a great meeting with social movements that came all over the country, that came to discuss this relationship between the movements, the social movements and the government. So how will we come together develop this country, govern this country? So I want to start, I wanted to start by, by saying this, this possibility to be together, different people, different nations, different organizations, supporting each other is one of the most important things that will happen for Colombia in this moment of transition between years and years of armed conflict and having this new government, only three months, this new government with Gustavo Petro and Francia Marquez that wants to bring democracy, wants to bring justice, opportunities for all. So this is a very excited moment for us in Colombia. And we need this, this kind of connections with the international community. So let's talk a little bit about, I have to just share with the audience. I mean, I've had the most fantastic day almost a week now. I arrived here in Bogota Thanksgiving, the afternoon of what is recognized as Thanksgiving day in the, in the States. And Lilia's had me busy since very early last Friday morning. We had and Quenthros with Indigenous women, the Commission, National Commission of Indigenous Women on Friday and the Campesino movement today. And so it's just been amazing. And Lilia's also flown to the Brazil border to meet with landowners. I think you did that yesterday. So Lilia, tell us a little bit about yourself. Give the audience a little bit of your personal bio so they, they have a better understanding of who you are and, and how it came that, that the Petro government chose you for this role because you have such significant experiences. You should share that with the audience. Yes, I, well, I kind of start by saying that my grandmother was a peasant, a woman from, from the countryside. And my mother was a worker. So I came from, from this family, led by women and also by very poor family that for both of, of these women, they, they have been the center of their life that we, the woman needed to study and women needed to go really, really far away. So I went to university to study philosophy. And then I, I did, I did a master degree on political science. I'm doing right now a PhD on social science. But my work, my involvement has been the whole life, almost my whole life in human rights, working with victims, working with indigenous organizations, Afro-Columbian organizations. So working towards peace and life of opportunities and development. So I am in my life, I was working about all these items. But now in the government, you have the great chance to do it far better because you have the power. You can really empower the people, empower these movements. And like we did it today with social movements and we told them you are in the position of really feel that you, you, you decide who will, who was the president. Now you can rule with that president. So it was a very important day that they need to overcome all these years of persecution and unjust. And now all of us can go through a way to, to build a direct democracy. Well, this is, I should pull up my notes. Let me pull up my notes from today's, today's Enquanthro, because this was really two things that I heard a number of people mention. And just for the audience, this is these Enquanthros that Lilia is organizing or calling people to join here in Bogota. She's also going out to remote parts of Colombia to meet with people in their own communities. And this is, she's creating a dialogue so that everyone has a say. So this is direct democracy, which is exactly how the constitution is set up. The 1991 Constitution is set up as direct democracy, correct? Right, right. And, but it's never actually been in practice. And that's, I mean, I think everybody, every citizen knows that you have a, you know, you have a written document, your, your nation's constitution, and then you have the realities of how it's, it's actually put into practice. And so this new government, the petrol government is, is trying, is, has Lilia on the river, on the path of bringing this direct democracy to the citizenship. And then of course, the citizenship is going to bring their direct democracy right, you know, to the government. So some of the, so some of the things that were said repeatedly, unity with diversity, and planification, and participation, and planning, and participation. And then one woman said, like, we believe, we create. So if we believe, we can create. And these were really very empowering words coming from people today. I mean, very much, you know, believing. And I mean, that's you, Lilia, you're bringing. I mean, it's the president for sure. It's why people voted for Gustavo Petro. But this is your role is to take what people voted for and bring it right, you know, from Bogota right into the community level. Right. Right. Because the truth is the president came to to power, because people all over the country from the most different backgrounds came and campaigned for him. Woman, indigenous, and for Colombians, the diversity. So people that was oppressed for a long time, more than 70 years in an armed conflict. The people was very, very humiliated, very in conditions of poverty. And they wanted a change. So right now we have Presidente Petro. We need to bring these changes, but but it's not easy. It's very difficult to overcome these powers that control for almost 70 years, not only for economical power, political power, the power of the arms. So right now we are trying to build a new Colombia. And the problem is we have media is in the hands, still in the hands of those who control the economy. And sometimes the economy controls always the elections. So it has been a challenge really to go ahead with the changes. But I think many of us who are part of the government that we we give our lives for those changes. We are so committed to to bring it to the old people to to the to really the basis of of the citizenship. Let me ask you something. Well, this is just for the audience that everyone watching knows this is a recurring theme over the years on this particular program, social movements, and how important they are in building community and political formation, building, you know, potential candidates to run for elected office. And and it's a theme that we can that continues to kind of lead into many of our other conversations as well. And one of the one of the things that came up when we were talking about Xiomara Castro's election last November a year ago, and well actually it's December now was over a year was that not being being in power, being elected into office being in power is not the same as having power and having power is is completely reliant on the citizenship and how much they participate and support and and believe in the elected in the president's vision. And so that's a big part of a big part of your role is it not is to get everyone supporting what they have voted for and and not just um I mean it's one thing to say as a oh yeah I voted for Gustavo Petro I support him and it's a whole other thing to participate in in an in a quen throw such as today's to lay out a roadmap for where you want as citizens to support the president and help him and her the vice president take the country. Yes it's like like as as you mentioned one thing is to win government different thing is to win power to get the power to you have to really build it and to build power you have to to make a huge effort because those on the economical power used to control the country and those economical power is still on their control of the majority of the business of the big entrepreneurs the media the half of the the votes went to the other candidates told you in some way the country was polarized between those who wanted to change those who who live in poverty and one also the peace project the new government represented and in the other hand you have these other powers that you but you need to to to rule for the whole country so opposition one of the difficulties that we face is that opposition is a strong opposition because the economical control of the country of the of the richness of the country the control of the land the control of the the the whole system of power has been controlled by them so we we needed to to build from from below to to build a power that that will lead us to to a real democracy but it wasn't happened in 100 days so you have to be at least we say this government the whole four years it will struggle with the possibility to build a real power coming from people and facing these other powers but that's why I was saying it's very important to to be with the international community because we already have many attacks to this very young transition with this new government and happening in other countries in Chile, in Peru, in Venezuela when when new governments came to power and opposition really came very strong to say no this is a whole mess you are really throwing the power the government to to to a crisis and we are hoping for for these other possibilities like Brazil, Bolivia, there is new government so we have also to side in Latin America with these other countries who came to to change to as we say the progressive countries in Latin America we have to to side with the new possibilities to make the the change especially Brazil being such a big country such a very important country but also Venezuela but also as you mentioned Honduras and Mexico so we have in the region the possibility not to be isolated but to be with with this those government we will face the same challenges and something that we we have to call is for the North Americans civil society that there is no represented the interests of war of the control of Washington of the big transnational corporations but with people they need to side with us because we wanted the same we want a life we wanted opportunities we wanted democracy development so that will be something that we have to wait for people like you Teddy that represent this other side of the civil society in North America that can make such a big change in politics will help us go through I think so well you're very generous it's an honor it's an honor to know you and to work with you and to be invited to so many events to see you building this direct democracy I mean it's really it's a very profound experience for me and I'm happy you know to share to have an audience to share your words with and you know our work is to bring these experiences back home to the state not only to to inform what's happening in Colombia and other countries in Latin America and the Caribbean but also you know it's such a great learning opportunity for those of us in North America as well you know you mentioned um Bolivia and I wondered if we can just talk a minute as to how because Bolivia in the last two years has been such a profound example of the need for social and labor movements and what can be achieved so when Abel Morales was removed from power in October uh 2019 his party returned to power a year later and that was possible because the party as a movement the the actual party actually came out of a movement did not fall apart simply because their elected candidate was no longer in office they kept their ground game in action they kept growing the party they kept educating people they kept the political formation and they kept the ability to develop candidates and they returned to power a year later because they had that movement that ground game in place and that is going to be so important for all of you here in Colombia and I want to you know Lillia there was this great quote yesterday we were Lillia with so generous and inviting me to a congressional event yesterday and Senator Senadora Hayal spoke and you all be proud of me I actually like listened to all these meetings in Spanish my fluency isn't great but I can actually my comprehension is actually very good in talking about this theme about how important it is to have this this movement this power under an elected official pushing up across the country um to the capital so Senadora Hayal said yesterday Gustavo Petro and Francia Marquez have four years pacto histórico is a 20-year project we don't make miracles we make changes the hour is the hour and so you're growing you you've got the first four years of a 20-year process which is a perfect example of why movements have to be in place so that when this president is not in office the whole project can continue by electing someone who can succeed and uh and that means the movement has to be in place and it has to keep growing in some in numbers and in power in political formation in developing candidates across the country at all levels of government yes this is very important also for us that we cannot depend only in in one we say calvigio but also build uh power power from the people people's power because then we we change the the one in the govern but you still have the people you still have the the congress people elected so this this is a unique opportunity to to have a real vision for the country not just the transition and and those kind of kind of things to to make the people believe that only this is the only one and no no one can raise to to to take the the power but we need to when you build this people's power you can enrich your vision you can really build the community of leaders and that the problem we have right now is during the years of war of armed conflict that people couldn't trust anyone because no one trusts each other because they they were afraid of killings of disappearance of internal displacement so now we start also learning how to trust each other how to to in in the in the name of this new country believe that we can be represented by this or this order but to to trust that they will raise a new generation of people that can can be on power and that we can feel represented by them but we all all of that we have to learn because we as a country we are far behind after these many years of war that's why we always have to oppose to war because war takes the life of the country the life of the people the lives even to to the environment the life or also the development so we have to oppose with all our lives to war because we are let's say we are 70 years behind because this this country because this war and that's why it was I was calling to the civil society from from North America because they don't know how much power they have because this civil society that are also a humanistic civil society can oppose of this agenda of international war everywhere in the name also of business but you need this new era this new moment and and we need you to side with us for peace and for democracy and and this is the moment because in many many times the people used to say no it's the civil society in North American air very naive that's why they side in the name of war but I can see this new generation of people that they have ears open their eyes and give us a chance to build the future and in the same time side with us and oppose to any possibility of war against us or against our neighbors like Venezuela because this is a different times we want to to leave behind those times when when the the the rule of Washington um tell us that they need to to control our countries and the military control was really real in our countries so we don't want any more the the politics the foreign policy for us in Latin America the south command we want a real development to our countries a new a new way of foreign policy to us let me um well I mean your your nation voted and I've shared this with the with the audience um several times um and you know this Lily I would Lily I was a um international election election observer invited to eight countries there were elections all over Latin America in the Caribbean between October 2020 all the way through um Columbia and Brazil this year and Argentina next year their presidential elections are next year and this this three predominant themes I saw and I will include Colombian in this as well um people voted for national sovereignty and what you're saying is we want a sovereign foreign policy we don't want us southern command dictating Colombian foreign policy so people voted across the Americas national sovereignty natural resource sovereignty and Colombia has many many natural resources oil being one and people the third thing people voted for was governments that were proposing an economy that would benefit the majority of the citizens and that could be anything from you know one step to the left social democrat type economy all the way to something more revolutionary that's a spectrum but those are the three things that I consistently saw people vote for and I think that's what happened in Colombia as well although I was not allowed into Colombia to witness the elections as many in the audience know as well and you most certainly did well but but the results were the same yes we that's right I think we all in Latin America hope with for these multilateral kind of relationships in the world and in the same time my hope is always with the new generation of people that will oppose the war and we still we still have many wars the the US fighting Colombia they fight the war against drugs the war against narcotics the war against so we we we needed to overcome these kind of relationships only about intervention and really to side for many things more for environment for the economy for life side with woman for for peace and we have many many ways to connect it so we are hoping for for this to build not only our democracy but to build also this relationship with with the people and also that people can compress their own government their own congress and can say give a chance give a chance to Colombia can I um you know you've talked about war and and young people changing and I would I would agree including in the United States you know so many young people want to see uh the the US Pentagon budget diminished and all those taxpayer dollars reinvested in social benefits health care education good public infrastructure how coming out of 70 years of war internal civil war in Colombia as you're building as you're doing your job as the vice minister of of the social dialogue inequality how how are you seeing and how are people reacting to one another coming out of a civil war I mean this is something really I would I mean I have to say in the events that you've had me at the past week I haven't really felt a lot of animosity between people it's like this is a very special moment where people are really ready to I don't know are people ready to forgive and forget and move forward or are they just starting to do that or what is what dynamic are you are you seeing are are people really ready to put the war behind them I think we people is very tired of poverty because all the money that went to to to the armed conflict is huge the money of education or health or public services most of the money for development it went to the military aid so that's why people was totally tired of sacrifice themselves in the name of a war like the women say always not in our name is not our war belongs to to the interests of economical and political and military powers so don't don't call us to to bring the life of our children in this war so that does make the need of hope is this was a country hopeless and when you are hopeless you don't have the energy to build anything so it was the only way for people to recover hope to recover that the the dream for a new country for their own families and children for the new generation but still this struggle between those who win with the military war and those who want peace has has always been a tension between both and we hope that the people in business will learn that peace is a good business to bring justice and to overcome poverty is a good business so that they can really give a chance to this new government give a chance to the generation of new people like me that we are ready to to to give everything in the name of an opportunity for all of us well I will say you you you particularly but but your entire country is really such an inspiration I mean you use the word hopeless everybody's is tired of this hopeless situation and you you've gone from hopelessness to being an inspiration for all of the Americas I mean so many of us who have done Latin America solidarity work anti-war work human rights defense work we're all saying my gosh if Colombia can change and Colombia is changing it is changing it is in a moment of shame all of us can change it's possible it's so I mean I have I've shared that with you since I since I've arrived that I mean it really is just it's like my gosh if Colombia is in a process of has achieved a government that's allowing for a process of saying we can all get there it's so it's so profound and it's so inspiring and we have so much to learn from all of you those of us outside have so much to to learn and so I'm I'm so happy to to share some of of these lessons with the audience tonight and I'm and I will be honored to take so much of our and quenthro conversations back home to the States Lilia is there anything else we should talk about this evening anything that we that you want to make sure is said before I let you go you've been so generous with your time tonight I know you're in the throes of the industry of the interior everyone she's got day two of a three day and quenthro uh that she's friends yeah this minister is the minister of politics so okay if you have to really work reading the times and tomorrow we will have a big big gathering of the campesinos and campesinas peasants the country people countryside people and we want to discuss because these peasants they faced the war so badly they the blood was really so with the country so we need now to go celebrate understand also what kind of country we want to build what is our future bringing the the campesinos and campesinas to the center of the discussion because in the past they gave up their lives for this new country so thank you so much to be with you I'm so thankful for your time and and thank you to the audience for your for your patients I apologize for the technical difficulties on on my end and I just want to remind you all you've been watching what the f is going on in Latin America and the caribbean it's a popular resistance broadcast we are live on youtube every thursday 7 30 p.m eastern 4 30 p.m pacific and those youtube channels are convo couch popular resistance dot org and code pink and uh you can also listen to us post broadcast on spotify and apple podcast so thank you everyone thank you to my dear friend and special guest lilia solano she is the vice minister of dial of social dialogue and equality for the government of columbia the new government there's petro gusavo petro and uh france marquez government so thank you everyone for joining us this evening and thank you so much lilia and thank you so much thank you for your time okay a big hug for you and the people that follow you too okay okay bye bye bye